The whole “Women reward bad guys with sex” complaint isnt just misogynistic. It’s misandranistic too.

jellybeanzandtings · 2022-12-29T17:15:46+00:00

Post changes to CMV for making affirmative claim.

The_Legatus · 2022-12-29T17:40:11+00:00

So…I think the whole “women reward bad guys” thing isn’t about women making any active decision to “reward” anything. Its more of a linguistic tool to describe what seems to happen in dating. Lots of young women seem to like the “bad boy” trope. Female attention is how men learn to feel attractive. While men derive our self-worth from numerous sources, a large one is how attractive we are to women. Because of that, the idea is that men see other men who treat women poorly or are losers in general, but receive a positive reaction from those same women or others. Hip-hop culture is a great example of this without going into too many specifics.

Now, nobody is “entitled” to sex, but people are entitled to the pursuit of it if it makes them feel happy and valued. As such, many men embody what they believe will get them more of it. This can be heavily influenced by environment and upbringing as well, which is another reason its important for men to respect the mothers of their children and women to respect their children’s fathers. Its also why its important for a child’s home not to be a revolving door for their parents’ multiple (sometimes abusive) sexual partners…but that goes down a whole other rabbit hole.

Either way, people are often going to do what they believe will yield a desirable response from society. If they feel like being a “bad guy” will get them the desirable result, then that’s what they’ll do. If that’s confirmed by them actually getting the response they wanted, then they’ll continue to do it and encourage others to as well because it works.

Mr_Makak · 2022-12-29T17:48:45+00:00

Are you arguing it's "misandrist/toxic" or are you arguing it's incorrect?

rippurplepill · 2022-12-29T17:20:45+00:00

It’s not untrue that we are hardwired for excitement, drama, thrills, even violence etc. and thus both genders are drawn to people who exhibit those traits like dominance and risk taking that meant a higher likelihood of surviving the dangers of our early existence. Meaning that on a primal level women do find bad boys thrilling and men do admire and elevate the bad boys among them.

My issue is with the idea that we can’t and don’t overcome those instincts using our rational brains.

Women already know that bad boys make terrible partners in modern society. Some women will lie to themselves that they can reform a bad boy. Some women will give in and indulge being with bad boys and just take the consequences. Other women will prefer to be with gentlemen, appreciate the benefits of that, and do their best to override their primal instincts.

This is why those in a manopshere who know what they’re talking about say that the ideal for a man in a LTR is to exhibit a mix of alpha and beta traits.

Being a responsible husband and father doesn’t mean you have to be boring. Being reliable doesn’t mean you can’t inject some spontaneity into your marriage. Being an upstanding guy doesn’t mean you have to be a doormat.

And it works for women too. Men don’t want a woman who’s boring and docile all the time. They want a lady in the streets and a freak between the sheets (discounting those who suffer from virgin whore complex or religious indoctrination). They want a woman who surprises them sometimes.

So basically people who say womne aren’t attracted to bad boys on some fundamental level are being disingenuous.

People who say we can’t override our biology are also being disingenuous.

And people who say you can’t be a good boy/girl and a bad boy/girl all rolled into one just aren’t capable of attracting such a prize. 💥

SecretAccount111191 · 2022-12-29T16:55:50+00:00

But you didn't debunk the claims

webernicke · 2022-12-29T17:13:27+00:00

I don't understand what's so offensive about the idea that people tend to respond to incentives.

Dylan10126 · 2022-12-29T17:12:31+00:00

Hate to break it to you, but humans are nothing special, and we quite literally are just "hormones and boners".

Obviously we have reached a point in our society where people should have self control, but I refuse to believe that OP is some saint that has never ignored obvious red flags for the sake of satisfying urges. We all do it, it is human nature.

tired_hillbilly · 2022-12-29T17:18:17+00:00

Also this really debunks the whole “men are logical” myth by claiming that they are controlled by feelings of horniness, and they cannot control if it dictates their actions.

On the contrary, molding ones personality to achieve their goals seems wholly logical.

Meihuajiancai · 2022-12-29T17:24:52+00:00

Young men want sex. They look around and see very clearly who gets attention from women. You can scream into the void all day long 'not all women' but you might as well bash your head against a brick wall.

