Why do you hate feminism?

Hypersapien · 2012-02-04T14:16:12+00:00

I want equality between men and women, too. That's why I don't call myself a feminist. The very name implies that it favors women. I call myself an egalitarian.

MattClark0994 · 2012-02-04T13:48:18+00:00

NOW (the LARGEST feminist org in america) posts "action alerts" against shared parenting bills.

http://www.glennsacks.com/enewsletters/enews_11_28_06.htm

As Christina Hoff Sommers documents in her best selling NY times notable book of the year "The War Against Boys" the AAUW (another fem org) promoted a fake girl crisis in the 1990's using faulty statistics or statistics that they "misplaced" in order to get all attention devoted to girls education, like it is now.

That same org tried to use the "wage gap" as justification for ignoring boys troubles in school.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/peg-tyre/who-says-the-boy-crisis-i_b_104172.html

A gap that is bogus btw, as proven by the Consad Report (prepared for The Dept of Labor).

http://www.consad.com/content/reports/Gender%20Wage%20Gap%20Final%20Report.pdf

The recent male studies movement which seeks to mostly address the boy crisis. The feminist reaction to that was not postive at all of course, because "history is male studies". Feel free to read some of the feminist blogs on the new male studies movement and tell me if you can find even one that has a postive outlook on it.

http://www.malestudies.org/

https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=male+studies+feminism&oq=male+studies+feminism&aq=f&aqi=g-v1&aql=&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=5356l7070l0l7429l9l9l0l6l6l0l48l139l3l3l0

NOW (again the Largest femi org in america) is against boy only schools because "they increase sexism and exacerbate feelings of superiority toward women." Sad that I dont have to make s**t like this up.

http://www.now.org/issues/education/single-sex-education.html

Many more examples of feminist hate can be found in Christina Hoff Sommers two best selling books - "Who Stole Feminism" and "The War Against Boys".

So no offense but I am not interested in the kind of "help" feminist would like to give. And also I have yet to see of one example of modern feminists campaining for a valid mens rights issue (in fact its usually the opposite with feminists campaining against an MRA issue) and that alone says something about the movement in general.

stemgang · 2012-02-04T16:16:59+00:00

Real feminists

Bring on the "no true Scotman"!

pcarvious · 2012-02-04T14:05:04+00:00

When a theory is issued in science it is up for speculation and challenge. However, challenging many of the notions put forth in feminist literature get you called a misogynist and dismissed. There is little critical analysis of many feminist theories accepted from outside of feminist authors. If you don't toe the line as a feminist author you're removed or have your pink card (I know it's not pink, but it fits the image) removed. This happened to Naomi Wolf as I recall. It also happened with Straus, (not straus-Kahn.)

Basically feminism when it was still a theory was fine, but since it's inception the theory has been used as a convenient excuse for the actions of feminist groups. I can claim to be for equality all I want, but my actions must also follow the same bend. You can't claim that one group has it worse than others and that makes it okay to exclude them. Be it fifty or be it five, all victims should have the resources available to protect themselves. However, feminism has pushed, in the case of vawa for exclusion of men and proceded to spread misinformation on the whole subject.

If I was asked today what I thought about feminism, I would have to base my decision on the actions ofthe group. There's a lot of good and bad mixed together, but little effort to fix what's gone horribly wrong with the movement.

ENTP · 2012-02-04T14:29:28+00:00

Because feminist theory insists on unsubstantiated, non-evidenced, ancient concepts like "patriarchy" and "pervasive male privilege".

In feminist circles, "cis white straight man" is practically an insult. "Man-splaining" is a common term used to shut men up.

VAWA, the duluth model and primary aggressor policies all owe themselves directly to feminism. All these are misandristic biased policies and legislation.

Feminism is extremely influential, as I've pointed out it influences policy making, law enforcement, and is official dogma in universities. With all this influence, feminism does not meaningfully address, or even ATTEMPT to address the majority of men's issues.

