CMV: Unsuccessful young men should go where they are treated best

creekcrystall · 2021-12-12T20:55:45+00:00

The problem with this suggestion is young nonwestern women are western women in sheep’s clothing. Sure they’ll be traditional but you have to pay for everything. Can young western men afford to or even want to do exactly what they’re running away from here?

What’s more is feminisim is expanding which means more women aren’t interested in being “traditional “ except the golddiggers.

What’s even MORE is if you do find a traditional woman, the chances of her marrying you are slim to none since her culture likely won’t allow her. Now let’s say somehow, someway her culture does allow her, how quickly can you adapt to living in a developing world as a shrivel American boy?

Demasii · 2021-12-12T21:08:55+00:00

If you have a way of working outside the country where your money stretches further (remote work) and you're okay with visiting family/friends infrequently (once a year), why would you stay?

Culture and language difference is a big one. The feeling of being a minority is a very jarring and lonely experience if you didn't grow up with it. It's alot to give up just for a woman.

Englishology · 2021-12-13T01:22:22+00:00

Shoutout r/digitalnomad

In all seriousness though, I'm early 20s and work remotely (and independently for the most part). I've been living in Colombia for the past two months and have no plans on moving back to the states. Women aren't the main factor - I've been able to save almost 60% of my income living here (vs. a meager 10-15% back in Chicago) and I don't really worry about money, like at all. Women are icing on the cake tho

EM2212 · 2021-12-13T02:09:07+00:00

Everyone gonna say foreign woman using you for green card/money but I've seen more and more guys say they do better out of their home country. Some guy said he got more match's and dates within one week then he entire time in the states. I don't know why people are so against men trying to get love and intimacy. I remember a dating couch saying going to a third world country to gain some confidence and learning the feeling of how it feels to be loved is a good idea. Don't let some randoms on the internet who probably don't know what they talking about tell you what to do.

md8716 · 2021-12-13T07:00:55+00:00

The truth is, your view is partially correct. You really can do a lot better abroad. Depending on the country, people just have fundamentally different values than native born American women do. But it's not for everyone -- you have to be willing to "go native". So while that prescription may work well for you personally, it's not going to be good general advice that applies to unsuccessful men.

Personally, I ended up marrying a cute traditional girl that wanted a family, and has a great personality. We've been married a decade already and have no signs of slowing down. Maybe I could have found that in the states, but the truth is, I would have to wade through 100x more bullshit. Shit, I'd probably still be single right now.

You'll get a lot of pushback IRL and on the internet because people just naturally hate competition and, to be honest, there's a lot of low-key racism and xenophobia. Americans tend to be dumb fat idiots who assume it's the greatest country in the world and that everyone wants to be like them. They also assume their values are universally superior and that obviously women just want a green card and to take advantage of you. Pay them no mind, they are narrow-minded.

WilliamWyattD · 2021-12-13T05:13:03+00:00

I've been around the world. I've actually lived or spent time in some of what were considered the prime destinations for less attractive Western men to get better looking foreign women.

The Internet changed everything. You can still 'safely' get a better looking girl there, but the degree of better looking is much less than it was. And by 'safely', I mean not get a girl who will basically be gold digging you, not find you attractive and resent you for 'exploiting her' even as she ruthlessly exploits her.

And of course, you take a hit in your own earnings. There are tons or other issues with fishing in the foreign pool.

If you aren't greedy, it can still be worthwhile for some men who do it carefully. But it is not what it once was. I mean it never was what people once thought it was. But it really isn't anymore.

NockerJoe · 2021-12-12T21:20:34+00:00

NGL when I see dudes with a lot of foreign fiancees a lot of the time its glaringly obvious they're getting taken for a ride. They usually put in a whole bunch of extra hours to pay to bring their foreign waifu back over and she is always like 8 tiers more attractive but rarely works, or works much. Hell I've seen lesbians do the same thing. Its a pretty consistent pattern of "Find foreign woman. Try to make it work. Agree to absurdly quick marriage or commitment. Put in 20+ extra hours a week at work to justify it."

Though this is probably more fair to them even so, in that they have the actual woman to work for, rather than being expected to be 100% sorted on a vague promise that you have a chance at a relationship.

creekcrystall · 2021-12-12T21:24:35+00:00

Why is it that some guys believe that a third-world girl using him as an ATM is "better treatment" than a Western sugar baby or Onlyfans girl doing the exact same thing?

This.

goatismycopilot · 2021-12-13T00:00:16+00:00

Here is where I CMV you.