If I said Americans like to eat hamburgers, does it matter if you're a vegetarian and don't eat meat? No, it doesn't matter at all. One person's preferences or behavior is irrelevant when looking at an entire population set.

So, you may not like the terminology, but sleeping with someone is a 'reward'. If women collectively sleep with certain men more than others, other men are going to try and model themselves after those men. They'll probably fail, but that's not the point.

Women can fuck who they want to. I don't think worrying about fairness and justice in sex and relationships is an attainable goal and therefore I don't worry about it. I just try to be the best me I can be and to be aware of my surroundings and what works with women. Living my life based on remote possibilities is foolish.

It's no different at all for women either. Women look around and clearly see which women get attention from men. The only difference is that if a woman tries to make herself more attractive to men, nobody bats an eye. It's only when men point out what can be done to increase their attractiveness to women that heads explode.

Finally, to your title, whether it's misogynistic or not is irrelevant. The question is whether it's accurate or not.

-angels-fan- · 2022-12-29T17:08:39+00:00

The claim is that women are driving men's behaviors.

If women were fucking shy, kind men en masse, you'd better fucking believe we'd see a bunch of shy, kind men.

Most men HATE the kind of man women are attracted to, and actually refuse to become this kind of man, which is part of the reason why we have 35%+ sexless men and growing. Most red pill men despise that red pill works and wish that women would just like nice guys (not Nice Guys).

pityforthemajority · 2022-12-29T17:10:12+00:00

I’ve never really considered myself RP, but I think it’s interesting how the arguments from the BP side if anything convince me that RP is onto something. Nowhere does the post claim that BP men will get sex, just that they ought to be content without it. After all, wanting to have sex is apparently the epitome of “toxic masculinity”.

SmarmyPapsmears · 2022-12-29T16:57:25+00:00

Furthermore, why would a woman want a man who can’t think for himself and whose only motivation in life is getting his dick wet?

Because women love fuckboys. They just wish they could constrain them into marriage.

They want everything else that allows those men to be fuckboys, in some magical unicorn man who doesn't fuck around.

jayval90 · 2022-12-29T17:44:20+00:00

Also this really debunks the whole “men are logical” myth by claiming that they are controlled by feelings of horniness, and they cannot control if it dictates their actions.

I'm not sure you understand what "logical" means. "Logical" doesn't define wants one way or another, just the means for getting to those ends. I think you seem to have associated "logical" to mean "better" or some such thing, which is untrue. Logic doesn't have an inherent morality.

mugdul · 2022-12-29T17:56:04+00:00

Oh wow, I'm sure all men are just thrilled to be reduced to mindless mutts who are driven solely by their hormones and boners. I mean, it's not like we have any values, beliefs, or thoughts of our own. No, we're just completely controlled by our primal urges and can't think for ourselves at all. How fortunate we are to be seen as nothing more than sexual objects to be collected and trained by women. And of course, it's not like any men out there might actually value and respect women as human beings. No, we're all just shallow, hedonistic creatures who can't control our actions. I'm sure all men are just thrilled to be portrayed in such a flattering light. Thank you for your insights.

stats135 · 2022-12-29T17:09:25+00:00

You say their views are misogynistic. You say their views are misandristic. But you never say their views are wrong.

Capeninja · 2022-12-29T23:06:07+00:00

The point isn't that women control men's actions. As we can plainly see many men still don't behave in line with the red pill, even if they know about it. A man makes choices based on his own cost-benefit analysis.

The point is that women shouldn't complain about behavior that they don't socially penalize themselves. If people can get away with XYZ, many will; it's on you as an individual not to willingly associate with those people.

It's like the nice guy complaining about everyone taking advantage of him. He could just stop being so subservient, and that wouldn't happen anymore. He's choosing to make himself vulnerable.

Most_Anything_173 · 2022-12-30T00:47:32+00:00

"Not only are these examples of toxic masculinity (such as enforcing the toxic belief that a man’s value stems from how much sex he’s getting) and sexual objectification of women (that women are not even people, but sex trophies for men to collect), this also explains that men have no values, belief, nor thoughts of their own".

"Also this really debunks the whole “men are logical” myth by claiming that they are controlled by feelings of horniness, and they cannot control if it dictates their actions".

