Hey guys share your thoughts about this perspective - Do you consider sex as merely a form of action or is it more than that? Can it be equated to activities like Dancing or Singing?

Gravel_Roads · 2020-12-09T08:22:47+00:00

I think of sex as a very intimate social activity, like giving someone a massage or talking about something very private and personal.

There is a mechanical element to sex, so yes it's an action, but it still relies on social interaction the most heavily - how people make each other feel during sex tends to impact how good the sex is.

That doesn't mean there aren't lots of different ways to make someone feel, tho, and what turns one person on might turn the next person off. No one person is ever going to be everyone's cup of tea.

Mimoxs · 2020-12-09T07:43:12+00:00

Men say that they don't want women comparing them to past partners. But that's effectively saying that you want a woman that puts up with bad sex because she doesn't know any better.

This is essentially the crux of the issue, yes, but you'll have a difficult time getting people to admit it.

I think it depends on how the individual views it. An individual might view it as just some activity, some view it as a bonding thing, some view it as sacred. Generally the way you view it affects how you behave in regards to it.

However, lots of men view it as just an action for them, they get to treat it as just an activity, but view it as much more for women. For me but not for thee mentality.

raviolipocketoli1836 · 2020-12-09T14:41:26+00:00

I feel as though it’s as special as you make it.

There’s been times where I was in periods of my life where I was very promiscuous. Not caring about who I slept with or how many. For Christ sakes it would be like 3 girls in 4 days and I’d feel some type of way later. Like regretful. I would then Abstain from hooking up and porn because I wanted to find something special. When I did do that and waited an entire month to sleep with one girl rather than hours I feel it was something special and easily is in the best times I’ve had sex. That’s after being with a lot of girls.

But when I was a 19yo virgin, I didn’t understand and had resent for “sluts”. Now I understand that people just like sex, it could mean something or it could mean nothing at all. It’s what you make of it.

If you want to wait to have sex with someone so you’re able to make it special after hooking up randomly in the past. No one is stopping you.

Some old friends I know want a virgin who will cook, clean, stay at home and literally just be a mom/wife. That’s fine, but the rationale behind having a virgin wife is that they want to mold her to please them the way they do. One friend went as far as to groom a fucking 16 year old. Once I called that shit out he stopped. Just goes to show some guys are pretty disgusting and selfish. I’m just glad I’m not close minded like them.

That’s my very incoherent take on it.

wtknight · 2020-12-09T12:05:56+00:00

Reliable birth control is something very new in human history, so for millennia sex was not just like dancing, it was an act that could potentially create a child. Many men's minds have not really adjusted to the new reality, so they unconsciously equate female sexual promiscuity in a woman with the idea that said woman has more of a potential to cuckold him and then make him raise another man's child.

Also, if a woman hasn't had sex with many other men, or any other men at all, she's not likely to know if the sex she is having with a certain man is good or not, meaning that she's more likely to be sexually loyal to him if that sex is actually bad. This might not be true, but it's the unconscious rationale that I think occurs in many men's heads.

GridReXX · 2020-12-09T14:27:45+00:00

She’ll know it’s bad music. She’ll just assume “music is bad” and focus her life on things that aren’t music.

But to your question. Sex can cause infections, PH imbalances, tears and friction burns, genital bruising, unexpected and unwanted babies, STDs, and STDs that cause cancers and ravage the body forever. So it isn’t quite like singing.

But still, that doesn’t mean a lot of people attach strong emotions to it either. Lots of women felt “eh” their first time and lots of men felt “love sex!” So if anything men associate a lot of emotions and attachments to sex. Women too tend to feel attached to sex if they’re in love/in strong like with the person or if the sex caused a trauma (it wasn’t wanted). But truly casual sex (she’s not 😍 with him) doesn’t mentally affect women the way men here claim.

I think men project a lot of “feelings” onto how women should view sex because it’s what they desire out of a woman. It’s not necessarily the reality. It’s just always felt to me that men think, breathe, live, feel, and are spiritually bonded to sex in a way I’ve never felt women were. So it’s interesting the narrative is that women care about sex... women care about not experiencing rape and having good sex (actually enjoying it from time to time). But generally speaking, men are the sex obsessed ones and have the most emotional baggage around it. Women aren’t up at night thinking about “who he’s fucked” ya know lol.

