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Why is it a bad deal?

theorangesmile
August 19, 2022
0 upvotes
/r/PurplePillDebate

When it comes to sex, I usually hear women say the following:

  • I had sex with Chad, Tyrone, etc... not because I liked them, but because they were an itch scratcher and they fulfilled a need. No feelings involved, just used for sexual release.
  • I am making you wait for sex, because I like you a lot. I have more to offer you than just my body and I respect you more than I did those men I just had sex with.

Why is it a bad deal if women make you wait because they want to give you more than their body?

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Post Information
Title Why is it a bad deal?
Author theorangesmile
Upvotes 0
Comments 179
Date August 19, 2022 11:12 PM UTC (5 months ago)
Subreddit /r/PurplePillDebate
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/why-is-it-a-bad-deal.1128776
https://theredarchive.com/post/1128776
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/wsrvo4/why_is_it_a_bad_deal/
Red Pill terms in post
ChadTyrone
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Comments

[–]KissMyAsthma-99 24 points25 points  (30 children) | Copy Link

If Tyrone gets it day one, she's acknowledged he's created a sexual desire in her that is greater than her good sense. Meanwhile, if she's capable of withholding from you, you clearly aren't creating that same level of desire. That truth will follow the relationship forever.

[–]neighbourhood-spider -1 points0 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

I do agree with this. However women place the Tyrone’s and men worth holding out for into a different category. We respect those men more because we want more than just casual sex back. While they may see it as being less desirable, they’re actually more desirable, because our desire to keep them for longer than a night surpasses our sexual desire. It doesn’t mean the desire isn’t there, I wish more guys knew that. Anyway I think the solution here for girls (to avoid their man doubting our sexual attraction for them) is to not discuss how quickly you banged a Chad or Tyrone with your boyfriend as it doesn’t do anything for the relationship.

[–]KissMyAsthma-99 6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I wish more guys knew that.

We wish more women knew that men think exactly the opposite way. We want desire above (almost) all else.

Anyway I think the solution here for girls (to avoid their man doubting our sexual attraction for them) is to not discuss how quickly you banged a Chad or Tyrone with your boyfriend as it doesn’t do anything for the relationship.

If that's your takeaway, you may be in for difficulty.

[–]Liberated_Asexual 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Hilarious rationalization

[–]cryptothrow2 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

How romantic

[–]coastFI_chaser 0 points1 point  (25 children) | Copy Link

Or maybe she was drunk

[–]KissMyAsthma-99 0 points1 point  (24 children) | Copy Link

Then let's go out drinking.

[–]coastFI_chaser -1 points0 points  (21 children) | Copy Link

You are welcome to do that. I'll I'm trying to highlight is some men try take advantage of drunk women for sex and it has nothing to do with desire or other BS they sell/say.

[–]KissMyAsthma-99 0 points1 point  (20 children) | Copy Link

Ahhh, the classic rape defense. No one is buying that 'yeah, my body count is 20, but I was raped every time.'

[–]cryptothrow2 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Alcohol removes inhibition. Doesn't create desire

[–]KissMyAsthma-99 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

That's exactly my point. The desire exists independent from the alcohol.

[–]tired_hillbillyredneck 16 points17 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

If you respect him more, why are you treating him worse? Only explanation that makes sense to me is that you don't actually respect him more.

[–]krinky_dinkPurple Pill Man 6 points7 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

Because they aren't mutually exclusive. You can smash them just as fast and still get to know them. If you're really into a dude like that what sense does it make not to put out just as fast you did for complete strangers?

[–]Sekina7FDS Femme Fatale -1 points0 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

Why not get a hooker???

[–]asshole67throw 0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

Hooker sex doesn’t make men feel validated or desired because it’s transactional. You’re purchasing something, you’re not being gifted it or chosen.

Not to mention a lot of hookers won’t kiss, insist on condoms, watch the time, or forcefully rub/suck you to give you one quick ruined orgasm so that you leave after 10 minutes even if you paid for the hour. They’re just not enthusiastic and there’s no chemistry.

[–]GloomyHousing26571 points [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

OMG YOU SHOULD ALWAYS BE USING CONDOMS WHEN HAVING CASUAL SEC YOU NASTY ASS.

[–]asshole67throw 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I didn’t say that I didn’t, I listed it as a negative aspect to casual sex.

[–]Sekina7FDS Femme Fatale -1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

So want to eeel desired by women for you even though you may have no intention of taking those women seriously and will judge them if they give you the raw lust you claim You want ? So all for your benefit then . PAY A PROFESSIONAL

[–]asshole67throw 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

You asked why men don’t just use hookers. Also I’m not OP.

It’s because men do actually want more than a relationship and an emotional connect not just a hole to poke.

Statistically the most requested adult service is “the girlfriend experience”. Most men do not want to be racking up body counts, they just want one high/equal value person who respects them.

The problem is most men don’t want to do the work and don’t level up to provide anything of interest to that woman, should they even find her, and they are bitter about that because blaming others is easier than admitting maybe they’re the ones with the problem. Then they come up with BS stereotypes like “all woman only want xyz or only care about money” which isn’t true.

