American murder, family next door

marshmallowqueen_ · 2020-10-03T22:37:05+00:00

I watched this. She was vulnerable and was the perfect victim for a narcissistic psychopath. She had previously been in an abusive marriage and was suffering with terrible physical health problems.

I’m struggling to put into words my thoughts about it too. I read the police reports on this case and the details are too horrifying to relay. It just makes me sick knowing that men out there are capable of such depravity.

AnniaT · 2020-10-03T22:54:24+00:00

Something I see in common with these family anhilators is that most of them had mistresses. They somehow want to eliminate their spouses and children all of a sudden because they think that will allow them to start with a clean slate with their mistresses. But then there's also the ones that can't cope with the woman leaving. It's very scary and we never know what a man is capable.

nat890 · 2020-10-03T22:44:13+00:00

There was a recent case in Australia about a man who set fire to his ex-wife and kids in their car and then killed himself (by stabbing, not by burning alive of course). The whole country was in outrage and shock and then corona conveniently happened and nobody cared anymore. I’m sorry to hear of what’s happened in the US. You just can’t know with these men so can’t be too careful!

MsVioletCline · 2020-10-03T22:50:48+00:00

The most interesting takeaway for me was when chris told the police that had he never met the new girl, he probably wouldn’t have realized he was unhappy in his marriage. So, what, like these men are one young and happy-go-lucky coworker away from murdering their families? It’s definitely eye opening

Prinnykin · 2020-10-04T01:41:36+00:00

There was a red flag in how he pursued Shannan. He didn't take no for an answer and chased her while she was vulnerable and very sick. Definitely worrying.

Side note, did anyone else take a look at that huge-ass home and multiple cars and think "There's no way a 60k salary can pay for this?"

Kimpractical · 2020-10-03T22:52:27+00:00

I’m sorry about what you’re going through, but I’m glad you decided to leave. You will most likely be okay. I love how at the end of the documentary they mention how 3 women are killed each day by a romantic partner, and people who kill their kids are usually men.

And the guys have the nerve to say that women have easier when it comes to dating. They complain about wanting to “go on their own way” just because a women cheated on and dumped them in the past. As if women don’t get cheated on and dumped on a regular basis as well.

On top of worrying about getting cheated on and dumped, we also have to worry about getting sexually assaulted, physically abused, stalked, harrassed, murdered. I wish I was a guy and didn’t have to worry about those things

eightwentyseven · 2020-10-03T23:26:50+00:00

You might want to check out The Gift of Fear by Gavin De Becker and Why Does He Do That? by Lundy Bancroft. (Both books are available for free from Library Genesis if you don't mind ebooks.) As terrifying as it is to see the reality of so many horrid men, advice on seeing the signs & getting out helps a lot.

werker115 · 2020-10-03T23:04:27+00:00

Weird! I am watching this right now and started to make a post but did not.

I am new to FDS and naturally, I am analyzing the documentary through the principles. It’s so upsetting. Her gut told her something was off while she was in NC, but of course she would never think it leads to the demise of her life and her precious daughters. And her poor family, esp her dad.. they were excited she married a “great guy” ugh.

Prinnykin · 2020-10-04T02:17:12+00:00

There is a book in which he says he felt zero remorse after he murdered his family because he just wanted to be free with his mistress. He said he even got angry at Shannan because she fell into the grave face down and gave birth to the baby. The details of the case are absolutely heinous.

He says he's still in love with the mistress and she's his soulmate. The man is depraved and it makes me want to be single forever.

I am also nice to my ex because I'm so scared he will murder me. He already threatened to kill me once. I live in a different country now, but I'm still scared he will come after me so that's why I do the "grey rock" method that a therapist told me to do.

NowTruly · 2020-10-04T06:20:36+00:00

Just watched the documentary because of this post. Super triggery — my chest was tight the entire time.

A few points:

The true depth of Chris Watts’ evil got a bit whitewashed. No mention of how autopsies on the girls revealed OIL IN BELLA’S STOMACH. They don’t think she was dead when he jammed her in the oil tank — that they think he didn’t care to check, since he knew the oil would finish her off. That he had to scrape Bella’s arms and head to get her inside that tiny tank hatch. His own daughter.... Or that Shanann’s baby was partially born as a result of what Chris did—and that he buried them both with his girls watching from the back seat.
Chris Watts’ MOTHER enabled this psychopath. Didn’t come to his wedding because she didn’t think Shanann was “good enough” (but didn’t keep it to herself, instead creating a massive wedge between the two right after the wedding.) THEN, she gives the youngest girl a treat that has all the things she has an allergy to—even though Shanann had told her not to. When Shanann (absolutely rightly) calls her on it, the grandma kicks them out, then doesn’t even attend the granddaughter’s birthday. Shanann was livid and told Chris he had to put his daughter first. (Chris’ reaction? He didn’t think it was fair for his mom not to see her grandchildren ....) THEN she’s got the gall to tell him she forgives him IN COURT, in front of Shanann’s devastated family. That psycho apple did not fall far from that psycho tree.
That girlfriend was sketch AF. I’ll be the first to put everything at the guy’s feet every day of the week, but ... watching that gf in the interrogation room, she does not seem right.

