Do men frequently misinterpret courtesy or friendliness as an indication of interest?

thetruthishere_ · 2021-04-25T00:53:27+00:00

[deleted]

XiSimp · 2021-04-25T00:51:00+00:00

When women treat men as friendly as they do women, it is oftentimes much too touchy and vulnerable for what men are used to in friendships. It’s a lack of understanding on both people what friendships look like to the opposite gender. A man who isn’t as well socialised with women will fall to this misunderstanding more often.

This is ignoring the fact that some women cause these “misunderstandings” on purpose. This is ignoring some men who are aggressively looking or are totally inept with social situations and treat any human contact as interest.

Goodthingstartssmall · 2021-04-25T01:09:40+00:00

what a woman think is friendliness is for another woman akin to directly offer sex to the man. A woman can even be unfriendly or indifferent and later complain how the man is clueless not getting her hints. The next woman can be touchy and cuddly but get offended if you suddenly misentepret her "friendliness" as romantic interest.

Jayfar14 · 2021-04-25T04:05:18+00:00

It's better to assume very woman doesn't like you until they make it clear 100%.

SylvestorTalone · 2021-04-25T03:05:03+00:00

Upwards of 90% of the time you aren't going to get more than that even when it is an indication of interest, so as a man, you can either make moves based on such signals, or just be a virgin.

Women are absolutely petrified of rejection, so they always want their signals to be plausibly deniable, in case it doesn't work out how she wants. In order for it to be plausibly deniable, there has to be an alternative innocent explanation for what she's doing. In other words, it has to be the sort of thing she might otherwise have done just out of friendliness/courtesy, with no romantic or sexual intent.

TheMailmanic · 2021-04-25T01:34:53+00:00

Yes, men don't get much compliments on a regular basis

goochiegg · 2021-04-25T02:21:47+00:00

Since I'm kinda ugly I'd usually would never assume a girl likes me cause she's nice to me. She's have to touch me for me to think she likes me

JediGuitarist · 2021-04-25T07:19:18+00:00

You can't win, as a man. We're endlessly told to look for "subtle" signs like touching and complimenting, but if we take those "signs" as indicators of interest we get angrily told that it didn't actually mean anything and it's just wishful thinking on our part. So we wait for something more overt and then people laugh at us about how we "don't get hints".

Man wrong, every time.

renfsu · 2021-04-25T01:50:22+00:00

I agree with this. This is probably the biggest problem I have right now. I think it's because with being friendly and being interested, the lines can be blurred. I am a guy that's pretty good at reading IOIs (there's some really subtle shit that I've picked up) but there are people that don't do anything at all that signals interest except be overly nice. I just assume that there's nothing there because if it's not an obvious yes, it's probably a no.

This is a big issue I have with gay men. They assume that because I don't bully them/are not rude to them, it means I like them. I try not to be overly nice but anything less than hostility seems to be an invitation to them.

PM-ME-YOUR-STOMACH · 2021-04-25T11:25:36+00:00

What I’d say is some girls flirt by “being nice” or “kind” but it ends up being really similar to girls who are genuinely kind. I worked with a girl like this and LEGITIMATELY every guy who wasn’t taken at some point was interested in her. She’s probably the only girl I’ve seen who didn’t have guys lusting after her but actually wanting to lock her down. 3 of the dudes there asked her for her number. 2 of them did so within the first two days of them working there with her. She declined all of them and still was friends with all of them.

She had the perfect personality for a romantic female partner. One of the guys at my job even asked her out, went on a date, and then was confused because he didn’t feel physical attracted but knew something was there.

When I talked to these guys 1 on 1 they told me they just thought she was cute and they liked her personality. Hell I even liked her at one point, but I won’t even say it was an indication of interest, she just had an inviting personality that felt warm and enveloping.

I guess it’s a bit of an alternative take but men can kinda tell when a woman is genuinely friendly or has an inviting/accepting personality. Sometimes it feels like a breath of fresh air so there will be some sort of attraction, be it platonic or romantic or physical, just off the fact she’s genuine.

To answer your question though most guys probably know by now that IOI are different for every girl but they can decide to be liberal or conservative with how broad they decide those indicators to be and whether or not to try to act on them.

GGMcThroway · 2021-04-25T01:36:44+00:00

Yes. And I hate it.

BlackPorcelainDoll · 2021-04-25T03:32:04+00:00

Often, but not always. Just because a woman is socially skilled doesn't mean she is socially intelligent. You can certainly be polite, courtesy and kind without giving a man the wrong impression. I've met plenty of dumb extroverts crossing boundaries without awareness.

