Why do women expect equality in decision making but not equality in paying for things or completing house tasks?

UpbeatInsurance5358 · 2023-12-03T15:52:54+00:00

Most of the stuff women are expected to do are daily chores. Mens are usually once in a while.

wtknight · 2023-12-03T14:18:01+00:00

If you pay for nothing, and do very little around the house(doing dishes, sweeping, etc for two ppl is NOTHING in the grand scheme of taking care of a house), then you need to compensate by being agreeable, submissive and peaceful.

A lot of women would rightfully rather live alone in rental properties with maintenance service included in the rent than agree to these kinds of terms with a man.

badgersonice · 2023-12-03T15:06:57+00:00

while men are expected to take care of the car, move anything, hang everything, clean the gutters, take out and bring in trash, mow the lawn, irrigate the lawn, replace anything that needs to be replaced, pay bills.

lol, and if you live in a big city in an apartment,, this means you as a man have almost 0 of those duties as a man. Somehow I doubt if you’d ever say men should be submissive to women if they simply live in an apartment and have public transport.

And it’s traditional in many cultures, or even within many families for the woman to do all the accounting and bill paying for the family. For example, in families that ran general stores, the woman was very often the accountant.

Your “partner” does 10% of the work while you do the other 90%… Imagine paying for someone’s entire life… If you put up 30% of everything that has to be paid for, you can have a 30% say in the decision making about shit we pay for.

The problem I see here is that men who think women should be subordinate to them worship money as the measure of all worth, and do not respect women for the work they demand those women do for them. They’re like a cheap-ass disrespectful boss who underpays them, doesn’t even thank them for doing anything, and then doesn’t even give them a good recommendation when they leave (because doing stay at home wife stuff doesn’t ever benefit the woman for her next relationship after this dude inevitably burns her out— she gets to start from a worse position next time, being older and less desirable).

Men like this simply regard the feminine work they supposedly want women to do as lowly and beneath them (but still demand the woman do that without thanks or credit), and meanwhile regard the number on their paycheck as a sign that they are important and should rule. If they actually valued the work they expect out of women, they’d actually respect the woman for doing it. And the reality is a lot of men don’t respect that work at all (and never have) based on how they act. So is it any surprise most women don’t want to take that role any more?

You wanna know a big reason why so many women want to work outside the home for pay these days? Because too many men think like you do: that having a job makes someone valuable and important and worthy of a voice and power like a king, and doing housework and childcare are not worthwhile and valuable contributions to the home, so women should shut up and obey like a lowly peasant

Imagine expecting women to all sorts of work for you for no thanks that won’t benefit them at all in the long run, all so they can also have no say in their own lives! Like, dude, no wonder women would rather work for their boss than for (generic) you— they get some long term benefits on top of their pay, and on top of that, a paycheck is the only thing guys like this evidently respect anyways!

lil_kleintje · 2023-12-03T16:37:46+00:00

I would hate decision making done on my behalf, but then I HAD to plan all the trips/figure out all the gifts on his behalf/look into activities for our kid etc. etc. and then try and kindly communicate to him so that he wouldn't be insulted by micromanaging - that apparently WASN'T a part of decision-making and could be completely ignored. How many times did he cook a meal for me and my kid in 10 years? Less than a dozen.

Lenovo_Driver · 2023-12-03T13:52:26+00:00

This post is ridiculous.

When in your bullshit examples where you talk about 90/10% of tasks being broken down, you’re flat out ignoring frequency of tasks being completed or who is more likely to even perform those tasks.

Cooking is done every day. Cleaning is done every day.

Mowing the lawn, gutter cleaning, hanging things, moving things? How often is that even done? If I had a roommate that thought this was an equal exchange, I’d tell them to fuck off and get to cleaning.

Also in 2023, how many relationships do you actually think have men paying the entire lives of their partners? The average relationship has both partners working and paying for shit. Your belief system needs to leave the 1950s and catch up with our reality today.

