Pros and Cons of a Traditional girl vs a Modern girl

rft24 · 2021-11-01T14:34:20+00:00

LOL i always know people who say shit like this don’t actually know many, if any, actually traditional people or relationships.

westerners have a ridiculously narrow view of what a traditional person/relationship is, and i say that as an american.

plenty of traditional women i know do not fit even half of the things you put under that title, whether they’re american-born or foreign women (the foreign women are actually tougher and stricter with their expectations ime). plenty of liberal women don’t fit a lot of the things you put under that title either.

you wouldn’t think you’d have to tell someone that people are more multi-dimensional than this, but i really have to stop expecting folks on ppd to have common sense.

NarniaFox · 2021-11-01T07:05:53+00:00

Considering that TRP is against marriage, I don't think a lot of TRPers would go for a traditional woman or could live up to her standards to start with. From the other hand, I guess most red pillers want a mix of traditional and liberal traits choosing the ones beneficial to them. Like a submissive but financially independent and not clingy woman.

Ib4, "women expect traditional dating", sure, a lot of women do it too.

Now to your lists.

Will not have more than 1 kid. Will use nanny

I think most people who want to have kids want around 2. Sure, liberal women less often have >3 kids, but it doesn't mean that the majority of them want 1.

More likely to cheat, divorce, get bored

Because of what? Yesterday I've seen one user posting a study showing that couples with one breadwinner have higher divorce rates. So it really depends on the trait we're comparing.

likely to have dated/had sex before

And She's less likely into "waiting till marriage" kind of stuff. More traditional women are religious and want to wait though.

Blames externalities more often

I'm not sure what you're basing this claim on.

Considers it to be the bare minimum only expected

If you aren't talking about women from some 3d world countries, even traditional women consider a lot of modern values a bare minimum.

More disagreeable

I guess so? Women who aren't taught to keep silent around their spouses and just do what they're told tend to be called disagreeable. From the other hand, I'm very liberal and I usually score moderately high in agreeableness.

I'm also not sure that men really appreciate the way traditional women tend to express their disagreement. A lot of them tend not to express it directly, but use more subtle and somewhat manipulative ways to do so. Not "I don't think we can afford buying a yacht right now" but "Oh, I guess we'll have to take out some of our savings...and I won't be able to buy that dress I've been dreaming about". My example is awkward because I'm very bad at "feminine talk", but I guess you get what I'm talking about. Some men find it off-putting, some are into it.

more likely to adopt an explicit communication style

And take the initiative.

not clingy and can take decisions and be strong/independent

will forgive me to a degree for being feminine and reject gender norms

Pretty much. From what I've seen from that sub for red pill women, they tend not to offer much support/help to their partners when they're distressed. They want them to keep the frame.

more smart and well-read, better income

I'm not sure about the first two, as traditional women also can get education and some of them do get it, plus, education isn't always a good indicator of one's intelligence. But better income is generally true.

more likely to be sex-positive, accept porn, want to explore sexually

I guess so? The stories from women/couples exposed to purity culture and who now struggle with having/enjoying sex are awful.

Mimoxs · 2021-11-01T13:32:56+00:00

no past relationships

Where's that meme showing the wojaks of different girls with body counts and it's like the goth girl -2, the egirl -3, the tradcon girl -35

Unlikely to cheat/divorce

Combined with ^ that tho in all seriousness though I would kill a man to be as innocent and naive as op

PopularBug5 · 2021-11-01T07:03:07+00:00

Correct me if I am wrong, but aren't divorces the highest in the Bible Belt? The less educated, the more ahem cross-fingers "religious", the more likely they hooked up and have past relationships, and the less stable their marriages are.

They are not religious - just in name only. Their knowledge of religion is shallow, even shallower than those with no religion but have the knowledge to make informed opinions about it. Most of the time they sit down at church and listen to sermons rather than study the bible pages.

...hell, even just absentmindedly pretending to listen to the sermons too like a disinterested kid in classroom. Modern Christians nowadays treat Church like speed dating meetups for 'trad' types when they have fornicated outside (cause sinning outside of the House of God doesn't count, tee hee!) and then wanting to settle down afterward.

AquaChip · 2021-11-01T15:38:15+00:00

This list doesn’t seem accurate. The majority of modern women who are married have more than 1 kid and don’t use a nanny. And even if they only have one kid can you blame them? A lot Men don’t exactly help with child rearing.

