Highly upvoted post in the EMSK subreddit - batteries included, as well as straw men, pedestaling, explaining what love is, emotional abuse, torture. But wait, there's more: "A healthy human being doesn't use sexual strategy."

EternallyAnon · 2014-06-30T19:23:41+00:00

Okay so I can see fallacies and whimsical logic but why disagree with what he's saying? I know his hate for trp isn't really based on much but doesn't what he say warrant some appreciation? If people are in a loving relationship shouldn't they communicate rather than partake in psychological one-upmanship? If people aren't willing to change for one another then they shouldn't be in a relationship with one another. At least that's how I see it...

This isn't so much a rant as it is a genuine question. I'm interested in hearing your opinions.

thewrightstuff88 · 2014-06-30T19:41:11+00:00

I've been on this subreddit for a while now, long enough to say that yes, there are definitely extreme ends of TRP that I personally don't agree with, however, I believe TRP has expanded to much more than "A discussion of sexual strategy in a culture increasingly lacking a positive identity for men." I think that it further spans the identity of a man himself, who he is, what makes him feel good about himself, what he can do to improve himself. When this sub started, it was about sexual identity. Most, if not all posts were about the subject. But now, its not about sex, its not about relationships, its about YOU and what makes YOU happy. Yes, sex is involved in that but more and more posts are about happiness and satisfaction out of life from within. Now, I haven't ever read a post where people complained about lifting, reading, learning, and having some new found self respect, but I have read about the positive effects those actions have on the lives of the people who actually put some effort in and made a change towards that.

Like earlier posts said, you even mention the words "red pill," and you will be hit with a shit storm of hate and apprehension. However, if you merely lay out the concepts, that you are a person, that your life isn't dependent on another person's happiness, that your own happiness comes from within, that you should have respect for yourself and that you stand by your values instead of giving in to someone else's, that is something that people can agree with.

TRP is more than sexual strategy and people have to see that. It's about self improvement, happiness, being content, instead of being walked on. Upvote me or down vote me into oblivion, either people will wake up and listen, or they'll still keep living the disney romance dream and will wait on hand and foot for a woman and believe in true love. Well, just like hate, anger, happiness, fear, etc, its a feeling. You don't have too long to live on this planet so either you get what you want and live the life you want, or you can sit around and let it pass you by.

TLAdaptD · 2014-06-30T19:25:04+00:00

There was around 58,000~ Subscribers at the time of the EMSK posting. We're in for a ride guys.

EDIT: The EMSK post is in the top 5 of /r/all

redpillshadow · 2014-06-30T19:42:12+00:00

Gilded 9 times. That "super upvote" button sure cashs in for reddit.

Wonder what kind of people upvote that. These kind of people.

Gilded and 600 upvotes

I honestly don't mean to have a hostile tone, but are you intentionally trying to project the whole stepford/pleasantville creepiness that many of your photographs seem to give off?

You seem to represent an almost impossible-to-attain portrait of womanhood, and as a woman I honestly find many of your pictures unsettling. I swear, I'm an otherwise very confident person and I consider myself attractive, so I'm not trying to sound like some butthurt overweight girl who is whining about unattainable standards of beauty and femininity (this statement is directed towards the rest of reddit, not you). Can you provide some insight about your artistic vision and intentions?

I'm very very curious to hear what you have to say. Something about your photos makes me feel strangely depressed/inadequate and I'm alarmed by my own reaction. That being said, this is truly great work and I applaud your abilities.

edit: I'm reacting to your Instagram as a whole, not just these photos.

A reaction to that thread. http://redditlog.com/snapshots/774049

Nothing new for a redpill reader. That is the way women (and blue pills) react to greatness. They are not inspired to better themselves. They hate with a passion which burns hotter than hell.

torien89 · 2014-07-01T03:05:39+00:00

TalShar -5 Points 16:36:53, 30 June:

Thanks! I noticed the x-post and I had never seen /r/FeMRADebates before, so now I know it exists!

It is a sad thing that nice guys (using your definition of actual guys who are nice) often "strike out" in the dating scene. However, if those guys stick to it, I find that they often end up with ladies who get sick of dating the "bad boys." And then their lady knows what they want in a man, and they appreciate what they've got!

Just takes a little patience. Or, well, a lot of patience. But nothing worth doing is easy.

This is a perfect example of why I'm here.

1) If you're not running sexual strategy you're having sexual strategy run on you.

2) Most people promote AFBB/The Feminine Imperative without even fucking realising they're doing it.