With condos, apartments and HOAs being so prominent today most people don’t even have yard work to do.

deste_eloise · 2023-12-03T13:31:20+00:00

just get a pet? you’ll pay all the bills, take care of everything and they’ll love you unconditionally and won’t undermine your imaginary authority. it’s simple & way easier.

ItWasBrokenAlready · 2023-12-03T14:18:55+00:00

Do you live on a farm? Most city-dwellers like me and almost everyone I know, have to face maybe one 'manly' task a year, like idk, putting an Ikea shelf together. And even then its done by the couple usually. The rest of the shit (renovations, repairs etc) gets outsourced. That would give you like, one dinner a year, provided you make dessert afterwards, if you want to keep it fair and balanced ;)

mackenzie013_02 · 2023-12-03T13:13:18+00:00

What is all this decision making? Literally never had a conversation about “hey I have at least 45% say in X” ..someone makes some decision, the other makes other decisions (granted don’t have kids).

Also - most of the “male” house tasks are very often outsourced.

Cethlinnstooth · 2023-12-03T14:03:30+00:00

Women who have the means to pay for anything or the energy to exert significant efforts aren't choosing to live with the sort of power obsessed man you describe. That's what I get from your post.

Why should normal people who behave in normal ways around issues of resources and power concern themselves with how the dregs treat each other? Those people gonna go off and have their miserable households together arguing about stuff that normal people just take in stride.

mrs_seng · 2023-12-03T15:05:39+00:00

With this kind of thinking, no wonder these guys are single. No sane woman would take such a bad deal.

Cooking, cleaning, laundry, washing dishes are done daily, bi-weekly or weekly. The car is repaired once or twice a year. And even when he fixes something, guess who's bringing the tools, guess who's holding the flashlight, guess who's cleaning afterwards.

Not to mention that i already know how to do most of those things myself: change a power socket, repair pipes, etc. Or if i don't want to do it, i can call a handyman and i have the financial resources to pay him.

This is why i say, women don't need a man on a personal level, but will take one if she wants him.

zeynabhereee · 2023-12-03T14:22:16+00:00

How do you guys have the time to come up with these weird hypothetical situations? You don’t have lives or hobbies? No wonder y’all sit at home and complain about not getting any woman.

KayRay1994 · 2023-12-03T16:56:05+00:00

let’s pretend in relationships where both partners work and don’t have kids and are in equal footing that this does happen, let’s just pretend. (although in most relationships where the two work and are of a similar income bracket and there are no kids, both pay and the woman usually does a bit more housework)

You do realize that decision making and paying for things/houseowork are not the same, right?

i see a lot of “but i’m not objectifying” on this sub, yet i also constant objectifying behavior. If you think paying for her stuff and doing the houseworks means you make your decisions for her, that means you have a lot of thoughts of ownership towards her that you need to address. It very much reads like “I expect the loss of your autonomy in exchange for doing these tasks”, it’s dehumanizing.

FromAuntToNiece · 2023-12-03T13:57:07+00:00

You forgot doing the laundry. Who does that?

In a relationship with no kids, I think the big stressor is cooking. Men can step up to do almost everything else a woman does.

tawny-she-wolf · 2023-12-03T16:10:03+00:00

I mean... my partner and I go 50/50 on everything (because we make similar money, we actually split in proportion to our income).

As to the tasks... all the ones you listed you also have to take time into account. Let's say no kids. She's probably doing at least 2 loads of laundry per week, that's sorting and loading the machines, possibly ironing, folding and putting away or hanging stuff to dry plus possible trips to the dry cleaners for odder items. Cooking can easily at least 1h/day if not more if she cooks fresh every day, then there's meal planning, meal prepping, grocery shopping at least once a week and putting groceries away then there's dishes and cleaning the countertops/stove etc. Cleaning the house is also at least once a week and depends how deep clean you go but can take a while depending on size, number of bathrooms and cleanliness standards.

