Why do women hate n-counts?

trueorfalsedmitry · 2019-12-02T00:16:29+00:00

Personally, I am quite ambivalent about the effect of a woman's n-count. I can certainly see the pseudoscience and the hypocrisy for what they are. But, I do want to take issue with one motif I see here, time and time again: The idea that men (writ large) don't care and/or never think/talk about it outside of Reddit.

I've been in male groups all my life, including groups of literally all PhDs in various subjects (not just STEM), team sports athletes on college and post-college teams, fucking rednecks who do little but work manual labor and smoke and drink, and weirdo goths. In every case, the N-count of women has come up! Men care. A LOT.

If you are woman, of course you've never been asked about it. The supposition is that you will lie. Why ask and gain nothing information-wise, while pissing you off? Every man you've ever been with has wondered about it. And, most of them care.

Reisiluu · 2019-12-01T22:49:42+00:00

I think there's nothing wrong with asking about it or making judgements or rejecting women for it.

It's just that it's impossible for women to meet the standards of some hypocritical lunatics. Like women have to somehow peer into the future to know if the guy they are on a third date with will marry her, knowing that the decision to increase her n count from 2 to 3 will make her more undateable than before but he won't wait for sex much longer.

Navigating that level of cognitive dissonance is just not worth it. Luckily smarter men exist.

exparadox001 · 2019-12-01T22:25:13+00:00

I wouldn't ever ask. You can begin to infer when you learn about her past relationships and meet her friends. You'll never get a truthful answer.

SmurfESmurferson · 2019-12-01T21:56:43+00:00

Anyone can have any standards they want, that’s fine. If N count is a hard limit for a guy, then it is what it is. There’s no point in getting mad about it, you weren’t going to be compatible with him anyhow

The problem a lot of women have is that the guys on here assign weird moral judgments to it. Just own the fact that it makes you uncomfortable, and be ok with that

brinkleybuzz · 2019-12-03T06:21:53+00:00

Spot on. Guys care because the type of woman they partner with impacts their perceived value to other men and women. The guy who wifes up the town bike is considered a joke whereas the man who lands the beauty who rejected all of the other guys is called a stud.

Women hate n-count because it's an objective metric that significantly affects their relationship market value and, because you can't un-fuck someone, past behavior may have a lasting impact on a woman's ability to land a quality mate.

flamingoinghome · 2019-12-01T22:04:39+00:00

So ladies, would you be less against the n-count debate if the men on here toned down the sexist hate?

Yes. I have absolutely no beef with a guy who doesn't like casual sex (perhaps he's religious, or demisexual, or just finds sex quite intimate and romantic), who wants to date a woman with a similar mindset. I do admit that I'd find a partner wanting details of my sexual history off the bat a little startling, but that's a cultural-taboo thing, and would honestly be highly dependent on phrasing.

The misogyny, hypocrisy, anger, etc., are my issues. There's a world of difference between "I, personally, do not want to date a promiscuous/very experienced woman," and "promiscuous/experienced women are worthless undatable scum (who I still want to fuck)."

Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2019-12-01T22:10:19+00:00

It is such a weird personality trope to describe women arguing with men as women "losing their minds" over a subject. It is self-serving and untrue. What women do here on the debate subreddit is argue with the men about the importance of it, as they are the ones who experience dating men. I certainly cannot deny that there are men to whom it is important. But women generally do not date those men and women don't experience them and the female experience is generally that men don't care. Maybe 100 men have rejected a woman because of her N count but she will never know that. all she knows is she has a boyfriend and he doesn't care and neither have any of the men she has ever had a relationship with. So what women are arguing with is that it matters to women, not whether it matters to men or should matter to men. Let it matter to you all you want but telling women that it is something in their lives, well they are gonna argue with that

Also what we argue with is the weird fetishistic clinging to the revenge fantasy life story you all repeat as if it is some gospel you learned in church about what this high count woman's life is like and what her life will be like. When you make these assertions the women who actually have these lives that don't match your story are going to argue with you. That is again not women freaking out that is women arguing with you

slavicgypsygirl · 2019-12-02T01:13:17+00:00

When men are crazy attracted to you irl none care how many guys you have had sex with

This is only something I see on this & other Reddit subs

goatismycopilot · 2019-12-01T22:07:59+00:00

Because we have several posts a week about it.

satanic_hamster · 2019-12-01T22:46:09+00:00

Can you show me an example of the women here losing their minds over it? I've seen them disagree, but not this hysteria you're talking about.

crookedsummer2019 · 2019-12-01T23:40:11+00:00

If guys don’t want to date a girl with a high n count that’s their right it’s not up to anyone else what standards they want to apply. I have no problem with that.

It’s the hypocritical shaming and judgement that’s annoying and particularly when it’s coming from guys who actively try to get easy sex from multiple women who they then criticize for being slutty and low value.

And the whole high n count = inability to pair bond crap. From what I have read in many RP sites guys preach about avoiding being in exclusive relationships and not investing any feelings while always having an IDGAF attitude, so seems they can’t ‘pair bond’ either. But of course, they call that ‘game’ :/.

katymarx · 2019-12-01T22:09:56+00:00

I dislike the sentiment about having sex physically deteriorates the vagina and mind of a woman automatically. Otherwise, vetting for n count is fine. It's not like it's hard to figure out the guys who care about it and lie to them appropriately anyway.