It got downvoted but still, only -5 for a post from the OP that contradicted his entire original post and promoted the same bullshit he claims to hate but in the opposite form. Amazing.

[-] Bananafarmers 28 Points 17:20:38, 30 June

I am a woman, and I just got out of a relationship where I was always left guessing, where I was always "almost" the girlfriend, where I couldn't get anything right. My emotions were always irrational, my worries were always unfounded- until, of course, I finally discovered the other "almost" girlfriends last week and finally broke it off literally yesterday.

Anyways, I am not really adding anything good to this, but I was sitting here feeling lonely, sorry for myself, and REALLY shitty about men in general (superficial amoral users)- and then I read this. Thank you for making me feel better about men, and helping me figure out how to take care of myself better in the next relationship. I won't settle for anything less than open, loving equality again. It is great to have a reminder that you guys exist.

[-] TalShar 4 Points 17:41:21, 30 June

Very glad to help. I'm sorry you got tied up with a reprobate. But there are more good men out there than it may seem at times. We just take a bit longer to mature. =P

And here again, perfect example of Alpha Fucks Beta Bucks with neither realising they're promoting it. "I'm a woman who's been riding the carousel but it didnt work out and I couldn't secure commitment so now I need my nice guy! Any volunteers?" Oh and look who's the first White Knight in line- the fucking OP.

If any of the new people needs a reason to stay - This is it. TRP is more than "lift weights bro! be confident bro", it's about recognising and avoiding female-centric bullshit that we're so deeply programmed to comply with that we don't even notice it.

thewrightstuff88 · 2014-06-30T19:36:33+00:00

[permanently deleted]

super-nsfw · 2014-06-30T19:59:01+00:00

I'd characterize that post as semi-genuine - I think much of it was quite fair (in my opinion), but there was also a partial element of not wanting to understand, and by that I mean, I personally did not get the sense that he was saying "here is my current understanding of what TRP stands for, does anyone disagree with that?" but rather "here is what TRP stands for, and here is why that is wrong".

His description is inconsistent with my understanding or interpretation of what TRP is. I'll describe my interpretation, or what I find useful about the general idea, and am curious to hear opinions of that, whether it is consistent with the "official" purpose, etc.

In a nutshell: humans, both female and male, have flaws. Some are shared, some are unique to genders. It varies by individual, but there are undeniable patterns and commonalities.

Speaking with respect to "women" and "feminism" specifically (men also have issues in my opinion, but that is a different topic): I believe for whatever reason (culture, media, law, perhaps the fault of men, etc) there is to a certain degree (with many but not all women) a systemic abuse of power in our society and relationships. If we have conflict, we are told we are supposed to sit down and communicate to resolve our differences, but in my opinion, one side is willing to do that and the other is not. One side is willing to be honest and genuine, the other side is not.

My interpretation of what TRP should be used for, is to essentially destroy that dishonest and uncooperative behavior in a relationship. Then, once the attitude problem has been straightened out, you can proceed discussions as rational adults as we are told we are supposed to do by OP of that post. I personally do not agree that the psychological tools of TRP should be used to subordinate or abuse your SO on an ongoing basis (as he claims is the purpose), but I fully endorse using it absolutely whenever necessary to force a climate of discussion. If you are in a disagreement with someone and refuse to listen to their side of the argument, than I believe any psychological technique to remove that deliberately ignorant and arrogant attitude is appropriate.

I disagree with the OP of the other post, and anyone else on that side of the argument, when they assert that everyone is always being reasonable, rational adults in this disagreement, and all you have to do is sit down and talk, you don't need to resort to such underhanded psychological games. Yes, many people are like that, but many people are not, and both men and woman are guilty of it - TRP just so happens to concern itself with the "pro-male" subset of this group.

Anyways, that's my view of it, I'm curious how that jives with other's opinions, or the "official" purpose.

Mardoo · 2014-06-30T21:22:07+00:00

To be honest, TRP made me happy for the first time in years. I always felt the pressure to be with someone or to persue women in my endless quest of finding love.

I've had a "relationship" with a woman who just wanted sex and tried to abuse me for months, and I played along because I was totally in love with her, but she didn't care at all, she just wanted what's best for her.

Right about after I finally cut her out of my life, I found TRP. First I didn't understand what it's all about, and it's actually quite hard to understand the message behind it if you got brainwashed by reddit that this sub is evil and women-hating.

I became more self concious, I started to give less fucks about what other people thought of me, my social anxiety is nearly gone now because I just don't give a fuck anymore.

