Why do men become the boiled frog so often?

PristineCommand9780 · 2025-03-28T23:22:09+00:00

I am at the start of divorce and I’m going to get completely fucked. I don’t care about losing shit loads of money but I don’t want to lose my kids. Finding that part very challenging. Any ideas on coping mechanisms when not able to see your kids?

Useful-Influence-251 · 2025-03-26T17:57:13+00:00

Marriage is not worth it for men Divorce is evil and ruins all involved. Maybe men should never get married.

Medium_Message_224 · 2025-03-26T02:57:38+00:00

After looking at all the comments, ot has started me thinking a little more clearly, but I still have some questions. As a man, if we band together, we can actually make changes to the whole divorce and child support laws that are in place. But it gets me thinking why all these laws Were put in place in the first place and it still goes back to the boiled frog syndrome. Slowly, but surely women made changes to divorce and child’s custody laws that we are all suffering from now. I’ve had many thoughts about how to fix the system. I wrote a post About staying away from marriage and going more toward marriage contracts that have a definitive end. With everything I have read about divorce and timing and how long it takes for a woman to change her mind about no longer being happy or that we are not what they want anymore that perhaps a seven year marriage contract Might be more beneficial. My thinking behind this is that with a contract, we deal with contract law and not the subjective nature of family courts. If you are interested, I will post links to my posts on contract marriages. I made them several months ago, but this whole discussion has gotten me thinking a lot more about changing the system. With a contractual end that we all know is coming we can prepare better and not be so blindsided when this shit hits the fan. Any comments or thoughts would be appreciated.

DisposableMan_ · 2025-03-25T10:57:16+00:00

Well we hope things will work out when we have children together. We think women will come to their senses. We still have trouble fully accepting that women react emotionally and don't stop to think about consequences.

Not to mention that women have the system which is there to help them. Men don't have that and have to make it work not to have the system come down on them.

Trust me before I had a child I would walk away so fast.

Pharlap12345 · 2025-03-24T02:44:28+00:00

We are ruled by sex. We are conditioned to think that we have to earn it and be subjugated to ridiculous standards. Most men are just happy to have a woman interested in them. Most men settle while women get to choose. Then we get trapped in a family with financial and father duties and we just accept our fate. All the while, women hold all the cards. The keys to the kingdom. The idea that I have to act a certain way or do certain things in order to gain enough favor to be acknowledged, let alone fucked properly and genuinely is a farce. You say you are picking the wrong people. I don’t agree. Women are unstable, use a completely different set of parameters for logic and always have an agenda. I have had too many experiences and communicated with too many men to not see the pattern of how dysfunctional women are. Particularly in today’s fucked up climate, they all want some ridiculous ever changing bull shit. I wish I would have been more aware when I was younger and not felt the weight of responsibility. If I’m lucky, I have some years left. I can guarantee one thing, it won’t be spent attempting to please a woman. For that, I will happily engage in a transactional service.

Soft-Landing-Divorce · 2025-03-23T01:37:18+00:00

As a divorce mediator and CDFA, I've worked with countless men in situations similar to yours. What you're describing isn't uncommon, and it's not just about being "easy to manipulate" as a gender.

Many men struggle with boundary enforcement for several distinct reasons:

Socialization patterns often teach men to be "fixers" - when relationship problems arise, the instinct to repair rather than reassess kicks in strongly.
There's frequently a gap in emotional education. As you noted, many men enter relationships without understanding what red flags even look like because these weren't conversations traditionally had with young men.
The sunk cost fallacy hits particularly hard in long-term relationships. After years of investment, walking away feels like failure rather than self-preservation.

What I've observed in my practice is that men who successfully navigate these challenges typically share a few common traits:

They've developed communities of other men with whom they can discuss relationship dynamics honestly. Having these reference points helps normalize boundary-setting and reduces isolation.

They've learned to distinguish between relationship problems that can be worked through versus fundamental compatibility issues that signal it's time to move on.

They practice regular self-check-ins to ensure they haven't started compromising core values or needs.

Your journey from not knowing what red flags were to having a "whole library" of them shows significant growth. The question now isn't whether you're somehow inherently susceptible to manipulation, but rather how to apply this knowledge proactively in future relationships.

What specific boundaries have you found most crucial to maintain your sense of self in relationships?

