Why You Need to Give Up Video Games (and How to Do it)

AchillesOtherLeg · 2014-12-04T19:30:29+00:00

I believe there's merit in what you're saying. Since you ask about positive impacts of gaming though...

What you're describing is asceticism which has much to recommend it for defined time periods while you're trying to achieve some specific goal. That can even be long periods if your goal is large or complex. One of the things I do during what I here describe as monk mode is uninstall all my games on day 1.

But we need to control stress. No joke, it will kill you if you don't manage it. There are all sorts of outlets and you should cultivate more than one but gaming is great for just letting the mind graze on a simple but rewarding puzzle. After an hour or so gaming I am very relaxed. Kill your stress or it will kill you.

As an aside on the subject of controlling addictive behaviours - you may notice the connection above in the term "simple but rewarding". Addictions are all about cheating your way to some mental/physical reward. The most effective method bar none that I've found for stopping any behaviour that I wanted to cut out was to make it non trivial to engage in that behaviour. This prevents doing something on impulse which is what happens when you unthinkingly do something you didn't want to do.

The example here is uninstalling your games. You can't just launch the app and play, you would have to run through the install and sort out your settings. Impossible to do on impulse. You would have to consciously go through the requirements over the course of several minutes in order to sate your craving.

Another one where I use this is in dieting. If there is nothing in your fridge but healthy stuff that is already set aside for planned meals then you cannot snack on anything unless you go to the shops and buy something. Going to the shops cannot be done on impulse and would require you to get your cash and travel to the store, go through checkout etc. The conscious mind would have to engage with doing that for many minutes so it's impossible to get fucked over by your autopilot.

You can extend that technique to any behaviour that is bothering you. Just make it difficult enough to engage in that it requires conscious effort and you will immediately have control over how often you're behaving that way.

juiceperks · 2014-12-04T06:13:35+00:00

reaching a high level in SC2 or WoW involves intaking a comparable amount of information that someone might be exposed to in a year of college.

Hits so close to home, WOW stole two years of my life and was the primary reason I dropped out of college.

I seriously got so fucking good at that game it was better than real life.. I was the most popular dude in my guild, shit on people in PVP and even had regular skype sex with a WoW 10 (6.5 IRL)... It was ridiculous..

I've had problems with addiction my whole life and gaming was the worst one of all. Started out so harmless, playing at night with all my friends.. At first it just replaced partying and extracurricular activities but soon I was skipping glass whenever possible and my social, physical, and mental health were devastated (happened in that order).

It took dropping out of college and getting cut off by my parents to wake me up..

I'd like to think I have recovered now, 7 years later.. But I'd be lying if I said that the depression and anxiety that those two years laid on me is completely gone.. Oh well, Cest la vie.

Nothing I can do now but make the most of each day..

Dubiousxy · 2014-12-04T08:33:27+00:00

Everything in moderation... It's not rocket science. Anything in excess can ruin lives- food, working, drugs, sun exposure, alcohol.

I play games occasionally because in this feminised shot hole it's one of the last places I can blow stuff up and be a man.

If you find yourself passing on real life events to play a game, then you have a problem.

DAEHateRatheism · 2014-12-04T08:43:39+00:00

Would you say the same analysis applies to playing a musical instrument?

I've recently replaced video games with learning Piano, which is something I've always wanted to do, but now I expend all this effort practicing and don't really go out. So have I just traded gaming for an even more demanding distraction?

Fundamentally, music is more fulfilling than video games. It's more organic. It's much more real than some artificial world created by a bunch of underpaid programmers. But still it's energy I'm not putting into my career or SMV.

Also, what about games that are played offline? Fighting games, card games, board games. Could these be considered worthwhile because they actually have a social element?

juanqunt · 2014-12-04T09:10:39+00:00

If you are addicted then sure, but treating games like they are crack is ridiculous. If you treat them like movies: playing occasionally to relax a bit, there's nothing wrong with that. The problem is taking them too seriously.

The problem is getting involved with competitive gaming and that culture, and getting sucked into that world rather than the real world. Never lose yourself in a game or measure your success through how good you are at games. If you can control yourself, you can cut back time and play casually just to deload your CNS... or get yourself an exercise bike at home and only play when you are doing cardio at the same time.

It's impossible to be focused every second of the day, some times you're more efficient after taking a break. The key is to take breaks in moderation and not just game during every break you take. Go outside and have other hobbies as well.

Now I know I need to cut back recently since I have some extra free time, but I've gone through plenty of times before when I'd not touch any games for months and not even realize it, so I know I don't have an addiction problem. The key is to remind yourself that there are other more important things to do when you start to game too much.

GayLubeOil · 2014-12-04T05:19:35+00:00

At 24 I feel like I just out grew video games. The real world is just way more exciting. On the other hand Reddit is kind of a video game. Its sort of a competitive writing video game. This post probably took at least an hour to write. Why dud you write this? Some of it came from a need to express your ideas in a male space. However some if it probably came from a competitive desire to beat other writers. Either way Reddit masterbation especially our high level brand hones our writing skills. Skyrim has none.

I learned how to read by playing pokemon Red after moving from Russia. So maybe video games have some benefit for yong children.

2014-12-04T07:12:02+00:00

You don't need to completely quit video games if you enjoy them. But people must understand that video games are one of life's spices that can easily be overdone.

I can honestly say that video games add a lot to my life and I will never stop playing them completely. That said, I used to play shitloads of video games and my life was shitty outside of them. Now, I only play for a few hours every week.

Ratcliff01 · 2014-12-04T11:31:48+00:00

Lol wut?

Couldn't this article be "Why you need to give up movies." "Why you need to give up books" Why you need to give up porn"

Do things in moderation and make sure they don't keep you from doing stuff that makes you happy. You don't need to give up anything.

R4F1 · 2014-12-04T13:47:36+00:00

In other words, gaming has a high Opportunity Cost. You spend the same amount of energy and/or intellect on it that you could be on something else.

krystyin · 2014-12-04T06:15:35+00:00

I lift, eat clean, go out a healthy amount, make sure to get 1 hour of nonfiction in a night, and am spinning a couple of plates at the moment (one of whom is a famous "gamer girl" with an army of beta orbiters).

And I raid 2 nights a week in WoW. However, I work at a video game company, and raiding with Senior Producers and others on my team is very good for my career- so in my specific case, gaming is an integral part of my life and isn't realistic at the moment to cut it out completely.

For 99% of people though, gaming is a huge waste of time that's stunting your personal growth (and I say that as someone who will be hurt by your lack of business).

Masonjarteadrinker2 · 2014-12-04T08:28:32+00:00

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drowninginfootwear · 2014-12-04T11:06:35+00:00

Stuff like this is what makes trp look like a joke to the rest of the world. You know what red pill is? It's doing what you want.

I like video games. If you have an addictive personality and can't play a game without getting sucked into it to the point where it ruins your life, that's your problem. I'm not gonna let anyone dictate my hobbies.

ShagggyDog · 2014-12-04T06:11:24+00:00

You just made a long post to say video games are bad. Guess what? Anything is bad at extreme and addictive levels. I was addicted to DotA and I can relate. Yes, quitting it made my life better. But I still play occasional non-competitive games as one of my hobbies. If you are RP you should be able to control yourself and regulate your life.

xXDragonFlyJonesXx · 2014-12-04T07:25:23+00:00

You're right gaming can be a huge problem. After graduating high school I spent two years doing nothing but playing Halo and Cod. I was only suppose to take a year off from school and jump back on the horse, well I didn't quite do that. I gained more than a few pounds, lost my athleticism, lost contact with the outside world, and lost my train of thought on how to socialize with others. Gaming deeped dicked the fuck out of me for those two years. I'm proud to say I've been back on the horse (school) three years now and life is good and so are the ladies. Haha

beltwaytr · 2014-12-04T09:15:33+00:00

Alright I can tell this will be a touchy subject so I am going to go ahead and say to all the game players here that this article is for those that have a serious addiction. If you haven't lost your job, quit school, or locked yourself in a room for 16 hours straight because of a video game this message is not for you.

I get it, less time playing games is more time doing whatever. That is fantastic but the same can be said about everything else people do out of habit. When it comes to me personally I gave up television, a friend of mine stopped hanging out at the club, some chick I used to know stopped smoking weed.

The point I am trying to make is there is a difference in cutting out things you enjoy and things you do out of routine. Everyone's definition of cool is different. For you it may be climbing a big ass hill, for me it could be earning a million bucks for playing a game. Just make sure you do what you do because you want to do it and not for some else that doesn't like how you spend your downtime.

J-roddy · 2014-12-04T11:14:28+00:00

I replaced video games in my life with warhammer( expensive would not reccomend unless you like building and painting) and DND. This doesn't sound much better but I spend less time in front of a screen, and get my friends together every Sunday to enjoy a shared hobby. Also its a very female free envirment to unwind.

musicvita25 · 2014-12-04T12:15:41+00:00

Playing 30 minutes a day stimulates your brain actually. But just 30 minutes. I for one haven't played in a while, but looking to take it up again but JUST for 30 minutes.

I didn't have an ugly addiction, I just believe its all I need.

However if I have 30 minutes free, I'd rather do yoga and stretching.

Its obvious what you get more out of.

2014-12-04T13:24:12+00:00

50 days of gameplay on Runescape. 11-14 I dare not even find out the cumulative time on CoD and Xbox Live as a whole. 14-18. Sold my video games 3 months ago never looked back.

the99percent1 · 2014-12-04T06:10:47+00:00

I gave up video games by:-

a) Sell my gaming computer and bought a laptop instead. b) got a full-time job and stayed back at work to do extra work/learning. c) get an internet plan that had a hard download limit d) hit the gym/socialize/hit the bar/fuck chicks

in two months, I guarantee you even when the opportunity to sit there for two hours just to play a game presents itself, you wont even take it..

ProjectShamrock · 2014-12-04T14:00:31+00:00

Good post but like others I think it applies to being addicted to something non-productive rather than specifically gaming itself. Also, to me, I rate video games at a superior level to people who are addicted to watching TV or professional sports because it at least requires brain power, while the majority of people sit and passively observe TV. That's not to say I find video gaming to be overwhelmingly productive, but rather it's a step up from simply being an observer.

I wanted to answer your edit because I do think video games bring positive things to my life. Here are two examples:

When I was a kid, my friends and I would play video games and watch movies on the weekends in the evenings. However, this was always after spending all day outside either exploring some woods, playing basketball, swimming, or doing other things. We'd tire ourselves doing all sorts of activities for real, and fall back to play video games after our bodies were too tired to do much else. It was a good way to continue bonding with friends. You could go from playing "war" in the woods with your friends to playing Contra on the NES seamlessly, for example. It was also a way for my dad and I to bond. We both played games together sometimes and I still have a hand-written paper of codes for Castlevania that he gave me and it's one of the few things I have in his handwriting left. So for me, along with camping, fishing, hiking, music, etc. video games are one of the things I remember fondly about my dad.
I am a dad, and my kids like video games. Obviously, the amount of time they can spend on them is limited, but it's a way to bond in the same way playing slot cars, Transformers, or having a tea party would be. We play Just Dance, Mario Kart Wii, Family Game Night, and many other games together, some being physically active some not.

Overall, it's all about how you live your life. Last night my wife and I got our kids in bed early, so for some of my "me" time to blow off steam before going to bed I played guitar like I normally do before bed, but I had a little extra time so I also played a little Super Mario World for 20 minutes or so then shut it all down. It's fun, and probably the first time in several months that I've fired up that game. I probably won't play another video game until the Christmas break, and I won't miss it.

So from my perspective, since you appear to have been addicted to gaming, yes, you needed to give it up. I'm not addicted, so it doesn't hurt me. I see the same with alcoholics. My dad was an alcoholic so I wouldn't drink around him, but my uncle (his brother) is someone I could have a beer with and not feel bad. I possibly could become alcoholic, but I don't get drunk anymore and I could go several months without a drink and not craving it, so I don't mind occasionally having a drink when it fits the meal that I'm having or as a bonding situation with other men. It's all about having control.

tedcase · 2014-12-04T14:06:07+00:00

I failed my masters Thesis because I was too busy playing minecraft.

