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[–]EulenWatcher 98 points99 points100 points 3 years ago (23 children) | Copy Link
As far as I know freezing is the best before one’s 30. Freezing at late 30s is kind of late already.
[–]slashd 36 points37 points38 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
And nobody is going to freeze it before their 30s because 'there is still plenty of time'
[–]pearllovespink 16 points17 points18 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Some women have health issues and have frozen eggs before 30. But that’s definitely a rare case.
[–]THHBHStT 14 points15 points16 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
It’s also mad expensive.
A down payment on a house to freeze your eggs isn’t feasible or high priority for most people
[–]funnystorPills are for addicts 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
It's not expensive to the women in high cost of living areas who care this much about their careers.
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Eggs after 30s start going bad increasing the chance of autism and other defects.
[–]LCOSPARELT1Purple Pill Man 29 points30 points31 points 3 years ago* (6 children) | Copy Link
I do think medical experts need to be more honest with women about egg freezing and fertility in general. I’d be willing to bet not one doctor gave this woman an honest assessment of her chances for success. We need to be honest with women and tell them that having biological children after 35 is difficult and will most likely be expensive. Instead, we have given them messages like the one expressed by the women in this post. That having children at 40 is going to be a breeze. It just isn’t true.
[–]pirotecnico_zacarias 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link
Not only during pregnancy.I was born when my mom was 37 and I was her first child. I kinda feel that she wasnt so healthier and motivated like younger mothers because of her age.
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Medical experts are getting money by getting women to freeze their eggs.
If they got money by being honest they'd tell women to have kids young.
[–]funnystorPills are for addicts 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
they'd tell women to have kids young.
"That's sexist!"
[–]FizzleMateriel 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
That having children at 40 is going to be a breeze. It just isn’t true.
Hugh Jackman and his wife adopted after his wife mis-carried multiple times. She’s 12 years older than him and he was obviously fertile and rich. If they couldn’t do it there’s no reason to believe an average 45-year-old woman will be able to successfully carry a pregnancy to term.
[–]LCOSPARELT1Purple Pill Man 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I think a woman starting a family at 45 is almost impossible. I think it’s even difficult at 35. Not impossible, but difficult. Many women 35 and older often struggle with infertility and require medical treatment to conceive.
Media and culture highlights the women 35 and older that can conceive naturally as the norm. But is really is 50/50 at that age and the odds get worse every year. By 42-43, the odds of natural conception without fertility drugs or in vitro are really stacked against women. And as we see from the women who is the subject of this post, even medical treatment is not a guarantee.
I am totally in favor of women in their 20’s having the freedom to put off starting a family. I just want them to know all the stats and facts about probable fertility in their 30’s and 40’s so they can make an informed decision. Instead, we sell these young women the dream that having biological children in their mid to late 30’s is going to be super easy. It isn’t.
[–]FizzleMateriel 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I have a friend who’s 40 and childless. I didn’t know she wanted kids until she mentioned she’d tried with her partner and they couldn’t get it to happen. This would have been a few years ago when she was in her very late thirties, past 35.
Anyway that and the Hugh Jackman example kind of sticks in my mind whenever people say age isn’t an issue. They’re just completely full of shit, it’s hard enough for 30 year olds to conceive and I even know a couple of mid-thirties couples who had to try multiple times with mis-carriages.
Political correctness has meant no-one wants to acknowledge the biological facts and realities.
[–]Preme2 37 points38 points39 points 3 years ago* (8 children) | Copy Link
Women can’t afford 19k before 30’s. Factoring in todays inflation might be 30k now.
[–]EulenWatcher 10 points11 points12 points 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
Quick google search gives really different numbers from 8k to 40k, so I guess it majorly depends on your insurance and hospital.
[–]Gilmoregirlin 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
Most insurances do not cover this in the US at all.
[–]Preme2 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
I’m sure the free government healthcare may come through one of these days and added to the free list.
[–]Gilmoregirlin 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
That would be good for all couples that struggle with infertility . I do know a few women that had cancer and went through egg retrieval pre chemo and that had to be covered. Not only women struggle with infertility, many men also freeze their Sperm, pre chemo or other health conditions. I used to volunteer with wounded warriors and many of them went through in vitro too.
[–]Preme2 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Yeah some women may use it like that. I bet most however just continue to Chad chase. If they cannot secure a man by 40 then sperm donor it is.
[–]Gilmoregirlin 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
How much real world experience do you have with this or with women and dating in general? Just curious. I am a 45 year old woman and I can assure that none of this is accurate. BTW many women don’t want kids.
[–]Preme2 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
BTW many women don’t want kids.
We’re talking about freezing eggs. How is this relevant?
Many of the women who don’t want kids cannot afford it or know they will never have them because they need a desirable man who will stay committed. Mental health issues as well. That is the “don’t want kids” demographic.
[–]Gilmoregirlin 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Because you stated that if a woman could not find a man by age 40 then sperm donor. That comment presumes that all women want kids, they do not. And I am a female lawyer partner at a law firm, and I have a lot of female friends that never wanted kids BTW we could afford it, we don’t want it. So people that are smart enough to decide they don’t want kids have mental health problems LOL. No the people that should never have been parents i the first place but have kids for their own selfish reasons are the ones with the mental health problems.
[–]DolmaSmuggler 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Also she only froze 11, which is well below the recommended amount to have a 90% chance of a live birth (~35 frozen eggs recommended if freezing at age 37).
[–]redditmcx 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Agreed. Late 30s is a bit late to be confident they are viable.
[–]variedpageants 29 points30 points31 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Even if it works out for her, wow. She's 45 now. She'll be 62 when her kid is 16. Imagine being a single mother at 62 trying to keep tabs on a 16 year old!
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 64 points65 points66 points 3 years ago (128 children) | Copy Link
Some people really need to consider adoption.
[–]SirTruffleberry 44 points45 points46 points 3 years ago (17 children) | Copy Link
Perfectly acceptable child: "Would you be my mommy?"
This woman: "I will literally pay $19,000 and buy infant supplies to get a different kid lol."
[–]anonymous-platypus1 19 points20 points21 points 3 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link
That’s literally what everyone who chooses to have biological kids does. People want kids for the wrong reason. No one who sees a child as a life-goal should have them. Being a parent should be about giving a person, yes person, not child, the best life they can.
As a parent you are 100% responsible for your child’s life. You should only seek to have children because you want to raise a person and give them a loving home and support.
[–]MiniMouse8 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
Being a parent is about allowing your genetic line; spanning millenia, to continue. And fostering and caring for your offspring so they can act as a continuation of you and also add their own personal traits to your family line.