Tugallois · 2020-12-09T08:10:55+00:00

When I have sex, I do not have any less sex to give to someone else. Because it's an action not an object. I have not lost anything because I performed an action and did not give away an object

This is objectively true, so yeah I agree with it.

However, comparing it to dancing or singing is disingenuous. By its very nature, it is to most women a far more intimate act than singing.

In sex we value lack of skill

Not really, no.

spacechicken1990 · 2020-12-09T08:50:51+00:00

Sex is definitely an action, I like the comparison to dancing. But the difference is sex is a Mutual act unlike any other. I would dance with anyone but I won’t fuck them.

Fucking is the most intimate & mutually pleasureable act you can perform, but it can also just be an action.. mechanical in order to satisfy a want, guys comments here confirm this.

When I fuck I’m not giving anything away rather receiving & giving.

The idea a woman will accept a worse performance due to a lack of comparison is dumb. She’ll eventually realize it’s not enough, just like dancing out of tune.

Vindicator_ · 2020-12-09T10:25:59+00:00

I personally believe that if you compare sex to those things you dont value sex and intimity as much as I do. Its basically the most intimate thing you can do and if you do it with people youre not really intimate with, youre cheapening it, and cheapening yourself as well. I dont care if you had relashionships before. but if the only thing you want out of sex is pleasure youre accepting to use the other as an object and to be used by someone you might sometimes not even know, in a sexual, intimate way. When I put myself in a situation of casual sex mentally I realised that I would either (1)Secretly want more from that person but knew that I couldnt so I was just taking what I could wich is the recipe for a heartache and pretty stupid (2)Actually have no respect whatsoever for that person and have sex out of contempt and almost hate because a person who wants me without knowing me and doesnt control her impulses is like an animal (3) Be drunk (Does thats work also for women?)

I truly believe that If you have casual sex with a guy he falls in one of those 3 categories (1 you use him,2 he uses you and youre ok with that because its pleasurabe and the fact that you let it happen makes me think that you value pleasure way too much wich makes me think you have weak character.)And 3 you have no control over yourself.

I think the reason for that is that people are so caught in their stupid rational lives that their mind is seperated from their body and emotions and they think that sex can actually be as casual as Dancing. Dont tell me that sex doesnt mean anything, that its just mechanical, you need sexual feelings and sexual intimacy and attraction for it or youre dead inside. I get it it feels good to the body and the ego but are you willing to overlook all the rest for pleasure. Or maybe you dont and youre in (1) and you deny it, you deny being use. Honestly I am not afraid of women like thatt but kind of disgusted, Its the same for menwhores by the way.

B o d y p a r t s

I understand that women might not see things that way sex as much, maybe for them its showing emotions or whatever This just makes me feel that nowadays everybody is replaceable by better bodys nobody is special everything is shallow. Hope this help you get in the mind of a random confused idealistic male

Dont be a body

tthisisalljustatestt · 2020-12-09T12:52:52+00:00

"Sex is just an action sweaty, stop judging me for my past, you misogynistic sexist pig." - Every whore that ever lived.

rubbooyuri · 2020-12-09T16:39:42+00:00

A pussy is a thing to be used for their pleasure, according to dudes. So the more users, the less appealing it is.

Yah. And you wonder why relations between the sexes is strained

ivy176 · 2020-12-09T08:54:08+00:00

I agree but I care in which the WAY my partner performed that with others, or more accurately, in what situations. Does he fuck anyone or reserve it for someone he's falling for? That's what I care about. I'm just not compatible with someone who views sex like a hobby or something fun to do with whoever looks good. Sex is love for me, I only do it with someone I love. He has to be very similar.

NPC_Personality_277 · 2020-12-09T11:48:44+00:00

Sex is like a walk on the beach.

It’s relaxing to do by yourself.

A way to get to know someone new.

A whole bunch of fun to do with a group of friends.

A nice evening if you do it with snacks.

And the most romantic thing in the world with the right person (or people).

Laytheblameonluck · 2020-12-09T11:21:23+00:00

What's interesting is discussing "Sex is Love" vs "Sex isn't Love".

