Nice guys are just assholes who felt obligated to be nice to get pussy.

classicslayer · 2024-12-13T16:07:14+00:00

This whole nice guy paradox is quite frankly a waste of time. The truth is that it's just a term women came up with to justify why don't find a certain type of man attractive by trying to psychoanalyze people they don't know.

neofau · 2024-12-13T17:15:34+00:00

I think the one of the biggest things that radicalized/persuaded men to join the manosphere in general (specifically red pill/black pill) OR at least become aware of it, is this idea that guys were RAISED with this mindset of being a gentlemen (and other arcahic gender norms) often tied with generosity and niceness. Only to be given a reality check that the gentlemen/niceness mentality is extremely counterproductive and unattractive for the most part. Guys who were raised to be gentleman were being rejected for guys who were the exact opposite, and im not just talking about guys that were just confident and successful and labeled as assholes, I am talking about the gentlemen being rejected for the abusers, bullies, gang members, and drug dealers and if you pointed out this observation you were a "fake nice guy" and an asshole all along. I gurantee you if u want to create more red/black pillers keep making posts like this.

DietTyrone · 2024-12-14T02:15:09+00:00

These "true nice guy" posts are so pointless because women themselves on PPD have admitted that niceness by itself isn't an attractive triat that going to make their panties moist. So it doesn't matter if you're a real nice guy, fake nice guy, or any other kind of nice guy, it's not going to make you desirable or get you laid either way.

And we know being an asshole doesn't prevent men from getting laid, so it's an irrelevant metric.

caption291 · 2024-12-13T14:31:56+00:00

The idea that you're not actually nice if you have any desires for yourself is nonsense.

Doing something good and getting worse outcomes than someone doing something bad isn't going to feel great regardless of if you're pretending to be nice or actually nice.

I think a lot of people push such a ridiculous idea of what niceness looks like because they are trying to justify why they aren't nice/aren't attracted to niceness and by moving the goalpost of what counts as niceness well past reason they get to claim that no one is nice but also that they are closer to true niceness because truly nice people don't complain about unfairness like them.

There's also a typical "complaining about my actions makes you the bad guy" bs.

Main_Aside_3072 · 2024-12-13T18:33:50+00:00

This again?

Being nice has nothing/little to do with your success with women, that's why every women you've ever meet has a "ex-boyfriend was an asshole" story and that's why whenever a women is murderer the husband is always the first suspect.

So yeah, for men: You being nice does not mean more women will find you attractive, you need to work on other things that matter: Personality, sense of humor, physical appereance.

For women: That guy you find attractive may very well be an asshole or not, that's completely irrelevant to you find him attractive.

So there, everybody gets slightly annoyed by the truth.

topforce · 2024-12-13T20:25:24+00:00

Remember, being a good person should be seen as rewarding in itself. If youre only nice in hopes of treats, youre not really nice.

You just want to hook up with with Jesus. For us mere mortals relationships are reciprocal in nature. If someone extends you a hand and you take a shit in it, they won't be happy about it.

ArtifactFan65 · 2024-12-13T18:31:39+00:00

There are no good men or women and every woman is attracted to assholes. Morals don't matter when it comes to dating. It's naive to believe otherwise.

Not only is being a terrible person not a deal breaker, selfishness and dark triad traits like psychopathy are highly attractive to women because they increase your perceived masculinity.

Nice guys are just submissive men. So yes often they are just nice to avoid trouble and appeal to others, I agree with that. They will also become abusive if they don't get what they want just like the dark triad ESTP guy etc.

MetalHead794 · 2024-12-13T15:27:49+00:00

You really need to hate men and to be misandrist to say that nice guys that are just nice don’t exist.

Clean-Luck6428 · 2024-12-13T18:34:41+00:00

By the same token women who want men to “give without expectation of reciprocation” are not good people to be in relationships with and if you give them an inch they’ll take a mile.

Tit for tat has no place in a relationship, but respect, appreciation and giving still is.

nnuunn · 2024-12-13T15:10:45+00:00

Then why do nice guys finish last? If nice guys were actually bad people, they wouldn't finish at all.

RelevantJackWhite · 2024-12-13T20:21:48+00:00

I think you're sorta right but you have effect and cause backwards.

