I don’t think I want to call myself a feminist anymore

sugacvbes_ · 2024-08-22T05:51:38+00:00

Just got banned from the offmychest subreddit for posting here :/

Adeus_Ayrton · 2024-08-22T07:18:03+00:00

I feel for radfems. They just hate themselves and don't know it.

Trying to drag men down to their level of lower sense of self worth has, and never will solve their problems.

Waste_Translator_335 · 2024-08-22T06:43:47+00:00

Im so grateful. Thank you for letting us know you care.

Current_Finding_4066 · 2024-08-22T09:33:37+00:00

"And I can’t say any of this to others because I’ll get labelled as a “pick-me”"

This tell you all you need to know. They are beyond saving. They lack any self insight and normal level of self critique.

monkeyninja6969 · 2024-08-22T07:16:50+00:00

If the patriarchy were real, women would not be allowed to bitch about it.

SidewaysGiraffe · 2024-08-22T07:05:46+00:00

Well, I'm glad to hear you're pausing to take a mental step back and reassess; that's always good to do from time to time.

First, the bad news: Feminism hasn't strayed from its roots. There's nothing in the movement today that wasn't there at Seneca Falls; it was just subtler and better hidden back then- and they had many far more legitimate complaints.

Secondly, the Patriarchy doesn't hurt men, and for the same reason the Loch Ness Monster doesn't: it's not real. Women have never, with a few questionable edge cases in the great mass of human history, been oppressed (as a class); they have been protected. Now, to be protected is to be restricted, which is why you rarely see people breakdancing in plate armor, and you probably feel that some of those restrictions (and consequently, those protections) were, or at least are, excessive. That's certainly fair. But to claim that society was set up for the benefit of men is simply dishonest. Where else in history do you see an oppressed class that as a matter of routine not only outlives its oppressors, but is granted legal and social rights that the oppressors aren't?

Here in the US (I don't know enough to comment on other countries, but I believe the overall situation is similar throughout the West), women are, in some jurisdictions, denied the right to public toplessness. Many say that's unfair, and I would agree. But to pretend it's equal in value in to bodily integrity rights, anti-discrimination rights, and anti-battle slavery rights is ludicrous. To claim it EXCEEDS them is baldfaced propaganda.

So why the insistence that women are oppressed? Why the vehemence- which you yourself have noted- that makes even QUESTIONING the dogma such an offense? Simple- it can't hold up to basic logical scrutiny. That's why a constant attack is necessary; to keep the rank-and-file from thinking about it.

If a man finds himself in a difficult situation, his first thoughts will probably be about how to get out of said situation, just as a woman's would. If that proves impossible, the thoughts of both will turn to changing the situation, but if that's the kind of truly daunting prospect that the individual doesn't have the power to do, the man (typically) will seek to increase his power; the woman might do the same, but is far more likely to simply wallow in misery.

This is partly due to instinctive risk aversion, but mostly due to risk assessment and acculturation (which in turn is built, in no small part, off those same instincts); we ARE animals, but we're- men and women alike- thinking animals. Yet we teach our sons to solve problems and our daughters to not bother trying; too many Cinderellas and not enough Antigones.

Funnily enough, this is something the Feminist movement, by and large, agrees with me on- or at least pays lip service to. What happens when someone tries teaching women personal power and equal moral accountability? Ask Erin Pizzey, who opened up the first abused women's shelter, to great praise from Feminists (understandably)- and then pointed out that these women often have psychosocial problems of their own, and likely need mental help to repair themselves to the point where they could reintegrate into society successfully. That caused many angry grumbles. Then Erin began making plans to open up an abused Men's shelter, and that got death threats. She eventually had to flee the country. She eventually came back, because she's a badass, but they still won't let her back into the organization she founded.

This is a roundabout way of showing that Feminism isn't about making women stronger, but about making them weaker, and then convincing them that they're constantly under attack, so they turn to the one group that says it's looking out for them.

As you yourself noted, it's a cult- but a very deliberate, methodical one.

Chemical-Airline-248 · 2024-08-22T06:03:04+00:00

once i said to a ultra feminist '4*4= 16', she replied ' no, it's not how u should see it. u should try to understand what the connnection means to each other & not see things objectively like this. u are deriving conclusions just from build up notions, u should rather try therapy' & am like what these are facts & u can't argue facts. them just need to know if a person is biologically male to fight with them. but they are doing more harm to their own movement than doing good.

1o11ip0p · 2024-08-22T08:30:07+00:00

this is a very reasonable take and its kinda crazy that its considered controversial in 2024 lol.

Reasonable-Wealth647 · 2024-08-22T06:27:12+00:00

Feminism has been cancerous since 1848.

phoenician_anarchist · 2024-08-22T06:05:40+00:00

Welcome.

Don't let the small number of people who will inevitably be somewhat hostile or aggressive to discourage you, they're mostly just angry at Feminism ( and be prepared to learn more about Feminism here than you ever knew, 🤣 )

Something to note; This isn't just some "anti-Feminist" space, the only reason that Feminism is ever mentioned here is because they constantly attack the rights of men. It's more of an "anti-anti-men's rights" position.

