Are Women's Demands for Male Beauty Reasonable?

theambivalentrooster · 2017-06-15T18:57:42+00:00

the idea that a man would be so viscerally beautiful that (sober) women would want to fuck him on the spot is pure, unadulterated projection of male sexuality. women don't work like that. attractiveness for women is a threshold... if you cross it you'll be considered on your other merits.

my reaction to a good-looking man is the same as my reaction to a good-looking woman or a nice painting or a good-looking car: that is to say, I appreciate that he's well put together but don't have anything resembling a sexual reaction.

haikufun · 2017-06-15T19:42:16+00:00

Attraction is not negotiable or debatable. If he isnt hot to me, then thats it. Why has the standard gone up for women judging men? Because marriage isnt the necessity it used to be. Women probably used to compromise attraction for other things like status as part of being more safe in that more uncertain world.

Also part of female beauty is youth, lots of collagen or facial chubbiness that obscures any possible uneven features beneath, so when young, lots of women can look even more attractive than their male counterparts, who need to look lean as part of being "hot" and cant hide any uneven features in that situation.

Love8Death · 2017-06-15T20:18:16+00:00

I want to go out to drinks with "beautiful" men, have them tell me I am "flawless" and plan parties with them. I wanna fuck men who look like they could fell a tree, scare an invader and be useful during a zombie apocalypse.

You're confused about what women want from which men...

sublimemongrel · 2017-06-15T19:02:49+00:00

This is just how female attraction works. Men aren't "viscerally beautiful/attractive/hot" to women the way women are to men. This is why you see uglyish dudes with attractive women all the time. As for women posted on places like r/choosybeggars there's a reason why that sub is so titled. When all is said and done, men still expect/desire conventional "beauty/looks" in a way women don't.

Littleknownfacts · 2017-06-15T19:20:50+00:00

I think that's pure lookist delusion. Women don't want or care about male beauty. Women want guys who look tough, who look smart (classy, not nerdy), dangerous, exotic, who represent a certain desired lifestyle. There's a reason women don't naturally scale men 1-10 like men do to women... Because shiney hair and a symmetrical face just don't mean as much as the whole package. Most women would take a an old rough, scarred face over a modelesque baby-face any day.

NalkaNalka · 2017-06-15T19:03:33+00:00

who cares. everyone is chasing the purple dragon these days.

guys want super porn sluts but really madonna, girls want Chad McRicherandNicerson.

its all bs. I am going to go drink.

goatismycopilot · 2017-06-15T19:41:11+00:00

What do you mean by male beauty?

Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2017-06-15T20:37:24+00:00

Reasonable to whom? Are they successfully meeting men who meet the standards?

purpleppp · 2017-06-15T19:06:37+00:00

I completely agree that it's harder to be a HG than a HB (at least in the present day US). That doesn't mean that women's demands are unreasonable, though. Reasonable with respect to what? Women don't have as much trouble getting the men they want as men do (judging from this sub), so I'd say their standards are pretty reasonable. Women aren't responsible for male thirst. They're just playing the game just like men are.

hyperrreal · Thu Jun 15 19:29:41 2017 UTC

Perhaps someone with an axe wound can weigh in here if it's different for you.

This is circlejerky and unnecessary. Plz remove.

TheGreasyPole · 2017-06-15T19:37:23+00:00

You have to eat what you can catch.

As long as women are catching these men. Heaving them up onto their dock, and getting a ring out of them… then their standards are not unreasonable.

And if they are not hauling those men onto the dock... Then they've got to lower their sights to what they can actually catch. He’s no good to you if he’s too big to heave onto your dock.

Getting nailed by a hot guy isn't catching him, it’s just getting your hook in. If you can’t get him onto your dock he doesn’t count as a catch.

Thats what a male fisherman would consider a catch, for us getting the hook in is VICTORY CONDITION ACHIEVED but a female has to get more out of the deal than that to be happy in the long term. The males VICTORY CONDITION ACHIEVED is the females “Welcome, Player 2 - Level 1 Begins..."

