I'd like to try this without getting arrested

[+]Aiomon 13 years ago [recovered] (173 children) | Copy Link

A little strange. That being said, if a women showed that much of her vagina she would be arrested too. And if a man shows that much of his chest, then it is perfectly alright. So I don't really think this is very valid.

[–]lacychenault 110 points111 points112 points 13 years ago (125 children) | Copy Link

[+]Aiomon 13 years ago [recovered] (108 children) | Copy Link

This. Breasts are the equivalent to a man wearing a v neck and showing his chest. Most definitely NOT a penis. Honestly, women have it worse in this situation, as men can go topless with little opposition when women really can't.

[+][deleted] 13 years ago* (40 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]dm287 43 points44 points45 points 13 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

[–]dungone 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+][deleted] 13 years ago* (7 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]billet9 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]draculator1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 87 points88 points89 points 13 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

[–]mindaika 21 points22 points23 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]TheDiscoBastard 33 points34 points35 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]lurkerr 4 points5 points6 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]dildospandex 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]dungone -9 points-8 points-7 points 13 years ago* (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]JonnyRichter2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]dungone2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

It did seem like his only point was to exaggerate and twist my words.

But I don't know "why" except that they do it because they can? I think maybe it's because bras and panties went out of style among certain groups of women where I live. When I notice it, it's usually some woman that's wearing a skirt on the train with her legs spread open. Obviously, then you'll have women flashing their breasts at bars. But it goes beyond that at times. For instance I saw 3 topless women sucking on each other's breasts in the middle of a busy intersection (women being topless in public is legal here). Then there are shirts just like this one, except they also wear them without a bra on. http://brandymelvilleusa.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/k/a/katetank_mx399-276_001_19_side-3.jpg I must have seen dozens of women dressed this way this summer and when those shirts catch a little wind, everyone in the vicinity gets an unobstructed view.

[–]ReaganSmashK 7 points8 points9 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]dungone -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]maniacalnewworld 4 points5 points6 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting 12 points13 points14 points 13 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[+]Drugmule421 -7 points-6 points-5 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+][deleted] 13 years ago* (5 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]onetenth2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–][deleted]-1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Nimbus1337 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]ScullyNess 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]dungone -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

This is the whole problem - people aren't comparing like vs like. They are looking at men at the beach and comparing it to women in the boardroom. You can't tell me that women's dress codes are more rigid than men's in the workforce , or that women aren't allowed to be far more revealing than men are. I am hearing people bitch about how men can walk around outside without a shirt on, when in fact they can't walk into a store or restaurant that way. So if they are actually going somewhere versus being a delinquent of some sort, they have to dress in more clothes than women do even in hot weather. Men can't even work out at the gym without a shirt on, whereas women can get away with a sports bra.

My whole comment has to do with the big picture. In a wide variety of everyday situations, women in Western society have far more leeway in what they can choose to wear or how much they reveal. Yet they are constantly complaining about not being able to do things that they don't want to do, anyway. Yet, a man can't get very far in life without a shirt on. They can take their shirts off when they assume low status roles, disposable roles. They can't be a valued member of society without also wearing more restrictive attire than women in the same situations.

[–]draculator 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]baskandpurr -13 points-12 points-11 points 13 years ago (27 children) | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting 46 points47 points48 points 13 years ago (14 children) | Copy Link

[–]half-human 15 points16 points17 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Aaod 9 points10 points11 points 13 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting5 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Aaod5 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Aaod1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]anachronic0 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–][deleted]-1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting3 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Ha. I'm a few cup sizes too big for Victoria's Secret because they stop at DD and so anyone who's actually busty won't fit into anything there either, but thanks for those assumptions there that women must shop there. Especially for businesswear, that store full of bras and sweatpants is totally where people would go.

Anyone who's busty won't fit into any of those button down shirts, and anything fitted that isn't stretch material isn't going to fit over the bust either, without being several sizes too large; anything that is stretch material is going to make them look even more mammoth. Things just aren't built for large busts. I had to try on seven different blazers at H&M before finding one that would close without being two sizes too big--and the one only works because it plunges and the buttons are below my bust. How about you stop talking out your ass about something you have absolutely no experience with?

Also, you conveniently ignored the "massively overpriced" there. $90 for a sweater? That's more than a day's wages, right there.

[–][deleted]0 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Orimos 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]baskandpurr 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Luxieee12 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]ComeAtMeBrother0 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]icallmyselfmonster 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]baskandpurr 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted]0 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]baskandpurr2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–][deleted]0 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]baskandpurr2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[+]silverionmox -14 points-13 points-12 points 13 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]baskandpurr 5 points6 points7 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]icallmyselfmonster1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]half-human1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago* (9 children) | Copy Link

[+]NoGardE -12 points-11 points-10 points 13 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

[–]TRH_42 15 points16 points17 points 13 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]NoGardE0 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]TRH_425 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Orimos1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]tigonometry0 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]ComeAtMeBrother 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]anachronic 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]NoGardE-1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]anachronic 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[+]Aiomon 13 years ago [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link

Legal doesn't mean acceptable.

