Genuine question from a guy

throwawaytradesman2 · 2025-09-21T00:49:55+00:00

Oppressed? Statistically there are more women in post secondary Institutions than men. The trend in healthcare all along the west is there are more female doctors than male doctors.

How often do you see an oppressed group doing better than the non-oppressed group?

Yes, there are more male CEOs. There are also more male garbage men, bricklayers, roofers, and loggers. Women are drawn to different fields.

Yes, sexism still exists and it's effing bullshit. But, saying that men overall are trying to hold women back is not something I believe is happening.

If there are disparities, they continue to be dismantled, and most are dismantled. I don't like the abortion ban, I think it has negative consequences overall. But to say that is oppression? The same people who are pissed off about the abortion ban are the same people who screamed for forced vaccination.

chocobolamo · 2025-09-20T23:54:27+00:00

These aren't held up by statistics, thats the issue. Those are non arguments often. Women actually get paid more per hour in similar fields in most working class jobs. They also graduate college/university at twice the rate men do. There's like thousands of statistics which flip the narrative.

i've been sexually assaulted by women several times. The world acts like you cannot sexually assault men.

I-wanna-GO-FAST · 2025-09-21T04:28:02+00:00

We live in a world where women experience sexual assault and harassment

And???? Are you suggesting that women need to face literally zero of this to not be considered "oppressed?" You're already starting off with a ridiculous premise. Not only are those offenses that are taken seriously by most people, and often lead to criminal charges, but it is also taken much more seriously when the victim is a woman!

Women are discriminated against in hiring,

Let me guess, your sole piece of evidence of this claim is that study about musical auditions.

I can think of countless examples of employers openly and brazenly discriminating against men in their employee search in my years as a working class male. Women have lower physical standards for things like military and law enforcement, and any field with that women are much less likely to apply to will clamor to hire any female applicant. Once you graduate, pay attention to how much easier a time your female peers have at finding employment.

face discrimination in the medical system, et cetera.

Honestly not sure what you are talking about here aside from women not being allowed to be guinea pigs for medical trials for a while.

The majority of positions of power are held by men.

Men also do virtually all the most dangerous and dirty jobs as well.

Besides, how often do you see "men in power" use that power to benefit men over women? When's the last time you saw a male politician specifically pandering to male voters? They never do that, but they will often pander to women because guess what? Female voters outnumber male voters in the US.

So, how do we not live in a patriarchy where women are oppressed at the hands of men?

Give me an exact definition of "patriarchy," and a clear outline of how someone would prove that we don't live in one if this question is asked in good faith.

Why do some people, especially on the conservative side, reject the idea that women are an oppressed and discriminated group?

First I want to start by stating that it is not important to me that everyone share my view that women are not oppressed. People can believe what they want, I don't really care. What I do care about though is when people use this assertion that women have it so bad to justify all sorts of discriminatory legislation and law enforcement practices against men. People who do that make it clear why they want everyone to believe that women are oppressed though. Because without that belief, it becomes much more obvious that they are female supremacists that just want special treatment for women and to make it easier for them to shit on men they don't like.

Why do I reject the idea that women are oppressed? For starters, look at arrest and incarceration rates, and how men on average are sentenced longer for the same crimes. Stats like these are often brought up as unequivocal proof that certain minorities face major discrimination, but when these stats are looked at to compare how the two sexes are treated? "Oh, men just commit more crime."

Also there's research that shows women's automatic in-group bias is remarkably stronger than men's, which completely invalidates the assumption that men in power work to benefit men more than women.

Those are the two major reasons but many others out there have written exhaustive lists of widespread injustices against men and our government giving favorable treatment to women that just makes any similar list of grievances from feminists pale in comparison to me. Examples:

https://np.reddit.com/r/MensRights/s/RfSetF7OkF

https://np.reddit.com/r/MensRights/s/MraUI5b5QV

SeemedGood · 2025-09-21T01:00:55+00:00

Western women enjoy the longest, most comfortable, and most privileged lives of any major demographic group in the history of the world.

Edit:…and still paint themselves as victims to uphold a culture of complaint.

abaxeron · 2025-09-20T23:13:00+00:00

Women are two-thirds of tax collectors, 3/5 of college graduates, ~52% of voters; one needs to actively and forcibly keep one's brain in a continuous state of switched-off to not notice that these things are positions of power and privilege. Name me any empire, any tyranny, any satrapy, where the enslaved, the subjugated, the second-class constituted 2/3 of tax collectors, 3/5 of highly educated, the majority of voters, and the minority of the disenfranchised. You can't.