Is doing 50% of the housework THAT bad?

More likely to cheat than women from 50 years ago? I’m gonna need stats on that. Women from 50 years ago cheated. They just didn’t divorce.

Again dating and having sex with someone before you isn’t a bad thing. You’re just insecure and possessive.

How is having no past relationships a positive? People who don’t have past experience are more likely to act in ways that are selfish without knowing because they don’t know how to act in a relationship.

All the positives on the traditional side indicate that you don’t want a partner you want a doormat and a maid who will bend to your will.

Fabulous-Housing102 · 2021-11-01T09:15:30+00:00

In what universe are sahm obedient and not bossy? Have you met any sahm? They run their homes like a military leader and certainly boss around their spouses!

j_arbuckle2012 · 2021-11-01T13:32:48+00:00

This list is ridiculous.

"Traditional" women don't exist. They never have. You're using some sort of pants-on-head universalism to ascribe "traditionality" to women whom simply have preferences for mate choice and lifestyle.

Further, marriage is neither traditional nor liberal. It is simply marriage. It has taken on all sorts of forms and functions throughout history. When we take the aggregate of the concept of marriage across the historical/cultural spectrum it ends up being about monogamy, children, and community. In that sense, then, traditional women are any woman who wants to get married and be monogamous, have kids, and be a part of a larger community through her marriage. That is the majority of women, regardless of sociopolitical leaning.

NarniaFox · 2021-11-01T06:17:49+00:00

You've kind of fucked up your formatting.

WestsideMoonWalker · 2021-11-01T06:20:14+00:00

I actually think TRP men would be very unhappy with traditional women. TRP men don't exactly strike me as that type that would be happy with a woman who was reserved and vanilla. Also imagine religious women would be out for them.

I think the locus of control point is off though. That has more to do with other factors imo.

Altruistic_Wafer4398 · 2021-11-01T06:27:06+00:00

I’m liberal but I want 3 kids at least. Also I took a big 5 personality test and I’m 90% agreeable.

NoMarriageNoKids · 2021-11-01T10:45:51+00:00

Whoever made this list hasn't dated both types of women.

DreamsOfWishes · 2021-11-01T08:49:14+00:00

I would switch the divorces and cheating between the colomns. Religious women are more likely to divorce and cheat. A modern girl will have left you before marriage and will leave you before cheating.

And more agreeable is highly subjective. It depends more on whether you two have less potential conflict, then on their religious beliefs are not. Ya think a religious woman is just gonna be agreeable if you tell the kids they don't have to go to church.

And then you put obedience with religious women??? Have you heard of the freaking term "Karen"???? I think you have a very...fantasy view of religious women...

eiggteen · 2021-11-01T15:20:01+00:00

Traditional woman will indeed boss their husband around if he slacks lmao, our grandmothers didn’t play

Cooking for your spouse isn’t traditional lmao

And liberal woman are very much against porn...lol

Laytheblameonluck · 2021-11-01T13:15:25+00:00

Traditional	Feminist
Is Feminist when it suits them	Is Traditional when it suits them

Bandit174 · 2021-11-01T07:46:14+00:00

I dont think most of those are exclusive to either side.

The average traditional girl isn't saving herself for marriage anymore than the average liberal is.

I think liberal women expect the guy to be masculine and aren't any more forgiving of weakness than trad girls are.

Liberal women are not immune from bossing men around.

and I don't think liberal women are going to be more exploratory with their husbands. I think a lot of the time they get all that out of their systems with hot guys off tinder and at college and then end up making guys pay for dinner date and waiting for sex only to eventually deadbedroom their hubbies just as much as the trad women do. Just look at FDS posts, they almost all have a history of casual sex but now they put on the trad act. So you get the worst of both worlds in a lot of cases.

Whether you have a fun sex life is more based on the type of guy you are than it is the type of woman you marry. If you're a hot high value man you can have a fun sex life with either type of woman and if you're not you probably wont.

ToughAnswers · 2021-11-01T07:10:50+00:00

Tradition for tradition

Modernity for modernity

Incongruence is a sacrifice made for NOTHING

SonicBackScratcher · 2021-11-01T14:36:04+00:00

This is less traditional vrs liberal but personality types.

My wife for example has strong mixes of both.