[–]anachronic -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Aiomon2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]anachronic0 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[+]xionaxa -9 points-8 points-7 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Aiomon 5 points6 points7 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] -4 points-3 points-2 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]anachronic 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]Drugmule421 -6 points-5 points-4 points 13 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]Aiomon 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]ComeAtMeBrother 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Aiomon1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[+]Drugmule421 -9 points-8 points-7 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Aiomon1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]TheAtomicOption -4 points-3 points-2 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]EmmaBailey 7 points8 points9 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]governmentyard -8 points-7 points-6 points 13 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

[–]Luxieee 15 points16 points17 points 13 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

[–]Coldbeam 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]ComeAtMeBrother -7 points-6 points-5 points 13 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]Luxieee3 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]ComeAtMeBrother-2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Luxieee2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]ComeAtMeBrother0 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Luxieee1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]ComeAtMeBrother1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Luxieee0 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]governmentyard 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]silverionmox 7 points8 points9 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting 4 points5 points6 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]silverionmox 4 points5 points6 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]jtj-H 14 points15 points16 points 13 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

[+][deleted] 13 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]Orimos 6 points7 points8 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Lecks 8 points9 points10 points 13 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting 18 points19 points20 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Lecks-2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]ComeAtMeBrother 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[+][deleted] 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–][deleted]1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Drugmule421 -2 points-1 points0 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]tigonometry 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]DavidByron 17 points18 points19 points 13 years ago (14 children) | Copy Link

[+]Aiomon 13 years ago [recovered] (13 children) | Copy Link

If a women is showing that much of her chest, I doubt it would be acceptable in an office setting either..

[–]mean0dean0 7 points8 points9 points 13 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

[–]whatknockers 7 points8 points9 points 13 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]mean0dean0 -3 points-2 points-1 points 13 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Female with large breasts here. I can't wear the stuff my male coworkers wear to work, at least on the top. Button ups gape (so you can uh see in my shirt) and pull at the buttons, and polos actually draw more attention to them because high necklines make it seem like the breasts take up a larger portion of the chest.

It sounds like you're not actually attempting to wear what your male coworkers wear to work; as a fatter-than-average male, I just buy a larger shirt. Sure, if you want a shirt to accentuate your larger than average breasts, having a shirt that can't even be buttoned up properly may be an issue; but I generally don't find it the case that anyone (including me) wants to accentuate my larger than average gut by trying to wear fitted clothes. The baggier, the better. But then, that's the same difference I've been describing this whole time:

I'm never wearing anything too low cut without extra coverage because I don't want anyone looking down my shirt

I hate to do it, because you sound like a nice person, but I do kind of have to say boo hoo, poor you for your attention-grabbing cleavage. In point of fact, you do want some people looking down your shirt at some point, because you've got an asset perceived as attractive; no guy, unless he is a chiseled muscleman, will ever have the uniquely desirable "burden" of having to fend off attracted onlookers. You say they don't "take you seriously" if they can see your tits; would you rather you had no tits at all, or that you had all the tits you could stand and that no guy ever fucking cared, and if you actually bothered to show off your cleavage, those onlookers would be at best uncaring and at worst actually physically disgusted? When was the last time you saw a 50 year old man's chest hair at work and said "wow, that's some nice old man hair..."? Because there's a secretary where I work who's over 50 now, and she wears v-neck sweaters with tasteful jewelry so that everyone can see her old, wrinkly, freckly, slightly overweight, and still undeniably awesome cleavage. She isn't even all that attractive, but she can be proud of her tits, and from the way she frames them, she is. Are you going to tell me to be proud of my gut, to the extent that I should wear midriff shirts and belly piercings to show how sexy my gut is? Because that's the male body; and I don't think even in your darkest and most self-loathing moments that you'd trade your tits for man-gut. So if you'll excuse me, no, I don't take you seriously for what you've written above.

[–]whatknockers3 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]mean0dean03 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Your post seems very volatile.

What do you think--would that be a code red or a code brown? Either way, my "angst" is not unjustified, and I felt that you were attempting to cloud the issue by saying women's issues are qualitatively different than men's issues because they happen to women. Well, in terms of clothing, you're half-right--women are allowed to wear women's clothing as well as men's clothing and still maintain their social and self-identification as "women." Men can only wear a very restricted amount of socially acceptable clothing and still call themselves "men"--the moment they step even the slightest bit outside that definition, their very gender is questionable, as if they stop being a real person and start becoming an "it." There's a reason "transvestite" and "transgender" are practically synonymous--they both are almost exclusively boundaries that men have to follow. It is functionally redundant to be a female transvestite; a woman can wear everything a man can wear, 365 days a year and still maintain her semblance of self whole and intact. At least in America, and for religious adherents all across the world, men aren't even allowed to keep their genitals intact, let alone their gender, in the face of social requirements that define them and restrict them. If my reaction to that seems "volatile," that's because it fucking is. Would you put up with that shit, in any way, shape, or form, in your own life? No--you'd be shouting to the fucking hills, demanding your right to define what being a woman means on your own terms. So why shouldn't I be shouting for mine?