Being a charity running babysitter for kids is not the goal of a parent. I have absolutely no attachment to a child who isn't related to me genetically or by law.
[–]Kilatypus 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
People who want their genetic lineage to continue are valid. It's not wrong to have this perspective.
It's strange that people are trying to change your mind about this.
[–]decoy88Men and Women are similar 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
It’s ultimately a stupid and narcissistic reason - “I want ‘me’, more of ‘me’”
[–]B_B_a_D_Science 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Its 3 billion years of evolution. Pretty sure your opinion doesn't trump that...
[–]decoy88Men and Women are similar 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Lol such a dumb response.
[–]Kilatypus 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I mean, if you want to see it that way, you are entitled to that.
You just aren't entitled to telling people that their preference in desiring their genetic lineage to continue is invalid. No one owes anyone anything.
You just aren’t entitled to telling people that their preference in desiring their genetic lineage to continue is invalid.
Good thing I never said that, but sometimes, a person needs to let a dream of theirs go. And seek alternatives.
Disappointment and Adaptation is part of adulthood.
[–]SirTruffleberry 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
In addition to a drive to spread your genes, there is also the more general drive to keep the species going. Adoption serves that drive well.
[–]anonymous-platypus1 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Adoption would make them related to you by law you silly waffle.
[–]erottawa 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Not the laws of nature you ditzy pancake.
[–]anonymous-platypus1 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
That’s…genetically…op said children that are related to him genetically or by law are the only ones he cares about. Adoption makes them yours by law.
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Please don't have children if you want them to be a continuation of you. You will be disappointed. Biological children do look a bit like you, but if you narcissistically need to see that you can look at others who are related to you. Who will continue your genetic line if the loss of your precious genes so worries you. And yes, looking after your children is the goal of a parent.
[–]Fl333rPurple Pill Woman 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Adoption can actually cost upwards of $35k in North America, unfortunately. Adopting abroad may be cheaper, but may also involve more bureaucracy.
I think current systems make it too easy for parents to birth a child for the wrong reasons, and too difficult for parents to adopt a child for the right reasons.
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
r/usdefaultism
[–]windowsfrozenshut 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Adopting a kid costs a whole lot more than 19k though..
I believe it would actually cost me nothing.
[–]CatchPhrazeMaster Of Memeology 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
It's weird to me because I would never want to be a single parent. The point of me wanting a kid at all is because I love my s.o and want more of him in the world. Otherwise I'd be fine not having them. Being obsessed with having a blood relation to yourself for yourself is something I can't really grasp.
Sounds to me like the lady in the article was unreasonably picky and the clock ran out on her finding a husband.
[–]HungerISanEmotionPill Pilled Piller and Penis owner 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
You can always return them back right?
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You can adopt out any child.
[–]BitsAndBobs304 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
but then how can they be selfish and make the world a worse place? adopting would involve helping out people already in need instead of reproducing your dna! gasp!
[–]funnystorPills are for addicts 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Yes adoption is a beautiful thing, that's why I had ten kids and put them all up for adoption!
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Might say something about you, then. It isn't the children's fault.
[–]funnystorPills are for addicts 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Who said anything about fault? I'm saying I'm in favor of adoption.
[–]Pizzashillsmom1 points 3 years ago [recovered] (77 children) | Copy Link
Adoption is literally just cuckoldry.
[–]purpleisverysus 15 points16 points17 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Genetically speaking perhaps. But as someone who was adopted and now help out their adoptive parents in old age - it does come with perks. After decades of knowing each other there is true unconditional love, so if a choice is to have no kids or an adoptive kid (for someone who wants the kid thing at all), adoptive one is not that bad of a deal.
I kinda view it this way - all humans are part animal and part higher beings with reason, selflessness, etc. We need both of those parts to thrive, but to make everything in life about satisfying our animal part and its instincts wouldn't lead to a fulfilling life either
[–]Anti_ThingChristpilled 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
It's literally not. Cuckoldry necessarily involves adultery. There's nothing cucked about a married couple who are faithful to each other adopting a child.
[–]RocinanteCoffee 17 points18 points19 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Millions of adopted children and their loving parents would disagree with you.
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue -3 points-2 points-1 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link
Million of people live lies on the daily.
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 20 points21 points22 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
If it is, seems like cuckoldry isn't the insult you think it is.
[–]OpeningInner483 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
I am not the step father, I am the father who stepped up
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
How awful to be a stepparent!
[–]OpeningInner483 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
I mean, for a lot of people, it seems like a waste of time, energy, and respurces to raise a child that is not even yours.
Like, why should it be my responsibility?
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Because you decided they would be and made them yours. Raising a child is not a waste.
[–]Neat-Sun-7999 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago* (3 children) | Copy Link
Yh it is if u don’t want and actively didn’t want to be a father to a son that’s not yours. Doesn’t mean u can’t have a relationship but ur being obtuse here. That’s not a reason most men and women would accept. But men here to stay on topic
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Then it's your choice. You shouldn't assume that stepparents don't want to make that choice, which isn't true in most cases.
[–]Neat-Sun-7999 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
We don’t have stats and I don’t doubt that there’s some that may. But a lot of ppl don’t want to be trapped into raising someone that they think is there’s and that’s fair enough. U can’t expect ppl to do that especially when adoption is more often than not voluntary
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue -4 points-3 points-2 points 3 years ago (62 children) | Copy Link
Yeah, if I was infertile I would not adopt. Why spend your resources and time on some other dude's kid? Better use the money on yourself and family. Blows my mind people actually consider the option.
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 18 points19 points20 points 3 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
Because they're your child? Adoption is literally making them part of your family and you won't even meet their biological father (or mother, but for some reason you've ignored her). It blows my mind you'd rather be miserable going without the children you want than consider having one you didn't personally make with your own genitals.
[–]UpbeatInsurance5358 12 points13 points14 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Meh. It's better people like this wouldn't adopt anyway, they'd be horrible parents.
[–]Gilmoregirlin 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Exactly.
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue -3 points-2 points-1 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
Lmao! Keep telling yourself that, champ.
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
Well, I don't have a worldview that's just selfish and illogical, so I'm okay sticking to the truth.
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue -4 points-3 points-2 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
You mean selfish and logical, and that you will stick to a lie. They will never be your child, you're a cuck.
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Making someone your child is the meaning of adoption. That's not even what being a cuck means.
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue -2 points-1 points0 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
If you adopt you are a willing cuck. Redefine it however you will. Liberals and leftists seem to love that tactic, instead of honest conversation it all become verbal slight of hand.
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
You're not conversing honestly, and I'm not left. You're just saying it makes you some insult you've rendered meaningless.