No, it doesn't, WTF are you on about? Do you just write random non sequiturs and call it an argument? Why is it so difficult for you to understand incentive and disincentive structures?

Our very system of government is structured to get more of the behavior we want and less of the behavior we don't want. Our goddamn tax code is trying to alter human behavior with tax incentives. Why is this hard for you to understand. This is like the 20th time you made this argument. At least put some effort into your poorly thought-out opinions instead of regurgitating the same thing over and over.

CompleteRetard69 · 2022-12-29T18:24:21+00:00

At no point do any of the sentences listed at the top “enforce the belief that a man’s value stems from how much sex he’s getting”. Not one sentence says that men who get sex more are more valuable, or that it objectifies women.

Also the “feeling of horniness” is t an emotion. It’s a physical feeling.

Silver_Switch_3109 · 2022-12-29T20:28:28+00:00

A woman would want a man who’s only motivation is sex because he is easy to control. She can make demands and he will do them with the reward of sex.

ZealousidealAd7191 · 2022-12-29T21:51:36+00:00

No one on here claims a 20 year old kid filled with testosterone is a bastion of logic and critical thinking, and none of the comments you cited are making any claims about value, they’re strictly talking about mens desire for sex.

This post is largely full of straw-man arguments. And i especially enjoy how you took an RP example of bad debate behavior and grabbed it as “toxic masculinity.” Choosing bad men is NOT toxic masculinity. It is the propagation of toxic masculine traits through toxic femininity

melody_of_ · 2022-12-29T23:29:20+00:00

Not only are these examples of toxic masculinity (such as enforcing the toxic belief that a man’s value stems from how much sex he’s getting)hese statements dont reinforce that belief.

if the feedback is sex, and the action is be a "bad guy", the woman positively reinforced being a bad guy.”

“Men want sex badly enough that their personalities and desires will be molded around whatever gets them more of it.”

“One of the reasons the red pill is so popular is because men don't virtue signal or pretend we're better than our instincts,”

Not only are these examples of toxic masculinity (such as enforcing the toxic belief that a man’s value stems from how much sex he’s getting)

Can youn explain how these beliefs reinforce the the beliefe that a mans value stems from how much sex he's getting?

this also explains that men have no values, belief, nor thoughts of their own. They are only driven by their hormones and boners.

No it doesn't it iust posits that within the current sexual marketplace the pressures to modify behavior are extreme enough to place men in a position where they can either emulate certain traits or be relegated to sexual/romantic irrelevance until they are eventually settled for. Modifying ones personality at that point isn't a failing of the man its just practicality.

Also this really debunks the whole “men are logical” myth by claiming that they are controlled by feelings of horniness, and they cannot control if it dictates their actions.

I think we migjt be thinking of two diffrent things But why would they chose to stand on a principle that goes against their lived experiences "I'm only going to be with someone who likes me for who i am /not change" is an easy position to hold when your a woman because their will always be men that will like you for who you are (barring extreme edge cases).

Men like all humans respond to incentives. And have no incentive to incentive to adopt practices that leave them alone unloved and unsatisfied with their love/sex life. But I agree with you it does show men will eshew culturally enforced norms if their situation is bad enough.

Furthermore, why would a woman want a man who can’t think for himself and whose only motivation in life is getting his dick wet? What’s the appeal having such a hedonistic shallow person in your life?

They can think for themsleves and they chose to do whats best for themselves. Changing in a way thats gives them increased agency in the world love and sex.

suj1290 · 2022-12-30T00:14:48+00:00

Men also have physical desires.Women here keep shouting on top of their lungs that they find casual sex bad but also have very High n count which implies they have lots of casual sex .And yes Bad boys get laid far more than other boys .Some men won't care about it.Some will change themselves to get laid .Most guys don't change themselves only a few actually do and Also women also value men only by the amount of sex a man is getting.Thats why their fav insult is always virgin or incel bcz deep down they beleive who aren't getting sex are unattractive and losers

UnjustlyBannedTime11 · 2022-12-29T17:57:15+00:00

Men are simply resentful of the fact that they have been told their entire lives that being a whiteknighting simp is a sure way to get a soulmate, but see that in reality, it is the domineering and extroverted men who attract a large amount of women, not shy, introverted, nerdy "nice guys". Pouring that resentment into an ideology is how you get the Red Pill.

