Question for women: Why do so many women have a hard time wrapping their minds around the simple concept that many men simply find high n count women unattractive?

hyperrreal · 2017-03-15T16:34:00+00:00

OP, your question is too leading. Please avoid titles like that in the future. Didn't remove because this thread is already huge.

brinkleybuzz · 2017-03-15T15:38:08+00:00

Women know that high N count is an indicator of low relationship value. That's why so many try to conceal their N count from men they like for relationships.

Social media makes it more difficult for women to cover up a promiscuous past, so the next best option is to shame men for caring about their past.

Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2017-03-15T14:00:12+00:00

Not one person has a problem with the idea that any particular men have a problem with dating high n count women

The problem is with the stupid rationalizations they offer for why. When you give reasons, especially ones that involve simple nonsense speculations about the interior lives of or actual experiences of women, it lends itself to being argued with.

You don't need reasons and justifications for why. Just say "ew, no high n count women for me ty"

DemonConsulting · 2017-03-15T13:23:38+00:00

Watch what they do, not what they say, no? From a logical point of view it makes sense and from a primal sort of intuition it also makes perfect sense. But then you look around and see that all those guys who talk about how they want a "nice girl" pay a million times more attention to stacy and date sluts and the more "high value"/attractive and high status the man is, the more this is true for him.

Sure sluts may not be ideal and men want an LTR who is less promiscuous. But just like women will put up with a douche if he is attractive enough in other ways, men will ignore every and all negative points of a woman, including her N-count as long as she's hot. Maybe that is where some confusion comes from, at least to me it seems hypocritical to criticise AF/BB strategy and sluts but then still get into relationships with them cause they gave your dick tingles. Then they are suddenly surprised that their slut gf cheated on them, resulting in the opinion "all girls are whores" just like man women end up thinking "all men are assholes"

As for the morally outraged, it is often a defensive reaction if they themselves have a high N-Count and feel attacked or outrage for those women if you were being particularly mean in the way you said it, instead of disagreeing with what you say. "Fucking sluts are disgusting - lemme go bang my plate" will conjure up more negative responses than "I personally don't want to sleep with someone who might have an Std" or "I am very monogamous and relationship-minded so I want someone with a similar mindset and similar experiences to mine"

rulenumber303 · 2017-03-15T14:43:50+00:00

Question for women: Why do so many women have a hard time wrapping their minds around the simple concept that many men simply find high n count women unattractive?

Because that "concept" is male hamstering. Men who believe in it are for the most denying their true nature.

Men are attracted to availability. They may at times hate themselves for being attracted to it, they may hate the highly available woman they lust after, they may realise that chasing after tarts is not in their own best interests. But they are still attracted.

If you introduced single men to twenty height/weight proportionate women in a room, but before the introduction someone tipped them off that the woman in the purple shirt is well known for fucking guys she finds attractive just after she's met them, like just grabbing the guy by the hand and leading him somewhere private and rucking up her skirt and dropping her knickers and having at it, guess which woman the guys will make a beeline to and pay the most attention to?

This is just the way it is. Party girls get all the male attention. They don't have to chase guys down and lassoo them, the guys seek the party girls out. The guys are attracted, bigtime.

Now obviously there are men who restrain their natural impulses. But that doesn't mean they aren't attracted.

Electra_Cute · 2017-03-15T13:04:44+00:00

I understand why the men who do not want high N-count women do not want them, but they have to keep giving reasons why and projecting their morality onto everyone.

They can simply say "I do not want 'sluts'" and stop it at that.

Those "sluts" they do not want, they probably do not want them either,

rooster1776 · 2017-03-15T13:28:31+00:00

Because it doesn't usually stop with "I don't want to date a high n-count woman". I think everyone could agree no one could give a shit about that. However, there's usually a tirade following about how she's broken or something stupid like that.

Littleknownfacts · 2017-03-15T13:00:34+00:00

LOL

oh please. Unattractive for a LTR, sure. Whatever metrics you want to use, go for it. But no man goes into a hookup with a hardon and a naked and ready bitch and asks her "so how many men have you been with?"