[–]Anti_ThingChristpilled 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Conservatives adopt more than liberals, lol. Adoption was a huge part of ancient Roman culture, too. Adoption is a very based & trad practice.
[–]purpleisverysus 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link
The kid would love you unconditionally - regardless how rich/broke, hot/ugly you are - something a romantic partner would never do. And would help in old age if you raise them right.
Granted raising a kid is still a hassle, but if a person is up to it, the effort won't be wasted, adoptive or not
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
I think I'm gonna puke. Do anyone really believe in this?
[–]purpleisverysus 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
It's personal experience. I care more for my adoptive parents than I can for biological ones. It matters zero that we are not related, I try my hardest to make their life better. And after growing up I gained special respect for my adoptive father accepting me and treating me better than many treat their biological children.
And it's the way it is in my country - stronger family bonds. Kids don't abandon their parents unless they really were abusive
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
What country are you from? Some eastern European country, my guess.
[–]purpleisverysus 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
That's correct. I consider it a good mix between modern freedom and tradition.
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I'm happy for you. Seems a nice place, culturally to be.
[–]Anti_ThingChristpilled 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Yeah, normal people.
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Ew.
[–]Gilmoregirlin -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Lol you truly have not lived a lot of life have you? This is so not true.
Depends on your culture and social circle I guess. Out of people I studied and worked with only a small handful are estranged from their parents - and their childhood was corresponding awful. Everyone else loves and cares for their parents - even if there are grudges, family ties are still above all.
My Mom works in the assisted living/nursing home industry. The amount of kids that abandon their parents, or don’t officially abandon them but never come visit, or come once a year or are only hungry for money is astounding. Just because people are not “estranged” does not mean that they treat their parents well or care or care or them in their time of need. So someone in your study could have answered no they are not estranged and that would be accurate but that in no way means they actually take care of or are there to support their parents and no these kids did not have awful childhoods they are just selfish. I agree that in certain cultures such as the Asian culture people take care of their parents, but in the US they put them in homes and ignore them.
[–]purpleisverysus 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I'm not in US. Nursing homes do exist here but personally I don't know anyone who has their parents in those.
Then in US people seem to tend to move between states more, while here people are more likely to stay in their hometown I think
I agree with you that in this generation most people move away from their families. Whereas even when I was growing up in the 80s it was less common for people to leave the area where they grew up, so you had family support. My friend from Vietnam is appalled that people put their parents in homes but yes the majority of people do.
[–]MonchMunch 10 points11 points12 points 3 years ago (35 children) | Copy Link
“Why spend your resources and time on some other dude’s kid?”
Because you can improve the child’s life? Pretty much every child deserves a loving family and support, and it’s ok for another person besides their biological parents to help fill in that gap. Blows my mind that you can’t see why people consider the option
[–]MiddleZealousideal89 11 points12 points13 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Because these dudes only want kids as a status symbol. Raising the child, caring for it, loving it, teaching them right from wrong is work that someone else has to do, they just need their mini me to exist, so they can brag about having procreated.
[–]RegularDue9718 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
You don't deserve anything. You women go around yelling that to lonely people all the time
[–]MonchMunch -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Wow. I mean, you’re right in a most basic sense. But we have so many resources that there’s an ability to auto give certain things to people(at least in first world countries). Like kids needing support. You just sound a bit bitter
[–]RegularDue9718 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
So lonely people deserve things when you say these lonely people matter?
[–]MonchMunch 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Lonely people do matter and do deserve basic human rights. Of course, those rights might not get them out of their loneliness but they should still get them
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (29 children) | Copy Link
No one deserves anything. 'Rights' are fictions. Keep cucking, I won't stop you. Just don't force me to go along with the genetic suicide.
[–]MonchMunch 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Genetic suicide? Dude, it’s not that serious. Helping one of the many hundreds of thousands of kids in the foster care system doesn’t mean that people are gonna stop reproducing all together. Quality of a kids life matters more than the quantity of kids
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
In all past eras the continuation of your bloodline was a sacred duty to your parents and their parents through them. Besides, step-kids are treated worse on a subconscious level by their guardians so your real kids would have a better life than your false ones.
[–]THHBHStT 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Idk but I feel like your ancestors prob didn’t want their genes to go to some guy trying to preach to others on PPD about raising a family
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
My ancestors would not know it was a possibility. But they would want a healthy descendant just like I want and make a goal.
[–]purpleisverysus 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I'm not sure ancestors beyond the last 200 years gave that much thought. For the majority of people at least children were just a resource for farm work and help in old age. Thinking about legacy was a Maslow's need out of their reach
[–]Anti_ThingChristpilled 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
In past eras, adoption was generally seen as continuation of your bloodline.
[–]throwaway164_3 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (22 children) | Copy Link
Why are you so attached to your genes? It’s just pieces of DNA
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (21 children) | Copy Link
Blood relations is the most important thing in the world, your typical liberal worldview is the dominant belief only in decadent empires.
Life, your life, streches back four billion years (a quater of the lifespan of the universe) and demands continuation.
[–]throwaway164_3 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
By your own logic, stretching back 4 billion years, all life is connected thanks to evolution and our common unicellular ancestor. We all share the same common human ancestor.
So why not continue that even if it’s not your immediate genetic descendant? Because you are still related to every other human alive.
Blood relations are not the most important thing. Being a scientific, literate and compassionate Homo sapien is.
There’s not any intrinsic cosmic meaning or purpose to the universe anyway. Might as well be kind and make the most of our brief time alive
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
That is true, even should you die you will live on in some way through your family, race and species and even in all life since there has only been one genesis on this planet. And thank fuck that life doesn't depend on you to keep it chugging along.
[–]throwaway164_3 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Thank fuck it doesn’t depend on you either 😘
Adoption is one way to keep your family going (& your race, if you adopt someone of your own race).
If you're against adoption, doesn't that make you against a future for millions of children of your own race? Would you rather your people have abortions instead?
[–]purpleisverysus 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
I totally understand the desire for your own biological children and think it's very natural, but... Since humans started out as a species of a few thousands individuals, we are all pretty much related to each other. If you are white and in US, probably even more so (to fellow white Americans) since the genetic pool of colonizers wasn't huge either.
Your children would have 50% of your DNA and grandchildren 25%. Several generations down the route only minuscule part of your DNA would be left.
Not saying you shouldn't prioritize your own genetic children - it's pretty to cool to notice familiarity in traits in them and the whole satisfying instincts thing - but obsessing over it (the way I see people in some pill communities do) is silly IMO.
