Two leaders in a relationship. Thoughts?

Willow-girl · 2023-12-10T04:10:02+00:00

Works out fine if you have different areas of expertise and are capable of deferring to each other.

AngeCruelle · 2023-12-10T03:37:27+00:00

There can be two leaders. There cannot be two insufferable prima donnas.

odd_cloud · 2023-12-10T02:53:37+00:00

I know a similar woman. She’s in top 10% earners, but looks for a guy who earns more. Also, she’s quite tough and disagreeable.

I guess that even if she manages to find someone who matches her criteria, the relationships won’t last long. Two people who got used to everything being in their own way and not used to compromise won’t last long together.

baiser_vole · 2023-12-10T03:17:19+00:00

She just sounds insufferable. My boyfriend is a feminine man dating a masculine woman, and he could not get through the whole video. He actually prefers assertive women.

I don't think she is looking to lead. She is wanting to boss around and be accommodated for. "I want it MY way!!!" is all I am hearing.

Fun_Push7168 · 2023-12-10T03:01:14+00:00

Smart move on the matchmakers part. That's very unlikely to work and there's no point in business of pursuing a likely failure.

Part of providing that service is going to be selecting for clients you know you can succeed with.

babazuki · 2023-12-10T16:34:17+00:00

Every human is worthy of some sort of love. Not every human has what it takes to make a marriage work.

She doesn't seem willing to change at all to make a marriage work. She doesn't want to give anything up. She wants a man to come into her life and make her happy and sacrifice his own freedom in the process. She's going to give him nothing in return. She thinks just being in her presence is a gift worth the same amount as his life long commitment towards her. Ain't no way an accomplished, successful man is going to take that deal while he's at the top of his game.

AMDisappointment · 2023-12-10T04:21:09+00:00

She's 38? She looks 48. The wall hit her hard.

apresonly · 2023-12-10T02:45:11+00:00

Matchmakers have no idea what to do now that most men can't be sole providers. They just talk about gender roles bc they are grifters and that's what grifters do.

ComfortableOk5003 · 2023-12-10T03:19:45+00:00

Just watching that short clip I honestly get why the matchmaker backed out. The man she described is generally not looking for a woman like her…and she looks 40+

So in essence 40s boss babe, neurotic, type A, leader, who cakes makeup on…got impression she makes good money…so ya those leader dudes with good money don’t want women like her. All around kind of obnoxious

There are no 2 equal leaders. There’s always one who’s the actual leader.

mechanical_fish_81 · 2023-12-10T12:42:54+00:00

She decided to persue a life where she developed traits that are not attractive. Sorry it is what it is.

If you disagree, then why is she even seeing a match maker?

Anyway, the video itself:

Her "Attractive Traits":

Organised

Like to be the leader

Looking for a man who is always a leader

At or above same income level

Ambitious

Ready to get married

High Strung

Type A

Are they attractive or unattractive in a woman who is at "The Ripe Age of 38"?

Life has the answers, she is single, paying for a matchmaker. You tell me?

Cannot be with a Beta Male

She is bringing the masculine energy to the relationship. If some guy is similar to her, will he want a relationship that is similar to the board room. Do guys at a level higher than her, find her attractive? Life has the answers. She is single, and using a matchmaker. If guys she found attractive were into this, they would be taking a shot with her. "If he wanted to, he would" or whatever they say on FDS.

Shouldn't be pushing on thse narratives

A matchmaker will have experience of what works in a relationship. Maybe the TikTok woman dosn't want to hear the truth. I will happily eat my hat, if she posts a video of her getting married to the type of man she desires, I can only go by what seems to work out in the wild.

No matter the type of woman you are, love is out there for you

Cool, then you have no reason to be seeing a matchmaker. And all is good then. Happy to hear that.

SlowEffective8146 · 2023-12-10T13:13:39+00:00

Let me translate for you:

"I'm an older masculine woman and want a high value masculine man"

The matchmaker is looking at it like a lawyer trying to win a murder case with overwhelming evidence against the client.

