Recent changes to public perception of masculinity have made men, on average, softer, weaker, and less attractive which is partially why so many women are choosing to remain single

Occams_clipper · 2022-07-02T01:51:30+00:00

Why are you moralizing masculinity? Someone can absolutely be abusive, tyrannical and even 'insecure' and still be masculine.

Bonds_Girl · 2022-07-01T16:56:52+00:00

Women are constantly told we need to choose better.

So we are.

But men don’t like that irl. Lol

Of course we want strong healthy physically fit clean hygienic attractive men who are financially emotionally and mentally stable. That is choosing better.

If women can’t get that, it’s preferable to be single.

RearwindowPinecone · 2022-07-01T16:12:51+00:00

NO,these men cant pass average womans physical attraction threshold which is mostly height and face,in my opinion masculinity has nothing to do with it

sarkington · 2022-07-01T16:23:25+00:00

Well, do you guys want to be beta bux or not? It is still unclear to me

TotalTravesty · 2022-07-01T16:17:29+00:00

Be more specific. How is masculinity—specifically strength and assertiveness—being stigmatized? If you can point to a “masculine” trait being stigmatized that also doesn’t happen to be an assholish trait that has nothing to do with masculinity, you’ll get…I dunno, one internet point.

If a man isn’t strong and assertive it’s because he either doesn’t want to or physically can’t be. It’s not society’s fault (though blaming society is pretty much the hallmark of weak, passive people).

coastFI_chaser · 2022-07-02T07:16:23+00:00

Women are increasingly liking men that have a balance. Can he cook well? Does he know how to put together an outfit and look professional? Does he have friends and hobbies? Has he got a career goal or purpose? Can he apologies? Can he be supportive? Does he have a vision for life? Is he good with money? Can he clean lol?

… those are questions in my head which are both masculine and feminine. For women seeking an equal partner they want someone balanced.

Barneysparky · 2022-07-01T16:37:12+00:00

Men who believe in partnerships don't have any problem finding a partner. It's those with traditional values in relationships that do not hold those values in the rest of their lives that are having problems, ie; wanting a traditional woman who's an atheist.

gofigure62 · 2022-07-01T16:29:43+00:00

Strong, assertive, and providing are traits that most successful people possess irrespective of sex.

Most people, men included don't want to date obese, immobile, mentally ill, emotionally unstable, destitute individuals.

Men in this sub always say that women need to make a minimum of 40k to be in a relationship with them. No one wants to date an incompetent burden. No one wants to date a human shaped potato that does nothing and is nothing.

CruelAngelGradThesis · 2022-07-01T16:31:24+00:00

Look at any study and you will find significant variation in preference for "masculine" traits by age group.

Philosoferking · 2022-07-02T05:02:53+00:00

Men have not become weaker. Men have CHOSEN to become weaker because they reject masculinity, and they reject masculinity because society tries to force men to play the role of "real man."

I don't think it's because feminists have declared that masculinity itself is toxic. That's not a thing. Toxic masculinity is something else and if you STILL don't knownwhat it is, you're clearly afraid to read anything that disagrees with you and you're trapped in a right wing bubble. Coming from a right winger right here.

These men, who reject masculinity, believe that masculinity is a special thing we must achieve. According to the OP, this thing is a scientific reality. It's simply what women want.

I don't agree. I don't think women want Toxic masculine men who are hair triggers away from rage explosions at the slightest challenge to their "masculinity."

Women want men who are their real selves, not little boys playing "real man."

So many men have no only rejected masculinity, but also, they have rejected expression of their real selves.

They fear to be the masculine they are, not because masculinity is seen as bad, but because men rank eachother by an imaginary heirarchy, where the pinnacle is the ultimate man and anyone less than the pinnacle is a worthless sack of human garbage.

Valuable-Marzipan761 · 2022-07-01T17:01:52+00:00

o think this could be part of the reason so many women stay single, but I believe a big factor is that there is much less stigma on women not getting married. it used to be considered shameful to be an old spinster, whereas now it's just considered a valid personal choice.

toasterchild · 2022-07-01T17:28:21+00:00

What do you guys think men used to look like? My job exposes me to a lot of antique photographs and most of the men in them aren't like all rugged looking. Real life isn't TV shows of vikings and manly gun slingers. I think there is a romanticized idea of what things used to be like.

alfen-dave · 2022-07-01T17:06:01+00:00

KPop boys and Androgynous Chads on TikTok proves OP is full of shit.

2022-07-02T07:27:01+00:00

I think it's more the hormones and the plastics in the diet.