Bright_Itempas · 2019-12-01T22:21:12+00:00

I hate N counts cause men online are so freaking obsessed with it. They're obsessed with their own N counts, with other mens N counts, with women's N counts. It's all wrapped up into an odd, immature circle jerk where men use women's sexuality to compete with other men and get mad at women for not gatekeeping their pussy hard enough.

Then the same men will bitch and moan when THEY are subject to pussy gatekeeping. They'll tell women here in PPD that waiting until the third date is outrageous and waiting until exclusivity will mean a woman will never find a man. That pussy is cheap.

Damned if you fuck, damned if you don't.

In any case, I've been asked about my N count twice IRL, and it always falls apart when I:

A) Tell men to define "sex," and B) Ask if sex with women counts

Turns out the only thing that mattered to these men was cock, which then feels vaguely homoerotic. What kind of heterosexual, high value, alpha man cares so much about other men's cocks? What happened to inner game and frame? It's just weird as shit to me.

i_have_a_semicolon · 2019-12-01T22:41:31+00:00

It's an intellectual debate.. I have opinions... Don't care if men reject women for it.. not my problem

Manny1400 · 2019-12-01T22:15:02+00:00

N-count obsession is not congruent with my IRL experience. Nor of my friends as far as I know. It isn't ever discussed, it is never an issue.

pajoorajoo · 2019-12-01T23:19:44+00:00

Its because a person's behavior defines who and what they are. If a person is a casual sex person, they're not really a commitment/marriage person. Its not a judgement, its an observation about them. Failure to make this observation is why the divorce rate is so high. Women who aren't suited for marriage are getting married to desperate guys who overlook observations they should be making.

kandyapplez · 2019-12-01T22:35:23+00:00

i'm against the n-count debate because i hate having to pretend something that isn't a thing is a thing. i've only ever been asked my n-count once by a dude and it was in college. none of the men who have dated me seriously have ever asked me about this. it doesn't come up. n-count preferences are pretty much imaginary

poppy_blu · 2019-12-01T22:52:07+00:00

Women don’t “loose their minds”’ about it here. Men do. Count how many of the last 50 posts about n count were from men vs women. And they pretty much all say the same thing.
Pointing out that real life evidence contradicts the idea that high count women (which here means 1+) are rejected by men isn’t “losing our minds.”
Pointing out that the “women with more partners are less happy in marriage” study doesn’t actually say what they think it does isn’t “losing our minds.”

OP pretty much just confirmed that men’s n count posts are meant to troll women for reactions rather than having any real discussion.

Do you. Screen for n count. I can’t even say it’s a bad strategy cause it’s not. OK?

Ofourkind · 2019-12-01T21:56:49+00:00

It's just a weird incel obsession.

In all my years of dating, it's never been brought up.

kicht · 2019-12-01T21:57:05+00:00

It's because the n count debate is pointless. Men wi never know a womans n count, and who they marry and commit to is not based on n count at all.

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[deleted] · 2019-12-01T22:36:23+00:00

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downvotesanimals · 2019-12-01T23:52:52+00:00

Do they?

nemma88 · 2019-12-02T00:59:58+00:00

I'm not convinced anyone has anything inherintly against n counts. I absolutly believe people avoid mating with slutty people. While they often go hand in hand, this isn't always the case and it wasn't until I thought about it there there seemed a missing link in the logic. I don't care personally but everyone I know has normal n counts so nothing to get personally annoyed by I guess.

JerkyMcGee · 2019-12-02T02:03:23+00:00

Can someone fill me in on what an "n count" is?

geyejoe7 · 2019-12-02T05:03:25+00:00

Guys are more protective over their "goods". And dome "goods" have been used 10 times previous to you, you're less likely to want them...

Female_urinary_maze · 2019-12-02T05:39:13+00:00

I'm not sure that there's no way to be that ate up about a woman's "n-count" without it being a sexist thing, or at least a purity culture thing. I think that even if a dude isn't a huge dick about it judging women based on "n-counts" comes from having internalized some sex-negative bullshit.

That being said if a dude rejected me on those grounds I wouldn't be really pissed. I might be annoyed, but it'd be for the best. It's good when people with incompatible values remove themselves from my dating pool.

GrievenLeague · 2019-12-02T06:25:40+00:00

Lol @ this thread. You people really think guys don't care about n-counts irl? They literally just don't ask. Nobody wants to date a town bike but nobody wants to check it, either.

Women that hate n-counts have their n-counts in triple digits or high double digits.