And to top it all off, when I reference statistics, such as men comprising 80% of suicides, the vast majority of the homeless population, the fact that boys are significantly less literate than girls, male genital mutilation I get all sorts of convoluted, awful explanations as to why "those aren't actually issues" and "women are so oppressed" and men "so privileged".

I don't hate feminists, just feminism and it's disgusting, biased, unsubstantiated, sexist, counter-egalitarian ideology and underlying "theory".

levelate · 2012-02-04T15:44:04+00:00

then where are these feminists 'who want to help men'?

do you count yourself as one?

because all i see here is you saying NAFALT and not backing it up, while those who want to harm men can hide behind your persona of NAFALT.

if you really wanted to help men then you wouldn't call yourself a feminist.

as an aside (and this is something i've wondered for a long time), how do you reconcile calling yourself a feminist after the many lies and dirty tactics they used and still do use

DavidByron · 2012-02-04T14:14:08+00:00

Real feminists want to help men in the areas that they are oppressed and women in the areas that they are.

Can you show me one feminist program or dollar spent to this effect?

There is no point in claiming that feminism does X,Y and Z when it clearly doesn't. If you believe that real feminism is about helping men but there is not one example out of the many programs or billions of dollars that feminism spends, what you think feminism is and what feminism actually is are two very different things.

shabutaru118 · 2012-02-04T14:42:17+00:00

If you want equal rights for both genders then you're not a feminist.

girlwriteswhat · 2012-02-04T17:48:33+00:00

To be honest? I hate feminism because feminist activism and theory steers society's collective empathy more strongly in the direction it naturally wants to go--toward women and away from men.

We could never, at any time through history, have kept women and children safe by sacrificing the lives of men (10 million of them in WWI) if we cared as much about men as we do about women.

Which is why every time you see someone like you saying, "What about this huge problem that harms a lot of men!" you get all kinds of responses like it's not the same even if it is, or it's not a big problem, even if it is. It's where you get entire articles on how women are afraid of violence and how it's a huge problem in urban centers because, OMG, in URBAN centers, women face ALMOST the same risk of violent crime as men (and that's the end of the article's analysis of the male half of the problem--which actually accounts for 80% of victims), and where you see, in pretty much every comment thread on a video of mine where I mention circumcision that it's not really that big a deal, and FGM is MUCH worse.

Feminism takes our natural tendency to view men as inappropriate objects of our empathy, and exploits it in order to enact laws and policies that help women but actively harm men. The allowable ratio seems to me to be 1 unit of help for women is worth 10 units of harm for men.

Considering I have two sons I love just as much as my daughter, I really don't want them to live in a world that does not care about their problems, and feminism absolutely contributes to that.

HolyCounsel · 2012-02-04T16:47:34+00:00

First, you need to be more aware of the title of feminist. If you are fighting for equal rights for both genders, then you are an egalitarian. If you are more selective in what you spend your time on, then you are a small "f" feminist, or an MRA, or a LGBT activist. Regardless of where your focus lies, you will be gladly accepted here in /mensrights as someone fighting for gender equality.

But you cannot simply say that "real feminists" want this or that, and deny the existence of a huge, well-established, and well-funded group of professional victims that call themselves "Feminists".

Feminism is broadly despised for very real reasons. Why do I hate feminism? Let me count the ways...

PATRIARCHY. The theory that privilege and power actively work to oppress women. This is patently absurd notion that does absolutely nothing to illuminate the real reasons behind the inequalities women face. Gender stereotypes and prejudice are as old as humankind, and arose from many sources, but not because men wanted to keep women under their thumb.

If oppression was the goal, then women of centuries past would have received NO protections or rights, similar to the truly oppressed slaves to which Feminists like to compare themselves. Patriarchy theory is even less able to describe why men would have any nasty gender stereotypes on their shoulders, yet that doesn't stop the pitiful "oh, but Patriarchy hurts men too!" rejoinders.