I see clothing as a visual reminder that I'm not in control of my gender, just as when I look down to pee I see a ring of scar tissue that reminds me that I'm not in control of how my genitals get to look. Society isn't going to help me gain any of that control back; quite the opposite, since social rules for men in the workplace have made men extremely passive for fear of making a "hostile working environment" or even (for fuck's sake) a hostle school environment (girls can have long hair and earrings; boys can't) for the female class, who has the privilege of wearing whatever they damn well please from the wardrobe of socially acceptable clothing. Suit and tie? Sure. Dress and heels? Sure. Pantsuit and power-blouse? Sure. Dun-colored sweater and ill-fitting khakis? Sure--they can even get khakis that are all stretchy and make their asses look good; if I get stretchy khakis, it shows off my penis bulge (not boasting--all stretchy pants make man-bulges) and the very fact of my having a penis and wearing pants where the penis is recognized as existing makes a hostile work environment for others. My body--any part of it--is a hostile element in the workplace. And don't get me started on circumcision; defining how men's genitals should look in infancy is 100% social gender conditioning, and we all just passively accept it, look on as babies' genitals are sliced and diced and fucking applaud Oprah and others for supporting it. That's the way of things. So you'll have to forgive me if I seem to have a bit of ire in my ranting; but if you were hoping to get me to just take my shitty sartorial existence lying down, it's not going to happen.

[–]whatknockers2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]mean0dean04 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

I would say that the different power structures in place between men and women during the mid to late 20th century created an environment where women traded on their sexuality for acceptance, while men traded on their uniformity; a woman's individual body (and body parts, like the open-toed shoe or the v-neck of cleavage) defined her relations with her coworkers (pretty women are always the front-desk/PR people-handlers, because their prettiness is a good image for the company). Men, not having individual bodies themselves, relied on dogged determination and unswerving dedication to the rules to stand out--spending longer at the office, looking more the "ideal" hard-worker (think Patrick Bateman--always sporting his mask of being clean-shaven, well-dressed, well-coifed, etc.) than anybody else, getting the predictable muscle car, taking up the predictable golf habit, etc. Variety of female desire and sexuality led to women being able to essentially "turn on" and "turn off" their charms--more clothing, less charms; less clothing, more charms. That's why the power-suit of the 80's was so garish in comparison to men's suits; unlike the uniform that men were required to wear, women were still operating on an individualized spectrum--the female boss, the woman in the boardroom, etc. In top-level companies this is still the case, but by and large women are already about half of mid-level executives in the business world, so highly aggressive pantsuits have gone out of style in favor of a more moderate (one could say, "feminine") attire, often mixed and taking portions from the male uniform (ties, blazers, pocket squares, etc.).

The problem for me is that men's professional fashion has stagnated; we can't even be the fakey Patrick Batemans of the business world, because more female bosses and fewer high-powered positions mean we're no longer facing such an uphill rat race against an endless stream of similar men. Now, we have to become individuals and show off our social skills (which we were never taught, because boys are socialized differently than girls from infancy to hide their emotions, not show them), express ourselves empathetically in our dress and manner (which means we need to have another kind of dress than a uniform), and we especially need to avoid the hyper-masculinity of the male power-suit exemplified by the "power tie" and its resultant phallic implications. That's where the "hostile working environment" comes in; women have always faced a hostile working environment, because it was a sexualized working environment. Everything about women's professional attire is subtly attuned to a sexualized working environment, from hair and makeup to the fit of slacks (panty lines abound!) and the depth of cleavage. Men, in order to literally make up for past wrongs, cannot mention this to women; we cannot say "your tits are distracting, keep them covered up or you're fired." However, it's entirely within our rights to fire a man simply for not shaving, what should be a completely normal life-choice (beards are biologically normal; every shaven guy in the business world is essentially walking around like people who ritually shave one eyebrow because they think it will make them more productive. It's dumb, but it's what we do.).