I don't need the approval of other people, especially women, to be awesome. I'm just myself and I do whatever the fuck I want with whoever I want.

I'm on this earth to enjoy my life, If you want to tag along, you surely can. But I won't bend my knee for any of you ever again.

2014-06-30T19:38:31+00:00

So basically just telling us not to use sexual strategy.

Fine. Let them. Better for me. It's not going to change a woman's natural desire to fuck high value men, but it will give me less competition as more men fall victim to a feel good story where they'll pretend not to live in the real world.

rubberbandnot · 2014-06-30T19:25:49+00:00

He doesn't seem to understand that it is Nature who pushes us to use sexual strategy, TRP didn't invent it. Being masculine, physically and psychologically, is how man is supposed to be and that is what TRP is about.

He never once makes the distinction between the nature of men and women. Instead, he keeps talking about "human beings". Human beings are like this and like that. The first premise of TRP is that men and women are different and that is why there is a specific TRP subreddit for women. He doesn't admit the difference between the two genders which is why all he has to say is that "A true awakening is realizing that the people around you are more than just faces, that they all have their own stories, their own thoughts, hopes and dreams, and that they are just as complex as you are."

No...what is truly awakening is realizing that men and women are different. Finally behaving like a man and seeing how it changes our relationship with others for the better is what's truly awakening.

TogiBear · 2014-06-30T20:01:48+00:00

What the Red Pill strategy does is flip that power dynamic on its head. When it works, now it's the man who is in power and the woman who is suffering.

My main beef with his entire argument. His premise is that women are "suffering" because their man now calls the shots.

Is it really emotional abuse when you hold all the cards? He writes, "And it's damned effective in some cases. It'll get you what you want if you do it right" but he completely ignores why it works.

Women love men, but they love stronger, independent men more. When a man swallows the Red Pill and begins re-shaping his relationship strategy, it's "my rules or the road." If she doesn't like a strong, independent man he'll simply find a woman that does. It gets him what he wants because she wants do be the one to do that. She values their relationship more than anything else and she'll do whatever she can to keep him happy.

Let's revisit the term "emotional abuse": Psychological abuse, also referred to as emotional abuse or mental abuse, is a form of abuse characterized by a person subjecting or exposing another to behavior that may result in psychological trauma, including anxiety, chronic depression, or post-traumatic stress disorder.

If you take common material from TRP's sidebar and implement it in your lifestyle, does your girl exhibit any of these symptoms?

Do any /r/RedPillWomen seek therapy because their husband or boyfriend is a red pill man?

The man gets the sex without having to commit any real effort to the relationship, aside from making sure that his SO's emotions are brutally crushed on a regular basis.

A common argument from someone that doesn't know what they're talking about. RedPill does not tell you to destroy your partner's emotions, it teaches you to become her emotional pillar. RedPill does not tell you not to commit anything to the relationship, it teaches you not to commit too much, as there will be an inbalance.

that's what the Red Pill is: cold, calculated, systematic emotional torture meant to produce a desired response.

Yeah. We teach you to torture the girls you seek an emotional connection with. It's right there on the sidebar right underneath....

Oh wait, that's right. It's not there. Shame, must have been removed. I trust your word though, because you're on the front page of reddit.

You want a healthy, stable relationship that is going to be rewarding? Here's the secret. Remember that your SO is just as complex, intelligent and vulnerable a human being as you are.

Hate to break it to ya bud, but not every woman on the fucking planet is worth investing your time in a healthy, stable relationship. The key is to find the ones that do.

However, none of your relationships will work out in a healthy manner until you realize that women are people too, not animals to be broken.

Are you a creationist or something? Humans are animals. Wake up. The universe doesn't give two shits about what you think is immoral. We care about giving men the knowledge they need to forge their own happiness.

colovick · 2014-06-30T20:43:06+00:00

Just copying my wall of text from that thread to explain my view on the issue:

No... This is a very sad misrepresentation across the board. The goal is discussing sexual strategy and everyone and everything has a sexual strategy, whether conscious, subconscious, will thought out, or poorly planned/executed. In a sense, everyone is playing a strategy game, some things work, some things don't. People find a strategy that works for them through trial and error. It's a fact.

As for the centerpiece of this thread, the concept of abusing someone by training them is patently false. In every relationship there is a leadership role and a follower role. In any and all relationships there is a give and take, trading the leadership hat in areas where one person is better suited to leading. Places like /r/theredpill gloss over this at large due to the purpose of the sub and the overall dichotomy of human masculinity which takes a lot of introspection and study within the source materials to understand, and that is something most, if not all people who are detractors of the group fail to achieve. They see material at surface level and reject it.