Brainless-Wonder · 2020-12-09T13:19:16+00:00

I get what you’re saying, but the analogy is admittedly pretty weak. If you want to stick with the dancing comparison, it’s more like you’ve found a dance partner but the variables are that you’ve just been shot up with a cocktail of testosterone, oxytocin, and maybe even a dash of a speedball for good measure, the dance is performed in your most vulnerable and literally naked state, your performance on the dance is intricately tied to other memories you may or may not have had performing this dance with other partners, there are societal expectations for when and how this dance should be performed that clash with your upbringing and personal experiences, and your partner is totally judging you the entire time because she herself has a schema for how this dance should be and what her dance partner should look like. There, I fixed it.

It’s not merely “a form of action,” masturbation is more deserving of that title. It is more accurate to say that sex is a culmination of events leading to that encounter, a clash or communion of two peoples’ lived experiences that determines much of what led to them winding up together in the first place, and whether it’ll happen again. Sex is particularly influenced by our personal lived experiences, and how society has molded us. When you get two people together in such a vulnerable state, it’s more than just “an action.”

Expensive-Guitar3609 · 2020-12-10T03:40:55+00:00

People don't "lose" anything (arguably) by having a lot of sex, but as a man I have found really true that women with a lot of sexual past/partners get more jadee about sex.

This could be for several reassons, though the most common are in my opinion, first because the way both sexes experiment sexuality (male sexuality is intrusive, disruptive and centrifuge, to the outside, while female sexuality is both physiologically and psicologically centripedal and internalized).

Of course women say "experienced" women know what they want and what they don't and all that jazz, and I believe it's true in part, but at the same time it's undeniable that an experienced woman that went through really bad sex episodes is more prone to have sexual hang ups than a less experienced one.

The very nature of sex can be quite agressive and dirty, and an irresponsible aproach to sex from the man's side can hurt or damage... Eehhm... The "view" women hold about certain aspects of sexuality.

This is particulary the case with women that get involved in relationships with a big power imbalance, and specially the ones who engage in modern NSA forms of sex that allow them, at least for a brief periodo, to fantasize with the ilusion that they can land a valuable man as long as they are willing to offer sex at demand without asking for much in return.

I'm not going to go into details, but I know from first hand the lengths women are willing to go to entertain a guy they really desire. In order to make a guy stay around women will indulge in some really weird shit that at their inner self they may find degrading and even insulting. This is some really damaging shit to a woman's self steem and sexuality.

Of course these men don't care what these women go through, because for them these girls may well be their second or even third options, so as long as the girl keeps indulging in whatever the guy ask and don't push too much to get Amy form of commitment or effort on his part, they will stay around and reap the benefits... Until something better comes along.

I've found through my years of dating that women that get involved in these kind of dynamics with these particular men often times end feeling "used" (their words) and very hurt, with a very warped and unhealthy view about sex and an incredible emotional damage, and I think this is what men around here mean when they say they don't want "used up" women.

You see, if men see women's sexual enthusiasm and willingness as a form of meassurement of how much a woman is attracted to them (and we definetly do) and attraction is the core principle of a healthy relationship (and it is) then a woman that is less enthusiastic in the sack and less willing to partake in our most private fantasies is, without doubt, a lesser partner.

I know, it's unfair, but it is what it is.

It doesn't matter that the woman "tried it before and didn't like it", or that "it was coherced", por that she was "young and insecure", or that she "knows what she wants and likes now because she's experienced"...

Men value sex, and value willingness and variety over all, so a woman with a lot of sexual hang ups product of bad past experiences is a bad choice for a sexual partner.

In this case, an "experienced" woman is not any better than an inexperienced one, quite contrary, she's "sub-par" and a downgrade.

So yes, sometimes, women lose something the more sex they have.

And this just one of the angles you know, there are like too many ways that I can think about why a woman with an extense past is worst partner than one with a prude past. Another one it's also the fact that for men it is an incredible ego boost and a sign of social status to date a woman no other man can talk about behinds your bancks.

I find this very intresting, you see, because it's usually "high status" men, good looking and rich ones I mean, the kind of men that are really proud of who they are in society and place really high their peers respect and self-image in their value scale, the ones that happen to date women with very little past.