Yes you should leave but you are not going to have MORE leverage you are going to have different leverage.

If you want to marry an attractive foreign woman who wants a green card and path to citizenship you will be able to meet any number of women. Depending on the culture and country you will be expected to provide gifts and cash to her and family members. It will be expected that you will be moving back to the US.

You are not just going to bang foreign women at will.

Once foreign wife has the ability to sponsor family members they may expect her to do so and she may be expected to send money.

Feisty-Saturn · 2021-12-12T21:29:55+00:00

First things first, you are talking to a small amount of people who can work remotely out of the country. I work In tech and so many of us who are more than capable of doing our jobs from home are being forced to go back into the office.

Even if a man has a job where he can work remotely out of the country he is probably fairly successful. There are no remote jobs for unsuccessful men. And as other commenters mentions even landing a foreign women more than likely means being her sugar daddy. There are many woman in America who are willing to date just about anyone if they are willing to take care of her.

Fusiontron · 2021-12-13T07:17:08+00:00

I think this works better if you're not White. I am mixed White/Asian/Hispanic which leads to me meeting the beauty standards in other countries better. I think Peru and the Philippines are the only places on Earth where I might be a considered a 7 in terms of looks. White and Black American women are not very receptive to my advances but I've actually had Peruvian and Filipina women try to flirt with me. It also helps if your accent is something non-standard. I speak in a typical Mid-Atlantic accent which is used on TV abroad all the time-I've heard actually that having a Southern accent is seen as really sexy even in the UK, but I'm not sure.

EDIT: BTW, if you're a Native American man, for some reason German women really would like to meet you. I'm still not entirely sure how this cultural phenomena started. Doesn't sound like a great offer either, being fetishized.

2021-12-13T01:33:16+00:00

Honestly man, I say go for it. Despite what some of angrier people in this thread might tell you, I think it’s completely possible to have a regular relationship as a foreign guy in SEA or wherever you go.

A lot of the guys who get taken advantage of are idiots who go for women way younger than them or try to fuck as many women as possible. If you’re smart about it, you can probably find a good girlfriend/wife there.

chips500 · 2021-12-13T05:05:05+00:00

Not impossible, but It is extremely difficult to immigrate as opposed to simply visiting.

It is, idealistic, to say the least to think you're going to have an inherent advantage. You'll be disadvantaged in so many ways too.

That being said, if you're capable to adapting to a foreign culture better than your local one, then congratulations. However that's no small feat.

No offense you don't have much leverage unless you're attractive in other countries either, and you need to become attractive by their standards. YMMV on what exactly those are. Sometimes that will be in your favor. Sometimes not. That goes back to the adapting and flourishing in the culture of the place you move to.

Also consider, USA is big, way bigger than you think, and way more diverse too.

Rather than changing views, and poo poo declaring one way or another is best, I advise you to travel and learn about both US and around the world and see what works for you individually to test what works for you. Learn more about where you live. Learn more about other places in the US. Interact with everyone. Everywhere is going to be different, and not in insignificant ways. It isn't black and white better or worse, its the hundreds of flavors of ice cream issue choosing between different qualities, requirements and literal ways of life.

If you can afford to travel, then go travel and find out!

Terpenstein13 · 2021-12-13T04:11:40+00:00

What’s really scary is that even being attractive isn’t enough. I know a very good looking guy who has been trying to settle down and get married and after a year like clockwork the girl breaks up with him. I think it’s because he wants to be a special ed teacher and the girls just don’t want a guy who makes less money than they do.

I mean at least he can get laid unlike me lmao, but I still feel bad for him. It’s a really bad scene right now. I don’t even think women like it this way either, look at how messed up femaledatingstrategy is. I think other women insult each other a lot and that makes them develop these unrealistic standards for men (and I think men have a lot of unrealistic standards as well).

Things just seem to be getting worse. The entire West seems so sexually frustrated

bleb_ploleman · 2021-12-12T21:53:10+00:00

K bye 👋

CatoftheBanals · 2021-12-13T00:03:47+00:00

I don't understand guys who are obsessed with the idea Western women will be "beta"-ing them and settling, with the fear that those same women will just cheat. "I'll find a hot young foreign wife who will obviously not be 'beta'-ing me and settling. She also, being hot, will not be cheating on me with men her age."