This, by the way, is intentional. These things were written intentionally in such a way that the surface representation is harsh, but leads to a better understanding of the concept at hand. An example of this is the statement "women do not age emotionally past 2 years old." You'll be hard pressed to find anyone who whole heartedly believes that, but the thought conveys a feeling that helps understanding concepts like amused mastery.

Back to the previous point though, the idea of TRP being about emotional abuse is far from the truth, but it's easy to make that mistake. People are happiest when constrained. When you give them a schedule, a list of expected behaviors, and consequences for acting out, people are quantifiably happier, less depressed, and more productive. This applies to the law, it applies to running a business, it applies to raising children, and it applies to relationships. A cursory trip through /r/redpillwoman will show a group of happy people who know the traditional roles that are expected of them in such a relationship and taking a support role in the family as a first mate would on a ship. There's nothing abusive about it.

The direct analogy for punishment is disciplining a child. It's not abuse to punish a child for misbehaving, it's not letting them be spoiled. Chastising an employee for not doing the assigned work isn't harassment, it's team building and keeping them to their word. Relationships are no different. If you set ground rules of no hitting and she starts slapping you in an argument, disciplining her by leaving, dumping her, or some other means is justifiable and not abusive.

Overall I believe that their method of holding prior accountable and assuming she can make her own decisions is more pro-woman than the feminist narrative of women being inferior and a victim. Just some food for thought.

As for the concept of alpha > beta, that is also patently false and misattributed. The best way to begin learning why is to look at the extreme of "pure alpha" behavior, also known as the dark triad. It's a very real psychology concept of the behaviors expressed by very high testosterone levels which are psychopathy, sociopathy, and Machiavellianism. No feelings, no remorse, and cut throat goal driven at the expense of everything else. If you reach that point, you will get laid, you will feel awesome, and you will drive away any semblance of friends or a social circle and never have a relationship last longer than a week. This is because the behaviors known under beta are caring, comforting, and providing. And these are required to hold any sort of human companionship. The opposite of having no alpha traits, means no spark in the relationship, no sexual drive or desire from your partner. So the full answer is that you need a mix of alpha and beta behaviors and traits to maintain any healthy relationship. Here's where it gets complicated though. People generalize. Women will judge you based on how you act and lump you into a desire group or a provider group, and it becomes the man's job to do enough alpha things to stay desired, but not so much as to run them off.

Where TRP takes a different path from me as a collective is this step. Because there are no repercussions for the lower earner in a marriage (the ultimate long term relationship) cheating on their spouse or being hateful and holding divorce, compounded with alimony and child support over your head, this causes marriage in its current state to be a risky investment for a male, especially one with a high income. TRP states you should never marry and be cautious who you choose to have children with (if at all). I differ in believing that marriage should still be on the table and that refusing under any circumstances may in fact drive away someone who was worth the risk. And this is where I agree with OP that blindly following a dogma without adjusting it for your life and goals is crazy. It also happens that TRP by and large is accepting of different opinions, but what I described above is what could be called the hive decision. That said, u still believe the bulk of the information there is solid and useful enough to stay there and apply it to my life and relationships. I trust myself to be rational enough to decide for myself what to take and what to toss.

TL;DR: if you need a TL;DR for this or any other information on lifestyle choices, then TRP isn't for you anyways.

pjewa · 2014-06-30T19:12:45+00:00

women are people too

Yes. They are. Which is why I don't put them on a pedestal. Which is why they aren't entitled to special treatment because they are the "gatekeepers" of sex. Which is why when they are hamstering or acting silly, I call them out on it.

I feel like the author uses "woman are people too" to advance an agenda of treating them differently. Seems a little backwards.

DrQuaid · 2014-06-30T18:49:10+00:00

I dont fucking understand.... why so much hate for the subreddit when you don't fucking BROWSE OR READ THE SUBREDDIT.

RebootedMale · 2014-06-30T19:56:55+00:00

If you think women don't use sexual strategy, you aren't just swallowing the blue pill, you are crushing it up and snorting it.

leftajar · 2014-06-30T20:07:09+00:00

His fundamental error is assuming that you can just tell a woman, "Hey sweetie, how about we don't play any games, okay? No games." And she'll agree to it, and stick to it.

As most of us here know, that doesn't work, ever.