ArtifactFan65 · 2023-12-10T04:07:06+00:00

You can have two equals but not two leaders

TSquaredRecovers · 2023-12-10T17:41:52+00:00

Why does anyone need to be the de facto leader in a romantic relationship? Both partners are adults, and neither one should lead the other. Children need to be lead, not adults.

Egalitarian relationships have the healthiest and least dysfunctional dynamics. In those relationships, there is no hierarchical structure. Both partners view each others as equals and treat each other as such. My husband and I have had an egalitarian marriage for almost two decades now, and it’s worked out very well.

Hi-Road · 2023-12-10T18:14:43+00:00

She probably said she wasn’t ready for other reasons. There’s other stuff she has going on in that video

RadiantDefinition267 · 2023-12-10T04:17:27+00:00

Someone has to be respected as the decision maker for a relationship to work, usually the man.

Why?

There will always be conflicts in a relationship.

When you're in an equal relationship, you both argue your point and you need to both make the decision that is "fair" and "right". Both parties will think that's themself. Then they will resent the other party for going against them.

Plus you waste so much time and energy having to prove your point and make your decision (or feeling downtrodden because you don't).

Usually even the wrong decision is better than no decision or an unaccepted decision.

Compound all these minor conflicts/discussions (where to eat) with major conflicts discussions (where to live, how to raise children etc) and the "equal" relationship will get more and more sour and more and more tiring.

Tywinlol · 2023-12-10T03:48:33+00:00

I swear females get more delusional by the day. I spend half of this year politely dodging advances of a female at work who is 3 years older then me and thought that just because we on the same educational level we would make a good pair. She was even willing to financially date down.

No surprises in the video she thinks that a man is going to have same requirements/desires as a women and value money and status instead of looks, youth and attitude.

macone235 · 2023-12-10T07:38:20+00:00

Two leaders is going to be the worst relationship, especially if they're both very assertive. It's why alpha females are doomed, because they want to feel feminine as a woman, but at the same time they don't as an alpha.

If she dated another alpha, then she might enjoy the excitement of the alpha initially, but the frequent battles and making her feel less than what she wants to be is going to make her resent him, and the guy is definitely going to resent her and cheat on her, and probably cheat on her even if he didn't resent her.

On the flipside, dating a passive guy will fail as well, but her resentment will grow slower. Eventually after the honeymoon phase wears off, she'll start to resent his inability to lead her. If he's more sensitive rather than logical, then he'll be more empathetic to her needs, but he'll also likely be more clingy. This will turn her off, because he'll either be too needy, or he'll cheat.

These type of women tend to stay single or begrudgingly settle with the beta that she'll probably cheat on with the alpha, so that she'll get both. They should be a giant red flag for any man in most cases.

Spyro7x3 · 2023-12-10T03:23:17+00:00

Women get to lead children. A woman will lead a man off a cliff 99% of the time.

ornamentalwallpaper · 2023-12-10T06:45:41+00:00

I am about to hurt some feelings. There is a lot of men in these comments who are nowhere near type A themselves, but have a ton of opinions on a woman who can perform their role better than them. It's absurd. When was the last time a woman who is not a complete desperate bimbo offered you anything in the first place? Why are you getting discriminatory towards a female you did not and could not fuck?

How about we collectively look in the mirror and in the wallet because some of y'all are definitely barely invited to this discussion.

To answer your question, I don't think it's a problem unless she is a narcissist. Which she very well might be, since she decided to blast her personal problems and to lie instead of introspecting quietly. I question too the validity of her story and the "not worthy of love" bit.

As a disagreeable woman, I am flexible about a lot of questions and don't push the shit that I don't care about, and most shit I don't care about enough to fight over it. Guys who whine just don't know how disagreeable people work. They confuse being type A with being a hysterical brain eating bitches like their skanks. They never met type A people.