Not only are these examples of toxic masculinity (such as enforcing the toxic belief that a man’s value stems from how much sex he’s getting)

But it does to a certain extent, Patriarchy or not. Since women are the selectors and men pursuers in human sociosexuality, a man copulating with lots of different women is (at least a shallow) sign that he somehow passes the standard for sexual intercourse and is somehow an attractive lay. That is the whole concept of the preselection. Toxic masculinity does take it to the harmful extreme, but in moderate amounts and in typical circumstances, a man's value does increase from the amount of sexual intercourse he has.

and sexual objectification of women (that women are not even people, but sex trophies for men to collect)

Agreed that this is a harmful conception that should be done away with.

this also explains that men have no values, belief, nor thoughts of their own. They are only driven by their hormones and boners.

The second sentence is true, in a certain way. Men are driven to seek out sexual intercourse far more that women due to the sociosexual value it brings, i.e. it feels good, increases your social status and is a source of the greatest intimacy a man can experience. Sexual motivation is far stronger in men than women, to the point quotes like "Don't put your dick in crazy" and "My dick led me to the places I wouldn't visit with my gun" are both warnings and sadly relatable to most men.

Hence, women must be responsible in training men as if they are mindless mutts, needing pussy waved in their faces to be domesticated.

It is a simple fact that women's sexual standards are the main vehicle of evolution. The reason we are as we are is because women choose to copulate with such men, who then passed on their genes into the next generation and so on. If women chose not to copulate with men who didn't have blue eyes (for example), most men would have blue eyes. Similarly, if women chose not to copulate with men who are abusive, sexually-displeasing and deadbeat dads jerks, there'd be a lot less such jerks around.

Also this really debunks the whole “men are logical” myth by claiming that they are controlled by feelings of horniness, and they cannot control if it dictates their actions.

I agree. The whole "men are logical, women are emotional" is a sham. Both are emotional, men are just a bit more individualistic than women.

Furthermore, why would a woman want a man who can’t think for himself and whose only motivation in life is getting his dick wet?

"Bad boys" are higher in Dark Triad, but that doesn't mean they are coomer deadbeats. Where did you get that from? In fact, they tend to be ruthlessly successful and dominant in their chosen field as a consequence of the Dark Triad.

modidlee · 2022-12-29T18:05:53+00:00

Silly. Would you say because career women also take time and spend money on grooming, make-up, sexy clothing, enhancements, learning how to twerk, etc that they know men like then that means their whole existence is based on getting men and they don't have their own beliefs? No you wouldn't. Yes men do and say things with the purpose of "getting women." But "getting women" is just one interest that a man may have.

epicgamer1986 · 2022-12-29T17:00:47+00:00

There can be bad or good guys that are sexually rewarded. What matters is that they are a physically *attractive* bad or good guy. That is what makes the most sense.

Barely-moral · 2022-12-29T17:45:44+00:00

It is not misogynistic because it doesn't hate women and it is not misandrist because it doesn't hate men.

“if the feedback is sex, and the action is be a "bad guy", the woman positively reinforced being a bad guy.”

Correct. Basic incentive structure.

“Men want sex badly enough that their personalities and desires will be molded around whatever gets them more of it.”

Men as a general population. Yes. Individual men can do otherwise. Humans respond to incentive structures. You can't deny that. Nothing misogynistic of misandrist about it.

“One of the reasons the red pill is so popular is because men don't virtue signal or pretend we're better than our instincts,”

Basically. Nothing misogynistic of misandrist about it.

Not only are these examples of toxic masculinity

Define the way you use the term first.

(such as enforcing the toxic belief that a man’s value stems from how much sex he’s getting)

There is no other value than the value others see in you.

and sexual objectification of women (that women are not even people, but sex trophies for men to collect)

It is worse than that. Women are not objects to collect. They are humans with functional brains and sense of morality.

That means that when they reward other traits over morality with sex (and they are smart enough to know that they are creating an incentive structure when they have sex) they are doing so willingly and knowingly.

this also explains that men have no values, belief, nor thoughts of their own. They are only driven by their hormones and boners.

They react to the incentive structure they find themselves in.

