Let's talk about Aziz.

Jewdius_Maximus · 2018-01-15T18:38:51+00:00

This has to be the bullshittiest of bullshit claims. And most regular people (ie not manosphere or sjw types) are calling it out as ridiculous. There was no coercion. There was no professional/working relationship. There was no power dynamic by which he could ruin her career if she refused (ala Weinstein). There is literally nothing here. They met at a party, she chased him a bit for a date. He takes her out on a date, serves her white wine instead of her preferred red (no joke, she actually makes this accusation as though it fucking matters?), they go down on each other and she calls it a night before there’s any PIV. She seemed to be upset she thought that she would become his girlfriend or something, whereas he was really only looking to get laid.

There is literally nothing here. I wouldn’t even call this sexual misconduct. Literally just a crappy date with a dude who was pushing sex a bit too hard.

Electra_Cute · 2018-01-15T18:46:27+00:00

My thoughts on all of these recently stories on celebrity sexual misconduct can be summed up into this being a trend and sexual assault is not the same as making someone feel uncomfortable sexually.

All of these celebrities, public figures and women talking about #MeToo, it is mostly just a trend used for virtue signalling in an attempt to raise ones status, it is effectively just that. This is a "hot" topic right now, so all of these stories are going to be coming out. I do not think it is necessarily a bad idea to have a conversation about these sorts of behavior or even raise awareness that these situations happen, but the way it is being handled is just another superficial manifestation of a movement. I am also certain that the majority of sexually active males have made a date or their partners feel negative in some way while pursuing sex at one point, but when it all comes out, of course you will only ever hear of the negative experiences.

This is the other issue too, what Aziz Ansari did, one can have a conversation about why this behavior is deemed unacceptable, but it seems as if all sexual misconduct is being lumped into one singular definition and all sexual misconduct is being discussed as equally reprehensible. Look at the article itself and what it chooses to share.

It took a really long time for me to validate this as sexual assault,

I was not expecting a bad night at all, much less a violating night and a painful one.

I believe that I was taken advantage of by Aziz.

The article tries to paint this picture of what happened, where Azis Ansari is some predatory male ruthlessly pursuing this young poor girl, the word choices and how it is presented is deliberately doing this. It is attempting to make the situation sound significantly worse than it actually was. This is typically what thought pieces and news article do a lot of the time, they may as well get Clive Barker to narrate and write these at this point.

Making someone feel uncomfortable sexually is not the same as assaulting them sexually, Azis Ansari is not some monster, rapist or criminal, just someone who grossly misread a situation and pushed way too hard.

i_have_a_semicolon · 2018-01-15T18:37:43+00:00

I think that Aziz didn't sexually assault this women. I think it's quite depressing that as a society, we would rather point the finger and blame a male for his sexuality rather than ask women to be agents and be accountable for their decisions/actions. She decided not to say no. She decided to let him proceed. She could have, at any moment in time say goodbye and leave. Now she gets to humiliate him, express the intimate details of their consensual sex encounter to all people, and get rallying support from others for her lack of ability to say No.

It ain't right. If women want to support this, they are delusional. I think it might be worthwhile to invest in chaperone-tech for women, who by their own admission, are unable to say the words No out of fears which have no backing in reality, as if a man attempting to get a Lay means he will kill her if she denies him 100% of the time. This nonsense needs to end , nd if women want to forgo their agency they should accept the consequences of being treated like they have none.

crackrocksteady7 · 2018-01-15T18:53:33+00:00

She said yes and willingly sucked his dick and he's still getting metoo'd lol 4th wave feminism is a riot

haunting-you · 2018-01-15T18:36:04+00:00

sounds like both contributed to a bad situation. he should have noticed/responded appropriately to her signs and statements of disinterest, and she should have gotten out of there ASAP when it got weird/beyond what she wanted.

a_mans_perspective · 2018-01-16T12:00:18+00:00

I dont understand what her point of writing all that was.

Did he do anything illegal?

No.

Rape her? Sexually assault her? Threaten her in any way?

No.

Did he show interest in anything other than sex?

No.

She was not comfortable with this and wouldve preferred more intimacy and patience on his part. However, she was not entitled to that. If men are not entitled to womens bodies, women are certainly not entitled to mens time, kindness, or consideration.

She WAS entitled to leave the premises after deciding that continued sex with this man was not to her taste. She chose not to, and therefore her continued discomfort was her own fault. She wanted the situation to evolve into more than just sex, so she hung around, but Aziz was under no OBLIGATION to give her what she wanted or change his behavior (which was within the realm of legality).