Cyralea · 2014-12-04T13:18:01+00:00

No one on their deathbed, looking back at their life, thinks to themselves, "I wish I'd spent more time playing video games".

Pointless waste of time = Pointless waste of life

ucancallmehansum · 2014-12-04T07:20:25+00:00

VR is going to wreak havoc on so many men's lives. At least there will be more babes for us... NSFW

Oculus Rift OFFICIAL TV SPOT PARODY

dynty · 2014-12-04T10:34:53+00:00

I dont like that "how to quit playing videogames" article. It is standart "motivation" crap.

i have some tips.

Dont buy new games. This is most important. Games gets old. If you have new WoW expansion, it is hard not to play it.

-Quit competitive gaming. Say yourself - i will not get platinum league in LoL, fuck it. Not " i will get to platinum and then quit". Quit ladders.

-Do not join any kind of guild.

If you follow these 3 rules, you will be "cured". There is nothing wrong on casual gaming.

bluedrygrass · 2014-12-04T10:43:03+00:00

I am an avid gamer, and i know that what you're saying is true. Defending videogames is like defending your drug of choice. "But but but, they give you faster reflexes (do they? I doubt that), they are harmless evasions, stress-relieving!"

Yes, and you end up wasting an absurb amount of time in.... virtual smoke.

What have videogames ever given to you? 20 years from now, you won't be saying " Damn, i wish i played more videogames."

You think virtual reality is the shit because you don't believe the real world can be as satisfying. But you can force yourself to do it, too.

Videogames fucks with dopamine levels and productions.

They let you satisfyed for things that never happened.

They are a trick, and tricks your brain making you a Dorito Dew Neckbeard passive amoeba.

Only on one thing i must disagree with you, OP:

"Gaming, however, is more dangerous than TV or porn "

Nope. Nothing beats porn. Porn is WAY more deeply stimulating than videogames could ever be (unless we're talking about porn videogames, then we could have a case).

Quitting porn is way more difficult than quitting videogames or eccessive internet surfing. And porn drawbacks are worse, especially under the motivational/ masculine aspect.

_Dog- · 2014-12-04T13:49:02+00:00

Why is an instrument a skill but being an expert at StarCraft not?

Or rather, why is this distinction of "skill" so important?

This post by u/DAEHateRatheism currently has 10 upvotes. It is a sad day in TRP when this mindset has taken hold. The fact at least 10 fools upvoted a questioning of the difference between the skill in playing piano and the skill in playing starcraft shows how low TRP is getting due to the influx of new members. Music is ingrained in who we are. All humans play and enjoy music. Every single one. Gaming? psh. Light entertainment easily replaced by other more positive activities.

edit: and to anyone spouting "moderation" keep in mind how games are actually played. Games are built to be addictive, to keep you in your chair and coming back for more. You know very well a majority of gamers do not game in moderation.

ThePacketSlinger · 2014-12-04T13:36:48+00:00

I remember being at Best Buy just killing time, browsing, picking up some movies or new music when I saw it: a guy in his mid 30s looking at the game aisle. By the way he was dressed it was obvious he was not only unmarried, but also without a girlfriend...and probably had been for a long time. What his appearance communicated was social awkwardness and lack of positive female-attracting qualities. To summarize his appearance: jeans, running shoes, flannel shirt, baseball hat and glasses. Not exactly hip, and quite unaware of what image he was presenting being dressed like that AND in the video game aisle at his age looking for the new thing to occupy his time...which could be better spent improving himself.

Now I mention that because I was probably the same age or maybe even a little older...and I still played video games. I did dress better and was on the self-improvement track and realized how important spending time in the right areas is.

Seeing him was a shock because I realized I did not want to be seen as that guy. Was that how people thought of me when they saw me at the checkout line with a new video game at my age? Hell no. I decided then and there that I would quit video games for good.

That has been several years ago and I haven't looked back. I spend my time either improving myself by lifting or reading as much as I can in, or pursuing my passions of playing guitar, writing songs and recording them. Basically fueling my creative outlet.

Don't be that guy who is too old to be playing video games.

grendalor · 2014-12-04T14:12:56+00:00

Seriously, we need more lessons like this. Cold harsh truth. I've been noticing lately that TRP has been overwhelmed with male hamsters. Being a gamer is a beta trait and im sure everyone knows it; hence the stereotype of a loser in the media is some WoW playing fatass or some other game.

Of course there are some dudes that play video games that plow a lot of chicks but they are the exception and not the norm. Everyone needs to stop hamstering around.

TheChisler · 2014-12-04T08:47:35+00:00

only play short single-player games now on during long college breaks. I get too much good information and ideas for real-life applications. Like Deus Ex: Human Revo pretty much inspired me to go the biotechnology entrepreneurship route, and Rockstar games always provide a good source of ideas/theories that pan out well. Sure, there are a lot of hollow, pointless games out there, but Square Enix, Bethesda, and Rockstar provide some densely packed, creative outlets of inspiration if you look for it at least.

Finucho · 2014-12-04T11:56:12+00:00

I totally agree. Best explanation I've read about this subject. Porn, videogames, movies, TV... are a strong part of the matrix, when you are connected to these, you live beautiful and exciting lifes, you trick your brain, but in reality it's all mental masturbation. I don't want to die after seen 20000 characters on the screen (just 1 movie a day...) having fabulous lives and adventures while my life has been mediocre. It's sad to see so much effort from the human species targeted toward entertainment and escaping reality...

wanna-be-writer · 2014-12-04T13:23:43+00:00

The only time that gaming had a positive effect for me was after I quit drinking. When trying to break an addiction you're supposed to change your people, places, and things. By switching to gaming it allowed me to replace all my friends who were associated with drinking with gamers. Plus, I was a social drinker so now I stayed home playing games instead of being at the bar.

Now, it was trading one addiction for another but gaming is less harmful overall than an actual physical addiction (usually). I was getting drunk five nights a week in bars, almost lost my marriage, did lose my job, and got in serious trouble with the law over my drinking. I was huge into MMORPGs. Now I play BF4 very occasionally and I'm working on eliminating that (as well as all tv/movie watching, but that's another issue altogether).

tl;dr videogames can help substitute for other addictions as long as you're able to step down your video game playing over time.

LeGrandDiableBlanc · 2014-12-04T14:40:10+00:00

It makes sense to categorize video games and pornography, and recreational drugs in the same category. Video games can be though of as achievement porn, versus sexual porn.

All ~~stimulate~~ masturbate reward centers in the brain and give you a rush of dopamine and other reward neurotransmitters. There's a growing body of evidence that suggests that anything that exposes the neural system to high concentrations of dopamine triggers a change in our gene expression, creating more of the protein Delta FosB. This protein sets off the neurological chain of reactions that result in addictive behavior. The point being, addiction to video games, pornography, sex, food, and drugs are all based upon the same neural processes and should be treated similarly in that context.

Drugs can be dangerous mostly because they're mechanically so good at lighting up our reward pathways.

Porn, sex, food, and video game addictions can be particularly tricky because they ride on our evolved reward circuits that promote reproduction, survival, and productivity.

Jrix · 2014-12-04T15:47:52+00:00

Can I beat Dragon Age first, Senpai? I'm 30% in or so.

likechoklit4choklit · 2014-12-04T16:25:26+00:00

♂

A word of caution: Videogame addiction can be readily replaced by internet surfing/forum addiction. If you're spending more than a few hours of week participating in online behaviors outside of a work context, you may want to evaluate what you are getting out of the interaction. Mercilessly interrogate yourself, adjust according to your results, and grow.

2014-12-04T16:52:13+00:00

I know you're getting some hate here but thank you so much for this post this was really what I need. I recently started deleting games one by one from my pc but this post really made me sure that there's just no place for pc games in my life if I want to be who I want to be. And also for newer guys I'd recommend cutting out porn completely and reducing masturbation dramatically cause doing that really reduced my social anxiety. I'm probably gonna get some hate for this no fapping recommendation but seriously if you are new here and think someone is slowing down your progress it's probably it (and games of course)

ArtTheRussian · 2014-12-04T18:22:53+00:00

Wait why not just set aside a certain amount of time? I go work then gym then video games at home and if I have a date I do that before video games. It's all about time management and what you think comes first.

Sarcasticus · 2014-12-04T22:10:10+00:00

I don't know if giving up something that brings you pleasure is necessary. But it's clear that video games are a low value activity. If you spend your day engaged in low value activities, you'll become a low value man.

Video games could be replaced by other low value activities; surfing reddit, watching tv, masturbating, etc... Spending a majority of your time engaged in low value activities will stunt your personal growth.

Similar to the "NoFap" idea, if you're currently spending a majority of your day playing video games, I'd recommend giving it up for 40 days cold turkey.

99_Problem · 2014-12-05T06:44:27+00:00

Wow, tons of responses.

In terms of entertainment, gaming is probably the most economical form there is. However OP, you're absolutely right. "Gaming" is simply sitting on your ass for extended periods of time. That is not useful to anybody.

2014-12-04T07:34:48+00:00

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Mikesapien · 2014-12-04T10:28:21+00:00

I find the opposite to be the case, actually.

My friends and I don our nerdy headsets and treat gaming like today's equivalent of the 17th Century coffeehouse - our game chat is an experimental place; a test chamber for storytelling, irony/comedy, conversation, self-expression, abstract reasoning, linguistic skills, topic knowledge, working memory, and our general aptitude at being "interesting."

Being a male space makes it relatively uninhibited, and central to its operation is humor, both the ability to laugh at others as well as ourselves. We joke and sharpen our banter. This skill carries over into the rest of your life. If you treat everything without seriousness, you'll find it easier to handle and easier to manipulate to your advantage. It puts people at ease and they extend their confidence to you. This is the "amused" in Amused Mastery.

I suppose this comes down primarily to how you game. I keep it a social, brotherly activity that I highly value and allows me to keep up with close friends. It's masculine time, and masculine time is valuable.

rainbowhotpocket · 2014-12-04T21:43:24+00:00

It all depends, my friend. The article you linked says quit cold turkey. This is as if you have an addiction. Now the people playing lol dota wow etc. very competetively are most likely addicted however, there is the casual gamer. Myself, and some other friends, will all go over to one friend's dorm maybe a night a week and play some halo or cod aw for a couple hours, then hit the gym or bars. As a social bonding tool with other men, gaming is an important bridge builder.

Nowadays most men play video games in their free time for fun; you mentioned a couple reasons why. You have to be able to relate to these people.

2014-12-04T09:45:46+00:00

I've ditched videogames in its entirety.

I used to love them, still do really. But I don't regret it, you know why? Because all that time I spent now goes into making music, which is just as fun but at the end of it I have something to show for it!

Overzealous_BlackGuy · 2014-12-04T10:43:56+00:00

Runescape fucked up my highschool years, i boxed for five years and spent my free time grinding on runescape instead of doing roadwork, showing up on time, i wasted my chance to win the golden gloves.

Goldfulgore · 2014-12-04T11:14:40+00:00

I agree with your post 100%. I haven't played a single MMO in my life cause I never wanted to get addicted. I do however play with moderation.

n your post, explain a few positive things that gaming adds to your life.

When I have nothing to do I will replace gaming with going out at bars or clubs to have fun. This has some negative implications to my wallet. In the past month I have had some economic problems and gaming has helped me reduce my spending budget. But this was more of a conscious effort than an accidental benefit.

TheRealMouseRat · 2014-12-04T11:55:18+00:00

I play a lot of video games, and I love them, and I agree with what you're saying here. What makes video games so great, is exactly why they are so dangerous to ones development. It's like heroin, it wouldn't have been any problem with heroin if it wasn't so great.

TRPsubmitter · 2014-12-04T14:05:47+00:00

Look, if you want to argue every negative thing about gaming or about how none of this applies to you because you're a "casual" and you "can control yourself... unlike those lame betas"...At the moment its just a bunch of people calling me "extreme"... which is true, but seriously, this is RP, a strategy or idea being "extreme" is not an inherently negative thing.