[–]krinky_dinkPurple Pill Man 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

STDs and exclusivity

[–]LotBuilder 14 points15 points  (18 children) | Copy Link

I took Stacey out last Saturday. I scheduled a massage and spa day for her and her bff till about 4. Then we went to the mall, bought her anything she wanted. She got like 10 outfits and some jewelry and LV purse. Then we went to her favorite restaurant and a moonlit walk in the beach. I set up a little non fire and we made s’mores and cuddled. I just kinda spoiled her because I knew it was short term and I didn’t have to worry about setting the bar too high. It will never happen again so I don’t have to match that effort level or spend that much.

But you, I see a real future with us. I want to build a true partnership potentially for life. Since I don’t want to set the bar too high or do anything I can’t maintain long term we are going to Waffle House and splitting the bill… your driving. I want us to equal and set the tone for a long lasting relationship because I just respect you so much. What I gave to Stacey is nothing compared to the true 50/50 partnership I envision for us.

Do you see how that may not seem like such an awesome deal?

[–]throwawaylessons103 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Maybe I'm insane, but I'd honestly be fine with this.

I value emotional connection and great conversations over gift-giving. If I like you, I'll like you even at Waffle house and if I don't like you, no amount of "spoiling" will change my mind.

[–]LotBuilder 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Maybe that’s true, but if he was extremely generous with every girl that he has dated right up until he started dating you… I’m sure you would not be super happy about that. You would want the connection and great conversations AND him to be generous.

[–]sleydon 0 points1 point  (13 children) | Copy Link

This is a straight up ridiculous comparison. Mainly because if someone see’s something long term with you have plenty of time to have sex as many times as you want. Does it really matter if it’s on the third date and not the first.

[–]LotBuilder 3 points4 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

From a man’s eyes, this is not ridiculous at all and over the course of a long-term relationship he will take her shopping and to a nice restaurant, and get her a massage…. Over time. There’s plenty of time for all that later.

[–]sleydon 4 points5 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

No woman expects that from a first date though? If a guy is giving that outside of a committed relationship, it’s his own doing.

[–]LotBuilder 2 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

I’m sure you wouldn’t care that he was extremely generous with every girl before you.

[–]Substantial_Wasabi 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

As a woman I wouldn’t expect any of that outside of a committed relationship anyways.

[–]midwesternMDNo Pill 3 points4 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Not really ridiculous at all. It’s treating different people differently, in a curiously counterintuitive way.

[–]sleydon 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Not having sex with a guy on the first date because you want to ensure you have a proper connection first is very much an intuitive response. If a guy is only in it for sex he won’t stick around and then you have your answer and didn’t get intimate with him when you had different ideas where it was going.

[–]midwesternMDNo Pill 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

That is one of many intuitive approaches if you view sex as something that is precious. And if that were true, then men being upset that the same woman will quickly have casual sex with one man (sex material), but will make another man (boyfriend material) wait x dates for it, then I would argue that men are right to be upset.

The caveat here is that I think the men of PPD overestimate the prevalence of women who are into casual sex, and I would argue that a one-off episode of casual sex does not make a woman into casual sex.

I think that in any dating model, two parties are trying to assess compatibility in values, personalities, lifestyles, goals, and yes, sex. Most of the non-sexual stuff can be assessed through conversation in the first few dates, but nobody really knows until you’ve been dating for quite some time. The sexual stuff, on the other hand, can only be assessed by having sex. That can be readily assessed as soon as the first date. Some insist on making that determination quickly, others don’t. If it works for them, more power to them.

Personally, I’m willing to go on 5-10 dates without sex, but I won’t ask anyone out for a 5th date (ish) if we haven’t kissed. If I photographed better and had women beating down my front door, I would be much less patient than I am now. But for my level of attractiveness, and for my level of pickiness, those numbers work for me.

[–]GloomyHousing2657 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Literally no dude does that shit. Ridiculous comparison.

[–]LotBuilder 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

It was a slightly extreme example but Yes, there are rich guys that will do a lot.

[–]sarkington 17 points18 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I’m pretty sure you’re still not allowed to post twice in 12 hours

Also, you’ve already asked variations on this question multiple times, so I don’t know why you need to ask it again

[–]attendquoi 19 points20 points  (48 children) | Copy Link

For me, the only purpose of making a man wait to have sex is to be certain he is not dating me JUST for the sex.

I really don't understand why men will ask women for relationships when that's not actually what they want. If you want to be "Chad" or "Tyrone", you shouldn't be looking for dates. Just hookups

[–]GloomyHousing2657 12 points13 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

Thank you! Lots of dudes try to be deceptive to get what they want. Which is why women make dude go through hoops and hoops to try to weed through the dudes just sticking around for a quick lay. Some women may be down if you’re just upfront with what you want.

[–]SylvestorTalone 4 points5 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Which is why women make dude go through hoops and hoops to try to weed through the dudes just sticking around for a quick lay.

They make unattractive guys go through hoops to try and weed out the unattractive guys just looking for a quick lay you mean?

[–]attendquoi 5 points6 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

If a man is unattractive, he's not getting anything at all. The only reason to date someone you don't find attractive is if they're reimbursing you financially.

And there is zero good reason to ever have sex with someone you don't find attractive.