PRIVILEGE. Not the idea itself, which is easy to understand, but the usage it received in the hands of Feminists. There are very few posters here in /menrights who have not been told to "check their privilege", or that they simply cannot understand because they are men. We can take you at your word that YOU wish to cooperate to end sexism, but most of us have experienced the reality of that promise.

RADICALISM. Scratch any anti-feminist and you can get a long list of extremely misandric quotes from the founders of feminism. Not just some of them, but MOST of them, are responsible for authoring quotations that should never have been given reception by those seeking equality, and yet still continue to get it.

Only when manhood is dead - and it will perish when ravaged femininity no longer sustains it - only then will we know what it is to be free - Andrea Dworkin

Posted three days ago and still upvoted in /feminisms, a promotion for the collected works of this bigot.

GENDER CONSTRUCTION. Only Feminists hold to the notion that men and women think and behave exactly the same, with culture making up the entirety of the differences. The grip of Feminism on academia is largely responsible for the deplorable state of research which could actually help us figure out the genders scientifically.

WOMEN ARE GOOD/MEN ARE EVIL. Not they the don't have problems; it is just not their fault. Women have poor body image - blame "the male gaze". Women do poorly at math - blame men for telling women they are bad at math. Women cannot get elected in democracies despite being more than half of the voters - you guessed it, blame men.

According to Feminism, there is absolutely nothing wrong with women that a little boost of "girl power" can't fix. Men, however, are outrageously flawed beasts, masculinity is toxic, and IF they can be fixed, it will only be with huge doses of Feminism. Scour the founding documents and you will not find a single Feminist who had anything good to say about men.

MEN HAVE IT GOOD. The converse of above. Feminists do not talk about men having shorter lifespans, higher suicide rates, higher workplace mortality, sole responsibility to fight in wars, an obligation to save "the women and children first", the inequities of family courts, etc.

As I have run out of time, I will let this point stand as my last. Contrary to the many declarations by Feminism's adherents, there has not been a single case where Feminism has actually helped men, and at the same time worked against men on various issues.

If you are truly for equal rights then I look forward to working with you and others like you. But if you are offering the help of a "real feminist" then you can shove off - you are most definitely not wanted.

aregeneral · 2012-02-04T18:20:48+00:00

feminism =/= equal rights for both sexes, it is inherently about rights for females.

2012-02-04T14:43:58+00:00

Because feminism is definitionally identical to female supremacism. If feminism were egalitarianism, it would be called egalitarianism. It's not. The "fem" in "feminism" is there for a reason.

For the record, I don't really consider myself a men's rights activist, either. I'm an individualist. Although "men's rights" is less offensive than "feminism," because men's rights don't come at the exclusion of women's rights (rights don't work that way), whereas feminism just refers to the promotion of females in general, including to the exclusion of men.

clockworkgirl21 · 2012-02-04T16:44:38+00:00

Because they don't actually want equality, they want to be treated better than men. Just watch what happens in a work place if a man talked to a woman the way he would talk to another man. Suddenly, he's create a "hostile work environment".

JockeVXO · 2012-02-04T14:57:56+00:00

I despise feminism because if you don't believe in Patriarchy Theory, which I don't, the hatred and bigotry that is feminism becomes clear.

I went from being a non-feminist to being an antifeminist because I found out what they'd told was lies, the constant lying about the past and the present really gets to me.

SpeakToTheSky · 2012-02-04T13:54:20+00:00

I don't hate feminism. I don't hate anything, except perhaps Lima beans. And you're welcome to post here.

Feminism is not compatible with men's rights because feminism is a supremacist movement as demonstrated by it's organized advocacy, attitudes towards men, and male-hating propaganda.
Feminism is not compatible with men's rights, because fem relies on Patriarchy theory, the idea that women, as a group, have always been oppressed by men, as a group. Hence the gendered word "feminism" for your movement.
No doubt there are many feminists who genuinely care about men's issues, but my distrust meter will always be in the red when i talk to (edit: men & women) who identify with a supremacist movement.

johnmarkley · 2012-02-04T22:26:40+00:00

Thank you for speaking up against the marginalization of male rape survivors. That's the sort of thing that typically goes unchallenged because it doesn't occur to most people that it's even an issue, and we need people calling out that assumption when it appear if it's ever going to stop.

aetheralloy · 2012-02-04T16:59:26+00:00

I don't hate feminism.