WOLFofwallstrYEET · 2019-12-02T06:52:00+00:00

I’m pretty late to this I suppose but I’ll add in my two cents. As a guy I’d like any girl I’m with to have a n count that’s under 30. However it’s not a dealbreaker for me. What counts is her willingness to get into an exclusive relationship with me now and not cheat.

thisgirlheidi · 2019-12-02T07:37:18+00:00

Fwiw, I'm a woman who's had 8 sexual partners while my boyfriend has had upwards of 30, and it makes me uncomfortable that he's had so much casual sex while I haven't, but obviously I am attracted to him & fell in love with him anyway. I guess I just wanted to say that I see where OP is coming from, and also those of you who say it doesn't matter so much irl.

parahacker · 2019-12-02T08:17:39+00:00

As a guy, I truly do not care about n count. Really. But I DO care about integrity.

Break up with your boyfriend, and land in someone's bed the next night? Nope. No no no. You have no respect. You will do the same thing to me.

Double dipping? Adulterer? You are a liar, a user, and again have no respect. You place no value on the emotions of the man/men in your life. Nope.

Polygamous? I'm OK with that. As long as you're honest and respectful. That said, those relationships tend to have more drama than I can handle, but I respect your choices. Open relationships are too hard for me. I am a one woman man.

And for those especially vile women who are grooming a new man while preparing to dump the man they are with, I am seriously done with all of you. Die in a fire. That is devastating to men, it is like emotional rape. And way, WAY too common. Do NOT DO THIS.

I'd rather date a porn star with hundreds in with honesty than a woman who did that evil crap to her fewer but far worse scarred exes.

Women who treat men as disposable are a blight. Again, this can be just as emotionally scarring as rape, and to hell with anyone upset by that comparison. I don't give a hot damn about your n count, but I care everything about how well you treated them.

JezebeltheQueen5656 · 2019-12-02T16:27:31+00:00

i dont hate it, i just dont answer the question should the moid be so audacious to ask. none of my friends tolerate any kind of intrusive questioning like that either. it's a matter of self respect.

MuleFool42 · 2019-12-02T18:10:21+00:00

I do believe that the n count thing being important for men is real. I don't get into evolutionary psychology that much but there does seem to be some truth to the idea that males do not want to invest time, energy, resources, and possibly their lives, protecting, feeding, and providing for offspring that are not theirs.

This is observable in many species, why not humans? The imperative of genes to reproduce would seem to dictate activities that would ensure certain genes survive - your own!

Women don't have to worry about it, when a baby is born, they know it's theirs. Men, until genetic testing came along, never knew. So for men, or for at least some men, loyalty is valued. As a high n count in women is a rough indicator of disloyalty, at least in that the woman doesn't stick around for long and is just as likely to be impregnated by any other guy, then n count becomes a red flag for men who want a family with their own biological children.

Enough men have n count requirements for it to matter more than that they're all just insecure about their sex lives. It's a thing, and I do think it is something about evolutionary biology that makes them avoid women with high n counts.

Grek27 · 2019-12-02T19:50:58+00:00

Because it excludes them from being anything more than sex.

It literally ends their life plan of AFBB.

Plutonic_blue · 2019-12-04T12:59:30+00:00

Personally I'm not as extreme about a woman's N counts because it is her past but it still matters. I mean the highest I'll go with a woman is 10 because at that point, a man will feel like he's just getting leftovers and no man wants to think about the amount of men their partner has slept with.

Honestly for women, I'd just say don't talk about it, and for men not to ask. I never asked my ex about her sexual past because number one, I didn't want to think about a woman I'm in love with getting plowed by 10 different guys or being in threesomes like hell no, no man would no matter what.

Unfortunately I found out from mine because her family and her would openly talk about her sexual past in front of me and yes it does matter. I mean what man wants to know his woman was in a threesome and fucked over 10 guys?

PanderjitSingh_k · 2019-12-01T21:50:20+00:00

Why do people ask?

Never occurred to me to ask and so long as they’re competent I’m happy.

Willow-girl · 2019-12-01T23:35:25+00:00

I'm more mystified than "outraged" by the comments here. IRL, I've never had a man ask my N-count or make a big deal over it, so it's surprising to see it hotly debated here. Quite possibly this is a generational thing and us old folks simply didn't/don't GAF to the extent that you kids do?!

mistresswhat · 2019-12-02T01:12:26+00:00

If you go on the internet talking about how women who have slept around a bit are all disgusting damaged whores you want to provoke a response and you'd be disappointed if you didn't get one. You could just quietly date near-virgins instead of spouting virulent pseudo-science, but you chose your choice and now you're playing dumb about it.

The same guys going "oh, not dating those disgusting damage whores is my preference, why u mad?" are the ones who get viciously defensive if anyone says "nah, I don't want to date those guys either because I think they're stupid and insecure."

spicy-heck-boi · 2019-12-05T08:13:05+00:00

N-counts are inherently toxic and objectifying whether applied to men or women. They’re a relic from abrahamic religions designed to control and subjugate women (your village murdered you if you didn’t bleed on your wedding night). It’s like asking if Jewish people would be cool with eugenics if we made it less about nazis. It’s still a no!

You don’t have to date anyone you don’t want to. Just keep your gross reasons to yourself.

Title	Why do women hate n-counts?
Author	FatmanSlim93
Upvotes	17
Comments	336
Date	December 1, 2019 9:47 PM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/e4od38/why_do_women_hate_ncounts/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/why-do-women-hate-n-counts.297400 https://theredarchive.com/post/297400

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