Q for sexually unsuccessful men: would you be ok with a woman who is not attracted to you dating you simply to shirk hypergamy

lulll · 2022-01-05T02:30:31+00:00

thats basically an arranged marriage and im not interested in someone who doesnt want me

Monchi_21 · 2022-01-05T03:18:01+00:00

I took the advice to lower my standards even more from this sub. (You can see one of my previous post today in my history for the scoop but I would say the girl was 1-3/10). At the end of the day I just couldn’t do anything with this person I really tried didn’t like her personality or her body at all.

I was never a advocate for lowering standards to a extreme level( ladies a 7-8/10 guy is above average!) so I already wouldn’t want anyone to do it. After trying it my self I’m even more against for anybody. I want someone who wants me and I want that for everyone else in this sub tbh. Even if that means I’ll end up being single and sexless for the rest of my life.

MotiMorphosys · 2022-01-05T02:06:13+00:00

As a formerly unsuccessful man, I would have been okay with an attractive woman dating me for any reason under the sun, so yes.

tf_bloomer · 2022-01-05T02:10:18+00:00

Vikingbeard1 · 2022-01-05T04:48:47+00:00

Very good question. Yet, consider what happens when, as recently happened, a post goes up about how women reject men based on height; heated denials, personal anecdotes to the contrary, etc. Why the discrepancy? It's the difference between judging men's attractiveness at a purely superficial level after 10 seconds, and judging men's attractiveness after speaking to them and getting an idea of their character, intellect, and personality. The problem isn't, contrary to many in the RP crowd, that any decent woman will ONLY sleep with men who are top-tier attractive (or rich/powerful), it's that women are making snap judgments and rejecting (this also includes simply passing over, aka, not noticing at all) tons and tons and tons of men that they WOULD find attractive if they just tried. It's gotten infinitely worse with online dating; unless you live in the middle of nowhere, online dating is like a fucking buffet, throwing an endless stream of pictures at ladies (with, maybe, a limited amount of text buried down there somewhere). Even if you're not into cheap sex and all that, it always seems like you'll definitely find your Prince Charming if you just keep swiping, never mind that if a really hot guy is on a dating app for very long, it's probably because he only wants sex or he's a disaster.

Ironically, this was and is a lesson constantly being thrown at men. Rightfully so, in many cases; there have absolutely been many, many men who rejected attractive women because they didn't get an instant erection. How many movies and shows have their Ally Sheedy moments? It's actually gotten sort of extreme these days, what with some groups trying to shame men for not being attracted to trans women or morbidly obese women--the beauty is on the inside, we are told! But where's the Shallow Hal for women, telling them about how many regular-looking guys are out there who are funny, kind, hard-working, and committed, if they just give them a chance? And it's not even that I am saying to date a fugly brute--I've met plenty of women who I initially thought weren't really attractive but, getting to know them, see them laugh and smile, seeing them in different light (I mean literally) and outfits, I found the attractive parts to them, the cute dimples or the confident stance or whatever. Especially since people can change; I'm not saying women need to find a loser and put in Herculean effort to "fix" them, that's no one's JOB, but most men would suddenly stop skipping leg day if a girlfriend told them they'd probably have a really cute butt if they did more squats.

AreOut · 2022-01-05T08:41:32+00:00

well, judging by how much escorts are charging it seems they are pretty much OK with it

Agreeable_Ads · 2022-01-05T02:11:12+00:00

Yes. Attractiveness can change; if I had a girlfriend I'd put in the extra effort to become attractive to her.

lukehighwalker15 · 2022-01-05T04:04:23+00:00

Hmm I remember my first love asked me for sex. My second gf kinda just let me advance and really acted like a fish.

I mean we later fully embraced each other. Go at it crazy but like that was once we got to be very comfortable together.

My point was that the 2nd girl. The one who really loved me. Made me feel like I was not wanted or doing it right when she just laid there. It made me not enjoy the sex and this is after my first love. After 3 yr drought I even rejected an unattractive girl in this drought.

...now that I’m writing this.... she did get sexually assaulted. So maybe that’s why.... fucking prick ruined what could’ve been a real special one for the book. Although all the sex after 2 months was special.

throwaway042994 · 2022-01-05T04:51:28+00:00

The question is: how attractive is SHE?

