It is not “just world fallacy” to believe that anyone who is chronically unable to have anyone ever desire them despite trying, is unattractive in some way.

growframe · 2025-07-04T13:04:24+00:00

But no one claims it is?

The just world falacy rebuttal is primarily aimed at people saying if you're a "nice, normal person" you're bound to get laid eventually, so anyone sexually unsuccessful must just be an unwashed misogynistic freak.

This just feels like a strawman

Responsible-Bee-3439 · 2025-07-04T15:56:45+00:00

The incels aren't entirely wrong when they say that some, maybe even a significant amount, of men just cannot get a date despite their best efforts, and usually it is stuff like disabilities and racial "preferences" that holds them back.

IgorXY · 2025-07-04T12:40:01+00:00

I thought the argument is that even if you are unattractive physically but behave well someone will like you. So if no one does, it means you are a bad person.

petellapain · 2025-07-04T16:55:11+00:00

Everyone conflates undesirable with bad. That's the just world fallacy everyone makes

Crazy_Kray · 2025-07-04T12:38:40+00:00

they simultaneously claim that there is nothing wrong with being single as they threat profile single men as “must be something wrong with them” creeps, homos or even pedo adjencts.

Secret_Worlder1992 · 2025-07-04T14:41:24+00:00

You're tilting at windmills right now. No one here tried to argue that - well, at least no man has.

Obviously, if someone is chronically lonely it's because they're unattractive in some fashion. The question here is why - why are they so unappealing to the exact sex?

The men here seem to have assessed - correctly, I might add - that, almost invariably, when a man struggles with chronic loneliness it is due to some bodily deficit. While you and the rest of the women here actively try to gaslight them into thinking that no - their deficit is not physical, it is moral in fact. The obvious implication being that those men deserve romantic deprivation; that is the just world fallacy.

Every_Pirate_7471 · 2025-07-04T13:06:41+00:00

You’re not calling them a bad person, you’re enforcing the idea that because they don’t inspire desire it means they should be permanently cut off from the warmth and intimacy of others. That’s why people get upset.

Ruztomski · 2025-07-04T14:09:00+00:00

I see something like just world stuff here pretty regularly. It usually happens in a context where the discussion gets heated and a person who struggles to date gets obnoxious. Then the other person say they can see why the currently obnoxious person can't get a date.

I think the person can appear to be generalizing the moment into an explanation for the person's struggles. They will literally say that X trait isn't the reason you can't get a date, being an asshole is.

I don't know that they believe in a just world. Seems more likely they're just firing back at someone who they feel took a shot at them. But the words are right there on the page.

RayAP19 · 2025-07-04T12:38:10+00:00

It is not “just world fallacy” to observe someone who consistently fails to inspire desire in others and conclude over time that it’s likely XYZ immutable physical or behavioral traits or XYZ mutable choices and actions they make that are causing their chronic unwanted singledom.

The problem is that people try to make this determination based on seeing a person on a forum or social media platform like Reddit, and that is in no way an accurate way of ascertaining someone's actual personality, much less figuring out why they struggle in dating.

Schleudergang1400 · 2025-07-04T12:53:49+00:00

Let's call it cause and effect.

Let's leave morals about "good" and "bad" out of the picture.

DecisionPlastic9740 · 2025-07-04T21:11:10+00:00

It's regular claimed on here that the unattractive person is single because they're a bad person.

ColbyXXXX · 2025-07-04T14:27:06+00:00

Yeah the immutable trait is “skill issue”. Just try harder to be attractive.

WebNew9978 · 2025-07-04T15:29:24+00:00

Just about everybody goes through life having a romantic life. Even the people who you would consider to be bad. So if you discover someone who does goes through life never having one, you are going to immediately think that they are a really bad person. Because even the bad people found someone who didn’t see them in that way. But everybody around this person didn’t, then they must have be really really bad.

Think about it: You see in my user flair that I’m black pilled, what immediately comes to your mind when you see that?