You see, most people would say that over-confident and acomplished men wouldn't be insecure to be worried about their women's past, but this is not the case at all. I think they place too much importance on their women's reputation because people tend to be jealous and envy these men's success, and a promiscuous woman could be a blind spot on his public image. You know... Men like to trash-talk other men, specially the ones dating "easy women" (it doesn't surprise me that "cuck" is a common insult among men in all cultures worldwide).

sweetlike314 · 2020-12-09T09:20:20+00:00

Somehow I think the same people that most judge women in this way could find a way to whine about legitimate “dancing”. “I feel inferior because she may have had a better tango partner in the past. What if she compares me to her last dance partner? I don’t think it’s right to dance with too many people. If you do dance with multiple people, I don’t want you anymore. What if she leaves for a better dance partner? I’m just not going to dance because women only want good dancers and they dance with everyone but people who don’t dance like me”.

wekacuck · 2020-12-09T12:26:07+00:00

My first thought is that the main difference between sex and those activities is the concept of seeking someone for monogamy. I'm not saying that it's an invalid perspective, but that's what's missing. But I'm struggling to think of other activities that have a "monogamy" angle.

xFallacyx69 · 2020-12-09T13:32:05+00:00

It’s more than that to me. That’s why I’m weary of women who sleep around. Not because I think you’ll cheat more (you prob will but idc I don’t want to be with a cheater)... but the chicks I’ve dated who have gotten around have not viewed sex as something special but rather a way to manipulate.... fun stuff... NOT

Cleanit_up_Jannies · 2020-12-09T15:16:26+00:00

why do we feel people lose value when they have a lot of sex?

Because the loss of perceived value correlates with how they value sex. If I have sex with a hundred women you will note that my value of sex is very low, its something more mechanical rather than intimate. Likewise, if I have few partners then my valuation of sex is clearly very high because i practice restraint and am selective of who I have sex with.

thats effectively saying go put up with bad sex

Its not. Women know that theyre not having orgasms if their man isnt getting them off. The implicit assumption that no one gets better at sex, especially when told they must improve, is obviously wrong.

acron5n5 · 2020-12-09T15:48:44+00:00

Yes I want it to be as trivial as sharing a dinner with someone.

GunnzzNRoses · 2020-12-09T17:00:01+00:00

It can be something meaningless and primitive, or the greatest act of intimate soulful communion mankind is able to carry out. It all depends on the pre existing emotional attachment with your partner, or lack thereof

Sid_Insidious · 2020-12-09T17:04:30+00:00

Sex can be a very intimate activity and expression of love and commitment.

Sex can be two bored people who are masturbating into each-other.

Sex can be an artform between two near-strangers.

Sex can be a gross obligation or transaction between strangers.

Sex can be a gross obligation or transaction between people married 20 years.

The bottom line, sex is what it is to the individual, and only to the extent of the two people consenting to it. When society starts telling people what sex should and should not be, we have a serious problem on our hands.

AidsVictim · 2020-12-09T18:54:01+00:00

From my perspective I think the view espoused in the OP is essentially unhealthy and a commodification of sex - it isn't an intimate physical activity, it's just another thing to consume, like a music show or night of entertainment. Highly promiscuous people may view it that way, many people do not.

Most people are aware on one level or another that people who view sex as just another entertaining activity are less likely to invest in a relationship, less likely to be faithful, and are basically a bigger risk overall vs someone who regards sex more seriously, at least in the context of looking for a relationship. If you're just looking for sex then you're probably value matched so it doesn't really matter.

Sex also has real biological consequences and dangers that can't be completely ignored or separated from the act itself regardless of mitigating modern technology. STDs are a possibility regardless of condoms, pregnancy can mostly be controlled by women at the cost of messing with their hormone profiles but I don't think sex can every truly be separated from it's purpose. There isn't any closer biological contact you can have (well, that I want to think about anyway) with another person and you're making yourself very vulnerable physically by engaging in it.

Men say that they don't want women comparing them to past partners. But that's effectively saying that you want a woman that puts up with bad sex because she doesn't know any better. It would be like not allowing your partner to listen to good music so that they don't know that you're out of tune. Sure she might be more content with out of tune music if she doesn't know any better but that's not actually a good thing

I won't say this is entirely without merit but at the same time this sentiment is often wrapped up in narcissistic crap passed off as self righteousness. There are valid reasons to want a low n count partner or someone who is less promiscuous, framing it as "men are just afraid of being compared to past partners!" is obviously very convenient for women.

Society really worships sex too much and for some women in particular they seem to think it's some kind of insult to imply there are more important things than having the "best sex" of her life by flipping through a phonebook of sex partners.

Copperstoner · 2020-12-09T21:18:23+00:00

It can be the most intimate thing ever or just better masturbation. Depending on why, when and with whom.