_name_of_the_user_ · 2024-08-22T10:48:02+00:00

The problems with feminism start all the way back in the very beginning. As you mentioned, men and women weren't treated equally. This I totally agree with. Also, women were treated badly, which I also totally agree with. The issue is that feminists did not and still do not agree that men were also treated badly, but they certainly were. A few examples to help paint the picture.

Women needed to jump through some hoops to leave a marriage, but when they did they left it free and clear. Men could not do the same, they were indentured to pay alimony for the rest of their life regardless of what that did to him. Sure, men had less hoops to jump through, that was because he wasn't actually leaving her completely and would still need to continue his responsibilities to her.

It was illegal for a husband to beat his wife. Yes, by any modern standard those laws allowed more violence than anyone now would agree with, but there were limits. There were no limits to how much abuse a wife could infect in her husband.

It was illegal for men to rape women unless they were married. Totally agree that law should have extended to wives as well. But it was legal for any woman to rape any man. And even today many places do not consider women forcing sex on men to be rape.

There's many more, but the point is feminists have always treated men's lives as the default of what they strived for, ignoring any and all issues men dealt with and ignoring any and all advantages women had. By doing this they denied men the opportunity to improve their situations with women, and instead made things a tit for tat battle. A battle women have incredibly more power to win.

Saying "patriarchy also hurts men" is paying lip service at best, and victim blaming at worst. There is no patriarchy; our societal system does not support and prioritize men over women. If anything it prioritizes women's survival over men's survival. But much more to the point, it prioritizes the rich over the poor.

Women's expectations, roles, and treatment meant it is harder for women to move from one class to another. This was designed as a way to protect women from mistakes by giving them as much of a safety net as possible. The problem is the net makes it harder for women to succeed as the net holds them back as much as it supports them. Men don't have the benefit or the restrictions of that net. Yes, that means a handful of men will be able to reach outrageous levels of success. But it also means vastly more men will be able to reach outrageous levels of failure. This is why the vast majority of work places, suicide deaths, homelessness, addictions, etc. etc. are all men.

Feminims hasn't become slander against men, it's always been that. Look no further than the Declaration of Sentiments from 1848 for evidence of that. Even before the term "feminist" was coined the women's rights movement was already slandering men as defective humans and psychopaths.

"The history of mankind is a history of repeated injuries and usurpation on the part of man toward woman, having in direct object the establishment of an absolute tyranny over her."

I'm glad you're seeing feminism for what it really is. Please, continue to examine it critically. I'm just saying what you're seeing isn't new.

Welcome to our corner of reddit.

iPhoneUser69420 · 2024-08-22T07:15:00+00:00

We don’t hate women. We just don’t like the misandry and the discrimination. Sometimes that gets misdirected as misogyny, but if most folks here think about it, they probably wouldn’t hold firm on hating women as a whole.

rabel111 · 2024-08-22T06:45:19+00:00

Back then it was 'womens liberation'

Feninism just hijacked that movement, and its good will.

Feminism has always been a deeply political marxist movement based on dividing our community by sex, use the vectors of oppression and hared.

RevelationSr · 2024-08-22T06:48:04+00:00

4th wave feminism is destroying Western civilization.

KetamineSNORTER1 · 2024-08-22T06:25:23+00:00

Feminism was always rotten

Current_Finding_4066 · 2024-08-22T09:31:02+00:00

Replace "patriarchy" with class conflict and you will get what it actually hurting most men and women.

Calling it patriarchy is moronic, because it actually hides the real issue, and replaces it with some nebulous gendered issue.

C20H25N3O-C21H30O2 · 2024-08-22T07:08:17+00:00

Welcome! I'm not sure why you think you'd be hated here. Is it because you are a woman or because you used to believe the modern feminist propaganda? We don't hate you for being a woman. You're a human being like all of us. We don't hate you for being a feminist in the past.

We don't hate you at all. You've started to see the misandrist brainwashing, hypocrisy, double standards and oppressive discrimination we are trying to highlight. The way I see it, you're one of us. You've become red-pilled. You see the world the way it actually is, not what the powers want you to see.

It is not the "patriarchy" that has caused the current gender war or oppression in the past. It's always been the ultra rich and powerful against the poor (working class). The rich must deflect the blame for the plight of the poor, otherwise they'd be wiped out, as it happened time and time again throughout history. That's what this current situation is all about.

revonssvp · 2024-08-22T11:51:24+00:00

Thank you.

I think in militant movements extremists always take power.

And now there is no culture to respond to it and keep it in check.

What is sad for everyone is that men are going to become more angry and extremists as a response.

BelCantoTenor · 2024-08-22T15:00:30+00:00

Welcome 🙏. Men want to be loved and respected and treated with equality. Watch the documentary “The Red Pill”. It will truly enlighten you. Hopefully you will come to understand that “the patriarchy” is a glass tiger that was invented by feminism to vilify men. Who never intended to be in charge of everything. They just assumed the role, because women assumed all of the other roles natural to their gender. Men aren’t somehow working together to push women down. This invisible War only divides all of us. And that destroys the future for all of us. It serves no one.

plainoldusernamehere · 2024-08-22T16:06:38+00:00

You should probably read up on the history of feminism. I don’t think your understanding of the original goals of feminism are what you think they are. Rachel Wilson has written about the history of it.