I’m with you that “the average guy” could totally have this kind of evil in him, but I disagree about the being nicer to the ex LVM part. I face a similar concern with my ex, and the one thing I know IN MY BONES is that nothing I do has any influence on his NVM decisions and actions. Not even a little bit. I can only do my best to be vigilant, and be ready.

Sending you strength, sister.

pao664 · 2020-10-04T02:05:46+00:00

This is exactly why you never date that “nice” shy weird awkward guy who is undesirable and insecure and below your league. Not saying they’re all murderers but they will always fuck you up in the end.

Mulkvistee · 2020-10-04T00:24:07+00:00

I just watched it last night, and his passive attitude + suddenly getting in shape screams why we shouldn't give socially awkward uggos a chance. They think they not only can, but deserve to upgrade once given a script to blend in by a woman willing to deal with them. In this guy's case he thought it so much he rationalized killing to do so.

For her part in how she treated Chris, I speculate after her first abusive marriage Shanann thought vetting for a guy who passive enough to be bossed around was a self defense mechanism. She had her finances together and a home at 25, etc. All she probably thought she needed was a guy that agreed she knew best in everything and took direction.

The end of the documentary makes it very clear dopey schlubs happy to have their asses wiped and run around are dangerous. This man was a coward in his bones and her build-a-boo approach gave him the unearned credit to be perceived as a "good man" which gave him the confidence to aspire to more. Being a coward though he couldn't just divorce like a normal well adjusted person. His murders were strikingly spineless to me, the only thing greater than his fear of owning his shit and starting over was the massive entitlement that he was somehow owed a do over in life.

I can't wish enough hell on Chris Watts. Though I read somewhere he's some kind of born again Christian prison Jesus freak. Because of course that coward would find something new to hide behind.

Vain, ambitious, and confident men have their own issues and red flags, but I'd take them any day and twice on Sunday vs the sniveling mommy-wife seeking social graspers. They use women to fake HVM status, then become the ultimate hazard to their health once convinced they're being held back by the very same women.

pao664 · 2020-10-04T14:16:24+00:00

The other thing about this- what a wonderful friend Shannan had In Nikki! She instantly knew something was off. As women, we should lift each other up. The fact that Shannan had a friend who cared so much about her speaks volumes about her character.

DoeEyedBrownSkin · 2020-10-03T22:56:39+00:00

If you look closely, there were subtle signs. Not signs of murder but signs that he is pathetic/LV/empty.

1) he was overweight and looked like he had no game and super shy/subdued (watch the relationship presentation he made and him sitting in the park looking unfit).

2) she pushed him away, was bossy, declined his attempts several times but he persisted - nice guy/LVM with no options. And she finally accepted the “nice guy”.

3) She admitted she bosses/humiliates him (doesn’t mean she deserves it) and he just allowed it.

4) He finally got fit and found someone new and shiny. Idiot.

5) Saving the marriage became one-side and sad to even watch. Not easy but she should have pulled back.

None of these point to murder and it’s even harder to see if you’re in her shoes but these are subtle signs of an empty man.

IwantyoualltoBEDAVE · 2020-10-04T03:40:34+00:00

The truth is we can never be sure.

UnstrirringCoffee · 2020-10-04T11:23:42+00:00

I don't think being nicer could have saved Shannan. Her very existence and that of the kids stood in the way of the shiny new life he wanted. They just had no value to him as human beings. To him it was like killing one dog and adopting another. The guy was just a psychopath and probably addicted to porn.

Please, get yourself out sooner rather than later.

DoeEyedBrownSkin · 2020-10-03T23:10:26+00:00

Can I just add how irritating it is that he uses “like” several times in his sentences?

Definitely mentally underdeveloped.

TexiMcCrae · 2020-10-04T15:01:24+00:00

My coworker‘s husband drove over the side of a cliff with her two baby daughters in the car because she said she wanted a divorce. They all survived and he’s now in prison. I wish they just let him drown.

pao664 · 2020-10-04T13:43:08+00:00

I have watched a ton of docus about this case.
I’m still confused by all of it.
This is an unthinkable tragedy that breaks my heart.
I think Shannan was in a bad place when she met Chris. If she had met that POS at any other point of time in her life, she would have kicked him to the curb.
A takeaway for me is that women should not date until they are fully healed emotionally. Don’t get involved with a man when you are vulnerable- as you risk becoming a target for a sociopath.
Also- Nichol- what an extreme pickme! I just have no words. Right down to the “how to prepare for anal sex” and “marrying your mistress” bullshit. 🤮 And I will say again- the way Chris was infatuated with Nichol- that had to do with him lusting after her body. All Men are visual, but men who notice a woman’s body over her face- are the type that view a woman’s body as a conduit solely for their sexual pleasure. These are not the type of men who want to touch your heart and your mind. That’s an instant asshole tell. I Block/delete any scrotes that send messages like “sexy” or “I live your curves”. And yes it is harrowing to think about how someone who appeared so normal at a distance can do something so heinous. I think that is why this case has stayed with so many of us.

