Is AFBB real?

noNooodleArms · 2020-06-08T02:54:50+00:00

Depends on who you ask and it also depends on the interpretation of AF/BB.

There's a famous quote by Sheryl Sandberg, Facebook's COO:

“When looking for a life partner, my advice to women is date all of them: the bad boys, the cool boys, the commitment-phobic boys, the crazy boys. But do not marry them. The things that make the bad boys sexy do not make them good husbands. When it comes time to settle down, find someone who wants an equal partner. Someone who thinks women should be smart, opinionated and ambitious. Someone who values fairness and expects or, even better, wants to do his share in the home. These men exist and, trust me, over time, nothing is sexier.”

Well, the first part about the "bad boy" is a classic AF. The second part, while not explicitly said, it outlines a guy who has his shit together: job security etc... and therefore financial stability.

There are a lot of women who follow that strategy in broad strokes, they have their fun with some guys and they don't care whether they are good providers or good fathers... they just want to have fun; and then - when looking to settle down - they seek someone who has his shit together, financially stable, who can be a good husband and father.

At times - but not always - some women - but not all women - have 1 or more FB/FWB while also being out there on Tinder and other OLD looking for a relationship.

These events fall within the broad definition of AF/BB.

DangZagnut · 2020-06-08T02:02:42+00:00

Women like sexy attractive men. Those "alpha" men have certain traits women will lie about not liking, and then date them anyway.

Giving them the biscuit to butter so to speak.

They'll bypass resource providers and "nice guys" because they're too short, too shy, too whatever, then, when they can't pull the "alphas" (ie: guys they actually want to fuck and lie they don't and can't get to commit) then they go after betas, ie: resource providers, for that sweet sweet money they crave.

Reality is toxic, because it doesn't care about retarded social justice nonsense, it just is. If you think it's "toxic" then your brain needs to realign with reality.

Of course, you're saying it's toxic because you don't want to admit it's true. Or really, it's saying it that's toxic, not the reality itself. It's toxic to point out is what you're communicating. In other words, sure it's true, but just don't say it or tell anyone.

Yes, women like sexy attractive men, but they tend not to commit, so eventually when those guys disappear (and they always do) they'll go for a lesser beta man who, meh, maybe sort of does it for her if he goes down on her long enough to get in the mood. then might starfish for awhile until the sex (thankfully!) evaporates from the relationship.

She still may like the guy, in that "best friend/brother" kind of way.

Which is fine, it's part of the dual mating strategy. Fuck guy 1, then have guy 2 raise the kid as he has the resources.

There's nothing wrong with it. It just is. To think it's toxic is to say women's actions and mating strategies are toxic, and I know that's impossible because women are strong, brave, independent, and stunning, and to think otherwise is misogyny, and you can't be a misogynist can you?

BROWN-TOILET-PAPER · 2020-06-08T02:56:41+00:00

Let's put it like this. Alpha Fucks is the core female fantasy. (Genetic attraction) Beta Bucks is the female reality. (Resource attraction) Some women get to live both or one or the other. Sometimes a man can provide both/overlap. I can't agree with looking at it just one way.

RP/Manosphere seems to generically catergorize men into two characters. Greek God statue, broke Chad Thundercock, whose currency is dick. And average BB man, Brad Moneybag. <I just made that name up. ;)

The idea that RP guys keep overusing is this 80/20 rule, they think most women get fucked by the top 20 percentile of men which is ridiculous. Those guys are the 'AF.' The rest of men are the 'BB' that a large number of women have to settle for after getting Thundercocked casually by bad boy Chads. Does this happen? Yes. Is it default reality? No. It's like, worst case scenario blown up into an extreme, as fantasy rage porn for RPers. For...angry motivation? They think they'll lift and make enough money to get Chad level pussy? Looks like that's the idea.

If this, like anything else, is the specific reality that they've lived, then that's their reality. Like the women that say 'all men cheat' because are only attracted to shitty dudes that were using them, because those women themselves, suck, and don't know how to treat a man other than spread their legs. (while being attracted to shitty dudes, who are like their shitty dad)

SeemedGood · 2020-06-08T02:46:50+00:00

Women find different and dichotomous traits attractive for sex and for relationships.

