Where is this behavior actually going on?

speed3_freak · 2015-08-26T15:32:31+00:00

Another thing. The divorce rate being 50% is actually a misnomer because serial divorcers are counted multiple times. Even still, first marriages have a 29% failure rate in the first 10 years, and a 43% failure rate over the first 15 years. That's a 43% chance that the person you agree to spend the rest of your life with is gone before the marriage would have graduated high school.

How long have you been married?

PemBayliss · 2015-08-26T15:12:53+00:00

I've been reading some of the red pill content with a sense of bemusement and wondering if the female and beta male behaviors they complain about are really that common? Because among my circle of mostly Gen X upper-middle class college-educated professionals in California I'm just not seeing it. The majority are (reasonably) happily married, with children. Infidelity and divorce are the exception, not the rule. Most of the wives had a few previous relationships but never did anything too slutty and got with their husbands before hitting the wall. Don't bother telling me that I'm too blind to see what's really happening. I am sufficiently objective and observant to understand what's really going on between the couples I know well.

Go back and read what you typed. The answer to your overall question is bolded for your convenience.

EDIT: so this is clear, I'll tell you that you're just not seeing the behavior of persons outside your bubble. You're white enough, rich enough, and insulated by land and distance enough, that you don't see it.

Also, most of the behavior that's written about in the 'sphere started on the coasts and has moved inward. Most of the manosphere heavyweights are from NYC and DC, and perhaps a few are in LA. But that bad female behavior has moved inward to the Midwest cities of CHI and DFW, and is now everywhere.

Cyralea · 2015-08-26T15:15:03+00:00

Your social group is all relatively high SMV. They're all statistically the most likely to be shielded (but not immune) from being divorced. The divorce rate is still 50%, regardless of your experience. A woman wants both AF and BB, if she gets it in the same man she's unlikely to branch swing. Basic hypergamy.

As for the long-term strategy, TRP is split. It's up to the individual. There are guys in their late-40's living that lifestyle, and they're pretty happy from what they say. Others like me pursue the LTR path. TRP is the methodology, the instruction manual, not the bible. I'm pretty damn happy myself.

As for you, you basically applied TRP for yourself. That's great, but not everyone recognizes their personality as being faulty. In cities like mine, feminist doctrine teaches men that their undesirable nature is fine, and to simply wait for the right woman. If you had done that, you'd be a lot less happy, I'd wager.

Not everyone needs TRP. You're an example of that, and I am too to a degree. Similar story to yours. But the men who need it, really need it.

gregariousnefarious · 2015-08-26T19:15:20+00:00

I've observed the same things in my life, over and over, in 4 different states where I've lived as am adult. They're going to tell you you're an outlier, guaranteed, but truth told they're the outliers

MagicGainbow · 2015-08-26T20:30:02+00:00

All i'll say is it takes one divorcing couple to set off the ''eat, pray, love'' chain reaction.

CuntyMcFagNuts69 · 2015-08-26T15:41:14+00:00

This is what happens when you browse and don't actually dive into a theory. If i went to Red Pill, pressed top post I would see Spin Plates, Dread Game, Field report and be disgusted and leave. But I went there, got disgusted, came back, read all the material and it took about 3 months to fully accept it.

kick6 · 2015-08-26T18:36:00+00:00

on't bother telling me that I'm too blind to see what's really happening. I am sufficiently objective and observant to understand what's really going on between the couples I know well.

Sorry, but your sample is what is failing you.

But if they really swallow the red pill I worry that they're going to end up bitter, lonely, and herpes-infected. Do you guys seriously want to still be "spinning plates" when you're 50???

Concern trolling. This is new /s

Also http://therationalmale.com/2011/09/12/the-myth-of-the-lonely-old-man/

speed3_freak · 2015-08-26T15:26:20+00:00

As far as divorce and infidelity, it isn't common to the point where it happens in most relationships, but it isn't uncommon to where it isn't/won't happen to people you know. TRP is a glass half empty approach where you expect the worst and hope for the best. The reason that TRP is against marriage is because we see what women and the courts are capable of, and it isn't that hard to protect yourself from it and still have a great relationship. What would really be the difference in your life if you hadn't actually signed the piece of paper marrying your wife? Maybe some tax breaks? Where is the benefit of actually bringing the government into your relationship.

