On why "Conditional Femininity" makes sense

OkProfessional9405 · 2024-06-07T05:13:00+00:00

This is like the guy who says, I have a yacht and a villa in the south of France, you just have to play your cards right and you'll get to see them.

You wanna be a masculine boss babe, you have every right to be whatever you wanna be, google luck with that. It's a hard pass from me and most men, however.

illusoryfindings · 2024-06-07T01:35:12+00:00

I can see your point, but I think ultimately this strategy would result in scaring good men away. It will either attract Machievallian types who understand this 'formula' and how to manipulate it, because this kind of "strong boss babe" posturing is like prey to abusers, they see it all the time.

Or it'll attract dudes with self-esteem issues, who see proving themselves to you as confirmation of their worthiness. They'll pedestalize you and act weird, overly affectionate, and clingy on the way up, and if that isn't offputting enough, you'll see their true colors once they feel like they've got you, which may not be what was advertised when you decided to be with this man.

And the good dudes, the ones you want, who don't want to begin a relationship on a weirdly adversarial foundation like that, will next you fairly early on because you seem standoffish and tit-for-tat. None of these outcomes are great.

It's a mistake to equate soft, demure femininity with weakness. There's a different kind of strength to it that, in many ways, transcends direct pushy assertiveness.

It's being socially graceful, charming people and softening them up in your presence, making it easier to spot their weaknesses and true intentions.

It's understanding what men want to see and hear, and subtly teasing them with the prospect of getting those things from you if they behave themselves, while still maintaining plausible deniability because of the indirectness.

It's getting a man to do what you want by daintily making a suggestion that it might possibly be a good idea, and he'll end up doing it thinking it was his own, because he wants to please you. He didn't even realize there was a negotiation and he was fully convinced.

There are a lot of women in the world who understand this "queen ruling by whispering in the king's ear" vibe, and they're able to be in charge, despite their men thinking they're the ones who are in charge.

My point is that even if you see dating as some kind of power struggle, like your post suggests, you are still best served by acting 'feminine' because it's what men want, and if you understand the power that comes with demure, gentle femininity, you will have won the war several times over before he even realizes there is one. Ideally you'd meet in the middle with someone and have a more balanced relationship though.

TheRedPillRipper · 2024-06-06T23:44:59+00:00

males first need to prove they’re worthy

The issue with this is now casual relationships are common. So much so, that if a man has options, he doesn’t need to ‘prove’ anything. As he has choice.

This is what TRP encourages.

januaryphilosopher · 2024-06-07T05:34:56+00:00

No, there isn't a secret feminine personality just waiting to be "unlocked" hiding within every woman. For the vast majority, what you see is what you get and a magical dick is not going to cause a personality flip. Femininity doesn't come out only when it's "safe" - it's literally the safest possible option for women as it's what they're expected to do, it's often used to cover up a woman's real personality because it's that safe.

SupportRemarkable583 · 2024-06-06T23:06:50+00:00

No thanks I'm alright

Sillysheila · 2024-06-07T01:26:11+00:00

Here’s what I don’t get. Why is being assertive sometimes when it’s warranted completely at odds with being nurturing? Why must we stay at home all the time to do domestic things? People always on here make out like it’s a binary choice. I work to put cookies on the table, but I also have the time to make them by hand. I don’t work crazy hours, but still make a good living. But because I remotely care about my job, like almost every woman now does, I’m a “boss babe”. I can’t ever massage my husband’s shoulder or decorate our house or make it nice and feed him because I am deemed “boss babe”. Does this make sense? Do we do this to men too?

jay10033 · 2024-06-06T23:50:44+00:00

You must also believe conditional masculinity also exists?

Whole-Employ4723 · 2024-06-07T00:48:05+00:00

“I’m a masculine and dominant man…you just have to unlock it first💅”. it’s crazy right?

Corbast7 · 2024-06-06T23:43:38+00:00

I don’t think this makes sense. Certain parts of the world you have to experience may be harsh because you have no control over some things, but that doesn’t have to mean dating has to be harsh, too.

If a guy seems like an asshole on a first date, I’d just leave. That’s enough of a “punishment.” I’m not motivated to act tough around a guy and play games in hopes that he’ll maybe bend to me and “earn” the softer side of me. Because that just shows he sees me as a game and that he’s not authentic.

If you feel like you have to play games with men, then you have low self worth imo. If this applies to you OP, then please raise your standards for the kinds of men you’re talking to! Walk away from them because they don’t deserve your time or any extra thought.