The only thing I'd caution women about it... the good fish get caught early. Don't spend too long arsing about with the hot guys who'll have fun sex, but aren't going to give you commitment. If you can’t get them onto your dock, throw them back quickly.

The longer you spend arsing about with these guys... the lower the quality of the fish still in your pond.... and the higher the likelihood is you'll have to eventually settle for a ring from a fish you didn't really want to catch.

Il128 · 2017-06-16T00:22:44+00:00

I find the women's reactions in this thread to be hilarious.

A man who is physically attractive, as I am, gets hit on by women all the time. Asked for my number. Get unsolicited selfie porn. Pretty much all the things women complain about men doing...

But yes, two hours a day of physical exercise, counting every calorie, maintaining social relationships and a great paying job and looking like it... Huge effort.

Most attractive women simply starve themselves. Those who do actually workout and keep themselves fit don't put in the two hours a day that's required of men and they don't have to maintain a high paying job and a complex and large social network.

Then again, "attractive" men are a cheap resource and disposable and attractive women simply are not.

Love8Death · 2017-06-15T19:12:00+00:00

OP, you should test your hypothesis. This would actually be really easy to try to confirm. Humanity has the technology.

Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2017-06-15T20:07:31+00:00

Inevitable result of photo based internet dating. I can't perceive anything about a man but his face from pics. I can't perceive his masculinity or presence. This is harming masculine but less beautiful men I imagine

mcmur · 2017-06-15T21:15:40+00:00

Women's physical standards for men are incredibly high. One single physical trait is enough to totally disqualify a man from being considered physically attractive to women (the most common one being height.)

Men's standards for physical beauty for women.....actually barely exist at all. If you know anything at all about men, you know that men (as a whole) generally have no standards whatsoever. If you're a woman, men will want to have sex with you.

You can be the fattest, most disgusting pig of a woman and you could still always find some loser to sleep with you if you put in a minimum amount of effort (ie. go outside and indicate your availability). Sex is always available to you as a woman, this is not true for men.

That's why i laugh so hard when somebody gives me the old 'beauty standards are unrealistic for women!'. Who's standards? Certainly not men's standards. If that were true, morbidly obese Becky would never have had sex in her life, but we all know a seriously obese Becky that has had plenty of sex in her life.

[deleted] · 2017-06-15T22:17:47+00:00

Yes because men's beauty standards have to deal with characteristics that are outside of their control.

Not every man can be tall with a large frame and a nice face.

However, I'd say it's not unreasonable because most women can actually get what they're looking for.

voteGOPk · 2017-06-15T22:35:24+00:00

It all comes down to testosterone.

women will never know what it means to have a brain bathed in testosterone. they simply cannot experience the same kind of lust men do towards a nice pair of tits and ass.

we must just accept this as fact and move on.

MagicGainbow · 2017-06-15T23:32:51+00:00

From what I can see? No.

The basic problem is a poor grasp of statistics and averages, for example;

Women that want someone of 6 feet or over are cutting out a large proportion of the population before controlling for any other trait.

[deleted] · 2017-06-15T18:57:44+00:00

Men are thirstier and willing to work harder for relationships so they can easily get away with such standards. That's life

wtknight · 2017-06-15T20:01:09+00:00

Most of the women I've known seem to think that most guys with the highest HB ratings are douchebags and they steer clear from them. They might like looking at some hot male celebrities, but many women usually seem to still be attracted to men who are not of the highest attractiveness level. Of course, decent looking women aren't going to go for a guy with a marshmallow body, but he doesn't have to be a ripped stud either. I think a guy who is at least "fit" appeals to most women.

IIHotelYorba · 2017-06-15T20:27:34+00:00

Look I'm telling you looks are REPLICATION value. It's a female type of value. If a girl isn't into you it isn't because of your looks, it's because you act like a bitch- you're missing SURVIVAL value.