MysterySolverDog · 2025-07-04T16:24:17+00:00

I mean people often don't fully spell out their beliefs like this but that doesn't mean they don't have the belief. To clarify, the belief I'm referring to here is a man who can't get dates must be a morally bad or otherwise defective person.

It's a background drumbeat that blue pillers keep rhythm with. Men who can't get dates and admit that online (I'm in this picture), frequently get people hunting for reasons why they're a bad person who deserves to be alone. Discussions on lonely men invariably devolve into people screeching about incels with radical misogynistic and political beliefs, and "toxic masculinity". More recently, discussion on the male loneliness epidemic online was overrun by people calling lonely men losers who were terrible people and deserved to be single. There's no other reasonable explanation for this behaviour.

If you gave somebody a set of noise cancelling headphones and they noticed that everyone else in the room was all clapping and moving in time, they're likely to conclude that they're all listening to a beat being played. Of course, some portion of the time, they just come out and say the just world belief openly. You should also consider that because you're a woman who's also a mod on here, you're much more unlikely to really lock horns with somebody looking to go incel hunting. On our end it's not about putting words in people's mouths, it's just observing that they're keeping rhythm with an unfortunately recognisable drumbeat.

MaxDureza · 2025-07-04T13:26:04+00:00

You are right being ugly is not a crime. But because of ego, how many people would admit or want to be ugly? No one, most people cope.

John_Oakman · 2025-07-04T15:20:19+00:00

By the time an appeal to a technical distinction is made, it's an implied admission that there's not a practical distinction, which is what really matters as far as worldly consequences/effects go.

MongoBobalossus · 2025-07-04T12:37:04+00:00

Being unfuckable isn’t a moral judgement.

Direct_Onion_8917 · 2025-07-04T16:52:58+00:00

I've had people on this sub many times claim I am a bad person because I can't find a partner. People use that as proof of something when everywhere you go you find retards, abusive people, narcissists and boring people in relationships. What you said isn't untrue but many people go the extra mile and make character assassinations about people because of something outside their control. You are correctly observing that immutable physical or behavior traits cause chronic singledom.

Logos1789 · 2025-07-04T19:44:43+00:00

Most people aren’t denying that such a person is likely to be unattractive; the point is that critics of these people often indict them as being of poor moral character and other assumed negative characteristics.

rejected-again · 2025-07-04T20:01:34+00:00

No, it is. People in my life have no idea I've never had a girlfriend. Many assume I'm dating someone. If I told them I've never had a girlfriend, only then do I become undateable. It's obvious many women have a "If no one wants you, why should I" attitude.

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2025-07-05T15:48:30+00:00

Did someone say it was it actually seems to be the opposite of just world fallacy

"You failed because you didn't try hard enough" is just world fallacy

chocobolamo · 2025-07-07T09:29:28+00:00

tldr: no one dates fatties

Good_Result2787 · 2025-07-04T15:19:41+00:00

While I agree it is not a case of "just world fallacy" I do think that because of how interpersonal dynamics work, you can "do everything correctly" and still lose. I guess I don't specifically disagree with your assertion so this might end up under automod (or I might need to put it there not sure)

But I post here because oftentimes people do tend to assert that if someone is chronically alone despite trying that they can "personality" their way out of it eventually. But sometimes you can't, and that's just how it is. I don't even mean me personally, just that finding any one of a number of "right" people who could be attracted to you relies on a lot of things, and only some of those things are how you present yourself.

Some people aren't going to try and end up alone and be fine with it, others will try and end up alone and be bitter about it, and yet others will try, end up alone and accept it. That's just how it is.

EDIT: And there's nothing wrong with rejecting people for any of that. There's really no nobility in dating nor should there be. The three biggest hurdles I faced in dating were having a physical disability, having extreme self-loathing due to reason number one, and being undersocialized due to my upbringing. I had control over two of those things and I knew I wouldn't be able to control how anyone reacted to the other thing, so I focused on what I could control.