[–]C4yourshelf 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Monster dong

[–]empresa_josefinaNo Pill 11 points12 points  (23 children) | Copy Link

I want a relationship with sex in it. The best predictor that the relationship will be filled with sex is if we have sex right away, since that means she finds me viscerally attractive.

[–]beautifultomatillo2 7 points8 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

Has nothing to do with attraction imo, it’s more so being sexually liberal and adventurous.

What I don’t get it men say they like inexperienced women, who I assume usually would like to wait longer because sex is a bigger deal to them

[–]Liberated_Asexual 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Women largely don't do anything during sex. Men are the far more active agent in it.

[–]empresa_josefinaNo Pill 3 points4 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

I don’t like sexually inexperienced women

[–]LocuraLins 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

It’s more so a good chunk of men on this subreddit want to have lots of sex with lots of different women then want women with little to no experience that goes all in in the first couple of dates. It’s complete nonsense

[–]C4yourshelf 1 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

Eyy tell your woman to swing by my place tonight just a little training here a little experience there. I got my boys here too help her get that experience you so like faster what you say?

[–]attendquoi 0 points1 point  (10 children) | Copy Link

And that's fine. But you should worry about finding a woman who thinks the same way you do...not waste time complaining about the women you don't want anyway. Women are not obligated to change their behaviors just so you feel like you have options.

[–]sebwiers 1 point2 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

In my experience, that's most women who want a relationship with me. But if I say that here, people presume it's because I'm attractive, not because I follow your obvious and rational suggestion to date like minded women.

[–]attendquoi 0 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy Link

Do you actually hang out in places where casual sex is frequent? Even encouraged?

[–]El_Tigrex 3 points4 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

Not all men can get hookups, men don’t want to be in a relationship with a girl who does hookups but wouldn’t hookup with them.

[–]attendquoi 1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

If a man can get a date from a woman, he can get a hookup from the same woman if she's open to casual sex. If he isn't surrounding himself with people who have frequent casual sex and going to places where casual sex happens frequently, that's on him.

[–]AidsVictim 4 points5 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

If a man can get a date from a woman, he can get a hookup from the same woman if she's open to casual sex.

Nah, a woman doesn't have to be explicitly open to casual sex to have it with the right guy. Right circumstances and right attraction is enough for most women, including most who say they "aren't into hookups" to hookup. Lots of guys who aren't there at the right place and time and/or aren't attractive enough even if they were can still get a date with these same women.

[–]attendquoi 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

My point is that banking on your ability to manipulate a woman into having sex she doesn't actually want is trash behavior. That seems to be what you're arguing for.

[–]El_Tigrex 3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

If a man can get a date from a woman, he can get a hookup from the same woman if she's open to casual sex.

In an ideal world that would be true but it's not, some women demand a certain level of "use" to have sex if you don't meet a certain attractiveness threshold.

[–]attendquoi 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

That "use" would suggest we aren't talking about casual sex, then, so my statement stands.

[–]Sad_Entertainer6312 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

I really don't understand why men will ask women for relationships when that's not actually what they want.

Because they are horny and want sex. It really is that simple.

[–]attendquoi 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Then ask for sex.

[–]Sad_Entertainer6312 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

And most women will say no if you just ask them outright.

I'm not saying it's right that men lie about it. I'm just explaining why they do.

[–]HimNeutron 1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

You’d be surprised at how many guys will play the long game

[–]attendquoi 1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Probably not. Still, my method has kept me from ever being "pumped and dumped" so I highly recommend it.

[–]HimNeutron 1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

How long do you make them wait and what age do you date

[–]attendquoi 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

The longest I've ever made a guy wait was 2.5 months, but that had more to with being nervous about having sex for the first time.

The longest my husband had to wait was 2-3, because he had already showed me he was sincere in his feelings before even asking me out. I should add that I never date strangers, so most of the time I already know a lot about a man before we even date.

[–]Acaciduh 22 points23 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

Can we vote to make this a pinned fucking megathread. Then all y’all that want to discuss this ad nauseam may do so as this is the 1 billionth time this question has been asked. My god OP didn’t you get enough answered with the whole “Nate” fake scenario post - this is obsession.

[–]ExpensiveShoulder580🔸️ Shocked UwU noises🔹️ 9 points10 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

Just turn the whole sub into 5 megathreads lol

[–]techr0nin 1 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

Which 5?

[–]BrofessorLongPhD 19 points20 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

1) Why are we all here?

2) First date (or zero dates) for Chad vs. Waiting for Billy.

3) Who has it harder: Civil War.

4) OLD apps statistics, aka Boomers don't understand modern dating.

5) Standards: imperial or metric?

[–]deste_eloise 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

😂😂😂… the best!!!

[–]kalashhhhhhhhNo Pill 4 points5 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

You forgot:

6) The evil of society - Single moms

7) The evil of society 2 - High N women

[–]Acaciduh 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

This is actually perfect lmao

[–]HimNeutron 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

W

[–]Liberated_Asexual 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

"Omg /u/theorangesmile made a mean but accurate post regarding female hypocrisy regarding sexuality and relationships — let me write a word salad comment that does nothing to actually address what was asked."

