Male Vulnerability

Laytheblameonluck · 2021-02-09T22:38:10+00:00

Modern men can't show vulnerability to modern women when it comes to sex.

Modern women have experiences and expectations that must be matched.

anomanderforPOTUS · 2021-02-09T18:56:02+00:00

I've never hid my vulnerability from my wife. Not when we first started dating, not now.

If I can't be 100% open with a partner I wouldn't be with that partner for long. That is kind of one of the great things about relationships.

I've also never regretted being vulnerability with my wife. At least not once that I can recollect.

Emervila · 2021-02-09T18:58:07+00:00

you are confused, emotional is not vulnerable. Vulnerability means being weak for women. Oftenly vulnerability is seen as opposed to confident hence the reason manly men aren't vulnerable with their women.

See this

https://www.reddit.com/r/AskWomen/comments/2if2l9/how_do_women_feel_about_vulnerable_men/

top answer

I like men who are willing to show me their vulnerability -- who can admit to having emotions and problems. I think that, just like for women, I prefer to be around people who are rarely completely at the mercy of those emotions, who are relatively emotionally stable.

They say they do but very "rarely", that's a NO in womanese language

2021-02-09T18:53:16+00:00

" there were many occasions when I have regretted showing vulnerability."

This happens to EVERYONE. It's called a "vulnerability hangover".

https://myquestionlife.com/vulnerability-hangover

Aldabruzzo · 2021-02-09T20:05:26+00:00

If you open up to someone, you might get hurt. You might regret it. Pondering this man's ideas a few days after I read them, I decided he is insane. I cannot imagine a relationship where one party never shows vulnerability, other than as something nightmarish and toxic, or at best extremely shallow.

Like some things at TRP, it can get overstated.

You can show some vulnerability to a partner, sometimes.

What you cannot do are the following:

--show vulnerability to someone you're not dating seriously or married to. I would never display vulnerability to a woman I wasn't married to.

--show vulnerability all the time. If all you are is wounded all the time, you're weak and she will lose attraction VERY fast. If you can't take care of yourself, how can you be expected to take care of her? If everything injures and hurts you, how can you be expected to protect anyone else?

--display extreme emotional reaction like heaving sobbing crying or catatonia or uncontrollable rage. If you can't handle your own emotions and pull your shit together, how can you be expected to protect her? Men make poor decisions in the throes of extreme negative emotion. Showing that kind of emotion can get you or others hurt or killed. Women display extreme emotional reactions all the time. When a man does this, he looks and acts like a woman, and women find that repulsive.

--fail to have a plan to handle the vulnerability and get on the road to healing yourself. You can get knocked down, badly. You can get hurt, badly. The problem happens when a man stays there. The problem happens when days stretch into weeks, months, and years. The problem happens when he can't or won't figure out how to get out of it, by himself or with help. The problem happens when he doesn't formulate a plan to get out of it, heal up, and fix it.

--rely on your serious relationship/wife to be your sole source or even a main source of support or help. Women just cannot do this for men. They just cant. And a man can't expect any woman to do this for him.

The problem is not his feeling the emotions. The problem is his outward displays and how it affects her. This is prerational for a woman: Her man is injured, wounded, or maimed. She immediately thinks:

He cannot protect me. He cannot provide for me. He cannot protect or provide for my children. If I stay with him, I could die. My kids could die. We will be exposed to outside threats. We could lose everything. I need to get rid of him and find someone who can protect and provide for us.

That's the issue.

bowserfire73 · 2021-02-09T23:41:42+00:00

When it's already so hard for most men to get a relationship, it's not worth it to show vulnerability and run the extremely high risk that she ends it right there.

Kaisha001 · 2021-02-09T19:55:43+00:00

I, and many men, have learned the hard way. You don't show true vulnerability to women. Sure shed a tear or two over the loss of a pet or your grandparent. But apart from some quiet stoicism, women don't want to deal with male grief, loss, insecurity, or anything apart from anger and joy.

xFallacyx69 · 2021-02-09T19:41:53+00:00

Isn’t it sad that this is even a debate though?

Shit, half the “super woke” chicks here admit that they don’t like guys who are emotional about a lot of things... which basically means “if you cry about anything other than your dad dying I’ll lose attraction”... some nice equality eh ladies?

Anyhow, since most of the responses are personal anecdotes I’ll add my own. I rarely cry, but when I do the only people who judge me are women. It’s 100% women; and 100% of the time the biggest critics are the chicks with Coexist stickers and or other dumb “love always wins” garbage plastered wherever they can find open real estate...

