Q4M: Do you want dating to cost less? Or do you want a traditional woman?

Kreeps_United · 2025-09-01T04:20:31+00:00

I'm not a traditional guy so wouldn't want a traditional woman.

Ultramega39 · 2025-09-01T02:11:50+00:00

I just want someone who is willing to put the same amount of effort into the relationship as I do. Traditional, modern, I don't truly care.

Also let's not pretend that just because someone is a "modern western woman" that automatically means that they're willing to pay or split the bill.

CerealExprmntz · 2025-09-01T10:30:11+00:00

She sings about how men here expect women to split the bill, but her beauty routine should recuse her from having to so

Why should someone's personal grooming routine ever exempt them from splitting the bill? Y'all do that for yourselves.

But they also say they don't like modern Western women (the very type to be okay with splitting the bill).

The women who are expecting men to fulfill all of the traditional male courtship roles and women who are willing to split the bill are not the same women at all. Saying that Western women are overall willing to split the bill is ignorance at best and active deception at worst.

RavenEridan · 2025-09-01T01:41:29+00:00

I wouldn’t say image-obsessed women are traditional, family-oriented women. Sounds more like a golddigger mentality. True, there is a cost to having a woman who is primarily home-centered, and if you want that you have to be willing to put in the work to provide for the household. But hopefully those women appreciate the sacrifices a man makes and doesn’t resent his role. The payoff should be worth it.

throwaway73737828 · 2025-09-01T04:57:22+00:00

They are tired because, they have to do it so much till one girl eventually says yes. If paying 100%, guaranteed sex and dating after, men wouldnt be saying shit about 50-50. And also another thing, if you are going 50-50, you definitely aint being with her after that date ☠️.

But in a perfect world if women were not resentful and bitter with 50-50 and they were valuing equal partnership rather than men to do literally everything, men would 100% go for 50-50 every single time.

Hadal_Benthos · 2025-09-01T07:13:18+00:00

Women who need an expensive "beauty routine" are either obsessed or ugly.

brassbuffalo · 2025-09-01T06:20:09+00:00

Why does her beauty routine matter? Does she think men wake up with with a combed head of hair, a clean shaven face, and a sharp suit? Gym memberships, well-fitting clothes, nice colognes, and good haircuts cost money. Unless she's dating fat slobs in sweat pants than she's got nothing to stand on. It takes a high level of self-importance and narcissism to think only your own efforts to look good matter.

Neptune-Jnr · 2025-09-01T04:11:10+00:00

I want modern women to help carry the burden. Traditional Women suck.

growframe · 2025-09-01T01:34:31+00:00

"Traditional woman" is a wishy washy term that will have attributes arbitrarily included and excluded at the speaker's discretion, so no.

There's no such thing as a "wanting a traditional woman", you either get with the program of how women behave today or you get left behind.

Clutterboxx · 2025-09-01T01:52:08+00:00

Dumb farming implement sings whiny song about not being paid for existing.

This is the future women wanted after all, you're independent human beings with your own money who should be appreciated for more than your looks.

If we are going for actual tradition AKA dating in the 60s it was an inexpensive date at the local food joint with her parent's permission, after several of these dates marriage would be on the table.

But women want it both ways, they want expensive dates with multiple men while committing to none of them to satisfy her massive ego. The only thing traditional about this dynamic is the fact that the man pays.

FrankZapper13 · 2025-09-01T03:03:45+00:00

Oh so women do wear make up and revealing for men and male attention? Glad we finally got that one sorted out.

But real talk, I would prefer it to just be cheaper. I don't want looks obsessed gold digging consumer who doesn't do anything with her life. I want an actual human being who has opinions and interests that aren't just preening and spending money. No woman wants a guy who's interests are just himself and spending money, why would we expect any man to want a woman like that?

Reasonable_Mouse789 · 2025-09-01T01:49:39+00:00

It seems that some men in these pill spaces are tired of women expecting the man to approach, rizz, ask for the date, plan the date, scheduled the date, pay 100%, make the 1st move, etc etc

The problem is, once you get to the point where a guy can consistently charm a random woman who has known him less than a week, regardless of whether it’s from online dating or in person, that guy is either:

1) single because he wants to be

2) not single and he’s cheating (some women don’t realize the older men hitting on them are also probably married)

3) he finds someone for a relationship quickly if he has basic preferences (straight white moderate Christian male liberal that wants 1 or 2 kids some day and has a decent job)

4) he finds someone for a relationship eventually if he has niche preferences (things that average women might not want to deal with, but he’s good looking so they consider him for a short time anyway)

Stuff like that. If he can actually act like a perfect gentleman, comfortably sleep with you in the first 24 hours, pay for your date, etc., then you’re basically getting a superior version for free of what a guy would pay $500 - $1,000 for the inferior version of an escort.