[–]Busy-Record-420 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm still on the clock at work, which is I'm posting on this shit hole but anyways...WARNING: LONG POST

I now kinda get their logic now. I was so confused in college as to why one of my ultra-slutty friends didn't fuck met yet fucked a ton of other random dudes, and even friends I knew. Kinda made me feel like a loser tbh, cause she slammed some really scrubby twigs and she would basically fuck them almost instantly and randomly.

Anyways, she was a year behind me but I was actually studying broad when she started her freshman year, then my next semester I was basically on the opposite end of campus where most of my classes, dorms, friends, etc were. So basically we didn't really interact in any meaningful way. Sure, I saw her at the odd party or two or when walking around campus, and we even did hang out in small groups together (through other people)...but no real attempt from either end to actually establish a friendship of any kind. I would also say she screwed a strong majority of those people before I ever met her.

So one semester we actually sort of hitch up and become friends one week. We progress remarkably quickly to "good friends", like no shit it gets the point where I can see her as being a top tier best friend. I also noticed she started to dress differently, more skirts and feminine shoes. Bit more makeup. But I chalked it up to maybe her trying to gun for internships or campus club leadership positions.

Yes, I am a massive idiot.

One night after a party, we were hanging out 1 on 1 at my place. It got very intimate, she told me about something traumatic that happened to her after hesitating for a while. Then she literally told me that I made her confused because she really wanted to fuck but also felt something for me. I was so shocked that I was silent for minutes and then meekly said that we should try remaining friends.

All of a sudden, one of my neighbors bursts into the room with a massive handle of goldschlager. Literally never seen goldshlager or a container of alcohol that large before, so it goes without saying that our conversation was stopped in its tracks.

She fucked him the next morning at 9am in the showers...the shared dorm showers that were literally in the middle of the hallway...during finals week

Goes without saying that we were never friends after that. I ended up discovering about a year later that she never propositioned literally anyone for a relationship of any kind...hmmm, kinda makes you think.

Women are crazy. But maybe there's truth to the whole dual mating thing not being nefarious?

[–]Eastuss༼ つ ▀̿_▀̿ ༽つ 15 points16 points  (49 children) | Copy Link

they want to give you more than their body? Why is it a bad deal?

Because the "more" contains mostly if not only constraints, chores, labour, and bills.

And for that, they gift you with less sex than they gave chads, and quickly degrading looks.

How is it difficult to understand that this idea women have is solipsism? Maybe that will help you if I reverse the genders? Let's try it:

Why is it a bad deal if men send women a dick pic? It's free! Why is it a bad deal men use a woman for sex and don't commit to them? Why not date married men? You get the sex and some gifts/restaurants, and the main wife gets to clean the dishes and raise the kids, seems like the optimal life isn't it?

You don't understand because you keep thinking men want the same things as women

[–]beautifultomatillo2 4 points5 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

So in this worldview does love romance and companionship not exist ? It’s not possible for a man to fall in love with a women without access to her body ?

Because from what you described the perfect relationship would be with a sex doll

[–]Eastuss༼ つ ▀̿_▀̿ ༽つ 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

It’s not possible for a man to fall in love with a women without access to her body ?

Yeah, just like you can't feel hunger when you're thirsty. But you still die if you don't eat, you just need water first to appreciate food.

Thou there are lots of simps and doormats who do "fall in love" and do acts of service sexlessly.

Because from what you described the perfect relationship would be with a sex doll

The perfect relationship are girlfriends that stay girlfriends. This is why TRP talks of plates because they don't just want only one gf.

[–]cryptothrow2 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Waiting isn't worth it if you're the one who gets to wait. Moreso when you're supposed to be okay with her doing other people while you wait. In the name of you never talked exclusivity

[–]attendquoi 8 points9 points  (21 children) | Copy Link

I think where you fail is in thinking the divide is along gender lines. Plenty of men want serious relationships, and plenty of women want meaningless sex.

[–]Eastuss༼ つ ▀̿_▀̿ ༽つ 1 point2 points  (20 children) | Copy Link

Plenty of men want serious relationships with plenty of sex.

Plenty of women want meaningless sex with their sweetheart lover that they're comfortable with.

This is where you fail, you ignore the main prerequisite, the "enabling factor".

[–]attendquoi 5 points6 points  (19 children) | Copy Link

The second bit makes no sense. How do you have meaningless sex with someone you love?

[–]Eastuss༼ つ ▀̿_▀̿ ༽つ 4 points5 points  (17 children) | Copy Link

It is meaningless because there's no commitment nor guarantee he stays.

Women who have casual sex or have casual sex and actually enjoy it are actually a minority.

[–]cryptothrow2 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Same way women cheat and say it's meaningless

[–]_revelationary 2 points3 points  (23 children) | Copy Link

So it seems like the only “bad deals” happen for people who don’t communicate well enough to be on the same page about their wants and needs?

Or maybe I should say when either side doesn’t communicate well.

[–]Eastuss༼ つ ▀̿_▀̿ ༽つ 3 points4 points  (22 children) | Copy Link

"good deals" are when you get her best and she gets your best.

Ideally you should be together young, have wild sex, then marry and have kids and buxx.