Shit, I even saw a “super woke” chick call my buddy gay for crying over the death of his dog... hypocrisy knows no bounds... anecdotal mic drop

TheBookOfSeil · 2021-02-09T23:57:55+00:00

Unfortunately, as far as this topic is concerned, women expect to be able to confide in their partners knowing that they'll be supported throughout, but this is mostly uni-directional. Women don't want to feel like they need to be depended on for certain things because those things are what they depend on others for. This turns the situation into "If I can't really feel secure or trust in my partner to support me, then why should I stay with them?"

Women's attraction to men usually relates back to themselves. Women want to feel desired and protected, and any prospective guy who wants to be with a woman is going to have to evoke these feelings from her in order to stay with her. The only way a guy can be vulnerable and not lose attraction is if his vulnerability makes her feel special, as if she's the only one who truly knows him and is able to support him. They don't, however, want to feel like there's any uncertainty coming from him, so if it's vulnerability for something like a problem that he seems to be having trouble overcoming, she's going to lose attraction to him because she's less certain that he'll be able to support her and handle her issues when she needs it.

So, guys aren't "insane" for holding back when we know that there are consequences for being vulnerable.

DP8414 · 2021-02-09T18:40:49+00:00

Women don’t want another female friend in a relationship. They have plenty.

vov1n · 2021-02-09T19:29:25+00:00

I cannot imagine a relationship where one party never shows vulnerability, other than as something nightmarish and toxic

I don't understand this, why is it so hard to shut up?

NarniaFox · 2021-02-10T01:00:42+00:00

I agree with you and I'm just extremely glad that I've met my husband before he had experience that would shut him down like it happened to so many men here.

I guess it could be called a result of toxic femininity, if they got rejected or even despised by their partners for showing vulnerability. The problem is that if you're told that men are these strong, resistant and kind of unemotional providers and protectors, and if your expectations are tied to this ideas, you gonna have hard times with experiencing their vulnerability. Overall our society doesn't handle emotional development very well and with some exceptions we aren't taught how to handle them and how to help each other.

And I add some personal experience here. My husband and I met pretty early, we were 16 at that time. We've never had any problems with expressing and accepting vulnerability and supporting each other, we've seen each other's in our lowest and it's had mostly a positive effect on our relationship and sexual life. Yeah, no one wants to have sex when their partner is crying but when they feel better, you often still feel that extreme closeness that continues during sex.

-since · 2021-02-10T02:45:04+00:00

Weakness disgusts women

End of story.

angels-fan · 2021-02-09T20:11:02+00:00

Search the sub for masculinity tokens.

Matt_Door · 2021-02-09T22:50:17+00:00

Like all things “Man” we must own and master our own vulnerability.

cuckspace · 2021-02-09T19:23:29+00:00

I cannot imagine a relationship where one party never shows vulnerability, other than as something nightmarish and toxic, or at best extremely shallow.

Are you currently in a relationship? Have you been in a long term relationship?

When I was younger I thought it was supposed to be exactly like this, two people sharing their deepest self and exposing their vulnerabilities. As I look back on my failed marriage and other LTRs, the point where it all went wrong was when I let my guard down and showed my vulnerability. That’s exactly when she would ignore me sexually for days, build up resentment and nag about trivial things. You can never let your guard down with a woman you’re involved with.

ihavezeropersonality · 2021-02-09T19:37:25+00:00

Women I’ve talked to think it’s a turn off if a man can’t be open and emotionally available.

Ill-Parsley-2473 · 2021-02-09T18:37:42+00:00

I forgot to add that the best sex requires vulnerability. For most people, even decent sex requires some vulnerability.

IcarusKiki · 2021-02-09T23:44:36+00:00

I think everyone is uncomfortable being vulnerable and being too vulnerable in a relationship may cause the other person to feel like a therapist or caretaker rather than a partner. Super vulnerable insecure women aren’t a prize either and get labeled as crazy or dramatic so I don’t think it’s just a guy thing. But everyone has moments of vulnerability in a long term relationship and it usually brings the two closer as a result. If you feel like you can’t have a moment of weakness with your partner id break up with her.

RRBeachFG2 · 2021-02-10T04:23:21+00:00

Oh gawd, here we go again

WilliamWyattD · 2021-02-10T13:00:45+00:00

There's clearly a gender asymmetry here routed in biology. That said, culture matters a lot too. Women who deny any gender asymmetry, or try to obfuscate with the 'it's all down to the two individuals' dodge aren't helping.

Now, many men may go overboard with their advice here. Honest contributions by women who admit that men have a different standard here, but feel that some men are going too far, could be quite helpful.

BionicFlo · 2021-02-09T22:09:24+00:00

If I can't be vulnerable around someone, why would I be in a relationship with/ let alone date him/her? The concept does not seem very appealing.

RedCoquette · 2021-02-10T00:12:43+00:00

I stopped showing vulnerability to my wife almost a year ago. Helped fix our struggling bedroom and she's never been a more attentive spouse.