They also have different levels of sexual attraction. They find very few men actively sexually attractive in that they will actively seek sexual interaction with a man solely for the sake of experiencing the sexual interaction with him. They find a wider variety of men (but still a small percentage) passively sexually attractive in that they would be open to sexual interaction with a man if he were to provide them with some other utility (emotional, financial, companionship, etc).

Certainly women consciously desire to garner both sexual utility and non-sexual utility from the same man, but subconsciously many of the positive traits for non-sexual utility tend to be sexually unattractive to women and many the positive traits for sexual utility tend to be unattractive to women for relationships.

Put those ingredients in a pot and simmer and you’ll get:

AF/BB, and
An accurate model for predicting women’s sexual and relationship choice patterns.

Since women tend to eschew introspection, objective self observation, and self critique as if it were the Black Death, most will deny this with differing levels of vehemence. As with all things, I would encourage you to disregard what they say and simply observe their behaviors closely to see if the model fits.

dylang92 · 2020-06-08T02:51:10+00:00

I mean this has been discussed countless times on here. Yes, not to the extreme extent some of the members of TRP or Incels might say, but it does exist and most people know it. They just don’t call it AFBB

Karmanger · 2020-06-08T13:49:09+00:00

It's one of the reasons why TRP guys will ask for body count number. The general idea is it tells you something is wrong if she has an N-count of 1000 but wants to save sex with marriage for you, while she has A FWB while dating you.

In this case you would be the BB and the FWB would be the alpha.

YetAnotherCommenter · 2020-06-08T04:41:01+00:00

the mindset surrounding it seems really toxic.

You can easily rephrase it into something that flatters women, and if you do, you'll find women lining up to agree with it.

All "AFBB" means is that the vast majority of opposite-sex-attracted women look for two basic qualities in a man.

He is sexually attractive to them. He's handsome, strong, powerful and socially adroit. "Tribal Chief Genes" to put it simply.
He is willing to invest in a romantic entanglement with her. He'll care for her happiness and wellbeing (and that of any resultant offspring).

Ideally, women want both in the same guy. But sometimes they cannot get this. In a situation where they cannot, they will try to attain one of these things from one man (or men) and another of these things from another man (or men).

What's the problem with acknowledging this? It merely means "women have needs and will act to fulfill them."

You seem more angry at the fact that "AFBB" habitually uses non-flattering terms to discuss these facts, than you are seriously contesting the actual proposition.

pizzaguy573871 · 2020-06-08T04:02:05+00:00

Yes it is real. Don’t listen to the gaslighting women in the comments. Many feminists not only admit it, but also advocate for it.

Sara E Hill says:

The good news is that – even in the face of trade-offs that each of us must make when choosing partners– a woman can still get the best of both worlds for her offspring… she just might have to get each of these qualities from a different man. This means getting investment from one man (usually a primary partner who is loving, caring, and reliable) while getting sexy genes from someone else (typical unbeknownst to the primary partner).

there will always be females who game the system by formally pairing with a good dad for his resource access and then getting sexy genes for their offspring from their neighbor.

Cheating indeed.

Such a dual-mating strategy will generally get a female a better deal…

https://archive.is/dNTdu

jkonrad · 2020-06-08T15:04:55+00:00

It’s true enough to be useful.

Sepean · 2020-06-08T15:27:06+00:00

Yep. I’m 42 and it is painfully obvious how the guys who relied on beta game (ie. being a good, loyal provider and family man) are treated like shit by their wives.

If you want a good relationship/marriage, you have to bring plenty of alpha too.

OXOzymandias · 2020-06-08T02:05:15+00:00

Some guys are able to pull ladies in one night, other need multiple dates, nowadays that what AF/BB means imo, girl in general are not looking for a provider today...

stats135 · 2020-06-08T02:53:45+00:00

At the heart of it AFBB is women "charging" different men a different price for her pussy. The men who can get in her pants for free (or on the cheap) are the "alphas" and the men that can not are the "betas."

The only way for AFBB to NOT be real is if she charges ever person she has sex with at the same price, or at least have the price difference be total random. Both of which we know is not true for the modern woman.

TheBookOfSeil · 2020-06-08T02:11:32+00:00

It is toxic, but reality isn't pretty. Nature is harsh. Animals often use each other in different ways, whether it be a mutualistic relationship or a parasitic relationship, though there are others:

Because different species often inhabit the same spaces and share—or compete for—the same resources, they interact in a variety of ways, known collectively as symbiosis. There are five main symbiotic relationships: mutualism, commensalism, predation, parasitism, and competition.