I dismiss it like I would any cult.

Lawtonfogle · 2012-02-04T15:31:47+00:00

Personally, I think someone who is truly fighting for the equality of either sex to the other has to, by default, be fighting for both sexes to be equal. Thus, a true feminist has to be a true MRA. Consider an abstract example of two piles of dirt that are of unequal size. Now, if I want to make them equal, I can add to the smaller, take away from the larger, or do both. But no matter what I do, in the end, I have made both piles equal. In making the smaller pile equal to the larger pile I have also made the larger pile equal to the smaller pile.

My problem is with people, of either gender, who only want equality in some areas where one gender is worse off than the other, but not equality in both areas. For example, a 'MRA' who wants equality in custody but not in pay grade, or a 'feminist' who wants equality in pay grade but not in custody.

This really becomes a problem when people try to say "oh, X's problem is so much worse than Y's we should just ignore Y." In some cases, this might be true, but often people twist the figures to try to make this argument when in reality X and Y are both having pretty bad problems.

Also, sometimes the solutions people come up with are just stupid. Consider the solution to female sexual assault being paying women to report sexual assaults (regardless if they result in a conviction or not) or the courts automatically siding on the side of a woman. Even if we were to pretend for a second males are victims of sexual assaults, some of the solutions purposed completely undermine the justice system and hurt the falsely accused.

2012-02-04T15:45:16+00:00

Historical feminism I have a lot of respect for.

My main gripe is "2012 feminism" seems to think we are still living in the 1950s while downplaying misandry and MRA.

Bobsutan · 2012-02-04T16:27:10+00:00

The thing is, if you want "equal rights" then you should have no problem casting off a female skewed title, and accepting something like "humanist" or "egalitarian." Most feminists that actually can do things such as lobby for change, or actually change it themselves, tend to be the man hater type that basically advance women at the expense of men. Most of the "equality!" thing is very skewed towards solely helping females. People like you say they are for equality, and many of you are (which is why I don't automatically write people off for being a feminist,) but much of what feminism actually does in practice, is "anti" men. Such as the complete vilification of male sexuality in the media, the (as you mentioned) marginalization of male rape (and domestic violence to an even greater extent,) and many more. Campaigns like the "Men can stop rape!" posters are blatantly sexist, yet feminism encourages things like that, when there is absolutely no mention of the possibility of female rapists. (when ironically, 59% of male rapists were actually molested by females when they were younger.)

AnonTheAnonymous · 2012-02-04T23:43:42+00:00

I hate feminism because it is female chauvinism. It fights an endless crusade against men, it tries to depict men as rapists and child abusers, it creates the broadest and vaguest definitions of rape (drunken hook-ups), domestic violence (being rude to her friends), and sexual harassment (flirting) imaginable. It makes it impossible for a man to get divorced (if he still has to support her, how is he divorced?), condones false rape allegations as a learning experience for men, creates anti male attitudes in the universities and school systems, is committed to the elimination of the idea of a father as a social role, and generally teaches women to fear, distrust, and eventually hate men, and even worse teaches young men to hate themselves. Feminism is based on lies, distortions, and political chicanery and is ultimately organized bigotry against the male half of the human population.

clockworkgirl21 · 2012-02-04T16:59:07+00:00

"Feminism is the idea that you can create equality by focusing on the issues of only one sex."

TracyMorganFreeman · 2012-02-04T18:06:28+00:00

My problems with feminism is with its advocacy and its theory. When it comes to theory, just look at the model for sociology in general:

-Have an opinion

-Redefine terms

-Profit

Most of sociology is deeply rooted in politics and not science, and that is why I give little credence to patriarchy theory.