Even while I was in relationship sex was sometimes just to „get steam out of the System“, while it was on other times the most sensual thing ever. And another time it was just to pleasure her and and and

So it can be everything or nothing at all.

moneygang4life · 2020-12-09T10:50:45+00:00

Except u dont get stds and lose ur ability to pir bond from dancing

GridReXX · 2020-12-09T17:46:24+00:00

I'll preface this by saying I'm a lesbian woman and not a guy.

To me, saying sex is just another action is basically saying "I don't have a brain connected to my body".

Sex is far more physically and socially intimate than any activity you compared it to and that's what makes it more valuable.

Men inherently value women, first and foremost, for sex. Not even procreation, but to gratify their sexual needs. Procreation is a byproduct of men needing to fulfill their sexual needs. My opinion only, but I think generally society would agree with me. I think it's innate for men to value sex, because it truly is what they regard as the most valuable aspect of women. Their sexuality, and who they are willing to be sexual with. Not their ability to dance or sing or have brains.

And sex is inherently transactional, based on physical pleasure or otherwise, which can also be extremely telling (if you're a straight woman not having orgasms every time you have sex, or in the closet having sex with someone you're not even attracted to, why are you doing it? This says a lot about a person to me as well). Sex for pleasure is inherently based on your attraction to another person which causes extreme PHYSICAL pleasure for yourself, unlike any other activity you mentioned. Dancing will bring you joy, but physical pleasure? No.

Sex is like an aggregate assessment of someone's attractiveness. Anyone who can play the guitar well could be in the band, and anyone can learn the guitar. Would you have sex with anyone who was good at having sex? Why not? I wouldn't. The answer to this is why sex is valued more. Because I'm sure I wouldn't be attracted to everyone that would be good at sex. It has more value than just being able to do it. Anyone can (almost...). It's really not hard to be good at it when comparing to an actual skill like dancing or learning to play the trumpet. To be good at sex is to be good at intimacy and social cues. And dancing is an in between, where it's more social and physical than something like playing in a band but not nearly to the degree of having sex. There are degrees of intimacy. Sex is at the top.

And if you have a brain, sex is usually more than just physical attraction, it's mental, emotional. If it's not for you, I assume you have serious mental problems or are no more intellectually interesting or mentally evolved than an animal which shows me we have different values. I have no problem judging someone who acts on their most primitive instincts at all times. It's like seeing a very obese person who eats nonstop despite the risks because food taste good. I get food tastes good, and I agree. I love food. That's fine, they can do as they please, but I don't want to date someone who has so little value for themselves, their future, their health, their partner... just for some cheap pleasure. Or the guy who punches the wall every time they get upset. Really? You can't control yourself, or more importantly, don't want to control yourself because you see no value in that? If you can't see the value in only having sex with people you love/trust, I'm not going to bother explaining them because there is no point. We look at life and emotional/mental health very differently.

Sex has inherent risk which exacerbate the value attributions to it. Pregnancy, STDs. It can be viewed as a sign of poor judgment. The values in a society would remain even if the risks were eliminated, because sex is social. Society is based on social relationships/hierarchies. I do think your question is interesting and think attitudes will continue to evolve around sex. As a lesbian, I never minded dating women who had many female sexual partners but male sexual partners often bothered me. Primarily, because it is a lot easier to assume women who were with men were being "used" for sex in one way or another, and women with women I assume are doing it truly for pleasure/from a place of empowerment. The former often disgusted me in a way where the latter doesn't bother me at all.

I think men know this about themselves, and it is a major reason why they judge women harshly for former sexual partners - because they themselves use women (or fantasize about it), degrade women as sex objects, or at least see how degraded women are amongst men's circles. The thought that they are dating a woman who has been treated the way they have treated other women, or how their friends treat women, disgusts them. They blame women for the way men treat women. How ironic.

Naxxremel · 2020-12-09T08:19:59+00:00

Sex is a commitment. Anything less is savagery.

moneygang4life · 2020-12-09T11:06:32+00:00

I want my future wife to have sex with me and guys she actually deserves and not a bunch of men she couldnt get to marry her.

IAmTheTrueWalruss · 2020-12-09T08:04:36+00:00

[deleted]

SonicBackScratcher · 2020-12-09T15:12:56+00:00

As someone who has casual sex as a marital hobby, sure it can be 100% like dancing or singing, or any sort of expressive activity.