For charming men that like the attention, it’s worth it. Men who hate it are obviously going to see it as a lot of work

Main-Tiger8537 · 2025-09-01T05:37:23+00:00

it is simple...

people with a conservative lifestyle want a conservative partner...

people with a liberal lifestyle want a liberal partner...

hypocritical people skew this concept and confuse both...

Ok_Use7 · 2025-09-01T02:04:43+00:00

I love modern women and I pay for everything.

What’s really insufferable is people who just can’t be normal. I pay because I like the women that I meet.

I can’t do trade offs. If there’s expectations because of her beauty routine, etc. that shits weird and she’s no different than a red pill man. I’m good.

Feeling_Ad_1034 · 2025-09-01T01:38:18+00:00

This is such a low level way of thinking about dating.

Let’s say the social norm of the guys paying was magically removed (which isn’t going to happen btw)

You still have the problem of lots of men desiring to date the few women who are very attractive. This is mitigated by factoring the guys attractiveness, outgoing-ness, humor, status, effort, or other stats. So you’re removing one variable that doesn’t change much.

I think when guys get mad about this they think that if the paradigm shifted, they’d magically have a shot with more/higher quality women.

If the woman is into you, she’ll let you take her for a walk in a park as the date.

Ego73 · 2025-09-01T02:59:05+00:00

Considering one of the options you give is for me to pay for her bill, AND to have a date with someone who looks like a clown with that level of make up, I know what I'm choosing. If she finds a man willing to get the worst of both worlds, good for her.

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ctrl_f_sauce · 2025-09-01T02:30:20+00:00

I have the opportunity to choose the location. I set the boundaries.

If I thought she was worth lobster, I’ll bring her to a restaurant where that is with the boundaries. I am 40, for me to bring a woman to an expensive date that I wouldn’t happily pay for a friend to attend, she would need to be a friend who I am at least 90% willing to be in a relationship with.

wtknight · 2025-09-01T03:37:00+00:00

Does traditional mean having to have an expensive beauty or fashion routine? I wasn't aware of that. I personally don't mind supporting a woman who doesn't ask for ridiculously costly things that she needs to spend money on. If a woman is actually traditional, then she doesn't really need to improve her appearance for anybody else but her partner. Wanting to spend more than that on beauty and fashion costs signifies that she either wants to advance her career, or perhaps find a better partner.

No_Mammoth8801 · 2025-09-01T03:41:21+00:00

Well, the two options in your title aren't mutually exclusive. But I think men of all backgrounds would appreciate the restaurants they take their dates to were less expensive.

But this isn't really a question about money. Money spent on dates is just a proxy for TEA. That is, time, energy, and attention. And while I can understand why women expect more upfront TEA from men in the beginning stages of dating, I just don't think it works very well when contextualized within what we now call "modern dating".

Men and women both are seen as more replaceable, disposable, commodified, etc. But then men are still expected to pay and court and pretend there isn't a massive roster of other men waiting in the wings? I mean yeah, you're going to feel like a sucker after a long enough period of time paying or just investing a disproportionate amount of your finite time, energy, and attention. Even when you avoid all the common don'ts women complain about, you're still going to get hit 90% of the time with a "no spark/chemistry".

So until you find some success you can give up entirely, take breaks, or change your strategy to something that is probably distasteful to the vast majority of women but less risky for you.

Gitsumrestmf · 2025-09-01T05:32:42+00:00

In my relationship, I plan the dates, and I pay for them. My girl is happy to go wherever I'd take her, and while she expressed we can split, I prefer to pay. Because it makes me happy to take care of her.

Artistic_Speech_1965 · 2025-09-01T08:27:04+00:00

I think it's not a black or white situation. For instance, I am okay paying for dates but not being the one initiating anything

Trancetastic16 · 2025-09-01T11:34:13+00:00

I openly cross-dress in combinations of women’s clothing and wear makeup as well as the standard skincare, dieting and gym, and would be fine being the only one dressing-up nice for a date.

So I’d want to prove we can provide a gender non-conforming relationship and equal incomes, house-partner and errand labor (as child-free folk) for each other, and step one would be providing each other a coffee and our equal gratitude.