Hamakua · 2012-02-04T16:36:32+00:00

Real feminists want to help men in the areas that they are oppressed and women in the areas that they are.

I know your movement better than you do and you are wrong.

First, I used to be a feminist.
Second, I have been studying the ugliness that is feminism for over 10 years.
Third, NAFALT.
Fourth, equivocating, stop doing it.

Many here have been doing this so long that there is nothing you could say about feminism nor anything you know about feminism that we have not already heard before, nor anything we don't already know. you underestimate this board believe that /r/feminism (or any other subreddit) has any sway over our opinions. This board isn't a portal in order to Xpost and combat the dozens of feminist centered subreddits. It is an outskirt border town to the rest of the MRM. Most here don't read /r/ anything for "feminist insight". Want to know what true feminists believe? Watch what your own organizations and lobby groups fight for, or more importantly... against.

You are just a pawn to be ignored (by both sides). Your ideals are not shared by your own leadership and you characterization of "feminism" is not shared by the members of this board.

"Not All Feminists Are Like That" - You are right, just the ones in power are.

2012-02-04T15:28:27+00:00

I personally have a sour taste in my mouth when I think of feminists because it's a dead cause. Women have equal rights, and the only difference in genders is that men can be exploited a hell of a lot more. Which is why this subreddit exists.

sfacets · 2012-02-05T01:23:22+00:00

I 'hate' any group of true believers. This includes nationalists, religious people and f course feminists.

The more outspoken about their indoctrinated beliefs they are, the more they are hated by me. Look at the Westoborough Baptist church - these people are clearly insane, and their insanity coupled with their sociopathic urge to call attention to themselves endears themselves to no one else but other nutters. The same goes for feminism. The average feminist isn't very well read, she (or he) may have read a few radical authors, but all the rest of their knowledge on the subject is gleaned from their friends, and in an effort to fit in, these socially awkward and insecure people feel that in order to fit in with their group they need to vocalize their hatred towards others - this is true of all hate groups, from the KKK to the Black Panthers, to any National government. True believers speak in slogans, cannot adapt to new ideas, and are extremely obnoxious and oftentimes dangerous to be associated with.

You cannot change their minds, their minds have been cast in the cement of ignorant belligerence against anyone who opposes their views (or who they believe may oppose their views) here they join the vast majority of humankind in their formation and subsequent segregation of "us" vs. "them".

I don't really hate or even pity them. They are living in the past, perhaps lacking the will to fight the natural tendency humans have to form clans, form territories, and fight.

tl;dr - they are idiots.

frehop · 2012-02-05T01:27:41+00:00

Never once in my life have I witnessed a feminist call out another on their misandry. Plenty of times, I've witnessed feminists explain to other feminists how some horrible thing they said about men is actually misogyny, homophobia, transphobia, racism, ageism, ableism, etc (while completely ignoring the misandry). However, I've never once seen a feminist call out or refuse to associate with another feminist because of their hatred of men.

windynights · 2012-02-04T16:22:36+00:00

As long as feminism remains a women-first ideology who can credibly support it? I have zero respect for its practitioners. The damage they do to community and public discourse grows by the year.

Lastaria · 2012-02-04T17:46:29+00:00

Hi, thanks for your post.

I have to say I have some issues with feminism. But those issues are for what feminism has become. It started out as something calling for equal rights, but now it seems to mean something different. It has become something negative towards men.

Not all who call themselves feminists are like this. A good deal genuinely do want an equal world. However the very term feminist speaks of there being one side, the feminine.

So I do not have issues with the idles of an equal society, I have problems with a group that has become one sided and cannot see or accept the views of the other side.

Alas I think the same problem can be found in this subreddit. I see from many a them and us attitude. Men here seeing women as the enemy.

I personally wish there were no feminist subreddits, no men's rights subreddits but instead a subreddit for equality where all come together to fight for the rights of women and men.

I doubt this will happen anytime soon however alas.