Hence, women must be responsible in training men as if they are mindless mutts, needing pussy waved in their faces to be domesticated.

Men as a population will do what the incentive structure they find themselves in rewards. Correct.

Also this really debunks the whole “men are logical” myth by claiming that they are controlled by feelings of horniness, and they cannot control if it dictates their actions.

They are logical. Acting in a way that rewards your efforts is logical.

Furthermore, why would a woman want a man who can’t think for himself and whose only motivation in life is getting his dick wet?

Those two are not mutually exclusive. And the reason why is because she benefits in some way from him.

What’s the appeal having such a hedonistic shallow person in your life?

The benefits.

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BecretAlbatross · 2022-12-29T19:07:30+00:00

yes but that doesnt mean it isnt mostly accurate.

John_Oakman · 2022-12-29T19:08:39+00:00

It's a couple of semi separate issues in parallel.

Yes the [relevant] men do think mostly with their dicks, and being [based and redpilled] net them the results they want. The issue is that there's no [meaningful] mechanisms (social or otherwise) to deter then from such unacceptable behaviors. They're not gonna listen to the shaming of LVMs and women (who they dont respect in the first place).

The other issue is the de-legitimization of most other sources of motivations (often done in the name of getting back at mainstream establishment), which drastically reduce the power of society and communities to peer pressure against unacceptable behaviors and promote acceptable ones.

4_gwai_lo · 2022-12-29T20:12:38+00:00

The motivation for getting my dick wet has gotten me a successful business and marriage. Works for me.

RahLyt · 2022-12-29T20:26:56+00:00

Post makes no sense? So men are misandrist because we are human?

despisedlove2 · 2022-12-29T20:47:44+00:00

Doesn't reality matter more than any labels?

Angrbaddie · 2022-12-29T21:15:57+00:00

Which of these notions are you objecting to: "Men's behavior is affected by the sexual choices of women" or "Women should change their behavior to incentivize good behavior in men"?

If it's the latter I agree, it's not a woman's job to police men and teach them how to behave.

However I feel like the former is pretty obvious, if men want sex and certain behaviors get them sex, they're going to engage in more of those behaviors.

I don't see how this is illogical it makes perfect sense to me. If I want a certain type of job and I observe that certain behaviors get others that job, then it's in my best interest to also adopt those behaviors, either that or give up on that kind of job.

If I want a certain type of woman then, I either do what I need to do to get that type of woman or I give up on that type of woman.

SoldierExcelsior · 2022-12-29T21:42:47+00:00

I won't disagree justvabout everything men do is to get laid and not starve...

If you tell a man he will never get sex again aslong as he lives no matter what he dies his productivity will sharply decline if he doesn't delete himself he will probably just live the most basic life become a hermit in the woods...Maybe if he will starts some spiritual journey and acend.

Men are driven by hormones and the desire for sex and that causes them not to think logically at times...Sex is the the main reason for most men's Downfall Bill Cosby Rkelly Bill Clinton, Weinstein, Epstein, king Solomon Jared the Subway guy...

Honestly if there was a pill to completely eliminate sex drive I think most men would be better off taking it...Sex is basically a drug and mennarecadfucted suffered withdraws and do the most ridiculous things to get it...

I wish I could get back all the time and money I've wasted getting pursuing sex..it's no different in my opinion than doing a line of coke and in my opinion deadlier

We talk about gun death,suicide deaths,motor vehicle deaths I think death over sex is the highest on the list.

Nature has cursed men with the desire for sex andI think it's a curse.I spent some time meditating 🧘‍♂️ and was able to get rid of my desire for a long time a good two years then I met a women that brought it back unfortunately...

Then I was going to start meditating again but I found out lack of sex can lead to prostate cancer ...So now I use sex purely for health benefits and have it atleast twice a week but I don't do anything crazy to get it.

sparklyyblueberryy · 2022-12-29T21:48:52+00:00

Indeed. It also shows no respect to individuality between different men and different women.

CaptainObvious4000 · 2022-12-30T01:08:10+00:00

Men are driven to have sex.

Women reward the men they’re attracted to with sex.

Assholes get way more sex with better looking women than nice guys.

Women prefer assholes over nice guys.

Part of your value as a man, whether you agree with it or not, is tied to how many women would have NSA sex with you.

