What would it take for men to value commitment on the same level women do?

exit_sandman · 2015-11-05T16:22:46+00:00

a lot of my female friends really want men to be more open to commitment. I hear "men are immature" and "need to man up"

I have the hunch that those women who complain about an unwillingness of men to commit are overwhelmingly refering to a subset of men who can have their pick of women and therefore don't need to commit to get what they want.

betterdeadthanbeta · 2015-11-05T17:46:35+00:00

1) make it harder to get sex outside of commitment

2) make it easier to sex when you already have committed

Too bad modern women are pursuing the opposite strategy: whoring themselves out for chads only to turn around and tell beta bux "sorry im just not in the mood" and "my priorities have changed" and "there's more to a relationship than sex"

Sure fire formula for creating a pump and dump culture

cats_or_get_out · 2015-11-05T16:47:16+00:00

Return of the dowry. Get a wife and a bunch of livestock, too!

mrcs84usn · 2015-11-05T16:16:08+00:00

A complete overhaul of the family court system.
Women maintaining their sex drives after the get the commitment they want.
Women putting more effort in being complimentary and not the competitor
A significant decrease in sluts.

isayimnothere · 2015-11-05T18:25:33+00:00

there are plenty of men who want to commit. Nothing needs cured.

rulenumber303 · 2015-11-05T18:53:54+00:00

Lots of men value commitment. Lots of women value commitment. What you hear when someone of either gender bleating about how they've been on the dating scene for years and get plenty of initial interest nobody wants to stick round is a person who looks appealing in a superficial sense but then is painful to be around in the long term and nobody they actually want to stay will stay. I see no point in changing things so that these people have an easier time of it. I neither need nor want them breeding more like themselves.

TheSandbergPrinciple · 2015-11-05T17:04:02+00:00

It would take women being worth commitment for commitment to make a comeback. Women are incapable of looking in the mirror.

Ultramegasaurus · 2015-11-05T17:22:22+00:00

Apart from divorce laws needing reform, here's my personal "dream wife" list which a lot of men will agree with.

Lay off any sort of attitudes such as "proud bitch" or "challenge me". Don't be obnoxiously opionated and confrontational. Despite media telling you so, it's not attractive in the least.
Don't insist on overly traditional wooing and pursuing, get your ass up and show him you want him too.
Speaking of which: don't use sex as a bribe or withdrawal thereof as blackmail.
Have a steady income and keep at it. Being a provider is becoming unattractive for more and more men. It makes you feel used and is the perfect starting point for divorce rape.
Don't ride the Cock Carousel.
Don't be a nag. Offer support and comfort.

These are the things entirely in women's control. There is more stuff like not insisting on children and not letting your sex drive fall off a cliff, but that's a lot harder to do.

TheGreasyPole · 2015-11-05T17:31:01+00:00

If girls stopped sleeping with anyone unless they put a ring on it...

Commitment would come back with a vengeance. Men like getting laid.

While there are women out there offering the milk for free ? Well, few man getting unlimited free milk (I.e. The guys you want to commit) are going to buy their own cow.

Girls... You need to get your slut shaming hats on!

Iforgotmybucket · 2015-11-05T18:59:43+00:00

I can't possibly be the only woman who has had no problems finding men willing to commit

fiat_lux_ · 2015-11-05T18:35:20+00:00

Some ambitious changes to society:

Improve the gender ratio. Too many kids are going to college now, but college tends to have skewed gender ratio. Too many women, not enough men. Even small imbalances have a huge effect on our behaviours. Something like a 60:40 ratio of women to men (about 50% more women than men) might not SEEM that bad, but once just 20 of the men and 20 of the women hook up, we're left with 40:20 (that's twice as many women as men now!). People pair down, and the ratios end up looking worse... which in turn puts pressure on the remaining singles to pair down even faster. It's a feedback loop of pressure. So the imbalances are always magnified.

Even if you're a completely blind or isolated bper with your own outlier social circle, that doesn't mean the average person won't see this and let it affect their behaviour. I.e. you can claim the pressure doesn't exist for you personally, but other people will feel it and thus your competition will change even if you don't.
Improve the employment ratio for men. Beta males are the ones who tend to favour commitment, but they also tend to be higher FTO than alpha ones. They have beta inhibitions and worries about the future, so they won't marry unless they have that stability. I.e. they need jobs. Alpha cads don't need that to fuck, but they're also less likely to commit.