I won't say it's one gender's fault or the other that men have had to become people without bodies; but along the whole road of liberation and progress women were on, they divorced their sense of self from their bodies, such that we can talk about the "objectification" of women as if it is a thing, while we have almost no clue about the extent to which we objectify men (for instance, the vast majority of sex toys are essentially disembodied penises, which we are okay with; but disembodied vaginas are apparently "creepy"). We objectify men by their not-being-there, their specific absence, rather than presence. If a man is truly to be a "man" in the professional world, he must have everything on his body covered, from toes to shoulders, and he must be shorn of individual markers of male beauty like beards (yes, beards are beautiful, the way eyebrows are beautiful on a person. Take away the eyebrows of your favorite movie star in photoshop, and they look like aliens; that should be how beardless people look to us... but it isn't) and given no signifiers of personal wealth or attractiveness (jewelry indicating status (except a watch, and then only a certain kind of watch), tattoos indicating individual personality, makeup indicating sexual responsiveness, etc.). He can't even really rely on the old regime, so he can't be well-coifed (barbershops have been on the wane for years, while female-tailored salons have been treating men's hair as a shear-by-numbers tableau--"are you a number 3 with the clippers?" Bzzzzzzzzzzzzz.... and all your hair (and your individuality) goes away, like in the military!); he can't be well-tailored, because there really aren't any mid-range tailors for men's suits. Men's Wearhouse offers suits up to several hundred dollars off the rack with little or no tailoring, and absolutely no variation on the Jacket + Pants regime; anything less than that in the price range is going to be factory made for laying flat. If you don't believe me, take a man's jean pants and a woman's jean pants and lay them flat on a table. You'll see that women's jeans are sewn so as to fit to the woman's body, with the inseam stitched to allow for a wide range of movement; men's jeans are stitched straight, even though we bend at the hips, and the low inseam is stitched actually improperly, according to my seamstress friend, for normal human movement. That's why women can do the splits in their jeans and men can't--our clothing is designed to be convenient for the factory worker, not the wearer. Our t-shirts too; it's an uphill battle just to find properly fitted clothing for men, and even "fitted" is almost always code for "skinny," so overweight folk like myself are simply Shit Outta Luck.

The most I can say about where male professional fashion is at this point is that it is DOA--men are dressing poorer than ever, and we're being treated poorer than ever as a result. 30 years ago, jeans were not acceptable office wear because they were worn by blue collar workers (the "blue" was jean blue, of the jean coveralls that factory workers wore); the white collar attire we have less resembles human fashion and more resembles mannequin fashion, being stitched out of convenient straight lines and flat angles rather than utility or (perish the thought!) the innately desirable contours of the male body, and it is slowly being replaced by attire that is simply shabby--corduroy, jeans, cardigans, non-descript brown shoes (what my dad's generation called "DIBS"--dead in brown shoes). It's not even chic--it's shit. And that's not even getting into men's casual fashion, which more resembles overgrown adolescence than anything progressively masculine. One can only take so many guys in polo shirts and cargo pants before one despairs of the future of male fashion altogether.

[–]pk_atheist1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Aiomon 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]mean0dean0 9 points10 points11 points 13 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

I'm sorry--business casual is "truly stupid"? Not if you want to keep your fucking job. And that's what the above picture is about; if women were forced to cover up just as much as men are in the workplace, they would riot. They would riot in the streets and call their employers shari'a fanatics. Women want equality in the workplace? Fine--cover that shit up, cut off all the hair, take off all the makeup and jewelry, and go to work the way men have to. Otherwise, women get to wear what men cannot, get to enjoy their bodies and their fashion sense in ways men cannot. Men's fashion = dumpy trousers and ill-fitting button-down shirts, all in nauseatingly boring earth tones and poor-quality fabrics. And for "dressing up"? The exact same thing, except in tuxedo format. For all intents and purposes, there is no such thing as men's fashion; there is just the man's uniform. Why should women get to claim "equality" when they can express themselves sartorially in ways men cannot even DARE to approximate, lest they lose their jobs or get publicly humiliated as transvestites? That's not fucking equality, not by a long shot.

[–]spicychildren1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]mean0dean07 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

...variations on the Shirt + Pants + Jacket + Brown fucking Shoes = Uniform. I doubt that /mfa would go in for a stylish male skirtsuit, or some truly masculine do-me pumps. If I wanted to pretend that dressing up like a young, white version of my grandpa or by constantly asking for "fit checks" or even just perusing their basic wardrobe section and think I'm being "fashionable," I'd spend more than the 5 minutes I did perusing that subreddit. I shudder to think what the female version of /mfa would be--a "Donna Reed" check--

apron length?
pearls a centimeter too tight or loose around the neck?
where the only marks of differing opinions are opaque vs. sheen hose and whether you count labor day itself as the day where you must stop wearing white?

Shirt. Pants. Shoes. Jacket. That's it for men's fashion. Sure, there's a watch sometimes, a pocket square other times, and ooh! a tie! Even trained monkeys wear ties. I'd rather wear earrings and a dress, but that would make me a freak, wouldn't it? I'd love it if women were considered dangerous freaks for wearing anything even remotely male. That would be hilarious.

[–]RobotBuddha3 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]gregnog 6 points7 points8 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]ScullyNess 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Dynisis 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[+]mean0dean0 13 years ago [recovered] (4 children) | Copy Link

...because the rest of us are just suffocating in our irrationality? I'm sorry, but when was the last time you saw a business skirtsuit made for a man? When was the last time that men were allowed to bear their chest hair with appropriate decolletage so as to seem both sexy and conservative in the workplace? When have you seen male executives with well-coifed long hair, earrings, and other tasteful jewelry? When was the last time you saw a male office worker's open-toed wingtip?

Let's face it--if women were forced to cover up in the workplace as much as men, to shave their heads down to nubs of hair and scrub all makeup from their faces, to give up all their jewelry, accessories, fine silk chemises and heels, and wear just as much clothing as their male counterparts, they would fucking riot.