You can want kids and still like FMF 3somes, you can be disagreeable and still be religious (SNL had a long running skit about this called "The Church Lady")

ilovepetya · 2021-11-01T19:01:23+00:00

"Traditional" women don't exist. Period end of story. Women in Saudi Arabia use Tinder (this is really true lmao)

LowCreddit · 2021-11-01T20:09:43+00:00

As someone married to a very traditional woman, this list is completely out of touch with reality. You are building up a perfect woman in your mind who doesn't exist. Even if she did, she would date a similarly perfect man.

neetykeeno · 2021-11-02T00:02:36+00:00

Eh. Whichever girl you date it is still going to be you dating her and you are going to be the cause of problems in the relationship too. There is no choosing your way out of the fact you are going to have to deal with another unique human being and humans are awkward to deal with

manfrom-nantucket · 2021-11-02T01:49:26+00:00

Pump and dump, wifing up a modern woman is a useless endeavor.

AidsVictim · 2021-11-02T04:49:45+00:00

I am sure there are girls leaning towards one of these sides, but no one is perfectly fitting into any one category. Do you think this list is missing anything or inaccurate when it depicts the tradeoffs between these two kinds of girls.

I think there is merit to the idea that "traditional" women are a better deal for men, and probably their kids and family in general - arguably themselves as well looking at happiness rates and general life outcomes. I think a few of the things listed here are of under false assumptions though (to be fair as you pointed out these aren't typically concrete categories) assuming traditional here means something like 1950's America. This is just my perspective from experience, reading history, and having met women from fairly traditional subcultures

Trad:

no past relationships - Only in highly religious communities. most traditional women will have had relationships of one type or another. Pre marital sex wasn't that uncommon for many women albeit having an n count of 1 was also common whereas such women basically don't exist now.

will not boss me around - they definitely can boss you around. Traditional relationships were about both partners fulfilling gendered roles and if the "wrong" personality types are married then the woman will be the "boss", although maybe not explicitly. Again super subservient women are really a highly religious communal thing.

Internal locus of control - this is just a personality type thing

implicit signals, indirect - maybe. I don't think modern women are really much more direct on average. There were at least more clearly understood social rules in the past.

modern "liberal" women:

will forgive me to a degree for being feminine and reject gender norms - this is mostly a facade. In some ways it's even more important you maintain masculinity with modern women because they are much more likely to move on if they see weakness.

many more common interests/hobbies - maybe. There's definitely more gender neutral hobbies and clubs but it's not that uncommon for men and women to still have pretty gender segregated interests.

more smart and well-read, better income - They're more educated certainly. The content of the education doesn't necessarily produce more "intelligent" people or desirable outcomes though.

a14deadpool · 2021-11-02T20:06:13+00:00

In my experience traditional women can be just as unfaithful as modern women. In fact some traditional women are more unfaithful because since they got married young eventually they will have that feeling of wanting to explore because they didn’t do it in their earlier days and then they will cheat.

RDelbson · 2021-11-02T20:08:11+00:00

You should add another row:

Traditional: Has a private instagram account, posts pictures of herself with friends and family rarely.

Modern: Has a public instagram account, posts racy photos of herself in an attempt to gain followers.

GrandRub · 2021-11-02T20:43:48+00:00

biggest con of a traditional girl - wants a traditional man.

kyjolski · 2021-11-03T01:25:37+00:00

I'll never understand the 'no past relationships' obsession of some men. The way I see it, it's human nature that 'grass is always greener on the other side of the fence', after a while.

Wouldn't such a girl then be more, not less, likely to cheat/leave simply out of curiosity and not having any barometer as to how relationships look like?

Jakes1967 · 2021-11-01T06:31:49+00:00

I think TRP guys will likely be wanting a more traditional girl?

People seem to consider me Red Pilled and from observation and experience, RP men tend to go for less traditional women, but one's that have certain traits they're looking for.

My wife is a HUGE mix of traditional and liberal, but with the traits I'm looking for.

I wonder if they realize the exact pros and cons between the two types of girls.

Probably better than most.

JacobMoogberg69 · 2021-11-01T07:56:24+00:00

I will take the girl that gives the best head.

baresquad · 2021-11-01T22:29:04+00:00

I’ll take the leftist woman over the traditionalist 100 times out of 100

Granted your pros cons list seems to be a little skewed so just speaking in general, yeah.

yungthrowaway97 · 2021-11-01T06:42:43+00:00

Traditional sucks for the most part. The only issue I have with modern American women is they absolutely do have a lot of entitlement but same can be said for guys. Also their vibe is really masculine. You honestly can really tell the difference if you talk to someone in a less western culture South America, East Europe, some parts of Asia etc.

