Resumes with a female name were 41% more likely to receive a callback than resumes with a male name for software engineering jobs

SudoSlash · 2022-09-05T13:29:57+00:00

This is obvious to anyone in the industry.

Me and my wife graduated the same year when we were in college. Her background was in classical piano but her parents forced her in to computer science, she wasn't exactly a star student. I had been programming since I was of single digits age, done public speaking, got a Olympiad medal and a big tech scholarship.

My professors and seniors in industry at the time were telling me that employers in tech would be lining up left and right to hire me because I had experience and accolades. The opposite was the truth. As a male and especially white or asian male you are the bottom of their priority list. This isn't to disparage anyone, it is simply what is structurally and provably being practiced in both college and entry-level job applications. Which of course mostly screws over the men from lower classes that are already most likely to end up homeless or in jail.

My wife got interviews from Amazon, Meta and Microsoft and was hired by a tech company within 30 applications. She put in the work and totally deserved it, make no mistake. But the odd thing is that we applied to similar companies and she could often skip the bigger technical assessment or take home assignment after the initial screener. I took me around 100 applications to get a job and of the pool of big tech only Amazon interviewed me despite being in the top of my cohort. They had me do multiple rounds of technical assessments after the initial OA before getting the on-site opportunity, which is a similar experience to some of my other male classmates. My wife at the time thought I applied for a different job altogether because she was invited to their office right after a recruiter call and a screener.

They always respond with that interviewees are held to the same standard, but this is simply not the case. For tech organizations having only white/asian male staff is simply a liability in the current political climate and having a so called diverse profile offers them business advantages. Of course they are going to be more eager to lower their hiring standards, not because women are less capable, but simply because the pool of women is smaller and they are more desirable for political/business reasons. Sometimes this may even be subconscious or structural business culture. This is really no different from how top colleges systematically discriminate specific applicants by putting them to much, much higher standards. This is also why some people have such different experiences and gaslight some incredibly intelligent people by saying they are not good enough, which is just frustrating and dishonest.

buppyu · 2022-09-05T11:08:41+00:00

Yes, men are clearly and openly discriminated against in many fields. The exact opposite of the dominant narrative.

My company has publicly announced they they will no longer be considering men for promotions into or within management, for example. They pat themselves on the back for their virtue at every opportunity.

Unable-Ad3852 · 2022-09-05T12:35:57+00:00

Well that's obvious and even more so. Companies go hand over fist to attract women in software :

Like this train to hire women only programs : https://bumble.com/the-buzz/bumble-tech-academy-for-women-software-engineers

Or outright women only hiring events : https://assessment.hackerearth.com/challenges/hiring/codehers-walmart-software-engineer-women-only-hc/

And there's women only job sites that companies can disclose positions for before uploading to say something like indeed or LinkedIn. https://www.womenwhocode.com/jobs

The reason it's unappealing is how software development is benchmarked and metered due to the agile processes. Once you're shredded into monthly evals, code reviews and everyone nitpicks your work, you really need a thick layer of skin to openly embrace all that "constructive criticism". Thereof the princess types feel hopelessly lost and pivot in hr ASAP. And the cycle repeats itself... Gee, we don't have women who code therefore DEI is down our throat to hire anyone to fulfill the benchmark. In my company they ended up adding a "culture" metric to the by yearly performance reviews that scores things like volunteering, representation in above programs and advocacy/activism that can counterbalance dev performance.

hendrixski · 2022-09-05T12:53:26+00:00

I'm a software engineering manager. AMA.

In my past 2 companies we have unofficially prioritized hiring female engineers - including prioritized promoting women to Lead Engineer. We still have very few female engineers.

dw87190 · 2022-09-05T10:03:36+00:00

As usual, the truth is the exact opposite to feminists' claims

PersonalDevKit · 2022-09-05T13:59:33+00:00

This has been going on for a long time

Back in University around, 2012, a team I was on won a competition and I was contacted by the sponsor of the comp for an interview.

I excitedly told the lecturer who supported us in the comp, he told me straight away "You won't get the job" I was a little shocked, asked him why? "You're not a girl, that company is only hiring girls right now to make their quota more 50/50".

5 interviews later and guess who got the job, the 1 girl in the competition who's team was in bottom 25%. That was the tipping point for me to stay away from big corporate companies.

stanleefromholes · 2022-09-05T12:02:35+00:00

It’s everywhere. It’s why I’m here tbh. I confess I was something of a liberal feminist type (not the insufferable kind I promise) and I still think there are genuine issues faced by women that aren’t faced by men (and vice versa of course!).