[–]Dynisis 4 points5 points6 points 13 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[+]mean0dean0 13 years ago [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

Now who's being irrational? The fact is that the comic is questioning what is considered "appropriate" in the workplace, and noting that women and men think nothing of women exposing their bodies to view without any sense of shame or indecency, whereas if a man did the same thing, it would be considered shameful or even disgusting.

And don't give me the "penises are different than cleavage" garbage; if you were awake in high school history, you'd know that codpieces were the height of men's fashion for several hundred years--men's "cleavage," if you will. So not only does the comic have a rhetorically persuasive statement to make, it has ample historical relevance. So unless you're going to repeat yourself again for the third time without any evidence to prove your point about the comic's "ridiculousness," maybe you should listen and think about the subject a bit more before betraying your ignorance of the subject by trying to talk about it..

[+]pk_atheist 13 years ago* [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

I appreciate the fight here- I think maybe this entire thread was raided by twox or something.

[–]mean0dean01 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Craysh 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]sirhotalot 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Stephen_Morgan 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]DavidNatan -2 points-1 points0 points 13 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

[–]lacychenault 18 points19 points20 points 13 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]FriendlyVisitor 5 points6 points7 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting 6 points7 points8 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]dildospandex 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]forever_stalone 8 points9 points10 points 13 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]anachronic 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]dildospandex 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]anachronic 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]dildospandex1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]horses_around -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]Aiomon -3 points-2 points-1 points 13 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]anachronic 3 points4 points5 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Drugmule421 -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]anachronic -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Moment_of_Truth -2 points-1 points0 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]ExpendableOne -5 points-4 points-3 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

No one would ever actually complain about, let alone arrest or convict a woman for showing her vagina and, to say that breasts don't have some kind of sexual significance, especially in cultural environments that completely sexualize breasts, isn't really all that accurate either(there are entire industries, if not pretty consistently all around the world, that make a lot of money off of the sexual appeal both men and women have for female breasts). Sure, there are places where naked breasts aren't a big deal and perfectly legal, and that's great, but that doesn't mean that there's nothing inherently sexual about them either or that they're just the same as male pecs/inert chest. Regardless, the problem here really isn't "what is sexual and what isn't", it's how people react to those sexual organs. Nobody should be getting offended, scared or disgusted by a penis, just like they shouldn't be feeling that way about a woman's breasts or vagina.

[–]Aiomon 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]maetrix2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[+]RageLife -8 points-7 points-6 points 13 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]ejp1082 42 points43 points44 points 13 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

[–]DanglyAnteater 14 points15 points16 points 13 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]ahipikr 4 points5 points6 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Stratisphear 5 points6 points7 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]danthemango 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]anachronic 9 points10 points11 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]pk_atheist 13 years ago* [recovered] (4 children) | Copy Link

Well I think the double standard here is more about how women are offended when you see what they're putting out there, and then they're also offended if they see what you put out there.

[–]slow56k 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]pk_atheist2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]pk_atheist1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[+]Drugmule421 -8 points-7 points-6 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]dalsgaard 71 points72 points73 points 13 years ago (48 children) | Copy Link

[–]ejp1082 65 points66 points67 points 13 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Male sexuality is often considered disgusting, perverted, dirty and creepy. I don't understand why to be honest.

Well, it's complicated, emerging from both sociocultural factors and probably a little bit of evolutionary psychology. Basically, there's gender roles. You're fine as long as you stay within accepted norms for them. Venture outside of them and you get in trouble though. Like, I'd point out that not all of male sexuality is taboo. Public display of alpha male traits, for example, is a multi billion dollar form of entertainment. And on the female side of the coin their sexuality isn't exactly universally appreciated. Any woman who's too fat or too old pretty quickly gets met with words like "disgusting". Plus there's still a lot of slut shaming that goes on - it's sort of acceptable for a woman to show skin, but it comes at a high social cost to her.

It's true enough that the male body (and genitals especially) is generally viewed as either threatening, creepy, or gross, depending on the context and audience. Simply it's because women (for either evolutionary or sociological reasons) are more attracted to a man's social status than his physical features. The only group that does appreciate male beauty is homosexuals, but that still elicits a lot of homophobic reactions from straight people.

What's frustrating is I feel like it's a topic where everyone just talks past each other. I can appreciate how a beautiful woman would get frustrated being objectified and getting unwanted attention all the time. But a woman who experiences that can't seem to imagine that there are guys (and other women) who'd love to feel that. You have women who just can't get her head around why guys are so into seeing her chest, because she's not visually stimulated like that. You have guys who can't quite fathom why women aren't into seeing their penis, since they get turned on by women's bodies and assume women must feel the same about men's bodies. And there's not a lot of cultural conversation about that disconnect.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]ejp1082 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It's probably where we're headed. As someone else noted below, we evolved (culturally and genetically) in a world where the costs of of having sex were almost entirely born by women and not by men. Consequently women traditionally had to be very discriminating when it came to sex as a matter of survival, and explains why a male signalling his sexual desire would be seen as threatening.