TheJim66 · 2021-11-01T06:55:19+00:00

The only actual con you've listed for the trad girl is the increased likelihood for lack of kinkiness. Everything else ranged from a pro to irrelevant.

Both expect you to be just as masculine.

The answer seems pretty obvious. Fuck the modern girl because she puts out easier, get a relationship with the trad girl. If you ever want a relationship of course.

Booexgirlfriend · 2021-11-01T07:24:32+00:00

And kids, this is the reason why these men fail in all their relationships because traditional girls can cheat, divorce and has past relationships, may it takes more time but can happen if he fails. A liberal girl can be faithful, less likely to divorce and still virgin. At the end of the day is just an ideology. Women are people, men are people too.

TRP guys will likely be wanting a more traditional girl but he would get tired of her. Faithfulness and all the work is on her always, never in TRP guys.

Wildhouse83 · 2021-11-01T13:32:36+00:00

I think the similarities are more common than the differences. All women have the same basic operating system, like Briffaults law, hypergamy, dual mating strategy etc. This becomes very obvious especially in front of divorce courts.

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nemma88 · 2021-11-01T09:56:29+00:00

I mean there's lots of ways to look at all of these really - take the divorce example (which elsewhere has been described as in the wrong column but anyway) would that really be a con in itself? Is a unhappy relationship with someone that doesn't want to be with you better than getting divorced? Isn't divorce in traditional relationships the divorce that men complain about with the possibility of alimony etc while equitable relationships is less stressful in dividing assets?

Even in the pro's there are cons and cons there are pros - so it's hard to have a 'definitive' list so to speak, one mans con is a pro etc.

hatit516 · 2021-11-01T11:35:24+00:00

Idk what you wrote but the quality you wrote are not traditional vs non traditional. The traditional one sound like a slave and half of the thing you wrote in the non traditional one is thing you will find that women do regardless if there are traditional or non traditional soem thing you wrote are also Interchangeable for the what you wrote for non traditional as well some thing are stright absent. You write this as if you never delte with a women at all and all your info on women are from media. This is pure bull shit your writing and you need to Deal with women instead of dealing with them through media

houstongradengineer · 2021-11-02T02:56:21+00:00

Will use nanny? What world do you live in?

heyitsjeape · 2021-11-02T12:25:18+00:00

what do you mean by less common vs. more common interests? Wouldn’t traditional people have interests that are more commonly found amongst females?

SaBahRub · 2021-11-02T21:34:52+00:00

Lol if you think you’re gonna get a guarantee

Life is messy, sorry to inform you

Prize-Thought-4205 · 2021-11-09T11:24:02+00:00

I’m sorry, I just woke up and I’m reading this and j can’t stop laughing for some reason lol I’m crying

the-aids-bregade · 2021-11-10T11:28:40+00:00

This man said he wants a slaves not a person

Traditional	Vs	Liberal Girls
will stay home and raise kids		Will not have more than 1 kid. Will use nanny
cooks, etc. for us,		We both do equal housework nearly 50 50
unlikely to cheat, divorce		More likely to cheat, divorce, get bored
no past relationships		likely to have dated/had sex before
will not boss me around		I have to trust her more because power is more egalitarian
Internal locus of control		Blames externalities more often
grateful for my modern value		Considers it to be the bare minimum only expected
More agreeable		More disagreeable

implicit signals, indirect		more likely to adopt an explicit communication style
dependent on me, obedient		not clingy and can take decisions and be strong/independent
expects me to be masculine		will forgive me to a degree for being feminine and reject gender norms
less common interests		many more common interests/hobbies
religious		less religious, superstitious, etc
usually less educated		more smart and well-read, better income
less likely to be kinky		more likely to be sex-positive, accept porn, want to explore sexually
Can become modern/rad fem later		She has been exposed and has formed informed views

Title	Pros and Cons of a Traditional girl vs a Modern girl
Author	Mark_Freed
Upvotes	16
Comments	155
Date	November 1, 2021 6:14 AM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/qk7w0p/pros_and_cons_of_a_traditional_girl_vs_a_modern/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/pros-and-cons-of-a-traditional-girl-vs-a-modern.1080665 https://theredarchive.com/post/1080665

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