What this woman seems to want is for men to OWE her a certain kind of emotionally intimate, caring, boyfriend-girlfriend treatment... and if they dont give you that treatment, its sexual assault. Sorry but thats not how it works. Your feelings of being used, disappointed, regretful and/or uncomfortable do not amount to assault. No threat, no coercion, no force = no assault.

reluctantly_red · 2018-01-15T18:38:36+00:00

She had a date that didn't go as planned. That is NOT sexual assault.

blackedoutfast · 2018-01-15T22:42:57+00:00

"omg why isn't he paying attention to my non-verbal cues that i'm not interested in sex? oh well guess i better suck his dick again."

GayLubeOil · 2018-01-15T20:12:43+00:00

If you go to the supermarket and buy discounted day old meat you're not getting a discount you are getting old meat at an old meat price.

Something goes for dating an SJW. You don't get discounted vagina. Now Aziz is paying the SJW price.

Entropy-7 · 2018-01-15T18:45:03+00:00

He's famous, she's not, she wants a platform. She plays victim, gets a bit of play and maybe a bit part in a sitcom.

raginghamster · 2018-01-15T20:01:23+00:00

The Atlantic: The Humiliation of Aziz Ansari. https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2018/01/the-humiliation-of-aziz-ansari/550541/

Was Grace frozen, terrified, stuck? No. She tells us that she wanted something from Ansari and that she was trying to figure out how to get it. She wanted affection, kindness, attention. Perhaps she hoped to maybe even become the famous man’s girlfriend. He wasn’t interested. What she felt afterward—rejected yet another time, by yet another man—was regret. And what she and the writer who told her story created was 3,000 words of revenge porn. The clinical detail in which the story is told is intended not to validate her account as much as it is to hurt and humiliate Ansari. Togethe, the two women may have destroyed Ansari’s career, which is now the punishment for every kind of male sexual misconduct, from the grotesque to the disappointing.

Pope_Lucious · 2018-01-15T22:57:27+00:00

This woman sounds like a piece of work.

She had delusional expectations about what the encounter with Aziz was. She was upset he wasn't the Prince Charming in her 14-year-old fantasy and only wanted her for sex (like almost every male). After the encounter, she attempts to craft a victim narrative rather than face her own naïveté and fix her self-imposed lack of agency.

The witch hunt continues.

alreadyredschool · 2018-01-15T21:57:17+00:00

I went on a date with Aziz Ansari. It turned into the worst night of my life

Privileged and sheltered girl.

I think this is actually part of a bigger operation to safe weinstein. They dilute the metoo thing with such stories, lump them in with weinstein and in 2 years he is where he was 1 year ago.

MrPerfidy · 2018-01-15T18:33:40+00:00

If once in that whole fuckin horrible story I read anything like, "I felt like he could easily have become violent," or, "I was in a very bad position alone in his huge apartment to escalate to any physical confrontation," fuckin, something like that, then, I would be inclined to sympathize with the woman in this story. Barring that I just feel gross and think, "that poor woman has problems." Also I am like astounded at how that's a celebrity's idea of a big night

AstuteBlackMan · 2018-01-15T19:35:26+00:00

For all the blue pill woman and men who think she's a victim she's not. She's actively making real victims lose credibility.

danofyourdreams · 2018-01-15T23:56:19+00:00

Why go on a date with anyone any more if this sort of thing is a real possibility? Why risk it? It seems like it would be far less costly and far safer, all things considered, to just hire a prostitute than to deal with this stuff.

goatismycopilot · 2018-01-15T20:30:03+00:00

I said this in another sub, she could have side stepped all this by not going back to his place.

Contradict-- · 2018-01-15T18:58:44+00:00

I told you guys that celebrities ain't shit but poster boys for the average.

Belfura · 2018-01-16T05:09:57+00:00

My thoughts on the matter: "As I went down on him, he refused to recognize my non-verbal cues."

ThorLives · 2018-01-15T19:08:08+00:00

Eh. It sounds like Aziz was getting pushy and overly persistent about sex. I don't think that's a cool thing to do. He also has made a big deal about standing up for women's issues in the past, so it seems rather contradictory for him to act that way.

Edit:

I've known guys who acted like Aziz, by the way. For example, I knew a guy who was always trying to hookup with girls, including girls who weren't into him. It got a little obnoxious, so I tended not to hang out with him. At one point, one of my female friends was out at the bar drinking with him "as friends". I knew exactly where this was going. I knew exactly what was going on, even if she didn't. She got a ride home from him, and he made an excuse to go up to her place. Then, he wouldn't leave. He kept making excuses and kept trying to escalate things. When she was telling me this (a few days later), I was just thinking, "Well, yeah. I don't know why you didn't see that coming ahead of time.", not that I'm blaming her necessarily.