But that all changed with the introduction of cheap effective birth control for women in the 60's. Social norms take a good long while to change so we've still got a ways to go, but it's self evident that the world in the 2010's is already much more sex positive than the world in the 1950's. Women feel a lot more free now to explore their sexuality and enjoy sex than they did then, and society has loosened up its judgment of women who do.

Men, I think, have benefited from this too - because women can afford to be less discriminating, men have an easier time getting access to sex. They can also discuss fetishes and other things they enjoy sexually more openly with their partners - things that were previously "creepy" aren't anymore.

Of course things aren't perfect - women are still slut shamed, sexual taboo's abound, some men still have no concept of appropriate respectful behavior around a woman, some women are still profoundly uncomfortable with their own sexuality let alone that of their partners. But the trendline is pretty clear. Give it another half century and men and women will likely have met in the middle somewhere with regards to sex.

[–]dalsgaard 11 points12 points13 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]sirhotalot 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]jtj-H -4 points-3 points-2 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Phlexonance 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]ContentEnt 28 points29 points30 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]shoegazer666 -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]lethalweapon100 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Norton_cabal 12 points13 points14 points 13 years ago* (5 children) | Copy Link

There is this unspoken rule that male sexuality does not belong into the public. Clothing is only one aspect of this. I know the sexual preferences, what they value in a sexual/romantic partner, what actors they find super hot, what porn they watch etc. from most female friends. From my male friends I know nothing. Not even if they ever had sex(except for the fact that some of them are in a relationship) not if they prefer blondes or redheads, not if they ever thought that an actress is hot or if they had a secret crush etc. I have no fucking idea if this is normal, because in the imagination of feminists we should be constantly objectifiying women.

Women are openly doing that all the time but everytime a man does that he is shamed. Just a few weeks ago I went camping with a couple of people. The women openly talked about very sexual stuff. If they prefer taller guys(ofcourse they do. Guys have to be at least 1 inch taller orthey are not real men) what hairstyle is okay, what they think about penis size, and who is the hottest actor stuff like that. And every men just sat there in complete silence because it was so empowering to the women(I actually think that it is and that its the way it should be that everyone should be free to talk about sexuality) but the closest the men got to discussing their sexuality openly was that someone brought some nuts to eat and said "Hey, nuts" which prompted 2 of the girls to shame him "Yeah thats so typical of men, always thinking of sex", and the discussion was suddenly about how oversexual men are. I realy thought I was camping in bizarro world, but then I realized that this is actually so pervasive that I'm constantly censoring myself because I dont want to be "that guy".

[–]InfinitelyThirsting 4 points5 points6 points 13 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]Norton_cabal 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Drugmule421 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]icallmyselfmonster 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Seacrest_Hulk 7 points8 points9 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]dalsgaard 4 points5 points6 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Seacrest_Hulk 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]icallmyselfmonster 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Aaod 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]rebelevenmusic 13 years ago* [recovered] (26 children) | Copy Link

Also, Dude, "a homosexual" is not the preferred nomenclature. "Someone who was homosexual" please.

EDIT: Who knew warning someone of potential offensiveness through a Lebowski quote could piss off a bunch of MRA's. We should be the type of people that are sensitive to things like this. We bitch and complain when women objectify us and then when it's in different context act like we are in middle school again. You guys let me down.

[–]ErasmusMRA 6 points7 points8 points 13 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

[+]rebelevenmusic 13 years ago [recovered] (9 children) | Copy Link

As told to me "I am not a transgender, I am transgendered. It should not define who I am, just as you are not a "straight"."

[–]absolutedesignz 15 points16 points17 points 13 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[+]rebelevenmusic 13 years ago [recovered] (4 children) | Copy Link

Surely there is someone who is LGBT that can help clarify this.

[–]Eryemil18 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]BromineOxygen5 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]rebelevenmusic2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Coldbeam2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]DiscreteOpinion 8 points9 points10 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]conan936 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Eryemil 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]InflatableTomato 8 points9 points10 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]dalsgaard 4 points5 points6 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+][deleted] 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]EdgarAllenNope -4 points-3 points-2 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[+]dalsgaard -7 points-6 points-5 points 13 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

[+]rebelevenmusic 13 years ago [recovered] (8 children) | Copy Link

I'm glad you got it I was worried I would just sound like a dick, also I'm not even sure if this is a thing. But a friend of mine once told me labeling someone as a homosexual or a transgender objectifies them. Any consensus on this?

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 13 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[+]rebelevenmusic 13 years ago [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

Yeah it is like that. As in "I read an article written by a black". I'm not saying its inherently wrong, just socially sensitive.

[–]aeauvian2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]rebelevenmusic-1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]DiscreteOpinion 4 points5 points6 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Eryemil 6 points7 points8 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[+]rebelevenmusic 13 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

This is the attitude that confuses me in a subreddit like this.