If he is sexually attracted to you, it doesn't matter either way, he will pursue with a bitch face or a tooth-y grin.

theoracleofosiris · 2021-04-25T03:40:32+00:00

As a man, for my own safety, I only act when there is clearly expressed statements of interest. On paper/text or with video evidence.

flapperfemmefatale · 2021-04-25T03:42:11+00:00

All. The. Fucking. Time

thetruthishere_ · 2021-04-25T04:05:54+00:00

Yes.

DaBlockObama · 2021-04-25T01:18:30+00:00

That’s why the whole concept of communicating with “hints” is dumb. If women could communicate better then men would be less likely to misunderstand them.

psypD · 2021-04-25T07:07:12+00:00

Do women often behave in a way that crosses acquaintance boundaries and can be interpreted as wanting more? Yes.

Do women often act in a way that wastes your freaking time with their delusion that men want some platonic relation with them? Absolutely.

SaBahRub · 2021-04-25T01:02:31+00:00

Yes. It’s understandable but no less inconvenient, annoying and sometimes dangerous

RedPillDad · 2021-04-25T02:45:49+00:00

[removed]

PlayfulLawyer · 2021-04-25T00:53:55+00:00

I think many do yes, or at the very least get into their heads about it because for the most part women are not going to make the first move so a lot of times a guy may not know if it's just being nice or if he's missing some obvious hints, I learned a long time ago there's a difference between a woman being nice to you and a woman going out of her way to be nice to you.

ogres_r_like_onions · 2021-04-25T03:06:10+00:00

I remember the chick that told me to "pretend to date her" so that her ex would leave her alone. Or the chick that told a friend of a friend to pose a hypothetical, casual, totally-not-a-serious-question about how I'd feel about dating her.

I guess I'm just making the point that... women DO, in fact, do some crazy, elaborate shit to get a guy to make the first move. So if a guy misinterprets something a woman does as inviting him to date her, the fault is not squarely on the male gender for being obtuse.

If women did not have a plausibly deniable way to invite male attention, one would have to be invented within the hour. But the thing about plausible deniability is that it is indistinguishable from true ambiguity. Much to the consternation of the male gender.

cloudsongs_ · 2021-04-25T03:37:34+00:00

I hope not. It's okay if they do, but doesn't and shouldn't necessarily assume it is interest. (I'd rather have them just ask). I'm going to be kind to people whether I'm interested or not.

TFL_Legend · 2021-04-25T04:32:52+00:00

When you get mistreated as much as I do any sort of acts of kindness Is has meaning to it rather the person likes me or not

NarniaFox · 2021-04-25T05:09:42+00:00

Yes. As I agree with some other users here, I'll just write about my weirdest case. I helped a guy to clean up his flat after his birthday and all guests left and his parents were on the way home. I had to deal with his advances few months before our school graduation and no amount of explanation helped. I just washed the dishes, I honestly didn't mean anything.

no_value_male · 2021-04-25T06:19:03+00:00

Yes they do, but can you blame them. Getting a compliment or other kinds of positive attention from women is very rare indeed for non-chadly males.

just_a_place · 2021-04-25T06:42:30+00:00

For most guys I think yes, but I have the opposite problem:

A few times women have been flirty with me and I completely misjudged them as just being friendly. I only ever found out that they had any interest when my friends insisted that they were flirting but I didn't see it that way.

Women are just friendly a lot of the time so how am I supposed to know the difference between politeness and flirtation when they basically look identical? Besides, I am usually the one doing the chasing when I am interested so I only recognize when a woman is being receptive to my interest.

_Neon_Shadow_ · 2021-04-25T07:40:16+00:00

Yeah, when you are young, it makes women feel like a complete mystery. But as you get older, you stop caring, so it doesn't matter.

thatMGTOWguy · 2021-04-25T07:45:40+00:00

Women use plausible deniability and then say shit like this.

Werewolf-Wild · 2021-04-25T08:00:03+00:00

I typically do not take friendliness from women as interest and I probably miss out on opportunities because of it. As men we don't have a choice.

Genetic_Prisoner · 2021-04-25T09:50:59+00:00

So we are going to pretend that women dont flirt with men they have no romantic interests in simply because they are bored?

Det_Steve_Sloan · 2021-04-25T11:15:00+00:00

76 comments and no-one mentions flirting without intent/validation flirting.

Taken women do this all the fucking time. Flirt with a guy they like, then play dumb when escalation occurs. Then back home to pot-bellied beta fiance, feeling good about herself. "You misread the signals". Yeah, bullshit.

Pilling_it · 2021-04-25T13:31:16+00:00

The variability among IoI among women is so varied that you can't sort them out. One way to signal friendship for a woman will be an IoI for another. Women don't even have to approach, just to make it really obvious it's an IoI. I certainly have mistaken friendliness for interest and vice versa before.

