When women find most men ugly, it's because they overrate their own attractiveness due to desperate men and the added benefit of makeup

SmilesLikeMardiGras · 2022-10-19T10:26:53+00:00

there is less than zero relationship between perception of ones own own attractiveness as a woman and what is found attractive in men, ther eis only what you can obtain base don your own attractiveness. this is an extremely off and bizarre analysis based on false premises

decoy88 · 2022-10-19T05:11:51+00:00

Whether or not men think I’m attractive and what I look like with or without makeup has literally no impact on which men I find attractive so I have no idea the point that is being made here. I could never receive an ounce of male attention the rest of my natural life, which men I am attracted to would not change

januaryphilosopher · 2022-10-19T08:30:40+00:00

That's not what women usually say at all. They say that strangers on the street don't stand out to them, nd they're not particularly motivated to do anything with many people based on just their looks. This doesn't mean these people are ugly, or even that they wouldn't date or have sex with them. I've noticed that women have a different meaning of attractive too, meaning they like someone enough to be considering the long term, rather than men who often use it to mean someone doesn't disgust them and they can tolerate them for a quick fuck. (And, as I keep pointing out, a six with makeup isn't going to be a three without. Makeup just can't work that kind of miracle.)

eth_trader_12 · 2022-10-19T05:33:09+00:00

I’m not attracted to the vast majority of men, that doesn’t mean I find them “ugly,” and I find the large majority of women say similar. And it’s not that we “underrate” guys at first when we grow to find them more attractive, it’s that physical attraction and desire for many women simply works a bit differently than it does for many men.

At any rate, I can assure you that how I perceive male attractiveness has little relationship with how I perceive my own.

hungrychick404 · 2022-10-19T05:54:49+00:00

Maybe men should start wearing makeup to be easier on the eyes

brownbellahadid · 2022-10-19T05:41:55+00:00

Thats not how sexuality works lol. You either make her wet or you dont. Has nothing to do with how you perceive yourself.

The9thElement · 2022-10-19T11:04:47+00:00

No it’s because they’re ugly

ElectricBugs · 2022-10-19T07:44:07+00:00

What a lot of men miss in these kind of discussions is that rating other people for attractiveness is already so subjective.

If someone finds me attractive that has little bearing on if I find them attractive. In fact I have seen guys who are super fucking hot but then open their mouths and act like dicks who then make my pussy clamp shut despite how fucking physically hot they are. Females in animal species are always more selective than men. That's literally just the biological reality of the animal kingdom. It's not like human women are deliberately punishing human men. It's that we are wired to find certain things attractive, a lot of which isn't based on physical looks but more in line with biological imperatives for breeding etc.

But on the same rate we also have our own ability to transform past those biological imperatives due to evolution. However, that still means that women and attractiveness is still about intangible and subjective impulses/hormones. What is true for one person is not true for others etc. So your ugly woman is probably another man's hotter chick. but none of that changes the fact that men and women find different things attractive and women will partner or fuck guys based on a variety of factors, none of which is dependent on his rating of her.

mistressusa · 2022-10-19T12:01:48+00:00

"Every woman has experienced the phenomena of finding a man physically unattractive at first and then suddenly finding him attractive once they get to know the guy and their perception changes. It’s not just that the guy’s personality overcomes his looks. It’s that their physical attractiveness quite literally changes in the woman’s eyes."

Yup, happened to me and many women I know irl. Many incels here think this is urban legend though.

kalashhhhhhhh · 2022-10-19T07:38:11+00:00

Women don't find most men ugly, most men are just normal, nothing special (before you get to know their energy).

Finding someone attractive has absolutely no correlation with whether they find me attractive or not.

Nymd90 · 2022-10-19T05:59:28+00:00

Women don't view the attraction of men the same way men view the attraction of women.

The application of Tinder and the added liberalization of promiscuity that comes with it, has led to an imbalance in the dating market system. Men have, to the most part, created this problem for themselves by being desperate and overrepresented in these dating apps. This leads to an imbalance in supply and demand, thus pushing the equilibrium to their disadvantage. This naturally gives women the ability to cherry pick men.