Sigh...more MGTOWs totally derailing discussion and hamstering about why THEY are exceptional and rules don't apply to them. You bring up an excellent point and they bring up ancillary factors about "no wait, I only play a little bit!"

I posted something before on gaming (not as detailed as yours) and all the comments were "fuck off! I can control my gaming! I'm still alpha and can play SIM city!"

facepalm

skimdit · 2014-12-04T18:23:38+00:00

This should be re-titled "Why You Sex-Deprived Basement Dwelling Betas Need to Give Up Video Games". The rest of us men who can handle our own business and still drink, toke, play video games and watch porn while getting more than enough tail have no need for all this "TEN REASONS YOU NEED TO STOP XXXXX TODAY!!!" bullshit.

2014-12-04T05:30:38+00:00

I've discovered a 100% effective method of quitting cold-turkey. Fry your card!

juicyjcantt · 2014-12-04T09:32:13+00:00

So this is my first post here. I generally read this sub out of a bit of horrified fascination, and at first I was honestly pretty disgruntled by this post. I felt angry that you were clearly so against something I really value (playing video games.)

But I think you're right. I felt sick when I was reading what you said about wandering around in the games trying to live out some boyhood exploration urge that should have been lived out in the real world. Gaming has thrashed a good bit of my life and still I basically will leap to defend it and get angry when people insult it.

Anyway, just saying, this convinced me to sub. I felt like a fat guy defending Wendys - like why do I feel so butthurt that something I know has contributed to spinal issues and antisocial behavior in me and many of my friends?

What do you recommend substituting gaming with? I'm 26, financially solid, and I work out and eat healthy. I work a ton, but I still have this free time and I don't really feel curious about anything else, like learning an instrument or painting or whatever. If I were to try out an "RP" outlook in this regard, what the hell would I do with my gaming time? I was looking around here and it seems like the answer is monkmode?

Cyralea · 2014-12-04T11:52:27+00:00

Theres a strong correlation between me becoming a stronger version of myself and less time invested in video games. I still play video games about 4-5 hours a week but that still feels like time wasted. Games feel great when I havent played them in a week but the novelty wears off in hours then I generally become more irritable and less happy with the simple things in my day to day life. With alot of video games I just get bored because ive already swalled the pill and they dont provide that same level of stimulus as when im expressing myself in the real world, working out and getting productive shit done.

I dont think you can say its worse than porn and TV because addictions affect people in different ways. Its subjective. For me Porn has been a worse addiction than video games. In online games at least you are playing with other people. With porn you are alone filling a void watching other people have sex.

Human_v2 · 2014-12-04T09:38:30+00:00

I played games competitively for five years, does anyone have an idea for what to do instead which allows you to get that element of nightly competition?

I was essentially competing for 2+ hours per evening. I since took up mma and bjj but even in those sports the competitive bit (rolling at the end of a session) is maximum of 30 mins or so.

How do you scratch the competition itch?

2014-12-04T10:22:19+00:00

When I moved overseas, I'd gone from gaming on the daily, to not at all because there was no console there, and my cousin only had one crappy laptop downstairs he used to Skype and browse the web (if he could even be bothered)

The only device I had was my iPod touch, and while always pretty personable - after a month it was like pulling my head out of water when I noticed the difference. It makes you awkward. 12 months later, I returned and I had nothing to do. I went to play a game, and it felt like a chore.

I enjoy my games, but time to pack it all away again. I'll enjoy that shit when I'm rich, retired and can't get it up anymore (hopefully never)

Tommythet · 2014-12-04T11:30:53+00:00

While I agree that gaming can have a negative influence on personal growth, playing in moderation can actually help relieve stress and escape real world problems. I play video games moderately, here and there, and it is a good stress reliever. After a long day of work, turning on the playstation and playing some madden helps alleviates stress just for that little bit as all your concentration is focused on the game. While it doesn't make you a better man, there is nothing wrong with having a bit of fun.

2014-12-04T11:58:23+00:00

You may have some points here but as entertainment goes video gaming is one of the most highly-engaged forms. Are you going to watch TV? Movies? If so you're partaking in similar entertainment but near-completely mindless. Video games have been shown to teach quick thinking, strategy and problem solving ability.

What you really need is balance in your life, not purges.

If you've ever wondered why you lack that raw X factor, that primal desire to buttfuck the weightroom, climb mountains, approach the hottest girls, blaze through learning new skills... it might be because you play video games.

Quit playing video games and you will suddenly be a hard charging mountain climber like drrrrrr? What? Citation needed.

Some people do it to extreme excess. They're going to do that anyway. Life doesn't need to be a Mountain Dew commercial.

panzergling · 2014-12-04T12:58:30+00:00

This is realistic, real world advice that every full grown adult should agree with, but 7/10 top comments on here are chastising the mentality. It really shows that this sub is divided into two subsects: people who read the sidebar material and those who didn't.

LaPiluleRouge · 2014-12-04T13:09:45+00:00

Just one thing I noticed last year when I played assassin creed, IT was much harder to old frame in real life. Once I realized it, I stop playing.

Hennez · 2014-12-04T14:08:29+00:00

This is an interesting post. I think OP has many good points. Playing video games tends to be an escape to something else (most of the time, sure some games are played just for the fun of it). In my case i've realized I've done it to escape the many truths that were given to tme that didn't add up in my life: gods, love, perfect parents and most importantly NOT BEING WHO I WANTED TO BE. I'm not fully RP yet but i'm working on it.

I found the red pill many years ago but didn't really want to finish swallowing it. It is extremely hard to accept that the world we're living in is basically a social construct to keep us enslaved to a way of thinking that doesn't really allow us to achieve our maximum potential and video games provide a good way to "calm down" or "relax".

Coming back to the main theme: I spent a full year playing LoL with friends and this is something I regret (not the good friends I made, some even from other countries) but the time I could have spent improving myself. To sum it up, in my particular case, I almost never play now unless it is to keep in touch with my brother who lives in another country, but even that I'm started to cut almost to 0 since it interferes a lot with my reading the suggested RP books, my meditation and my routines to keep me at my best conditions.

Good post. It can help people who face a disorder or simply want to keep improving themselves.

MakeTheSexyTalk · 2014-12-04T14:32:08+00:00

I used to love playing guitar hero games. I got really good at them and then I realized that if I'd invested the same amount of time learning how to play an actual guitar I'd be pretty decent.

Thank god for Rocksmith.

asimplescribe · 2014-12-04T14:35:23+00:00

Jesus Christ this turning into LifeProTips. Don't get addicted to things and have some self control. Thanks for that brilliant advice. That never would have occurred to me.

Snivellious · 2014-12-04T14:41:48+00:00

If you're yelling about how this isn't you in the comments, be scared. If you casually thought "nah, I play madden once a week with buddies when there's no game on", you're probably fine. If you thought "No! That's bullshit, I'm just fine, it's just those Korean SC addicts who have a problem!", then you talk like an alcoholic. I know, cause I do too. Take a hard look at yourself.

2014-12-04T14:51:45+00:00

I just came home from an afternoon of work with a few guys from my college.

I went by one guy's place and it so happened it is the place of my ex (the girl who caused me to search for TRP).

I feel bad right now. Angry, sad, desperate. I feel all the emotions I used to feel in this relationship and even if they are much less stronger, I must avow I would gladly kill some nazis on call of duty 2 right now. If I had a video game at home. Duh.

Also, video games saved my life. I was bullied and beat every day at school and failing high school. No friends, toxic family, nothing. At one point I got injured. Because of this major health issue, I couldn't get out of my bed. My parents bought me a mmorpg. Online, I met my first friends and even my first girlfriend. I know it sounds pathetic but this game helped me to become social enough to go talk to people in real life and it helped taking the pain of my injuries away. This daily escape was pleasurable and that's one of the things that allowed me to go through sickness.

Now I've stopped gaming for more than 5 years with the occasional play with my brothers (a few hours a year, but it's more to do something with my brothers than to play a game). I've improved, got hobby and real life experiences, I'm striving to graduate from college with an engineering degree but video games helped me to take the first step.

And also, I have great memories of some things I "lived" in game. I sometime listen to the soundtrack of the game and I feel great melancolia (in a positive way).

The guy who wrote this article is right : I used to explore mmorpg's worlds rather than fight or do PvP. That's because I love adventure and I love finding new places. So I've decided to do that IRL.

My motto : become the bad ass I was in game.

2014-12-04T15:05:02+00:00

Thanks I needed this. I've been off games for about 4 months now but I'm the kind of person who gets incredibly addicted to video games immediately after playing a bit. A lot of people say, oh, just take it in moderation. Im one of those people who can't. You don't find many of us around because most of us are busy gaming.

I've been watching some of the new warlords of draenor game play videos and have been feeling the itch to get back into it. So this post came at the perfect time for me.

So thanks OP. My favorite line was when you said:

The differentiator between successful men and mediocre men is very simple. Successful men do what they do because the pursuit of their vision, the war with reality to create something, IS their entertainment. Mediocre men enter reality and pursue work so that they can carve out enough finances and stability to access entertainment that others have created. This need to be entertained and the contentment in watching another guy, be it your avatar, a guy in a TV show, or Lexington Steele do the things you want to do... is the hallmark of second-rate men.

cocaine_face · 2014-12-04T15:32:00+00:00

Video games are a huge waste of time. Nothing good or positive comes out of them. They are actually an effective waste of time, nothing kills it better than them. I really can't imagine a guy who can get women spending his weekends playing them.

A guy calling himself a `gamer´ is not complimenting himself. I'll be honest I look down on gamers.

Jf5ve · 2014-12-04T15:52:00+00:00

This is great, and as much as I loved video games, I sold my tv and Xbox and all games a few years back. I went out and bought a paintball gun instead. I thought, if I'm going to sit around playing a first person shooter, why don't I actually go out and be in a first person shooter. Instead of being stuck inside alone in the dark, I was outside running jumping sliding diving and shooting. I was out in the sun. I had a real adventure in an outdoor world. The actual social interaction with being on the field with real people was more rewarding. You think it's exciting playing Call of Duty? Go play some paintball on a weekend and tell me how exciting call of duty is after.

deville05 · 2014-12-04T16:01:36+00:00

I feel its kinda similar with consuming music, movies, porn etc. There is just too much of it. Your favorite actors go out there and work with their bodies on their craft. They hardly ever get to watch movies. You on the other hand sit and condume everything. Yoh are so saturated with entertainment that nothing surprises you. Uve seen it all

Metalgear222 · 2014-12-04T16:04:57+00:00

I just started fighting off my gaming addiction and felt I should share the things I replaced it with.

I started rock climbing again 3-4 times a week. It's incredibly fun, beginner friendly, and extremely competitive in the long run. Also a really good way to meet new and decent people.
I picked up playing pool/billiards at a bar with a buddy, bought my own cue and started playing a few times a week and often on weekends too when we are out drinking. A good way to earn respect and start good conversation with new people (because it started with a friendly challenge).
I picked up playing an instrument. Relieves an incredible amount of stress, has the endless "level-up" factor to it (you continue to practice and to see yourself do what you thought you couldn't do), and brings good SMV when you reach a decent skill level. A lifelong venture if you find an instrument you love (Drums for me).
Hitting the gym! I feel like a broken record. Lifting is too fucking good for your physical health and mental confidence. Inspires you to eat right AND get better sleep so you don't waste your hard efforts.
When the nice weather comes back, I plan to pick up mountain biking, golf frisbee, and swimming (probably have a decent physique by that time since I started in November). Who knows what I'll add to this list.

Just wanted to voice some ideas for those wondering what interests to pick up.

goemon45 · 2014-12-04T16:10:35+00:00

Ill enjoy in modration but thanks for the advise

Self_Actualize · 2014-12-04T17:08:01+00:00

I'd say, at least for me, that cutting internet use in general should be included with TV and video games.