The problems here are too numerous. For one, beta males will often be dishonest about this. This isn't a comfortable topic for most guys and they won't admit to this insecurity. It also tends to make a lot of men depressed, which busts our balls, lowers our T, and turns us into wimps because we're too busy moping instead of actively doing shit. Also, too many young males are unemployed or working dead end jobs.

This part of the problem might actually go away on its own as baby boomers finally start retiring and leaving room for the younger generation to move on up.
Women themselves might just have to adapt to this new feminist paradise. They wanted more opportunities they also have to take on responsibilities now. One of those responsibilities is to just suck it up and start supporting house husbands who could potentially sit around at home just watching daytime TV (or maybe playing games, the new stay-at-home pasttime). They'll need to just suppress that aversion to hypogamy that men have been doing forever.

AbrasiveAsshole · 2015-11-06T01:50:53+00:00

It would take encouraging women to become women again, not the half-assed men that they've become under feminism and victimhood culture.

ETA: Also women would have to bring their expectations down out of the clouds. Men won't commit to these women because they're chasing the same men that all women want. There's no incentive for those men to settle down.

TRPThrowRug2 · 2015-11-05T17:32:39+00:00

They just want free commitment from men with tons of options.

Just like guys would love free sex from women with tons of options.

I.e. The standard plot lines for chick flicks, and pornos.

truenorth00 · 2015-11-05T16:30:34+00:00

Men do value commitment. But if they aren't committing to you that doesn't mean they are commitment phobic. Just that you aren't what they are looking for. Even George Clooney married in the end.

Women who complain about not finding marriageable men or about men not committing don't understand the difference between the SMP and MMP and their different rankings in each one.

prodigy2throw · 2015-11-05T16:26:23+00:00

Men do value commitment. They just don't trust these hoes.

Vzuv · 2015-11-05T17:50:21+00:00

Men would likely be very happy to commit to the mythical "unicorn" as TRP calls it.

It's essentially a physically attractive woman who will do the sexual things he wants - and do them enthusiastically. Who causes minimal drama in his personal life, while also having unwavering loyalty to him. Obviously this is IDEAL

Outside of that, a lot of other things - such as education, income, etc. etc. are relatively minor concerns - although they are bigger concerns to some than others. Take a poorly educated woman that doesn't work - but ticks all the above boxes, and you'd have a huge line of men wanting to commit to her. Note I'm not saying that an educated woman with high earnings is unattractive - I'm just saying it is a very small variable in the equation for most - especially if the other boxes above are all/mostly checked.

Most, if not all (hence the term "unicorn") are lacking in at least one-to-several of these, and even if there are ones who aren't, the sheer number of them that are lacking in them give men such pause because the court system is favor of women that he can feel trapped in a relationship that he did "commit" to - if a woman has fewer and fewer of those boxes ticked - or they untick over the course of their relationship.

Feminism has sold this idea of women that is not what men want - it has more or less sold the idea of women becoming more like men - and men (at least most) aren't attracted to masculine women, they're attracted to feminine women.

Now, the "good" men are looking for the women that tick a lot of these checkboxes up above - and the "good" women can deservedly have high standards. What's left is that you have a lot of lower-quality women (from a man's perspective) lamenting that they can't have a high quality man (from a woman's perspective).

The lower quality a man is - or, at least - the lower quality a man views himself, the lower his standards are, and the fewer of those boxes have to be checked. I'd say that TRP helps give guys a way to boost their confidence and their belief in their own quality (as well as methods to actually increase their quality).

If you're a fit, confident, high-earning, stable, masculine guy - what incentive do you have to be with a pudgy, unstable, dramatic girl that doesn't do what you want in the bedroom? There isn't one. So the "good" men go to the "good" women.

GridReXX · 2015-11-05T20:55:52+00:00

A man who can get anything he wants without committing will only commit if:

He's physically and mentally tired of the player lifestyle and has exhausted all of his personal utility from it - he wants a family and kids and some semblance of a "full house."
He finds his idea of an exceptional woman who makes him want to commit.

I've seen both happen.

So basically he has the same reasoning as a hot woman.

impossibleworlds · 2015-11-05T17:54:38+00:00

IMO, men don't owe anyone long-term commitment, much like women don't owe anyone sex. Women aren't entitled to commitment (especially from an attractive man) by the merit of being alive or just showing up to the party. For me to deny this would be akin to saying men are entitled to sex for just being alive. Not, in fact, accurate. The bars to clear are much higher for those things, and not guaranteed regardless.