However, like I mentioned above, there's a greater complexity than the psychical appearence itself. Men has a way more simplistic view of determining the attractiveness of a women, which rely a lot on pure psychical appearence, in combination of the equilibrium, makes men less picky. In the other case, there's far more factors in play. Women value other attributes of men, (such as personality, confidence, the ability to make them comfortable and the depth of connection between them), a lot higher, thus making psychical attraction less valued, even if it important in some cases too.

*edit: we tend to forget that psychical attraction and sexual attraction is not entirely the same. Sexual attraction allows a second chance for uglier men to compensate their looks by having other desireable traits that has the potential to boost their psychical attraction in the eyes of the woman that they have an emotional connection with.

2022-10-19T07:04:42+00:00

I concurr, to a degree i guess. I had an experience recently where i was hardcore attracted to a woman that i knew quite well. Then i found her instagram account. Complete thirst trap account and the woman on the pictures, while it was clear it was supposed to be her, wasn't really her. If you know what i mean. While she didn't outright use photoshop it was clear that she was "enhanced".

Then i found out she has fake eyebrows, fake eyelashes, fake freckles, fake eye color and uses way more make up than i thought.

Instagram 8, IRL + Makeup 5, no makeup 3-4 at best. Acts as if she is a 10 and uses men up until she is bored of them. The men are to blame tho because they have no spines.

On the other hand, most women i know don't use that much makeup to really say that they are in some ways deceiving anyone about their own looks. It doesn't change who they find attractive because even the fattest slob of a man is still attracted to beautiful women. So our own attractiveness isn't really part of our own attraction patterns.

SeliciousSedicious · 2022-10-19T10:15:10+00:00

Im of the firm opinion that men need to raise their standards.

Would go a long way to helping correct this.

BetaNatalis · 2022-10-19T13:34:56+00:00

I’m curious why so male posters on this sub claim that most women find most men are unattractive. I don’t think this is actually a thing.

AngelxEyez · 2022-10-19T15:08:44+00:00

how pretty or ugly I feel doesnt have any effect on how I see others????

like I do my makeup really well one day and wear my best clothes and suddenly chad down the st seems less chad-like? lol I roll out of bed one day and look like a slob so so terry working the corner store by my house starts looking mighty fine???

these things have 0 correlation

if you look good, you look good regardless of what I look like. if you ugly… you ugly no matter what I look like

Lift_and_Lurk · 2022-10-19T17:19:10+00:00

Pretty sure is that most men are average. But the thing is average women can still get some. Average dudes? If you don’t got the looks young better have something.

Complaining or bashing the other side or trying to judge “how fair it is” is useless. This is how it is, this is how it was, and this is how it will be.

handsanitizer-- · 2022-10-19T05:08:03+00:00

Most people don't look good. Without makeup, average women are equal to average men. I'm not impressed by average men so why would I be impressed by average women?

Bandit174 · 2022-10-19T12:59:07+00:00

I think it's because of pregnancy. Women subconsciously judge mens looks from the perspective of "are his genes worth enduring pregnancy and potentially dying over" and that will be a much more strict standard than the one that men judge womens looks on.

Mens looks being judged by women is the strictest standard.

Women's looks being judged by men, women's looks being judged by women and men's looks judged judged by men will all be easier standards/thresholds to pass and its not a coincidence that none of those pairings involve pregnancy.

techr0nin · 2022-10-19T11:24:05+00:00

The idea that a woman has to be matched to a man of equal sexual value is driven by the underlying assumption of everyone being monogamously paired off. And while this might be a stronger assumption when discussing marriage prospects, it isn’t the case in the context of dating/casual sex/FWB relationships.

In reality most people, both men and women, do eventually pair off and marry, and most of them with their looks-match. Most of the inequalities between men and women and HVM and LVM happen prior to tying the knots.

gymbro718NYC · 2022-10-19T12:32:23+00:00

Isn't this the third thread this week on this very topic?

AstronautLoveShack · 2022-10-19T14:37:27+00:00

I don't wear makeup, so if I say you're ugly, you're definitely ugly.

bunnakay · 2022-10-19T14:57:23+00:00

My makeup use has changed over the 25 years I've been wearing it. My taste in men hasn't. If I see a man as ugly, nothing I do to myself is going to change that. Only he can change my opinion.