Game-playing is hard-coded into the female brain, because it's a part of their sexual strategy. You could literally tell a girl you don't want to play games, and she'll agree to it, and mean it, and then play games anyway. Thus, the BURDEN of running the relationship falls onto us men, because only we are capable of running a relationship for mutual benefit.

TL;DR the guy has no idea what he's talking about, and lives in a la-la land where chicks will magically agree not to play games if you just ask.

MachiavellianRed · 2014-06-30T21:24:26+00:00

TRP is a case of shoot the messenger, nothing more, nothing less. We've invented nothing new here, we've just brought to the surface what 50 years of feminism and progressive propaganda has tried to suppress and condition out of the population. Holding these beliefs and espousing them in spite of progressive propaganda efforts is an affront to all the sheeple who are silly enough to believe in equality and base most of their desires and viewpoints around that fundamentally flawed and irrational assumption (that everything is nurture and we're all equal - LOL.) These people are so conditioned to believe in egalitarianism that they rationalize away any actual inequality/double standard they see and tow the "liberal" rhetoric. FYI, modern day liberalism is not about libertarianism anymore just like feminism has gone beyond civil rights, they are bastardized corrupt movements full of doublethink and doublespeak, selling the illusion we live in a utopian progressive paradise when the reality couldn't be further from the truth, humanity is unequal and hierarchical as ever and it ain't fucking changing because of the western education system.

2014-06-30T21:09:09+00:00

He does have a point, but he fails to realize some crucial points:

TRP is amoral. He says what we do is breaking women. While trp can certainly be used to do just that, it's not the whole point of it. The same way a knife can be used to make dinner or carve some beautiful shit, it can also be used to just stab somebody in the back. It's the same with trp. It's a tool, nothing less, and nothing more.
Just telling a girl "let's not play games, ok?" isn't going to fucking fix anything. Just because you talk about the biological programs we're all running and just because you realize what's happening, does not mean you'd be able to stop it. Try telling somebody who's afraid of heights "Nothing can happen dude, you have a fence right in front of you, there's no way you can fall". Is he going to lose that fear all of a sudden just because he realizes it's irrational? Fuck no!

yojymbro · 2014-06-30T19:44:53+00:00

This sub often acknowledges the way that videogames waste enormous amounts of time and leave you with nothing. Something I don't see mentioned here enough is how easy it is to waste time the same way by mindlessly browsing the internet. You're not going to be better off spending your time reading rants like this or arguing with SJWs. Nothing here relevant to your personal development. Nothing here will advance you in any way. There is nothing to be gained and too much time to be lost.

I admit I didn't read much of this post, or the thousands of repetitive comments anybody who's been here long enough has seen hundreds of time laced with SJW buzzwords, ridiculous claims, and denial, but a glance tells me that this is yet another a post of somebody saying "even if TRP is correct, you shouldn't listen because ..."-- Well, somebody like myself, and maybe yourself too, just cares what is right. Then based on what is correct and what isn't acts accordingly.

m1serablist · 2014-06-30T20:04:04+00:00

I'll see most of these fuckers after their first marriage to the girl they got by just waiting for the right one and lost by just being themselves. I'm not cynical, just look at the fucking stats.

LukeMooney · 2014-06-30T20:25:38+00:00

I fucking love the red pill. I love everything about it. Even the maniac new subscribers who don't understand it, they need to be educated is all. I love its honesty, the way it deals with reality instead of bullshit. They way it offers solutions rather than sympathy. And I love the brotherhood, reading a decent FR even if its bragging 101, I still enjoy it. Mostly, I love the guys that come here broken, sort their lives out then do a write up, I fucking love those coming of age stories.

Dicks like OP who stir shit up are pathetic losers. He started his post off ok, then just started making massive generalizations that I don't believe to be true about red pill ideology. I honestly believe if people here were advocating being mentally abusive they would be harshly criticized. The worst thing TRP encourages is plate spinning, about which no one is encouraged to lie, but to be honest if anything! The abusive domineering relationship crap OP talked about I'm yet to see, and would like sources of gtfo.

scarfox1 · 2014-07-01T02:24:25+00:00

I'm wondering what /u/Rollo-Tomassi thinks about the thread from front page against TRP

charlie_gillespie · 2014-07-01T03:59:46+00:00

But there's good news... Something else human beings are good at is changing

People never change. This guy is an idiot, lol

tigolbittiez · 2014-06-30T21:33:24+00:00

I don't get it. I don't understand the apparent Reddit-renowned hatred for TRP. This guy got gifted gold 25 times.

