Wealth and sexlessness correlate extremely well. The former reliably creates the latter on average.

majani · 2021-10-15T13:58:09+00:00

The more rich countries import people from foreign countries, the more those countries will stay poor. The rich countries of course only want the intelligent, hardworking immigrants, and most Western immigration policies filter for those traits. Leaving the dumb, lazy guys back home, continuously failing in life

Lonelybuthopeful9 · 2021-10-15T12:21:31+00:00

Nonsense thread.

Mouse utopia is simply about mouses burning their dopamine receptors with abundance in resources, and not enjoying sex.

It can be comparable to drug addicts no longer be able to eat food or enjoy life etc.

Neet males on wealthy nations arent that, they are not rejecting girls to play games, its simply a coping mechanism for unhappy life they have.

WilliamWyattD · 2021-10-15T12:34:53+00:00

What really is the primary drive behind herbivores in Japan? I bet it is female driven and not male, given greater male libido.

My bet is that the more money a society has, the less powerful the economic forces that men can use to overcome female selectivity and hypergamy to make women mate more widely with Beta males.

TryLambda · 2021-10-15T12:10:57+00:00

this is incorrect, you are equating population growth with sexlessness. Don't you know wealthier/educated people are more likely to use contraception?

gofigure62 · 2021-10-15T13:06:03+00:00

That mice experiment was flawed. Mice socialization and mouse habitat priority wasn't taken into consideration. Mice in the wild that have an abundance of food and space create plagues that can last several years until food is scarce again, or if natural disasters, disease, or predators don't eradicate them.

The observation is far more reliable than that ridiculous study.

Having more wealth isn't the reason why people are having less children. People are havingnless children because they are educated and because longer hours and more resources are required to raise children. The Japanese have ridiculous working hours. It isn't practical to work 10+ hours a day and have time to date. There are also cultural factors that play into why men and women are choosing to be alone in Japan. Both gender norms are hard on both men and women. They aren't practical expectations and people don't want those impossible obligations in their lives.

Humans are complicated. Shifting cultures, longer working hours, education, and isolation is why people are having less sex and less children.

GridReXX · 2021-10-15T13:29:05+00:00

Let’s say from a differentiating perspective, men desire sex, beauty, and nurturing from women and women desire stability, security, creature comforts from a man.

In economically successful societies, men and women can, at the individual level, more easily attain stability, security, and creature comforts independently.

However, for men, it is very difficult for him to obtain sex or a beautiful sexual partner or a nurturing companion.

On the other hand, women don’t crave sex as much but if she did want it she could easily get it with a beautiful dude. And even if that dude ‘pumps and dumps’ her, she can easily go find nurturing emotional support in her female friends and family. Whereas it seems men who aren’t in relationships don’t have any outlet for emotional support.

TLDR:

Without societal incentive (Sharia Law as an extreme example) women will not be obliged.
Without men being able to showcase masculine aptitude (he’s out chopping wood or hunting or protecting her or being physically impressive whilst adding value), women aren’t going to be attracted.
Also most women didn’t love having 15 pregnancies and fistulas by 33. Female agency and education about her own reproductive cycles and access to contraception led to less babies.
Not to mention with more money the less need to pop out babies as some sort of Oregon Trail survival tactic.
Finally more prosperity means more exposure/education and educated ppl tend to not believe in “Gods” which means less “you must procreate because He divines it so, Amen” obligation.

SuperSupremeKai · 2021-10-15T11:55:49+00:00

Everything has a bell curve of diminishing returns. There is a peak where enough of one thing makes the maximum of the other, but more than that would just cause it do decrease.

Western countries, rich Asian countries and the ones following them in the future will have the same effect.

We can also point out how the changes happen over time:

"I can't afford to get my children to school yet. I can't be a parent now!" yet there were no schools in the past or they were not as important as it is now.

"I can't maintain my standard of living if I do have children." yet the standards of living were dirt huts and stone walls centuries ago.

And the biggest indicator of all, the normalization of wealth. Today's ten dollars would lose their value and look like a dollar a few years later. Thus, a person's wealth would theoretically decrease by a factor of 10 during that time, forcing him to attain ten times as much wealth to keep the same level of value. And if people base their choices in partners based on that value?