Now, let's talk about the chores you gave to your hypothetical man: - taking care of the car, I have a newer car so this is basically taking it to get serviced once in 2025 and then again in 2027 (which I do because it's my car) - move and hang stuff, do you redecorate once a week at your place ? I think this is more of a once every couple years or more type of thing - clean the gutters: again, how often do you do it and how long does it take ? If you do it once a year and it takes you five hours, congrats that's less than a week of cooking for her (which she does 52 weeks a year) - trash: it takes literally 5 minutes 2-3 times a week - mow the lawn & irrigate: what if you live in an apartment ? No lawn work. Say you do have a backyard, you already get at least the winter months where there's nothing to do. Do you have sprinklers ? Automated. Depends on location and size of the yard of course but it also seems like at most you're spending a couple hours on it every two weeks and only part of the year if you don't have a mansion with crazy maintenance. Congrats that's about the time she spends on laundry every week or so. - paying bills: I'd say a lot of women these days also handle the finances (I do for joint things)

So in the end, different chores but in terms of time they take up, hers make up a higher %, especially if they live in an apartment and have decent cars. Why should she not get 50% say in decisions !?

apresonly · 2023-12-03T18:08:52+00:00

> They rather not take a submissive role in a relationship

the vast majority of men can't provide for a woman without her working full time herself, why would she be submissive to her roommate?

januaryphilosopher · 2023-12-03T15:31:16+00:00

There are not many teams where everyone does exactly the same things in the exact same amounts with nobody specialising. That does not mean that two people doing different things can't have equal say over the whole affair, especially when they're contributing equally but differently. If you do more of the writing up while your partner does more of the research gathering, you can still be equal at the end of the day. You might have the last word in writing but not on what the project will be about. And women generally have less free time in relationships, you'll notice that "their" tasks have to be done constantly and are big time drains (and you forgot the biggest one, children) while the "male" ones are small amd intermittent, apart from having a job which women need too.

philseven12 · 2023-12-03T13:20:59+00:00

women are pretty helpful and eager to contribute/cooperate if they are attracted to you. guys need to stop getting involved with women who aren’t particularly interested in them to avoid these kinds of happy wife, or everything is on ice dynamics. i dont stick around women who act like they’re doing me a favor

LadyLazarus2021 · 2023-12-03T20:25:13+00:00

As a woman, I know how to change oil, tires, etc. When I lived alone in my own house, I mowed the lawn, did all the gardening, painted, paid all my bills, cleaned the place, did laundry … everything … by myself. And maintained my two cars and took care of my dog?!? It was just me?!?! God knows I cleaned gutters as a kid and hated it. We have gutter guards now.

Like why do you think women can’t or won’t do these things.

Oh and I make money, thanks.

Like wtf?

SwimmingTheme3736 · 2023-12-03T21:03:27+00:00

I don’t know any women who expect that

They all work if the don’t have children, most that have children do too

volleyballbeach · 2023-12-04T01:50:31+00:00

Why do women expect equality in decision making but not equality in paying for things or completing house tasks?

I want to be an equal in all these things.

I see plenty of women saying that they want equality say in everything. They rather not take a submissive role in a relationship but those very same women still a man to do all of the hard tasks around the house and also help with the easy ones?

I can’t speak for those women you claim to see plenty of, I personally surround myself with the kind of people that believe in equality and put in the work that comes with that.

My thoughts are: your input into the project should directly correspond to how much of a say you have in the matter.

Agree with this part

Pretty much the same in a relationship. If you put up 30% of everything that has to be paid for, you can have a 30% say in the decision making about shit we pay for.

Value isn’t only in the things that have to be paid for. For example time put into cooking, cleaning, maintaining vehicles and equipment, home repairs, gardening etc should be considered too.

Flightlessbirbz · 2023-12-04T12:27:48+00:00

The “women’s” tasks are daily and end up taking a lot more time total than the “men’s” tasks. And for people who don’t own a home, which is most of millennials and gen z, lawn work and home maintenance is nonexistent. Most women also work outside the home, it’s quite rare for men to pay for everything these days or even be able to do so.