But this is entering the realms of deeply unfair social engineering. It’s simply not acceptable to be going about things the way it’s being done, with quotas and ‘reverse’ discrimination. They lost me.

I was, and am, a huge supporter of fairness. This isn’t fair.

bfte2 · 2022-09-05T11:49:48+00:00

Morons are probably like "but it's not 50%, therefore patriarchy!!!!".

Alarmed-Call8569 · 2022-09-05T12:00:17+00:00

HR is dominated by womyn

hawkeyepitts · 2022-09-05T14:20:08+00:00

I see commercials about encouraging young women to major in STEM fields, clubs for girls who want to learn to code, plus blatant and literal discrimination in hiring procedures.

I think it’s good that everyone feel welcomed into the field they’re interested in. But it’s pure sickening the way they try to push girls into STEM and basically say go show the boys how stupid they are because you’re a stifled genius and are entitled to show them who’s boss. Boys aren’t encouraged to attend college at all, let alone guided towards any particular field. It’s like, nobody gives a shit about us as long as we’re silently making other people’s lives easier.

A lot of girls aren’t interested in STEM subjects. A lot of boys aren’t either. Why are we telling all girls they deserve to be in STEM and push them into it, when a lot of the time, they aren’t genuinely interested? Or they get there and realize how difficult and boring it is. I majored in physics and the large amount of women freshman year who were so smug about having infiltrated the boy’s club had all dropped out by junior year. They realized (shock!) that there is no boy’s club and they were obviously welcome in class on the simple basis that they’re a fucking student who wanted to learn about the same fucking subject.

I don’t think it’s entirely wrong for employers to be aware of a significant gender imbalance in their workforce - but it’s not because they refuse to hire one sex over the other. If it’s a field where there simply aren’t enough qualified candidates of one sex, it’s ridiculous and discriminatory to try and have a 50/50 gender balance. You’re going to turn down a lot of qualified people in order to get a bunch of mediocre or even terrible employees just so you can say the employer is equal or whatever.

Angryasfk · 2022-09-05T11:04:55+00:00

Well there are quotas to fill and other affirmative action programs, so I’m not in the least surprised.

ForeskinPincher · 2022-09-05T16:53:21+00:00

A good friend of mine in high school, when we were all applying to colleges, told me she wanted to study computer science at the same college I was applying to(the best computer science program in the state), because it "seemed fun". She showed me her transcripts and essays, and she had never taken any programming classes or had any prior experience, nor did she really show why she wanted to pursue it in her writing or provide reasons as to why she ought to be accepted. I, on the other hand, with all of those things and a 3.8 GPA, didn't get in while she did.

My 5-6 other peers, with similar academic and racial backgrounds(take a wild guess as to what racial demographics we belong to) told the same stories.

ChicagoIndependent · 2022-09-05T12:44:00+00:00

Should I change my name to a female name then?

JayTheFordMan · 2022-09-05T13:26:34+00:00

Yes, because companies have effectively mandated hiring of females in preference to males in order to drive up the numbers. Gotta have that equity....

perryurban · 2022-09-05T13:57:57+00:00

it's so routine now to work with someone who's incompetent and wonder why until you realise "oh that's right they checked a diversity box or two"

vanishingly-orca · 2022-09-05T14:26:00+00:00

But remember kids, there’s no quotas. And women aren’t quota hires.

MGTOWManofMystery · 2022-09-05T16:54:07+00:00

I am now a masculine-presenting trans-lesbian!

qctireuralex · 2022-09-05T15:23:29+00:00

gotta keep the equality and diversity quotas up yo!

the fact that diversity hires now gets more opportunities than actual competency hires is just baffling and should never exist

voortrekker_bra · 2022-09-05T13:17:24+00:00

Men and white people are heavily discriminated against

Rixae · 2022-09-05T19:25:07+00:00

Guys named Ashley are going off rn

sorrynotvaccinated · 2022-09-05T20:14:19+00:00

Just apply using female version of your first name and on the interview tell them that you’re non-binary fluid-gender. You felt like female when you applied, but once you’re hired, you usually start to feel like a male.

taco_smasher69 · 2022-09-06T01:23:31+00:00

Asian guy here.

While white dudes are complaining about being overlooked in favor of women, guys like me have to fight being overlooked for being Asian and a dude. So, welcome to my world.