Screen technology alters your brain.

http://m.psychologytoday.com/blog/mental-wealth/201402/gray-matters-too-much-screen-time-damages-the-brain

Now, permanent abstinence from the internet is a bit extreme. I mean more of a "detox" so to speak. For me personally, I intend to use it solely as an educational tool after I get my real life more sorted.

Planner_Hammish · 2014-12-04T17:27:36+00:00

Civilization for me. I started in 1995, with a multipak game. Then Civ 2 came out, and I begged my dad to get it for me, and later the expansions. I played until I found Alpha Centurai, and that was the main one. I spent thousands of hours playing. I could beat it on deity, leaving competitors magnitudes behind. In 2005, I quit cold turkey, and it was difficult, but it was good. I was "clean" for three years, and then my brother sent me Civ 4 BTS the week before my final term exams at university. Worst decision to install before finishing. I ended up not handing in papers. I was unemployed for about a year afterwards, and playing the game isnt to blame, but it didnt help either. I stopped playing for a bit because of all the frustrating crap within the game. I actually tried to program my own mod (i have no experience doing so). That went on for a bit, but found a mod I liked and started playing again. I don't play anymore, and I mostly regret the time spent. Conservatively, if I played 2hours a day (yeah, right) over those ten years I would have put in 7300 hours. The actual number is probably double. Imagine if I had spent that time doing something, like woodworking, working out, building a canoe, learning a language, researching equities, or whatever.

YaBoiTibzz · 2014-12-04T19:08:01+00:00

I believe video games are like almost anything in life--good in moderation, bad when it starts to control you. I've seen people who were ruined by video game addiction in a similar way to alcohol or drug abuse, they just couldn't stop, failed classes, lost their good job, etc.

My personal experience has been that in the past few years, I have had to give up all forms of social gaming. PvP, PvE, it doesn't matter, if it involves playing with other people I dropped it. You're exactly right that the human interaction you get from it far too easily replaces real-life human interaction.

I only play single-player games now and have a far more healthy social life because I cannot meet or talk to any real people through the games. When I get done playing, I still have that craving for human interaction which hasn't been fulfilled yet.

I also find it funny that this is such a hot topic on a sub like TRP, but I guess it is still reddit, so not that surprising.

t-_-j · 2014-12-04T19:23:55+00:00

Your problem was time management, not video games.

Don't give up video games, give up playing them 5+ hours a day.

You make fair points about letting them become a substitute for real adventure, real entertainment you create yourself with your own adventures. This is dangerous and it is a worthy warning.

However I think the real lesson is moderation, men need to be strong enough to experience something they love and not let it take over their lives. Like with a woman - don't be subservient to your desire for her - same with games, don't let them get in the way of your goals, don't let them become your goals.

Chrispy3690 · 2014-12-04T19:56:47+00:00

they provide an outlet for your competitive masculine urges and instincts. The joy of exploration, the need for adventure, the desperate yearning for competition... When you get that through a game, you reach a point of satiety and don't seek it in real life.

Why isn't this being talked about more? This bit of information seems so on point that I'm having a hard time getting past just this. I'm not sure if the OP has a source to backup this theory but there should absolutely be someone looking into this.

Women: "We want men to be less aggressive."
Men: "Are you sure? That's pretty much what got this species where it is today."
Women: "~~illogical nonsense~~ Yes."
Men: "Ok, I guess." Invents video games
-Time Passes-
Women: "Stop playing video games! You guys are such pussy, whiny, loser, babies because you play games all the time!"
Men: "Le Sigh"

2014-12-05T02:51:00+00:00

I play video games and guess what? I do so in moderation. By the sounds of it, you played in excess and it took over your entire life and your reason for living. Stop projecting, some of us can enjoy a video game and still have the will to leave our bedroom.

Video games for ever!

RedPillExclusive · 2014-12-05T03:35:54+00:00

The fuck is this?

I do whatever the fuck I want.

Cyralea · 2014-12-04T07:34:13+00:00

Any addiction is bad. An addiction to cocaine can lead to you OD'ing. An addiction to chasing women can lead to you being broke. An addiction to being on the internet or playing video games can lead to you not developing well socially.

All addictions have consequences.

2014-12-04T11:17:50+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Astronauts · 2014-12-04T23:52:27+00:00

It's true.

I love the fuck out of videogames, I have a billion internet friends that always guilt trip me about quitting, but I just can't anymore. Every second I spend playing games there's a tiny voice in the back of my head telling me that I'm wasting my time. Of course there's another voice providing cognitive dissonance, telling me that anything I do that brings me joy cannot be a waste of time - but even then, I look back at my weights and I see the ebooks I've been studying minimized beneath the games, and the feeling doesn't go away. Even playing a game for 30 or 60 minutes makes me feel like shit. I realized that every second I spend on some shitty freemium MMORPG or DOTA clone is just another second I spend maintaining the status quo and going nowhere, running around inside some game designer's Skinner box.

Speaking of games, there's one game that I'll never forget - and it's somewhat relevant. It's called Planescape: Torment. It's a long story, but the gist of it revolves around one question: What can change the nature of a man? It's one of those old CRPGs from the 90s where the answers were all grey and ambiguous and they let you choose your own ending, but the writer has gone on the books and given his answer, and it shows in the narrative. According to him, the only thing that can change the nature of a man is regret.

I tend to agree. These days, regret is my barometer. I actively regret playing these games, and as much as I try to ignore that feeling it snuggles down inside of me and refuses to leave until I address it. Bluepill thinking will tell you to bargain with it or to ignore it and do whatever makes you most comfortable. Fuck that. Regret is healthy. Regret is the one thing you will never stop feeling because it's the sound inside your soul that your hopes and dreams make as you smother them. Listen to it.

Edit: I should mention however that some games, especially games that have a defined end point and thought-provoking mechanics, can be worth your time. Things like Dwarf Fortress or Kerbal Space Program or certain (rare) RPGs with good writing.

AlwaysBulking1 · Thu Dec 4 5:41:57 2014 UTC

I used to be really into gaming but around the age of 15 my interest in it just disappeared overnight and since then I haven't played a game for more than an hour. My gaming addiction was replaced with lifting and combat sports, put on 50 pounds since then and overall I am much happier.

chillmonkey88 · 2014-12-04T08:09:14+00:00

I enjoy this post... I think gamers in trp are probably less addicted and more casual... your examples are great games to not play because constant attention to the game are key to success and failing is easy when you fall behind so you get sucked in... we all have vices that need to stop that other successful people can easily regulate and if you fit the criteria of gamers in op or play games in the op (except sc2... silver scrub zerg down here, swarm all day baby gg) or fit the lackluster life described by op, then you definitely need to consider not playing them at all... because almost all the examples are the formula of (time invested + skill + sometimes money = success... and you don't want to be a silver scrub do you?). control your time, control your fate...

I have a friend that became obese over wow and still has a hard time giving up the sticks and getting out so I can't say I relate to a lot of other posters here but I do however have a good sticking point on what's okay acceptable for gaming and what's not.

2014-12-04T08:29:47+00:00

Honestly, MMA replaced gaming for me.

Only reason I play LoL now is just to hang out with my buddies and that's about an hour on days that I do play.

Need my 8 hours of sleep or I won't be able to get through the day.

dencrypt · 2014-12-04T08:23:37+00:00

I am regurlarly playing LoL and still have a decent live. Don't know where the problem is when you know your limits.

2014-12-04T12:21:03+00:00

"I haven't played for 4 years" - Your League of Legends post asking for jungling advice a year ago suggests otherwise.

"I work in gaming." - Unless you're some prodigy I doubt you developed the programming skills necessary to be any thing other than a journalist( which in gaming is more or less a /r/circlejerk contributor) in the past year that you asked for which language to start.

Also you didn't describe negative affects of gaming you described addiction. I would think that someone who "works in gaming" would know better than to falsely attribute the consequences of addiction to gaming rather than to the individual who lacks self control.

You want to blame your short comings on gaming? Go ahead, you're still the one coming up short. This blame game has always been left to uninformed parents and CNN, I thought better of this sub than that. Even worst is that the post is gilded. The fact is gaming is a place where you can develop a healthy sense of competition, form bonds, and unwind for the day.

It's shameful that it comes under such constant scrutiny from this sub and the blame game has never been what TRP is about. I came to this sub looking to rebuild my viewpoint on the male identity in an effort to help mold myself into the man I want to be. NOWHERE in that process is there blame for anyone or anything but myself.

jastrow · 2014-12-04T12:29:10+00:00

Those here that play video games more than once a month (those specifically defending playing video games), if you cannot right this moment walk over to your gaming system, willingly and successful gather up all peices/parts/disks/games and carry them over to the nearest dumpster and throw them away right this moment after reading this post never to own a system again, complete your current favorite game, spend quality time with you online gaming friends you have never met, etc.....you are addicted....don't argue back, rationalize, come up with excuses, etc.... Do it right now. Take the money you would spend on games and buy something tangible; an instrument, a canvas and paints, an antique (insert wtf here) to restore, collect rocks, buy a gun and goto the range, build a race car (or soap box derby car), go for a walk (or jog if you are foolishly young enough to do so) or peddle bike every evening that you would have played games, take classes to improve your work situations (or watch youtube video classes and learn something you don't know to impress your boss), read books, chase women, go to the gym (groan), learn to cook (not involving a box or a microwave), blah, blah, blah......you get the point.

Go.....now.....go.....

.....or....here is your blue pill.....

vnjxk · 2014-12-04T12:03:45+00:00

Nice timing I just quitted LoL, best advice to you guys from me is give away your account, or ruin everything you have, just so you won't come back to it after a while

demoneyes905 · 2014-12-04T12:34:26+00:00

Why do so many people in TRP jump to extremes?

All in moderation. You can do gaming as long as you have the self discipline to limit it to a very small amount of time like once a week for maybe an hour or two.

What the hell is the difference between video games and watching non-educational TV programming? ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. Yet so many people here don't complain about it like it's the bane of their existence

Some people have 0 self control and so for those people, this advice makes sense.

Hell, when I started monk mode, I didn't touch games for 6 months but now I incorporate games as a way of releasing stress and interacting with others. I still have time to improve my skills for my career, learn how to dance, learn how to play a musical instrument for an hour and read books on behavioral psychology and programming for at least 2-3 hours a day.

When you get to a certain state in your life when productivity is your modus operandi, you can afford to add gaming into your life as long as the time limits is shared with other nonproductive tendencies. For example, I watch TV for 40 min a day as a way to take my mind off things before returning to side projects and reading. You can just replace gaming with that non productive TV watching and as long as you have the self control to stop and limit yourself, then you can have the best of both worlds.

TaylorWolf · 2014-12-04T13:20:30+00:00

If you can't handle moderation then maybe you should quit cold turkey.

Unless your like me and instead of quitting smoking cigarettes, you buy about 10 packs per year and can occasionally enjoy one without going off the rails.

I was as hardcore into WoW as anybody for 4-5 years and the junkie lifestyle is way behind me. Just because now I want to play a few games of Super Smash Bros or Marvel vs Capcom 3 is not going to hurt me or slow me down.

duglock · 2014-12-04T15:19:23+00:00

Nice post OP but you completely miss the point. This is like an alcoholic saying nobody should should drink because it will ruin their life which completely ignores the point the vast majority of people can enjoy it in moderation.

I'm almost 40 and play about 2-3 hours a week. Nothing in your post tells me why that is a bad thing. What people do to relieve stress is amoral if it causes no harm and cannot by definition be right or wrong.

Aksfsc · 2014-12-04T20:07:04+00:00

I don't fully agree with you on this one. I can understand what you're getting it, but what you're doing is blaming video games for your own problem.

Just because you couldn't control yourself doesn't mean video games aren't red pill or fuck up your masculinity or whatever stupid excuse you want to make.

I always thought a major part of red pill was understanding yourself, taking responsibility for yourself, striding to be a better man etc. Well, what you're doing isn't that, at all. You had a problem controlling yourself. Video games weren't maliciously eating away at your manhood. Especially for you, since you claim you work within the industry. Video games should be a large part of your life.