Take the ban as a badge of honor though. You know you’re on to something when the average mindless people get uncomfortable and ban your thoughts from their fictitious world they live in.

WhenYoung333 · 2024-08-22T06:00:02+00:00

Back in the days all you cpuld stay in home doing nothing except of housework and taking care of the kids. Literally nothing more !

( There is a reason why prostitutes are knows as " working girls ". Cause they actually were one of the few working )

With half of the population being women and all of them and nearly not working the " powers that be " could not tax them.

So they inveted feminism ! It was a finacial scam to tax you ! Nothing more.

: - )

no_ur_cool · 2024-08-22T12:28:19+00:00

Preach! As a former male feminist I couldn't agree with your points more.

omega_dawg93 · 2024-08-22T15:03:26+00:00

i’ll support feminists when i see 2 things:

feminists protesting at court houses DEMANDING that women receive equal sentencing for the same crimes. eg teachers having sex with underage students.
feminists DEMANDING that their daughters be forced, by law, to sign up for selective service to be drafted into war.

until then, they need to THANK A MAN for delivering the x chromosome that made them women.

and to all the straight male feminists out there… “she’s not gonna fuck you bro… esp while you’re wearing a vagina hat.”

Wickedjr89 · 2024-08-22T19:21:16+00:00

I'm a trans man and I can't even begin to explain my feelings. I'm 35. I'm a year and a half on T and 6+ months post top surgery. I pass generally. So I know what it's like to grow up as a girl/woman into my 30s and now i'm suddenly seen as a man. I've struggled with dysphoria and now i'm happy with my body and who I am - but now some people see me as the enemy, the same people who loved me when I was a sapphic woman. But now i'm a straight [trans] man... Still part of the lgbt community. I used to be seen as a demon by family members for being lgbt... now I seem to be seen as a demon by others in the lgbt community for being the wrong shade of lgbt... a simple trans man.

I'm sorry if i'm going off on a tangent. It's just a very interesting... to put it one way, and frustrating, place to be in right now as a trans man in this society.

The original feminism sounds great. I can see, from literally experiencing life as a woman and as a man, there is sexism in both directions. I've also learned that a lot of differences in men and women, come down to hormones, and a lot of people don't want to hear that. But i've experienced both... and it's not just me. I'm not the only trans man or woman that's experienced both.

I completely agree with everything you've said. Just adding my own experience.

IceCorrect · 2024-08-22T07:39:16+00:00

Feminism done it to themselves. You never kicked out those "radfem" and if you don't kick them out, you agree with them. If they are such a minority you could do it, yet you don't, so majority of them agree with them and you can see this by up votes.

SupaJenkins · 2024-08-22T11:12:34+00:00

If it's any merit, a term I've been trying to fight for the legitimacy of is 'Equalist'... A: it sounds more generalized- fighting for EQUAL rights, and all- and B: it allows for people like us to fight against the aggression pointed towards men on a daily basis.

Former_Range_1730 · 2024-08-22T12:07:36+00:00

" I feel like feminism has strayed way too far from its roots. "

The thing is, Feminism has always been anti patriarchy, which = anti men.

If you're a woman who likes men, wants to have sex with men, marriage and children with men, any of these, you have the massive conflict having to either choose being a Feminist, or choose being with a man, but you can't have both.

This is especially a problem is you're a straight woman, (not sure what your sexuality is) which also makes Feminists, anti-straight women. Yes, Feminists are indeed anti straight women, and only accept you if you agree that men are no good, join things like 4B, be a political lesbian, etc.

So ofcourse, "I can’t say any of this to others because I’ll get labelled as a “pick-me”

Exactly.

"For ages I’ve tried to keep up with feminist ideologies but it’s gone way too far"

You say that, but then you say,

"I believe that the patriarchy harms both men and women."

You can't feel that Feminists have gone too far, while also being against Patriarchy. Being against Patriarchy means there is no "too far", as the goal of feminists to get rid of Patriarchy. So it appears you are having conflicting thoughts.

JackasaurusYTG · 2024-08-22T12:33:34+00:00

Kill all men? How would that work? The species dies. I don't think these people have thought that chant through you know!

griii2 · 2024-08-22T16:28:19+00:00

I just hate what modern feminism has come to

Pardon me, but what makes you think the earlier feminism was about? I wish I could sort https://np.reddit.com/r/ToxicFeminismIsToxic/ by year.

VanillaCandid3466 · 2024-08-22T10:34:42+00:00

As far as I'm concerned, you are extraordinarily welcome here. Hello! :)

Women are fantastic creatures (normal human caveats apply obviously) but I've honestly just given up even reading any of the feminism subs. Gaslighting themselves into oblivion as far as I can tell and censoring *anything* they don't like, true or not.

If you haven't heard of her, I'd suggest getting your head into some Camilla Paglia stuff. And getting the low down on the real history of Feminism. It's a hell of a wake-up call.