"In the medical system, et cetera" is a complete fabrication; you can't at the same time believe that contraceptive pill trials, or James Marion Sims practice, or lobotomies, were wrong because they were performed on women (or on wrong kind of women in the wrong way), and at the same time believe that women weren't allowed to be medical test subjects. There was a temporary limitation on medical tests on women after thalidomide backlash. It's over. And you, and everyone, should get over themselves on this topic.

"In hiring": the state holds guns to employers' heads forcing them to hire women under threat of legal action. The fact that despite all these measures, many women still want to just marry a simp and never work a single day of their lives again, is not men's fault or problem. Talk to actual employers, or even better - female employers, and get a taste of their personal impression for how men and women perform in the workforce, and who is better to deal with. I will spoil a thing for you: there is no better and more compliant worker, voter, employee, or tenant, than a married man, as long as the well-being of his family is at stake.

We are left with "Muh Rape". I will insist that rapes happening is not indicator of power; what is, is how easily perpetrators get away with it. Surveys indicate that (judging by what paper you look at) women constitute anywhere between roughly ~10 and 30 percent of perpetrators of sexual assault against the opposite sex; meanwhile, they constitute anywhere between 1 and 3 percent of felons convicted for these crimes. So I ask you again: which sex is the oppressed and discriminated group here?

FaceFruit27 · 2025-09-20T22:48:13+00:00

Because the system was not designed and created to unilaterally uplift men at the expense of women. If it was, men wouldn’t also be the majority of the population experiencing adverse outcomes in a large variety of circumstances (Apex Fallacy essentially) (Source 1).

Secondly, I don’t reject that women have issues that are more prevalent among them as a group, however I do reject the ways in which some of these are presented and the narratives that are constructed around them in modern discourse. For example, under the Duluth model, domestic violence is literally characterized as men abusing women within the household, despite the fact that research shows women commit violence at equal or higher rates in these contexts (Source 2; further breakdown, Source 3; discussion compiling sources, Source 4).

Women also generally make a bigger deal of their fear of violent crime (which I don’t totally blame them for, I get why they’d be more perceptive to it) while also downplaying the fact that men are overwhelmingly the victims of said violent crime. Among everyday feminists you’ll often hear victim-blame style retorts like “who created that system?” or “so men are hurting men, leave women out of it.”

On top of that, statistics will get manipulated to hide places where men do worse, or people just won’t care. Men are lagging behind women in education and a variety of other metrics, but generally no one bats an eye (until they feel it’s affecting women, then suddenly it’s a crisis, see the aftermath of the 2024 US election). Examples: men falling behind in STEM (Source 5), broader discussion on men’s worsening outcomes (Source 6), and how global institutions bury these disparities (Source 7).

And then there’s the way feminist terminology itself is framed so that all negative characteristics and ideologies are coded masculine : “Toxic Masculinity,” “Patriarchy,” “Internalized Misogyny”, while misandry isn’t even seen as real by many feminists.

TL;DR: men are also oppressed in society, which makes zero sense if society really was built for the sole benefit of men as a class. Women, who do have legitimate issues, don’t behave in the West like a group being actively suppressed by some stronger, more violent ruling class. They can openly criticize men, call the system patriarchal, and face basically no backlash for it; meanwhile men’s suffering is ignored, hidden, or treated like a punchline.

Shoutouts to TheTinMen.

Zabadoodude · 2025-09-21T01:24:36+00:00

In modern Western societies situations where women are disadvantaged are often viewed as examples of patriarchy and there is a push from "woke" people to rectify these issues. Situations where women are advantaged are presented as a win for women struggling against the odds, or an example of how men need to get their shit together and get over their own issues. As a result, if you only look at mainstream, left leaning, discourse you get a one sided picture.

Women are supposedly mistreated in the medical field, based on some dubious studies, but men statistically die younger. This is seen as just their own fault.

Most top income earners are men, supposedly because of patriarchy. But most of these men are married and their wives are legally entitled to half their wealth, which they spend as their own. Most dangerous jobs are held by men. Most homeless are also men, but that's their own fault.