TWENTY-FIVE TIMES.

I've never seen that before. The amount of traffic and the amount of support a post has to get to reach that is on a scale I've not yet seen here on Reddit.

With that out of the way, I have no idea where he got the idea that we're here to emotionally abuse women and make them suffer. It's literally like everyone who criticizes TRP and says we're women-haters simply hasn't even looked at it once. Not even once. Nobody would have that reasoning if they knew what TRP was really a place for men to self-improve and become the man they want to be.

Since when is having sex with a great guy for a night, or being in a "red pill" relationship with someone who they are attracted to, who gives them space, who leads his own life, who she is attracted to, making her suffer? The fact that this post got so popular is blowing my mind. If nothing else, I can just hope that everyone who commented and is going with the hivemind is doing just that for karma.

Otherwise, if it's representative of people's opinions, then the world is a lot more blue-pill and blind to the truth than I thought. We still have our work cut out for us boys, if we're to not lose the entire world in blue obscurity. I'd have posted this as a reply to the EMSK post, but I know it'd have been blindly downvoted into oblivion. How sad...

fuckingkike · 2014-06-30T21:21:24+00:00

Any bets on whether TRP will break 60K subscribers today?

Nan_Ren · 2014-06-30T21:32:05+00:00

The comments on that are ridiculous. Women complaining about ex's whose actions did not make them Red Pill at all - it just made them dicks. It's an attempt for people to label anyone who belongs to a group who does not think like them. Guy acts like a dick? Must be Red Pill.

I view Red Pill as more of a counter strategy to the stuff that women have been doing for 50 years. 99.9% of relationships use some form of sexual strategy and power struggle. You're a sucker if you don't at least educate yourself.

nottraceable · 2014-06-30T19:41:50+00:00

The problem with this sub is that it does not tolerate any criticism, no matter how constructive. THAT is what makes it so bad.

The smallest hint of opposition gets downvoted to oblivion while accompanied with stuff like 'bluepiller' or whatever name you come up with.

2014-06-30T19:38:01+00:00

[permanently deleted]

QQ_L2P · 2014-06-30T20:32:02+00:00

It's a strange post. In one breath he's berating us while with the next he espouses our core values. Talk about being hot one second and cold the next. Just fuck and be done with it.

Axotl · 2014-06-30T19:10:04+00:00

You don't get a legion of haters and doubters for being wrong. Lots of new subscribers today.

thisbaseball17 · 2014-06-30T19:05:14+00:00

Is that why I'm subscribed to /r/everymanshouldknow? For opinionated, wordy manifestos that are supposed to change my entire perspective on love and relationships based on one person's life experience?

legauge · 2014-06-30T19:58:26+00:00

There's one thing that the guy has completely wrong, and it's the main argument in his rant, is the sexual strategy.

In short, his definition of TRP sexual strategy can be taken from his test as:

What the Red Pill strategy does is flip that power dynamic on its head. When it works, now it's the man who is in power and the woman who is suffering.

It is inherently wrong. He assumes that "power" - a wrongful usage of the word, in my opinion - in a relationship lead by a man is absolute: all or nothing.

In the following sentence, his belief of a RP relationship goes like this:

The man gets the sex without having to commit any real effort to the relationship, aside from making sure that his SO's emotions are brutally crushed on a regular basis.

I believe that a TRP relationship is one of male leadership for the benefits of both the man and the woman. The man leads and the woman willingly follows, and as a result, they are both happy.

However, the poster believes the RP man to be an emotionless beast that wants his dick sucked on whenever he wants. That a RP relationship is one of woman slavery and male indifference.

He believes leadership to be a "do as told or get out." However, that is not leadership. That's bossiness. The best way to describe the difference is with this picture.

A leader listens to those who follow him and takes their needs and/or desires into account before acting. In short, a leader works for the benefit of the group, or this case, the relationship.

A boss is the opposite. Instead of "do and be rewarded," it's "do or get punished." Personally, I don't believe someone in a relationship should be punished.

Now, I know that TRP strategy includes dread games. For any surface observers, it's a terrible thing to do. However, they don't understand that the point of the dread game. To keep the woman entertained, she needs to be reminded that nothing is set in stone. It's their own little drama show and they love it because it presents them with occasions to keep a spotlight on herself.

I'm not as experienced and knowledgeable as the more seasoned posters on TRP, but that's basically what I take from it all.