LettuceBeGrateful · 2024-08-22T15:37:55+00:00

I feel the same. I (and a lot of the guys here) used to identify as feminists, but when we spoke up about our issues, we were mocked and dismissed. It's a movement that's increasing hostile towards men.

It's frustrating because I'm pro-choice and of course I support equal rights for everyone, I just can't get behind a movement that actively works against equality for men. It's so frustrating.

Radioheader128 · 2024-08-22T07:34:27+00:00

I agree with this. Gender wars are dumb. Everyone is a human no matter what gender.

CharmingSama · 2024-08-22T09:03:09+00:00

my advice is to expand your world view... take a look at authors that feminism criticizes and does its best to cancel their voice. sure there are some that are due cancellation, how ever, there are many that aren't. and get a different perspective, especially from other women who dont support feminism.

Historical_Plate_318 · 2024-08-22T10:15:05+00:00

I greatly support equal rights between men and women and I hate modern feminism with my whole heart.

ComplexAd7729 · 2024-08-22T12:01:29+00:00

I swear it’s so normalized. Like stupid dog whistles include questions like man vs bear argument. It’s just a dog whistle to be sexist on. And stuff like I hate men don’t get banned yet I hate women does.

Forsaken_Hat_7010 · 2024-08-22T13:16:48+00:00

I think most of us here also started out as feminists, as it is common to be educated by being told that it is gender equality and women's rights, which is reasonable for almost everyone.

If one looks at the facts instead of propaganda it is easy to see that it often works badly or the other way around, but it is not so easy to oppose the hegemonic ideology at the risk of being ostracized. So, congratulations on prioritizing your values, and welcome!

You may want to see r/Egalitarianism or r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates

Captaincorect · 2024-08-22T18:52:41+00:00

it's all definition games, feminist can mean so many things, but now it's one of those things they play like it all about "equal rights" but more about "hating men and boosting women"

Tofuprincess89 · 2024-08-22T19:47:58+00:00

Same thoughts sis. Same. Other women these days just want to believe “all men” are bad. Smh

Nobleone11 · 2024-08-23T03:16:57+00:00

While I don't agree that even feminism in its infancy was about equal rights and "Patriarchy hurts men, too." (How do you explain girls hurting/bullying boys in school without repercussions, hiding behind "Girl Power"? How about media promoting the same message that in order to empower you've got to disempower the opposite sex?), your personal journey reminds me of Cassie Jaye.

She's a documentary maker and former feminist. Years ago, she'd been reading smear articles online about the Men's Rights Movement and decided to shine a spotlight on them in order to discern whether the accusations of misogyny, for example, were true.

She interviewed some of the foremost advocates at the time, including Warren Farrell, whom you could say was THE pioneer that kickstarted it.

Going into the project, she admitted carrying personal biases against the Movement shaped by the articles she'd read and people in her feminist circles.

These hands-on experiences, however, opened her eyes and, overtime, she'd learned that both media and femnism were sorely mistaken about its intentions.

Furthermore, she'd garnered detailed information on the issues men continue to face.

When it was all over, Cassie renounced the feminist label in favor of a more egalitarian approach to gender issues.

Unfortunately, as a result, her character and project were smeared non-stop by the feminist movement as they'd hoped her intention was to attack the Men's Rights Movement instead of sympathize with them. In Australia, feminists picketed a movie theatre in hopes of having it removed.

The documentary is called The Red Pill and I highly recommend it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7MkSpJk5tM

In short, you'll relate to the transformative journey she undertook during, and post, production.

Mechamiclas · 2024-08-23T14:44:23+00:00

" Modern Feminism is bad. " Feminism was always bad, did you know that 1st wave feminists committed fire bombings & poisoned people's dogs? I'm not joking. Feminism is a misandrist(man hating) movement that should be thrown into the dust bin of history and replaced with egalitarian efforts for true equality.

Of course a straight white man like me saying anything remotely bad about feminism in public would get me yelled at, I have certainly been loudly disagreed with by feminists during my college days.

000CuriousBunny000 · 2024-08-22T12:19:55+00:00

Women forget that it was men who gave them their rights If men only wanted patriarchy then women would have it worse by now

as_ewe_wish · 2024-08-22T11:10:45+00:00

Something a lot of feminists seem to miss...

Women and men live their lives around each other.

Harmed people are more likely to harm other people.

If you're not engaged in preventing harm to men you're not fully engaged in preventing harm to women.

Fearless_Ad4244 · 2024-08-22T14:09:47+00:00

Can you define patriarchy and can you give actual data that it exists or that it even existed?

Drachus_Maximus · 2024-08-22T09:29:04+00:00

Reddit in general well known as a leftist liberal social site. God bless for some subreddit who maintain common sense like this one most of the time.you want reason behind feminism? Learn about WEF. Family as a unit is a threat to the globalist agenda. That is the reason they create different ideas to destroy society as unity which has the very basic foundation called family.