Key word is can be. This took a mindset, some study, experience, good mental health etc to happen without causing any drama or real negatives. I'd say people like me are a rather small minority and while more people probably could go this route, many would not benefit from it.

I see this on reddit all the time because people are trying this shit too young, without understanding themselves, their partners, etc and then wonder why it explodes in their faces.

Sex can be controlled and shaped but not by everyone.

PMmeareasontolive · 2020-12-09T17:45:14+00:00

Do women like it when men have large N counts?

Taboos about sexuality and promiscuity are largely around preventing pregnancy or disease, but also deal with creating sexuality as a currency, which can be used to create bonds within clans or tribes, and also to procure protection for the female when women were dependent on men.

Nowadays with those things no longer in play, people are free to reinterpret sex in any way they want. It can be a bonding thing if you think it is or a completely casual thing if you think it should be. For those who claim sex is bonding the promiscuous would say there is no shortage of love.

MGTOWManofMystery · 2020-12-09T18:06:59+00:00

Why not make it an activity? "Swing your partner round and round!"

arcticshqip · 2020-12-09T19:02:32+00:00

Sex is to me personally very emotional and sort of spiritual thing. At that moment I have known him long enough to know I love him and at that moment he is my universe, a lifeforce that shares his masculine energy with me and I become obsessed to give him pleasure just as he wants to give it to me. Entanglenment of souls and bodies. He is the most beautiful thing in the world at that moment, regardless of his height, weight or features.

R3adyS3tGo · 2020-12-09T23:02:19+00:00

To me, sex is tied to matters of the heart. The heart which is explained songs and poetry. Sex exclusivity isn't really about the sex. Its about the exclusivity of the sex. The skill is secondary and honestly can probably be developed regardless of multiple sexual partners. My ex and I were virgins and we explored a lot of things on our own, making it good for both.

People don't lose value per say but their sex sure loses value. Their commitment loses value. A person who sides with everyone (like Petyr Belish in GOT) doesn't provide any value in their being on your side save for what you can exploit from them safely until they switch sides again. Likewise I think the sex becomes a take what you can get instead of an offer each other everything sort of deal.

Sufficient-Ad-3586 · 2020-12-10T00:14:21+00:00

People don’t like to imagine their SO being fucked by someone else.

That doesn’t make you insecure or jealous, that makes your normal. Nobody wants to think about someone else having their hands and mouth all over their SO unless you got a kink for that kind of stuff.

Sex is a lot more risky and intimate than dancing or singing since you can create a new human with it or spread an incurable virus.

redpillhub · 2020-12-10T00:49:50+00:00

I believe that it can be both. The act of sex can be different every time even with a monogamous partner. Sometimes I act (go through the motions) sometimes I work my wife and myself out🤷🏾‍♂️

Whisper · 2020-12-10T09:46:24+00:00

Women don't lose value as sexual partners by having sex with different dudes. They lose value as relationship partners.

mohammdvhbzdh · 2020-12-22T15:50:11+00:00

An object

CentralAdmin · 2020-12-09T09:11:14+00:00

I don't get why we feel people lose value by having sex. We don't feel that people lose value as a dancer by dancing with multiple partners.

This would be fine if women never used sex as a tool nor as a resource.

Comparing it to dancing or musicians is disingenuous. They have to practice for years to get good. All a woman has to do to get sex is be available.

You're missing the problem men have with this: women reserve sex for men whom they desire then use it as a tool for men who they don't desire but see as a meal ticket. Even if they didn't use it that way, the ease with which she can get laid means a slut lacks impulse control. This is not good because, as another redditor pointed out, the more previous partners she's had, the greater likelihood of infidelity and divorce.

But that aside, women with high N counts are not displaying something men find important: loyalty. Men value loyalty and wouldn't be happy with a woman who hasn't got a track record of sticking around long enough to know how to handle challenges in relationships. She also will probably waste her youth with men who won't commit and she will waste the time of a man who seeks commitment.

If we used your dancer analogy, you'd also have to ask women why it's a problem if their partners had previously paid for sex. After all, if dancing isn't an issue, surely him paying for a dance isn't either.