Welcome to this subreddit. I hope you do not get put of by some here who like in the feminist subreddits can be a bit extreme and you cn work towards a better understanding for all.

MRMRising · 2012-02-04T19:19:00+00:00

I think it's wonderful you feel so passionate about equal rights, but there are feminists who want the same things. Don't shrug us off, Let us help you!

So you want to help eh?

-Donate to Tom Martin's legal fund.

-Sign the petition to end MALE circumcision.

-Call/email your Senator, and tell them why they should oppose re-authorising VAWA.

Thats a start.

kyrie-eleison · 2012-02-04T20:31:28+00:00

I dislike feminism because addressing the problems of a single gender will not bring equality.

stinger503 · 2012-02-04T20:36:17+00:00

You're what I would call a "mild" feminist. Every group has these people. For example: Can you think of anyone who doesn't want clean water and air? Of course not, everyone wants those things. But would you put these "environmentalists" on the same plane as someone who kills their family for Gaia?

So YOU might be an egalitarian feminist and want equal rights, realize that there is a whole movement of feminism who follow feminist theory (i.e. men have always oppressed women and still do) and that these people are setting feminist policy. Another analogy would be: say you agree with the Republicans on the economy but disagree with them on wars. Whether you agree with them on war doesn't matter because you voted as a Republican anyway.

My point is, represent your own beliefs first before identifying as part of a group or trying to change a group's beliefs to your own.

clockworkgirl21 · 2012-02-04T21:35:03+00:00

I am against Feminism because they are against Biology.

Many feminist simply do not recognize that men are inherently stronger than women. (Generally speaking of course)

Also, they simply reject gender roles based on biology. Men and Women have different bodies and our brains are wired differently. Gender roles are real, and we shouldn't shy away from them. That doesn't mean women and men should not bet treated equally, it just means real differences exist between men and women.

Feminism believes ALL gender roles are based on the "patriarchy" which is absurd.

spagma · 2012-02-04T22:44:44+00:00

I don't hate feminism, I hate some of what feminism has done, and continues to do.

DavidByron · 2012-02-05T01:32:56+00:00

If you want sex equality then you need to stop supporting feminism because it's a hate movement. /r/feminism is a really nice bunch of feminists relatively speaking. If you think they are bad you should try some other feminist hang outs. I sounds like you don't have much clue what the feminist movement is really about. I strongly advise you to disassociate yourself from them.

afndale · 2012-02-04T16:50:59+00:00

I don't hate feminism, but I think it (and the MRM) have huge bulks of their organization locked into a zero-sum mentality. I'm bored to tears with the statement "Men must stop rape", as it's the greatest sidestep of a potentially effective policy. What's needed at a time like this is honey, not vinegar, but it irritates the shit out of me when I go to a feminist blog and see a post on this subject that's mocking anyone who disagrees with them about the nature of the problem or the solution. If you charge them with marginalizing the issue through mockery, they respond saying something like "Yeah well this is my space and I'm allowed to be offensive in my space". No, this isn't just your space, just because you're the moderator doesn't mean your blog exists in some kind of vacuum. You're not allowed to bitch about why men don't come support feminists in droves until you cross that narrow bright line of understanding that people are paying attention to you and evaluating your entire movement based on what you say. If you want people to like your movement, stop offending people unnecessarily.

Oh, and on a similar note, feminists, please admit that female privilege exists. Please acknowledge it, so that I can take you seriously. I completely accept the existence of privilege, and I've spent far too much time trying to watch my male privilege, but refusal to acknowledge female privilege is what creates the perception of a victim mentality that just turns people off.

2012-02-04T18:12:17+00:00

It's as simple as this. Feminism = nothing to do with equality, usually about power, and generally use mud slinging tactics. Womens / Men's rights = fighting for equal rights and are just 2 faces to the same coin with the same goals.