BigBrotherKhan · 2025-03-22T20:21:23+00:00

I disagree with the statement this this is just "by nature". Instead, I would attribute it to the education system. Man, the workhorse of any industry, are trained to be "nice workers" just like worker bee. Ideally, they will just work and reproduce till death without complaining. But women, on the other hand, are not obligated by this expectation. And because of systematical repress of women in history due to productivity, they are now protected by "political correctness" and are in general more organized fighting for more in all frontends. It's the "protected organized women" vs "atomized men" and you can expect the results.

MetaCognitio · 2025-05-30T23:18:11+00:00

What is changing is online spaces are now educating men about these things. Before you had to figure it out on your own and go against a lifetime of conditioning to arrive at correct conclusions.

Now online has allowed men to talk and compare experiences and see these things more clearly. We get to listen to women talk at length and hear how they think and how inconsistent their opinions are, like how they cherry pick when to be traditional or not.

Lastly, the ridiculous standards are causing men to just tap out of the dating market. Online dating and social media has accelerated this by commoditizing male attention while raising lifestyle expectations even further.

I think there will be a marriage drought and a bit of a market correction as a lot of the very entitled women who thought they would be happy alone realize they aren’t. By that time a lot of their options will have quit dating, learned enough to see she is circling back after ignoring them, or be dating someone younger.

deep66it2 · 2025-03-22T20:04:19+00:00

I heard frog legs are tasty.

No-Marsupial1823 · 2025-03-22T18:04:30+00:00

Yes we are very easily manipulated by women. That’s the nature of things. And when a man finally wisens up that’s when he sees it all. Usually it’s too late

PriorPineapple3778 · 2025-03-22T14:57:23+00:00

I think it can begin in childhood. If you have a demanding narcissistic mother you can be formulated to believe that your role is to take care of her and "make her happy". Your role becomes the provider. Nevermind what is good or healthy for you. This mindset then becomes transferrable to relationships with other women in adulthood

Curious_Helicopter29 · 2025-03-22T12:02:15+00:00

Woman get boiled just as much.

softinvest · 2025-03-22T05:25:38+00:00

As I get older I become less interested in sex. I realized as I was a boiling frog trying to escape the pot that relationships are not worth my loss of peace. We’re too gullible or desperate to please our wives. Some of us are strong enough to say no to them, but I wasn’t one of those guys. I can be 100% happy being alone and fulfilling my curiosities and enjoying life. Not only that, most marriages fail and many of the ones still together are miserable. And then when they fail you lose half of everything. My legacy will be to instill in my kids to never be the boiling frog. Always keep your independence and never accept disrespect. Walk away. If you need sex, get snipped and find a fuck buddy.

judasholio · 2025-03-22T01:32:12+00:00

Men endure immense pressure to suppress emotions and ‘man up’ from boyhood, leading to a tolerance for abuse. This, combined with societal and male-on-male pressures, creates a cycle of isolation. Breaking this cycle, as you’ve done with therapy and boundaries, is good.

As for being the boiled frog, most don’t know it until they are already cooked.

Worried_Baker_9462 · 2025-03-21T23:35:51+00:00

Yes men are easy to manipulate as a sex.

This is naturally selected.

As is the complementary nature of women.

Vegetable_Payment101 · 2025-03-21T23:20:59+00:00

Wow this is a really good question. I don’t think I agree that men are more easy to manipulate, but I do think that “modern men” are much, much more accommodating and collaborative than “modern culture” gives them credit for. I’d also suggest that modern culture valorizes women for collaboration and teamwork etc… when in many cases that capacity is overestimated.

IHaveABigDuvet · 2025-03-21T23:15:24+00:00

A lot of it is education. Its only the millennial generation and younger that really have conversations about red flags. Its a relatively new topic in the public sphere.

Now as a society we are generally just more informed.

redragtop99 · 2025-03-21T23:00:59+00:00

There’s a lot to it. But I know as a man it’s so tough to be the sole supporter. I believe no marriage will work unless both people are committed to putting the work in. The work never stops, there’s never a point when you can think OK things are good, she’ll never leave me now. My wife didn’t even attempt to participate in our marriage, like not at all. It was so confusing to me she would put in the work to build a life w her AP, not me, the man who supported her entire life, married her, paid for the wedding, helped her family, made her my world, and yet she wouldn’t dare get off the couch to throw in $50 to help out w the marriage as that was a waste of $50 to her. But for the AP? She’ll start working more, sell her stuff (actually mine) and go get her own apartment and “live on her own” of course I didn’t even know there was an AP.