Lets_Remain_Logical · 2024-08-22T10:27:21+00:00

Thank You! I Know That The Hardest is turning against feminists. one would feel isolated and vulnerable. But... it's may be time to leave ideologies and religions behind, and focus on the important : may be it's not m vs f but moderate vs extremists? Because i Know Very Bad GUWS, and I kno extremely bad women! But... In an era of "believe all women", I got abused, slandered, destroyed, rejected from a huge group... Then labeled crazy and abusivefun fact: almost nobody came to hear my version of the story.i am left to die alone on my depression. Yeah... Believe all women

anothermanwithaplan · 2024-08-22T12:15:18+00:00

The journey you’ve been through to make it here is not completed by enough people unfortunately.

You are entirely right in what you’ve seen and realised for yourself.

Feminism has changed from being a voice for improvement to a crusade against men, and this is not being addressed, somehow it’s being applauded. Most young women with a minor inconvenience or unpleasant experience are falling for brainwashing, the easy way out, the ‘nothing is my fault’ option, the ‘men are to blame for everything we don’t like’ escape.

Hopefully more and more women, like you have done, will see that the path forward is unity, not aggression.

When I first posted here I was similarly auto-banned from a couple other subs, and it just made me realise exactly what we’re dealing with.

You are welcome here and I hope to see many more women such as yourself head on over.

PeonSupremeReturns · 2024-08-22T15:53:01+00:00

Abandon everything feminism has taught you. That’s the only way you’ll ever learn what men’s lives are really like.

Fearless_Ad4244 · 2024-08-22T16:03:16+00:00

Some issues that boys and men face in society and in law:

https://hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2012-10-16/debates/12101636000001/Sentencing(FemaleOffenders

Starr, Sonja B. (2012). Estimating Gender Disparities in Federal Criminal Cases. Law and Economics Research Paper Series, Paper No. 12-018, August 2012. 41 pages.

Andersson, Neil, and Ari Ho-Foster. (2008). 13,915 reasons for equity in sexual offenses legislation: A national school-based survey in South Africa. International Journal for Health, 7(20): 6 pages.

Awad, Edmond, Sohan Dsouza, Richard Kim, Jonathan Schulz, Joseph Henrich, Azim Shariff, Jean-François Bonnefon, and Iyad Rahwan. (2018). The Moral Machine experiment. Nature, 563: 59-64.

Bindler, Anna, and Randi Hjalmarssonm. (2019). The Persistence of the Criminal Justice Gender Gap: Evidence from 200 Years of Judicial Decisions Working Paper in Economics No. 780, 58 pages.

Economy, social policies:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0049089X21001216

https://eige.europa.eu/sites/default/files/documents/MH0415087ENN_Web.pdf7

Pensions in Russia:

https://www.issa.int/news/gender-gap-beyond-retirement-how-men-and-women-compare-relation-pension-benefits

Education:

https://doi.org/10.1016/j.econedurev.2020.101981 http://dx.doi.org/10.1787/9789264229945-en https://doi.org/10.2139/ssrn.3348981 https://doi.org/10.1016/j.jpubeco.2008.02.009 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0742051X22000993 https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/09645292.2021.2004999 https://doi.org/10.31234/osf.io/yq24b https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1307856/Boys-held-women-teachers-gender-stereotypes-reinforced-classroom.html https://www.pnas.org/content/112/17/5360 https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=13620&fbclid=IwAR1zxexkrfKy5VeGcW0IC-hUy6mgUMQS4F8di_Eyk3ZDt2jhMVgtTcX6WcA https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/11/05/real-reasons-girls-outperforming-boys-school/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/thinking-man/11668169/Why-arent-we-doing-more-to-encourage-men-to-be-primary-school-teachers.html https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/09645292.2023.2252620 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0191491X17302584

ratatosk212 · 2024-08-22T16:27:58+00:00

Always remember that just because you left feminism doesn't mean you've abandoned equal rights for women. They moved away from that a long time ago and they keep moving the goalposts on what "feminism" even means.

PROFESSA954 · 2024-08-22T16:31:38+00:00

Things have gotten too polarized hence many on both sides have taken the "You're either with Us or against Us" stance. Both genders get their fair share of difficulties in different areas of life and I just want everyone to get along. We don't have to agree on everything but life is tough enough without these unproductive shouting matches.

HansDevX · 2024-08-22T17:55:32+00:00

Feminism has destroyed women. Now they have to go to work, join the military, open up only fans because all of that is empowering.

new-fayzr · 2024-08-22T18:03:50+00:00

We appreciate your insight and accountability.

BCRE8TVE · 2024-08-22T18:40:32+00:00

Instead of a feminist you can call yourself an egalitarian, and that you agree with say 70% of what feminism advocates for but the other 30% or however is going too far.

Sorry to hear you've been banned, but welcome to the club. If you advocate for men you're on the same level as woman hating misogynistic neck bearded incels according to society. It sucks, but be prepared to endure treatment as though you were advocating for pedophiles.

I am curious to know, what was it like to start seeing those things happening, and to start getting away from the mainstream feminism? Was it a single thing that sparked the chance, or just that you noticed a bunch of small things building up?

BreakinLiberty · 2024-08-22T19:07:39+00:00

Anything will hurt both men and women. Patriarchy bad? Ok then what's the alternative? Matriarchy? Ok so that means women work the hard labor jobs and fight wars while men stay at home right? No. Women want so delusional fantasy that doesn't exist?