I still faced tons of rejection due to reason #1, but I understood why this was and I knew it was no good being bitter about it. We're all out here looking to make one of the most important decisions we can make in choosing a partner, and it behooves us to make the best choice of our options. Part of me had to go on a journey to accept that I would not be considered a good option by most people. And that was the right choice for them, even if it could sting a bit.

Trancetastic16 · 2025-07-04T13:19:31+00:00

I prefer the term “Unconventional”, since, for example, I’m Non-binary, Bisexual, mixed race, child-free and anti-marriage.

I’m average looking but clearly would be incompatible with the majority of the population for immutable traits that don’t make me “less attractive”, just “different”.

Because within my extremely rare niche, I’m pretty much exactly what they’re looking for.

Some other reasons a person would be unconventional and thus unappealing within the pre-dominant culture would be being a cultural minority or having extremely niche interests.

Junior_Ad_3086 · 2025-07-04T17:45:05+00:00

that's not really how most people refer to the just world fallacy on here though, at least not in my experience. what i see is rhetoric like 'misogynistic men don't have success with women' (lots of them 100% do) and that receiving no female interest is some sort of character flaw on the man's part (rather than related to a general lack of traditional markers of attraction). it's part of the premise of 'nice guys finish last' and thought patterns like 'being a good person doesn't matter in dating, being attractive does'.

i literally can't think of a single example where somebody who's struggling with dating was told they're just unattractive and their rebuttal being 'just world fallacy!!!!'.

caption291 · 2025-07-04T20:49:00+00:00

You're right that it isn't a just world fallacy to believe that unnatractive people are unnatractive...but no one is disagreeing with that.

The point of contention is about wether there is a bias towards the assumption that people who fail at dating do so because of some sort of moral shortcoming. You don't disprove a bias by calling yourself unbiased and shutting down the conversation.

Master-Spare8150 · 2025-07-04T12:40:45+00:00

The first issue to address is who they're trying to attract. For example, most women on the planet will fail to attract Brad Pitt's attention, in the same manner as most men in the world will fail to attract Jenna Ortega's attention. I'm using very random people as examples here of people who have objectively a good amount of wealth, social clout, and above average looks.

I always see people trying to get the attention on people who are very much unequally yoked, yet blame their failures on society wide issues. Said another way, they're swinging for the fence exclusively.

SnooCats37 · 2025-07-04T12:58:27+00:00

You guys really need to watch old episodes of jeremy kyle, it will be eye opening

GrouchNslouch777 · 2025-07-04T17:49:16+00:00

This logic even if true is trivial. Why? Attractiveness isn't some magical objective quality. Culture has a lot to do with it.

For example if women are hypergamous and attracted to markers (superficial) of a status difference between her and the man, then cultural messaging that devalues the average man and elevates the average women will result in average women finding average men unattractive.

So in that scenario what you're saying is true but it's also meaningless because the issue for the unattractiveness isn't "genes" nor is it blame on the part of average men.

It'd be a social.....justice....issue.

The type of issue leftists are all up their asses about....until it comes to issues that ARE PRESENTLY REAL.

Leftists love fighting battles that were won decades-hundreds of years ago. Which is why they love bitching about slavery, racism, gays, etc. Because they're not for actual social justice. They're out for virtue signaling when socially expedient.

DGenerationMC · 2025-07-04T18:10:16+00:00

It just makes them lesser than ;)

Bitter_Emu6366 · 2025-07-04T13:53:35+00:00

How do you think structural and material conditions effect relationships ?

Title	It is not “just world fallacy” to believe that anyone who is chronically unable to have anyone ever desire them despite trying, is unattractive in some way.
Author	GridReXX
Upvotes	4
Comments	202
Date	July 4, 2025 12:32 PM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1lrhmbd/it_is_not_just_world_fallacy_to_believe_that/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/it-is-not-just-world-fallacy-to-believe-that.1556318 https://theredarchive.com/post/1556318

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