Thing is, it’s hard work always taking care of everything. I’d come home on a Friday after working all week and she’d complain why I don’t want to go out w her (who sat home all week watching TV and eating). After a while, it’s literally too much work to have to worry about her happiness too.

I think a lot of women just think it’s the man’s job to make them happy.

LibAftLife · 2025-03-21T21:43:36+00:00

Men are drugged by their hormones. It's powerful stuff. We need a pill to turn it off. Makes us stupid and controllable.

cynical-mage · 2025-03-21T19:55:00+00:00

I suspect that, male or female, we are subconsciously 'trained' to normalise or downplay fucked up dynamics and behaviour, first within our own families, which then makes us more vulnerable to awful partners, who then refine the whole process. Your normal-meter is set waaaaay off, and some people can, and will, prey on that. Gently escalating ofc, and you rationalise it; it's not as bad as xyz, and then you become trauma bonded and afraid of the unknown, of being unloved and alone and worthless, because your self esteem got shredded and then set alight.

Physical-Pie748 · 2025-03-21T19:26:42+00:00

women are powerful, over the years i learned that women can manipulate the sht out of a man (she needs the looks, the emotional connection and the right amount of femininty, then she can pull him in and make him do dumb choices). thats why many men make dumb irrational sht that they would laugh about if they wouldnt be in love. love makes you do irrational decisions. women act like a magnet , they pull you in and then they can make a 180 degree change and you follow because you cant imagine living without her, men are the romantic ones (there are studies how men are the more romantic gender) they act on love, women on the other hand are more rational when it comes to mate selection (charisma, confidence, height, money, status, social skills, looks,..... men on the other hand just want emotional connection right looks and femininty)

i wasnt the same person anymore when i was in love, now i just laugh about myself, now the fog is clearing and i see the truth. people say men are the powerful ones, i tend to disagree. women are the powerful ones who can control men.

everytime a woman pulled me in with her femininty looks and the emotional connection, she could do anything bad and i was feeling like someone stabbed me with a sword in my chest. painful. then women wonder why men avoid emotional connection and vulnerability, because of sht like this. exactly because of this. you are not alone my friend, we understand. men who are divorced are more likely to end their lives, and i see why. i fkin understand why.

Medium_Message_224 · 2025-03-21T18:52:00+00:00

I posted this as a reply to a reply down below, but I think this illustrates boiled frog manipulation:

Look at the evolution of the man cave for example. She wants you out of the family room and suggests the garage or the basement. Keeping to the boiled frog analogy check this progression and tell me where I am wrong:

⁠Partner sighs heavily when you relax in the family room to watch a game.
⁠Over time, for some reason, you watching the game is the best time to run the vacuum, have aloud phone conversation while sitting right next to, have a serious conversation while you are distracted.
⁠Subtle hints that you are unwelcome in that space. (Paper cuts)
⁠Hyping up man cave, “have you seen what Kim’s husband has done to their garage/basement” with subtle hints
⁠Scheduled a bbq at Kim’s house so you can see the man cave.
⁠Less subtle hints about how you can do anything you want whenever you want. Put neon beer signs and air hockey table.
⁠Finally, she makes you think it was your idea in the first place.

And because she can’t stand to see her man happy, mild nesting starts in your man cave starts to happen just to make sure you are aware that this is her territory too.

Oversimplified? Probably but you get my point

Exotic-Belt-6847 · 2025-03-21T18:41:41+00:00

I think society has also taught us young to assume that women are kind and sweet and happy. We grow up knowing men can be evil, cruel, violent so we expect that….. but are shocked when we see it from women. I think that distortion of reality allows us to miss so many red flags and chalk it up to things that arent meaningful patterns to be concerned with until its too late. Then you become the dead beat dad for leaving or an asshole for trying to correct bad behaviour.

probebeta · 2025-03-21T18:16:50+00:00

I think it takes a divorce or a serious breakup to start learning and paying attention to things we should have paid attention to long ago. This led me to listening to hours of podcasts about women behavior, not just because I'm butthurt and am afraid of it happening again, but because I actually want to understand it. I'm muuuch more selective with who I bring into my life, if that ever happens. Before this I was pretty much sleepwalking in relationships while the women were doing their work.