QueenLatifaLaBiggest · 2020-10-04T00:37:29+00:00

I can't tell you how to leave because I don't know your situation but i can tell you that many psychologists superficially thinks he showed many red flags. These people are not the movie style narcissistic or psychopaths and sociopaths. They show their nature soon enough if you know what to look for. So if you haven't seen anything that set something off, it should be ok. Don't let fear cripple you from doing what you need to do. But be safe.

creamtart_ · 2020-10-04T03:45:51+00:00

He looked so normal

What does normal look like? This is a common statement that reeks of ignorance.

Domestic violence does not have a face. It does not discriminate between class, race, or age. It’s everywhere. In my line of work, I am faced with the most well-presenting men who engage in the most abhorrent behaviours. Violence is everywhere, we just don’t seek it out. It finds us.

All people have thoughts and feelings which lead to their behaviours. Some of those thoughts and feelings will be unhealthy and can lead to problem behaviour, but most of us learn to manage our stressors appropriately to prevent acting out problematic behaviours. Presenting well means nothing, it just means you’ve learned to blend in and manipulate people better.

If you ever catch yourself thinking or hear anyone say, “oh he looked like such a nice guy”, stop. Rethink it, call it out. The best place for a monster to hide is in plain sight.

husheveryone · 2020-10-04T13:43:20+00:00

I watched it, and learned some new details about the case, including the fact she’d been divorced from an abusive man prior to Chris pursuing her.

It’s common to end up with another type of abuser (the younger, the less therapy the survivor has had access to, and repartnering fairly quickly the more likely that becomes), and psychopaths are masterful at playing the role of the perfect man so they look amazing compared to a woman’s past partners. Chris’s red flags were so subtle they were only meaningful with the benefit of our 20/20 hindsight.

Just thinking it through for myself a bit further here. I mean, how would one convincingly warn such a happy looking woman about someone like Chris, arguably the so-called “best person” she had ever dated and married?

So the red flags to me were his crazy (likely sociopathic) mom being reckless/depraved with her grandchild‘s peanut allergy, refusing to attend the wedding etc and his lovebombing at the outset— but here’s the thing. A lot of people have crazy parents (raises hand) and they aren’t psychopaths, so society isn’t ready to conclude that as per se problematic. I dunno. Very subtle red flags here, to my mind, and we’re telling ourselves we and ours would spot and act on them just to feel better about our own safety perhaps. I just think we as a society don’t have enough education about subtle abuse dynamics and how pregnancy - yes even a 3rd pregnancy after many years happily married from her perspective— is very often when abuse ramps up. We here at FDS know it, but it’s hardly common knowledge out there, unfortunately.

Edit: grammar

AliceInDatingland · 2020-10-03T22:50:38+00:00

Well the fact that there were no warning signs is not necessarily accurate. I do believe there were warning signs. I know the biggest way to get rid of scary men for me is the woman needs to ask the man really hard questions about his character. I doubt she did that and I doubt he would still be around if she did. A woman can happily marry a horrible man if he is able to hide things from her. He will be happy for a long time before it gets bad. But a woman who asks really hard questions would be unappealing to this kind of man.

2020-10-04T13:26:58+00:00

This was something I was waiting to watch due to all the comments listed here and I agree they could and should have gone deeper into the case; so many unanswered questions and the way he was treated was shocking (rubbing his back asking if he was ok for example). The woman he was having an affair with was also brushed over. I am not sure why it was such a sanitised documentary?

Two others I watched this week were;

*The Memphis three (sky) ; 3 children murdered,3 other children framed for the murders, Stepdad obviously killed them and no prosecution still to this day?! The male depravity on this one is jaw dropping by all male adults involved both sides of the fence.

*Honour (UK) this story I know well and it was updated and shown again....I have no words other than MEN!!!!

Let me know what you think if you guys watch.

OP I am glad you posted this as I was waiting for someone to say something on the show. Hope you don't mind me signposting the other 2 documentaries...I did a murder week and was just frazzled by it all but all I could think was thank god for FDS 🙏🛐

NowTruly · 2020-10-04T06:35:23+00:00

[deleted]

throw2422 · 2020-10-05T17:25:04+00:00

It shook me to my core too.

I can't risk that.

Title	American murder, family next door
Author	washopingyoudask
Upvotes	292
Comments	169
Date	October 3, 2020 10:19 PM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/FemaleDatingStrategy
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/FemaleDatingStrategy/comments/j4ny9j/american_murder_family_next_door/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/FemaleDatingStrategy/american-murder-family-next-door.280213 https://theredarchive.com/post/280213

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