I wouldn't be ok with it if she's average looking. Imagine an average chick acting like you're not good enough for her. fuck that, I'd tell her to get over herself.

If she's really hot, at least her shirking her hypergamy actually means something. She really is doing you a huge favor by dating you.

most women are actually the first chick, but they act like they're the second chick

pillchangedmylife · 2022-01-05T08:06:02+00:00

No. That would just be relationship hell.

GenerallyToxicPerson · 2022-01-05T10:52:02+00:00

I dont think an average heterosexual woman is naturally unattracted to an average man.

hypergamy stems from female narcissism and feeling entitled to the very best. the same average man could go to southeast asia and women would find him attractive, but in the west he gets nothing.

this shows that women aren't necessarily unattracted to looksmatch/average men on a biological level, which means it is possible for women to 'shirk' their hypergamy and still be attracted to their partner. any decent human being should know not to set standards on others which is significantly higher than what they live up to themselves.

lostwanderer28 · 2022-01-06T14:24:32+00:00

No.

I used to be one of those men complaining endlessly until I figured how ridicolous it is. Your post basically nails down the reason. Ultimately it would end up in a relationship where she doesn't really love her partner. That's not what I want. I want to be wanted, I want to feel needed and all that jazz...

wtknight · 2022-01-05T02:17:53+00:00

No. I was sexually unsuccessful at one point in my life, but I wouldn't have wanted sex with a woman who wasn't really into it even if it had meant losing my virginity or ending a dry spell.

logiauser · 2022-01-05T03:20:25+00:00

I love this question. Really gets to why dating and relationships are about to fall of a cliff IMO. Men have always hoped (normal guys not the exceptions like Bezos) women liked us for who we are.

Now we know that women find 80+% of men unattractive. As more and more men find this out, we will wonder “why is she really here?” “Is she settling?”

Fundamental breakdown of trust required for LTRs imo. I expect men to refuse to commit even less.

To answer the question, I’d rather be alone.

DarkSp3ctre · 2022-01-05T02:50:52+00:00

I want mutual feelings, so no thank you.

redpillbob69 · 2022-01-05T03:11:40+00:00

I would want someone to give me an honest shot and see what happens. Looks do not determine character and personality. Less attractive people can be assholes as easily as attractive people.

EpicVen · 2022-01-05T03:51:10+00:00

I think I am a qualified to answer the question. I’m new here I hope that’s okay with you. Here it goes:

As desperate as I may be, I recognize the effects that desire has on people. I would like someone to desire me ideally. Now if someone showed interest in me, I would like to present my best self to that person. The thing is having that opportunity to be able to get there is what makes all this impossible to many. Just like not every man likes the same woman body type, every woman has different interests as well. So, the opportunity would be great.

PlagueDoctorD · 2022-01-05T08:57:29+00:00

If there was no other option, yes.

Gravel_Roads · 2022-01-05T09:33:48+00:00

No thanks. I don't date people that aren't into me. I'm not offended they aren't into me (I'm not into a lot of people, myself). But I would find it very confusing why that person was trying to date me. I would have to assume they were doing it due to some sort of mental health issues.

EnteFetz · 2022-01-05T10:16:50+00:00

I would hook up with a very unnatractive girl, if she would treat me OK, but there are not nearly enough desperate girls out there even the women at r/foreverAloneWomen have unrealistic standards and prefer to be alone instead of dating men like me.

WilliamWyattD · 2022-01-05T10:25:18+00:00

While based in biology, female hypergamy and sexual selectivity manifest in a cultural context. Nature and nurture are both at play.

So the goal would be to figure out a culture that influences hypergamy and sexual selectivity such that a greater number of men and women are voluntarily and eagerly pairing with one another. In other words, what we find attractive is partially malleable.

Mark_Freed · 2022-01-05T10:51:22+00:00

hmm it comes down to that dilemma of would you rather date a girl who is not attracted to you but you are attracted to vs would you date a girl who is attracted to you but you are not attracted to her.

I think I would pick the former. I think with time she will come to be attracted to me. So if my unccessful dating streak continues and my goal of finding someone where both of us liking each other turns out to be too ambitious.