It is not impossible for an animal to treat a member of its own species in these ways as well. They can all apply to us. You can either find a partner to work with where you both benefit from each other, or one benefits while the other doesn't benefit or is not harmed either, or one where one benefits at the expense of the other.

Most relationships are seen through the eyes of parasitism where one takes advantage of the other, whether it be the woman taking advantage of the man, or the man taking advantage of the woman. TRP exists to prevent men from being taken advantage of by women, and instead turns the tables on them by allowing men to take advantage of women, if they choose.

Mutualism is the unicorn of relationships where both see each other as equals and work together to ensure equal benefit at the equal and willing cost.

If you're not sure of whether you've seen the douchebaggy guys being popular with women and the lesser-attractive successful guys being less popular with women and only sought out for stability, then you might want to start looking around.

nemma88 · 2020-06-08T07:20:48+00:00

Sure it exists, to what extent is a bit wibbly wobbly. Situations we can look at and say 'That fits AF/BB' are not the majority, and within those situations we don't know how many are AF/BB or how much we are just projecting the reasoning on.

Tugallois · 2020-06-08T07:41:26+00:00

Some "red"-pillers act like AFBB means most women have tons of casual sex until their thirties then lock down some unattractive schmuck and dead bedroom him as soon as the wedding cake is gone. That interpretation of it is not grounded in reality. Women are not en masse marrying men they were never attracted to after racking up double-digit Ns from ONS.

Women date around until one sticks. They marry a guy they met in their mid-to-late twenties who displays enough alpha traits to be attractive and enough beta ones for the relationship to work. He's probably different from her high school boyfriend but not significantly less attractive to her than the guy she dated at twenty-one; he might even be the same guy.

In marriage she might nag him into submissiveness and the sex dies, and poof, she has a BB on her hands.

TechnicalMight0 · 2020-06-08T08:55:39+00:00

Yes, it's real and quite common. Of course it's most often not a conscious process.

Women will often say their tastes have "matured", but then after a couple of glasses of wine they start spilling the beans how they wish their "wonderful" boyfriend is "too respectful", not hands on enough, how they barely have sex these days and how they didn't find him attractive at first, all the while you never hear them say these things about their "asshole"/"abusive" exes (who just happened to be good-looking dark triad guys.

Sure some women never liked the bad boys to begin with and others were lucky enough to get a Chad or Chad-lite to commit and some choose no commitment over comittment from a BB, but by god is AFBB common...

LittyKitsune · 2020-06-08T05:06:46+00:00

I say no for many reasons, but for one it reflects a very narrow and actually kinda sheltered view of the world.

I think men have a specific type of woman in mind when they think of AFBB: an educated career woman who spent her youth dating alphas. Now that she's in her 30's she wants to settle with a stable, reliable man whether she's actually attracted to him or not.

This is straight-up sheltered middle class and up problems. Start straying beyond the bubble and you'll find that women looking for provision, stability, and certainty in a long-term partner is not something you can take for granted as true. It's just that men only care about what the types of women their "beta" selves idealized are doing lol.

wekacuck · 2020-06-08T03:07:30+00:00

[removed]

beigesun · 2020-06-08T05:25:39+00:00

It’s nuanced, some dudes have alpha periods in their life and some never realize them. Others have it then lose it. Once you can distinguish yourself from the large percentage of inherent betas then you could manifest the Chad persona.

It’s really a never ending plight for excellence. Will some guys retain “the sauce” for the entirety of their lives? Yes, but that’s a very small percentage. Celebrities, musicians, athletes, etc. For us normies just do the best with what you got. Life sucks, but you don’t have to let it. Luckily I’m 6 feet so one day if I play my cards right I’ll be able to post an IG picture captioned as “6ft, 6 pack, & 6 figures.” I’m very close to the last two. But even then you could get 2 of those 3, youknowhwhatimean??

Wrasserman · 2020-06-08T06:54:38+00:00

Anna Nicole Smith, Carson and Kate's 'relationship', Regina Daniels, the entire concept of sugar babies, numerous testimonies of girls keeping guys around for favours while dangling sex in front of them.