Many "nice guys" don't really want many women, they just want one and they want to do the right things to make that happen. They have been misinformed about what the right thing is to do, or they have decided this based on media. Then they try it and when it fails, they get frustrated that it doesn't happen for them. This becomes rage toward whoever most recently rejected them. It felt like a waste of time and effort because all these rejections have built up anger and stress. They don't have strong social skills, role models or maturity, so they don't realize that:

It doesn't work like that
The woman who just rejected you is fully unaware of your past and does not deserve your vitriol, because she didn't cause any of his other rejections
It's time to re-evaluate your tactics

I have known nice guys before, and I don't think many of them are intentionally assholes. They have a poor handle on their emotions

just_a_place · 2024-12-14T08:24:26+00:00

Nah... from what I have been observing I can tell most genuinely "nice men" are just effeminate men who are still sexually attracted to women, and are unable to attract them. Just as masculine ass women are unable to attract men.

mobjack · 2024-12-13T14:31:15+00:00

Some people are natural people pleasers.

They aren't just putting on an act to get pussy. They are "nice" to both men and women.

Over time, resentment can build up which leads to hidden asshole behaviors.

Key_Spread_3422 · 2024-12-13T20:12:26+00:00

Dating is purely a numbers game

No_Sun_658 · 2024-12-14T13:37:40+00:00

If what you say is true, we wouldn't have so many single mothers.

Zabadoodude · 2024-12-13T16:07:03+00:00

"Nice guy" has become just a caricature of a cowardly asshole hiding behind a thin facade of politeness.

There are genuinely nice guys that struggle too, though. It's not unreasonable for them to feel frustrated that the values they've been taught and sincerely embraced lead to poorer outcomes. They weren't doing it to get a reward, but they weren't expecting to get punished for it either. The truth is that people that push for what they want will get it more often. Whether that's stabbing a business partner in the back or risking making a woman uncomfortable by making a move.

Tren_troll · 2024-12-13T14:16:24+00:00

Remember, being a good person should be seen as rewarding in itself.

So being nice is essentially playing on hard mode since you are expected to be altruistic and prioritize others' well-being over your own interests, with no tangible benefit to yourself.

It's hard enough out there as it is. I don't think that many people can afford this added challenge. If being a good person is helpful for society at large, being a good person should be incentivized.

you_are_a_femcel · 2024-12-13T14:06:46+00:00

Why do you always make threads berating men? You say that you aren't a misandrist but where is the same vitriol for women? Why don't you talk about them as well? Are you biased? Do you just don't care?

-angels-fanatic- · 2024-12-13T19:35:40+00:00

This is such bullshit.

Most nice guys are legitimately nice guys that would do anything from any girls around him.

A guy being a doormat to women is one of the biggest turn offs a woman can have. Women fucking need a man that won’t cave to her every whim, aka a man that will pass her shit tests.

Does a nice guy get frustrated when the girls he orbits tells him that “he’s, like, the perfect guy and some girl is going to be soooooooo lucky to land him…….. just not me”?? Of fucking course he is!!

Being frustrated doesn’t automatically make a guy a misogynistic asshole.

Dertross · 2024-12-13T15:06:54+00:00

There is overwhelming evidence that dark triad traits lead to increased sexual success. There is little reason to believe that "Nice Guys" only pretend to be nice. And even if they were, such manipulative behavior ought to increase their sexual success.

In addition, nice guys are called assholes for a specific reason and not for general behavior. It is unlikely nice guys are assholes, rather than a specific event leading to a specific response. It's absurd to assert that someone who got into a fight once is just as competitive as someone who frequently gets into fights.

Similarly, just because a "nice guy" reacts to a specific situation of being rejected by women with negativity doesn't make them an asshole or a bad person. It is entirely normal and healthy to react with negativity to rejection.

John_Oakman · 2024-12-13T16:52:58+00:00

If genuine moral virtues are wholly independent of worldly/material results, what's preventing the genuinely morally virtuous from being exploited by the rest of society?

FrameWorried8852 · 2024-12-13T16:59:32+00:00

Every man feels obligated to be nice for pussy, full stop. If being nice didn't get me preferential treatment, then I, and human society wouldn't even think to practice such. We don't live in a society of martyrdom.

BlackRichard420 · 2024-12-14T23:22:34+00:00

Women never date guys who are nice to them. That is why they all have an evil ex bf or a ex husband who was abusive.

bluestjuice · 2024-12-13T15:43:52+00:00

So in Sondheim’s Into the Woods the Witch has a great line that I think about a lot:

”You’re so nice. You’re not good, you’re not bad, you’re just nice.”