Men say that they don't want women comparing them to past partners. But that's effectively saying that you want a woman that puts up with bad sex because she doesn't know any better. It would be like not allowing your partner to listen to good music so that they don't know that you're out of tune. Sure she might be more content with out of tune music if she doesn't know any better but that's not actually a good thing.”

Wrong again. Women love to make this argument. But when men make the mistake of thinking a vagina is extra loose if it takes more dicks, women will be the first to point out that they can have a ton of sex with one guy, effectively nullifying the argument. So she can have a low N count, enjoy sex and be good at it.

You're making a logical fallacy if you think fewer partners means worse sex. What men are saying is that he isn't special if he is dick number 69 on her cock carousel ride to her three digit goal. There's no guarantee she isn't doing it for the validation or just starfishing for five minutes with a one night stand.

Women also want to feel special when they get intimate with someone. Why is this concept so difficult to understand?

There's also the mismatched experiences. A low N man might not feel comfortable dating a high N woman, especially if they run into her exes here and there. He may want a low N woman who also shares similar values.

To further use your analogy, women of PPD have repeatedly said they prefer sex in a committed relationship with someone who has learned how to please them. They claim casual sex sucks.

This would be like having a dance partner who understands your subtleties, is at your skill level and can move and lead almost instinctively. Changing partners means learning this all over again, and if you never stick around long enough to get in sync with your partner, other dancers may not want to be your partner because you lack experience and commitment.

moneygang4life · 2020-12-09T11:06:00+00:00

Women who sleep around in their youth did not treat their eventual husband fairly i dont understand what ppl dont get about this?? Its not complicated if men like young women and young women ignore these men for other me. They dont deserve clearly those men who actually like her will be upset this is soooo simple its unbelievable how many ppl dont get it

Bandit174 · 2020-12-09T13:25:57+00:00

It's not that that she has less sex to give its that the action itself has less value/intimacy the more you give it.

Then insecurity and ego factors in as well. Women can find dance partners far easier than men can and when comparing an average girl to an average guy the dance partners a woman can get are of higher quality than the dance partners the man can. Furthermore women will give dances freely and easily to some guys but expect other guys to work harder to earn those dances which further cheapens things.

But that's effectively saying that you want a woman that puts up with bad sex

No, just because a guy is concerned doesn't mean he has a micro dick and sucks in bed. He could have an average dick and be good but still reasonably be insecure about being compared to muscular guys with 7 -8 inch dicks that fucked like pornstars.

And on some level I think it might be instinctual. For example when a guy knows a woman has slept around he has the image in his head of all these other men fucking her and the mental image of these other men having sex with a woman they are committed to possibly sets off an ingrained cuckhold adversion trigger. For example even if a woman had sex with a bunch of fat ugly midgets with micro penises I would still have a feeling of disgust even though I would have no reason to feel insecure.

And there are statistics that suggest that there is a correlation with increased partners and increased divorce risk. A correlation like that would be a valid concern in any other realm but when it comes to sex and divorce guys are expected to shut up and turn a blind eye.

DeLovehlyCoconute · 2020-12-09T08:02:47+00:00

Neurological effects, definitely. Women with a high N count can't feel love for their partner in a ltr. It causes emotional issues like low self esteem, depression, anxiety. All because of the way those brain chemicals work over time due to sleeping around without a consistent or meaningful sexual experience. It ruins a woman. (Sorry for poor explanation. Just tired and wanna get it out with 0 effort.)

Edit: But yeah, definitely don't mess with casual sex. It's a lifelong regret waiting to happen whether due to lowering your value with single motherhood or a high N count, and the inability to have an emotionally loving relationship. I forgot to mention the ol' mental illness(es) to boot.

LooseIndication · 2020-12-09T16:10:00+00:00

Men gain value by having sex, and women lose value for having sex.

That's because:

-Women get pregnant. (and anticonceptives don't matter)

-Women can only bond with sex. So having sex with multiple males destroys their bonding ability.

TheBookOfSeil · 2020-12-09T08:40:11+00:00

I don't get what you mean.

Sex is a form of expression related to sexual feelings. It can be similar in that there's some form of intimacy motivating their actions but people aren't exactly sexually aroused while they're singing or dancing, so take away the sexual arousal and that would make it more similar.

Sex is an action not an object. When I have sex, I do not have any less sex to give to someone else. Because it's an action not an object.