Most victims of violence are men and men are proven to be heavily discriminated against by the justice system, but somehow women are still seen as the more victimized gender because they are more kikely to experience sexual violence. (The only form of violence men arent far more likely to be the victims of)

When men were disproportionately getting educated this was seen by feminists as an example of the patriarchy, and needed to be addressed. Now that it's flipped and young women are getting more educated than men, no one is arguing that it's a sign we live a matriarchy.

To be clear: I don't think we live in a matriarchy either, but you have to really cherry pick examples to come to the conclusion that women are disproportionately mistreated in modern society.

DzejSiDi · 2025-09-20T21:49:15+00:00

Kinda wrong place. This is, let's call it, "applied evo psych" praxeology redpill. We're not very political here. But "redpill" itself in the most generic way represents... well, just watch the Matrix. Let's call it "truths hidden from us by a system", whatever that system represents. That's why, in the USA at least, political redpill is rightwing-leaning, since establishment was left-leaning.

But this is what I don't get; We live in a world where women experience sexual assault and harassment, largely at the hands of men. Many women tell stories of being harassed and threatened by men at very young ages. Women are discriminated against in hiring, face discrimination in the medical system, et cetera. The majority of positions of power are held by men. These are facts backed up by statistics.

Since you're at college, it's a good time to educate yourself. You WILL lose, or at the very least draw any serious discussion about women discriminations in the western world. Check MRA's arguments, check what's cherrypicking (for example: https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/ST_20.09.15_Election-turnout_Turnout_02a.png?w=640 clearly govs were picked more by women than by men, so blame them) and check how to fact-check some stupid claims about discrimination. Check how moronically "gender gap" was calculated and other "muh discrimination" claims were made.

So, how do we not live in a patriarchy where women are oppressed at the hands of men? Why do some people, especially on the conservative side, reject the idea that women are an oppressed and discriminated group?

Redpill != conservative. No, we do not live in patriarchy, you don't understand what this word even means. Check "my" graph above, how this is a patriarchy if women, as a group, have slightly higher voting power than men?? If you want to know how patriarchy looks like, go pick up the bible or, for more modern examples, check talibans/dagestan/amish communities.

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onlyaseeker · 2025-09-20T22:53:31+00:00

how do we not live in a patriarchy where women are oppressed at the hands of men? Why do some people, especially on the conservative side, reject the idea that women are an oppressed and discriminated group?

I have a YouTube playlist that covers that in depth, especially the content at the bottom from Renegade Cut and Innuendo Studios. Innuendo has excellent right wing coverage and analysis.

Suffice to say, it's complicated.

To be clear, it covers why people think patriarchy doesn't exist, and why conservatives are the way they are, at least on this issue.

To cover why conservatives are the way they are in general is more complicated.

My best attempt is this post I made, which is an analysis of why Trump won in 2025, and the broader cultural and social factors. I'm a little time poor so it needs updating, but it'll introduce you to lots of people who will answer your questions.

"But you're red pilled, why aren't you conservative..."

https://np.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/s/zER6kHw0oG

berichorbeburied · 2025-09-20T21:31:54+00:00

Because women get all benefits. Full privilege. Preferential treatment. Unwarranted attention. Value for just existing. Etc etc

In the u.s we are not a 3rd world country. There are no patriarchal influences that still exist or are enforced on women.

All the bad things that happen to women are men breaking the law. They are doing illegal things. And either they aren’t caught or punished for it. But it is not accepted in society

So hopefully that answers your question

As far as sexual dynamics are concerned. It’s a full on matriarchy and very gynocentric.

As far as relationships. That is on an individual basis. But the environment is clear as day.

At the end of the day it’s sink or swim. You will be able to have sex with at least one woman. Even if you go full male feminist. But it was never about just being able to have sex with any random woman. This goes deeper than just that.

So essentially to summarize. Because the sexual dynamics. Lean fully towards woman. It can not be a patriarchy. And you don’t have to worry about it. Because u could be the biggest pussy in the world and have sex with at least one woman. So if your only goal is to have sex or be with one woman who could be any woman. You don’t have to worry about it

It’s only if you have dreams and goals and standards and types and preferences and etc that you’d have to worry

InterestingGoose5507 · 2025-09-20T22:26:41+00:00

There is no mythical patriarchy! That’s just a feminist construct to paint themselves as victims.

There is an elite group of ultra wealthy powerful people that subjugate men and women! Men arguably have it worse in many regards. No average man in Ukraine or Russia feels privileged at the moment!