[–]Martian_Expat_001More red than blue 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago* (7 children) | Copy Link
I'm a Dane in Denmark, for the record. Obsessing over racial traits is actually repressed in America, if you are white that is, from what I can see. That you think it is unhealthy probably is only due to being in an environment where it's near zero (artificially kept that way (for one group anyway)).
Like with, say, the importance of body-count. Clearly men care about that, it's just not proper for them to make that clear, so it happens online.
[–]purpleisverysus 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago* (4 children) | Copy Link
The obsession is near zero in my environment because my country is predominantly the same race (white). People don't feel as threatened - socially, genetically - so they don't have that kind of neurosis.
And I don't think the obsession is small in US. I think it's the opposite - different race compositions as there create tensions that are simply due to instincts - which are there whether voiced out loud or not.
Danes are handsome af, good for you. I certainly would rather have more of Dane DNA out there xD
Denmark is a historically Christian nation; Christianity is pro-adoption. I don't think pre-Christian pagans in that areas had any problem with adoption, either. If you support traditional or conservative values, then you should definitely support adoption.
White Americans are pretty diverse due to immigration, actually. I don't even think most of them are predominantly of English descent anymore.
None of that makes it wrong to adopt.
People do it because they want kids, & also to help society. I would definitely adopt if I couldn't biologically have kids, in fact even if I do make biological children will probably adopt in addition to that.
No, adoption is consensual. You can think of it as a form of charity, willingly giving your money to help the less fortunate.
Cuckoldry is bad because it's done to people without their consent.
[–]cara-melada -2 points-1 points0 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
Nobody really wants a kid that someone else threw away
[–]KikiYuyuPurple Pill Woman 12 points13 points14 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Why is it that sociopathic heartless creeps are ALWAYS convinced that everyone in the world is like them?
[–]armpitpics 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Because they are sociopathic little creeps
[–]MiniMouse8 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Not wanting to adopt a lost cause and father some random persons child is common sense, not sociopathy.
[–]KikiYuyuPurple Pill Woman 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
"I'm not mentally disturbed, I just tell it like it is!"
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 14 points15 points16 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I'm sorry you feel that way.
[–]pearllovespink 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
That’s harsh. Kids are innocent and don’t ask to be brought into this world. I hope you’re pro-abortion.
[–]MiniMouse8 -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Every person has the option to end their life at any time, being entitled and complaining that you were born is the definition of pathetic
[–]pearllovespink 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You’re encouraging young children to commit suicide? How sick.
[–]_here_ok 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Only if they like have the capacity too tho. The problem is a lot of people won't take care of anything correctly unless it has a specific meaning or traits. Lots of women or men won't feel the urge to take care of even their own child if it doesn't look like them. Is it wrong? To me personally it's not wrong because it's something they can't control but those people do need to recognize they have the obligation to take care of the child they brought in this world or bring that child to a safe guardian.
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
I don't think someone like that should be having children of any kind.
[–]funnystorPills are for addicts 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Sadly for you, you don't get to police what other people do with their bodies.
Obviously, I can't make them and wouldn't try. I can still have an opinion on what they should do.
[–]_here_ok 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I don't mind it as long as they themselves actually respect and treat the child with care which is different from actually feeling the emotion. We can still do things out of obligation or moral compass despite not having an active urge to do it. It's like how we can feel fear but still act regardless.
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
Ultimate cuckery.
Caring for your own kid made with your DNA is much more than caring for some random kid. In pleasure, but also in utility because you contribute to natural selection thus in making humankind better.
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
They're not random. They're your own child that you chose. That's something pretty special and theyre no less pleasure to be around. Natural selection really isn't a process you should be worrying about, and adoption is something that could make humankind better right now by meaning there's one less parentless child.
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
There is less pleasure, they are just trying to pretend it's their kid. Not saying caring for someone is no pleasure, but it's less.
And adoption is actually only making the adopted better, not humankind.
Natural selection is making humankind better. And when someone is trash and abandon his kids voluntary or not, natural selection principle is their DNA not perpetuate or struggle to perpetuate, by messing with that and helping his DNA to perpetuate by raising its DNA, you actually make humankind worse.
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
It literally is their child. If you don't have some weird DNA obsession, it is just caring for your child. How is leaving children parentless going to make humankind better exactly? Their DNA didn't do anything wrong, and it won't disappear just because they're left to rot in the care system. Horrible people are generally made horrible by their upbringing, not their genes, and you're making sure that upbringing won't be good.
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
It is caring for a child. It's not really yours, you just consider it is. Which is fine, but it has many differences. And first, your adopted kid has less in common with you, physically, behaviourally, psychically. His own kids will too have less in common with you, etc ...
Genes code everything. Everything you can do that a bacteria doesn't do, is because of genetics. Every desires, every action is genetic. Do bacteria care for their kids like us ? No. Why ? Because our DNA is different. Even education is due to DNA, can you educate a bacteria ? No.
If you do something, it's exactly because your DNA let you do it or didn't prevent you doing it.
And helping an individual is worthless to humankind, individuals are temporary and insignificant. DNA has a bigger impact because it lasts until extinction.
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
What makes something yours is just that you and others consider it to be so. You do something because you choose to. Lots of factors go into that choice, your genes being only one. Your children will never have everything in common with you, but if you raised them, they'll have quite a bit in common. If you think helping an individual makes no difference to humankind, then why did you argue abandoning them would make one?
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Considering something, even with several persons, doesn't change reality. It only changes your perception in a limited way.
I'm not talking about having everything in common with your bio kids, I said having more in common.
Natural selection pressure makes positive difference to humankind, alleviating it makes a negative difference.
Belonging is a social construct so whatever us considered to be true about it is reality. Does it change things when you have not much in common with biological children then? As I said, it's not obvious that natural selection pressure would push people to not adopt rather than to adopt, and you're still saying contradictory things - why can an individual only make a positive difference and not negative?
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
It changes a lot yes. Maybe you can convince yourself it doesn't change a lot, but whatever you consider, big or small, there is a difference.
I didn't say an individual can only make a positive difference, there has been a misunderstanding, you can make positive or negative difference. I just meant making a short term positive difference for an individual isn't relevant to humankind, but even talking about the long term negative effect for humankind.
[–]howdoiw0rkthisthingsugar-pilled 19 points20 points21 points 3 years ago (27 children) | Copy Link
“Women are no sympathy for men’s issues and love to mock them 😭😭😭”
[–]OpeningInner483 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link
Yes, you mocked us long before we decided to mock back
[–]howdoiw0rkthisthingsugar-pilled 9 points10 points11 points 3 years ago (15 children) | Copy Link
🐓🐣🐓🐣🐓🐣🐓🐣
[–]OpeningInner483 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (14 children) | Copy Link
I mean this discourse started at leeast with NiceGuysofOkCupid. Its definitely feminists who started it.