Don't bother telling me that I'm too blind to see what's really happening. I am sufficiently objective and observant to understand what's really going on between the couples I know well.

It's not an issue of your deductive reasoning as much as it's their ability to hide it. I know a couple that will be divorced within a month. He just found out that she's been spending hours talking on the phone, and going out to dinner, with one of her coworkers who has a history of sleeping around the office. Two weekends ago we had a big party with 20 or so close friends, and I guarantee I was the only person there that had any idea that they're having serious problems. People cheat on their spouses for years without them finding out, why would you think that you're observant enough to truly know what's going on in people marriages?

So am I just living in a happy little bubble? Is cheating, gold digging, and "shit test" drama more common in other areas of the country or among younger or lower-class people?

You are just naive. Hopefully you'll be able to stay that way. And no, that stuff is more prevalent among higher class people because they have more options, and they have their basic needs secured.

relationshipdownvote · 2015-08-26T15:05:33+00:00

Infidelity and divorce are the exception

The divorce rate is still around 50%, you might be young, rich, and white enough to not have experienced it personally, but if you look at the statistics, they're out there.

alreadyredschool · 2015-08-26T15:10:07+00:00

Some of the red pill guidelines represent good practical advice for nice guy losers who habitually let women take advantage. But if they really swallow the red pill I worry that they're going to end up bitter, lonely, and herpes-infected. Do you guys seriously want to still be "spinning plates" when you're 50???

I think we had this often enough now. Trp helps you getting women, it does not tell you that you should spin plates, but if that's what you want here are is some knowledge. If someone wants to do it with 50 then let him have his freedom. No really WHO are you to judge him? What kind of argument is that when supposed to be?

Xemnas81 · 2015-08-26T18:16:23+00:00

So basically you half-unplugged, boosted your SMV then selected prudently to moderate for hypergamy.

Congrats you followed Red Pill rhetoric to a tee.

skeetch_a_leak · 2015-08-26T16:22:28+00:00

It's probably far more common on the East Coast than the West for some reason. I haven't see racial differences though. But TRP explains a lot of what I grew up with in an inner ring suburb. Whether it's NYC, DC, Boston or Miami it applies here.

This sounds racist but more than 1 person (both black and white, upper middle class, educated - I'm more lower middle class and semi-educated) has said to me during high school or college that they thought two-parent families were an Asian, African, Catholic etc thing.

These are upper middle class kids whose fathers were multigenerational union members and who wore name brand clothing growing up. One rich, shitlib, blacklivesmatter chanting white boy I knew growing up proudly proclaimed that his dad was in copyright law for the MPAA, and his proudest achievement was shutting down access to American DVDs in Asia.

Another common occupation for upper middle class people here, is being a dude who collaborates with the government to get state construction contracts. There's more corruption here than in South America, no lie.

Upper middle class guys around here have more of a beta / alpha dichotomy too. On one hand a lot of them wear name brands, exercise a lot and get shape ups / fancy hair cuts, but there is also a large beta group among them that faps to pokemon slashfic. Alphas will openly bully beta groups and teachers will take their side in high schools and universities.

I was called a mark and a cheap slut growing up for not "demanding more" of men. I've seen ads in public for IVF and Truvada (the AIDS morning after pill). It's pretty dystopian. This is also true in some segments of Asian and Hispanic culture here, so it's not just "white feminists".

The message is always "you have to keep up, you have to compete". It's also very classist. Upper middle class people are pretty negative toward working class folks here. Terms like cheap shoes slut, trashy vs classy etc are bandied about a lot which is why I kind of dissociate from the upper middle class.

You will have shitty limousine liberals saying out of one end of their mouth "black lives matter" and then putting down Asian / Indian men the next day with weird barbs like "Rape culture in India". You can also tell they believe in Rushton's HBD - that they fear black guys stealing their women.

LUClEN · 2015-08-26T22:20:46+00:00

It likely gets exaggerated.