True equality? They don't want equality because when the check comes they claim to be ladies but in any other case they say " i can do what men can do"

makeumadd · 2024-08-22T19:25:40+00:00

Love, feminism has always been horrible it just had you all fooled that it was for a positive purpose. It has always been a misandrist cesspool of hate and ignorance to the point plenty of feminists left and either became anti feminist or men's rights activists themselves. Yes they accomplished some much needed goals but as a whole feminism has always been the issue.

devolution3 · 2024-08-22T21:08:49+00:00

Welcome, you're not alone. A lot of people feel the same way, there are many ex-feminists in this sub.

Starman164 · 2024-08-22T21:43:12+00:00

I can relate. I was in a similar boat back when I was like 14 or so, and seeing all the misandrist venom spewing from the Feminists at the time (some things never change lmao).

For a while I considered myself an Egalitarian and a staunch Anti-Feminist, but recently I ended up realizing that while Feminism has a lot of man-hating, female-supremacist bullshit going on, there are still a lot of causes they champion that I think are worth fighting for.

These days, I take a sort of cafeteria approach to it, supporting the aspects of Feminism/MRAism I like, while disavowing the rest. I consider myself an MRA, an Egalitarian, and a Feminist, though I'd bet the average Feminist would disagree with the latter cause I don't perfectly toe their line or buy into all of their philosophy (I've always had issues with the notion of "the patriarchy" as applied to the modern US).

What really sucks imo is calling yourself an MRA/Feminist and immediately getting lumped in with all of the toxic members of the movement. I sure love blind tribalism!

ApprehensiveMail8 · 2024-08-22T22:19:40+00:00

Thank you for your support.

liferelationshi · 2024-08-23T05:50:11+00:00

I got banned from the r/dating subreddit for posting in here. Other subreddits too but can’t remember now.

2024-08-23T07:50:33+00:00

feminism was never for equality, it was never equalitarianism.

White_Buffalos · 2024-08-23T07:56:42+00:00

Glad you see the issues, OP. I appreciate your self awareness.

Qantourisc · 2024-08-23T12:14:14+00:00

Good, here is your new and better label : egalitarian

What feminism should have always been. But feminism is sexists by it's very definition: because it's only about woman's rights.

Vlasic69 · 2024-08-23T21:12:21+00:00

The history books will look fucking retarded when people realize capitalism causes sexism.

Rozzie333 · 2024-08-25T06:52:03+00:00

I got banned from /mentalheatlh a few months ago for writing this-

"I have a lot of questions about it. Can someone answer these questions for me? Why has there been a 4000% increase in teen girls becoming trans boys in the last couple of years? If that's the case, why aren't we seeing a lot of adult women becoming trans? Why are doctors prescribing kids puberty blockers or hormones after one visit? Why do I see YT comments from feminine boys or young tomboys saying people tell them they're trans or should become trans? Why is it more acceptable for gays teens and lesbians to become trans than admit to being a homosexual? Why are they allowing kids/teens to change their sex at school without informing their parents? Kids aren't allowed to be left alone and do a lot of things, but they're allowed to take hormone blockers? Why are they allowing teen trans males to remove their breasts when they can't vote, drink, or smoke yet? How many people know about autogynephilia, and it's a fetish, not a trans issue? Why is there a manifesto for Incels to become trans women because it will be "easier" for them in life? Why are there whistleblowers coming out and talking about what's happening in trans clinics? Have people read WPATH files or the Cass Report?

I believe there are legit trans people, but it's a very small number. I think a lot of these people are confused, are being indoctrinated, are ashamed to be homosexual, have people tell feminine boys and tomboy girls they're trans, men having a fetish, and/or social contagion.

I care about young people being hurt and having their childhoods ruined because they thought they were trans. I care about non-binary people having no self-worth, and their gender is what is making them "unique" or "special." Some people call themselves "it." How sad. Everyone is unique in their own way and we don't need to base it on our gender.

I have chronic depersonalization, and when I look in the mirror, it isn't me. I can't look at pics of myself because that isn't me. I don't feel like I'm real. I don't really feel like anyone, but I know I'm a female. I get what people mean when they say they aren't female or male.

Ten years ago, you'd rarely see or hear about a trans person, but now high school friends are turning trans together. Legit trans people's lives don't revolve around their gender. They don't scream at someone if the person mislabels them. They quietly want to live their lives. I look very much like a female, and I've been called "sir" because the person isn't paying attention. I don't care. I laugh about it. I worry about the impact it's having on legit trans people and homosexuals and how this is destroying what they worked so hard for.

If you're an adult and have been wanting to transition for years, do it. But I don't believe children should be taking meds to transition. I also think people who have rapid onset gender dysphoria shouldn't be suddenly getting on meds either. They should be required to go to therapy and figure out want made them suddenly become gender dysphoria.

Some people might not like my opinions and thoughts, but this is what I believe."

🙄No more freedom of speech! God-forbid anyone has his or her own opinion! Shoot, most of it was questions! Maybe I'll be banned from this page, too!