Over a decade ago, nerdy spaces where pretty feminist friendly. Until the misandry that feminists started to spew everwhere
[–]howdoiw0rkthisthingsugar-pilled 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link
I didn’t realize we were confining the conversation to the internet age
[–]OpeningInner483 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link
The internet age is over 20 years old right now.
Misoginist incel culture only took root in the mid 2010s, when online feminist communities took a misandric turn.
[–]howdoiw0rkthisthingsugar-pilled -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
I don’t buy that women have the drive or the originality to organize a space like that before men do
[–]OpeningInner483 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
They pretty much ran tumblr a decade ago.
Women tend to be great at social networking
[–]howdoiw0rkthisthingsugar-pilled 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
On platforms and spaces that already exist or are created for them, yes
[–]OpeningInner483 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yes, thats how online feminism started
[–]phuck_polyeV 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Umm hateful male centric online communities have been a thing from at least the early 2000s
[–]OpeningInner483 -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Not anywhere near the point of being mainstream like now.
And most of those places were from guys who got divorce raped or otherwise got screwed by the gynocentric legal system. They were embittered normies, not permavirgin incels
That means all these takes are even dumber.
[–]OpeningInner483 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
What do you mean?
Current blackpill incel culture would have never taken off without the mainstreaming of feminism in the 2010s
[–]decoy88Men and Women are similar 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
the mainstreaming of feminism in the 2010s
How old are you?
[–]OpeningInner483 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Mid 30s
Was extremely online since the mid 00s
[–]Gilmoregirlin 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
we have sympathy we are just not willing to extend that sympathy by lowering our standards and sleeping with men we find repulsive which is what men mean by sympathy.
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
Women insult and attack ugly men. I haven't asked a woman out in my life but I've been insulted and harassed by them for being ugly. Y'all ain't the more sympathetic gender.
[–]cshal420 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
skill issue get good
Stalker.
[–]Gilmoregirlin 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
I have never in my 45 years of life randomly harassed a guy for being ugly and I was pretty hot in my younger days. I have never witnessed this either. I have witnessed and personally been rude to men who approached me and would not take no for an answer after I politely declined their advances. Are you saying that on the regular women just walk up to you an insult you for no reason? That's odd. Most women would not voluntarily engage in an interaction with a man they thought was that unattractive that they did not know?
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
No, it's women I know who will insult me for my looks at work and also at school. Women give me disgusted looks and whenever I post my face online women make fun of me. Women aren't perfect and they're way more judgemental and cruel than me.
[–]Gilmoregirlin 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Why are you posting your face online? And dude grow some balls, don't let women treat you like that!! if it's the same people at work or school then don't engage with those people or report them to HR at work. Come on now.
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Women have always treated me like that, they either joke insult or give me weird looks. I can report them, get a new job, etc... But I'll always encounter it. If you think women are so kind and innocent try living as an ugly man, even if you don't make sexual advances on them they'll be cruel. And I showed my face online because I have friends online an the wanted to see.
[–]cshal420 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Dude maybe quit being negative your life will be negative if you don’t use a positive white belt mindset. Work on yourself. Become the best version of yourself and quit porn. I’m quitting porn and it’s doing me wonders
It's hard being positive when someone constantly pushes you back down.
[–]Stunning-Potato-1984No Pill 31 points32 points33 points 3 years ago (22 children) | Copy Link
Damn men are really trying to scare women into letting a dude baby trap them young. Wild.
[–]WYenginerdWYpro-woman pill. enjoys shitting on anti-feminists 17 points18 points19 points 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
Right? For all the anguish this woman is experiencing, she's still ten times better off than if she'd settled for some negging, shitty male that she was now stuck with. Raising a child, while he slowly sucks the life out of her.
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
nope. She'll get her life sucked out alone working for a shit job with no purpose or familly.
A shitty male and several shitty kids are how you are supposed to get your life sucked out.
[–]WYenginerdWYpro-woman pill. enjoys shitting on anti-feminists 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
noooossss, not a wahmens getting her life sucked away in a way that doesn't directly benefit a MAN 😭
[–]Street_Fuel_7751 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
You anti child people are mentally ill. Baby trap doesn't even exist. It's called having a family.
[–]Stunning-Potato-1984No Pill 11 points12 points13 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I've recently noticed an uptick in anti birth control sentiment and now this. Men here constantly emphasize the importance of women having children in their 20s, because it's what they want. This article is a scare tactic.
And tsk tsk calling people mentally ill for making their own life choices. Having a family is great, for people who want it. Not everyone does.
[–]WYenginerdWYpro-woman pill. enjoys shitting on anti-feminists 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Lol. I'll remind you of that the next time some dude on PPD complains about child support payments or "sperm jacking".
[–]Street_Fuel_7751 -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Idk what sperm jacking is.
[–]CLyD3_H3ffalump 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Taking the used condom after it had been discarded and assumed disposed of in efforts to have a baby.
[–]Street_Fuel_7751 -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Oh, that's the "baby trap"? Wtf!
[–]CLyD3_H3ffalump -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yes, and it happens, scary stuff.
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
That's their biological goal. Women should have mandatory pregnancies.
[–]Stunning-Potato-1984No Pill 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Lol.
[–]cshal420 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
average motherless piece of shit
Cope.
[–]cshal420 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
How much porn have you watched today?
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
You don't wanna know
[–]cshal420 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Damn
your ancestors are probably turning in the grave knowing their descendant is being a low testosterone worm
XD
[–]cshal420 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
I’m assuming you know who david goggins is correct?
No clue what you're schizoposting about.
[–]nothatyoucare 25 points26 points27 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Why do you care what women who you don’t know decide to do with their life? They aren’t hurting anyone. men are fucking sick in the head. Why? This post.
Why do you care what women who you don’t know decide to do with their life? They aren’t hurting anyone.
men are fucking sick in the head. Why? This post.
Lol women keep this same energy every time a post is made about men "you don't know" about they "decide to live their life".
[–]oneblackcoffeeplease 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
story so old she prob over it by now
[–][deleted] 23 points24 points25 points 3 years ago (24 children) | Copy Link
Incels are celebrating women having trouble conceiving lol. This is why I don't feel bad for incels and I hope they never sniff a pussy in their life lmao.
[–]OpeningInner483 14 points15 points16 points 3 years ago (20 children) | Copy Link
Ironically, the reason why we dont feel bad when women suffer is precisely because women dont feel bad when we suffer.
You would never have felt bad for us either way.
[–]Gakeon 10 points11 points12 points 3 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
Women don't feel bad if incels suffer because incels hate women. Incels don't feel bad if women suffer because incels hate women.