But the part that's actually CYV here is: you can't just pick up and waltz into any other country and plop down. You need a job, you need skills, you need papers, you need to demonstrate you can be there and won't be a drain on the resources. If you aren't pulling that in the US, you won't be there either. There are only so many English teachers in the world, and there are plenty of rich Chinese and Korean and Japanese businessmen so your can-do entrepreneurial spirit isn't really something unique there. The EU has insane requirements to settle there, if you think slipping into Poland or Lithuania or somewhere will work for Eastern European women.

poppy_blu · 2021-12-12T23:37:44+00:00

If it works for you have at it.

Where i disagree with your OP is this isn’t new by any stretch of the imagination. In cave days they traded with other tribes for women. Mail order brides have been a thing since there was the mail.

It may be logistically much easier to do today with the Internet and cheap international travel but it’s certainly not new.

manfrom-nantucket · 2021-12-13T00:21:54+00:00

Or you can stay in the west, stack your paper and not get married. Marriage and relationships are entirely optional. Go get yourself snipped, and never commit to a woman. Done.

Wide-Illustrator2906 · 2021-12-13T02:57:18+00:00

I think all men should go where they are celebrated and not tolerated. But as someone who travels for work I can honestly tell you that as an American man your SMV will go up at least two points just by traveling. Not to mention that if you are looking for a more traditional partner, you'll have a much greater chance of finding her overseas than in the States. I literally have no idea why so many western men continue to complain about the western dating market but won't even take one step out of their comfort zone to meet women overseas.

John_Oakman · 2021-12-12T21:04:54+00:00

Most LVMs currently residing in developed countries do not have the skills to live in developing countries. You can't just insert oneself [a stranger] into societies & communities that still have older community values*. Most developing countries are still very cutthroat in terms of interactions (especially of the informal business types critical in establishing oneself economically). It'll be akin to throwing a sheep into the lion's den.

Funny enough though, Americans don't even need to go to some developing country to observe how those types of communities operate: just look at how Asian restaurants operates, especially the parts that are under the table (which is like most of it).

*otherwise known as tribal, but that term carries some baggage that aren't necessarily true in this context.

quiturbitchn · 2021-12-12T21:14:12+00:00

Being financially sound and stable is valued as baseline. It’s no longer the best a woman can get because she can provide that herself. So you need to bring more to the table than the absolute bare minimum.

TotalTravesty · 2021-12-12T21:19:55+00:00

Ah, poor thing. Still believing that jetting off to some developing nation is the shortcut to your harem dreams.

There's nowhere in the world a person can expect to be treated "better" than any other place. There's just trading off one place's set of headaches for another's. You bought some impoverished girl to pretend to like you? Congratulations! Now you have to pay a recurring and ever-fluctuating rental fee to keep her and her extended family happy lest she dump you for the next Western incel with the same bright idea.

Why is it that some guys believe that a third-world girl using him as an ATM is "better treatment" than a Western sugar baby or Onlyfans girl doing the exact same thing?

Educational-Cut4177 · 2021-12-12T22:49:13+00:00

Let me guess, u want to go to Ukraine to find a submissive white wife

This kind of mentality is ridiculous, you’re not gonna have a better relationship in America or other country if you don’t fix yourself

NoMarriageNoKids · 2021-12-12T22:38:19+00:00

That's actually the tag line of The Nomad Capitalist

vin9889 · 2021-12-13T01:11:57+00:00

Why is the end goal is to marry someone!?!?

-Ivar-TheBoneless · 2021-12-13T03:07:03+00:00

Moving out of the country is very drastic and I think you need to take a lot of other things into account besides just getting girls. In fact it just sounds like a pipe dream whenever I hear guys say it.

Yes men will do much better in dating if the go to another country. I just think a much easier solution is for young guys to just get with older post wall women until they can build themselves up enough to get the younger girls.

Plenty of women today have fuvked up on everyone that ever cared about them and are ending up alone when the hit the wall. Alot of those older women still look good enough to hit and are lonely, but The older more established men don't want them anymore. So those women are easy picking for young guys. Those women can't get established men so they often settle for younger guys that are easy to impress and at least she'll get a guy with a hard dick and some stamina.

When I was younger I had problems with girls too so instead of killing myself chasing them I just got myself an older chick with a fat ass and I was good. Now a few years later I have my money right and now I can go after the younger hotter girls if I wanted to.

ex_red_black_piller · 2021-12-13T10:49:46+00:00

Betabuxxing is pathetic whether in US or elsewhere.

Hoopy223 · 2021-12-13T15:51:06+00:00

The USA isn’t monolithic, same for Europe. Its not the overpriced hell of San Francisco from coast to coast.