If you tell me you should feel happy to only have the last part I'd just disagree.

[–]_revelationary 5 points6 points  (21 children) | Copy Link

I think that perspective is pretty limited and why a lot of people on this sub seem so unhappy. People have vastly different views on what is meant by someone’s “best.”

[–]Eastuss༼ つ ▀̿_▀̿ ༽つ 1 point2 points  (20 children) | Copy Link

It doesn't matter their views, that truth doesn't need observers or believers to exist.

Besides, OP was asking "why is it a bad deal" to a group of people, I'm answering why.

[–]todo_pasa_🙄 24 points25 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

This again? omg

Arguing this to a woman who is making you wait for sex is a huge red flag IMO. So if she is making you wait and you bring up this shit up it only means that she did good in make you wait and leave your ass. She will have sex with you when she wants and there's nothing you can do about it.

However I'm sure this are hypothetical scenarios for karma.

[–]purplish_possum 8 points9 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

She will have sex with you when she wants

True. However, if a third date comes and goes without sex I'm bouncing. Next!

[–]BeautifulTomatillo1 points [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link

Bullet dodged for her

[–]todo_pasa_1 points [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

exactly. the trash takes itself out

[–]keine789 5 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

its rather bullet dodged for both, no sex by the third date means she doesn't find you attractive so an LTR is doomed to failure.

[–]BeautifulTomatillo -1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

That’s not true, especially if you’re going out with someone young and inexperienced.

Everyone views sex differently

[–]Liberated_Asexual -3 points-2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Kpop attracts a subsection, most of which is largely minor-aged girls.

[–]todo_pasa_🙄 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

You are hoping it doesn't go more mainstream than now right?

What are you going to do? start wearing make up to attract 20-25 year olds?

[–]Kentucky_Supreme 20 points21 points  (78 children) | Copy Link

Because you already set your price with Chad and Tyrone. Nobody is going to want to pay more than that.

[–]attendquoi 8 points9 points  (57 children) | Copy Link

Which begs the question: if all a guy wants is sex, why is he asking for a relationship? If we're willing to date you, we're also willing to fuck you casually. So don't misrepresent your intentions.

[–]Specialist-Action-33Posionous Pill 9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Unfortunately only way some men can get sex is though a relationship.

[–]trueorfalsedmitryred despite the handle 7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

If we're willing to date you, we're also willing to fuck you casually.

You may think this is true for you. It is completely and utterly not true for the vast bulk of women.

[–]andrejusilva123 6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

If we're willing to date you, we're also willing to fuck you casually.

This is not true, either you wouldn't see men complaining about their gf making them wait.

[–]midwesternMDNo Pill 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I can’t speak for other men here, but for myself, I don’t know if I’ll want a relationship with a woman on the first few dates. All I actually “know” at that stage is: “am I attracted enough that I want to see her again?” And if the answer is yes, and I’m a man with a lively libido, that same statement could be “do I want to fuck her?” We can understand that women might take a bit to warm up to someone. But if we know that a given woman can be quick to warm up to someone else, then realizing that she is not quick to warm up to us is a bit of a sucker punch.

Let’s be honest. In the early stages of dating, everyone is still on their best behavior, and both parties are usually too afraid to share any of their traumas or skeletons in their closet.

[–]Kentucky_Supreme 5 points6 points  (50 children) | Copy Link

??? Where was it said the guy "only wanted sex"?

[–]attendquoi 6 points7 points  (49 children) | Copy Link

If you're mad about not being treated the same way as a man who got ONLY sex, then I assume you want ONLY sex.

Do men not realize that it's either/or? You can be either the guy we want to spend the rest of our lives with...or the guy we hook up with one night and never see again. But you don't get both.

(This seems obvious, because I'm pretty sure men categorize women the same, no?)

[–]krinky_dinkPurple Pill Man 5 points6 points  (17 children) | Copy Link

You unironically believe you're incapable of seeing someone again if you put out on the first date?

[–]empresa_josefinaNo Pill 6 points7 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

There are plenty of women who have casual sex (outside of a relationship), keep seeing the guy, and eventually they date. My college roommate had sex with his now wife on their first date.

Most recent survey said that 15% of FWB turned into a relationship, I can look for the journal article and edit it in if you care.

I’m a guy and I would get quite suspicious that I’m being used if she had quick sex with Chad but made me wait for sex. It’s possible she’s making me wait because she loves me and wants to be serious, but it’s also possible she’s using me for my money and stability (she would treat a betabuxx who she had 0 sexual interest in the same way). I can’t tell a priori so the safest option (since a sexless relationship is the worst possible outcome) is to just not date her. Therefore I never pursue serious relationships with women that make me wait for than 3-5 dates.

[–]purplish_possum 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

If sex isn't such a big deal why is it being withheld?

[–]Kentucky_Supreme 4 points5 points  (18 children) | Copy Link

Who said I was mad?

Who said the guy wanted both?

Wtf.

[–]SilentFroggy 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Men who would commit to a woman that’s been used by other men might not respect himself.

[–]Yupperdoodledoo 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

It’s not a transaction. We aren’t selling sex.

