There are good reasons why birthrates are falling

PorkyOfOnett · 2023-09-06T13:14:52+00:00

CoL is sky high and kids are expensive. I think it just boils down to this.

Clementinequeen95 · 2023-09-06T13:17:56+00:00

I think the biggest is finances. Kids are insanely expensive and we’re living in a time where people can barely pay rent much less daycare. Additionally, I think women are being more honest about motherhood and how difficult it is. It’s definitely had me take a step back and reevaluate if I really do want kids or not. It’s a huge sacrifice to make.

ThrowRAinn · 2023-09-06T13:31:00+00:00

This is all nonsense. The desire to have children has nothing to do with any of the stuff you outlined.

Cost of living, cost of raising children, and more women joining the workforce are the only meaningful factors. Go look at the statistics. It's not complicated.

If you want to debate, use some facts and not just your biases.

mnt68 · 2023-09-06T13:22:37+00:00

Women don’t pick men for their ability to raise kids, they pick men for their genetics.

It is stated over and over on this sub. Women are only attracted to certain types of men. Because…biology.

If women don’t prioritize dating men with good character and stability, you create a society of single moms.

noonereadsthisstuff · 2023-09-06T14:38:25+00:00

First of all, single parent families are devasting for children:

63% of suicides in the US are by children single parent families.

70% of teenage suicides are by children from single parent families.

70% of people who never finish high school come from single parent families.

80% of rapists come from single parent families.

90% of homeless people come from single parent families

Children of 2 parent families do better on every single educational metric than children of single parent families.

Secondly, the biggest casual factor in falling birth rates is female education

https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/womens-educational-attainment-vs-fertility

odd_cloud · 2023-09-06T17:40:57+00:00

It’s fucking economy. If people could have a house by 25, they’d buy houses and have children.

ace52387 · 2023-09-06T13:49:43+00:00

How does having kids benefit men? It doesnt “benefit” anyone unless you want kids.

wtknight · 2023-09-06T15:06:39+00:00

I think women should have kids on their own terms by sperm donor, that way women dont have to deal with a male partner:

But then they are having the burden of taking care of a kid by themselves, and their children will likely not have a good male role model.

PMmeareasontolive · 2023-09-06T15:34:34+00:00

I think women should have kids on their own terms by sperm donor

You had me until this part. I actually view this as abusive toward the future kid. The massive ego you must have to think you can do it alone and that that kid doesn't need another parent. It should disqualify you from parenting. At least when you choose some awful, awful guy, as you seem insistent on doing, and are almost guaranteed to do with the hateful attitude you have, if you do so with good faith that he will take on some parental role, even if it's incommensurate with the labor involved, then, even if it fails, ok. TLdr: it's for the kid, not all about you.

melindabrown2023 · 2023-09-06T13:22:11+00:00

Women are increasingly shunning marriage and children because it's a net loss for them. In the past it wasn't like this. You needed men to be able to feed yourself (since you couldn't earn money), and there was nothing else to do but have children (since you couldn't earn money).

But today's women have to provide 50% of the household income while doing 100% of the cooking, cleaning and childcare. And most of us would rather have one job than two.

Men are doubling down on their misogyny to try and get women 'back in line' but in reality, the men that will be the most successful with women will be the ones willing to shoulder the household responsibilities, be present fathers, and see women as equals in the home.

Some men will evolve. Some men will get left behind.

Bubbly_Taro · 2023-09-06T13:32:14+00:00

Useless write-up.

Birthrates are negatively correlated with standards of living.

In shithole countries people have less education, access to contraception and in addition children are valuable assets requiring limited financial investment while providing labor from a young age.

In civilized countries the script is flipped.

CombinationMore4630 · 2023-09-06T14:36:50+00:00

Is it really the hardest job in the world... When most of humanity throughout time has done it??

Come off with this bullshit.

If the job is so hard then where are all the suicides from the stress???

Let's stop with the bullshit that it's the hardest job in the world.

It seems odd that the hardest job in the world has been done so many times by so many people throughout history.