Well, dang, I just got permanently banned from /offmychest! I've never commented on or joined their page.

Amichat · 2024-08-22T07:30:57+00:00

I understand where you're coming from. I'm a woman and me too sometimes I don't recognize myself with the current feminism movement.

I still want to be a feminist though, because I'm a woman and sympathize with women worldwide who face hardships. But I'm a humanist as well and wish both men and women to see their lives improving.

I'm less interested in western feminism because we already achieved so much. I live in Europe and don't feel like society is perceiving me less than a man or that I have less rights or opportunities than the average Joe.

But when I read about women in some countries I'm still infuriated and that makes me want to speak for them, not forget them. And let's be honest, when I see men staring at me on the street or hear about again another rape case I also feel like there's room for improvement even in western countries.

And sincerely, I don't have to agree with everything that is being shared by other feminists or the overall feminism movement and I'm good with that.

levelate · 2024-08-22T09:31:31+00:00

what happened?

it's not like feminism has recently been like this, it has been like this for 15-20 years.

now that the tide is turning you suddenly realized that it is hateful. you saw what was going on, and you were silent for 15-20 years.

so, to me, your post comes off as insincere.

i'm guessing we will see more stuff like this in years to come, but, for me, it is far too little, far too late

StandOutLikeDogBalls · 2024-08-22T09:53:09+00:00

I used to consider myself a feminist until it got more and more militant. Now, I consider myself an advocate for women’s equality.

Proper_Frosting_6693 · 2024-08-22T11:53:14+00:00

First wave feminism: seeking equality, not getting cat called, protection etc…all noble goals

Modern feminism: Toxic misandrist supremacist movement that seeks the subjugation of men.

Pwdell_ · 2024-08-22T07:17:17+00:00

I can say I agree with you. Although I did not live in those times, I believe feminism was needed and generally a good thing back then. Now it seems to me that radical feminists use the oppression which their grand-grand-mothers had to suffer to put blame on modern men. They also use their movement as an excuse or sometimes “as a weapon” to get out of situations they don't like. Thats my thought

Welcome to the subreddit, thanks for sharing your opinions here

ShanSolo89 · 2024-08-22T12:03:06+00:00

It’s no longer feminism but feminazism. Glad you realized it.

Twisted_lurker · 2024-08-22T12:34:26+00:00

Thank you. I generally agree, but hope you help take back or redefine what feminism should be.

Front-Hovercraft-721 · 2024-08-22T23:48:32+00:00

Nice to see some common sense, honesty and accountability. That’s very honourable. I see men everywhere saying they’re done with women, don’t trust them, been screwed over by them, hurt by them and many, like me, have been subjected to violence by them. Most men don’t believe in chivalry anymore, that it was never appreciated anyway. Men are voluntarily choosing celibacy in record numbers today. Guys I work with won’t talk to them or help them and never remain in a room alone with them, ever. It’s a sad state and feminism is the common denominator. I’m an old school boomer who loves women, have & will stand up for their safety and their rights all day but it gets pretty hard to do so with all the misandrous gender bias man-hate out there. I see where young men are coming from. It just isn’t worth the effort anymore in their eyes.

Gemwriter2 · 2024-08-22T08:10:34+00:00

Leftwingmaleasvocates is a sub for leftists who are not feminists.

Jgreatest · 2024-08-23T00:06:52+00:00

Feminism and red pill are 2 sides of the same coin these days. It doesn't leave room for proper discourse. Feminism has become a way to try to assert superiority over men. it's less about equality anymore because, basically, we have reached that point. I had a conversation with a woman a couple of years ago. She was smart, educated, and well-spoken. She said she felt as if Feminism lied to her. She wasted so much time chasing her education and financial goals that she missed out on and chased away the only man she ever loved. She wanted family, and at 27, which was still young, ansd she didn't see it happening. And she has, by her own admission, put herself behind. She was of the mindset that she didn't need a man before. Feminism should be about the right to choose for a woman. Not to bash the other side because someone hurt her or she chose a man who didn't give her what she wanted. We should all appreciate what the opposite sex has to offer. The world would be a much better place if we could just come together and play to our strengths. The internet has spread this toxicity all over the world. And people are so impressionable. Social media, dating apps, and short form video platforms, while they have given us a voice, have simultaneously ruined a proper society.

Joker_01884 · 2024-08-22T06:45:36+00:00

Patriarchy just boosted gynocentrism back then in Europe.

skinetchings · 2024-08-22T17:14:27+00:00

There’s 3 different types of feminism. Sadly the other types are drowned out by radical feminism. I actually took notes on this in a course I took last semester:

Feminist Theories: Socialist, Radical, Liberal, Power-Control

Feminist theorists come under the umbrella of conflict theories and focus on women’s experiences and issues that impact them in our society. They focus on the patriarchal system as a divisive factor in society that divides subordinate and dominant groups. They include:

Socialist Feminism - focus on women’s economic oppression and lower-status Socialist feminism considers sexism and gender-inequality to be part of a capitalist society. This has been examined to determine why men and women commit different crimes. It also looks at how gender and class impact criminal opportunities, victimization, and criminal justice processes.