A dude I work with has 3 baby moms and based on his explanations they're quintessential examples of a lot of what TRP describes when discussing female mate seeking behavior and other habits.

His experiences seem to be the exception to the rule though, at least based on the people around me.

duro77 · 2015-08-27T12:22:22+00:00

I am under the impression that most redpillers operate under the illusion that the world is simply a macrocosm of American College Life. This world is populated with chads and cheerleaders perpetually playing out some elaborate kabuki of one-night-stands, clubs, 'shit-tests', and weight-lifting. I see nothing of their 'reality' in my own life.

I am happily married, most of my friends and colleagues are happily 'tied-down' or want to be. Their lives, their relationships are filled with problems that supersede the 'problems' discussed on the redpill to such an extent that it makes me think that redpillers are leading very sheltered lives if they are genuinely worried about the things they claim to be worried about.

wtknight · 2015-08-26T15:15:46+00:00

Being a Red Piller is all about being anxious about women in some form or another. If you don't have any anxiety about women, there's no reason to take the pill. Equating women to guns in the phrase "treat all guns as loaded" is pretty indicative of the Red Pill mentality when it comes to women in general. People with more healthy psyches about women, such as yourself and your friends, probably don't freak out as much when it comes to interacting with the opposite sex on a non-sexual level and take the occasional "shit test" in stride.

yo_radical_one · 2015-08-26T15:42:36+00:00

Agreed.

The things described on TRP do happen, but not only do they not apply to all women, they don't even apply to most women.

terminator3456 · 2015-08-26T17:02:21+00:00

TRP is vague & wishy-washy enough that you can apply it's "principles" to literally any situation if you so choose.

I mean, they advocate for it literally being an all-encompassing worldview so it's not surprising when "durr durr AWALT confirmed" is thrown around.

RPSigmaStigma · 2015-08-26T17:05:52+00:00

One thing that gets missed in these discussions a lot is the fact that people often behave very differently behind closed doors in their relationships. I'm not going to say all your friends secretly have shitty relationships, but people who do have shitty relationships will rarely broadcast it and will often put on a front with friends as if everything is great. You have no idea what's going on behind closed doors. Again, I'm not saying this is the case, I'm just saying you can't really dismiss it on the grounds that all of your friends appear to have nice, happy BP relationships.

[deleted] · 2015-08-26T19:05:37+00:00

The thing is, it's different even for millennial upper-middle class college-educated professionals in California.

I'd say you're lucky, but you're older than me and maybe all the women around me will change over the next 5 years or so.

Whisper · 2015-08-26T21:04:15+00:00

Because among my circle of mostly Gen X upper-middle class college-educated professionals in California I'm just not seeing it.

Duh.

Look, I get it. You live in a bubble.

That's not a bad place to live, but try talking to people outside of it. Gen X had it worse that our parents (how is it that the greatest generation gave birth to the worst?), but Gen Y and the millenials have it even worse. We are a society in social decay, and the sexual marketplace is worse and more ruthless for each generation as compared to the previous one.

wattwatty · 2015-08-26T21:49:41+00:00

Hmmm... I'm Gen X, upper middle class as well. I could probably accept your characterization of your circle were it not for one statement:

most of the wives had a few previous relationships but never did anything too slutty

How do you know? They told you so? If you were, in fact, ...

something of a loser nerd in [your] younger years and never had much success with women

let me assure you that all of those wives in your circle did shit with someone (likely, several someones) that no woman ever did with you. They were WAY sluttier than you are assuming.

buttlollipop · 2015-08-28T00:16:58+00:00

Seriously, I've been wondering the same thing. I know maybe one or two women who have behaved in a textbook TRP "cock carousel" fashion and both of them are seriously mentally defective. Literally every other person I know, male or female, has had a few hookups, a few relationships, and is now (mid 20s to early 30s) looking for a relationship or in a serious relationship. This world-as-endless-sex-party view is something I've never experienced. Not saying it doesn't happen, but it's not my experience.

I will say I do know one man who TRP would probably hold up as an example of an 'incel' (he's had sex before, but he just fails with women way more often than your average person). However his reasons for failing with women are pretty obvious, he just doesn't listen to anyone who tells him what they are.