T-rexTea · 2014-06-30T21:02:19+00:00

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aphelion3342 · 2014-06-30T21:10:25+00:00

Welcome new readers! Please be sure to read the sidebar, and thanks for checking us out.

Jbonn · 2014-06-30T20:11:46+00:00

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EducatedCavemen · 2014-06-30T21:51:23+00:00

The difference between a BP and a RP is that the RP takes the world as it is and not how we wish it could be.

foodstampsforpussy · 2014-06-30T19:13:23+00:00

Who cares?? Less competition bothers me zero.

TLAdaptD · 2014-06-30T19:19:22+00:00

WELCOME to all new Subscribers.

Please, get a cup of coffee and sit down. Read, and read, and read. I say 2 hours to 3 hours.

Now how do you feel? Can you look at your life objectively? Try meditating after all that reading. How do you feel?

Now do you think you can relate? If so, welcome, and enjoy your stay.

Sturmgeist781 · 2014-06-30T19:10:55+00:00

But then it goes to way too far, linking to articles about how women shouldn't vote

Some people clearly don't understand we link satirical articles from RoK and even WE don't take said articles seriously. Jesus.

acartoontiger · 2014-06-30T19:05:13+00:00

The chain ending with the shooting reference pisses me off. No one cares what RP is actually about.

mctoasterson · 2014-07-01T14:42:02+00:00

That EMSK post assumes that both parties in a relationship are even consciously aware of (or wish to be aware of) the psychology behind their decisions. In my experience, most people (of both genders) can't be bothered to think about the reasoning behind their own decisions. After all, it's easier not to.

In both short and long term relationships it is entirely possible that one party doesn't want to get into the psychology of it. He or she may just want to act impulsively or instinctively.

So does that mean the other person should choose to do the same as a courtesy? I don't think so. Personally I would like to better understand my dynamic with other people and understand my own reasons for certain behaviors, so I can possibly choose better behaviors and increase my net happiness (and even my partner's net happiness). If both parties of a relationship aren't thinking about the subtext and mechanics of their interactions, that doesn't automatically imply "emotional abuse" by the party that is thinking about it.

People have realized benefits from increased scientific understanding of human behavior in virtually every area. But in sexual and relationship strategy, we aren't allowed to use this knowledge because it's "abusive"? My ass.

SariaLystra · 2014-07-02T08:35:49+00:00

I think how he represents TRP is fair(er). Its not that we're flipping the dynamic on its head: its just that we're treating women as human beings. In essence, that might be "emotional abuse" to normal people because normal people hold women to a different standard than men (which would be sexism). In fact, if you held a woman accountable the same way you held men accountable, you'd be labeled a misogynist. That's where he's coming from: he doesn't see his own bias.

But more to the point, he is right about true love. For us, its more about playing a power game more than anything else. We get a woman to submit to us by breaking her power and, as he points out, we probably wouldn't do that to the person we love. Yet that's just the price we pay for The Red Pill. TRP just creates a model that works for 90% of the women out there. There are those 10% that it doesn't work on and most likely, you'll find true love amongst those 10%. Whether you want to trash the model on a 10% chance is up to you.

ImFromHereDamnit · 2014-06-30T21:32:38+00:00

The amount of white knights in that thread is simply amazing.

PyrrhicIntent · 2014-06-30T19:20:55+00:00

Punch him in the face and tell him you're not playing his bullshit game.

In theory OP was right, the only way to 'win' is not play the game....

VarsitySlutTeamCpt · 2014-06-30T19:59:21+00:00

Hah that's great advertising if you ask me.

Overkillengine · 2014-06-30T20:19:41+00:00

You will be envied your successes and despised for your failures.

Typical conflation of the tools with the intent. People yet again trying to defend their Disney fantasy when you can just look at the statistics and see how well that is working out in the divorce rates.

Just because you can use the red pill poorly does not follow that you will. In fact, the best advice here is centered mainly on self improvement and using red pill strategy to avoid/defuse the rampant abuse that comes from people attempting bluepill strategy beyond all common sense.

Silwc · 2014-06-30T22:05:32+00:00

This kid is so blue pill. "There is someone out there for just about everyone." Really? It's ridiculous how often they repeat this line to themselves.

Blue pillers are like religious people. No matter how many facts you will present, they will still choose to believe in their fantasy.

2014-06-30T21:50:40+00:00

Most people love their pretty lies.

2014-07-01T02:53:57+00:00

Why argue with them.

The points they're bring across are illogical. flawed and emotionally driven.