2022-10-19T15:47:13+00:00

tell me why more men aren't artists muses then.

Oli_love90 · 2022-10-19T15:52:16+00:00

I have to disagree on like…everything.

No, men don’t find more women attractive. Statistically that would be actually impossible. You all are not walking around turned on by literally every. Single. Women you see. So it stands to reason you also don’t find a lot of us that attractive.

We don’t think men are “ugly”. Most humans are not judging people on a pass/fail metric. If anything most men are simply average, most HUMANS are average. I’ve NEVER heard a woman complain there are no attractive men around, that would be a dumb statement from a stupid person.

Women do not overate their own attractiveness and makeup is not magic. Makeup cannot make you look THAT much better. If it does you are a drag Queen or an artist. We are not fooled into thinking we’re cuter with a face full of makeup. That again would be ridiculous, Do you forget what you normally look like if you got a nice haircut, trimmed a beard or shaped your eyebrows?

If you “suddenly realize” a women is not as beautiful as you first thought your standards for how humans and women “should” look is too high or unrealistic.

2022-10-19T18:16:17+00:00

Because ugly women are gaslit that they are 10/10. So then they end up repulsed when they meet their equal in looks male

Laurely4u · 2022-10-19T20:48:09+00:00

As an elderly grandmother I can still se which men are attractive and my view of men hasn’t changed because my own appearance changed.

Andrew-Taint · 2022-10-19T07:20:06+00:00

Yeah but the reason so many women find men gross is because so many men are actually gross. It's purely down to grooming and taking care of yourself. If 80% of men put the same effort in to look good as women do, 80% of men would be pretty attractive. Short/tall doesn't matter. Most women do the most they can to look pretty, most men don't. Simple as. And I say that as a man.

AshookaNaga · 2022-10-19T05:07:43+00:00

Tbh men are pretty ugly. Sex is best with the lights out.

I mean seriously. Would you have sex with a sweaty hairy man unless you were paid?

That’s why I only date desperate women with low self-esteem.

Clearly there’s something wrong with them if they’re attracted to men.

Like deeply wrong. A woman being attracted to you is a serious red flag. Obviously she’s a psycho.

Women into guys are seriously gay.

blockboii190 · 2022-10-19T12:19:57+00:00

Why do women were make up

Apprehensive_Cut_146 · 2022-10-19T10:07:06+00:00

When women find most men ugly, it's because they overrate their own attractiveness

Not everything has to be mental projection.

Ask men what % of women they find attractive

About the same percentage like women. Attraction and “fckble” are different things.

The latter will usually say they find most men ugly

So what? We aren’t supposed to find a lot of people attractive, goes against our instinct

Attraction is all about perception ~~and demand~~

FTFY

It’s been shown that women consistently underrate men at first glance and men consistently overrate women at first glance.

Every woman has experienced the phenomena of finding a man physically unattractive at first and then suddenly finding him attractive once they get to know the guy and their perception changes.

It doesn’t change, it’s just that she gets mentally and emotionally attached, hormones are a different matter. She wants more due to emotions, not lust.

It’s that their physical attractiveness quite literally changes in the woman’s eyes.

Its just that emotions take over hormones

Cat_Lover259 · 2022-10-19T06:05:22+00:00

We all have our types, not every single man we see is attractive just like not every woman you see is attractive. Most average men feel like they don’t need to make themselves appear more attractive because most of the time they don’t care about what they look like compared to women. They just do it to themselves ultimately.

2022-10-19T07:14:14+00:00

I am a man and personally very few women I found are attractive enough without makeup. Also aging I think affects women much more than a man. The most affected part of men is the belly ,while you cannot be attracted to the thighs,ass even face of an aging women. But telling a woman that she isnt beautiful is like telling a man that youre impotent. This false sense of beauty makes em spend thousands on beauty products. Their biological instinct is to find a 10/10 man if shes 4/10 herself. Men compelled with T levels agree to sleep with 4/10 women,despite them being much higher. In several married couples I found the women are worse than the men. They are generally way way shorter,,fat,,unattractive figure etc. A taller wider woman is much sexier and beautiful than them.