Radical Feminism - oppression is the result of role in the family Radical feminism believes that the oppression of women is a basic example of domination of one group over another. Reproduction dictates the sex-class system in this country. Women are kept in subservient positions through marriage and motherhood. The focus is more on women as victims than offenders in terms of the way that courts fail to protect them from male violence.

Liberal Feminism - people are created equal and should be treated that way Barriers should be removed that keep women from being as successful as men in the workplace. Legal change is needed to abolish gender-discrimination laws and enact laws that prohibit gender discrimination.

Power-Control Theory - uses gender differences to explain the onset of criminality John Hagen sought to identify the family and social relations that frequently resulted in delinquency. In paternalistic families where the father is the bread-winner, boys exhibit more criminality. In egalitarian families, daughters have more freedom and delinquency among sons and daughters are more equal. This also applies to lower-class families where this distinction is more prevalent.

wordjedi · 2024-08-22T17:45:27+00:00

If "feminism" meant women being allowed to become dentists and engineers and CEOs them I'm a feminist.

Nowadays that's what they all say they are:

"Feminism is the simple principle that women should be equal to men"

It's something like that, but it's used as a cover for all kinds of misandrist bigotry and discrimination in hiring, draft registration, circumcision, reproductive freedom, family court, unequal sentencing for the same crimes, etc.

PriorityAsleep2193 · 2024-08-22T21:09:03+00:00

This post is clear evidence of how men will clamber over one another to talk to the girl.

That's why men are screwed.

New-bryt · 2024-08-23T00:15:24+00:00

When civil rights don’t need to be fought for supremacy will be fought for, we see in race and sex, and constructed groups

khanivorus_rex · 2024-08-23T01:35:06+00:00

to you what is the patriarchy ?

rockstarcrossing · 2024-08-23T12:40:54+00:00

I think the increased percentage of girls with daddy issues is why these women exist. They never had a good father figure and a lot of time it's the toxic mothers at fault. It also explains why many western women are endorsing the feminisation of men.

antifeminist3 · 2024-08-26T02:56:51+00:00

Feminism indicates women--trying to claiming that female means equality when the word feminism excludes males is a false equivalence.

Call yourself a humanist or equalist.

Wide-Aside-7610 · 2024-08-27T02:55:04+00:00

Men have no place on feminism

Eye_Qwit · 2024-08-22T15:01:03+00:00

You just said "patriarchy". I'm not sure you'll fit in here.

findmein · 2024-08-22T10:40:09+00:00

I stopped calling myself a feminist when TERFS like J K Rawling started spreading hate towards trans women. They proudly call themselves feminists and no other feminists object that. I supported equal rights and always will but the label of 'feminism' became too toxic.

000CuriousBunny000 · 2024-08-22T12:13:51+00:00

Queen

Capital-Options · 2024-08-22T17:55:33+00:00

As men, we have plenty of women in our lives: mothers, sisters, daughters, aunts, cousins, wives, girlfriends and so on. There is nothing more we want to see than them being happy, safe and treated well.

Thank you OP for being one of the good ones.

the_no_bro · 2024-08-23T04:35:46+00:00

Eventually you’ll discover patriarchy is the cornerstone for civilization and matriarchy is the bedrock of our civilization.

The reality is, men do all the dirty work and give women a safe and orderly place to exist.

Women take the safe place men create and turn it into the beautiful reality that exists within the confines of our homes and business.

Soggy_Move4322 · 2024-08-23T10:58:00+00:00

It’s ok to not identify with modern feminism. Modern feminism is not true feminism. Modern feminism supposes women’s rights should go above and beyond those of men. Real feminism is the belief that men and woman are socially equal. It sucks that so many people ruin the meaning of such a meaningful thing.

Diligent-Physics189 · 2024-08-22T17:54:13+00:00

Men and women are not equal and it's actually insane to treat both the same. We have different roles and different pressures that come with it. Our sexual dynamics are complicated and there are many layers to the game, with men often harming other men under the guise of protecting women ect when really its just about gaining a small advantage in the marketplace. I need feminism because I am envious of men with bigger dicks than me.

tyYdraniu · 2024-08-22T14:20:15+00:00

Whats the point in posting here?

erikmyxter · 2024-08-22T13:18:03+00:00

Feminism does include men

Bascome · 2024-08-22T11:45:26+00:00

First-wave feminism did include men.

adam-l · 2024-08-22T12:42:33+00:00

What took you so long?

Mat_WhateverSilva · 2024-08-22T17:58:40+00:00

Pick me.

mrkpxx · 2024-08-22T06:48:48+00:00

Men and women are treated differently because they are different. They have different interests and needs.

The patriarchy took this into account and tried to establish a custom that was valid for everyone. For most people, this time was much simpler and healthier.

Title	I don’t think I want to call myself a feminist anymore
Author	sugacvbes_
Upvotes	576
Comments	296
Date	August 22, 2024 5:47 AM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/1eybsrw/i_dont_think_i_want_to_call_myself_a_feminist/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/i-dont-think-i-want-to-call-myself-a-feminist.1527986 https://theredarchive.com/post/1527986

Comments