It's not something to be "cured," it's just a fact.

runitonce007 · 2015-11-05T16:47:27+00:00

Commitment needs to be made more appealing to men - what do they really get out of it? Women have more to gain out of commitment. Once you're married, all the power lies with them.

MissMaude · 2015-11-05T21:08:29+00:00

I've always found it to be true that some men want commitment and some men don't. Some men warm to the idea of commitment with age. I don't think there's much women or a woman can (or should) do to make a man interested in commitment that is not. If a woman wants commitment, she just needs to save her time for men who also want it.

Side note: I think it's lame to call lack of intrest in commitment something to "cure." People who are honest about not wanting anything more than casual romance aren't broken.

RobotPartsCorp · 2015-11-05T22:18:49+00:00

Men value commitment to the right woman. Women value commitment to the right man. I have never had any issues with men and commitment, I feel like this is an issue that those on reddit talk about or the Daily Mail or something. Men don't need to be "cured". You get what you give.

yo_radical_one · 2015-11-05T18:16:04+00:00

Honestly, lets say I had a top job and a beautiful woman and I was gunned down and in bed for months and she stood by me even though I was useless for ages and had to rebuild myself and she had other good offers and could swing with complete ease.

Then I would be like damn that's a good girl, just being there isn't enough, being there when it's hard is what counts.

RU_Crazy · 2015-11-05T18:39:51+00:00

Men want and value commitment but its not the same. Women want emotional commitment. Men want physical commitment.

So yea, a man wants commitment but what that means to us is that you've committed your body for our use. Preferably, exclusive use.

As a man I just don't require emotional support on that level to feel good/happy about myself. But I do require physical intimacy i.e. physical commitment.

PhantomDream09 · 2015-11-05T19:04:39+00:00

Finding a good woman.

louplop · 2015-11-05T19:57:31+00:00

How did the men react to this Facebook post ? And how old are you ?

VermiciousKnidzz · 2015-11-05T22:09:49+00:00

i thought RP always preached that its women who are on the "cock carousel" and can't commit? that men are the emotionally superior ones?

saying "women/men can/can't" commit is naive and stupid imo, talk to your partner and find out what each person wants out of relationships immediately.

honest communication honestly isn't that difficult.

wub1234 · 2015-11-05T16:00:20+00:00

I think just generally people should be more open and honest about their intentions. Its' fine to have a fuck buddy relationship with someone if everyone knows what's at stake. But too often people lead each other up the garden path and needlessly hurt each other, and I find that one of the least attractive elements of our culture.

anacrassis · 2015-11-05T15:57:08+00:00

A shortage of marriageable women.

wtknight · 2015-11-05T17:11:37+00:00

Without traditional religion and society guiding things anymore, it would take a greater reward vs. risk equation for men to make most of them want to settle down and be committed. So, either he would have to find someone who seems like a unicorn to him and just as committed to him as he would be to her, or the divorce laws would need to change a bit more in men's favor. If a man wants a child enough and to play a part in raising that child, that may be enough of a reward to make him settle down and be committed to a woman, as well, but more and more men don't seem to want children, it seems.

nicethingyoucanthave · 2015-11-05T18:17:25+00:00

You get more of whatever behaviors you reward.

There is variation in every population, and therefore in every population there are men who value commitment very highly. If those men leave more and healthier offspring, then there will be more men in the next generation with the genes that predispose them toward that behavior.

...if on the other hand, the men who value sex a lot and commitment very little (continue to) leave more offspring, then that preference will become more common.

MoneyOverSluts · 2015-11-05T19:14:09+00:00

How about this instead "how do we teach women to be more appealing to men so that they'll want to commit?"

[deleted] · 2015-11-05T19:50:09+00:00

Do you want to change how men feel? Give up. You won't.

It's nature. It's simple. It's biological. Men can't get pregnant. That explains the male basic instic: spread semen.

Men only commit if they have to, because men instinctly desire variety.

Rufus_Reddit · 2015-11-05T20:40:50+00:00

What changes could be made to "cure" men's commitment issues?

It seems like an attitude adjustment could help : Why is it that if a woman is unhappy with how the relationship is going, it's the guy that has issues? If friend of mine wants his girlfriend to be more open to, say, oral sex, I don't say that she's got oral sex issues.

It would, of course, help a lot if there were clarity and openness about relationship roles and expectations, but requires confidence and self-awareness that people generally don't have.

madscientistlove · 2015-11-05T21:21:10+00:00

I don't think it's that men are "afraid of committment" so much as young men don't want to commit.