[–]OpeningInner483 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link
Feminists where shitting on "incel" (back then they were called "nice guys", and guys who complained about friendzoning) years before contempery incel culture took root
[–]Gakeon 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
Yeah, because nice guys are also toxic. You shouldn't expect sex or a relationship simply because you are nice. Feminists, and non feminist women, shit on nice guys and incels for opposite reasons. Incels are verbally abusive to women, while nice guys act like nice people so that they can get laid, which is also bad.
[–]OpeningInner483 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
The "nice guys" where just confused whybthey couldnt get into relationships, despite putting in the effort tp fo so.
Incels just realize that looks, not effort, is what gets you laid.
[–]Gakeon 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
It's all about reaction. For example, I've known people who start cursing at women for rejecting them. i've known many genuine nice people who couldn't get a date, but they handled rejection it well. One of these is a nice guy as everybody means it to be, a guy who expects sex or romance after being nice, and the other is a victim of the former.
Women are careful around "nice guys" because they could be like the later and mean genuine good. Or they could be like the former and harass, abuse or even kill them.
As for incels and looks, incels are completely wrong. There are some ugly people in relationships, but they try and take care of their bodies despite naturally looking less fortunate than others. Combined with their personalities, which are often funny, nice, and genuinely caring, women are interesting. Women generally don't look for hook ups, but relationships. They are looking for people that share their interests, and are respectful to them.
[–]OpeningInner483 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Henry Cavill has no problem getting girls, despite having pretty much incelesque views of women.
Looks matter
[–]Gakeon 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
When has Cavill ever have incelesque views? And of course, looks certainly matter a bit, but incels act like looks are the only thing that matters, which is wrong.
[–]Important-Stomach474 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
"toxic" just means "disliked by women" so thats a circular argument
[–]Gakeon 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
No toxic means negative behavior. Shitting on women, treating them like lessers or even property, being nice for the sole purpose of sex/romance is toxic.
[–]Important-Stomach474 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
negative behavior
"behaviour disliked by women"
[–]Gakeon 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Bro i just explained traits that are toxic
[–]Important-Stomach474 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
yeah and i explained the reason why they are 'toxic'
[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
I'm not a woman. You are right though, I will never feel bad for an incel.
[–]OpeningInner483 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
Let me guess, you are a father with at least one daughtee
[–][deleted] 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Nope. You keep missing. Not a father, so no daughter. Not dating a single mother. Have a mother and father, both still lovingly together. Just to help you out so you stop losing.
[–]OpeningInner483 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Are you gay? A closeted rapist?
Like what reason do you have to be a g7nocentric cuck?
[–][deleted] 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
lmao holy shit.
[–]phuck_polyeV 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
You just simply have to not be a loser to despise incels
[–]OpeningInner483 -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
The average denizen of inceltear suggests otherwise
[–]phuck_polyeV 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You don’t have to hope… these men’s bloodlines are ending with them
[–]Submersiv 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
If you see someone driving towards the edge of a cliff and you tell them so but they say "nuh uh!" and keep driving, and then you tell them they're going to die if they keep going and they say "no I won't, stop oppressing me!", and then they drive off the cliff and die, do you think it's somehow wrong to point and laugh at their idiocy?
[–]hear4comments 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
While this isn’t something to celebrate. in this society. Getting a sniff of P is the easiest and cheapest it’s ever been.
[–]34lockdown 27 points28 points29 points 3 years ago (95 children) | Copy Link
This is tragic and laughing at her is shitty
[–][deleted] 17 points18 points19 points 3 years ago* (94 children) | Copy Link
How many actually good men did she reject for... whatever reason tho?
So women got sexual freedom. Like this. Okay. Sometimes, people make bad choices with their freedom. Like this.
This is nobody's fault but hers and that's on god.
[–]Gilmoregirlin 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (21 children) | Copy Link
Probably not that many . Very few men out there that are good father material.
[–]variedpageants 11 points12 points13 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Very few men out there that are good father material.
That's especially true when you define "good father material" as "being in the top 1% of men"
[–]Gilmoregirlin 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
I don’t. Looks have zero to do with being a good father. But that’s the standard response on this sub from men who have been rejected, that they are not in the top 5%. News flash more than the top 5% of men are having sex, getting married and in relationships.
[–]variedpageants 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
that’s the standard response on this sub from men who have been rejected
Awww!! Your attempt to make it personal is touching.
But here's the deal: 100% of the data we have shows the unreasonable pickiness of women. Every time we get data from a dating website, or a survey, or a study, it shows this. Every time we hear from people who try to help women (e.g. matchmakers) they say the same thing. Every time some woman is interviewed, it goes the same way - she lists attributes that exclude 99% of men, and she seemingly has no clue she's doing it.
The pickiness of women is legendary, and all you're doing when you deny it is gaslighting.
more than the top 5% of men are having sex
...and you're bad a math. No phenomenon that follows the Pareto Principle (and there are hundreds of examples, in nature, in engineering, in business and in finance) implies that """"only 5% participates""""
For example, one domain where the Pareto Principle applies is social media. 80% of retweets go to just 20% of tweets. If I point that out to you, and you attempt to dismiss it by saying, "more than the top 20% are getting retweets" then yeah, all you're doing is gaslighting.
[–]Gilmoregirlin -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
So women would rather stay single than settle and? What’s your point? If its not personal why do you or any of these men care. Just let the women live their lives as they please.
[–]variedpageants 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
women would rather stay single than settle
It's only a problem if they complain about it latter in life.
And you know this. You know exactly what point I'm making, because you would react the same way.
You (yes you) fully understand the difference between a guy who isn't getting laid "because of his standards" and an incel. You fully understand that a short, fat, bald guy with no money who thinks to himself (very, very silently to himself) "I'm only going to date supermodels" is never going to get a supermodel but so long as he keeps that shit to himself, you do not seek him out and ridicule him.
...but, if that same guy is vocal about his """"standards"""" and worse, he whines about being an incel, then you will call him out, and I will join you.
The woman we're discussing here is getting sympathetic mainstream media coverage. It's a "cruel twist of fate" and there's "no sign of Mr. Right."
My criticism of her would be very obvious to you, and you'd be echoing it (and going further) if that short, fat, incel had a mainstream media article sympathetically calling his inability to achieve his unreasonable standards "a cruel twist of fate."
She's getting sympathy because she wanted kids and struggled to have them, a man should get the same sympathy. And she's not complaining she is just getting sympathy because because people that cannot have kids and want them should get sympathy male or female. I don't understand the logic of men here or your logic. Why would you ever want a woman to settle for you? Like hey this is my wife she settled for me, she lowered her standards?