By the way, I think some of this behavior is influenced by the demands and obligations men have in the dating game. In general, it's better to assume that a girl is into you (otherwise, you might miss out on opportunities with women). I also think men have a higher sex drive. I think women/feminists/PUAs like to say that women have a sex drive just like men, but I don't believe it. However, if you can convince yourself that it's true, you can push things forward and have sex more often than a guy who thinks women are less sex-driven. It's an adaptive belief. (And by "Adaptive" I mean that it gives you some advantage in life, even if it's not true.) Similarly, a salesman who walks around going "Everybody loves my product and is waiting for me to approach them and make a sales-pitch" is going to sell more widgets than a guy who doesn't. By some standards, it's better to have sex with 3 women and piss off a dozen women, then be that guy who only sleeps with one girl and every girl is okay with. (In general, I think that strategy works better in big cities, because in small towns your reputation gets shot quickly.) In the dating game, it's important for men to lead (because women are often passive, and they want to feel the thrill of a guy making a big effort to get her - because that validates her ego), but the downside is that women have to put-up with guys pushing things forward when they don't want.

DrDenisovich · 2018-01-15T21:11:26+00:00

I feel like this is more of a manifestation of media at this point. Someone out there needs to write an article to generate views, ad clicks, or subscribers. They know this is the flavor of the month topic that gets people to talk about it, share links, and discuss creating a powerful incentive to publish these types of articles. This claim seems outrageous, and is a bad date at best and a good learning experience for her. Too much of it seems like the writer/publisher trying to shoehorn this popular narrative into another article.

washington_breadstix · 2018-01-15T23:32:54+00:00

consensual at the time.

A.k.a. "consensual."

notworthmuch20xx · 2018-01-15T18:15:45+00:00

He was wrong to press her so hard but it is not sexual assault. And I have no idea why she went home with him if she wasn't interested

Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2018-01-15T18:48:28+00:00

woman has bad date with celebrity, writes gossip piece on garbage website. so what?

shes not accusing him of rape or sexual assault, shes just saying ewwwwww

the date didnt just happen to ansari, it happened in HER life, its HER account of it, whats the issue with her publishing a tale from her life?

Jammerly1 · 2018-01-15T20:01:55+00:00

I have mixed feelings. This is clearly not sexual assault based on her own description, so let me clarify that upfront.

Even if this was "normal" sexual behavior..... should it be? It definitely seems predatory. I feel like this is the part of the conversation where we start to renegotiate the parts of M/F sexual interaction that are "normal" but seems overall to cause more harm than good within our culture.

As I wrote a post on this a while ago, the problem is men you're dating or in an intimate relationship with can just generally decide to ignore consent whenever they want to with little to no consequence as long as there is plausible deniability, and then put it down to an "awkward misunderstanding" even if you've clearly said no. I've had issues with men I was actually dating and regularly having sex with, so the answer can't be "never be alone with a guy if you don't want sex":

https://www.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/7lnml1/id_like_to_get_my_boyfriends_to_stop_forcing_sex/?ref=share&ref_source=link

I'm not always convinced it's accidental. Some guys purposefully exploit these situations. Is Aziz really just awkward & clueless, or does he just not care? How about James Franco? Is it their job to care? Is it predatory and should it be illegal? If you tell a guy to stop and nothing short of you physically leaving will stop him from coercing or forcing sex with you, is it rape? Where does women's responsibility start and end after the word "No"?

throwinout · 2018-01-16T02:49:20+00:00

It sucks that this happened to him, but I do get a little bit of schadenfreude whenever one of these stories comes up about these "male feminists" (like Ghomeshi or Louis CK). Their schtick is that they are so much better than other "patriarchal" men so they try to socially castrate themselves and other men. They contribute to the pussyfication of America. Then they go after real feminists for partners and see the havoc they can reign. Well, good. This is exactly what other men have been warning you about and what they have been trying to avoid. You made your bed, now lie in it.

wracky272 · 2018-01-15T18:42:23+00:00

He bought her a cab ride home ffs. This is an egregious example of female hypoagency. Sounds like Aziz is terrible romantically (I shouldn't even know this much about his private life), but where is this woman's ability to walk away? She gave him oral (and received it) and then was shocked that he went for sex afterward?

Also, she dropped this story immediately after he won a golden globe. It has bitter revenge written all over it. Sounds like she had an uncomfortable night out, that's it. She's diluting any actual victims' experiences.

Feelings aren't facts. She even says it took her 4 months talking this over with her female friends to be convinced that it crossed the line.

Mr_Smoogs · 2018-01-15T18:52:03+00:00

I love how on one hand women say you should be more aware of non-verbal cues and anything less is sexual assault. And on the other hand it is an injustice to say women “ask for it.”

IME it’s pretty clear that women ask for sexual escalation from men by the way they dress and act.