Mrs_Drgree · 2021-10-15T12:13:41+00:00

[permanently deleted]

cowfishAreReal · 2021-10-15T12:21:00+00:00

Source?

Mrs_Drgree · 2021-10-15T12:52:10+00:00

[permanently deleted]

GodFromMachine · 2021-10-15T14:09:27+00:00

The Mouse Utopia experiments indicated a correlation between overabundance of stimulation and population decline, not a correlation between wealth and sexlessness.

Japan's herbivore males aren't a product of their wealth, rather they are the end result of a culture that values work infinitelly more than it does human relationships.

Besides, more children =! more sex. People in wealthier countries have just as much intercourse as those in poorer, if not even more, they just have access to reliable birth control.

rivetcitymayor · 2021-10-15T14:43:07+00:00

People in poor countries do be making a lot of babies

pukubr · 2021-10-15T16:10:04+00:00

this is true but you overlook one critical factor: in developing and poor nations, they see children as a resource and sex as a past time. that's why they're motivated to have as many kids as possible, playing a lottery game for example hoping one of them "makes it"

in wealthy countries, they have less kids or none, as the pursuit of developing the country and working on your career becomes the end game, and wanting to provide the best possible future for your kid instead of having as many as possible and hope they turn out alright. people dont have kids because it would get in the way of their career or education, so they don't have sex anyway since dating would take up a lot of time

MrShakedown1 · 2021-10-15T16:13:23+00:00

So in other words, women want fuck most of is just for money. Also can't eait when USA starts importing masses of piss poor, uneducated people to boost their economy and population. /s

Lateralanouncer · 2021-10-15T21:51:24+00:00

At first I though this was silly. Then if you think about it. In the west we are loosing interest in marriage, families and children.

Matt_Door · 2021-10-15T13:34:15+00:00

Using Japan as a “canary in a coal mine” for western societies is basically useless. Far too many differences in family, work and sexual culture and mores. More importantly, recent economic events, especially post-bubble Japan play a far more important role in why more men are becoming “freeters” or shoushoku danshi/herbivores. You can draw some broad conclusions but really should avoid saying “Japan is going here, therefore that’s where we’re headed”

TryLambda · 2021-10-15T12:21:13+00:00

last time I checked humans aren't genetically identical to mice and humans have different cultures to mice and also within the human species? Your logic is all over the place buddy

harold_shipman_gp · 2021-10-15T12:00:33+00:00

The findings of John Calhoun's mouse utopia study have been re-examined in the 60 years since it took place.

The dominant interpretation now is that the aggressive mice killed off the beautiful mice, and that is what caused societal collapse. So if you believe that humans are the same as mice, and you're one of the beautiful mice who are being killed off (in your case genetically, by being denied your Nat King Cole by women), then the answer is for you to become an aggressive mouse.

Of course, that's not what's happening in human society in the 21st century. Beautiful mice are thriving, while their aggressive brethren are dying off.

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BluePsychosisDude2 · 2021-10-15T14:04:56+00:00

The colonies grew, then suddenly new generations of mice quit being interested in mating, and the colony completely collapsed.

If we are thinking of the same experiment, it was way more complicated than that. It's clear that the "utopia" they set up really wasn't well adapted to mice at all. I'd say it's an interesting experiment, but to apply it to humans is a broad jump.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/how-mouse-utopias-1960s-led-grim-predictions-humans-180954423/

Megabyte7637 · 2021-10-15T14:09:03+00:00

Interesting.

moosemc · 2021-10-15T14:36:38+00:00

Rich countries have no mice, then.

nick1812216 · 2021-10-15T14:42:07+00:00

What does ‘they’re going herbivore’ mean?

Cataclysma324 · 2021-10-15T17:04:47+00:00

It correlates with low birthrates but not necessarily sexlessness. The combination of highly available birth control plus the advanced shucking of the "big family tradition" as having more kids was an unnecessary burden to a large post industrial economy rather than a survival tactic. Of course, it is more likely that on the individual level it is primarily about lower education and lower birth control, rather than a conscious motivation

Longshot_56 · 2021-10-15T17:09:49+00:00

Birth rates have dropped precipitously in developing countries as well after the UN contraceptives programs were introduced.