Although I'm glad you cut them out of your life considering it was clearly a problem for you.

Everything in moderation.

trplurker · 2014-12-05T00:43:49+00:00

Hmm this is too black / white of an approach on what is a very large and varied spectrum. "Video Games" need to be broken down into two segments, first is entertainment games, second is competitive games. Sometimes these segments mix but most often they are kept distinctly apart because each has it's own goal and purpose. Often a particular game will include modes of play that address both as a way of widening it's appeal and consumer base, they are still different types of gaming and need to be addressed separately.

First there is entertainment games, these are games designed around providing entertainment to the user. They can range anywhere from the lighthearted quick fun of bejeweled / angry birds / solitaire to the more complex fantasy / SF elements present in RPGs and Action Adventure games. They are all some form of escapism aimed at providing entertainment, fun and enjoyment. The goal is the user experiences pleasure. They are not serious.

The second is competitive games, these are the online interactive games that pit player against player as a form of competitive sport. The goal is not enjoyment, though that often happens, but a method for the users to experience competition and create / refine various skillsets. Contrary to the OP's position, the skillsets required to master games like SC / LOL / COD / BF / ect.. are not unique to each game or even to gaming itself. It's the ability to discern rules and apply those rules in creating strategy and applying that strategy to a tactical situation.

In both cases the user is entering into an exchange of their time for something, either a pleasurable escapist feeling or a competitive skill event. As long as the user is aware of what they are exchanging and is capable of controlling and prioritizing their time in such a way as to not have a detrimental impact on ones life, then there is zero harm being done. The OP himself even argues for this as unless your trying to procreate, having sex with women is exchanging your time for a pleasurable experience, and playing a sport is just a skill based competition. The central problem arises when a user becomes addicted to the event itself, that they chose to allow detrimental effects on their life by either escaping or "getting lost in" their sport of choice. We shouldn't be so foolish as to think ourselves above addiction because we choice to avoid one particular poison. As long as games, both video and physical, are used in moderation they are no more dangerous then wine, a nice cigar, or that sweet pussy you got coming over later.

primordialbeast85 · 2014-12-04T17:53:18+00:00

Wait so giving up something you enjoy for women is redpill? Isn't that backwards?

DeviousPaco · 2014-12-04T18:06:18+00:00

Didn't read, still gonna play vidiya games.

Austintvtious · 2014-12-04T07:13:45+00:00

I feel like this post should have said "Stop playing money/time sucking video games with no definite ending and stop making them more important than real life." MMOs and even MOBAs are made to be addictive and a huge time suck. You can't compare the likes of World of Warcraft with a game like Forza for example. You can game casually and be RP.

2014-12-04T18:07:53+00:00

This is one of the worst threads in TheRedpill.

Let's give up all our hobbies then. Let's give up fishing. Who should be fishing and relaxing when they can be going to the gym and then fucking bitches?!?!! Let's stop watching movies and instead go to the gym so we can increase our smv, that's what life is about after all!!

Logseman · 2014-12-04T08:19:52+00:00

So is it too foreign a notion that you play these (or other) games without regard to your stats, without months spend in grinding and leveling, without status seeking? In short, do you not know how to play a game for fun?

The X factor you talk about seems to be pent up aggression. That you don't know how to channel it and that you don't know how to derive enjoyment from things that are created for exactly that is no one else's fault.

ShekelBanker · 2014-12-04T10:40:06+00:00

If you let games be a big part of your life (excusable until you turn 20) you got big issues. I play about 4 hours a day of games out of 12 that I sit in front of a computer.

2014-12-04T10:59:14+00:00

I'm a history buff and I freaking love playing Paradox Games. I probably do play them a bit too much to be honest.

barmaleo · 2014-12-04T11:30:40+00:00

Is it my adhd or videogames just too repetative and boring? You start playing and pretty soon you realize it is just the same old shit all over again? I used to love playing games when i was a kind and teenager, but around 25 the love just gone. I tried playng WOW but got bored after 20 level, same happened with Skyrim and Fallout. The only recent game I managed to play through is Diablo 3. And the only game I play nowadays is Minecraft, shomething like an hour a month on average. Turns out Minecraft is a great game to relieve stress and clear your mind.

2014-12-04T11:39:37+00:00

I would have to disagree with the idea that you have to quit video games all together. Two years ago I was homeless, couch surfing and working in a call centre. Since then I have more than doubled my salary, I now work in software development with huge enterprises and investment banks and I've put on 25kg of muscle to date. During this entire period I have devoted at least a few hours every week to video games. I think it is specific to the person, if you lack the self control to manage your time properly then yes playing video games could be a huge hindrance. I think there is to be some classification between the games that are played too. I have a history of dumping time into mmorpgs however in these last two years I've only played HoN and Dota. I personally feel/felt that if I am going to play a game it should be a game that is not based around a 'grind' i.e. A game that x person who spends 600 hours doing monotonous tasks outclasses person y who has only spent 20 hours but is equally 'skilled'. Most recently I had a very serous career move and now is more or less the proving grounds for my future. I spent a long time deliberating whether or not I should stop playing Dota but I deemed it actually healthy for my brain as I am capable of playing it at a level where it is just a thinking man's game. The escapism is also healthier and more beneficial than getting drunk every week (I only do that every month or so now).

Also as a note; I've played video games my whole life and I've been RP since I was in my mid teens (with women at least) as I've been lucky enough to not look like your normal 'gamer' so I don't know how a gaming habit would effect someone who is a BP-RP convert and the advice of abstaining completely might be more applicable.

2014-12-04T11:47:52+00:00

I respect your opinion.

If you have an addictive personality, or have an addiction to anything in general to the point that it hampers your social and professional life. You should straighten it out.

Then yeah, in general give it up.

Smoking, masturbation, alcohol, Food, you gotta give it up.

But if you only play video games like four times a week, what's the problem?

2014-12-04T12:15:38+00:00

But how am I supposed to be extremely violent, kill people, steal and wreak havoc without any repercussions? Also when has a person ever filled an entire room with cheese wheels instantly by emptying their pockets. Can't do that irl.

EKcore · 2014-12-04T13:17:56+00:00

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Bartholemew1 · 2014-12-04T14:11:41+00:00

Im gonna have to take a back seat in this one and say what everyone else is saying. Its good in moderation If you go cold turkey, a powerful relapse can happen and we dont want that. If it makes you happy an lets u blow off then play the games, just dont get sucked into it and obsess over it.

Snivellious · 2014-12-04T14:41:57+00:00

OP, how have you managed to balance working in gaming (assuming you're a dev/designer) with not playing games anymore? It seems like you'd lose your design edge that way, so I'm curious to hear whether you've found moderation or some other way to succeed.

fryelosopher · 2014-12-04T14:46:11+00:00

I had a similar epiphany back when Skyrim came out, when I was about to begin a graduate degree.

"Why am I making this false me learn all of these things, develop all of these skills? The real me is just sitting in front of a television." It seemed absurd that I would put work into finding success in a virtual world, with no real gains outside of unlocking different layers of coding. Especially when I had let my real self go so much in these pursuits. Skyrim, as a game, took me away from my friends and other social outlets, kept me indoors and inactive. A friend of mine quoted me on facebook as saying, "This game is so good it is ruining my life."

I primarily played a thief with magic mixed in. I wanted that skill set, I envied those abilities. I decided I wanted to learn some of those skills myself.

I started running, because my avatar was fit as shit from all of that movement. I didn't have toned muscles, so I started lifting (using machines at first). Things started coming together physically.

I worked on my real life charisma, made myself start conversations where otherwise I would sit back and let others do the conversational work.

I noticed there were archery lessons being taught down the road from my gym. I toyed with the idea of learning this, as well as locksmith work. I dropped the ball on both accounts, not seeing any real use in my real life.

I found myself living as more of a hybrid between thief and mage in that I aimed for agility in my physical form, and focused on my intellect with my classes and independent studies.

I have played video games all of my life, and the norms of the fantasy genre actually helped me conceptualize my own personal success. I broke myself down into traits, attributes, and worked to better those. That same dynamic used in role playing games can be used in real life. (At one point, I wanted to make an app that let you keep track of your "EXP" and let you level up when you hit benchmarks. That never went anywhere, but it would have been nice).

2014-12-04T14:56:44+00:00

I quit gaming at some point in college when my grades started to slip. Picked back up my saxophone I hadn't played since high school and started to learn again. Now I play every other weekend with a band at a happening jazz club. The ladies love it.

1NV0K3R · 2014-12-04T15:00:00+00:00

Later, I realized that I just loved nature and I had this inner masculine urge to get out and see the primal beauty of the world around me.

I really like killing people and shit talking them.

Where do I do this in real life?

Edit: And before the weekenders come in here to riff on me, I'm joking/trolling.

Mostly.

image_linker_bot · 2014-12-04T15:06:25+00:00

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dancingwithcats · 2014-12-04T15:12:39+00:00

Anything can be bad in excess. The problem is not gaming or any other hobby. It's an excess of anything. If one is strong minded and manages there time appropriately there is nothing wrong with setting a little time aside to game. It is those who let it become an addiction and 'waste' countless hours that are showing weakness and are hurt by it.

2014-12-04T15:18:04+00:00

I play for like an hour or two at night after I'm done with everything else just to relax ala Frank Underwood; I don't see any problems with it

closetothesilence · 2014-12-04T15:21:20+00:00

Guess I'm ahead in this one. I used to game for hours and hours in high school but once I got to college my desire began to wane. Now, while I still have many games and systems I just don't play. I'll fire one up, go for maybe 15 or 20 minutes and get bored. So I stop. And then not play at all for another 6 weeks.

WaterPotatoe · 2014-12-04T15:30:45+00:00

explain to me what is your gaming helping you achieve, what function does it play in your RP journey

Happiness.

What else is the RP journey about for you?

ThirdLegGuy · 2014-12-04T15:49:33+00:00

People just need to start approaching their own life like a game, doing quests, gaining achievements and so on. Giving up on gaming addiction isn't easy, but it is possible to switch it to another outlet - your real life.

Everyday 'gamification' of your life, todo lists as quest and achievements, monk mode full on - and you're completely different person in a year.

EscortSportage · 2014-12-04T15:53:20+00:00

I agree with this article, It makes me feel good that the only game i know you listed is Skyrim, i dont recognize any of the abbreviations. I love cars and racing so i occasionally play Forza4 or F12013 however i completely agree with the get out and train/workout and socialize with real humans. Best part or most interesting part is reading this now directly correlates with my Monday night. My plan was to go home, take some caffeine and train at home with my gymnastic rings and pullup among other bodyweight exercises, i sat down turned on some Forza next thing i know its 1130 at night and im like fuck me! I have to go to sleep soon, (work next day) damn wasted a night sitting down moving my thumbs instead of getting it in and feeling like a god. Followed up by a narcissistic shower and shave.

trphardmode · 2014-12-04T16:22:52+00:00

For the older gents among you that may not resonate with video games making you complacent with not improving yourself, you may have the same problem with a much more innocuous grind: your lawn. For me, mowing my lawn sated my desire to protect and improve my property. Being the master of your castle is an alpha trait, your desire to do this will go up to tell you to make your castle better. Pay someone to do your yardwork, and go out and make meaningful improvements to your living situation with that drive.

If yard work makes you feel less depressed, your body is making you depressed for a reason - it is telling you that you need to improve your living situation and you are using mowing the lawn as an escape mechanism as surely as those millennials playing video games are.

CastratedBetaOrbiter · 2014-12-04T16:26:59+00:00

You can apply the same logic to a lot of other things too, watching tv, watching sports, reading fiction, listening to music, etc.

All these things also make you "feel good" but in the end don't really improve you as a person or make you any money.

JackGoldsteinWrites · 2014-12-04T16:28:10+00:00

Yes and no.

At one point I had a major lifting injury where I could barely do more than sit at a desk. I never gamed before, so I wanted to try it. I got myself a PC and played an MMO near-full-time (20-30 hrs a week) for a year.