[–]Substantial_Wasabi 1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

Why do they think they deserve chad treatment?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Such a brutal an based response. Most men will never ever get Chad treatment.

[–]Kentucky_Supreme 4 points5 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

They don't. That's why they're not paying.

[–]Substantial_Wasabi 0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

Fair, but that’s because they falsely believe they deserve more

[–]Kentucky_Supreme 1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

More what?

[–]GloomyHousing2657 4 points5 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

No one is entitled to a woman body, if she’s said yes to another she doesn’t also owe you a yes.

[–]Kentucky_Supreme 10 points11 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

Can you please quote where I said I was entitled to her body?

[–]GloomyHousing2657 3 points4 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

It’s in the undertones of you’re argument, lots of RP dudes hate having to wait if he assumes she’s said yes to other people. It’s entitlement to her physical body and honestly a little incel vibe.

[–]Kentucky_Supreme 12 points13 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Sounds like you're talking about your own personal triggered interpretation about what I said and not actually what I said.

[–]beautifultomatillo2 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

You barely comprehend your own arguments this is embarrassing

[–]Kentucky_Supreme 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't see a quote.

[–]Express-Fig-5168Purple Pilled "Stacylite" 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

It is a bad deal to some people because they want both sex and love quickly and to last long term.

[–]AreOut 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

so what's the problem with that?

[–]Express-Fig-5168Purple Pilled "Stacylite" 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Where did I state there is a problem?

Or are you trying to say there is a problem?

[–]basebornmanjack41 7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I’ve literally never heard a woman say either of those things.

[–]CocoBabeNYC 5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Because we've trained women that they should play hard to get if they want to be seen as a good girl and a girl of quality that is relationship material. Because when guys sleep with a woman an hour after meeting her, they wake up and think: "jeez what a stupid slut to sleep with a loser like me so fast. I bet she does that with everybody". And then you wonder why women play hard to get.

[–]Sekina7FDS Femme Fatale 6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

NONE of them are man or honest enough to admit this.

[–]jackedsoon||| 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

well them making you wait can mean a lot of things. usually guys think it means ur not as attractive as ONS guys, whether its true or not in most cases waiting for sex is not worth the time and effort.

[–]JoeRMD77 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

This same post gets posted everyday. It's like y'all have options but you're just not happy with them. Even the attractive sluts can't fulfill you, nothing will.

[–]KirthWGersen 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

It is a bad deal because relationships involve greater obligation/effort from you. One guy gets sex in return for sex. The other guy has to jump through hoops for sex and provide a hell of a lot of other things that benefit her.

In effect, she is charging you more for a worse product. She is offering you a worse deal.

The purest situation is when a women offers sex and a relationship with no commitment. That is the closest you can ever get to love.

[–]keine789 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

If a woman don't have sex with you at least in the second date she sees you like a low value beta so forget anything long as she will resent you.

[–]Purple-Heiss 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

As I said in another post in another sub...

Having to be patient (for weeks, months or even years), invest money, time and make efforts just to hold someone's hand with the knowledge that this same person has had rough and uncompromising sex with another person(s) in matter of hours or even minutes, is humiliating.

[–]VasiliyZaitzev 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Women: ” sure, we fucked Chad and Tyrone, but they only got the sex, you’re going to get the relationship which is far more valuable.“

Most Dudes: ”We would rather have the sex, thanks.”

[–]Cibfbfin 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Do you like being second place to your own girl? Fuck that I rather be single.

[–]Big_Hearing6536 3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I see this topic and everyday wmn make me understand why men are radicalizing themselves everyday. Because the day some of this behaviors will be checked maybe some things will change.

But to answer the question, that's a shitty deal. Because if she had sex with these type of dudes, it means de facto she find them attractive. Women don't do "charity" on sex. Even the landwhale next door. They don't bang someone unless he ticks their "handsomeness" box. If a woman don't want to have sex with me after few dates, it just means I am not what she is looking for so I should call it a day and move on.

So if I have to wait several dates to get a wild experience, then better believe that I will leave you in a heartbeat. Honestly if nothing comes after the 3rd date (or even the 2nd date), I will bounce.

"Then you just prove you were here for sex"

Ok let's play with your argument. You are a woman and the guy you are dating , based on his previous relationships, generally propose to his partner after 3 months. You are with him since 9 months and he still doesn't mention anything, never even alludes to anything longterm. What are you going to say ?

That's the exact same feeling as a man I would have if a girl I date don't drop her pants after few dates.

"You are not entitled to her body"

You are not entitled to anything from me then. I don't know who is the idiot who invent this sentence, especially in this context. Men are not entitled to women bodies, but in this case women should not expect a man to stay if he feels he is being played. They are not entitled to his time or feeling if doesn't get what he wants. Because on the other side many women complain on this sub, on r/women or other type of female oriented sub that men leave after discovering their past. And that's why they literally fight this "natural standard" everyday.

That's all of that constitutes a relationship. Sacrifices on both ends at certain point for the sake of it. If you are unwilling to do so, you are just looking for a free meal or maybe male best friend.

[–]GloomyHousing2657 -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

He’s choosing to stick around, she’s feeling him out. He doesn’t like it he can go find other women that are in the same page as him.