Protect your energy girl ✨

Barely-moral · 2024-06-06T23:56:36+00:00

I did the work before the first date to even be considered for the first date. If I am not getting what I want on the first date I am out.

I am not waiting more than I already did.

Also... why would I even want someone whose personality is conditional? That is unstable and unreliable. I want someone that is always the same.

RaidenTheBlue · 2024-06-07T00:00:29+00:00

So should I be a feminine queen until a woman finds me trustworthy?

Sure-Vermicelli4369 · 2024-06-07T00:07:05+00:00

Oh come on, this is ridiculous.

Women let their guard down for misogynistic dangerous men every day if they're good looking enough.

bluehorserunning · 2024-06-07T04:43:20+00:00

Yeah, no thanks.

kongeriket · 2024-06-07T06:15:38+00:00

Thanks for the laugh, OP.

BackToTheMoon_ · 2024-06-07T19:02:27+00:00

“You dont get a masculine provider on the first date. You have to earn that”

Pristine_Fuel_2604 · 2024-06-06T23:11:19+00:00

lol

I’ll just take a woman who’s naturally feminine by my standards than listening to whatever bullshit a woman like this would come up with to justify their actions

Hope that works out for them and whatever sucker puts on ring on a woman’s who’s personality is earned

Opie67 · 2024-06-07T00:04:21+00:00

I agree but you have to show some of it at some point so the guy isn't rolling the dice on if you're really feminine or a boss babe 24/7

KayRay1994 · 2024-06-07T01:11:55+00:00

While I do get what you’re saying, the association with “feminine” and “submissive housewife” is iffy. I wanna be clear, all submissive housewives are feminine, but not all feminine women are submissive housewives.

That all being said, I think it is very important for everyone to balance both ‘energies’ amongst themselves. I follow a few different set of spiritual practices and a common tenant is balancing both the masculine and feminine within yourself. We all have both within us, but a balance is key and fully leaning towards one should only really happen when appropriate/within right dynamic.

A woman opening up her femininity around the kind of man who makes her feel safe and secure is a good example of this, actually. She is free to lean into her femininity because the man is providing his masculine energy. At the same time, a man providing this protection and security is leaning into his masculinity as his femininity is addressed by the presence of his partner.

Of course, you won’t always have a partner (even if y’all are happily still together, there will be moments of the day or even periods of time when y’all aren’t seeing each other) and that’s where tapping into that energy is important.

Way I see it, masculinity is an externalizing energy and femininity is an internalizing energy - which is why feminine energy is far more empathetic and nurturing and masculine energy is more action driven and protective. We all need both within us, but leaning on one with the right partner can feel amazing for most people.

jayofthedeadx · 2024-06-07T06:30:57+00:00

I honestly think it just boils down to trust for both parties. If a man trusts you then he will “unlock” his masculinity for you and be a man for you. If a woman trusts you then she will step into her feminine for you. It goes both ways but without trust men won’t give a shit about you and women will be masculine aggros.

RandomCentipede387 · 2024-06-07T09:06:30+00:00

Bruh, what are you talking about, I try to use the feminine to actually cover my personality a bit, haha.

serpensmercurialis · 2024-06-07T12:09:21+00:00

Demure? Mom’s been reading her magazines again it sounds like. What does he think about ladies who don’t wear stockings?

Deference should be based on reason and the situation, not gender role. If I’m out with a guy on a first date and he obviously knows more about something than I do, then I am going to trust his judgment over mine as long as it’s reasonably safe risk-wise. But if I am with somebody 10 years and know that I know better than them, then I am only going to defer if it’s a big enough pain in the ass otherwise.

The femininity is there, but you may have to unlock it. Basically males first need to prove they're worthy of us letting our guards down. Demonstrating you are safe to be around, trustworthy, and capable (among other things).

Once those conditions have been met, THEN the woman will can feel safe to rest in her divine feminine energy.

“Chatgpt, describe the process of trusting someone as if you’re someone who calls themselves an empath and reads tarot cards on tiktok live”

Just kidding, actually it only takes about 4 masterwork crafts to get your reputation up to 5 stars with me. The turn-ins are limited to two items per month, though. Then you can unlock me with the master key I give you after you complete the reputation checkpoint quest.

Like we’re really just saying whatever the hell in 2024 to describe normal human behavior aren’t we?

Horned-Beast · 2024-06-07T14:20:45+00:00

Umm guess that works both ways.