I was raised by a single mother, she worked, and went to school, and raised me. I'd say the hard part of that equation would've been getting her second masters...

Fuckin bullshit

1Here4Bach · 2023-09-06T14:05:50+00:00

It’s mostly because the economy. Before the 1960’s it was pretty easy for a male to look like a big shot with an average white color job. That doesn’t cut it these days and many males have made it clear they don’t want to take on the burden of “women’s work”. Women don’t think marriage is a good deal because they don’t think a male making 50k and not doing house work is worth it. The cost of living is too high as well as the price of raising children and marriage is for lack of a better term is unprofitable.

Many women would happily bare the brunt of the housework if she was with a wealthy male who payed all the bills, allowed the family to live in a safe neighborhood with a nice school and gave her a nice allowance on the side. But marrying a male who makes low-mid 5 figures, having to do most of the child rearing and house management, having to pay half? That’s indentured servitude. You might as well stay single if that’s what the average marriage looks like.

TelevisionGloomy5458 · 2023-09-06T14:15:34+00:00

This! 100 percent

MxMaster9907 · 2023-09-06T14:44:04+00:00

It’s a mostly economic problem.

See how young people live nowadays, they can’t even move out of their parents, let alone buy a home. They into massive amounts of debt with the hopes of getting a decently paying job. Marrying itself is expensive and costs thousands of dollars (more debt). This sounds “American centric” but this is the case all around the world.

I am from Mexico and buying an apartment in Mexico City is impossible. Other big cities (where the good jobs are) are also getting expensive.

Housing (the lack there of) is probably the main thing that prevents people from having kids. Chances are you won’t own a house, and if you it will be a very small apartment or townhouse.

Neptune-Jr · 2023-09-06T16:32:41+00:00

Men make terrible fathers. SO many absent, abusive, emotionally stunted dads out there. Women shouldn't even bother to have a child with a man when the vast majority of men do not add anything positive to parenting.

So the existence of bad father means no man will ever be a good father? Bad Mother exist too does this mean that woman make terrible mother?

Men are most attracted to youth. And what does pregnancy do to you? It ages you. Sleepless nights, stretch marks, loose skin, saggy boobs, hair can fall out, no time or money for self care. If you want to be deemed as unattractive by society then have kids lol.

And yet tons of moms are attractive. Pregnancy is scary and it does a number on your body but it's not going to turn you into a hideous troll permanently.

Its a thankless job for women. Women do the all the work in pregnancy and childbirth and then they are expected to be the mom who loses her self identity in doing everything for her kids otherwise she is a "bad mother" and do women get acknowledged for their sacrifice? nope it is expected, fathers on the other hand get praised for the bare minimum. For example single moms do it all yet get judged harshly.

Most of the other stuff I simply disagree with but THIS is a straight up goddamn lie. Mother's day is only one the most popular holidays of the year. Children practically adore their moms. And endless praise from media and other moms. Why are you lying right now.

Mrs_Drgree · 2023-09-06T13:00:57+00:00

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MiddleZealousideal89 · 2023-09-06T15:57:49+00:00

Having kids with men is probably the worst thing you could do.

Well I can't have a kid without a man being involved in a part of the process at some point. Semen doesn't grow on trees.

As for the rest of this post - while women today tend to be more cautious when entering into a relationship that will involve a child, I don't think the issue is men (as a whole) being shit. They aren't. Especially among younger people, you have more men willing to take care of kids, and more men doing housework, on top of working. While women, on average, still do more chores/childcare work than men, things have gotten way better from our grandparent's time in that regard. But our financial situation is kinda fucked. You need a good amount of money to raise a child, you need both people working to support the family, the CoL has skyrocketed, and more and more people are struggling to afford their own expenses, let alone the expenses that come with a child. It's not surprising that birthrates have dropped but it seems to be due to the economic pressures people face more so than deadbeat dads and societal shaming of single mothers.