JustAnotherOmegaMale · 2018-01-15T18:51:14+00:00

It wasn't sexual assault but the girl doesn't claim that it was. Aziz had no regard for her boundaries or did not care that she was uncomfortable. He was definitely in the wrong.

handklap · 2018-01-15T22:22:24+00:00

Just the fact that we're discussion something private in public and in such detail is just so wrong.

OTOH, fuck him. Couldn't happen to a better cuck.

mistresswhat · 2018-01-15T22:43:36+00:00

Look, if you think this sort of behavior is acceptable and you decide it's worth it to get laid, you accept the consequences. Lots of people think it's scummy and no one is obligated to keep quiet about it or continue supporting/associating with you.

Dude has written a book and two seasons of a TV show about modern dating. He's also an unattractive South Asian man who has gotten tremendously successful in an industry where merely being talented isn't enough even for hot white people. He is absolutely socially adept enough to know what he was doing and how that behavior would be viewed by a large swath of the population if it came to light. He's not a victim.

gabriot · 2018-01-16T02:35:16+00:00

The thing is, even with celebrity power that Aziz has, at the end of the day he's still a average build shorter Indian dude. Any guy that isn't an absolute hunk (a +95%-er as many studies have shown are the only men women will throw themselves after) you have to constantly be the one making ANYTHING happen sexually. So if he doesn't let it be known that he wants to have fuck, then it isn't going to happen. Couple that w/ the fact that he's been pretty well known as a feminist, he now has this weird grey area where he doesn't think it's right to say outright "the only thing I want to do is fuck" (which is perfectly ok for women to say, why can't it be for a man?) and instead he just skirts around the issue and keeps trying to make advances.

Long story short yeah he probably did come off as a creep to the woman and yeah she probably did feel violated, and yeah he probably did want to have sex and yeah he probably did not intend for her to feel that way, she sucked his dick so he obviously thought she was into it to some degree but it wasn't obvious to him when he's getting what he interprets are mixed signals. It's a lose-lose situation all around and you can thank society for it, I'm sure this type of situation happens quite often and it's not a good thing but it's what we're left w/.

Jammerly1 · 2018-01-16T03:31:20+00:00

As I predicted, the line between bad relationships and sex is coming very close to sexual harassment or assault.

More Stories like this will tip the iceberg in the other direction.

eliechallita · 2018-01-16T16:00:44+00:00

I'm on Aziz' side here: The woman's own account fails to support her claim. I'm sympathetic to people who claim that they were pressured into act A when they had only wanted to consent to act B, but the line there is too blurry for me to support allegations of rape or abuse.

This is very different from cases like O'Reilly, Weinstein, or Ailes where the women never consented to any sexual behavior but the men went on anyway. Going by the woman's account, she was already having sex with him but didn't want to perform specific acts. He didn't threaten or force her in any way, by her own account. At this point it's entirely on her to remove herself from the situation. I sympathize for the discomfort that she felt, but to criminalize his behavior would be unfair to him and indicate a dangerous lack of agency for women.

VoidInvincible · 2018-01-15T20:31:15+00:00

Do you blue pillers get why we have to treat women like children now? It's to SAVE our asses!

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squidracer · 2018-01-16T00:30:33+00:00

That will teach him not to take anymore chicks out to a fancy dinner.

DashneDK2 · 2018-01-16T00:56:28+00:00

"babe is for girls who don't give a fuck"

Ultramegasaurus · 2018-01-16T04:45:21+00:00

This story really hits the spot for women who feel entitled to relationships and hate Indian men.

derivur · 2018-01-16T19:35:45+00:00

Wow, if Aziz Ansari wasn't famous he would totally be on r/ForeverAlone right now. Just how desperate can a man act !?

Worst of all he would have gotten the sex he wanted if he had been just a tiny bit more patient.

A lot of men need to study up on foreplay.

Blue_Violet23 · 2018-01-16T21:13:15+00:00

I never heard of this guy until this whole think. I don't think he's a rapist. Doesn't mean he's not a little creep

Alth12 · 2018-01-15T19:04:40+00:00

Women's March soon. If there's not enough actual revelations they'll cling to these dubious at best ones. Got to keep the uproar high.

prodigy2throw · 2018-01-15T21:55:56+00:00

In 2018, You’re not cool if you’ve never been raped

BisquitBill · 2018-01-16T01:49:46+00:00

I keeping a copy of the original story published by babe so as to raise awareness of feminism and feminine thinking when the text messages surface proving the accuser - Grace - to be yet another liar.

Rolling Stones magazine ring a bell, anyone?

Title	Let's talk about Aziz.
Author	Jammerly1
Upvotes	25
Comments	328
Date	January 15, 2018 6:15 PM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/7qljrv/lets_talk_about_aziz/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/lets-talk-about-aziz.263998 https://theredarchive.com/post/263998

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