For most men it’s low-zero because they have low-zero power.

FlyV89 · 2022-12-30T01:45:13+00:00

Not a terper actually, but I understand some of the logic behind it.

I mean I do "mold" some behavioural paterns around women, I'm less easy going, chill and relaxed around women I'm intrested in, basically because I've learned that that's what "gets them".

Yes, I'm kinda a jerk when it comes to women.

The rest of the time, I'm just me, unless the situation requires me to go back to jerk mode and push people away or behave in a rude manner.

As a whole, there are lots of situations in the daily life where you can't just "be yourself", you have to put your foot down and demand respect, you have to speak up no matter what, you NEED to do what's needs to be done.

For example, we are only two weeks away from the biggest, most popular, worldwide known sports event, the FIFA World Cup.

Go over the internet and take a look at the finals between France and Argentina.

This it's funny, because days before the match french players (last champions) were giving bullshit to argentinian players saying Messi (argentinian Captain and current GOAT of football) was lame, that he was not a liability but a weakness to argentinian squad because he was too old, that Argentina had lots of inexperienced players who were just young and afraid, that France would come on top easily because they are European and argentinian are South American, and South America is underdeveloped...

They were being plain rude and DISRESPECTFUL to argentinian players and Latin America as a whole.

Argentinian players?

They were just silent.

When the day came, the cards turned.

In the field, argentinian players went on BEAST mode on french players. They said bullshit to their face, they bullied the french, they gave them mad looks, they protested every referee decision, they played fair but on a really energic and even "violent" way, argentinian defenders would taunt french forwards directly, the argentinian goalkeeper danced and laughed at the french during the penalties and throwed the ball away instead of giving it to his rivals, other players would try to scare Mbappé (french captain) acting like crazy or pass in front of the french bench and mock the players who were about to enter the pitch... French were astonished.

They were never disrespectful thou, they never said racist or mean stuff against France or European people...

But in the pitch they behaved like absolute BRATS. And you can clearly see argentinian players actions took a tool on french team. They weren't focused, they weren't confourtable on the field, and and the end they got dominated and couldn't perform as they were expecting.

Argentina's team was stronger not only from the playing style, but in mind too. It's like they were going to war or something. Pure, ol' mindfuckery.

After the match, when argentinian won, they hug french players and had some gestures of kindness with them and even talked really high of the french team to cameras. People was like "what's going on here? Aren't these dudes the bad guys?", yeah, like, no?

These dudes are just normal men, and some of them are the most chill and kind guys you can see all around. Lionel Messi, despite being the greatest athlete that has walked the Earth and also filthy rich as fuck, is also well known for being humble and kind.

Then why was he acting like a madman in the pitch?

Simple. Competition.

This is the clearest definition of competitiveness.

It's the same when boxers before a fight badmouth each other and throw insults and brag about their skills. It's about taking a tool on your rival.

Sometimes in life you have to go hard on others to get results. You have to push boundaries, you have to test others.

You also compete in your daily life at work for example, or in your friends group, or in the streets when strangers try to mess around with you.

Sometimes you have to "perform", to put on a fakade, and that's fine actually.

And I've learned when it comes to women, if you want to be succesful, if you want to best other men, if you want women to consider you their best option, you have to fake a little.

You don't want to behave like a dick to others right? But you don't want girls to take you for granted. You don't want other guys to join in between you and your "crush" or whatever while you are chatting and start cockblocking you or taking her away in front of you. You don't want women to think you're a spineless limp.

So you put on your best face, stand stright and if something gets out of control you act on it. Fast, hard and right to the point.

And if that means being a jerk to this girl or that guy in order to get what you want, be it a rise, respect, a better position in life, a trophy or sex, then so be it.

Sex isn't something that "just happens" to men, and countless men over the internet can proof this.

As a man, in fact, you have to fight for what you want during your whole life, get your shit in order and go for what you want. We are not women. We are not handle stuff for free.

Drinks and free meals? You have to pay for it.

Travels and fashion clothes? Bust your ass. We are not given free rides to anywhere.

Respect? Earn it, be it through love or fear, nobody is going to respecto you "just because" when you're a man.

And hey, don't let me start with freedom and civil rights...

Women were just given those because... Who knows.