But if you want to leave I say go for it. When you are young and don’t a bunch of responsibilities and debts its the best time to travel. Go out and have that adventure.

frizface · 2021-12-13T22:07:42+00:00

Living in a place in Mexico where this isn't all that uncommon. Somewhat well to do Western males with much younger/prettier partners. And some plain Western women with hot boyfriends that are perfect gentlemen. My guess is more people will do this as working remote is common now.

As you're trying to settle down one issue is that relationships take a lot of communication, and that is harder across cultures/languages. It's also just nice to be able to crack jokes about shows you both grew up watching.

-passepar2t- · 2021-12-12T20:57:34+00:00

Have you ever traveled throughout the world and attempted to date in various other countries? If so, how has it turned out for you?

Educational-Cut4177 · 2021-12-12T22:58:02+00:00

Guys, the way most of you speak is insane. You’re never gonna be happy, even if you find some Thai or Ukrainian girl that’s willing ti out up with your sexist ass, your insecurities will be a challenge here, Asia or Europe. It baffles me that most of you think foreign women want ugly, sexist, broke American men, they don’t… they might marry you for the green card and leave you 2 years later.

Fix yourself, get some help, work on your fears and insecurities.

It’s extremely obvious you want a woman that you can hook, that’s why you are using the “being a provider” argument. You don’t want a woman that doesn’t need you economically, because she won’t deal with your bullshit.

I am fine guys, i hope you get the help you need, because this path won’t bring you true happiness.

_HEDONISM_BOT · 2021-12-12T22:08:33+00:00

And where would that be?

Lol!

LOLLLLLLLLLLLLL

At first I was laughing at the audacity, but then the absurdity was funnier.

And then the reality hit me and it managed to be even funnier.

I …. This is it you guys. I. I think this might be the time for me to die laughing.

captainquestionasker · 2021-12-12T21:55:08+00:00

Dude, all women suck. The ones overseas will just pretend to love you for less.

Golden-Sperm · 2021-12-12T22:36:54+00:00

Do you know how sexpats get their reputation?

souredskittles · 2021-12-13T09:19:39+00:00

Did you know expats (especially American) are known to be losers in foreign countries? There’s a stigma so I doubt you’d get tons of women, unless paid for ofc

Jakes1967 · 2021-12-12T21:34:18+00:00

Unsuccessful young men should go where they are treated best

Read Simon Sinek's: Leaders Eat Last.

There a parable called; 'you only ever deserved a Styrofoam cup'.

Fuel_Fine · 2021-12-12T22:00:05+00:00

Fellow Zoomer here. I agree that young men should explore their options as much as possible.

However the sexual market is global nowadays and as a foreign guy (specially american/western guy) you have to deal with such as the competition of other foreign men who already live in the country you're planning to go/move, competition and sometimes hostility from local men and of course little to no connection to the community/people living in there. Hispanic men tend to have it easier due to already having friends & communities in the countries they come from.

So there's that if you're looking for a relationship. Now if you're looking for sex then bon appétit , the vast majority of countries have a decent to excellent sex industry.

Rough_Collections · 2021-12-12T23:18:43+00:00

They will expect you to pay for everything.....Everything being food, shelter and clothing. Western women everything is....6K this and 100$ monthly subscription New 70K SUV that and monthly maintenance of 2K. "Everything" to most international women is a 52k lifestyle with less sass.... everything to most Western "traditional women" is a 150K lifestyle with a monkey on your back. Still cheaper to find one overseas. FYI if you factor inflation median income was 52K in the 1950s you women who want 100K+ men are asking for above average upper middle class men not the bare minimum.

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JacobMoogberg69 · 2021-12-12T21:30:00+00:00

If you are unsuccessful romantically as a guy

1. Why do you still identify with providers/betas/losers?

2. Why do you keep doing the same thing (being a provider/beta) and expect different results?

Why not change your behavior to be closer to what women find sexually attractive, the same way women change their appearance to make themselves more sexually attractive to men?

PlayfulLawyer · 2021-12-13T00:27:39+00:00

Well I am a successful guy and depending on how this country goes I'm still probably getting the hell out of here within the next 10 years for reasons other than dating obviously.

However for you guys that thank that you're just going to travel abroad and find this perfect ideal wife and scenario, as someone who has done a fair bit of traveling, good luck😂😂😂

TryLambda · 2021-12-13T00:32:08+00:00

Go mgtow, it will save you millions in the long term

Ratatouille2021 · 2021-12-13T03:10:52+00:00

Why do so many people advocate for things that they've never done themselves? Your post would be 1000X more valuable if you write in a few years after you've had success doing what you've advocated.