[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (14 children) | Copy Link
Ah yes, and she also thought so, which is why she's a barren spinster
You could learn something from her mistakes, but hey
[–][deleted] 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago* (6 children) | Copy Link
cranky because you’re not good father material aren’t you
but seriously, sexual selection is women’s biological imperative. it is in our nature to be choosy. if that bothers you, consider how many of your behaviors you ascribe to nature and insist cannot be helped — the impulse to be polygamous/cheat, for instance — bother us, and then consider what your response typically is to women expressing our frustrations at that because i guarantee you are nowhere near as empathetic as you expect us to be. why should i care that you’re mad at women doing what we’re meant to do? you glorify your own nature and demonize us for ours… that’s misogynistic, not merely “speaking facts” lol
[–][deleted] 9 points10 points11 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link
Okay so a woman fucking up because she decided that both billions of years of evolution and basically all men weren't good enough for her
There are differences between being reasonably cautious & exercising discretion, picky because of sexism, and being outright ridiculous.
All those options -- about 4 billion of them -- and making money was still more important to her. She's somewhere between the 2nd and 3rd classifications.
Like bruh no fr I get it women are picky and why wouldn't they be, duh. But cmon u already know this woman had so many opportunities to meet a good guy but still decided none of them were satisfactory🤷♂️
Edit: upvoted for funny at the beginning, +1
Edit 2: I'm not getting mad at women for "doing what they're supposed to do", and tbh I don't know wtf that's supposed to even be. What?? Can u pls stop putting up strawmen. Sticking to the main point: the woman in question is dumb, she thought she could game the system while thinking most/all men were trash. That's sexist and she got what she deserved tbh
[–]PizzashillsmomSelf Made Pill 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Sexual selection in women is based on the times when there was a very real chance your neighbor could come beat you to death with a club if your husband wasn’t strong enough to protect you. Just say you’re not attracted to those men, but claiming that women’s sexual selection has anything to do with who makes good “father material” in the modern world is just pure delution.
[–]litanyagainsttears1 points 3 years ago* [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link
hm no it’s actually still a pressing issue that women ensure the dregs of society are not reproducing and passing on their degenerate genes to the next generation! when we fail to discriminate in this way, IQ goes down and violent crime goes up, to name a few consequences. i imagine you still, however, believe it’s a man’s prerogative to Spread His Seed Far And Wide by fucking as many barely-legals under false pretenses of love or financial stability as he can? cope cope cope
[–]PizzashillsmomSelf Made Pill 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Lol projecting much? I have literally 0 interests in sleeping around…
Actually my argument is that living after your biological imperative doesn’t make much sense in the modern world. A man who decides to spread his genes to every woman he can sleep with is just gonna end up with tons of bastard children that he has to pay child support to and might not even have any real connection to any of them. Not a very good way to live.
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
sexual selection looks different today than it did in the past because we do not have the same face-value needs as our ancestors but it is very much still necessary. one wants to produce healthy and stable offspring, so to do that one must mate with a healthy and stable individual — women select for this. violent crime does actually still exist despite society’s best efforts, so women are still under pressure to select a mate who is capable of protecting them if necessary though maybe he doesn’t need to be the “strongest in the tribe” anymore — we select for this as well. children require more resources (money which translates to food, clothing, etc) and women are therefore under pressure to also select for a mate who can provide although we often have to contribute as well, since the average income made by a single person is probably no longer enough to support a household — we select for a provider, too. any woman may choose a combination of any of these things depending on the circumstances in which she will be raising a child — perhaps a woman with a large inheritance will not prioritize a provider as much and so will select for a more physically adept man with less money. a woman with a neglectful upbringing may just want to find a man that treats her well at the cost of him being a high earner or extremely strong. I don’t fucking know, people are all different.
…the need for any of these qualities has not vanished, it has simply changed appearance. i don’t know what else to say to you other than that you are straight up wrong.
Clearly. the more I read this sub the more I understand why these dudes have issues dating!
[–]Gilmoregirlin 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
Spinster, what are you stuck in the 1950s lol. But you would like that since women had less freedom then and would be more likely to settle for lower quality men like yourself.
Learn something, like what? I never wanted kids so I did not have them. A lot of women do not want children. In fact i his day and age it seems like more men want children than women.
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago* (5 children) | Copy Link
Dude she's a blonde lady with a nice paycheck, she coulda had damn near anyone even without the professional success
So now she's dried up and pissed about it. I wonder if she blames men for it or if she's aware that she put herself in this predicament.
And yes that is what a spinster is. She's a childless woman* beyond the usual age for marriage, so yes
Edit: and fuck no I don't want to control women. They're too much work as it is, plus my life is already complicated. Men aren't monsters, modern women just kind of lowkey suck lmao look dude we let u have ur careers, birth control, child custody courts, the vote for free (no military service), etc. so what I'm saying is this: women can't get mad about this because she got exactly what she asked for.
This is what happens when women get equality the good parts of being male. Both parties can't occupy the same spaces because now there aren't enough jobs to go around, and women really hate dating men who make less than them.
This is exactly why women like the one in the OP exist. She demanded professional equity and ended up childless, probably because the reasons she prioritized a career over relationships may very well overlap with the reasons she effectively deemed all men 'not good enough'.
U can't have both. We've been saying this for a minute, u just can't have both as a woman if ur gonna still expect men to earn as much or more + be as educated if not moreso.
[–]Gilmoregirlin 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
When choosing a father for your child, damn near anyone is not the standard that most women use. LOL again stuck in the 1950s. She Is not pissed about it, and nowhere does it say she blames men. Did you read the article?
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Your rhetoric is fallacious and it sucks
Me expressing that this woman is an idiot and has no one to blame but herself =/= me advocating for a return to genuinely sexist roles. The 70s and 80s had a pretty good idea though.
Just because a man thinks a woman is ridiculous for thinking she could actually play life this way doesn't mean he wants to go back to the 50's, it means he has a brain lol
[–]Gilmoregirlin -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Men think the same way and then they get to their 50s and are shocked that child bearing women don’t want to have a kid with some old dude. But it’s not okay to make fun of people for that, or to take pleasure in someone else’s pain? The 70s and 80s women did not have it pretty good. Men did, not women.
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link
Except they do. Stats say I'm more attractive to women aged 30+ than below.
Women will fuck and marry older men if they're hot and have money. Sometimes they fuck them without the looks or money.
Source: I see women liking older men all the time. 18, 19, 20 year olds like me because I'm 22+ (won't say exactly).
Being tall and aging well helps.
[–]BusinessGarage2606 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Votes formie free? Women grow whole human beings inside of them, feed them and raise them. Of course we deserve rights to vote to decide about the future of our countries.