In recent times, under the woke liberal era, white men were severely discriminated against due to racial quotas in hiring. Thankfully that DEI nonsense is dying and it’s back to merit. I don’t think there should be any racial or gender discrimination in hiring (FYI Indians are by far the worst and most racist group for racial hiring. They will only hire other Indians and I’ve been personally discriminated in this way before in the UAE). It should be merit based.

midnight_blue77 · 2025-09-21T20:25:00+00:00

So what is your question? All I saw was "The Message" being preached at us.

N_Count_Council · 2025-09-21T01:45:40+00:00

I promise you that anything that redpills men happens on a scale 1000x more often than women get assaulted (since the question seems to be directed at redpill?)

Women dumping guys for being "too nice" happens 1000x more often for example.

Acceptable-Truck3803 · 2025-09-21T00:47:38+00:00

So lets answer this. I am more of a moderate conservative and my ideals for the last 16 years align more with Obama, Biden, Harris + Waltz. Please check for yourself (usa politics based): isidewith.com . I really have no idea why people want to worship CK when that man was basically a whiner who generated a following on social media.

We live in a world where women experience sexual assault and harassment, largely at the hands of men. Many women tell stories of being harassed and threatened by men at very young ages.

- unfortunately this happens. It shouldn't however it does. This isn't "leftist or rightest." This is people making decisions to harass another person who has indicated they aren't interested. If you are hot enough as a man, this happens from women as well.

Women are discriminated against in hiring, face discrimination in the medical system, et cetera. The majority of positions of power are held by men. These are facts backed up by statistics.

- Not too much anymore but it still happens. It's against the law, however from a business perspective If you are going to start a family after being higher/promoted as a women, I have to account for 4-6 months of family PTO at larger companies and leave because pregnancy leave. Don't get me wrong family raising and building that bond with your offspring is ideal for a great family environment to raise your family, however from a business standpoint it's 100% a liability. We have to pay someone to not work and also all the healthcare costs go up because employee + family + children + if offspring have health issues that means PTO/sick leave, etc etc. Thus our costs increase because we have to hire contractors to pick up the slack.

A large push of removing DEI programs (at least on a gender standpoint) was to aim for more women and "minority ethnic groups in leadership and C suite roles. By all means if the best candidate is a woman/transgender/gay/"minority" man by all means let's hire them for the role. I genuinely don't care let the best candidate win. However statistics were shown that men and white men whom aren't considered a minority were overlooked to meet and fill more "woman gender and minorities in leadership roles vs non minority men" within the last two decades because "woman/diversity hire" and not because they could do the job/career and hit the ball running. I don't have papers or official studies to show this, however in my personal experience recruiting post grad masters and attempting to gain promotions at current companies before jumping after 3 years every time for career advancement, it was clear companies wanted to place women/minorities there instead of non "minority" men to boost DEI numbers. Would I have to extensively train said person(s)? Yes. Was it BS? Yes. Did I refuse to train them and point them to their direct manager for advice on how to do said tasks as I wasn't "qualified" to do said work after internal interviews but now am asked to show how to do all these things efficiently, effectively and run the team(s)? Yes.

So, how do we not live in a patriarchy where women are oppressed at the hands of men? Why do some people, especially on the conservative side, reject the idea that women are an oppressed and discriminated group?

- both genders are oppressed to an extent. Ethnic races are oppressed as well. This applies to hiring, working, dating, marriage, family raising, schools, neighborhoods, etc. What's happening now is men are actually fighting back against the rise of "the women" from the past 2 decades because the playing field for dating and getting great jobs has drastically increased. "women doesn't want to date me or others like me because they want to focus on career/don't want to settle/have options thanks to the internet/really really really enjoy sex with their partner(s) and I don't get to play with them." It appears the idea is to do everything to make women go back to the nurture and support vs be the head of their own households. I don't agree with the way this is happening at all, but it's a factor you cannot ignore with the popular rise of MAGA.

Genuine question from a guy

Comments

I had big doubts on your comment so I asked chatgpt and it vehemently disagrees with you:

Title	Genuine question from a guy
Author	CharmingLion1811
Upvotes	2
Comments	244
Date	September 20, 2025 8:58 PM UTC (10 months ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1nm9ej4/genuine_question_from_a_guy/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/genuine-question-from-a-guy.1562447 https://theredarchive.com/post/1562447