This is my personal filtering method including to filter-out hypocritical virtue-signaling false progressives who can’t put their money where their mouth is.

For obvious reasons I’m incompatible with traditional women and direct about this.

I also prefer women who are at least able to signal and be socially open but not expect me to approach, and would at least approach me when I appear socially open, if I truly didn’t notice.

And plan dates and initiate (even to encourage me to initiate) equally.

Popeoath · 2025-09-01T11:59:12+00:00

I want either a traditional women or cheaper dating, not the current bullshit where you still have to pay for feminist boss babes.

Naebany · 2025-09-01T13:01:56+00:00

I don't need traditional woman. I'm fine with self sufficient, career oriented woman who split the bill with me. Actually we take turns paying for each other. I don't need marriage and kids. So we're both here for each other, not because any of us had a plan and just needed someone to fill in the position.

James_M_Croft · 2025-09-01T13:42:18+00:00

I would love a traditional woman, including the femininity, maturity and competence, But I know it is impossible, so I am going for whatever at this point.

I do not mind the payment or not. I am more interested in how worthwhile is my stay with her; and although I agree way too many women are valuable as casual sexual partners. They are not worthwhile for much more besides that.

SeemedGood · 2025-09-01T13:44:27+00:00

Description of the ideal traditional woman: Pro 31:10-31

shadowrangerfs · 2025-09-01T14:48:25+00:00

Here's why I disagree with the "beauty routine"/ "makeup is expensive" argument for why men should pay.

She's going to wear makeup even when she's not with you. I would accept the "I wear makeup for you" argument if the woman ONLY wore makeup when she was with me. But she's going to wear it when she goes to work or out with her friends or when visiting her family. Women wear makeup when they are single.

And let's be honest. If women just stopped wearing makeup at all, men would still try to date them.

Also, this isn't really an either/or. You can find a traditional women who doesn't expect you to break the bank on a date.

Wide-Illustrator2906 · 2025-09-01T18:36:32+00:00

Traditional women are virgins, if she's not a virgin then she can't offer being a traditional partner or wife. But to your point, it is irrelevant what men want because both traditional women and non-traditional women want men to be traditional in relationships

Anti_Thing · 2025-09-03T22:09:57+00:00

Your title question is a bit of a false dichotomy, I think. I've met lots of women who are religious, right-wing, or who are, were, or want to be SAHMs, or some combination of the above, in both North America & in Eastern Europe. Many of them don't expect men to spend extravagantly on them during dating, or didn't expect men to do so back when they were dating. Many of them want men to pay or at least appreciate it when they do, but they don't necessarily want expensive restaurant dates or big trips on a regular basis.

I, as a man, am happy to pay for dates, but in many cases those dates will just be at a coffeeshop or teahouse, or won't necessarily involve spending money at all (such as going for a walk in the park). In both North America & in Eastern Europe, this is how dating was traditionally done by society at large in the recent past (such as in the 1950s), & how it's still often done by conservative-minded people.

I could say that I want a "traditional" woman, but you'll have to define exactly what that term means to you.

NotUsedUsernameYet · 2025-09-01T01:47:08+00:00

No, I don’t want to date a “traditional woman”. Couldn’t care less how much woman spends on hair if it’s clean. I find long nails unattractive. My perfect date is an introverted “next door girl” who works as an engineer in tech.

As a man, I also spend quite a bit on my appearance. My skincare is about $2000 a month (partially covered by insurance), my clothing budget is about 8k a year, my supplements/protein/gym budget is significant as well.

Having that said, I don’t expect women to split the bill on dates. But I do expect them to cover share of expenses when cohabiting.

Infamous_Anonyman · 2025-09-01T05:33:59+00:00

I would love if women would to their part.

As of now, i only date for sex. In my opinion it's not worth the energy, time and money to be invested in the women these days.

If you expect me to carry all the burden because i'm a man, you're better off searching for another man.

I would love to see the equal effort put in by women. If they consider themselfs the prize, i'm the prize too.

ilikecats18851 · 2025-09-01T08:51:11+00:00

The way you present this so confidently is hilarious. Literally either of those would be amazing, considering we have neither atm.

Title	Q4M: Do you want dating to cost less? Or do you want a traditional woman?
Author	Windmill_flowers
Upvotes	1
Comments	176
Date	September 1, 2025 1:29 AM UTC (10 months ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1n5bsge/q4m_do_you_want_dating_to_cost_less_or_do_you/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/q4m-do-you-want-dating-to-cost-less-or-do-you-want.1560993 https://theredarchive.com/post/1560993

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