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[–]Fat_PapayaI Lost 41lbs 8 points9 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

OP is obviously a woman haha

Maybe even trying to justify something haha

[–]Acaciduh 11 points12 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

According to their comment history OP is a dude 30M and needs to dump his girlfriend so we can all stop getting the same topic posted every few days about the same issue.

[–]Fat_PapayaI Lost 41lbs 6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Oh so it's a man trying to alleviate his insecurities about his girlfriend's sexual history haha

[–]Acaciduh 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Bingo.

[–]BruddaMSKMale virgin, late 20s 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Cause that sounds like a cheap excuse, eh?
Sex is what I NEED, if you claim you like me so much give it to me. Then you can give me the rest, whatever you mean by 'more than just my body'.

But hey that's just an excuse given to less attractive men and we both know it. This bait is a tad low effort for my taste.

[–]Blame_the_Muse{<my pussy tastes like pepsi cola>} 4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I've never heard a woman say this shit

[–]MaidStoryFunny 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

It's a pretty common belief among women

[–]NockerJoePervert Palpatine 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

"More than" implies you get the first thing. If theres a lack of enthusiasm most people will assume the sex won't be frequent of enthusastic.

[–]Patrickstarho 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Lmao Tyrone.

[–]Ok_Razzmatazz_1751 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

What ethnicity is Chad and Tyrone ? Lol

[–]BumblingBetaWannabe Chad Thundercock 1 point2 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

Why can't women have sex early with the second guy AND do things with him which show she likes him more than that? That's what I never understood.

[–]no_bling_just_dingunpilled male 1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

because he is not desired

thats pretty much what it is. most of this debate is just smoke and mirrors for plausible deniability.

[–]BumblingBetaWannabe Chad Thundercock 1 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

Fair enough. I'm waiting for some women to admit to that though.

[–]no_bling_just_dingunpilled male 0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy Link

whats the point? if they know, they know. they're not toddlers. if they don't, they don't.

[–]BumblingBetaWannabe Chad Thundercock 2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Because this sub would be so much more productive if women told the truth. They are on an anonymous internet forum, so there's no fear for their safety if a man doesn't like what she says.

[–]DisasterPeace7Purple Pill Man 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Because you're getting a worse version of the primary reason of why men get into relationships with women

[–]upalse 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Why is it a bad deal if women make you wait because they want to give you more than their body?

Because men want women for sex first, everything else second. Whereas to women those priorities are in opposite order - meaning woman is forcing her priorities on the man, contrary to his own, which gives rise to the conflict. I feel like we were over this like million of times already.

[–]OrdinaryFarmerBurgundy Pill Man 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Internalized Madonna-whore complex.

[–]Choice-Garage-5723 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

The woman who wants a relationship and makes men wait is usually a different women then the one fucking “Tyrone” and “chad”. Women are different, some want sex some want to love.
On the other hand, if it is the same woman who fucks “Tyrone” and “chad” but she is making you wait, then she doesn’t want you. She is jus stringing you along to squeeze money out of you. Man up and move on

[–]SwaySh0t 1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

She wants to give you: shit tests, headaches, stds from Tyrone, baggage etc the list goes on. Chad and Tyrone got the best parts of her and none of the worse. But go off.

[–]social_mulemgtow 9 points10 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

stds from Tyrone

You 1488ers are slick.

[–]idcidcidc666420 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I mean.. https://www.cdc.gov/std/statistics/2019/tables/11b.htm

i don't think knowing basic health data makes you a nazi

[–]Fat_PapayaI Lost 41lbs 1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

What does "1488ers" mean?

[–]totes-not-angels-fan -1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

It's code for white supremacists.

I don't know the 14, but 88 is the 8th letter of the alphabet, which is H. HH=heil hitler.

[–]Fat_PapayaI Lost 41lbs 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

So the guy I responded to is claiming that the guy he responded to is a Nazi because he's implying that 'Tyrone' has STDs? Even though, statistically speaking, there's a good chance that it's true haha

[–]beautifultomatillo2 7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Racism to add to the misogyny

[–]SwaySh0t 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I’m black I literally get a pass just like “oppressed” women. Black people and women are both “oppressed”

[–]TheRedPillRipperAn open mind opens doors. 1 point2 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

why is it a bad deal if women make you wait

For women it’s a bad deal, because men with options, won’t wait.

[–]GloomyHousing2657 0 points1 point  (10 children) | Copy Link

Not really, women want to make sure he’s not just going to fuck zone her.

[–]TheRedPillRipperAn open mind opens doors. 1 point2 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

women want

I agree. That doesn’t change the facts. Anecdotally my now wife, had to wait for me. To fit our first date in. Which I bombed. The next date we still had sex.

I don’t consider myself a Tyrone, but presumably other men have had similar experiences. Which is the point. Women may want to wait. Which is fine. Men with options however, don’t have to.

[–]GloomyHousing26571 points [recovered] (8 children) | Copy Link

That’s just you, every situation is different.

[–]TheRedPillRipperAn open mind opens doors. 1 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

every situation is different

Whilst true again generally speaking, men with options; have all the options. Hell even when I was poor I had options. So even if a girl was trying to make me wait; I wouldn’t.