Cavemen didn't spend their time having male beauty contests. Hunting, social alliances, problem solving, persevering, things like that. Stop trying to be male bimbos who have the perkiest, cutest little ass. That's what women and gay men do, people who want to passively attract men who are attracted visually and like to be the masculine, active partner.

Before you worry about looks, ask yourself "are you a woman?"

super-commenting · 2017-06-15T23:18:16+00:00

Women expecting and demanding male beauty

Where? I don't see it.

Women aren't demanding anything it's just of a guy isn't super hot they don't treat him like he's super hot.

BiggerDthanYou · 2017-06-16T01:47:49+00:00

However, it's so much harder for a man to be viscerally beautiful.

And less important for men. Things like grooming, posture, healthy tan, stylish clothes, tattoos and an outgoing, funny and confident personality are part of mens beauty.

It's like the bar is just much much higher before anything registers at all.

Unless you are at the very bottom of the generic lottery, in bad clothes or out of form this is where your personality should do the rest.

There can be intense desire even if you don't have beautiful looks.

I think it's simply a lot harder for men to be an HG7+ than a woman to be an HB7+. For every ten HB7+ I see, I'll find maybe one HG7+.

But you don't look at men like women or even gay men do.

If you saw me you'd probably think that I'm a 5 or a 6, but that doesn't mean that all women also share that taste.

I actually expect it to be even less common for women as I don't think they prowl for beauty as much, but maybe I'm wrong there.

Many women do love people watching and unlike men they can watch strangers in public without needing to wear sunglasses to do so.

And well if me and my girlfriend are going somewhere she spots more hot guys (and babies and puppies) than I do, but I spot more hot women. Sometimes she notices a good booty that I somehow missed and she also agrees that there are more stunning women than stunning men.

[deleted] · 2017-06-16T01:54:17+00:00

In a word, no. Women aren't as unreasonable as you think.

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cxj · 2017-06-15T19:10:38+00:00

I'm not gonna say it's "unreasonable" for girls to want male beauty, but it is generally unrealistic. Part of this imo is that guys just point blank aren't as attractive as girls, even many girls say this. Also, guys overall put much less effort into appearance than girls because overall, there is much stronger incentive for them to achieve social status, money etc. the percentage of "raw looks" loving girls isn't high enough to incentivize enough men to improve appearance. Even if it did, when I talk to such girls they seem to really be sticklers about these guys looking "natural" and I'm not sure how much guys improving their looks would really help.

Girls I've met like this tend to be 6-7/10 wanting 9-10 dudes. It may be the most clear cut hypergamy I've seen irl. I have a good friend like this and all of her girlfriends have point blank told her she's unrealistic lol.

statsfodder · 2017-06-15T20:21:03+00:00

"Women" want 300lbs to be seen as sexy... (but don't objectify!) Meanwhile "looks don't matter but I deserve my channing tatum and won't settle for anything less"

"You are just sad that we have standards" - no I'm "sad" that you don't apply those standards to yourself.

"You must love me for who i am and fat is beautiful" - no I don't have to see fat as beautiful and no amount of man-shaming will change that.

At the end of the day you are attracted to what you are attracted to but don't be hypocritical about it, if you are 300lbs and smell like foot mixed with ham, don't get angry at the world that only creepy 3s and 4s approach you or that 6s and higher don't know you exist... fix it! Get healthy and learn to present yourself better. (This applies to males and females... it also applies to the other umpteen genders there supposedly are)

OurThrownAwayDreams · 2017-06-15T22:16:47+00:00

women's standards are pretty high nowadays, and im going to take a stab in the dark and say that their standards get higher the more well off they are. a rich woman's standard can get astronomically high because she doesn't need a provider so she's gonna go full blown on getting herself a 666 (6 figures, 6 pack, 6+ inches)

in the end it's not about who's standard is higher. it's about who can meet those standards easily. this is where both sides have their own little problems to deal with:

for a woman to meet a man's standard, she better pray that she's born with good genetics and a good face. though even if she's a 6, as long as she doesn't overeat and get fat, she dresses well and applies proper makeup, most guys will find it acceptable.