I think both sexes can be manipulative and this is simply human nature. Right now I could be called manipulative too. I do want women's company but I don't want to commit, keep the bad ones at arms length but sure we can hang out. They have their own ways. I don't think this will stop, it's just a matter of realizing it's happening and knowing when to walk away.

LoquiListening · 2025-03-21T18:03:04+00:00

This is a really important question, and I think a lot of men can relate to what you're saying. It takes a lot of courage to admit that we've been manipulated or that we've ignored red flags for too long.

I think you're right, there's a tendency for men to try and "fix" things, to hope that if we just work harder, or are more understanding, things will get better. We're often socialized to be problem-solvers, and that can translate into trying to fix relationships even when they're fundamentally unhealthy.

And you're right, the "boiled frog" analogy is apt. We get used to the gradual increase in discomfort, and before we know it, we're in too deep.

Maybe it's a combination of societal expectations, a desire to avoid conflict, and a lack of awareness about healthy relationship dynamics. We're often not taught how to recognize or set healthy boundaries, and that leaves us vulnerable.

It's great that you've done the work to learn about red flags and set boundaries. That's a huge step. But it's also important to share those experiences with other men. Your "library of red flags" is valuable knowledge.

I'm curious, what are some of the key red flags you've learned to recognize? And what strategies have you found most effective for setting and maintaining boundaries?

I think a lot of men could benefit from this conversation. It's not about blaming or shaming, but about understanding and supporting each other.

Local_Initiative2024 · 2025-03-21T17:53:43+00:00

People pleasers are at risk of losing themselves in relationships regardless of sex. Some people have more difficulty setting boundaries than others. Those who struggle at it tend to attract those who walk over others.

To what extent relationships in general have boundary issues I don’t know.

shrimp_42 · 2025-03-21T17:50:25+00:00

I basically married, in my opinion, one of the most difficult women in the world to be around. From observing other people’s wives and girlfriends, mine was by far the most challenging to be with. After divorce from her, I’m bulletproof. Other women I’ve met have been a breeze in comparison, and also I’m so battle hardened that my boundaries are like granite thick walls that I move for no one! I see it as a good thing almost that I experienced such good “training” so now I’m prepared for anything!

dukeofthefoothills1 · 2025-03-21T17:43:20+00:00

It’s programmed. In earlier times, the men who survived were those who maintained commitment to the team as hunters/warriors.

Pro-IDGAF · 2025-03-21T17:40:19+00:00

same for experience for me and now my FAFO meter is way more tuned in with women’s shenanigans. i will not and do not tolerate low quality behavior.

my current gf got a big dose of that recently and got her shit figured out.

dating is like musical chairs late in life and theres no reason to sit on a shaky chair.

Pbranson · 2025-03-21T17:39:55+00:00

Would love to have your share from your library of red flags!

ParkAffectionate3537 · 2025-03-21T17:22:44+00:00

Learning how to stand up for myself and also being a people-pleaser led to my downfall. But thankfully it's something that can be fixed over time.

Grafixx5 · 2025-03-21T17:15:39+00:00

Men are taught at a young age how to treat a woman but not what to expect from a woman. Whereas women are taught what to expect from a man and not how to treat a man. (In most cases, look at most old Disney movies and fairy tales for examples)

Men also will sacrifice their happiness for their families whereas women will sacrifice their families for their happiness. (Again, in most cases, not all)

xjeeperx · 2025-03-21T17:04:40+00:00

We’re taught from a young age to just deal with things, “walk it off”, “man-up”, because no one cares how we feel. So we just tolerate the bullshit.

no_user_selected · 2025-03-21T17:02:12+00:00

I think that we naturally gravitate towards fixing things, and the easiest way to fix a relationship issue is to change your own behavior. What happens is you end up in an infinite loop of being accused of not being perfect and then trying to fix it, but the problem is that your wife/gf doesn't really know why she isn't happy and is just blaming you for everything she can think of. No matter how hard you try, you'll never be able to fix that issue without her having some self-reflection.