Scott2508 · 2012-02-04T15:59:57+00:00

why do I hate feminism , id say i hate feminism, I dont hate all feminists , feminism as a concept has moved away from being about equality and into this weird, twisted anti men concept , there are a lot of good honest women who dont see it yet , who wear the feminist badge but are good, its important that people outside the mra see this.

sumrexnox · 2012-02-04T16:38:11+00:00

I hate feminism for the exact same reason that i hate all other "rights" movements. They're inherently racist/sexist. We need to be espousing the common rights of people and not focusing on the past, but looking to the future.

2012-02-04T16:39:55+00:00

I don't hate them. I don't trust them.

EDIT: Also, western law enforcement officials rarely even investigate muggings as individual crimes. You might get justice if the guy is being looked for and you can identify him, but the costs of investigation and payoffs in reducing crime tend to be against you. Muggings are mostly reported for the insurance reimbursements.

breakwater · 2012-02-04T18:40:34+00:00

I don't hate feminism. But aside from the many many good points already made, I'll add in that there is a certain meanness that exists within the movement now. If you don't fit their demands exactly, they have no use for you. Go against them and they will try to destroy you.

A perfect example happened this week. The Susan Koman foundation decided to stop donating to Planned Parenthood. Why? PP does a lot of abortions and it the Koman foundation was being told by potential donors that they did not want to help support that.

Because of this, their website was hacked, they were mocked and derided and called "anti-woman." Get that, an organization, who has spent hundreds of millions of dollars exclusively to benefit women's health is viewed as anti woman because they don't support one organization anymore.

The assault was so harsh that the Koman foundation eventually came back in to renew the funding. Can you imagine that? They are now stuck as perpetual donors to an organization that they want no association with. That is identical to a mob protection racket.

earl_sleek · 2012-02-04T22:29:14+00:00

OH BOY HERE WE GO AGAIN

failbus · 2012-02-04T23:18:30+00:00

Asking me why I hate feminism is a little like asking me why I hate Americans. A lot of people claim to be feminists. Some are reasonable. Some are not. I know self-identified feminists who are completely against the actions of NOW.

There's no definition of a "real" feminist as far as I can tell. If someone identifies as a feminist I say, "and what social issues do you think need addressing the most?" Then I'll figure out if I should hate them or not.

us3rnamealreadytaken · 2012-02-05T02:19:27+00:00

Feminists are like Christians, that all use one label but have many sects.

In_Armor · 2012-02-05T03:01:20+00:00

Equality can't be reached by focussing on one gender. Thus feminism is flawed in terms of equality for all. Don't label yourself a feminist if your aim is equality for ALL

TheRealPariah · 2012-02-05T04:12:24+00:00

I see no problem with the analogy as applied in either cases. Both should be questioned to determine the validity of the statement. And both should be punished if they are lying. This is equality not trying to shield one from scrutiny.

themountaingoat · 2012-02-05T12:40:04+00:00

It's easy for you to say that you care about equal rights. Basically all feminists say that. Then when you try to say that some of the problems that women face are partially the fault of women, or at least not men's fault, or say that men have equivalent problems then call you misogynist. To me, it seems that feminists are more interested in perpetuating an attitude that women are angelic blameless victims of men than actually helping women. In addition, feminists, if they do advocate for men's issues at all, do it only when it doesn't conflict with women's issues or their overall program of women as victims and men as oppressors. If the feminist movement wants to work with the MRM it needs to change, because I would guess that everyone here has tried to work with feminists and realized it's impossible.

Roddy0608 · 2012-02-05T13:04:33+00:00

The term, feminist, alone is sexist.

Zorbius · 2012-02-06T04:13:19+00:00

First of all, I don't hate feminism. I do however resent the majority of the people who visit that subreddit.

My biggest issue is the ridiculization of anything other than women's issues.

That /r/Feminism would be focused on women's issues, is to be expected. It's the main demographic. My issue starts at the behavior of claiming that anything not about women being wronged in some way, is of no importance, or even something to be ridiculed.