The negatives were obvious - I ignored my g/f too much - I got out of shape - I became detached from RL and disinterested in family - Other skills declined ( not practicing music, writing and languages)

On the other hand, when I began I was a rank newb and I slowly ascended to a top 100 position in the world. This journey wasn't one that was lost on me as I felt many of the factors of success were revealed to me.

What seemed to me like impossibly magical levels of skills were mostly just time investments
What seemed to be like great plays were skill + luck playing out over time. Play enough and you'll get that good map, or that confluence of synergies.
Bitching about game, balancing issues, etc., is useless. None of the top 50 players EVER posted on forums or anything - they just played. And played and played. Bitching is 99% useless.

I think if you pick up those lessons and move on, it's a win. It's the same as gaming women. The real winner isn't the guy who is alone at 80 having gamed 1000 women, it's the guy who used the game to find the reality he wanted and then transitioned to the next game (long term game, harem game, business game, etc. ) Staying in the dating / bar scene game once you've got it down pat is just as "loser" as staying in the "video game".

I left the video game behind but today: - I am almost never in awe of anyone. I realize the true difference between me and most masters of an art is just time, dedication and investment (assuming equal levels of talent). - I realize to be good at anything I need to put 2000-10000 hours in it. - I realize that most of the time, things just are the way they are and the best use of my time is to use the system proficiently, not rail against it and whine. Girls are hypergamous sluts now? Project high SMV. Jobs and career are political? Play the office game. - Success if 50% showing up, 40% hard work and 10% luck. If the stars don't align don't beat yourself up. Maximize what you can control.

I think I came out on top - I left at the right time. I think that's the gist everything: Every system, hobby, experience can teach you things. What is detrimental is when you favor the system instead of development.

jerrytheman1998 · 2014-12-04T16:32:32+00:00

What if you're in high school

rpscrote · 2014-12-04T16:36:27+00:00

I get 90% of the benefit of this by refusing to play any competitive game. Those suck me in and make me want to crush kids in it, but the time required to get to that skill level is far, far too much. This also goes for MMOs, although I can't see how people enjoy that. Had to quit playing League and other MOBAs for this reason

I use gaming as a nice fun activity to do with buddies or otherwise as my decompression/non-advancement activity. I don't watch sports or TV or spend a lot of time shooting the shit with buds at bars.

It ultimately comes down to your ability to control your impulses to do something non-productive. If gaming (or watching football, or reading reddit, or drinking, or ...) is something that intrudes into your time for personal growth, then stop. The smell test is: if your Mission requires you to drop everything and focus 100% on the Mission, do you resent that for losing time doing your addictive activity (gaming or otherwise)? I easily stop when I should because I know I'm doing something that's more worthwhile. If you ever consider skipping a workout to game, then you should probably stop gaming as you don't have the right mindset yet.

Aweshocked · 2014-12-04T16:53:16+00:00

How does this apply if you're young? Because honestly I play a lot of LoL, just hit plat which require information but I really don't play as much as I used to, but I really don't go overkill on it. I can understand if I play all day everyday. But what about in controlled amounts. Mostly I go out in the day and play at night

redpillthrower · 2014-12-04T17:29:20+00:00

I disagree, i think when it comes to video games, alot of people are shitty first and than play video games. Yes video games can make you shittier/weaker/less will power if you play them alot (i for reference, spend 2-3 hours a day hammering out some competitive online games), kind of like drugs people are losers (inside even if their lives 'seem' ok) before they get addicted and than everyone including themselves/society blames the drug. Me and my friends in high school always played video games, some of us were good at sports, some of us were highly intelligent but we never fit into the overall social hierarchy and we all had various social issues like anxiety.

As for me and my gaming, i have to have been eating healthy/worked out/meditated that day or the day before or i won't even bother playing the game because i won't be at a high level. As i have changed from my deepest periods of depression and gaming and being a bum, i have not found video games to particularly get in the way at all, but i also changed into a "get my most bang for my buck" type mentality in the time i spent playing video games vs doing other things.

2014-12-04T17:37:11+00:00

I really disagree with this. It shouldn't be "quit gaming omg panic panic", but rather "you should be aware of how gaming can negatively affect your personal goals".

First, if you have poor impulse control, you'll go too far. And that's bad, just like going too far with anything - but it doesn't have to be.

Second, games help me spend time shooting the shit with good people I want to keep in my life. I play games with my RL bros and it helps me - it makes me happy! The reality of my situation is that I don't work directly with many men, really, and all my male friends have moved away (law school, med school, one started his own company and travels for it, etc). We're all successful, but our work takes us away from each other geographically. So if we can bro out online at night for at least a little bit, talk about what we're doing, support each other, that is a very good thing - and games give us the platform to do it while having fun and relaxing.

2014-12-04T17:41:36+00:00

This post is spot on, but I would like to make a couple adjustments.

I think that the right video games can sharpen and maintain useful skills, like Chess does, simply digitally.

You want to automatize thinking 3 moves ahead? Go get good at X-com: enemy unknown. Predicting enemy actions and factoring them into your plans will become second nature (a skill very useful in game theory, which plays into social engineering, a broad view of the work we do here).

Want to learn how to quickly recognize movement patterns and react to them? Most high speed fighting games (Super street Fighter 4, Ultimate Marvel Vs. Capcom) will develop this skill, which actually translates well to my Wing Chun training, where the ability to react to your opponents movements is called "eye touch".

Video games are just interactive forms of what can be useless or useful mental exercise and maintenance tools.

Kose2kose · 2014-12-04T17:48:03+00:00

Casual gaming provides me with bonding time with my family and friends. We play and laugh and enjoy each others time and company. It builds stronger bonds with the people in my life.

Also, it is relaxing. It is a stress reliever. I don't play like that so when I do it's a treat. Yea it's a minor escape. I think that's healthy.

However, when I was a kid/teen I was definitely addicted to gaming. It ruined my high school years. I would immerse myself in Socom 2 and 3 online and be on it every waking moment I could. My identity was on there. So much so that I neglected my personal life for sure. It was the reason I didn't come out of my shell until later in college.

But at this point in my life I barely play. I recently got Xbox one and i play it more often than I did my ps3 but only cuz it's new.

I know what u mean tho. It u have An addiction to gaming it would do you good to back away and change ur life

boscoist · 2014-12-04T17:49:29+00:00

The positive elements of gaming are very similar to those of television and cinema. It is a method of conveying a story or experience, in the case of games the experience is interactive (to a greater or lesser extent) and you have some control over the experience.

some games are very competitive and can improve your ability to plan and think on your feet, I would say RTS in general but I feel the need to eliminate games like starcraft and COD as too deterministic and limited in scope to really allow for the experience I'm talking about. Older FPS games (halo 2/3 come to mind) were slightly better than COD about giving you more freedom, but bigger scale games like planetside 2 (MMOFPS) and Supreme Commander (Giant scale RTS) give you true freedom to maneuver and out-think your opponents rather than simply grinding them down.

I will say that most (if not all) MMORPGs and RPGs are stuck in fantasy land and have little value outside of anesthetizing and addicting their players. If the word "grind" is used, its best to avoid.

Soender · 2014-12-04T18:22:54+00:00

I stopped a year ago. I'll never look back.

Masonjarteadrinker2 · 2014-12-04T18:34:31+00:00

You know you struck a cord when people bash out at you, good post BTW, whenever I put that dreaded Madden game away for a week, I hit the gym more and I'm an over all happier and more productive man. TRP is about improving ourselves and being better men, some people won't appreciate it since you're attacking something that they love to do. Regardless I appreciate the post and I know from personal experience that you speak the truth.

2014-12-04T18:53:59+00:00

The only game I play anymore is a soccer simulator. It's competitive as fuck when I play people online because they are hella good. I win sometimes. It's frustrating as fuck win or lose. But I've always been hyper-competitive when it comes to sports. Even in middle school when our team lost it would ruin my Saturday, didn't matter that I played extremely well.

DrBillC0sby · 2014-12-04T18:58:29+00:00

then do this - in your post, explain a few positive things that gaming adds to your life.

While I can't-and won't, by any means- attempt to speak for everyone, here's my take on gaming and this topic in general.

Preface: For the most part, I completely agree with your post. Extreme addictions to games are hindering to our progress of self improvement. We live vicariously through those characters instead of us actually living. Sadly, I used to be that way. But then I found this community and started on changing my life for the better. Marathon gaming sessions of over 6 hours used to be normal for me, but now I get enough fulfillment after maybe 30 minutes to an hour, and never go beyond that.

Now that that's out of the way, I actually want to get into the gaming industry for my career. Ideally sound design. At this point, playing games helps me see what is currently being implemented in the industry, what design techniques work well, what control schemes, what mechanics, sounds, etc are innovative and what keep the players coming back for more. Simply going onto forums and asking players wont do it for me. I like to experience it myself, as I believe any game I help develop should be one that I would want to play. Secondly, while I do have a social life, I have met some pretty cool people from other countries because of gaming that I otherwise wouldn't have (not using gaming as an excuse to not go out and live).

Another aspect that has been previously addressed is that it can be a social event. Sometimes my buds and i will just shoot shit for an hour while we beat the crap out of each other in Super Smash bros. After this we'll go out and do shit. On some occasions we'll actually play games after a gym session.

I think the most important point is that in moderation and in certain cases-like the ones I mentioned- gaming is not as detrimental as you claimed it to be.

tenthirtyone1031 · 2014-12-04T19:00:01+00:00

I was an EQ gamer, MMOs since they started. Console and PC before that since I could walk or about that time.

Games have uses. Granted, I experienced the game at the dedicated player level and most of my high school years were spent raiding until 6AM then sleeping through school.

When the games were a challenge they were, I would argue, acceptable for someone stuck in a bad town or around bad people to find a social outlet. I learned more about organizational structure and working with others from Everquest than I ever did in school or college and it has helped me in my career.

I agree that modern games are shit. I can zone out in LoL but the people who play that game are cancerous.

That said, I don't understand how modern games can be so addicting as there is very little challenge. For me, that means a paltry reward for my effort. In my WoW experience it was mostly a battle of who could follow what their plugins told them.

EQ was more a raw numbers game and Sony was brutal. It involved lots of communication, planning, etc. and there were no tutorials or information for most of the encounters. Main tank went Link Dead? Grats start the 8 hour raid over and you lose experience points.

In short, blame the carebears for turning MMOs in the DDR

2014-12-04T19:20:09+00:00

Unfortunately, ANY addiction is like this. While I don't agree gaming RUINS your life, I will agree that in playing the games its not making it any better. Giving up your dreams for a few more hours of gaming is the same as giving up your dreams because you want to party all night and sleep all day. Neither accomplishes anything other than mediocre self satisfaction for small periods of time followed by a longing to continue to do it again. Any addiction in general can cause these problems, but gaming being something that is "harmless" can really get you sucked in.

But its not all bad, applying some of the things learned in your gaming experience could help you IRL.

Punctuality is a big one, if you know you have to be somewhere by a certain time, (raids/meetings/appointments/dates) and you are dedicated enough to it, then you will be there.
Dedication is another, just because you are dedicated to the wrong thing doesn't mean your dedication is bad, just point it at something more for YOU instead of your character. Goals are easy in games because they are given to you, but at least you know how to work towards them, now get off the crutch that is an "achievement" system and work towards something that matters. People who play games work DESPERATELY hard at these goals, so why not work just as hard towards your life goals? SOCIAL, you can make a TON of good people online gaming world. You can also meet a ton of morons and inconsiderate pricks. But dont keep it online. Take your friends out, find local spots (for the online group that stays local) and get out of the house every now and then. Nobody says just because you know each other online you cant meet IRL.

BlackHeart89 · 2014-12-04T19:20:43+00:00

Everything in moderation, right?

I play video games, but not very much. Once or twice a year, I may buy a new video game and play for a straight week. Then I'm pretty much done unless I hang out with some friends and we play some video games. And even then, that takes a back seat to everything else (money, food, women, billards, etc).