As to how I react to either, I'm just cautious now depending on the environment I'm in, and treat these on a case per case basis. Overall idea though if she can easily signal it for what it is if she wants to do so, if it wasn't clear enough, there's a good chance I'll assume she's not interested enough.

trueanonymousperson · 2021-04-26T09:06:27+00:00

I used to get the friendly treatment a lot a long time ago, and also the speeches from friends that "oh she was just being nice".

The way it usually goes for me now is that someone will throw out a hint, but I (trying to be super aware that maybe she's just being friendly) will just assume they are being friendly. Then I get sad because I look back and realize that I missed an opportunity.

You know, maybe she really just wanted to watch a movie in her room alone with me.

You know, maybe she really just wanted to chill at her place alone with me after a night out on the town.

You know, maybe she really just wanted to watch the stars, alone with me, at night on some beach.

I think the best way to address this is to accept that you will make mistakes, some awkward situations might occur, and instead focus on knowing what to do if an awkward situation happens. You realize then that saying "oh I totally read that wrong let's just be friends then" makes many awkward situations go away.

skystar86 · 2021-04-25T00:55:06+00:00

You miss all the shots you don't take so interpreting it that way yields higher success.

4D-Alien · 2021-04-25T01:31:04+00:00

some guys might, but the reality is deep down all guys know when a girl is or isnt into them, and many times said guys can trick themselves into believing bullshit and chasing dreams that dont exist.

nyauknow · 2021-04-25T05:56:10+00:00

Women are so full of shit. They know what they're doing

Carkudo · 2021-04-25T03:22:01+00:00

Probably yes. Women tend to act shitty towards men they don't find attractive, so friendly behaviour is indeed a somewhat reliable sign of attraction.

It would be much less of a problem if women stopped thinking of friendliness and politeness as a reward for sexiness.

801735 · 2021-04-25T02:26:04+00:00

Do men frequently misinterpret courtesy or friendliness as an indication of interest?

What else is "courtesy or friendliness", if not an "indication of interest", tho?

Just the scale is different. While the guy may think she's thinking about sex, she's just trying to fuck with his "wallet" only (M or S from the LMS, L being just an attribute of her next victim).

rft24 · 2021-04-25T04:37:41+00:00

yes. many of them do.

TheBookOfSeil · 2021-04-25T04:59:53+00:00

Really depends on how much they're actively looking. If they're desperate or have sex on the brain, then I think they're more likely to mistake kindness for interest.

Salkinov · 2021-04-25T09:25:11+00:00

For me it was quite the opposite during school time. I often thought some girls were just nice to me but later on i realized they probably wanted more. I once got asked from a girl for some technical help in music stuff (I'm a musician) and we spent some good time making music afterwards. She was honestly like 10/10 in looks and was a very nice person to spend time with but i never even imagined that she could like me more than as a friend. My gf at the time was very jealous and told me that she is into me. Afterwards i realized this may be true i just couldn't imagine it. Especially because she knew i had a gf.

Another time a girl wanted to make out with me at a outdoor party even though she knew i was there with my gf. In that case SHE misinterpreted MY friendliness with interest.

I think in the end it totally depends on the person but i agree that mostly men misinterpret these signs. Ive seen it quite often even though my experience was different.

2021-04-25T10:00:13+00:00

Friendliness usually is a requirement for there to be any interest. The mistake I think men make is to not quit and move on when friendliness is all there is.

Melohdy · 2021-04-25T10:21:11+00:00

Yes. We're not use to others being nice to us unless there us something to it.

otter6461a · 2021-04-25T12:23:00+00:00

If a man’s not willing to risk making that mistake, well, I hope he likes being single.

smasher187 · 2021-04-25T12:46:14+00:00

There are a lot of girls who I thought were just being friendly.

Later on they confessed that they liked me.

A string of missed opportunities.

I had a girl I had an insane crush on. I'd just look at her picture and melt.

I entered into a serious relationship with someone else and she wrote to me confessing how much she liked me.

It was too late, I won't cheat on my GF to get with her.

Kaisha001 · 2021-04-25T13:26:40+00:00

Only if he's ugly.

aerial_coitus · 2021-04-25T14:42:59+00:00

Exactly. Which is why MGTOW is growing.

2021-04-25T15:03:34+00:00

If she doesn’t explicitly ask you out on a date or texts you “want to come over?”, she’s not that into you. She’s willing to do that for Chad but not for you. There’s little point and getting with a woman who doesn’t see you as a Chad.

Good-Strong · 2021-04-25T15:53:18+00:00

YES.

But I guess there's no harm done unless they go nuts on us and start hating/stalking/threatening/hurting/generally looking for "revenge" on us for not being interested.

If the guys just took rejection gracefully and left us alone after that, 99% of us would just forget the incident and carry on with life as normal.

yabbobay · 2021-04-25T21:10:46+00:00

There is no grey area sometimes.

Example:

I go to the gym and really mind my own business. I don't make eye contact. I do what I do and leave.