Men don't like women who ARE or ACT like the town bicycle. Don't give a man reason to ask questions.

VermiciousKnidzz · 2017-03-15T15:08:25+00:00

because its wrong to judge people for having sex like normal people. that's pretty different from saying "i like blonde hair" or whatever.

goatismycopilot · 2017-03-15T13:30:09+00:00

Actually where I struggle is not the concept of not wanting a high N partner, that concept does not piss me off at all. The confusion is that everybody seems to have a different version of what constitutes high N. High N men are not super appealing to me so I can understand.

honeypuppy · 2017-03-15T22:43:48+00:00

If you said "I have nothing against short guys and I know it's irrational, but I just can't feel sexually attracted to them", most people would be accepting of that.

If you instead said "I won't date a short guy, because they're disgusting and Science^TM shows they have Napoleon Complexes", you'd get roundly criticised and the "science" disputed.

PaperStreetVilla · 2017-03-15T18:47:21+00:00

Notice, girls with low N counts don't give a shit if you shame high N-counts.

shoup88 · 2017-03-15T14:18:58+00:00

I'm going to have to pull a u/LewisCross here and ask do you mean SEXUALLY attractive, or attractive for a relationship? Because if you mean the former, then I disagree based on personal observation. Men have sex with sluts all the time. That's kind of what makes them sluts.

[deleted] · 2017-03-15T20:15:34+00:00

Don't most women understand this tho?

I mean, they lie about it for a reason

fetchyminx · 2017-03-15T17:16:09+00:00

Men don't like sluts? this is new information to me.

[deleted] · 2017-03-15T17:50:09+00:00

K. Maybe you should realize that most women don't give a flying fuck about what you're into. You really think this shit matters?

Me2_0 · 2017-03-15T20:42:34+00:00

Women have a hard time wrapping their mind around insecure guys. "Like why does this guy give a shit??? Wheres all the real men who would fuck me regardless. "

mindplaybyneo · 2017-03-16T00:13:00+00:00

I think at the end of the day we all know High Counts and Chasing the amount of people we sleep with are shallow. People who had no bearing with our life, and reality is women are more promiscuous than men. I just know too many woman who would travel outside the country and more willing to bang guys on a random place. There is no such as low count woman now a days.

dragoness_leclerq · 2017-03-16T06:14:06+00:00

[deleted]

[deleted] · 2017-03-16T06:24:16+00:00

Your title and the body of your thread ask two separate questions, so I'll address them both:

Why do so many women have a hard time wrapping their minds around the simple concept that many men simply find high n count women unattractive?

Because you're asking me to accept a "fact" that has been demonstratively untrue. I have a high n, it's fairly apparent if you party with me and I'm sure no one I've dated has been under the impression that I'm chaste and virginal. And yet I have had 0 problems finding men to date, and eventually finding a very attractive husband.

If "many men" care, then where are they? Why have I never run into any of them? I'm sure that some men care, but the real truth is not enough men care for it to act as a deterrent to women.

Find a woman with a high n count unattractive? Oh mein gott you sexist douche! YOu are the worst person ever! I don't understand this, its so illogical, it makes no sense!

Don't really care if high n is a dealbreaker for certain men. That's fine; all preferences are valid. Just don't expect me to believe that most men share that preference.

lapisthewaterwitch · 2017-03-16T16:36:34+00:00

Most people who say it's wrong to judge someone based on how many people they've slept with would say that judging people based on the other things you mentioned is wrong as well

Subway_Bernie_Goetz · 2017-03-16T18:43:15+00:00

Because they are in denial. You can't un-dick yourself, and most women have done things sexually that they wish they didn't (even if they don't admit it), so accepting that fact means swallowing a pretty painful pill about your own worth as marriage or LTR-material.

But also because men are really shitty at explaining why they have that preference. The truth is that men are emotional about sex too. It's such a visceral, emotional, intimate thing to men that the idea of committing to a slut is deeply sad. If you're the only guy she's been with, by default you are the best lover she's ever had. By default you have a connection with her that no other person has had.