As for female engineers — I’ve worked with a couple,and In one case, we all had to walk on egg shells around her because she was throwing out harassment/discrimination claims like it was going out of style. Coincidentally these claims always came around deadline time and we were all waiting for her to finish her work so we could work on integration. (she was incompetent)

Her demise came when she complained that her new manager was discriminatory and treating her unfairly. Unfortunately for her, the new manager was a woman.

atximport · 2022-09-06T02:05:01+00:00

I worked at Google in 2008 and my boss literally said to me that he would hire any woman that applied for the same job I had, no matter how qualified. I had over a decade of experience at that point.

hottake_toothache · 2022-09-05T13:57:04+00:00

Funny I didn't see this reported in the media. /s

RewRose · 2022-09-05T20:12:30+00:00

Man I don't know why I even open these threads anymore, they're filled with very depressing information for this here asian male.

shit-zen-giggles · 2022-09-05T10:11:44+00:00

very useful 👍

RandomThrowaway410 · 2022-09-05T15:37:40+00:00

Surprised that it is only 41% and not 410%, tbh

equalRights111 · 2022-09-05T20:06:19+00:00

Inb4 something along the lines of ‘it’s because of the patriarchy which thinks women are helpless and so help them more, so it’s still sexism’.

Gloomy-Taste-9664 · 2022-09-05T13:43:27+00:00

Here's what I think.

Companies go out in the market and hire women to stay away from feminists' bad side and get a pat on their shoulders. But what happens is, if you look closely, female workers gossip more and work less. As of now many times, this workload is taken care of by male workers in that office.

As days go by, now the company hires women only, and suddenly the majority of their work remains undone. Projects are not submitted on time, so much office politics this drives the company into a loss. While those women take payment as per market value. So productivity/work done is almost negligible but the expenses on salary keep mounting up.

What do you think?

Artimiz2001 · 2022-09-05T16:45:26+00:00

Yeah I don’t know how I feel about this

la_1099 · 2022-09-05T17:09:41+00:00

they only care to fill diversity quotas

White and Asian men will be discriminated against to the glee of the public

Kookaburra-Chan · 2022-09-05T17:27:57+00:00

Rutgers found a similar phenomenon in engineering in 2016. Glad to hear the study is repeatable (increases scientific validity).

dixieStates · 2022-09-05T21:29:15+00:00

Lately, there is a rush, especially in STEM teams, to get a pair of tits at the conference table.

Reasonable_Listen514 · 2022-09-06T15:47:58+00:00

Men need to start filing discrimination lawsuits.

2022-09-05T16:57:08+00:00

I would say, go to smaller companies or be self-employed. Makes more sense to me especially when you are male.

CallieCallie86 · 2022-09-05T20:51:26+00:00

Is it worth changing your name to something unisex just on your resume?

Theyll realize later when doing the references anyways.

Educational_Bet_6606 · 2022-09-05T12:24:25+00:00

If this is true I wonder how much of it comes down to employers wanting to get their dick wet over them thinking she can actually do the job as good or better than men.

Thomjones · 2022-09-06T15:33:49+00:00

We hired a woman in our tech department and im fairly sure she was hired for being a woman bc she's terrible at it. That being said, I don't think it's a bad thing to diversify a team it's just that she obv sucks at troubleshooting. It's so obvious that she had to be hired solely for diversity. I don't mind hiring woman black IDC. But just be trainable.

Infinite-Raccoon-784 · 2024-07-26T09:08:33+00:00

The only solution. Anonymous contest. You are only a number, your race, sex, gender, political opinions are unknown. The contest should as closely as possible mimic daily tasks and common challenges faced by worker of the given industry/profession.

Then you take people based solely on this, unless something as obvious as criminal/terrorist record shows up.
Sample Contests and Contest Curriculum should be freely and publicly accessible.

This is the only way to fight nepotism, racism, discrimination, reverse discrimination, sexism, ...

Anonymous contest, not stupid hypocritical quotas. Period.

yas_kang_slayyy · 2022-09-06T01:00:17+00:00

White men make up like 48 percent of the engineering field tho, don’t they? https://www.nsf.gov/statistics/2017/nsf17310/digest/occupation/overall.cfm

TamedShroo · 2022-09-05T10:23:52+00:00

These are the exact opposite results of the famous study that had science professors rate potential candidates and the males were rated far higher than the females when the resume was identical.