DStoo · 2015-08-26T16:20:29+00:00

It's going on in the cherry picked examples they like to use.

Anything that doesn't fit their data gets thrown out.

Maoist-Pussy · 2015-08-26T15:54:45+00:00

and herpes-infected

Oh nos, not the minor inconvenience that nearly everyone is already infected with already. Shield of Chastity, keep me from this grave pestilence!

Archwinger · 2015-08-26T18:54:25+00:00

The younger crowd. Things have changed a LOT since Gen-X.

I'm mid-30s, upper-middle class, married to a well-educated and extremely useful bitch, though most days, we're reasonably happy. Not much previous slutting around for either of us. No infidelity from either of us, at least not that I've found out, and the signs aren't really there.

If I put on my blinders and assume that the entire universe, today, is just like the world I knew 15-20 years ago, I'd probably come to the same conclusion you did.

dripred · 2015-08-26T22:57:56+00:00

The problem with women in your demographic is utter lack of obedience. I used to mix in circles exactly like yours. There is a preconcieved assumption by middle class, educated metro women - especially in artier cliques that they merit equal decision making power in their relationships. It's not tenable to have a relationship where women's decision making abilities are equally weighted with your own. Sadly, females do have to suffer being demeaned ever so slightly in this regard, not only to foster their sexual interests but also to protect their general interests. When women have a reasonable earning capacity they cease being submissive. Nobody with half a brain would invest in what you're selling. I've seen all the types you speak of - grad school girls, female entrepreneurs, girls who founded bands, girls who are established counter culture artists, etc. These women are worthless to the men they glom on to. Redpill extrapolates why these women's artificially inflated sense of value is as offensive as it is - they are denying all of their genetically encoded behavioral patterns to try and put on a show of besting you and your masculinity... ah but they hardly try and stifle their lizzard brains when it comes to hypergamy though.

Maybe they wont divorce rape you if they're in an equal tax bracket - but they sure will place a whole lot of stock in their own opinions. You want to live your life compromising your plans and objectives to accommodate a little girl playing businesswoman - knock yourself out. I can assure you it's a living hell and your male friends are living emasculated lives of silent desperation. Let me guess, your wife isn't submissive.

squirrelcuisine · 2015-08-26T17:34:32+00:00

you and I are about the exact same. However with one difference. (and it is quite substantial.)

I probably know about 50 couples over the past 25 years who have gotten married. My wife and I will be celebrating 20 years in a few months. We have been together 25.

Of those 50 couples 3 of them including myself are still married 15+ years. All of the other ones.. Literally 47 of them have been divorced.

NOW.. that is skewed from the national average for sure. However here is the other thing that is weird that is my reality but does not match statistics.

EVERY last one of those 47 people have all gotten remarried WITHIN a year.. and all of them are STILL married 10+ years or longer now. (Second marriages are supposed to fail at a higher percentage right? Well not in this case)

Strange.

Now I am as of a year ago into a different demographic and I am in a financially very interesting state now. (No debt of any kind and a personal net worth that is growing substantially. I have "Made it" finally. I am now in a different group of friends. (All 6+ figure earners in the midwest.) and of THESE people. These people are happily married ONE time and just like my wife and I.

It is so funny how well I get along with this new group of friends too.

chazzALB · 2015-08-27T15:07:01+00:00

~35years in NYC, roughly 6 mo in Miami and about 4 months on LA. everything TRP says has been my exact experience.

MorpheusGodOfDreams · 2015-08-27T17:52:59+00:00

I was something of a loser nerd in my younger years and never had much success with women.

how many sexual partners has your wife had?

winndixie · 2015-08-31T18:59:59+00:00

Exactly, right? I mean I never gotten raped, does rape even exist in this country?

Title	Where is this behavior actually going on?
Author	ssr401
Upvotes	33
Comments	205
Date	August 26, 2015 2:57 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/3ih24g/where_is_this_behavior_actually_going_on/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/where-is-this-behavior-actually-going-on.280038 https://theredarchive.com/post/280038

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