Mrs_Drgree · 2023-09-06T14:05:22+00:00

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Nellylocheadbean · 2023-09-06T13:36:20+00:00

And don’t forget once women pop out a baby, a lot of men are only concerned about when you’ll be able to have sex with them. Unfortunately nothing a man does equates to having children, so this creates an uneven dynamic. A lot of modern men don’t even deserve having a woman by their side and the privilege of a woman who’s willing to carry his child. It has to be earned. I do wish women weren’t so frivolous with who they have kids with.

Modern women are bad but so are modern men.

TopNYJeweler · 2023-09-06T14:41:21+00:00

Men make terrible fathers

Women have more options to choose good men than men to choose good women. If they choose terrible fathers, that is their fault.

Single mothers are demonized. Single mothers are AMAZING.

A lot of single moms tried to use children to trap men, and it backfired. Single moms are not necessarily amazing just for opening legs, in fact they are reckless... because women have birth control, abortion, put to adoption power than men don't have, and yet they find a way to be single moms anyway.

Men are most attracted to youth.

So? Men are mostly attractive to tall or strong men, which does not necessarily means men who will stay around.

Most men cant support a family.

Again, don't fuck those men. Imagine being a woman, having countless options of men to pick, and just picking the same men that already have children with other women... obviously their attention and finances will be divided. Imagine being a woman, living in tutorial mode and still finding a way to lose.

Its a thankless job for women.

Why should anyone thank you for just your job as a mom?

anonymous375555 · 2023-09-06T14:20:44+00:00

Yes finally my country is on the map, yay

Also, all what you said is non sense, there is a reason why people count birth rate as a percentage of women not men.

Uglypostwall · 2023-09-06T14:44:24+00:00

Do man still love wife even after her postpartum changes?I find it impossible to believe if man still love wife same.Postpartum ruin everything

Pathosgrim · 2023-09-06T15:23:32+00:00

Women think average men are unworthy because the standard of average has risen post age of "equality" Fathers that willingly do housework and have an active role with child rearing are seen as weak by women and are resented due to subconscious and biological reasons that outweigh "morality" The real facts.

AcrobaticRhubarb2147 · 2023-09-06T15:59:11+00:00

agree with OP 100 percent

twistednormz · 2023-09-06T13:39:06+00:00

Well assuming this isn’t satire, women’s rebellion from marriage/child rearing will likely have sweeping economic and social consequences in the future. Women like to think they’re stronk and independent but they still and likely always will rely on men to do a great deal of the heavy lifting in society. If/when most of those men are no longer able to find a romantic partner, they’re not going to want to bother working those jobs anymore (men are happier in relationships than not). We’re in a transition zone where women are enjoying benefitting from the hard work of men while earning lots of money in busy work industries like HR and academia. Enjoy the free ride while it lasts, I guess.

One other thing, single motherhood is positively correlated with like every bad thing, like poverty and crime.

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obviousredflag · 2023-09-06T14:48:11+00:00

Contraception and abortion is the reason we don't have kids anymore. We never wanted them, they were just a side product of the thing we can't stop doing: fucking.

John_Oakman · 2023-09-06T22:11:02+00:00

The combination of hedonistic materialism and obsession over absolute pure moral virtues will be the self correcting errors of these generations. You will be replaced with these of lower expectations and lower morals, and your noble struggles will all be for naught.

On the minor topic of the lack of suitable provider males: Asian american males tend to be usually in good financial shape as well possessing traits of good work ethic, studious, nonaggressive, etc. They also tend to be the least successful among the males. Probably it's their lack of moral virtues and their misogynic cultural outlooks.

Kosilica457 · 2023-09-06T23:33:07+00:00

Jesus christ this entire post is a cesspool of pure misandry

Title	There are good reasons why birthrates are falling
Author	Illustrious-Line-996
Upvotes	0
Comments	167
Date	September 6, 2023 12:55 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/16bjku4/there_are_good_reasons_why_birthrates_are_falling/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/there-are-good-reasons-why-birthrates-are-falling.1231360 https://theredarchive.com/post/1231360

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