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SwimmingTheme3736 · 2022-10-19T13:28:25+00:00

Women do not say that

howdoiw0rkthisthing · 2022-10-19T16:19:05+00:00

I felt this way long before I knew how to dress or wear makeup. My self image was not inflated.

MistyMaisel · 2022-10-19T16:56:14+00:00

Nah, chief.

Women rate men low because they're evaluating them for dating purposes, not sex. And dating/relationships mean a lot and require a lot. And a lot more than how they look. And yes, the more you know a man, the better he looks because the more you understand how he's animating the body he's in.

Men rate women high because they're evaluating them for sex purposes, not dating. And the rating scale here is basically, does it have a vagina and would it possibly be something I could hop in? And the more men get to know women, the less enamored they are because she's not a fantasy anymore. She's a real person and real people are never as fun as the lies in our head.

briiiana1122 · 2022-10-19T18:42:24+00:00

t Hg to Jo

RocinanteCoffee · 2022-10-19T20:46:09+00:00

If I suddenly became hideous tomorrow (whatever anyone's definition of conventionally hideous is) it wouldn't change who I am attracted to. I was attracted to the same people when I was a young teen with zits, terrible hair style, and my mom dressed me in awful clothes as I am now with good skin, hair, and better style and fitness.

What you look like doesn't have any impact on who when you see them for the first time appeals to you.

Filmguy000 · 2022-10-19T21:03:47+00:00

Yeah women do care about looks more than men in my opinion. But they are also attracted to a man's energy. If you act as ugly as you look, it's a no go. But if you make her feel a certain amount of good and anxious (in a guilty pleasure kind of way) then you are golden. You may not have them lining up. But you can still land some lays or find a girlfriend.

2022-10-19T21:48:31+00:00

Be ause most men are not beautiful nor pretty.

Just-Pie-5579 · 2022-10-19T23:01:26+00:00

FOR THE THOUSANDS TIME. There is not such a thing is overrating or underrating, or blowing the rating out of proportion, or inflating the rating on the sexual market. However people rate you is in fact your rating by definition - whether the people are thirsty, hungry or some other goddamn thing. Take economics and don't waste people's time.

UnfurtletDawn · 2022-10-20T02:09:09+00:00

1# beautiful women stick more in head than beautiful men

So you men remember and perceive then more than vice versa

2# majority of people are not exactly attractive. Just look at obesity stats.

3# women put more effort into their appearance so they look better.

Make up, clothes etc...

Gee I wonder when you dress well you look better. Who would have guessed.

Ok_Razzmatazz_1751 · 2022-10-20T02:57:36+00:00

Have you never just looked at some one and think damn they are attractive? It's the same way with women looking at a man. If they by chance are negotiating within their selves , they by definition don't have true sexual attraction, it's settling. There are truly ugly people in this world. Poor hygiene , lousy genetics , no ambition. Not every individual on Earth should procreate. Who rates their self in incomparison. How odd I'd like to add. Makeup has been around for literally since the Egyptian times. Why do you guys act like your generation is so hindered in comparison to everyother generation. Relating to makeup , it's evolved just like everything else in society. Each generation had its difficulty, but damn these newer generations , jeesus.

SoleMatesC4S · 2022-10-22T05:18:49+00:00

Nah. Most of the women I either know or have spoken to who say "the majority of men are ugly" are stuck-up misandrists who think their shit don't stink. If that's the first thing out of their mouths, start asking them other questions and note their responses. I guarantee you that "the majority of men are ugly" will be the most polite part of the conversation if you dig deeply enough, because fundamentally, on a deep level, they hate men. hate.

Additional_Speech164 · 2022-10-22T13:55:00+00:00

No . It’s bc we’re not desperate.

fayaz_mogra8 · 2022-10-23T09:50:01+00:00

Additional_Speech164 · 2022-10-27T01:10:49+00:00

No, first off I wouldn’t tell someone they’re ugly. I have a type and that’s consistent.

Title	When women find most men ugly, it's because they overrate their own attractiveness due to desperate men and the added benefit of makeup
Author	eth_trader_12
Upvotes	51
Comments	186
Date	October 19, 2022 5:00 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/y7te6f/when_women_find_most_men_ugly_its_because_they/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/when-women-find-most-men-ugly-its-because-they.1135851 https://theredarchive.com/post/1135851

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