My friend told me that her neighbor has said he doesn't think I like (general like) him because I don't acknowledge him at the gym.

Another friend goes to same gym and smiles at people. Then she is put in the awkward position of being asked her number.

2021-04-25T21:29:20+00:00

IMO it's everyones responsibility to be a good coregulator. Coregulation is the non-verbal process of "making sure we are on the same page" that moms do with babies and eventually you do with everyone you interact with, even your boss. Typically, we are always trying to make sure we are in balanced relationships and we are constantly using trial and error to find that balance. We also know everyone else is constantly doing this as well.

If you are purposely vague or misleading or otherwise manipulating someone else's ability to coregulate, you are doing something wrong.

If you know someone likes you and is giving you special favors, you need to help them coregulate.

Obviously if someone is crazy, that's one them. I'm not saying anyone has to do anything more than just not be around someone. If someone doesn't respect your boundaries, you can always say you want to go no contact and then block them.

fourpanelwindows · 2021-04-26T04:30:46+00:00

Only men who dont get much interest do this

shnanogans · 2021-04-26T05:38:46+00:00

Yes. In general, women tend to be nicer/friendlier than men. We're used to being friendly to each other. Most men are used to (mostly) dealing with men who (again, in general) are not as nice or friendly to just the average person they see.

Guys all the time think that a women is being exceptionally friendly to them when really that's how they act towards everyone.

sweetestpineapple · 2021-04-26T11:11:22+00:00

In my experience this happens a lot when the woman is below average/ not conventionally attractive and her actions are perceived differently than if a hotter woman acted the same way. Awkward instead of quirky, desperate instead of friendly, weird instead of unique etc. I’ve been accused of trying to eyefuck a guy when I was staring off into space and maybe happened to glance at him at some point. Anyway sorry if this comment is too off topic but I thought I’d give my 2 cents on a slightly different perspective

BarestBranch · 2021-04-26T22:19:20+00:00

Yeah, I think most men are often more liable to misinterpret normal friendliness for a sign of interest than they are to miss hints. I also think 'missing hints' is a bit of a misnomer a lot of the time. It's more often about men being too afraid to act on a potential sign of interest. It's a lot safer to just not act and later talk about missing hints than it is to actually make a move and risk rejection.

Megabyte7637 · 2021-04-28T17:19:45+00:00

Not thesedays. We're more concerned with coming off creepy or getting slammed with a sexual assault/rape charge.

Joul3s214 · 2021-04-29T18:32:20+00:00

Sex differences in misperceptions of sexual interest have been well documented; see Lee et al (2020) https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0956797619900315

SrWND1 · 2021-05-06T16:15:42+00:00

2021-04-25T01:17:20+00:00

My high school teacher was hitting on me hard. I thought she was being nice to me and giving me compliments but no. Most men can't understand the signals women try to send. I think it's only shy/introvert guys that take friendliness as a sign of interest.

michael1962-01 · 2021-04-25T11:51:38+00:00

97% of men do not see it correct from my hpov.

That is why RP tells most to do 100s or 1000s 'cold approaches' as it is for the "blind" ones a number game.

They do stupid social stuff like "hi.. do you know the time? Hi...do you know which tomatoes are best?... hi...(fill in)...." and then take away your time not realising that you are disgusted and only socially enough educated not to tell "fuck off now weirdo!"

There are even treads and books about "best openers for getting someone"

"Did you fall from heaven? You look like an angel"....c'm on weirdo. 8 hours training in front of a mirror to deliver that. Now... ? Second sentence,

If you are able to see 'aura' of a human (learnable) and 'bodylanguage' of a human (learnable too) you know direct in the first fraction of seconds of eye contact as your subconcious and her subconcious exchange 100s of small nuanced informations that lead to the IoI.

Asking for a number is lame.

If it 'klicks' i'd ask direct for a coffee date on spot.

If she does not want - she has options. She just can decline, make something up or whatever.

If she really has tingles and no time she can offer her or ask for your number.

I think this approach takes all the problems away.

Even while approaching you can still see. If the bodylanguage is negative wtf? Why'd you go there.

Ok. I am approached from women too. I get - depending on bulk/cut cyckle a lot of ioi-s

But i think that part is absolute learnable.

It is so easy - done right - and so complicated done wrong.

A nice non fake smile to the ioi.

Slow going there.

"Hi. I'm Michael. Seen that smile. Lets have a coffee somewhere."

That easy. And so complicated.

Title	Do men frequently misinterpret courtesy or friendliness as an indication of interest?
Author	FantasticStranges
Upvotes	42
Comments	159
Date	April 24, 2021 11:47 PM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/mxw2lg/do_men_frequently_misinterpret_courtesy_or/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/do-men-frequently-misinterpret-courtesy-or.761297 https://theredarchive.com/post/761297

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