Your girl can respect you, or she can be your mommy. You can't have both.

SmurfESmurferson · 2021-02-09T19:19:06+00:00

Vulnerability is like anything else - you need to find someone who “speaks your language”

For example, I cannot handle people who show vulnerability through whining. Or prolonged, self-indulgent pity parties. But if you need to cry and get it out? Do it, I’ll rub your back. Get mad and punch a wall? I’ve spackled many a wall in my day, I’ve got you

Other women can’t handle men who cry or get angry. My LTRs wouldn’t work with them, but they worked for me

iloveyoubutyou · 2021-02-09T19:09:12+00:00

I’m fine with vulnerability as long as their way with coping with the vulnerability isn’t being an asshole.

flapperfemmefatale · 2021-02-09T19:01:24+00:00

I absolutely agree. Vulnerability needs to be a two-way street. If you're not ready to be vulnerable with another person, you're not ready for a meaningful relationship.

ChibsFilipTelfordd · 2021-02-09T19:37:34+00:00

As u/SherbertBacon and i were unable to agree on a definition of vulnerability in the previous thread, I think you need to define what you mean by it u/Ill-Parsley-2473

alexmwalsh11 · 2021-02-10T01:49:43+00:00

It’s interesting because one of the main reasons it didn’t work out between my ex and I was his lack of vulnerability led him to grow really closed off and never express his emotions, not that it was particularly his fault either, it’s how our society socialises men because vulnerability could be seen as weakness

Gaddammitkyle · 2021-02-10T02:11:47+00:00

It's always a trap. Never reveal your weaknesses to anyone you love. When relationships get in rough spots those weaknesses become justifications for cheating.

HemluckMcGee · 2021-02-10T02:36:54+00:00

I think most of you are wildin. Vulnerability is important in all types of relationships, friend or romantic. I feel like people who are rude or unsympathetic when people are vulnerable just don’t have the capacity (at that time or in general) to deal with someone else’s emotions on that level. But if you’re with someone who genuinely cares about you they’ll support you. Any time a guy has been vulnerable with me I felt more protective of them and I felt closer, that they felt safe enough to share with me.

back_againx13 · 2021-02-10T03:33:04+00:00

This is one of my soapbox issues!! Society puts an intense amount of pressure on men to hide their emotions. Being the "strong, silent type," the protector, the voice of logic and reason are traits pushed forward as "masculine." Men are made to think that being vulnerable, expressing emotion, asking for help, etc make them less masculine, and they get that messaging reinforced all the time. It's incredibly unfair and unhealthy for men. They've been so inundated with that narrative that they shame one another for infractions and perpetuate the cycle, albeit without intent.

Jesus Christ, can we just recognize that men are human beings and not robots without any needs other than food or sex? Being vulnerable, asking for help, being overcome with negative emotions are difficult experiences for everyone, but especially for men who spend most of their school years being called a "fag" or a pussy for every social infraction. No wonder toxic masculinity has become a problem - the expectations set for them by society are contrary to human nature and impossible to achieve, which sets them up for failure.

getmoneylikesocrates · 2021-02-10T12:34:00+00:00

It’s always a grey area. Building a deep relationship with someone requires being vulnerable at some point. The difference is how you display or manage your vulnerability/emotion.

Example, let’s say somebody got a promotion over you at your job.

A: “Omg babe I can’t believe they chose them over me I am so upset I worked so hard for that and the promotion meant so much for me I really don’t know what to do anymore I’m so lost”

B: “While the promotion meant a lot to me and I’m upset I didn’t get it, they chose who they chose. The only thing I can do is move forward”

Shitty example but I hope that makes sense.

ariesv123 · 2021-02-10T16:40:12+00:00

That’s the whole point of vulnerability. High risk, high reward

350207e · 2021-02-10T18:37:11+00:00

This is the problem with redpill logic, the value of everything is centered on if it gets you puss or not, and you neglect your needs and dehumanize yourself in a stupid chase.

Redpill = beta gynocentrism

How could you even call it a relationship, you have no relationship to that person if you cannot open up to them.

Flightlessbirbz · 2021-02-11T22:45:18+00:00

Personally would not want a man who couldn’t be vulnerable with me. Being vulnerable with each other is part of intimacy. Likewise, I don’t think a woman who you can’t be vulnerable with is a good choice of partner if you are looking toward marriage/long term.

Ill-Parsley-2473 · 2021-02-09T19:47:59+00:00

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Starter91 · 2021-02-09T23:24:24+00:00

Vulnerability is gay. You show you are vulnerable you are out of the house. That's a one way street.