Men had to fought and die for them during 5000 years.

So when a guy comes to me and says "hey bro, women are just too much work, it's a Game where odds are stacked against good dudes" I just say... And what's the news?

And this comes from a guy who ACTUALLY doesn't enjoy competing for women's attention mind you...

But if you're just this chill, relaxed, easy going and fun guy who just minds his bussines and wants to be on good terms with anybody...

Yeah, you're going to die sexless.

Also, a free piece of advice:

Remember to back up your words and thoughts with ACTUAL ACTIONS.

You don't want to go the route of french.

If you want that trophy, do what argentinian dudes did, and fight for it with teeth and nails. Be on Beast Mode.

James_Cruse · 2022-12-30T02:08:39+00:00

Men see women responding (not necessarily rewarding) “bad boys” and assume that women must have a dark biological nature, based on this desire/response.

Women’s desire is alot more simple than that - women desire men who are leaders of other men.

One of the main qualities of a Leader is that he doesn’t Follow others - which is really the definition of a bad boy - not following anyone else and acting on his own desires. So they’de technically leaders due to the qualities they display.

Bad boys are generally unpredictable and do things they want to do without caring about the wider consequences. This is not only technically strong leadership but also exciting to women.

The actions of a “bad boy”may be destructive sometimes, but they are by default strong leadership actions and reflect an internal freedom (risk taking) that women are attracted to.

Many other women prefer men that are leaders in a positive way (leaders of their friends, their community, a team etc.) who help the community or lead through positive actions. But most women don’t have those men as options because those men are so few and generally unattaintable to all but the most attractive women.

Additionally, those positive male leaders are generally people who also act on their own desires mostly, but not always like the bad boy. They are considerate of people they’re leading which restrains alot of actions of a positive leader.

Unlike the “bad boy” that isn’t considerate of others because he doesn’t lead anyone, only himself (selfishly).

Positive leaders have an internal ordered calmness, in my opinion, whereas a “bad boy” has more of an internal freedom that he acts on.

Positive leaders have alot of strength but certainly aren’t as emotionally exciting as “bad boys”.

Men should aim for being a Positive Leader but without the destructive elements of the bad boy - so the middle path.

hari_hbp · 2022-12-30T02:53:17+00:00

I think some guys just see what women like, mold themselves around it and are sometimes confused about those choices.

Loki, the guy who invaded earth, is considered far more attractive than captain America who is always trying to save earth.

Daemon Targaryen, the guy who killed his first wife, groomed his niece and has angry outbursts, is considered more attractive than Jon Snow, who was broken when his first lover died due to his allegiance and always beloved in doing what's right.

When some guys see this, they assume "bad guys" (invaders and wife-killers) are attractive where as in actuality, it's their overall mannerisms that make them attractive inspite of being bad people.

pending_ending · 2022-12-30T04:03:26+00:00

okie. and calling grass green is colorist. what does it change?

LillthOfBabylon · 2022-12-29T17:15:07+00:00

[permanently deleted]

bluestjuice · 2022-12-29T17:18:11+00:00

The ‘sex as reward’ model is broken because it supposed women make the decision to have sex without their own biases and priorities.

At best you can say sex rewards someone for finding or putting someone else in a frame of mind to want to have sex with them. But it doesn’t reward any behavior or characteristic directly.

AutomaticMeaning3844 · 2022-12-29T19:50:54+00:00

It'll stop being true when women and society stop insulting and talking down on men for not being able to get sex. It's a reward because women and society see not being able to get sex as a man as lower status.

KirthWGersen · 2022-12-29T17:05:33+00:00

"Why would a woman want a man who can’t think for himself and whose only motivation in life is getting his dick wet? What’s the appeal having such a hedonistic shallow person in your life?"

To have great sex whenever it is convenient to her, obviously.

HazyMemory7 · 2022-12-29T16:55:01+00:00

[permanently deleted]

BitsAndBobs304 · 2022-12-29T17:52:40+00:00

The entire society and world economy and civilizations revolve around men trying to do anything to get sex, love, affection, family.

zerofeetpersecond · 2022-12-29T18:52:42+00:00

There are millions of male virgins and dead beat dads, let that sink in.