But I might add that I play mostly fighting games and 1-player games like Assassin's Creed, Prototype, Batman, etc. Once I beat it, I'm done for a while. I realize the ladies don't like that shit at all.

TRPdoctor · 2014-12-04T20:05:48+00:00

There is definitely merit in this post. I go through bouts of video game addiction, it is on and off. I have noticed that whenever I am not playing 60+ hours a week my life improves greatly, especially when it comes to social life.

I started to treat gaming like a phone call with my buddies. Instead of calling and chatting it up with one of my friends that I haven't seen in ages, we log onto Arma III and do some cooperative gameplay while catching up on life. This is way more fun than a normal phone call, and we feel like we connect again because we are working to achieve a goal, as artificial as that goal may be.

With the technology today, gaming can be a great hobby that allows you to have fun with friends that are across the country. In moderation I think gaming is okay, but that is the key phrase - moderation.

I started to avoid single player RPG's, or playing by myself when none of my friends are on. I also make an effort to hang out with social circles before resorting to gaming for the night.

With an addictive personality, it can be hard to not overdo it, just like with alcohol or other drugs. I am still working on the moderation aspect of gaming, but I don't plan on completely removing it from my life unless it becomes a serious problem.

2014-12-04T20:47:37+00:00

Not only is he right , but the rabbit hole goes much deeper and darker with video games....

2014-12-04T21:01:15+00:00

I consider games as one of my favorite hobbies, but they don't interfere with my gym time or schooling nor my relationships. It bothers me all gamers have that negative correlation, but I understand why when I look at my fellow gamer friends.

MojoMoley · 2014-12-04T21:08:51+00:00

Fuck you, I will play video games for the rest of my life. You fucker won't tell me how to live my life. I have enough sex with or without gaming.

le_king_falcon · 2014-12-04T21:16:45+00:00

Without addiction being a problem gaming is as good a brainless relaxation tool as any.

Ideally you only spend time building value but sometime some chill time is good. For an introvert like me a few hours gaming a week is great once I've achieved my goals for the week.

If it's getting in the way of your goals gaming isn't your problem. Your lack of willpower however is.

AFPJ · 2014-12-04T21:25:13+00:00

Why knock a tool you couldn't handle? I met my two (now very successful) business partners through SC2 in 2010.

I spend 5, maybe 8, hours a week on SC2 but being able to say you're Top 200 in a game like that is more than worth it from a business standpoint due to the nature of mine (semiconductors, very relateable to my customers).

Gaming has no place in the imaginary land of 100% productivity, alphaness & making history but back here in reality it's not a bad way to pass the time since it has cognitive benefits. Obviously if you have a desk job or can't control yourself or waste too much time on it you shouldn't do it but saying a hobby isn't "RP" or "Alpha" is pretty out there.

spjjj · 2014-12-04T21:37:25+00:00

The easiest way to quit? Have better things to do. Gym, dates, school, work. Go cold-turkey.

demilitarizdsm · 2014-12-04T22:10:18+00:00

I found a middle ground approach that works so well. I only play old games I loved as a kid. No competitive games, nothing new, nothing insanely long or online. I can still zone out and be entertained but its never quite entertaining enough that I cant just stop and do something productive.

bdub85 · 2014-12-04T22:23:22+00:00

Excellent post, OP

One thing that keeps being overlooked is the overall decline of the games themselves since the early 2000s. I remember a time where WoW wasn't the be all end all of games. The first person shooters in particular had better, more dynamic gameplay and were less like Skinner boxes. You didn't end up in an endless cycle of menial task for faux reward.

Don't get me wrong, I love playing in-game dress up as much as any gamer. I spent hours in Skyrim tweaking my character model only to abandon the game after the first scene when actual gameplay started. Plus my machine wouldn't run the damn thing...that's another rant altogether.

I went to LAN parties back in the day. These were valuable male spaces. You interacted with mostly, if not exclusively men. A portion of the time was spent helping each other update and resolve technical problems....at least one guy always had LANitis, where his machine wasn't up to spec but the guys got it running like it should. There were no fake "achievements" ...you got the reward of p0wning someone on the server, followed by the satisfaction of being able to turn around in your chair and look at the guy who you just defeated spectacularly (or were just defeated by). You could talk shit face to face. You could get acknowledged for your successes or smacktalked for your failures in real time, with real people, while enjoying real male banter in a friendly environment.

But then as it shifted from LAN parties to online, you had a pandemic of cheaters, aimbots, crappy servers, high ping rates and too much time downloading some map so you could join a server only to have the game be over by time you're able to join.

Game companies got so paranoid over "piracy" ...which is probably the most misused word in the English language...piracy is when somebody comes onto your boat or ship to steal it or sink it, kidnapping or killing you in the process. It has nothing to do with electronics or data ...anyway companies got so afraid of a few people copying their games that they punished the majority of their customers by doing away with disks and burdening them numeric keys and bloated, useless clients that bogged down gameplay and killed the LAN parties altogether.

By the time WoW was the thing, the LAN parties were gone and you no longer had people interacting face to face. You logged into your terminal with a headset by yourself. Instead of bantering with your buddies, you now had to shield out distractions to play...such as your mom or your wife/girlfriend nagging you and distracting you.

Instead of somebody's living room or a hotel ballroom full of hobbyists enjoying both the games themselves and the tinkering with the tools of that trade, you have a solitary individual, usually a man, who has been driven to his "man cave" because that's the only place he has to go for solace and freedom to engage in his preferred pursuit.

Let's not forget the quiet dissolution of the mod community. Where before you had game companies encouraging modification because it sold more copies of their game and was conducive to replay value. Now you buy a game and, depending on the game, you then have to subscribe to an official server and pay for that as well. No ability to modify the game and thus, you never see the full creative potential of the game as an art form.

Then you have the introduction of really, really stupid and mindless games like Farmville and Candy Crush. Granted, you saw really good gameplay with Angry Birds, but even then there was a dumbing down to appeal to the "casual gamer."

Then you had the "console wars" where to play the latest games you had to have the latest machine. PC gamers were marginalized and had it worse, you had to upgrade to the latest machine and that was only good for a year or so before you had to upgrade again, even though the games themselves stopped looking better...you weren't getting a payoff for all your investment anymore.

Let's not forget all the political correctness and SJW's. You had folks like Jack Thompson, Joe Lieberman and Hillary Clinton leading the charge against content under the assumption that all games were for kids...the result being that games for adults got censored. Anyone remember Hot Coffee?

Now you have Zoe Quinn and gamergate, which just shows that the anti-Hot Coffee crowd have now made it inside the wire in ways that Thompson/Lieberman never could.

And if all that's still not enough...the games are too buggy...that is the software is buggy. The leading high end titles like Assasin's Creed, Far Cry, and Watchdogs being released with a level of bugginess that was unheard of in the days of Id Software. But yet half the time you still end up waiting long after the initial release dates to see the actual release. Valve still hasn't learned to count to 3!

To sum up...

TL;DR It's easy for me to give up video games because video games SUCK now!

Claude_Reborn · 2014-12-05T00:37:44+00:00

Personally for me TRP is about balance, and doing ANYTHING too much leads to dysfunction. I play games, but only after I have got everything else done in my list, including lifting.

2014-12-05T02:31:23+00:00

wow man, i can relate so fucking much, i basically growed up playing video games, since i was about 2 i started playing mario 64, and a bunch of nintendo games, i liked those games but remember i wouldn´t complain when my parents told me to go to sleep or to stop playing, but things got worst when my dad bought a pc and a friend told me about this game called runescape, i created an account and since the moment i started the tutorial, i was completely hooked, started to play when my parents went to sleep or went out, went back to school and played. my dad found me one time and put a password in the pc, i got so mad at the time. things got a lot worse when my parents divorced, my dad was the only one that would tell me to stop playing, i stayed home with my mom and i was 14 and played from 5 pm to 2-4 am stopping only to eat, barely took showers, declined all social activities with friends. so to wrap this up basically i agree, gaming is adicting since you can escape from all your problems and insecurities into a world where you can be whoever the fuck you wanna be. i am playing 1-2 games of lol a day now and my life has changed A LOT, i get compliments from highschool friends that tell me i change so much, im no longer awkward or shy, i engage on conversations and talk, i work out 3 times a week and try to meet with a friend whenever i can tl.dr. quit gaming, embrace real life and yourself

AntixD · 2014-12-05T04:00:40+00:00

everything is good in moderation

2014-12-05T04:02:27+00:00

I think you can do whatever the fuck you want. However, you need to be in control and play only in moderation if need be. Maybe some of us like to live out our fantasies in being a ninja or hitman by enacting them in video games. There is nothing wrong with playing video games and some people have managed to make a nice living off of them.

The main problem with video games is addiction. And addiction isn't even a cause but something would have to have happened to trigger that addiction. We all have hobbies, I don't see what is wrong with having a hobby you enjoy and love. And since you want positives on how gaming has affected me well:

Gaming got me a best friend who I still visit and play video games with for over 10 years
Gaming got me some more friends in college
Gaming makes me think harder about finding the best optimal solution.
Gaming makes me think of the programming that goes into it which makes me a bit more programmer savvy.
Gaming is a great platform to release any negative emotions

Besides I hardly play games because there aren't too many enjoyable single play experiences out there on PC. Although, I am awaiting Valkyria Chronicles to be on sale so I can experience greatness. And I mostly play when my friends ask if I want to join in. In any case, the worst thing video games can do is make you feel addicted and even if so the addiction is caused by something.

NOFAPFOOL · 2014-12-05T04:15:15+00:00

This article helped me quit gaming about a year ago. I am a recovering alcoholic who has been sober for over 2 years now. Not using any mind altering substances for some time has forced me to take a look at my life and deal with shit instead of checking out. I spent one summer break from high school completely checked out on WoW... It wasnt until I had been sober for a bit that I realized how detrimental my gaming had been on developing coping skills and dealing with my problems.

I think this belongs here. http://www.wired.com/2011/10/mf_hardwickexcerpt/all/

NOFAPFOOL · 2014-12-05T04:25:35+00:00

EVERY TIME YOU GET TO THE NEXT LEVEL, HOT JETS OF REWARD CHEMICAL COAT YOUR BRAIN IN A LATHERY FOAM. Chris Hardwick

CapitalG · 2014-12-05T04:46:11+00:00

I don't think there's anything wrong with my getting in a game or two of FIFA every so often, especially when it's something my friends and I do after a night at the bar at one of our houses. I think there's something wrong with spending money on in-game items, regularly devoting entire days to playing games, and forgoing sexual opportunities to play them.

an0n4btc · 2014-12-05T05:07:29+00:00

'in your post, explain a few positive things that gaming adds to your life.'

I made a side income of around $600 from casual gaming in the last 12 months.

2014-12-05T09:06:36+00:00

The joy of exploration, the need for adventure, the desperate yearning for competition... When you get that through a game, you reach a point of satiety and don't seek it in real life.

I gotta disagree with this. Participating in competition makes a person more competitive, not less.

The point of "satiety" only lasts a few hours till I get the urge to conquor some more shit.

As for the learning curve. Maybe thats just exclusive to RPGs cuz shooters are more like learning to ride a bike: the initial learning curve is rough, but once youve got it, you have it for life.

As for giving up video games?

Fuck that. I love video games and will play them till I die.

TRP_FuckFeminists · 2014-12-05T17:11:05+00:00

What if you're a part time pro gamer making roughly 500$ every other weekend which is way more than you make at your part time job as a college student. My only problem is balancing gaming with school. My grades are suffering and workouts are missing for the sake of "practice"

RedArgonaut · 2014-12-09T23:57:15+00:00

Good post. I used to be a competitive gamer. So much time and, more importantly, passion spent on my game of choice. I had been reading on TRP for months that I needed to stop. I just kept hating myself more and more every time I played. I "quit" a few times but it was more of an exercise in discipline rather than a fundamental shift.

Now, it's been months since I enjoyed playing a video game. I can feel the manufactured-ness of it all. I can't get immersed like I used to.

Since then I've been getting laid regularly which is nice. I would've never put in the effort necessary before.