GullibleAirport732 · 2021-02-10T02:15:27+00:00

The replies here make me so sad as a man. Dating and relations seem like hell for men in the West. I'm just glad women here are virgins, so we don't have the pressure of living up to their former partner's expectations. The vulnerability thing is also true here though. I feel most women here see men as an errand boy and finance provider for the children. Well at least they don't walk out lol

PMmeareasontolive · 2021-02-10T02:53:43+00:00

Do you note how you called the guy insane though?

justaskinthequestion · 2021-02-10T03:45:10+00:00

Exactly. Welcome to dating as the average man.

P-o-o-b · 2021-02-10T04:16:09+00:00

One thing I really don’t know why it happens is why can I confide in my actual close guy friends and shit once we establish that it’s not gay, and get better results overall than when I tell it to a girl? I’ve only ever met 1 woman that didn’t use something I said in confidence against me at some point, and even then that 1 woman ended up forming judgements about my life that weren’t true. Honestly my worst experience with this has come from my mother and it was borderline unforgivable.

Plus when it comes to women you’re trying to flirt with and shit you can just leave that vulnerability shit at the door. That’s basically a recipe to get you left on read or delivered for half the day.

Atilla942 · 2021-02-10T10:25:37+00:00

I cry alone and when I'm done I feel better and ready to face the world. I would never risk crying in front of a woman other then my mom/grandmother.

skepticcentral · 2021-02-10T11:30:22+00:00

Aba and Preach did a YouTube video on male vulnerability that I thought was very insightful.

sivarias · 2021-02-11T00:21:01+00:00

When I show vulnerability my wife's sex drive goes down. If this continues long term she treats me like a child and scolds me.

No thank you.

photichache · 2021-02-10T03:38:17+00:00

As a 28/F, I always only fall in love with men who showed me vulnerability. Crushes yes, but deeper level of affection only formed after they showed me their weak side. It maybe has something to do with my instinctive dismay towards fakery, like I hate it when men pretend to be someone they're not. But vulnerability feels real and safe.

Entropy212 · 2021-02-10T05:07:34+00:00

I love authenticity, and I view emotion as authentic. It's not that I find emotionality attractive, it's that I find someone being themselves and being honest attractive.

YveisGrey · 2021-02-10T05:42:22+00:00

I honestly never understood this one because I’ve never felt that a man being vulnerable with me made me less attracted to him, if anything I would say it had the exact opposite effect. The only thing I could think of is maybe if you were being vulnerable too soon it could just make you come off as clingy or some thing but if you actually are in a relationship I don’t see what the issue with vulnerability is in fact it’s expected and I think it makes you closer.

RIFKIN_666 · 2021-02-10T07:01:05+00:00

well in a relationship you have to show some vulnerability imo. but us men dont like being vulnerable so if we feel weak alot of us hiding it is the 2and best option to ot feeling that way at all.

I think we should show it but not all the time.

like I dont think I should tell my woman when I get one. everytime I'm upset. i think most woman will look at as a turn off and I'll look at myself as being weak minded for being emotional often.

Rhye88 · 2021-02-10T08:50:38+00:00

This sub is disgusting. Y'all need love and therapy

gxga · 2021-02-10T10:01:07+00:00

The deepest bonds occur when vulnerability is shared. Its pomp and circumstances otherwise. As women we are steeped with vulnerabilities around the male sex. We still navigate our lives around men and we adapt. We get ridiculed here for having less trust because of it but how is that any worse then men deciding they will never open up, never be vulnerable while feeling tortured by a deep need to connect that they cannot meet

It's a personal choice and the risk will be there. It's not a "woman's fault" thing and it's nice to see that being recognized

queen_beastmode · 2021-02-10T17:31:07+00:00

I think a lot of men must somehow equate being vulnerable with emotional instability becuase a lot of the replies to this thread seem to be referring to trying to avoid frequent and disruptive displays of strong emotion.

My working definition of vulnerability is that vulnerability is interacting with other people even when you're not sure how others will react you. A really good example is giving a speech in front of a crowd of people despite having some stage fright. Another example is asking your boss for a raise you think you deserve. You don't know how your boss is going to react but you know that it's the right thing to do. Or it's setting a personal boundary with another person.

Willingness to being vulnerable in a relationship is actually an indicator of emotional stability becuase you are able to communicate needs and boundaries, which counteracts the alternative of not communicating your needs until the experience of the relationship becomes so stifling that you have an emotional outburst.

Men seem to skip over the whole communication and vulnerability thing and focus on not having outbursts, which become almost inevitable.

Title	Male Vulnerability
Author	Ill-Parsley-2473
Upvotes	130
Comments	390
Date	February 9, 2021 6:34 PM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/lg9z7j/male_vulnerability/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/male-vulnerability.740252 https://theredarchive.com/post/740252

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