Not sure which study to believe.

TamedShroo · 2022-09-05T11:13:10+00:00

In software engineering, 23 percent of graduates are women. Yet most business, less than 20 percent of their engineers are women.

So of women are being favored, it's not making much of an impact on ratios.

Grouchy_Attention963 · 2022-09-05T13:39:49+00:00

Women make the worst anything they are so emotional and when they pms it’s a fucking pain working with them.

wineblood · 2022-09-05T17:33:16+00:00

I don't even understand why they do this. "We need more women" but until what point? There are a lot more men training in software than women, so 50/50 is not representative at all.

An old place I worked at got a new CEO (ex Apple marketing guy) and a few months after we heard that HR were only accepting female CVs for the engineering roles. What a clown.

I get that women are underrepresented and often not confident enough to apply for some positions. All you need to do is guarantee female applicants an interview, it gets over the initial hurdle of applying and everyone still has a fair shot in the end.

sunny_yay · 2022-09-05T16:20:59+00:00

“Women represented only about a quarter of computer workers and 15% of those in engineering occupations.”

So far though, men are 3x more likely to be hired.

https://www.census.gov/library/stories/2021/01/women-making-gains-in-stem-occupations-but-still-underrepresented.html

Edit: and closer to 6x more likely for engineering.

mechajutaro · 2022-09-05T11:05:14+00:00

An earlier study found the opposite https://hrdailyadvisor.blr.com/2019/05/15/gender-bias-the-resume-edition/ Whether or not assertions like these("Employers prefer one gender over the other")can be verified via replication remains to be seen

kindacuteimo · 2022-09-05T13:42:56+00:00

IMO? All NN u.oxt mm mmL.i

cjgager · 2022-09-05T14:24:46+00:00

pfft - phooey - - - yeah - just like all those warehouse help jobs that have a requirement of being able to "lift 70lbs throughout the day" - of course some jobs are discriminatory, and these days younger firms are finally trying to hire more females than the natural male "computer nerd" - since many women can be just as nerdy.
seem a bit cry-babyish to complain between a callback rate of 11.2% vs one at 15.8% - women have had to experience such things for decades. a likely reason not really discussed is - women are cheaper & might be a bit more personable.

2022-09-05T17:02:47+00:00

Stop working for the big companies and start instead working with smaller ones and build those up.

Gries88 · 2022-09-05T17:51:44+00:00

My name is Sue, how do you do!

RedPill_Hispanic · 2022-09-05T21:50:49+00:00

Duuuhhh durrrf durrrf

TaxingAuthority · 2022-09-05T23:53:53+00:00

This paper’s conclusion is rather interesting, particularly because the hiring patterns at my office represent a stark contrast. Granted, we are not in the same industry but rather a financial based regulator.

I have been on four years now and seen five people hired, all of them male. No female applicant interviewed was ever invited to the second round of interviews. I’ve always found this odd as when I first started our office was close to 50/50 gender split. We now heavily lean male and our exec at headquarters has actually openly asked why.

Soon after I was hired our regional director (male) retired and was replaced with a female. Talking with employees who are actively in and out of the hiring process over the years make it sound like our female regional director is actually overly critical of female applicants while downplaying less attractive elements of male applicants.

What makes this even more odd is that I’ve participated in several career fairs for my regional office and (in general) the women who come and talk to us and show interest are always more experienced and present themselves better than the men do.

WhyIsHeSoSick2 · 2022-09-06T01:16:39+00:00

Best bet is to get a trade. All these office positions are steered towards women. Be smart and adjust to the changes this corrupt world offers.

unchill27 · 2022-09-06T02:23:42+00:00

Isn’t this just because now most corporates are moving towards a 50/50 breakdown of male and female new hires and there’s significantly less females that are graduating in these degrees so of course they would receive more callbacks?

rahsoft · 2022-09-06T10:07:19+00:00

two words

"quotas"

"spineless"

Stunning_While_6162 · 2023-07-11T04:18:38+00:00

This was written by an undergrad. Not really a peer reviewed paper.

Title	Resumes with a female name were 41% more likely to receive a callback than resumes with a male name for software engineering jobs
Author	yas_kang_slayyy
Upvotes	1630
Comments	363
Date	September 5, 2022 8:51 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/x6bbgd/resumes_with_a_female_name_were_41_more_likely_to/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/resumes-with-a-female-name-were-41-more-likely-to.1130035 https://theredarchive.com/post/1130035

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