I've met very few early- to mid-20's men who wanted to settle down. I'd say women should fish in a slightly older pool to get commitment if they want it... go for the men who've already had their fill of "sowing wild oats".

cromulent_weasel · 2015-11-06T02:47:24+00:00

Women: Why can't men be more like women?

Men: Why can't women be more like men?

darksoldierk · 2015-11-06T03:32:40+00:00

Nothing. That's like asking "what change could be made to "cure" women's labidos?". There is no "cure" because it's not a sickness. It's nature.

kick6 · 2015-11-05T16:36:54+00:00

Women are the gatekeepers of sex

Men are the gatekeepers of commitment.

What would it take to "cure" men's commitment issue? Two options

be a better bitch (be worth commitment)
make them women.

cravenravens · 2015-11-05T21:00:53+00:00

Seems like men already value commitment, if they complain about women cheating etc.?

OmLaLa · 2015-11-05T15:59:04+00:00

Effortless sex.

BeyondTheLight · 2015-11-05T17:37:31+00:00

Make them wait more. If sex is less available, then men will jump through more hoops to get it. Face it we live in a time where people can easily get sex with a wode variety of people too, so what good reason is there for men to commit to these women if they give sex easily away? You know aside from things like "snot fair!".

Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2015-11-05T19:42:47+00:00

female scarcity rather than abundance. when women are abundant and free, men are coy, when men are abundant and free women are coy. its not magic

ManRAh · 2015-11-05T22:46:03+00:00

Men have always valued commitment, but increasingly commitment comes with risk. If 30% of first marriages end in divorce, and 70% of divorces are instigated by women, what incentive do men have to get married, especially if it's likely to end up in massive financial burden? Refusing to toe the social line isn't a fear of commitment, it's risk mitigation.

Xemnas81 · 2015-11-06T00:01:15+00:00

Women lowering their standards and genuinely desiring a beta bux they previously friendzoned. Problem: Hypergamy doesn't care, women's SMV inflated by social media, online dating and feminist imperative
Destroy the bastardised Marriage 2.0; end no-fault divorce, reform the divorce courts, bankrupt the divorce industry (cf. Misandry Bubble)

tallwheel · 2015-11-06T04:40:00+00:00

It's been tried already, in several independent locations and times throughout history. It's called traditional marriage and religion.

RacialRealism · 2015-11-06T08:21:31+00:00

What changes could be made to "cure" men's commitment issues?

Cook, Clean and Swallow. Congratulations you are now every man's dream wife.

In the modern age it's too much to ask for, no it's even "sexist" to suggest that a women should be able to cook, clean and be down to slob some knob.

"I am an insufferable cunt who is extremely selfish with my desires, why wont men commit to me? :("

stairstepper357 · 2015-11-06T10:17:06+00:00

We don't need a cure. We need to know that making a commitment is worth it, and we're smart enough to know that making a commitment to girls like that is never worth it.

ifelsedowhile · 2015-11-05T21:04:15+00:00

probably we should give kids a gender neutral education because differences in sexuality between genders are 100% social constructs like marxists, feminists, creationists and SJWs successfully proved beyond any doubt. /s

LadyVetinari · 2015-11-06T03:15:02+00:00

Well, if you're consider the Redpill as if it was a legitimate strategy, you're probably retarded. Therefore, I'm not surprised that the facebook friends of a...more slow individual also speak to what idiots think.

Men and women are not separate species, the people in my life who consider them as such are fucking imbeciles. So, If you are giving creedence to the shit you see on facebook from your "friends" you're just probably stupid, sorry. No help there.

Aerobus · 2015-11-05T19:33:48+00:00

Women behaving.

Learn to close your mouth. Eat less. Practice saying "yes dear." Cook food. Spread your legs. Don't be fat. Wear a dress. Smile more. Act like less of a bitch.

These simple things are too complicated for the average female.

Gnometard · 2015-11-05T19:16:07+00:00

Less yoga pants, more time dressing like you care.

Less blaming everything on everyone (this mysterious they that tells women how to look#act) and more being interesting and responsible.

Less nagging.

Until then, I commit to my friends and family while getting my sex from the abundance of ladies to choose from.

Title	What would it take for men to value commitment on the same level women do?
Author	LimboLoves
Upvotes	12
Comments	282
Date	November 5, 2015 3:54 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/3rn2ve/what_would_it_take_for_men_to_value_commitment_on/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/what-would-it-take-for-men-to-value-commitment-on.278628 https://theredarchive.com/post/278628

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