I would rather a girl settle for me, rather than I settle for a girl.

But yeah it is a not a strong belief, I mean sometimes I think at that point being alone is better and casually dating girls who are attracted to me. Your point about the quality of sex and how both of us will likely be miserable stands.

I think guys are more clear about attraction, it is more objective and binary. So thtat is why I think the dilemma is solved like this.

A girl who is attracted to me can lose her attraction later, the same way even if she is not attracted right now, it can happen later. That attraction takes time to build, it is very contextual. But if I don't find her attractive now, I find it very skeptical I will change my mind later.

But who knows, I might be wrong on this.

Barely-moral · 2022-01-05T11:40:20+00:00

I was an incel for years. I would have been okay with that considering that loneliness was making me suicidal.

Also, sacrificing personal aspects of your life for the benefit of society in general is something worthy of respect. It would be nice to date someone worthy of respect.

Also, respect and basic decency are not the same.

throwaway316stunner · 2022-01-05T14:02:35+00:00

I want more than just sex. I don’t want just the physical aspects of having sex, but the emotional aspects of having sex with a woman who genuinely loves and cares about me.

So, as a 31 year old virgin who has never dated, no, I would not be ok with it.

DzejSiDi · 2022-01-05T15:09:31+00:00

Eh, maybe for short term only, if she's decently looking, to gain preselection points in other women. In the long run no. I doubt it would be better than being single, relationship is a mixbag of costs and benefits and we enter this one already with heavy handicap.

Bjj-lyfe · 2022-01-05T16:58:02+00:00

For rp, this falls under alpha fucks beta bucks (at/bb).

Around late 20s/30s, women start dating less attractive guys (beta bucks) for stability and comfort. When they were early 20s and their most attractive physically, they would have hot sex with the most attractive guys out of genuine desire (alpha fucks).

The issue with this is, even though women do genuinely try to make it work with the beta dude, the desire just isn’t there so there tends to be starfish, resentful duty sex. Also, the relationship is riddled with arguing, annoyance, and general malaise (both in and out of the bedroom). See any example on /r/relationship_advice where the married guy finds out his wife did fun, hot sexual acts with guys in her early 20s (anal, blowjobs, etc) that she thinks would be disgusting to do with him. That is af/bb, and a potential outcome of the scenario you are describing.

So yes, women do try this, but the best case for the guy is to become attractive.

Im_The_Daiquiri_Man · 2022-01-05T03:56:24+00:00

I don’t know anybody (even blackpillers) that wants this.

What most PPD / RP men would want is for an open and honest discussion about the myriad of ways boys and men are set up for failure and not prepared for the ugly realities of the world or modern relationships.

Also, we should be teaching girls about their potential “toxicity” just as we do with boys.

Stop pretending boys and girls are the same and are “just people”.

This is code for “act like a girl (ie low to no sex drive) or you will be punished” and “your male sexuality is disgusting”

Make it the norm to teach boys about the myriad of ways of women manipulate men, trade on their looks, gaslight and tell self serving fictions to protect their virtue.

Do this in the exact same way we hammer in how “predatory” and “dangerous” boys are to girls.

Tell boys and girls that if they hit a man they should expect to get hit back.

Explain to boys what women trul find attractive. (Hint it’s not what they say and it’s certainly not what society will tell them) without the discussion itself being labeled as “myosginist”

Discourage girls from Chad Chasing or at least make them aware that they are doing it and why.

Girls and women are especially susceptible to a bandwagon effect where they want to get the “top guy” at all costs.

They need to own this and recognize this for a pitfall in their character.

Castigate and punish girls for “creep shaming” just as we would for boys “slut shaming”

Teach girls how to have empathy for boys. Stop the “privileged toxic (white) cis het male” narrative as it gives license to hate and be shitty an entire group of people.

Basically teach a moderated / non angry form of TRP to boys as a matter of course.

PopularBug5 · 2022-01-05T02:38:27+00:00

As a man, I'll just say, if she doesn't like me I won't put a ring to her finger, and I can tell if she is just faking liking me just so that she can get married.

I am not Christian but I believe there is a verse in the Bible that has a nugget of truth. It is better to be alone in the wilderness than to be with an insufferable wife.