Expensive-Guitar3609 · 2020-06-08T19:30:51+00:00

Marriage as a institution is outdated and ancticuated. If marriage or commitment was necesary once for sex and children, it's not anymore. Men now face a generation of women that have had their fair share of sex and even children way before marriage so...

What's the point?

This is the main reasson why men seem to believe a contract and vows, or any other form of LTR for the matter, are equal to accepting the short end of the stick willingly.

This is due to men lacking their own sexual revolution and having the chance to reject their part of the social contract in a time when women refuse to hold theirs.

The second reasson, for what I can see, it's sexual frustration.

This is the modern world. We know the dids. Whe know what is going on out there. But while internet, television and media in general is filled with sex, for some reasson it's always other people having it... Right?

I do believe that the system want young girls and boys to feel they are being left behind, but also think there is some truth in what the Red Pillers say.

Some men have extremely easy access to sex, and the kind of sex relationship dinamics they have with women is way more exciting than what most men can have. There is no way of denying this.

Men alwayd wanted sex, but now they want the porn-like kinky exciting sex "those guys have".

This is not healthy nor realistic. At some point we need to understand some people won't have all in life. Some people won't have some neither. Some people won't have any. Such is life.

And last but not least there is the fear of being settled for.

I think this is a good one. Men don't want to be the guys their wives chosed at the end. For the record, nobody, man or woman, wants to be the second choice, but for what we can read in some subreddits, for what we see daily on media, some personal experiences and what it seems to be the general consensus of the female modern culture, women settle down way more, and men have more than one reasson to be worried about this.

Men don't want to end in a sexless marriage with a woman that resent them and feel contempt. And who would? Marriages plumeting and divorce rate skyrocketing may only add oil to the fire.

Don't get this wrong, of course most women won't thick 10 out of the 10 boxes of the "reformed cock carousel-gold diggin slut" archetype the Redpillers are terrified of, but at some degree the women's new "cosmovision" of the dating world revolves around a very different view than men's.

If you have a relationship with a woman chances are you will have to face some "red pill" situation, that's right. She may be not playing the full AFBB at a Poker Star Pro level, but perhaps you will caught a gold diggin side of angel, or she will keep orbiters around for validation, you will caught her lying about a "girls night out", or may be she has that ex that broke her heart and you can't mesure up to...

Yes, I do believe AFBB does exist, in some form, in some way, in real life.

For context, I think this "hypergamy" thing is exascerbated by the modern dating culture and the toxic relationships and broken people that are a direct byproduct of the new inter-gender dinamics.

AND WOMEN get tricked too, don't think for a second they are safe from pain, sorros and heartackes becouse they are born with a vagina.

Do you think women enjoy bringing ass and blowjobs to the table all day for six months just for the promise walking the Grammy's red carpet by the hand of a handsome rich man only to realize at the end the guy had you to fulfill some kinky fetish but wasn't serious about all the things that promised?

And then bum, reality hits you and you have to settle down with a guy you would never thought you will spend the rest of your life, just to have a family and do what every other ordinary woman does.

Like, yeah, I would take being a man hands down every time. I have nothing but at least I didn't got fucked in the ass for nothing.

MuleFool42 · 2020-06-08T19:35:49+00:00

Yes, the guy down the street from me is a total BB. He married his current wife after she had two kids with some biker dude who wasn't stable. Married my neighbor, stays home while he pays the bills and helps raise some other dude's kids.

It happens all the time. I don't get it, he didn't need her or her kids. He could have found someone else and had kids with them,if he waited and didn't just agree to marry the first thing that came along. He makes REAL good money, so she stays at home while he pays the bills.

Nice gig if you can get it.

fakeaccount687 · 2020-06-08T23:05:07+00:00

Yes it's real. You'll only have real success dating young if you won the genetic lottery.

Then women get older and they all get married just to not be alone/without security. This is where they'll drop a lot of their expectations and marry the clueless man who is just happy a girl wants him.

She will always resent him and be bitchy because she was never really happy with him in the first place. This is why the sex stops in most marriages.

DaphneDK42 · 2020-06-08T03:52:16+00:00

Yeah its real. But not in the way its described by trp dogma. Everybody - man and woman - both change their preferences over time (I used to be into moody goth/punk girls - fucking hell), and get more realistic in their demands.