‘Nice’ isn’t a moral quality, it’s a mannerism. You can be gruff and abrasive but be doing fundamentally good things; you can smile sweetly while stripping someone of their rights, and every other possible permutation.

Being nice is probably generally pro-social, since pleasant mannerisms are good interpersonal lubricant, but a lot of other factors go into whether people actually like you, are attracted to you, think you’re a good person, and so on.

I’m sure not all nice guys are resentful assholes, though becoming resentful and angry about women could fall into that bucket. No reason to assume the resentment and assholeness were necessarily there beforehand, though.

EdwardTheeMasterful · 2024-12-13T15:54:33+00:00

So I mean uhh were they supposed to be mean guys and then feel obligated to get pussy like some guys do? Plenty of bullies and jerks out there with girlfriends and rotations that are "rewarded" per se . Nice girls get dick. Right?

When you want a promotion from your boss or raise.. In addition to work ethic and demonstration of reliability is it better to be nice to your boss or aloof to the boss?

OfficialHaroldHolt · 2024-12-13T14:26:33+00:00

Nice guys don't get pussy because they don't add anything outside of being nice, it has nothing to do with them being assholes, it's because they're all bread no butter outside of the basic common decency of being nice, the niceness is the fundamental core of their personality, well, feigned niceness, they have nothing else to offer.

That's why they don't succeed.

BearSpray007 · 2024-12-13T15:59:41+00:00

…Again, I don’t know If you are INTENTIONALLY leaving out the parts of the argument that makes men seem I dunno…reasonable…human…NOT complete assholes…or if you’re just an autist with terrible social instincts, but your argument (AS USUAL) is suspiciously inaccurate.

I’m addressing your claim that “doing good things is its own reward” and or “a good person is one who is willing to do for others while not expecting anything in return”. Now that is TRUE but incomplete. And when you intentionally tell a half truth, you’re basically lying.

On the individual level a good person is generally willing to do good for the sake of doing good, and will do good without expecting an IMMEDIATE return. This tends to function WITHIN a social group of individuals who share this mentally. So from the individual level it SEEMS altruistic, but what is ACTUALLY occurring is an eco-system of reciprocal good deeds. You have systems where EVERYONE is giving and receiving in equal measure.

Now this doesn’t mean that every transaction is even, there may be times when one gives gives gives and doesn’t receive, and that same individual may receive receive receive and not give. But you ultimately break even and everyone is giving and receiving in equal measure. The Natural and INTUITIVE state of being therefore is reciprocation of good deeds.

Now to bring it to the topic of this sub…a man who feels bad or hurt because his attempts to be “nice” and/or his attempts at good deeds are spurned is NOT necessarily a bad person acting on false pretenses, he is not reacting from a sense of feeling entitled to a woman’s affection.

He is reacting naturally to the perception of an imbalance in the relationship, to a perceived lack of…let’s hear it…RECIPROCITY!!. His hurt feeling are justified, and make sense.

And no a “nice guy” doesn’t WANT to be an asshole fuckboy he’s just a guy who unfortunately is lacking the “edge” that women tend to find attractive.

rustlerhuskyjeans · 2024-12-13T16:42:15+00:00

Average women date and have casual relationships with above average men, they won't with average guys. Average guys find it very difficult to have casual relationships with average women. The nice guys are calling the above average guys assholes because they treat that woman like an option, but she tries with him anyway. Average single guys are tired of getting left out of the dating market while watching average single girls date whenever they want. Average single men deal with loneliness, average single women do it voluntarily.

Dangerous_Unit_1238 · 2024-12-13T21:32:25+00:00

Nice guys put on performances to be the part they think women want them to play.

I don't know if these guys are 'assholes' as opposed to spineless simps. They are the guys that don't have the balls to make a move romantically or sexually with women so they just stand pat and 'be nice' hoping that she will show interest and make a move for him. These men will find out that this almost never happens.

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LillthOfBabylon · 2024-12-13T18:08:27+00:00

Okay then let’s be honest. You need to do certain things that are “wrong” or “ungentlemanly” to get a girls attention and take things to a romantic or sexual place.

Efficient-Baker1694 · 2024-12-13T18:18:42+00:00

Quick question for you OP: What is a good person and can you give me examples of people who are a good person?

2024-12-15T19:41:38+00:00

There is be nothing as a truly nice guy.