KamuiObito · 2022-12-29T19:06:04+00:00

I don’t gaf it’s true y’all are equally ignorant as I am misogynistic..it’s a2wY street ..stop rewarding bad ppl and more ppl will try to be good ppl it’s simple childrens teachings..we teach kids how to work by waking them up early ..have them doing school work..literally probing them for adult life …but mfs can’t pick a guy who isn’t a pos..it just say y’all lack that skill entirely cuz y’all are ones rewarding mfs

localmicrodosechamp · 2022-12-29T19:18:49+00:00

these men think they discovered machiavellianism.

2022-12-29T18:34:59+00:00

Some genders can’t be accurately described without being misogynistic.

PatrickAizen · 2022-12-29T17:32:52+00:00

Toxic Masculinity doesn't Exist and as they say "he who lacks Sex will value it"

Otjeho · 2022-12-29T17:04:57+00:00

The thing with “bad boys” is that they often are light years ahead in terms of being socially gifted. And “good guys” usually have other negative traits like being creepy, strange or overprotective

Safinated · 2022-12-29T18:39:11+00:00

Men don’t believe this, otherwise the jails would be full and the rest of the world a war zone

its just a deflective, self pitying whine. Unfortunately, some women are dumb and take them seriously

TheRedPillRipper · 2022-12-29T21:07:33+00:00

They are only driven by their hormones and boners. Hence, women must be responsible in training men

First hormones aren’t the only driver for men, but they are significant. From puberty, without guidance, discipline, and appropriate avenues of direction, testosterone can drive a lot of poor decisions.

It’s misandristic

The ‘bad boy’ is attractive, because of perception. That they’re ‘beyond’ the rules. The truth however, is they’re simply willing to risk more. So when ‘Average Adam’ compares his own risk tolerance, even reasonable, he falls short. Which is hard to accept. Far easier, to blame women’s choices.

It’s not misogynistic, nor misandristic, to observe that a high risk tolerance in men, is attractive. It’s fairly reasonable. The issue arises when men blame those men, and the women that choose to sleep with them. As opposed to utilising that observation, to better themselves.

Godspeed and good luck!

LillthOfBabylon · 2022-12-29T17:11:25+00:00

this also explains that men have no values, belief, nor thoughts of their own. They are only driven by their hormones and boners.

As much as I hate to say it as I myself am a man with complete control on my sexual urges, yes most of the men in today's generation are crippled to the point that they can't survive without sex. This point is butt obvious when I've literally read some comments on reddit saying "sex is a need like air and water".

Well I love to have some spicy debates on reddit but seems like I have to agree with this one.

briiiana1122 · 2022-12-29T17:39:01+00:00

It does seem that any man who talked about “getting” or “being rewarded with” sex fits the negative descriptions here though. Those particular men fit this description in that they don’t see or value relationships outside getting their dick wet and so that’s how they operate within their lives. It’s just not all men by any stretch. Not even close. Unfortunately they speak loudly and claim to speak for more men than they represent so the ones not like that get painted with the same brush.

WildCardSolly4 · 2022-12-29T18:57:58+00:00

I have to applaud Lilith of Babylon Bc she gets you boys riled up. (Prob Bc you don’t get laid idk)… as a more nuanced guy I’ve have a couple run ins with her. We’ve had compromises , disagreements everything in between. But she is good at getting the struggle boys riled up.

2022-12-29T19:39:49+00:00

Women aren't trying to reward bad guy, it's just that they don't care so long as he's hot.

Furthermore, why would a woman want a man who can’t think for himself and whose only motivation in life is getting his dick wet?

No man's motivation is only sex, but most men also want sex. Why would you want to be in a monogamous relationship with someone who wasn't into sex? Going after what you want is the opposite of not thinking for yourself.

What’s the appeal having such a hedonistic shallow person in your life?

They want to have sex with you, and you want to have sex with them. It's just that simple.

Title	The whole “Women reward bad guys with sex” complaint isnt just misogynistic. It’s misandranistic too.
Author	LillthOfBabylon
Upvotes	29
Comments	368
Date	December 29, 2022 4:49 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/zy9yj7/the_whole_women_reward_bad_guys_with_sex/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/the-whole-women-reward-bad-guys-with-sex-complaint.1145337 https://theredarchive.com/post/1145337

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