Vibivub · 2022-07-02T15:24:09+00:00

I think that we are currently undergoing a big transformation of masculinity in the western world. Just as how the 20th century was the decade of progress regarding femininity, leading to women‘s rights and a more progressive view on women, the 21st century will involve a change in society‘s view on masculinity. I actually believe men becoming more „weaker“ and „softer“ is a step in the right direction, but I also agree that it often undermines the assertive and confident side of masculinity that is important for being viewed as attractive.

Smitten_Squire · 2022-07-01T18:15:11+00:00

Hence the "soy boys" and "nice guys" thinking that will get them a girl by being the opposite of masculine

figuringMylife · 2022-07-01T19:24:53+00:00

i love feminine men. this is cap. but insecurities are a bitch

AelfredRex · 2022-07-01T20:56:46+00:00

Or you could avoid the stupid studies and talk to women directly, where they will point out that there's a surplus of entitled narcissistic asshole men these days and women are rightly avoiding them like the plague.

Machinecrash · 2022-07-01T18:21:18+00:00

Nah what it is, is that women can provide for themselves. So if she’s going to date you you have to pass her looks threshold or significantly out-earn her. Being a strong assertive provider is irrelevant if she makes just as much or more than you do and she’s not attracted to you. If you’re assertive but you don’t meet her looks threshold you need the big bucks that’ll make you seem like more of a lucrative option than being single. So 50k to her 20k, 80-90k to her 50k and so on.

localmicrodosechamp · 2022-07-01T21:55:56+00:00

It’s the opposite. Today’s concept of masculinity is a man I do not wanna cohabitate w. Too loud/aggressive/mean/intent on being superior to others.

_Excellent_Tree_ · 2022-07-01T22:59:11+00:00

Well yes, and then men try to “become” masculine by being toxic and that is just even worse.

jayval90 · 2022-07-02T02:31:13+00:00

I think you're missing the fact that the feeling is mutual. Men are also choosing to be single rather than deal with the modern "empowered womxn." (Which just means that they act like they don't need you and are incredibly more disagreeable).

PlayfulLawyer · 2022-07-01T16:20:43+00:00

I can definitely see that playing a part, the fact that so many people including so many men are willing to believe in the fake concept of "toxic masculinity" is just one example like that bullshit Gillette commercial from a couple years ago, and then not to mention you have the influence of the alphabet soup group emasculating a lot of men, and the rampant amount of single motherhood which leads to the real problem which is a lack of masculinity around for young men so yeah it's definitely part of the problem.

And it seems like a lot of spaces and areas that are for men at the very least receive unnecessary pushback, like there was never any reason for girls to be in the Boy Scouts, you see how much shit the manosphere gets (and yes some of it is deserved), I'm a member of a men's only Club and every once in awhile you can almost count on it like clockwork you have this sea of clucking hands making a big deal about our establishment, it's almost everything that's majority or exclusively male is frowned upon unless it means telling men that they need to cry more🤣

-Ivar-TheBoneless · 2022-07-01T16:26:01+00:00

No that's only made the men on the left softer. The men on the right are the ones they call toxic and masculine.

ImagineWagonzzz3 · 2022-07-02T03:17:32+00:00

This is why i say feminism has always been an attack on masculinity. And they won. They basically committed cultural genocide.

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Intelligent-Term · 2022-07-01T17:51:27+00:00

https://time.com/6104105/more-single-men-than-women/

https://www.pewresearch.org/social-trends/2020/08/20/a-profile-of-single-americans/

wtknight · 2022-07-01T18:38:47+00:00

It’s not too difficult for men to try to learn to emulate successful men. I disagree with much of TRP, but at least they have the will to try to become the type of guy who they believe is successful.

2022-07-02T03:07:07+00:00

Agreed.

There is no competition out there for masculine men now a days.

_Woodrow_ · 2022-07-02T07:33:54+00:00

First off, yes, popular media and overarching culture has stigmatized normal displays of masculinity (being confident, displaying strength, even things like talking and sounding like a male, to things such as taking care of ones appearance).

Toxic masculinity is indeed a problem, but it's probably somehow an offshoot of the same cultural rot that has destroyed normative masculinity, I just can't see the link right now, but it's always linked.

Lastly, yes, women do not like soft, weak, limpy, lispish men, or men who don't take care of their appearance, or men who are pushovers, and malleable. But society continuously lies about this keep men in line and create good worker bees.

HazyMemory7 · 2022-07-02T10:24:57+00:00

Not like modern day women are the pinnacle of femininity either.

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