Kind of like..... a Women?

niczar · 2014-06-30T19:52:33+00:00

They sure love sucking each other's cock.

vandaalen · 2014-06-30T19:43:26+00:00

I barely read more than the foreword. What a bunch of bullshit. The premise that anything else than having game is no sexual strategy at all is faulty from the start.

Being The Nice Guy (tm) and trying to talk your way into girl's panties by being their subordinated, obese, disgusting and neckbearded orbiter while watching her swallowing alpha guy's jizz until she is about to get a proteine-overdose is no sexual strategy?

Indeed it is one. Just a very dumb and lazy one. And the only possible "positive" outcome is that they might one day fuck these sluts every three months while paying for them and their offspring, which - if they really are lucky - is also their offspring.

Congs.

HitlersCow · 2014-06-30T21:38:53+00:00

The solution is agreeing with one another that you're not going to play the game.

Yes, the only way to win the mating game is to not play at all! How could I have been so blind?

Every many should know selfishness is a virtue. How can you help others if you can't even help yourself?

Posagi · 2014-06-30T22:36:16+00:00

He is right about one thing, accidental I persume, this sub is filled with either extreme success stories or extreme failures. To get any longlasting use out of here, you need to contrast it with your own life experience.

Phokus · 2014-06-30T22:29:10+00:00

I consider myself partially redpill as i think it speaks to a lot of truths about human/female nature, but I think the community really needs to get rid of bitter elements of the community like Roisy/Chateau Heartiste and Roosh... way too much hate and bigotry from them, they are really a poor representative of the community. I think the guy who runs the rational male is a much better representative of the community. The other thing that concerns me is advocating 'dark triad' traits. No doubt that women fall for that bullshit like moths to a flame, but society would be even worse off if men started to act like that to get laid. You can improve yourself, gain alpha traits, maintain frame in the face of female bullshit without having to be a sociopath.

Forever33 · 2014-07-01T00:08:57+00:00

Apparently giving my GF what she wants and expects out of me as a man is emotional abuse. I've tricked her into being happier than ever. Alrighty.

SgtBrutalisk · 2014-07-01T01:11:46+00:00

Because of TRP:

I understand hamsterese.
I understand how vagina tingles work.
I understand what is AFBB.

I thank TRP for "killing" me inside.

JohnGalt316 · 2014-07-01T01:30:16+00:00

"great post

when a women cheats, remember that she didn't mean to disrespect you. she was just vulnerable and was mentally abused by a RedPill Alpha. take her back with open arms and she will love you even more than before.

also, if your wife gets pregnant with another man's kid, suck it up and raise the kid as your own. the child is blameless and there is nothing manlier than raising another man's kid.

also, don't get in the way of your wife's needs. most of the time she needs your love, support, and income. however, there are times when she needs hot sex from a stronger man. you are unable to give her that. don't hold her back because you are incapable. instead let her fulfill that need. what matters is that at the end of the day she comes back to you. she will be happier and everyone knows "happy wife; happy life""

my thoughts on the post

2014-06-30T19:05:56+00:00

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subcover · 2014-06-30T21:44:51+00:00

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NSA_Overseer_num247 · 2014-06-30T22:50:03+00:00

You know, I always laugh at posts like these. I scan through them and everyone has their beliefs and opinions but the one thing that really sticks out is that they will try to demonize TRP in any way they can, but you never see them make claims that it flat out doesn't work.

Ya ya ya, those Red Pillers are sycophants and psychopaths and they want to torture their wives and all women and blah blah blah, but... the argument isn't ever that TRP is bogus nonsense, it's that it's "evil" in some way. You know why? Because it fucking works.

codeverity · 2014-06-30T19:49:48+00:00

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le_king_falcon · 2014-07-01T13:34:44+00:00

Essentially that quote in the title boils down to: "A healthy human doesn't try to better their own situation."

Its such a blatant fallacy. How can someone be so deluded?

ImFromHereDamnit · 2014-06-30T21:40:06+00:00

Oh goodie! How many new subscribers will they bring us this time. :)

subcover · 2014-07-01T02:49:21+00:00

"And as long as you keep that power dynamic active, you will never know what love is. Because love means that you feel what your lover feels."

Bullshit. I know what love is. I had it for the first five years of my marriage. This experience is extremely common and discussed here. And therefore, I know what love isn't. When love isn't there, yes it's down to brass tacks and what works. Because I am capable of greater power and am worthy of it. Because I am less likely to frivorce her. And so on.

genericusername80 · 2014-06-30T19:52:11+00:00

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