I read books now for entertainment. I just finished "Catch Me If You Can".

theproudbanana · 2015-01-14T06:07:12+00:00

i would but the next FF looks cool. I think the red pill itself unplugs you from games, i cant play anymore, only sometimes a bit a JRPG. but mostly i just study or something else, tnks trp you ruined my happy gaming life.

_Dog- · 2014-12-04T07:11:31+00:00

Fuckin' thread makes me want to sell my PS4 right now and Dragon Age arrives tomorrow. Ever since I started reading this thread I have been getting REALLY great responses from chicks be it physical or "fuck me" looks (you just know). I am seriously contemplating selling this shit or flat out stop buying games.

SuperMike83 · 2014-12-04T18:24:22+00:00

What a load of bull shit. If you have self control its not an issue and if you don't then that's your fucking problem.

whatsazipper · 2014-12-05T00:41:08+00:00

You get a lot of negative responses because you hurt egos, and they know you're right. They still have a lot of blue to wash away.

SpaceFunkyMonkey · 2014-12-04T09:32:23+00:00

I'm 28 years old, been gaming most of my life and spent a good amount of time in WoW aswell. I never faced problems with my masculinity or urges because I hit the gym and had various girlfriends at the same time.

I believe it has to do with the individual himself and not gaming, if he's mentally disciplined and how he will let "addictions" to rule over his life.

There's a quote by an ancient Greek poet called Cleovoukos, “Pan metrion ariston” (Everything in consideration / Moderation in all things).

It has worked for me for the past 7 years and allows me to do anything I like (working on new projects, partying, reading books, playing videogames, television etc) but in consideration.

Edit: Letter was missing.

Edit: Thanks for downvoting without discussion.

kruddthemessiah · 2014-12-04T09:41:42+00:00

Learning guitar - Rocksmith

Losing weight - Wii Fit U , UFC fit

Wanna go for a bike ride but its too cold outside ? - Cyberbike

Going cubing and wanna learn dance moves - Just dance

Games that teach ZUMBA , YOGA , Meditation etc all exist

Hell you can strap a keyboard onto a treadmill or stationary bike and waste your time in WOW or skyrim and get fit while doing it.

furyoffive · 2014-12-04T13:04:00+00:00

This post seems like the OP had a bad experience with video games, that does not mean we all do. Like others have said, gaming is more interactive then just watching tv/movie or reading a book. Both of the previous mentioned activities are socially acceptable. Heck going to the club and wasting a bunch of money on drinks is also considered socially acceptable, but gaming is not?

Yes, I game and lately quite often. To say that because I game that i must be wasting my life is absurd.

I digress...

xatabis · 2014-12-04T14:50:09+00:00

I hear you bro! Dota has stolen some years of mine as well. Why do I have to improve myself if I'm really good at this shit-game? Getting laid, studying, lifting? Nah fella! Owning in Dota is better!

Now that I made it to be senior software developer with pretty high income, LTR material GF, athletic body I see how many time I have wasted. But this is not the point here. One of my best bros of 15+ years of friendship is stuck with that shit. I mean he is 24 year old kiseless virgin ( no jokes here! ), unemployed, without degree and he's a HUGE stoner living with his parents with 10k+ hours online in Dota. I tried to speak to him about getting job and self improvement multiple times but no effect! This guy is my bro and I DO care about him, because he is almost only one who always got my back!

Bros I'm sorry for my language, English is my third best language!

Requi3m · 2014-12-04T16:00:24+00:00

Just because you were a gaming addict that doesn't mean everyone else is. There's absolutely nothing wrong with playing video games every once in a while.

J2501 · 2014-12-04T16:29:10+00:00

When did this forum become about changing natural male behaviors in the name of female approval? First the communists took over r/anarchism and now this. I feel sorry for the new generation of redditors, who have been taught a bunch of doublethink and newspeak by agent provocateurs.

2014-12-04T18:51:17+00:00

the problem is your using WoW as an example. That's like using meth as an example for all drugs.

And no, I'm not going to give up my games, shit like this is just as annoying as the anti-masturbation rhetoric.

Just because it worked for you, don't mean it will work for all of us. Sometimes the problems are underlying and the games/porn are a symptom not a cause.

2014-12-04T18:55:39+00:00

I get the same thing out of gaming that I get out of watching football or any other form of television.

That is to say, nothing but hedonistic entertainment. And maybe some socializing topics and cultural awareness if you want to be generous.

You make some great points, but the simple fact of the matter is most of us aren't going to go out there and be ultimate alpha warriors conquering pussy left and right.

Most of us will just not put up with some bitchy bullshit from our girlfriend, and get extra blowjobs by not being a pussy, or not chase after a girl like a chump.

And that's okay

TaylorWolf · 2014-12-04T07:39:33+00:00

I agree 100%. I'm tempted to buy Xbox one to play batman Arkham knight, but then I really think about it and realize it's way more fun to train like batman and do metcon work, running, yoga, weightlifting, gymnastics, martial arts, etc then play an adolescent game.

breakingmad1 · 2014-12-04T18:31:57+00:00

Urgh this posts stinks of the same shit nofappers spout. Its called balance

Kvantemekanik · 2014-12-04T20:21:27+00:00

This just like nofap.... It's only bad for you if you do it way too much. Playing a couple of hours on sundays are not gonna ruing my life.

Cyralea · 2014-12-05T17:38:48+00:00

Christ, you certainly struck a nerve with a lot of people. Unsurprising, given that there are likely a lot of fledgling TRP'ers in here.

You're spot on, of course. I'll chime in with my experience. A long time ago I used to be a very hardcore gamer. Like, marathon sessions spanning days. I got such immense satisfaction with my gaming 'victories'. It felt good to feel a semblance of success.

But I was a loser beta in every sense of the word, and I knew it. I decided to put down the games for one month while I tried to make some lifestyle improvements, because I wanted more success with women. I was in university at the time, so social activities were readily available. I wasn't going to the gym as often as I wanted to anyway.

To say my experience was night and day is an understatement. Instead of doing the same treadmill activity I was actually learning the beginnings of game and frame. I was learning what behaviours attracted women. I began overcoming my approach anxiety. Women actually found me interesting, and while it didn't happen during that one month, I eventually finally lost my virginity.

A month came and went and I honestly had no desire to play games. They seemed like such a waste of time by comparison.

That was 13 years ago. I play games very lightly now (1-4 hours a week). I have everything now that I wanted then. Would never have done it if I was mindlessly grinding for new gear.

_Dog- · 2014-12-04T11:53:03+00:00

[permanently deleted]

xmarcs · 2014-12-04T07:07:16+00:00

So hours of World of Warcraft won't get you anywhere? Fucking genius man! Don't know how you came up with this...

2014-12-04T15:10:55+00:00

Nope nope nope. I'm going to have my cake and eat it too thank you very much.

primordialbeast85 · 2014-12-04T17:54:42+00:00

Skyrim is the shit as well. Why the fuck would I not play Skyrim? Fuck this.

chanandlerbong420 · 2014-12-04T14:49:21+00:00

Eh, I fully agree with your sentiments especially regarding mmo's and large scale RPG's, but I don't think gaming is necessarily inherently bad at an absolute level. My sophomore year in high school I logged about 800 in Black Ops one and had absolutely no life; obviously video games were detrimental at that point. But the key is everything in moderation. After a long day of school and work it's great to unwind with a bowl and some PS3. I think gaming can have a place in your life as long as you don't abuse it. That's just my 2 cents though

2014-12-04T14:51:14+00:00

I agree with everything you said. It expends our most equal resource: time. I'm still pretty addicted to games, but am seeing more the value of time and gravitating away from it.

This is natural too. I can no longer run around with a sniper rifle headshotting everyone. No longer can I compete in the upper echelon of SC2, the most skilled game in the world. No longer can I kill days of time in Fallout III/NV because I've done everything there is to do in that game. It's not fun anymore. I didn't even play through Bioshock infinite or dishonored which I would think were prime games 5 years ago.

But when Fallout IV comes out holy shit.

RPMahoutsukai · 2014-12-04T18:30:24+00:00

Definetly. 28 y.o. lifelong computer gamer. Gave up on games and never been better. I'm getting fit, strong, I'm getting girlfriends, I'm enjoying life... Dammit. Stop playing games. Learn to live in real world. It's awesome!

The_Truth_is_a_Troll · 2014-12-04T19:49:31+00:00

At the moment its just a bunch of people calling me "extreme"

"Extreme" is an anti-concept.

To illustrate: if you (correctly) believe that the sky is blue, you are taking an "extreme" position.

For a person who thinks "extreme" is bad, only a state of permanent doubt -- a complete absence of any judgment whatsoever -- is acceptable.

They wish to escape judgment. They will not.

vengefully_yours · 2014-12-05T06:20:02+00:00

I gamed when I was unable to do the things I normally do, because of weather, waiting on parts, need a break, or when I was stuck on base overseas after my workouts. Never played mmorpg shit, found it tedious. I got a kick out of highly accurate ww2 Era flight Sims and first person shooters like CoD. Sometimes GTA San Andreas or IV. I need my mind to be engaged when I'm not busy, it's a hypervigilance thing. Only in winter when there was nothing I could do but wait for parts.

It's been months since I goofed around with something, have cars to build so while the weather is awesome I'm taking advantage. Games are a time waster like TV. I don't watch that shit either and i get a ton of shit done without busting my ass.

Starshitlord · 2014-12-06T07:07:59+00:00

I o ly play apps on iPad because it helps pass the time at work. Other then doing it while I get paid its not something I devote free time to

2015-03-01T04:20:37+00:00

It seems that the people most offended are the the people that some RPer's used to be, i.e. their lives are centered around gaming. Now, I'm a gamer. Loud and proud, always have been and always will be. I'm studying game design in school but learning so many additional skills along the way. Programming, logic, art, history, music, articulation and verbal/written communication. Granted, I was already cognizant and more than capable in half those fields, but additional knowledge is always appreciated.

Anyway, like all things, you can't let it run your life. I play an hour here, an hour there, some days more than others, and some days less. Usually it's at night after I've accomplished whatever I wanted/needed to do that day. Part of it is a release from the real world; reality is fucked. We all know it, we preach it every day. It's not a bad thing to escape from that for a little while. Playing games doesn't make me forget the kind of world that I exist in. It's no different than reading a book or watching television or cruising reddit.

I've experienced attachment to characters that are well fleshed out, been forced to consider difficult moral questions, learned basic economics, been exposed to some of the most intense visual spectacles ever created by mankind, heard some of the most beautiful music I've ever known, increased my reflex time and found a passion for a subject that speaks to me on a metaphysical level.

Could I have learned all these things from different place? Sure, but why does it matter where the skills are obtained? I'm still an avid reader, a skilled writer, a moderately talented guitarist, and I never developed scoliosis or a neckbeard or what have you. Also, the gaming industry makes more money in a year than movies and music COMBINED, reaching over $60 billion, with a "B". While it will inevitably crash, as it did in the 80's, it will also inevitably recover. That's a piece of pie that's much more beneficial to my life than any amount of pussy ever will be. Games are always there when I need them; women aren't and won't.

Does all this make me less Red Pill? So be it. The entire concept of TRP is exactly what my idol, Bruce Lee, would espouse: "Absorb what is useful, discard what is useless, and add what is uniquely your own". This has been my main gripe with some of the TRP veterans. Many take an "all or nothing, my way or the highway" view of TRP, and that runs completely counter to what I believe TRP to represent. I don't expect people to agree with me and I have no need for it. My life is mine to live, and I'll take what advice works for me and make it my own. My life is not based on the approval of others. When I accomplish my goals, it'll be because I did it on my own terms.

Title	Why You Need to Give Up Video Games (and How to Do it)
Author	The_BitterTruth
Upvotes	402
Comments	395
Date	December 4, 2014 4:58 AM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/TheRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/2o8d04/why_you_need_to_give_up_video_games_and_how_to_do/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/TheRedPill/why-you-need-to-give-up-video-games-and-how-to-do.25771 https://theredarchive.com/post/25771