You really think it's that easy to walk into a foreign country where you don't know the language, you don't the culture, you can't handle the local cuisine, you don't know their financial system, you don't know their laws, and start picking up chick's because you're white?

Dream on man, you should try it if you think it's so easy.

cccccclairee · 2021-12-13T05:55:15+00:00

Go to SE Asia and take a look at all the old white guys who essentially purchased a local wife. This is not a new idea.

I don’t know that I’d be so ok with the way the rest of the world saw me if I did that, but do you.

samxx9 · 2021-12-13T05:56:06+00:00

Moving abroad seems cool until you do it. And being 'foreign' won't automatically make you a sexy chick-magnet. Try actually moving abroad and settling somewhere, especially somewhere in a less-developped country as you seem to be fantasizing about. You're also assuming poor countries are cheaper. You're often wrong. If you do your research, a ton of 'poor' countries are actually more expensive for the same goods and life and etc than the USA. import taxes, cost of needing private everything, etc.

_HEDONISM_BOT · 2021-12-13T06:37:20+00:00

So do it.

I’m surprised PPD men think they have better options in non western countries where women have less/no human rights.

Guess what happens when your entire livelihood depends on a man because you exist in a sharia law shithole as a woman?

It’s literally the most important choice in your life. In many places, it’s the only choice that matters..

Women get even pickier. The problems men complain about in the west, are the hard, cold, harsh facts of the east.

M_LaSalle · 2021-12-13T09:56:58+00:00

Packing up and moving to another country where one doesn't even speak the language is a serious undertaking. There are serious reasons why Bob might consider packing up and moving to Lower Slobbovia or wherever, but there could end up being some major downsides. Lower Slobbovia has ancient quarrels with Vulgaria that could erupt into war, refugees from Central Booga Booga are already flooding into the country because of human trafficking bringing with them crime and squalor, and the Slobbovian government may prove to be incompetent and corrupt. It would suck to move to a country that is in early stages of collapse, ethnic cleansing, or whatever. And maybe Bob turns out to be as autistic and socially inept as he was here. And then what?

There are a lot of reasons to pack up and get out of the USA. Things here aren't good, and they are likely to get a great deal worse. Having said that, OP doesn't seem to understand what's potentially involved in decisions like this. The choice isn't free of risk or cost.

ChromaticVengeance · 2021-12-13T14:36:59+00:00

You think dating is not competitive everywhere in the world?

Golden_Garfunkle · 2021-12-13T18:16:25+00:00

U yo**

Satan_and_Communism · 2021-12-13T19:04:20+00:00

I guess it depends on what you find attractive. I disagree unless by not attractive you mean blatantly ugly and quite fat.

If you’re ugly here, you’re probably ugly in a country where everyone’s jacked and tan. Even if you’re “exotic”

If you want to essentially go buy a wife by flashing around your cash in a developing country I guess that’s your prerogative. (Kind of sick and twisted if you ask me, but morals are relative I guess, maybe that woman would end up poor with someone who’s an ugly asshole anyway).

IMO you should simply get in good shape and attempt to actually understand what women want and become someone people want to spend time with. Then select wherever in the world you desire to live based on your own criteria.

But do you, king.

2021-12-14T00:01:33+00:00

CMV: Unsuccessful young men should go where they are treated best

Where, exactly?

Living in a complete different country than the one you grew up in-different culture, language-is a very high bar. It's hard even if you have a lot of things going for you. For a lot of men it is just not realistic for them to be able to do that kind of thing.

MelisandreStokes · 2021-12-16T14:55:42+00:00

I watch 90 day fiancée and the normal Americans are the ones who accidentally met a foreigner they like. The Americans who seek out foreigners to date are universally weird and off-putting and are clearly hoping language and cultural differences will cover for their strangeness if they date a foreigner.

Just food for thought

Title	CMV: Unsuccessful young men should go where they are treated best
Author	ItIsLikeMyOpinionMan
Upvotes	57
Comments	301
Date	December 12, 2021 8:39 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/rexrch/cmv_unsuccessful_young_men_should_go_where_they/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/cmv-unsuccessful-young-men-should-go-where-they.1092798 https://theredarchive.com/post/1092798

Comments

1. Why do you still identify with providers/betas/losers?

2. Why do you keep doing the same thing (being a provider/beta) and expect different results?