for a man to meet a woman's standard, he may not need to be born with an utterly god-like face. even the skinniest, scrawniest and weakest dude can put in a few good years in the gym and gain muscles. however the difficulty lies in the fact the demands for a man to have multiple vectors to master is greater than a woman. not only he has to be physically fit, he also needs to make good money and have good game (charisma). while you can say a lot of those can be achieved if you work hard enough, but not a lot of men are in position to be able to cultivate all those qualities at the same time and do so successfully.

now having been generously rated by some of the women here, if their answers were honest, then i dont think women's standards are too impossibly high. sure it may be higher than in the past, but physically speaking it's very doable if you set your mind to it and you're willing to work hard to get there. if anything, height - the unfixable trait, fucks with a lot of guys, and i think that's the most irrational standard a woman have nowadays.

theiamsamurai · 2017-06-15T22:35:12+00:00

The threshold of looks for which women would pay a man for sex is unreasonable.

Princeso_Bubblegum · 2017-06-15T22:49:40+00:00

Men's beauty standards aren't reasonable either, we all suck.

despisedlove2 · 2017-06-16T02:10:27+00:00

Women have a right to go for the guy they want.

When they settle (as most do), it ends in divorce. She never sees him as anything other than an ATM with a big payday at the end.

IncelExecutioner224 · 2017-06-16T17:11:17+00:00

Women consider the bottom 80% of men to be ugly, middle 10% as average and top 10% as actually attractive.

Tinder's data: https://archive.is/mCmMT

Okcupids data: https://archive.is/wDxuW

Women using Tinder: https://youtu.be/VZ4dIz5q648

You have to be a 90th percentile male just to be attractive to women. Of course their standards aren't fucking reasonable. And of course these online statistics are probably bluepilled af compared to actual reality. When you actually ask women how many men they find attractive, it's actually closer to 1%:

http://archive.is/fm9zk

So really only 99th percentile males are attractive in practice. Women have no fucking idea how miserable male's lives are in comparison to theirs (at least in first world countries). I wish every single one of them had their face melted off with acid so we can finally have true equality.

NewOrder777 · 2017-06-21T20:47:43+00:00

The women here posting that females aren't viscerally and lustfully attracted to a man at first sight are lying. The question is whether it's to themselves or to look good.

The main difference between men and women is that women's standard for this kind of attraction is muich higher than mens. A man will often start getting sloppy over a nice pair of tits or a shapely ass, regardless of the women's other features.

To elicit this kind of reaction from women you must be over 6'0, be very well built (and visibly so), have a handsome face and walk with swag.

If you have any friends like this you will see how women behave, including many who would have sex with the man on the spot if he makes the right moves.

If anything, men who get under the small "hot guy" umbrella have it way better than very hot women in regards to sex. That is because many men will be intimidated by a woman who is an HB-10 , while women generally do not fear men who are much better looking for them since they know men will have sex with them if they make it easy enough.

A man who is a 10 will have women 7 and under outright offering sex and literally begging for naked pics. I couldn't believe it either, but my friend who is extremely muscular and looks trendy (tattoos, beard, manbun) on Facebook showed me all the women like this.

An intelligent debate on this female phenomenon and how it effects women in the long-term when they start looking for men to "settle down" with is impossible while women are around. They sit here and outright deny the premise, saying it's our lying eyes when we witness women in their 20s wasting their best years having unattached sex with strangers because of their looks.

Title	Are Women's Demands for Male Beauty Reasonable?
Author	Love8Death
Upvotes	14
Comments	404
Date	June 15, 2017 6:55 PM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/6hh3eb/are_womens_demands_for_male_beauty_reasonable/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/are-womens-demands-for-male-beauty-reasonable.267580 https://theredarchive.com/post/267580

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