It sounds silly to phrase it this way because there are plenty of actions that you do less of with other people. I, for example, talk less with some people than with others, and when I'm talking to one person, there is an entire world that I'm talking less to in that moment. They might be confusing themselves with semantics in an effort to make this argument.

I have not lost anything because I performed an action and did not give away an object. I have in fact gained skill by practicing.

That's where they'd be wrong. Every exchange between matter consists of matter. We're exchanging energy at the very least. Just because it can't be seen with the naked eye doesn't mean it's not happening at some level of reality.

I don't get why we feel people lose value by having sex.

It is conceptual "value" but does have some basis in reality. Sex isn't something that happens in a vacuum. It has physical effects on the body that can last beyond the action being performed.

We don't feel that people lose value as a dancer by dancing with multiple partners.

Dancing =/= sex though. They're clearly different actions.

Men say that they don't want women comparing them to past partners. But that's effectively saying that you want a woman that puts up with bad sex because she doesn't know any better. It would be like not allowing your partner to listen to good music so that they don't know that you're out of tune. Sure she might be more content with out of tune music if she doesn't know any better but that's not actually a good thing.”

It's not that they'd be "putting up with bad sex because they don't know any better." It's that they'd be accepting that one thing isn't the same as another thing. Let's say, for example, that someone constantly ate food at a fancy restaurant and then had the same meal cooked at a cheap restaurant. It likely won't be as good, but should that mean that they can't enjoy it because it's not as good? If they will only accept and enjoy the food from the fancy restaurant or complain that it isn't as good, they would be called "spoiled," and that seems to be what the situation is here. Women who expect good sex from every man have been spoiled with good sex and it's likely preventing them from acknowledging and accepting the differences in people.

CosmicBioHazard · 2020-12-09T10:07:33+00:00

I mean, this CMV in itself is coming from the perspective of someone to whom sex has long since ceased to be ‘special’ and now basically has no meaning. The problem that I find with that is; thanks to the release of relevant hormones, sex is the most potent action for giving someone those feelings of intimacy and attachment to their partner, it’s like a finish line for intimacy.

As a divorcee with an N of literally just the one, I’m already not satisfied to commit to someone else when I don’t get to experience that level of intimacy with her fresh and unspoiled; The act doesn’t elevate her, anymore, to a position all to herself.

The possible counter-arguments: “well you hate the ex-wife now so that pedestal has a vacancy” doesn’t work because that pedestal no longer has meaning.

“just have better sex”-not like I can discover it for the first time again, better sex will still be missing that; sensitivity’s gone down.

“bond through means other than sex”-Those means aren’t as potent, they can only do so much.

This dilemma that I’m finding myself in would in theory factor in to how I’d judge a partner as well, if I was looking; She expects me to commit to a sexual relationship with her, but the sex itself isn’t special to her? There are other facets to a romance, sure, but sex is the central one, if that’s not special to her then I’m not special to her and I’m frankly better off not going for it.

NarniaFox · 2020-12-09T07:44:14+00:00

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kor8der · 2020-12-09T10:08:47+00:00

Love too. So what if you partner hugs, kisses, and tells his female friends and coworkers that he loves them? Those are just actions.

And really, objects are just things, they should be worth even less to rational people. So what if he buys more expensive presents for his female friends? As long as you're not actually losing anything, there should be no problem.

cuckspace · 2020-12-09T08:34:00+00:00

Let’s take the music analogy. Let’s say that you were used to having a professional band and singers performing the birthday song on your birthday every year. Then your family and friends will sound pretty shite in comparison, even though they do it with love and appreciation for you.

Sex is an emotional and spiritual bonding ritual. There are some powerful chemicals released, dopamin and oxytocin. The better the sex, the more of these chemicals get released. It affects your nervous system. Lower doses won’t have the same effect once you’ve experienced the higher dose. It’s like trying to achieve the same effect by drinking coffee when you’re used to taking hard drugs. It wrecks your nervous system and natural highs lose their flare.

Kaisha001 · 2020-12-09T09:48:37+00:00

Men have a built in biological wariness of high-n women due to paternity fraud. This is something women just don't have. So while many men will say dumb shit like... well read below... most I feel just have this 'iky' feeling that is their biological programming telling them to beware.

SteveSan82 · 2020-12-09T09:12:23+00:00

For men it’s simply an action. For women it’s an emotional bond. That’s why it’s impossible for men to cheat as he’s simply getting a release.

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