I'd say it's much more problematic if people are too apart on the spectrum because they don't understand where the other one is coming from. They'll resent each other. If two people are natural leaders, nothing prevents them from leading in different situations, these is how even conservative marriages work too. I fail to see the problem.

ZeeMark17 · 2023-12-10T07:43:01+00:00

What I find interesting about this video is that most people are with the matchmakers side saying that the matchmaker is correct. But, how she (the woman in the video) interprets the comments is "they are dragging me", this was one of her response.

Now imagine being in a relationship with someone who thinks that when a person is siding with someone other than you is the same as being "dragged".

Either way, I have grown to hate these Leader discussions because people seem to take it to extremes like saying that someone who wants to lead basically wants to call all the shots without regards to the other person's wants and needs.

There can only be one leader, the couple will decide who that is. But there cannot be 2 leaders.

jsmooth3363 · 2023-12-10T15:54:09+00:00

She appears to be difficult to manage. I doubt she would submit to a man and she isn't open to constructive criticism i.e. being more agreeable.

Ironically, she wouldn't respect a man if she leads the relationship. 2 leaders is code for she leads and destroys the relationship with no accountability.

WilliamWyattD · 2023-12-14T18:44:10+00:00

Just don't make it about trying to prove something. Forget about who is leading and just go with what works and makes sense. So that probably does mean one person will be more of the leader overall, but their will be domains of expertise and leadership as well. It can't be a power contest.

What is really annoying is how many women will look for a more competent or dominant or leading man, but then feel some need to make sure they 'lead' just as much as he does because doing so proves that women are equal to men. It's just stupid.

Turbulent-Tonight975 · 2023-12-10T04:33:03+00:00

It doesn't work having 2 people who both want to drive a car. I mean 2 people who want to take the lead as opposed to having an equal partnership.

These women want their cake and to eat it too where they want a guy who makes more than them who they would respect and be attracted too, but also is not going to want to lead. Those high achieving men are not going to take a back seat to a woman because they are not the passive type- they have ambition and are not going to give that up.

If these women want men who will let the woman lead they need to go after men who have substantially lower earning potential who are not ambitious. Those types of men are okay with being house husbands because they aren't competitive and ambitious. The ambitious men have careers and ambitions and they will not let a woman get in the way of that. I made it clear in my previous relationships that my aspirations will always be number 1 and I can love you and care about you and commit to you, but if you ever get in the way of my career I will have to leave.- it is not negociable and never will be.

Jesus Christ. I just watched the video linked after I typed my post until this point. This woman is a mess and then some. You can tell: hyper controlling, has to have everything her way, no negociation, has entitlement and godess complexes, lacks secure attachment, and is difficult beyond words.

The dating coach was correct. She is not someone a dating coach could not help because her attributes are completely incompatible with the man she is looking for. Any guy she wants is going to look at her as a pain in the ass who is way too difficult, not that pretty, and way more trouble than she is worth. This is why she is 38 and single. The type of guy she wants has enough stress in a successful job or business and the last thing he wants is someone like her who is so difficult and brings more chaos to his life. Men need peach in relationships, not what her personality will bring.

grillopie · 2023-12-10T03:04:49+00:00

I think its fine? you just have to create lanes. you can't lead on the same things.

boom-wham-slam · 2023-12-10T13:36:17+00:00

Two leaders is a recipe for failure. I wouldn't touch that with a 10 ft pole. I'm very successful and leader in life, I'm smart enough to lay that out when I date that I'm capable and lead and either accept that and follow or there's nothing here for us.

Cool_Relative7359 · 2023-12-10T14:09:41+00:00

Look up the analysis of that video by someone who worked in a matchmaker service. Anyone, but especially women, with too specific an idea of what they're looking for get rejected, because their main goal apparently is the match percentage of their client base because tjays what their marketing is based on.