The world is a violent environment, men have to be quiet and submissive or face physical violence. As a result men when dating should never act like providers or protectors. Women should expect less than masculine traits

Once women prove themselves to be worthy of being protected and provided for, demonstrating trustworthiness, faithfulness and femininity, men can feel safe dropping their guards and assuming a more masculine role.

Only after those conditions are met, can he feel safe showing his masculine side. He should never feel safe to be the chivalrous based on the hope and trust she's worth his masculine side and a good partner.

tdlr you don't get a masculine, provider and protector on the first few dates, you have to earn that.

see? all balanced and 50/50 and equal.

howdoiw0rkthisthing · 2024-06-07T01:19:06+00:00

You had me until divine energy

MongoBobalossus · 2024-06-06T23:24:01+00:00

Mine stayed aggressive and assertive, and I dig that. It’s like living with a lioness.

shadowrangerfs · 2024-06-07T00:33:27+00:00

The issue is the hypocrisy. If a man tried to make his masculinity conditional, woman wouldn't stand for it.

Imagine a woman getting harassed by another man on the first date and her date not doing anything about it because, "You don't get a protector on the first date. You have to earn that".

I have no problem with conditional femininity as long as masculinity also gets to be conditional.

Also, the guy she wants might decide to date a woman that doesn't make him "earn" her femininity. IF he's a guy with options, he can go to someone else. If he has to earn your femininity, he should at least get to what he's getting beforehand.

AdEffective7894s · 2024-06-07T03:32:24+00:00

I don't really care about femininity

You can be a boss bitch if you want abd most of all behaviours will slide of my back.

But if you resent me for not being in your feminine, or for me not allowing you to be more feminine.... Well that's just retarded.

That being said it better if they manifest that rage earlier so that I don't have to waste time on that.

Metalloid_Space · 2024-06-06T23:13:29+00:00

Who even wants to earn a "submissive housewife"?

And I also don't understand why you'd have to be "aggressive"? Can't you be authentic and still be great at setting boundries?

Motor-Buy-6991 · 2024-06-06T23:08:23+00:00

Just become Chad then she will submit to you. Even let you put it in her bum.

Preme2 · 2024-06-06T23:17:33+00:00

With the world being a harsh place, many women are hanging to be more assertive and aggressive than we’d like to be.

Western women folks. Absolute delusion. The world is probably less harsh for you than it’s ever been. You’re a blue pill woman who asked for a job and we gave you one. Congratulations. Now the world is “harsh”. Pipe down. Not sure why the BB men gave so many women the privilege to speak anyway. Some, sure, but definitely not all.

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CradleCity · 2024-06-07T00:01:17+00:00

What do they need to do and how, in order to prove they're worthy?

(And I ask this as someone that will not enter into a relationship, my window closed years ago)

DietTyrone · 2024-06-07T10:01:15+00:00

The femininity is there, but you may have to unlock it.

How could you know it's there is you've not seen it? You might hope it's there but you can't know for sure. Maybe she's just a masculine woman and will remain a masculine woman.

addings0 · 2024-06-07T10:43:13+00:00

Unfortunately, that's not what women do ( or want ) . Huge lack or articulation. It's not good enough for her to be safe. She must do whatever she wants with that safety, even if he's providing it. Women don't want to be providers or build trust with a man, because they also find that to be ' oppressive ' . Him being a CHAD, doesn't make her more trustworthy or submissive. Far to many women want to pretend to be single, while dating. Or pretend to be dating, while married. Her femininity isn't for him at all, and her safety has nothing to do with her other desires. There's nothing about her to be unlocked, if she's aiming for indifference towards him.

obviousredflag · 2024-06-07T12:21:49+00:00

The femininity is there, but you may have to unlock it.

If i am met with "masculine bossbabe" vibe, i don't want to unlock anything, i want to get out of the date and into a date with a woman who doesn't need to put up an aggressive and assertive facade on a first date. It's fine if they put that up to be more successful in their line of work. It's not fine if they can't switch to date mode.

You can be on guard on a first date AND be feminine. Femininity doesn't make you vulnerable. Most of my dates have been perfect examples of femininity but cautious and gathering info about me to increasingly feel safe, to go home with me.

Divine feminine energy. You are watching too much tiktok. Nothing about your femininity is divine and you are not resting in any energy.