A 40yo man who wants a family and stable homelife is not likely to be able to attract a hot 21yo party girl, nor is it likely to lead to any good if he could. He knows this, because he's fucking 40 and have learned a bit. Thus he goes for the more realistic 30something woman. Is that settling? Yes, he settles for a less attractive woman, so he can get other qualities which he now value more. One of the things men 30+ tend to want is a woman who is more mother material. So this could be described as AFBB - Alpha Fucks, Beta Births.

A 30yo woman who wants a family and stable homelife is not likely to be able to attract and get a hot player to stay, nor is it likely to lead to any good if she could. She knows this, because she's fucking 30 and have learned a bit since she was 20. Thus she goes for the more realistic 30something man. Is that settling? Yes, she settles for a less attractive man and less exciting man, so she can get other qualities which she now value more. One of the things women 30+ tend to want is a man who is more long term material.

psypD · 2020-06-08T01:55:39+00:00

Life is toxic.

Joey_Lopez · 2020-06-08T14:33:08+00:00

You don't spend enough time in the real world or don't have enough life experience. Spend time with people at different points in their lives. AF/BB is everywhere.

flamingoinghome · 2020-06-08T04:14:29+00:00

Not to any significant extent.

I mean, I'm sure there are a few neurotic gold diggers out there, but by and large, nope. I suspect the whole thing comes from the hopeful myth that if one can simply learn the correct magic incantations, one will never have to deal with change, ever again. Mixed with that is discomfort that luck and timing could play any significant role in one's romantic life.

Willow-girl · 2020-06-08T02:15:07+00:00

No. It was invented to make men feel better about having lost their dream girl. "She never really loved me; I was just her beta bucks" is more soothing to the ego than, "I blew it."

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diffdedbed · 2020-06-08T02:02:04+00:00

In some situations yes, but some have taken it to mean all relationships.

wtknight · 2020-06-08T13:15:10+00:00

Not as much now in the west. Women can earn enough money now that many just avoid guys that are too beta unless they are the type that gets super lonely without a man in their lives.

One can still see AF/BB quite a bit in poorer developing countries where women are not as privileged, though.

ontherailstoday · 2020-06-08T16:45:05+00:00

Everyone looks more to comfort and security as they age. And not just in sexual matters.

Physiologist21 · 2020-06-10T18:35:52+00:00

Do you go outside? Take a look.

gaylord_fag_2 · 2020-06-08T03:19:37+00:00

Ask the moderator of r/cuckoldpsychology he's a betabux cuck.

Maxj3001 · 2020-06-08T04:41:14+00:00

Bro fuckkkk no this isn’t true. I mean sure it makes sorta sense on paper but In real life a very large amount of guys(who aren’t an “alpha”)don’t abide by this rule.

mandoa_sky · 2020-06-08T07:03:54+00:00

depends on who you ask.

to normal people (off reddit) a BB is just your average family man. job, wife, house and kids. ie, a normal person

Silly_Field · 2020-06-08T02:10:11+00:00

No it’s not a thing.

It’s really something that (some) men do and then project onto women. They go for dominant, extroverted, assertive women for short term flings and then try to settle down with quiet, passive women who are easily controlled.

The ‘bucks’ part of it isn’t really relevant any more imo.

Pola_Lita · 2020-06-08T03:01:29+00:00

Everyone changes. Everyone's life changes. Therefore, everyone's needs change too. Male and female.

It has nothing to do with evolutionary forces, or men being used, or women's destinies being tied to populating the planet. Who isn't in their physical prime from 18 to 28? Or has any real grasp of their own mortality? Sometimes RP is worse than religion.

Meritamen9 · 2020-06-08T02:37:14+00:00

Doesn't everyone act differently when they are young? It makes since that people would date differently young too. How often do we see men on here saying how sluts are only good for sex and that they want to commit to a low n woman? Low value men are just upset that they can't participate. I don't even blame them since no one likes being shortchanged.

As a side note I find it funny how much men complain about women settling and seeing past men as more attractive and then they go on to say they are settling for women their age. Everyone settles.

mistresswhat · 2020-06-08T02:00:24+00:00

Nope.

Title	Is AFBB real?
Author	pizzaguy573871
Upvotes	17
Comments	295
Date	June 8, 2020 12:57 AM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/gyoscm/is_afbb_real/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/is-afbb-real.671593 https://theredarchive.com/post/671593

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