Every "trueky" nice guy(me atleast) has been backstabbed by both men and women enough times to know you cannot be nice to everyone. You have to look out for yourself abd choose who to be nice to.

If a person is helping someobe who clearly wont have his back in rough times is not nice, he eother gas a motive or is just not experienced enough in life.

Kanenas_T_Potas · 2024-12-17T02:48:12+00:00

That's not what the guy who coined the term says about nice guys. I do get your logic (a guy who is pretending to be nice while deep down he's an asshole), but the issue is that the Nice Guy syndrome doesn't really work like that.

Robert Glover, who wrote a book about it basically says that the Nice guy is actually a guy who was "conditioned" to please people, put other's needs before his own and avoid accountability for his flaws and bad behaviour because he was taught/ actively thinks that there is something inherently hideous about his needs and his flaws.

These people are generally taught that putting themselves first is bad, and generally feel entitled to sex, love, affection and validation because they think that putting other people before them IS the right thing to do in every circumstance.

They believe they SHOULD get rewarded for neglecting themselves and putting others first. They are not pretending to be nice, they just think that it's on other people to meet their needs because they themselves neglect their own needs to meet other people's needs.

As most healthy individuals tend to look out for themselves and fulfill their needs on their own in healthy ways, the Nice guys become resentful, mainly for two reasons:

They actively hide their own flaws and bad behaviours instead of owning them up, and end up believing their lie (which makes them believe they are better than the guy beside him).
They believe that, as they are going out of their way to fulfill another person's needs that person should do exactly the same thing for them. Glover calls that covert contracts, where the Nice guy expects to get his needs met by neglecting himself and pleasing others.

You do have a point when you say that most women will go for a guy who either has looks, money or personality (or a mixture of the three), but cultivating at least one of those requires a tiny bit of self esteem and also a bit of fulfillment of one's own needs independently of others. The Nice guy lacks this not because he is pretending to be nice, but rather because he has a flawed idea of what being a truly kind individual means.

Werevulvi · 2024-12-13T15:34:40+00:00

Yeah there seems to be some kinda confusion between men who are nice because they want other people to feel good, they want to be helpful and supportive and they have genuine empathy - and men who only act nice to get pussy, but as soon as the woman says or does anything they don't like they start name calling her and being nasty.

Like I dunno if it's clear that Nice Guys (tm) is not the same as genuinely kind men. It's kinda tiring when it's brought up over and over that "women don't want the nice guy, they want the bad boy" when we say we don't want an asshole who's just pretending to be nice. I dunno it's some kinda deflection? Because of course I want to date a man who genuinely cares about other people's well-being and treats other people the way he wants to be treated.

Of course it's normal to get angry on occasion, we all do, but if you completely lose your shit over your date being late due to ending up in a car crash or her pet died, or you call her a wh*re for not being a virgin, you aren't actually a nice person.

The "nice guy" is a trope, of assholes who are self-proclaimed "nice," not an actual description.

ConstantCode8637 · 2024-12-13T19:33:07+00:00

When a guy refers to himself as a "nice person", you know he really isn't, because who in this world, man or woman, says that about themselves?

child0light · 2024-12-13T21:02:40+00:00

I think we're talking about the people who slap the "nice guy" label on themselves, and not "genuinely nice people". It's like, if you tell someone "I'm funny" or "I'm smart", you're probably not funny. You're probably not smart. If you have to tell me you are something, you're not.

I agree.

Wide-Illustrator2906 · 2024-12-14T01:06:59+00:00

Nice guys are trying to supplement their lack of attractiveness with niceness and women know this .The truth is that if these men were attractive they wouldn't be nice at all.

missmireya · 2024-12-13T21:44:22+00:00

If I had been smart back when I was a young girl, I would have used every single one of those "nice guys" and been rich before hitting my 25th birthday. Drain their funds, just like they were hellbent trying to drain their balls.

Lets be real, those so-called nice guys just want sex. They were only trying to use me because I was a young, timid, pretty girl. Luckily I shut that shit down. But had I used them right back- They would have deserved it, tenfold.

Downvote away.

Title	Nice guys are just assholes who felt obligated to be nice to get pussy.
Author	LillthOfBabylon
Upvotes	0
Comments	247
Date	December 13, 2024 2:05 PM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1hdcwp7/nice_guys_are_just_assholes_who_felt_obligated_to/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/nice-guys-are-just-assholes-who-felt-obligated-to.1538372 https://theredarchive.com/post/1538372

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