Not to mention that in a healthy relationship, there shouldn’t even be all these conflicts over stupid things that have to be solved with some weird “I calculated that I do x% of the work so have x% of the say” power struggle. Mentally healthy adults should care about what is important to their partner and be able to work things out to find solutions they’re both happy with. Why would you even want to live with someone you hate that much?

Bubbly_Taro · 2023-12-03T14:25:42+00:00

People don't have real problems or hobbies anymore, so they make up shit.

Safinated · 2023-12-03T16:20:19+00:00

Plenty of people make approximately the same amount, and women have been proven to do more chores

And, of course, there’s sex — which is way more important to men than women

Sillysheila · 2023-12-03T18:45:21+00:00

Most women don’t pay for nothing. Most women in relationships work.

I do a lot of the man tasks you mentioned. I replace stuff, I hang out washing, I move things, I take out the trash and I organise bills. Where’s my gold star lol?

Your examples of things men traditionally do don’t make sense to me because a ton of women do those things as well. I don’t have a lawn but many women mow the lawn. Plus many of these tasks aren’t arduous. Taking out the trash, hanging out washing, paying bills and mowing the lawn really isn’t that hard.

For some of things that you mentioned as well like working on the car, a lot of men like cars and enjoy doing that stuff so that’s why they take care of it. Just like many women have more interest in cooking. Some women are car enthusiasts but more men are.

SmallSituation6432 · 2023-12-03T12:53:35+00:00

Sure mate. Well reasoned, and not at all ignoring the nature of a romantic relationship.

God speed.

esdebah · 2023-12-03T15:19:03+00:00

From my experience, the ones who say that also make comparable money or otherwise to comparable work.

Fun_Push7168 · 2023-12-03T22:06:56+00:00

While your articulation of it leaves a lot of room for criticism I think I get your premise.

Women do tend to be fairly audacious with demands and tend to be more comfortable in the taker role.

Even in egalitarian relationships it tends to be her priorities over his.

The home, the decor, etc. will take up what can be afforded while the garage/workshop etc. gets the scraps under the guise that all the things in the home are " for both of us". This is why you see couples getting bigger and fancier houses while men give up their sports cars.

I've seen it from both sides. Men as providers tend to try to spoil or at the least give in to demands while women as providers will have no issue putting that man on a bread and water diet, so to speak. Men tend to take some pride in providing or at least are reluctantly generous.

killamillaa · 2023-12-04T16:54:33+00:00

So in relationships where the husband is the stay at home person, should they also be submissive, do all the house work, and get ZERO say on anything that happens in the house? Let me ask him if he's okay with relinquishing his person to me just because I make the money. I'm sure he will be thrilled lmfao.

In all seriousness, when he disagrees with me on something. we come to a compromise that works for the both of us. it's never a "No, because I make the money and what I say goes". He does exactly what you said in your 4th paragraph. He doesn't contribute financially (which I am fine with), does "very little" around the house (I mow the lawn, clean the septic, attic, gutters, put up shelves etc.), and only cleans for two people as we have no children. Should he be 100% agreeable, submissive, and peaceful? Should I be tyrant that runs a household for my own benefit rather than OUR benefit? I don't think so, but you seem to.

Edit: Put quotations around "very little" because I highly appreciate the work my husband does at home to keep the home tidy and our doggies happy

Captain-Stunning · 2023-12-04T13:34:47+00:00

while men are expected to take care of the car, move anything, hang everything, clean the gutters, take out and bring in trash, mow the lawn, irrigate the lawn, replace anything that needs to be replaced, pay bills.

Imagine thinking that those occasional things are harder than the unending hours of tasks that women typically perform daily

Comprehensive-Job243 · 2023-12-04T02:14:05+00:00

I dunno.. am currently financing my spouse's career, where he gets all the glory and all I get is yelled at that I haven't been able to mind-read his next ever-shifting needs.

sixsevenrice · 2023-12-03T13:07:14+00:00

Because they have the sexual value and leverage to get what they want.

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