Background_Database4 · 2022-01-05T02:40:56+00:00

money aint got no owners, only spenders

Sagittarius_AAA · 2022-01-05T02:31:34+00:00

im glad women are starting to outearn and make their own money now. imagine being sent back decades ago to be forced to marry and fuck an ugly beta guy. and regardless of whether he beats you or not, you can't divorce him because you need him to survive. its like pressuring a guy to marry a landwhale. i roll my eyes every time guys shame women for trying to only date the guys they're attracted to. i hope women just stay single if they can't find a guy who they're attracted to, even if it means 4 out of every 5 of them dont get matched up.

Philip8000 · 2022-01-05T03:25:32+00:00

I've always felt the 80/20 was a load of BS. The average age for losing their virginity is about 17/17.5, so either the remaining 20% of women are really getting around, or it's a load of nonsense.

Haven't been successful, but I'd want to be with a woman who genuinely wants to be with me.

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GarbanzoJoe1103 · 2022-01-05T02:10:12+00:00

I’m all in for this.

BruddaMSK · 2022-01-05T08:54:38+00:00

I would be okay with that but it's yet another unrealistic scenario. What if the world turns upside down, what if the God himself shows up at your door, what if your penis grows by seven inches overnight, what if you become president of Syria tomorrow.

And yes sex is going to be mediocre at best if there's any sex planned for me at all in your setup.

AtomicMGTOW · 2022-01-05T13:33:53+00:00

Women are going to date you for basically one or two reasons even if they have a list of 20 things that they want.

Whether you're hot or you have money or you have status or you're in a band or they're desperate or they're horny or their lonely or you have wheels or their friend wants you... Whatever, it's not unconditional love like they have for their dogs or children so just go with it. Don't give too much. Don't marry and don't move in together. This is what they want as demonstrated by actions not words.

Shredddz · 2022-01-05T13:43:17+00:00

this question really is nonsensical. The problem is not women having to be with unattractive men. they are AS unattractive objectively, but still get casual sex from way more attractive men, deluding them into believing they can get these men because 80 percent of women indeed can get sex from 20 percent of men, but this is not representative of the womens desirability for relationships, but women use sexual attention as proxy for their relationship value, because from a woman’s perspective, sex is more guarded than the relationship itself.

the absurdity is that women paint it as if they are naturally more selective. They are not, they are simply more entitled and deluded about their value because of many males casually fucking women way below in looks out of biological imperative to go for quantity, especially when there is no commitment involved.

women are not any less attracted to average men than in reverse, they just can get the sexual attention of better guys aswell because of the male imperative being different, causing the imbalance in the marketplace.

its really a womens misunderstanding of biological differences in behavior and imperative and its wrong interpretation that makes them hold out for something they perceive was possible that was not.

Neptune-Jr · 2022-01-05T15:27:55+00:00

No that sounds awful.

Khidorahian · 2022-01-05T15:56:29+00:00

Khanluka · 2022-01-05T19:22:57+00:00

I dont really care what the reason is somebody would want to be with me. I just be happy the would wanna spend time with me. Money i have none. Great sex nope not something i can give. Good to look at. Not realy. I am i funny? Na. I am really smart nope. So if you wanted to be with me inspite of that. I would not care what your reason is. Just that you have one.

Antonija_Blagorodna · 2022-01-05T22:11:33+00:00

This question doesn't present a realistic situation, because men would never know if women are dating down unless the woman specifically told him that she was doing so. There's no benefit for men to question why a woman is dating them. That kind of questioning only leads to paranoia and insecurity.

Women are free to date whoever they want. Nothing is going to make a woman lower her standards, unless she can't actually get a man who meets her standards, so she settles for less. Just like a job. If you can't get your ideal job, you settle for the 2nd best job.

Title	Q for sexually unsuccessful men: would you be ok with a woman who is not attracted to you dating you simply to shirk hypergamy
Author	Cupcakelover1985
Upvotes	20
Comments	206
Date	January 5, 2022 2:02 AM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/rwb431/q_for_sexually_unsuccessful_men_would_you_be_ok/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/q-for-sexually-unsuccessful-men-would-you-be-ok.1094561 https://theredarchive.com/post/1094561

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