Men face discrimination and harassment based on their gender too, yet when those issues are raised, /r/feminism uses male stereotypes to either justify the discrimination or even encourage it and claim you're the one who's wrong for not agreeing with it.

I see a bunch of people fighting against sexual discrimination, but only against female discrimination. Male discrimination, they couldn't give a shit.

Those truly aiming for total equality are by far the minority on that /r/Feminism.

Equality, but women more equal than men. That's /r/feminism every day of the week.

2012-02-06T07:55:22+00:00

The important distinction is between feminist and feminism. Feminists can be of any stripe, creed, political leaning, and orientation. Institutional feminism, on the other hand, is essentially a matriarchal lobbying group with local, state, national, and international political power to change policy in their favor as they see fit. Sometimes, that change is good--outlawing FGM, for instance. Sometimes, it's not good at all--giving money to impoverished women and mothers, but not fathers and men; tacitly and even actively supporting circumcision; promoting the myth of male dominance in domestic violence, etc.

So as much as individual feminists want to say "Not All Feminists Are Like That!", that's not the point--it doesn't matter if every single feminist on the planet were the best and most moral person they could possibly be. Institutional feminism is still a political action committee with its own aims to control legal decision making, social attitudes, and the bully pulpit of "diversity" for its own benefit.

roland3337 · 2012-02-04T21:07:20+00:00

I hate feminism because it is a hate-based supremacist ideology that has no basis in any kind of reality.

C0CKPUNCHER · 2012-02-04T17:37:21+00:00

Why is this obvious concern troll so upvoted?

black_or_white · 2012-02-04T14:33:15+00:00

Read Wendy McElroy at ifeminists.com. Now she's a real feminist.

oomod · 2012-02-04T15:17:41+00:00

http://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/p70en/haaay_im_writing_a_paper_for_my_feminist_class/

WhatsUpWithTheKnicks · 2012-02-04T17:15:55+00:00

It's not so much a question of hate. It is about loving the good. Feminism is an evil. Do you hate Nazis? Well, I do not say if I have feelings one way or the other towards Nazis, but I know that Nazism is an evil. It should go away. No need to hate. Do you know what you put on your dinner table and what you flush down the toilet? I do.

clintonsclit4u · 2012-02-04T18:25:20+00:00

i think feminism makes women unhappy, just like macho chauvinism does the same for men. i don't see a point in either, they both divide us.

2012-02-05T03:33:36+00:00

Pretty gross. You can help us, and it's very easy. Leave men alone, don't support women who tear down men.

But, even in the one post you put here, you can't help it.

Pretty gross.

Well no, things must change and you feminists are wrong about many things because your lying chaletans....we don't deal with liar's any more.

mikesteane · 2012-02-05T08:42:17+00:00

As an MRA, I do not support equal rights; I support an appropriate balance of rights and responsibilities. If men, and only men, are required to register for the draft, then men, and only men, should be responsible for electing the government. If women are incapable of consenting to sex because they have been drinking, then they are also incapable of deciding whether to drive or not and therefore should not be allowed to drink.

JeremiahMRA · 2012-02-04T21:33:17+00:00

Feminism, like all leftism, is inherently immoral.

2012-02-04T15:05:53+00:00

I got an idea...

You want to help, then fucking do something. Until you do, shut the fuck up.

crossedculasses · 2012-02-04T16:51:42+00:00

I hate feminism because most feminism I have encountered personally only seeks to reverse the old order of men being in power and women being second-class citizens. I believe in true equality.

ss_camaro · 2012-02-04T15:56:18+00:00

NAWALT!111!

andiW · 2012-02-04T19:15:48+00:00

Dictionary -- > Feminism --> the doctrine advocating social, political, and all other rights of women equal to those of men.

Don't see the problem.

Title	Why do you hate feminism?
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	55
Comments	224
Date	February 4, 2012 1:27 PM UTC (14 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/palnc/why_do_you_hate_feminism/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/why-do-you-hate-feminism.1028242 https://theredarchive.com/post/1028242

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