Bangladesh, for example, went from a fertility rate of 6.95 in 1970 to 2.01 in 2019.

SirTruffleberry · 2021-10-15T17:31:20+00:00

The prevailing belief is that sexuality is genetic and, if this is so, surely one cannot "become asexual" just by being thrown in an environment where one doesn't need sex. I'm not saying the basic idea here is wrong, just that I don't think it's a matter of sexual orientation.

purplish_possum · 2021-10-15T18:01:46+00:00

When women are educated family size decreases. This happens independent of wealth.

PassMyGuard · 2021-10-15T18:19:52+00:00

I mean, Scandinavian countries are having more sex than anywhere else in the world bro. Switzerland is like the most open to casual sex on the planet.

I think your theories fall short a little bit, and it takes more than a few correlative studies to draw conclusions.

redback-spider · 2021-10-15T18:34:52+00:00

Well this thread misses real reasons A mice experiments say little to nothing about human sociology, B the childlessness is decoupled from sexlessness, our parents that 99% married early had probably more sex than our grandfathers, yet their produced (at least in my western country) less children, why because sex is decoupled from babies, you do familiy "planing".

And the current collapse of the numbers even further is more correlated to a LACK of resources and stability (besides other reasons like social media and feminist propaganda) , many want first a career and then when they stand on both feet they want babies, now if countries give 0 security hire/fire and living paycheck from paycheck and people have to live by their parents till 30, yes either when they are ready (as far as they ever reach that) they either can't get pregnent healthily with high success rates or they don't find a partner at that point.

So no the reason is not that they are to richt, that reduces the number of children but not the sex the sexlessness and childlessness is on the other hand in a country where most people don't have to fear to starve but never have a long perspective no security.

Megabyte7637 · 2021-10-16T00:35:34+00:00

Taipanshimshon · 2021-10-16T02:29:13+00:00

my response

Pastelitomaracucho · 2021-10-16T10:38:45+00:00

Is not wealth, it's women's access to career and education.

Strong-Dot-187 · 2021-10-20T13:37:39+00:00

Weird post.

Poor countries tend to have big families because of a higher risk of child death.

Improved general global healthcare means child death has dropped, but big families are still a cultural hangover.

Being wealthy in a good country doesn't mean you're sexless. You can be horny as hell. But you're more likely to be responsible with, and have access to, birth control. Plus the culture of having a giant family you can't provide for is dying off amongst all but the poorest / most recently immigrated.

JennyConcinnity · 2021-10-15T14:40:20+00:00

The herbivore men are forced into it, it is not of their choosing. Herbivore men is reference the 30 million men who have no chance of having a family or a wife even due to one child policies which left a generation of men without partners.

Did you know that human trafficking has been bringing women to the countries with herbivore men to sell the women as wives. The family pays for the women so their sons can have a family.

You make it sound like men enmass are walking away from women when the truth is vastly different. Outside of the America's there are more men than women (52% / 48%) and those places have much higher value in marriage

anonymousUser1SHIFT · 2021-10-15T15:21:17+00:00

I looked at this study. You are 100% missappropriating the study. What they found was when mice were given all necessary things for survival, they tend to lose their drive for survival (which includes mating, but also eating and grooming)

Cuthulion · 2021-10-15T17:36:44+00:00

You draw the wrong conclusions. It's not that being wealthy makes you less likely to reproduce, it's that intellect predicts success and most intelligent people won't reproduce while less intelligent people who are more often poor will.

Title	Wealth and sexlessness correlate extremely well. The former reliably creates the latter on average.
Author	czerdec
Upvotes	54
Comments	315
Date	October 15, 2021 11:47 AM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/q8mrfq/wealth_and_sexlessness_correlate_extremely_well/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/wealth-and-sexlessness-correlate-extremely-well.1079394 https://theredarchive.com/post/1079394

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