EARNING femininity is a weird wording, when all a man has to do is act normal and let himself be observed by the woman. Maybe turn around that whole concept and make it about women needing to overcome their fear of men by observing them long enough to be reasonably sure they can be vulnerable with them.

Also, maybe include that this fear and need to be on guard is VERY variable in women, just as the observable level of trustworthyness in men is very variable. I am a super trustworthy guy to observers. People (men and women) want to be vulnerable with me within minutes. My pics score 9.5+ on trustworthyness on photofeeler. I don't need to prove anything in the majority of cases. Within minutes, on any first date i have been, people felt safe, opened up and were open to go home with me. And on the other hand, i have had women that were SUPER guarded or not guarded at all, on the onset of our matching.

So, untrustworthy appearing guys need to be observed by very guarded and anxious women, so that they can form an opinion about them being safe to open up to or go home with. It has nothing to do with femininity.

Dense-Tell-6147 · 2024-06-07T13:25:33+00:00

Between a "submissive housewife" (ick) and a ludicrous "gUrLboSz!1!!" (ick²) there are better relational styles.

"Any man who must say, 'I am the king' is no true king." Same goes for "kweens".

A confident individual (regardless of the gender) will be able to assert their boundaries with calm and grace, without having to flex muscles or pound their chests.

And be able to role play with their partner without becoming submissive or defenseless.

Cat_Lover259 · 2024-06-07T13:38:25+00:00

I’m so glad I’m in a relationship already 🫠

shmupsy · 2024-06-07T18:20:47+00:00

Can you give an example of how just being your true self while dating would be dangerous?

(excluding showing like a silly etc side of yourself or whatever which we all hold back a little when dating because that stuff takes getting used to)

just_a_place · 2024-06-08T07:18:38+00:00

Nah.... if a woman is giving off mad masculine energy I ain't going near her. Fuck that shit. I ain't attracted to masculinity in any way, shape, or form.

And no, I can tell you from experience the femininity is definitely not there on masculine females. Women who act all fucking masculine usually do so because they're high strung, have trust issues, and more red flags than a communist parade.

Nobody is talking about submissive anything, If you don't comprehend that femininity does not require submissiveness then that right there is the problem.

No man wants to deal with a combative, sardonic, loud, and hostile woman who acts more like the enemy than a comrade.

TheUnsungSaint · 2024-06-10T01:47:37+00:00

If you think anyone needs to prove anything to you for you to simply be cordial you're fucking retarded honestly

fakingandnotmakingit · 2024-06-10T22:06:00+00:00

Why is it that your choices are boss babes and completely feminine women?

There is a vast middle ground of women who aren't aggressive and adversarial boss babes and also not demure or with divine feminine energy 🙄

Women who know what they want, but are willing to compromise within reason. Women who are affectionate and nurturing but expect that same affection and nurture back.

Women who have "masculine" and "feminine" traits. Women who don't believe in "masculine" and "feminine" as concepts. Women who are willing to let a man make a decision in somethings, but makes the decision in others.

EuphoricPangolin7615 · 2024-06-07T00:08:49+00:00

Some women are masculine because they have damaged femininity. And they think masculinity is superior. Most feminists are like this.

John_Oakman · 2024-06-07T01:16:45+00:00

The more desperate party put out more [whether it be effort, resources, whatever] earlier, and once the low value males (which aren't even seen as humans by most of the factions here) are excluded generally women are more desperate [in comparison to the based & redpilled real men of the manosphere].

Which is also why you see the more aggressive men with traditional feminine spouses while the more social justice oriented males tend to pair up more with less feminine spouses (or we can all pretend it's all just matters of preferences).

boom-wham-slam · 2024-06-07T01:32:38+00:00

I agree this is how it is. But for us men who are capable for bringing this out in women... boss babes with conditional femininity are bottom barrel. Because rare women are actually feminine and not boss babes first and thus at least I always pick that first.

It's a stupid game because women permanently ruin themselves by being a boss babe at all.

Sure-Vermicelli4369 · 2024-06-06T23:58:28+00:00

I'm good but I appreciate the transparency

ExcelsiorState718 · 2024-06-17T04:20:10+00:00

Them she can divorce you..while cheating on you with a dude out on parole.

Title	On why "Conditional Femininity" makes sense
Author	Windmill_flowers
Upvotes	0
Comments	146
Date	June 6, 2024 11:04 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1d9vvp0/on_why_conditional_femininity_makes_sense/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/on-why-conditional-femininity-makes-sense.1520794 https://theredarchive.com/post/1520794

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