AceOfSpadesGymBro3 · 2023-12-10T11:36:34+00:00

50/50 never works. A relationship is not a democracy. You can't have two people driving a car.

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Pathosgrim · 2023-12-10T05:45:50+00:00

Women like that are insufferable and are stalwart examples of why populations are decling in the west as well Japan, South Korea etc. Most importantly tho, leadership dynamics within a relationship work best when the dynamic itself goes unquestioned. Whatever works within one's relationship may not work for another. Today the man may be in the lead, tomorrow the woman may be calling the shots. Don't stress over it, just be ready to pass the ball. People aren't able to do that tho because they like to keep score and keep up with the joneses.

However, there's no leadership or communication to be had if both women and men are doing things in a tit for tack manner. There's nothing stable when one or both parties are insecure whenever they aren't behind the steering wheel in the relationship. It's hard for folks to adapt and go with the flow because narcissism is commonplace, especially when money and status is involved.

Safinated · 2023-12-10T07:17:20+00:00

That’s called egalitarianism, and this woman is nuts, as the service provider correctly deduced

mrsmariekje · 2023-12-10T09:56:03+00:00

Of course there can be two leaders in the relationship, and I believe there should be. Everybody should take the lead on something, whether it's a house move, or meal planning, or interior design, or gardening, otherwise they're no different from a pet you have sex with. You just can't have two people leading on the same thing at the same time.

januaryphilosopher · 2023-12-10T10:46:25+00:00

I think the word you're looking for is equal. If everyone's leading, nobody's leading. It works well, feeling that one person is leading the whole relationship leads to resentment, sometimes on both sides.

BoomerTeacher · 2023-12-10T14:39:39+00:00

Hmmm. I came from a patriarchal home, where my Dad's word was pretty much all that mattered. My wife came from a matriarchal household, where my mother-in-law miraculously gave birth to over a half-dozen children despite the fact that she had apparently castrated my father-in-law before my wife was born.

So we came in both (unconsciously) assuming we would be "the leader". It is miracle our marriage lasted. The first ten years were nearly constant fighting, but we both believed that we had to make it work (some days, only one of us believed that). All I'm saying is that anything can be made to work. After 40 years we have a nearly perfect, equal relationship, where we either have bailiwicks in which the other will yield, or on more important issues, we just work it out together.

KayRay1994 · 2023-12-10T14:41:44+00:00

I think two leaders working together can work, but both have to be humble enough to know their strengths and weaknesses and are willing to cooperate as a team

That being said, i get the sense that she wasn’t reject for that… to put it bluntly, she gives me Jan from the Office vibes - ie. powerful corporate lady who just might be crazy. Walking red flag.

WanabeInflatable · 2023-12-10T14:42:12+00:00

She maybe worthy love. But the problem she feels entitled to love. Nobody owes her relationships

No-Rough-7390 · 2023-12-10T15:11:50+00:00

Doesn’t work. Case in point.

Now, can there be people who are in charge, dare I say have roles? 100%.

The two leaders thing works until you bring violence into the equation, which everyone will only laugh at because safe world theory has folks operating in a delusion.

SupposedlySapiens · 2023-12-10T23:53:33+00:00

My goodness that woman’s entire personality was so utterly off-putting

KamuiObito · 2023-12-11T02:13:15+00:00

Why do women require a superior male? Thats lowkey a turn off for me. Being weak and vulnerable compared to me is not attractive. Like why do adult women admire men slightly better than themselves.

MaterialWestern8805 · 2023-12-22T14:28:56+00:00

Can you stop basing your posts off TikTok? Silly af

Title	Two leaders in a relationship. Thoughts?
Author	Windmill_flowers
Upvotes	11
Comments	233
Date	December 10, 2023 2:35 AM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/18etk1u/two_leaders_in_a_relationship_thoughts/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/two-leaders-in-a-relationship-thoughts.1240373 https://theredarchive.com/post/1240373

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