[–]Eryemil5 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]HPeroit 8 points9 points10 points 13 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]anachronic 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]HPeroit -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

id put them on the same plane myself, but the reason I think this is worse is that it is just an image and that it occupies the number one spot. A comment by a divorced guy talking about the evils of having a vagina isn't that big of a deal when it occupies the middle of a comment thread for a very MR-relevant article (the stupid ones don't typically take the front page). It is easy to dismiss those comments. It is hard for us to say "we stand for very important issues" when people see this on our front page. I get that it is saying we demonize male sexuality while we worship female sexuality. I agree with this as well. I also like how the comic is very simplified. I feel, however, that the comic could be over-simplified for people that are not familiar with what issues we gravitate around and for what reasons. "oh those MRAs just wanna walk around with their dicks out" could be just around the corner (you know what I mean). /$0.02

[–]anachronic 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]pk_atheist1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[+][deleted] 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]salami_inferno 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]i84 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Drugmule421 5 points6 points7 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Kentuckyless 25 points26 points27 points 13 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]anachronic 9 points10 points11 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]RageLife 18 points19 points20 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Kentuckyless 12 points13 points14 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]anachronic 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]ether_reddit 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Nepene 8 points9 points10 points 13 years ago* (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]farfigneugan 6 points7 points8 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Nepene 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]anachronic -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]Nepene -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]anachronic 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Nepene 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]anachronic 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]i84 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]damn_it_so_much 5 points6 points7 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]misingnoglic 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Zarobeck 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Heterohabilis 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]horses_around 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]XDingoX83 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]takatori 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Aiomon 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]dildospandex 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]SenorSpicyBeans 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]forever_stalone 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]TiddBits1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]hispters -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]roadhand -4 points-3 points-2 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting 7 points8 points9 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]roadhand 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]pk_atheist 13 years ago* [recovered] (51 children) | Copy Link

The double standard here is interesting, because I bet if I showed that much of my pelvis, I would be arrested. Simultaneously, cleavage up to the nipples is just fine.

[–]Grapeban 39 points40 points41 points 13 years ago (46 children) | Copy Link

[–]IchBinEinHamburger 5 points6 points7 points 13 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]Jkay064 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]roadhand 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]IchBinEinHamburger 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]AceCake 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Curebores 5 points6 points7 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]753861429-951843627 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

If you want to talk about double standards, consider that it's perfectly acceptable for you to take your shirt off in public, but not women.

That's also a ridiculous comparison. Breasts are sexualised¹ and can not be simply equivocate with the non-sexualised male chest. And in some ways, showing a lot of cleavage is worse than toplessness as such, because cleavage is a willful emphasising of the sexual aspect of breasts. Women wear clothes that are especially made so that they show more breast. Male shirts don't have deep v-necks precisely because the male chest isn't sexualised and there is no sense in emphasising it.

1: No, it is not relevant that there are cultures where breasts aren't or are only to a small degree sexualised. We don't live in those cultures. I'll give you an example before this becomes a wildly discussed issue, because I'm actually quite tired of this argument: Where I live, swastikas can not be publically displayed outside of art or education. Somebody with a swastika armband will get in trouble because my culture does not condone swastikas. It doesn't matter that elsewhere people associate swastikas with Jainism or Hinduism, because such is not the case here. It does not matter that swastikas are not in themselves evil. In my cultural context, they represent evil.

[–]InfinitelyThirsting 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]753861429-951843627 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Pecanpig 3 points4 points5 points 13 years ago (26 children) | Copy Link

[–]DiscreteOpinion 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

[–]Pecanpig 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting 6 points7 points8 points 13 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

[–]Pecanpig0 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Luxieee5 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Pecanpig-1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Luxieee4 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Pecanpig1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Luxieee1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Are you kidding me? I don't think everyone is sexist just because they disagree with me. I think everyone is sexist who is sexist. I'm in /r/mensrights, I'm subscribed to this subreddit, I'm very open minded about the struggles men face that a good portion of the world refuses to recognize.

Have your own opinion about when/where a woman can/should breastfeed, I don't care. But don't try to impose that on any woman, as it's not your place to do. As long as you're not trying to force your opinion on my body, we're good. Even though I still think your opinion is sexist as hell.

Just like it'd be sexist for me to say, "I think men should be able to cry, just not in public where anyone can see them do it. In private." That's sexist and stupid, but still an opinion anyone is free to have. It's also sexist and stupid to say, "Women can breastfeed, just it should be in private and it should be modestly." Is this 1950 again? And do you seriously think that a woman wants to flop her boob around while she's breastfeeding "because she can?"
And what part of breastfeeding is acting indecently, I wonder?

And you're right, men don't have prominent breasts but I fail to see why that even has any significance? Women are just as attracted to a nice set of pectorals as men are to a nice rack of breasts. But society doesn't ever see it that way. It's always, "But breasts are sexualized, they need to be hidden, man-chests aren't, so we can flaunt them." They only are sexualized because society insists we keep them hidden. Male chests are just as sexualized to us, but we learn to see it as 'normal' because we see them everywhere, because it's legal and normal for a man to do so, but taboo and usually illegal for a woman. Our one thing is breastfeeding. We actually need to use our breasts for that, in public, and anywhere, but even that is culturally shunned to do anywhere but your home. It's absolutely absurd.