It amazes me sometimes that if I accidentally miss a crumb on a counter when making my son food, my ex will scream about it and talk about how horrible it is living with me. Then we will visit with friends, and their house will be a complete disaster, but they are happy. We are separated but cohabitating until the divorce is finalized, yesterday she was yelling about there being fingerprints on the stainless steel appliances. It would have been a lot cheaper to just buy white or black ones and never have that issue, and it's not like people are purposefully smudging them, it's just how stainless steel is.

I've decided after the divorce is finalized that I'm done with relationships, I'm just going to enjoy the rest of my life not trying to please anyone, it's not worth it.

Smoovie32 · 2025-03-21T16:53:54+00:00

We don’t come out of the womb or graduate with knowledge of emotional intelligence or best practices in relationships. We see what’s modeled for us and that usually is not perfect. In many cases, it’s the opposite of good. These are all things we have to learn through experience, unfortunately. When you add in the historical societal pressures on men to not be emotional or to just toughen up and get through it, it’s real easy to see how. now that the societal expectations seem to be shifting, men are caught flat footed trying to figure out what’s acceptable or appropriate.

Good on you for starting to set your boundaries. They’re still a good chunk of women, at least in US culture, that actively practice misandry in their expectations of men to be the primary breadwinner or to just suck it up and take care of everything and divide the workload up in the way that the women seem comfortable. The problem with men is we just typically go along with it because we’re happy to have a partner and a family and a stable lifestyle.

My perception at this point is that some women think that that’s just the start and eventually they’re going to make the man change or take on more and more in an effort for the women to feel fulfilled. Problem being, they don’t know what is fulfilling to them and they are chasing after something that they need to work on themselves at the expense of their partner.

I’m not saying, this is universal, but the more I read here and experience in life the more this model seems to be fitting. I could go down a whole rabbit hole about the seemingly recent (last 40 years) trend of women tearing down their partners and thinking it’s acceptable. More of the men don’t really have feelings, trope, which gets flipped on us whenever they need emotional support. I’m not sure when these pushes and poles are going to balance out, but I can certainly see the perspective of men who have gone through a divorce vowing to never get married again or never get into a serious relationship. When this is your most significant relationship experience, why would you sign up for more pain and economic loss? Why would you risk the love of your children or the ability to retire comfortably if at all? No partner is worth that.

TheSwedishEagle · 2025-03-21T16:50:54+00:00

I learned from my dad that it was important to maintain the marriage and provide for the family even though my mother actually made more money than my dad. He always put his own needs behind those of my mom and the kids. He always drove the oldest car, ordered the least expensive item on the menu, and wore the cheapest clothes compared to my mom. That’s where I learned it was the right thing to do to sacrifice for your family.

Husbands don’t leave their families no matter how bad it gets because they won’t get to see their children. Wives do. I can’t think of any divorces among my peers as a child that were initiated by a husband unless the wife was cheating in which case she really left first unofficially.

Men tend to be extremely loyal in a way women aren’t. That’s my impression. Even if a man cheats he usually doesn’t want to leave his wife and family. I think it’s something that’s just pounded into us as young boys: we are supposed to be the protectors of the women and children and what happens to us isn’t important.

Striking-Trainer8148 · 2025-03-21T16:46:57+00:00

After several years of a subpar marriage, my personal conclusion on this topic is that men are builders. We build societies, buildings, electronics, all we want to do is build and create.

It is my opinion that men recognize the cost of building a long relationship and what it means. I understand the argument that it might be a sunk cost and not worth debating, but I feel as though the male gender has a harder time destroying all of the work that they had put in. Women don’t have that issue, and are more forward thinking.

You can apply this to many topics. I look at our house, and lives that we have built together and say “look at all this work we did, this is great!” While my wife looks at the same house and life that we have together and says “this is not enough. I need better.”

I have found that many of our fights and conflicts come down to this one incongruity in our ways of thinking

TLDR, my personal opinion is that men look behind and see everything they have done. Women look ahead and see everything they can have.

Title	Why do men become the boiled frog so often?
Author	Medium_Message_224
Upvotes	127
Comments	113
Date	March 21, 2025 4:39 PM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/Divorce_Men
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/Divorce_Men/comments/1jgl6rn/why_do_men_become_the_boiled_frog_so_often/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/Divorce_Men/why-do-men-become-the-boiled-frog-so-often.1547063 https://theredarchive.com/post/1547063

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