The typical response is "so what if she's had other guys- she loves you and she chose you." Sorry, that's just not how it works. What she's done with her body is more important to me than whether she "loves" me on an emotional level.

Also, "she's with you now, you're the only one who can sleep with her now" is not good enough because I see a committed relationship as more than leasing a vagina. That's where TRP falls down in explaining the n-count thing. Because they keep trying to preach that relationships are some kind of crass transaction where men trade investment for sex. No, it's more than that. It's an emotional thing for guys too.

They also fail when they rationalize n-count as an indicator of something else about her that is low-value, like impulsiveness. That really doesn't capture it. It's the number itself that is the issue, not that the number represents something else about her character that is low-value.

Can't really fault women for this too much given how little of a shit our culture gives about marriage and how far we've drifted from marriage. And who you fuck is your business. I can't judge. But when it comes to marriage, you can't be all "I can do with my body whatever I want, it's 2017" and then still expect a husband. It's like, are you progressive, or aren't you? Are you a feminist, or not? You can't just go back and forth between traditional romantic customs and progressive sex positivity at your convenience. You can't just eliminate chastity because it's "outdated" and then expect a man to play the traditional role of husband for you.

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--Bob__ · 2017-03-15T16:07:25+00:00

actually that's fine too

mistresswhat · 2017-03-15T21:45:22+00:00

You're welcome to be turned off by whatever you like. In the case of guys who struggle with insecurity, I can even be sympathetic -- they shouldn't be dating people who are going to make them insecure, because that is going to be no fun for anyone involved.

But yeah, most of the time, an aversion to high n-count woman is an indicator of deeper issues. Usually some combination of misogyny and hypocrisy, always some unhealthy attitudes towards sex. And that is deeply unattractive to me, a high n-count woman! So I guess we don't have to worry about dating each other, but like, not gonna pretend there's nothing wrong with you.

If, in addition to finding high n-count women unattractive, you also feel the need to complain a lot about the ways in which high n-count women are awful, that's a lot more than a sexual preference, and yes, that does make you a sexist douche. Sorry not sorry.

yellingaccount · 2017-03-16T21:51:18+00:00

I think the bigger issue is when the repulsion is based on a double standard. An extremely high n count would bother me, and I'm a woman. Whenever men try to explain why men with high n counts should be attractive while women with high n counts should not, it's never as "logical" as they claim. It's always based in pseudo science or self-fulling prophecies that mask emotional insecurities and jealousy.

There are logical reasons, but all them apply to men as well.

crankypants15 · 2017-03-20T17:54:14+00:00

Define "many men". I think your experience might be different from that of other people.

IllimitableMan · 2017-03-15T17:04:36+00:00

Evolutionary men want women to be low or preferably zero N count because it means they can ascertain paternity. This is an inbuilt part of the male operating system and is impossible to change in most men.

Now pragmatically and psychologically, once a woman has a man in her past she can't get over because he so thoroughly owned her in heart and mind, you're never a real person to her, she is fundamentally incapable of connecting with you on the level of depth she did with that guy. You never get all of her, because it's either just not there anymore, or she's incapable of giving herself over to you to the degree she did him. Maybe it's a mixture of both, I have no way of confirming my suspicions here, so I can't say.

Men who want deep, meaningful relationships will see this as a dealbreaker because they'll never be "the love of her life", or her "main alpha" or whatever the fuck you want to call it. That dude in her past will be. And she will always compare you to him, you'll always be living in his shadow. It sucks for all involved because it means she can't get the sense of completion and happiness she needs, and you as a man can't get the level of respect, deference and worship you need - but yeah.

Makes perfect sense it'd be a disqualifier. Sluts and damaged girls get mad because they don't want to pay for the mistakes/tragedies in their past. They want a fresh start. The problem is, to have a fresh start you need to purify yourself of the shit that has contaminated you. You can't change the past, so they can't do that.

They want their past to be in the past like the past means nothing and affects nothing in the present. But the truth is, the past is responsible for who you are now. It's very important. Minimising it is an ego preservation strategy and is ultimately dishonest.

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