The issue is that 80% of men. That don’t have options. Which is where TRP comes in.

[–]SnowHatesWomePill Depends on who im Trolling 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

As a guy who has waited before, if a girl is making you wait she is not attracted to you and you gotta move on bro. You’re not gonna be a Chad to every girl, but you will be a Chad to some girl

[–]SkeletonMagi 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Because a man doesn’t need anything more than a woman’s body.

You are like a used car salesman trying to up sell me from sex with you to marriage with you. I never wanted marriage with you, only sex.

[–]mahaitre 0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy Link

It is a feeling of disrespect to have to wait for a thing that others got immediately, as well as to have to put a lot of effort and money for a thing that others got for free and effortless.

[–]GloomyHousing26571 points [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link

Entitlement….. it’s her body, don’t like it? Go find some one else. Your not entitled to a yes if she’s given a yes to other people. Her body belongs to her…. Dumb AF

[–]mahaitre 3 points4 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Who said that her body doesn't belong to her? If she preferred to give easily and freely the best of her body to others, she's entitled to do that, but I am also entitled to not like her as a relationship material. It's what I'm saying.

[–]GloomyHousing26571 points [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link

Totally fine, then I’m not sure why men complain about it if they didn’t actually feel entitled in this whole sub. A. Be honest up front with what you want, B. See girls who are on the same page as you. I don’t get the constant complaining about women with holding sec, just see other women.

[–]mahaitre 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Both genders complain about the other, since both don't get what they want and believe that they deserve.

[–]mahaitre 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Still about entitlement: I don't feel I am entitled to the body of a woman in particular, but, regarding relationship, I feel entitled in the sense that I believe I deserve a women whose best she gives to me.

[–]WOPR-1983 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Women have different uses for different men.

Chad/Tyrone gives her hot sex with a chance to get impregnated with fine genetic material. That's all he brings to the table, because that's all she needs him to bring to the table. Chad/Tyrone are genetic providers. Sex with Chad/Tyrone is for raw, primal reproductive reasons.

Beta Brad thinks he's now Chad's equal because he eventually gets access to the same coochie. Wrong. Brad is there to jump through hoops and show that he can be a good resource provider. Sex with Brad is transactional for survival reasons.

Chad/Tyrone is for the seed, and Brad is for the need. Alpha Fux, Beta Bux reigns supreme. Brad, you now get to pay for the meal Chad/Tyrone ate for free. And waiting is part of that process.

Red Pilled Brads should understand their role is different. They need to wait for sex because of the transactional nature of their agreement with her. They need to first prove themselves to be "partner ready" and "resource ready" before getting the prize.

Chad/Tyrone's hot sex and semen is a prize unto it self.

Sorry fellas. You don't equal these men just because you're fucking the same woman. Your ego tells you that you are but you are not.

So shut up, earn that money, earn your sex, and help raise Chad/Tryone's illegitimate children. Look on the bright side. Some men have resources and can't get laid unless they resort to prostitutes. You, Brad, have the chance to have a Society Approvedtm sexual relationship with a woman.

Stop envying your genetic betters. You'll be happier.

Signed,

The REAL Red Pill

[–]ta06012022 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Chad/Tyrone gives her hot sex with a chance to get impregnated with fine genetic material. That's all he brings to the table, because that's all she needs him to bring to the table.

Are there no smart, successful Chads? That seems to be the consensus here, even though more attractive, taller people statistically earn more money.

[–]cunningcaring 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

This is complete nonsense.

[–]John_OakmanLVM advocate 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Social legitimacy values only have values when there's societies/cultures to back them, much akin to fiat currencies' values come from government backing. Take away the importance of said societies/cultures (either rejecting/leaving them entirely or whatever) means said social legitimacy loses most/all of its value.

And the real men of the manosphere in general rejects the old social/cultural constructs... and also their opposition ironically. Even more interesting is that both of them still tries to leverage those when situational convenient (i.e. guilt tripping the opposition to follow them while exempting themselves from it).

[–]asshole67throw 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Myself (male) and another male friend have actually discussed if we should not have casual sex with women we want to date.

Our reasoning is that sex clouds judgement, puts us under their spell, and we overlook a lot of red flags.

If anything I’d say that sleeping with a woman lowers my standards. They usually want to see me again, and that usually ends with us dating and becoming a relationship that lasts for 6-12 months until it fizzles out.

But usually I know by the second or third date if I see us going anywhere. But, if sex is on the cards, it’s an incentive to stay.

I also have no interest in spinning plates again. I ended up with three women for two years, it’s exhausting, expensive, and honestly not worth it. I had a favourite, but she had red flags I should have seen earlier. But again sex clouded my judgement.

I’m not anti hook up, I just think it does make you put up with more, it’s not necessarily a good idea if you’re looking to meet someone for the long run until you’ve established that you like their company and have common ground and like them for more than just sex.

This is from a male perspective, I think this may be close to the rational that women perhaps follow.

Outside of this though I have a long term fwb/older woman/cougar who is married (open relationship, husband knows/is a cuck) who I can just hit up to bang and she knows everything about girls I’m seeing.

[–]cryptothrow2 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

If you're the only one waiting,it's not worth waiting for

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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