[–]Pecanpig1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Warning, NAWALT ALERT.

Imposing on someone's body would mean stopping them from doing something, I'm not suggesting that.

Crying is an involuntary bodily response to a host of emotions and sensations, comparing it to breastfeeding is absurd, you may as well compare crapping. It's fine to do, just not in public where people can see you. Yes there are women like that, lots and lots and lots of them, just because you do not think of yourself as one of them doesn't mean shit all. 1950 was a better time than now, from a social standpoint anyways.

I call bullshit, women's aren't as attracted to anything as we are to anything even remotely female. Male chests are not nearly as sexual to women, if that were the case then I suspect there would be allot more staring and changing of underwear. Breastfeeding in public is fine, so long as you aren't an idiot about it.

[–]Luxieee0 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Are you a woman? No? I am. I don't think you're exactly able to tell ME what we do and do not feel. In fact, it's another sexist thing to say, "Women can never feel the kind of passion we feel for breasts, there's nothing comparable so those feelings are closed off." Hohoho no. No no and no. Do you jizz in your pants from seeing a nice pair of boobs on the beach? Likewise as a woman even when fully aroused I have never soaked through panties. Getting moist on the other hand, you'd never know, and that's how womens genitalia responds to arousal. Moistness. We don't gush ourselves (well, a few women do, upon orgasm). Sir, you have no right to tell me what women do or do not feel. You are free to speak on behalf of men, as you have done, but not women. That's my place in the conversation, and I'm pretty sure I am more knowledgeable about females than you are.

Back to breastfeeding. It is called a comparison for a reason. It's not the same. I'm sure you could compare bfing with anything, but I compared it with something that would drive home my point. In truth, there's nothing biologically similar for a man as bfing is for a woman. It's not pooping or peeing, it's feeding your young, and humans have no problem with seeing animals do it... just other humans. Whether this is from shame of the female form, or oversexualization of breasts and thusly seeing a woman use them for something besides sex making men uncomfortable, I'm not sure. What I am sure of is my bodily right to feed my child anywhere she needs fed. Luckily, the law recognizes this right and protects my ability to do so in any public venue.

As for the 1950's, I'm quite sure it was a better time socially, for men. On my side of the gender line, I think we'll stick with 2012. We have a long way to go before we achieve true equality... for women and men, but I hope it's something we're all working on.

[–]Pecanpig1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

I don't care how you feel. Again, you are misusing the word sexist, and yes that has been the general conclusion of anyone who observed human behaviour, while of course we cannot actually make any solid conclusions just due to the fact that no single person can really feel attraction one way but both ways. You are comparing orgasm to arousal, while the two are related they are most certainly different things, I never said you would have orgasms from seeing a guys chest, I simply meant that if you were nearly as aroused from seeing a mans chest as I am from seeing a woman's breasts that that it would be observable, arousal is a bodily response, not an emotion. Nobody gets to speak on behalf of half the human race.

True there is no direct analog, but the closest comparison would probably be taking a crap. humans also have no problem watching animals have sex or shit in public, again, flawed comparison. It's because breasts are sexualized, not over sexualized, it's just annoying to people (nice try with that one though). Tell me when you need to feed your child in a starbucks? in what situation would feeding your child in another location simply not be feesable? The law can go fuck itself, Justice > Law.

I think the 1950's were a better time for everyone, not necessarily men since men still had oodles of responsibility, but at least being a husband and father was respected. The genders were far more equal in the 50's compared to now, hell the genders were far more equal in 1064 then they are now.

And it seems most women agree with me that the 50's were a better time, women sure seemed happier then and women who married then (my grandparents for example) seem far happier than most coupes now days.

[–]Luxieee1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Pecanpig1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Grapeban 15 points16 points17 points 13 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

[–]Phlexonance 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Pecanpig -3 points-2 points-1 points 13 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

[–]AceCake 9 points10 points11 points 13 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

[–]Pecanpig3 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]AceCake6 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Pecanpig1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]AceCake2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Pecanpig0 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]AloysiusC1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Pecanpig1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Phlexonance 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Gingor 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting 5 points6 points7 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]DiscreteOpinion 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]AloysiusC 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]InfinitelyThirsting 1 point2 points3 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]DavidNatan -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]SeriousMoad 2 points3 points4 points 13 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]christofur -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]horses_around -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]AloysiusC -2 points-1 points0 points 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]diarrheadump -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]notaliveiam -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]junkeee999 -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]motchmaster -1 points0 points1 point 13 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Title	I'd like to try this without getting arrested
Author	pk_atheist
Upvotes	964
Comments	318
Date	November 3, 2012 2:10 PM UTC (13 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/12kbfy/id_like_to_try_this_without_getting_arrested/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/id-like-to-try-this-without-getting-arrested.1009975 https://theredarchive.com/post/1009975

Comments