[–]pearllovespink 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (70 children) | Copy Link
How is it her fault? Do you know what happened in her relationships?
[–]variedpageants 10 points11 points12 points 3 years ago (51 children) | Copy Link
Do you know what happened in her relationships?
I do, actually.
She met an older guy in Italy where she was "studying abroad" - he dumped her when she turned 30. She shacked up with a rich guy in San Francisco for a few years, but he didn't want kids. She also spent her 20s and early 30s getting completely useless degrees (from good schools though).
She finally got a real degree and started a real career and then she thought, "whoa! Can't put this on pause for a family now!!" so, she wrote on her blog about how the egg freezing thing was awesome because it meant she was strong and independent and didn't need no man.
Bloomberg did a cover story about her <--- I'm not joking. That's her.
Anyway, she eventually did get pregnant with some other woman's eggs so ... happy ending??
[–]THHBHStT 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
LMAOOOO
Nah I feel bad for her and this is fucked up but yeah she highkey did this to herself
[–]pearllovespink 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (49 children) | Copy Link
Useless degrees aside, she did everything she was supposed to do. Her situation is just an unlucky one.
[–]variedpageants 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (48 children) | Copy Link
she did everything she was supposed to do.
I want to be clear that I'm not, nor would I ever, tell a woman what she's "supposed to do" - it's her life and if she wants to have kids or not, that's her business, not mine.
I only comment on it when a woman complains. I have a similar view of finances. I'm not telling people that they're "supposed to" save and invest. If you choose not to invest, that's your business.
But if you get to retirement age and go, "omg I don't have money!!" then that's when I do have something to say. You don't have money because you made bad choices. It's not that you're supposed to make better choices. You can do what you like. But your situation now is a consequence of the choices you made years ago.
Same with her. She made choices that resulted in her ending up barren.
This woman went to an elite prep school. Don't tell me she didn't have the opportunity to get married in her 20s when she was still fertile.
This woman did nothing meaningful, career-wise until she was 33, when she got an MBA. Before that, she got degrees (plural) in art and did nothing substantial. She could have married, had kids, and raised them until they started school, and still had the same trajectory in her 30s. Literally no difference at all to her career.
She chose not to. And that's fine with me. But let's not pretend this was done *to* her.
[–]pearllovespink -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (47 children) | Copy Link
She made choices but they weren’t “bad” choices at all. There’s nothing wrong with focusing on your career and education in your 20’s. That’s what you’re supposed to do. Just because you deem her degrees as useless doesn’t mean she wasn’t trying to thrive and have a successful career. No one goes to college planning to be a failure when they graduate.
[–]variedpageants 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (46 children) | Copy Link
they weren’t “bad” choices at all.
It they lead you to a place you don't want to be, that is by definition, "bad choices"
Doesn't even matter if it's an accident. You could be lost in the woods and think to yourself, "I should go North - that's how I get out of this jungle." Then it turns out that was the wrong way to go - you made a bad choice.
[–]pearllovespink 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (45 children) | Copy Link
I disagree. She might not have the family unit she dreamed of but other areas of her life could be going just fine. You do realize that marriage is out of the control of women? We can’t make someone marry us. I’m sure she wanted commitment and then a child like most people. That is totally out of her control. She can only dictate things that are in her control like education and her career. Men don’t understand that part of the equation and I’m not sure why.
[–]variedpageants 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (44 children) | Copy Link
marriage is out of the control of women?
This is like saying, "I can't control whether or not I get a job."
It's technically true in the sense that I need a company to hire me. However, if you observe me making bad decisions that reduce the likelihood that a company will hire me, you are justified in calling those "bad decisions."
She can only dictate things that are in her control like education and her career.
That's not true at all.
She could make marriage and family a priority. Should could date with that purpose in mind - which would mean only dating men with a similar immediate goal.
Your excuses aren't working here.
[–][deleted] 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (17 children) | Copy Link
She could've dated basically any decent man given her looks alone. Because that's how men are. But she chose not to. Having a career only made her a more attractive candidate to other men, but those same men probably became outright unappealing to her as she scaled the corporate ladder.
Honestly dude most women have no problems getting men. Attractive women have it the easiest. If a woman like her goes single her entire life despite claiming to want a beau & co., she's probably being way too picky.
[–]pearllovespink -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link
Relationships end all the time for numerous reasons. You don’t know happened through out her lifetime.
[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (15 children) | Copy Link
Dude I'm pretty fucken sure I know what happened lol
https://youtu.be/sP2tUW0HDHA?t=45
this, minus Trevor
[–]pearllovespink -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (14 children) | Copy Link
Someone just posted her dating history. It sounds to me like she just became unlucky. Her story is not unfamiliar. A lot of women go through it. You just don’t hear about it because they aren’t dropping 20k to freeze their eggs and making it public.
[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link
A world of 4 billion men and not a single suitor. Yeah, okay. Sounds like a them problem.
[–]pearllovespink 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link
How is it a them problem when she was in multiple long term relationships? They just didn’t work out.
[–]throwaway1937411 points 3 years ago [recovered] (11 children) | Copy Link
Because she's a stupid fucking cunt who couldn't figure out that having a pussy = everyone wants to fuck you
Jesus fucking christ when the person who has 94948389202 options can't pick one, it's because they're judgemental cunts, not because they couldn't find anyone.
I know women who have rejected perfectly good men for the stupidest fucking reasons. They tried asking abt a test in uni they both had (sexist). They tried talking abt smth they rly liked (mansplaining). They 'mansplained' about class (when the guy had a 3.88 GPA).
Women suck, all they have to offer is pussy. That's it. If they had more to offer then history would have more to say about them.
[–]OrdinaryFarmerBurgundy Pill Man 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Anything less than an absolutely perfect chad JUS AINT WURF IT!
[–]LupeDyCazari 12 points13 points14 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
this chick looks like she's 50, bruh, lmao. That said, why do these kids worry so much about what women are doing? Worry about completing your god of war raganarok platinium run or something.
[–]learn2earn89 10 points11 points12 points 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
My neighbor tried to have kids for years in her 20s and 30s. She ended up having a kid at 45. This isn’t to say that all 45 year olds can have kids. Just that anything can happen for good or for worse.
[–]Gilmoregirlin 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Same with my high school friend. She tried forever in her 20s and 30s in vitro over and over again and then a 43 got pregnant and had a baby boy at 45 the same thing. This is not the norm but it happens.
[–]learn2earn89 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
I hear it’s also because toward the end of your menstrual cycle (late 30s to menopause) you’re more likely to release multiple eggs each time you ovulate.
[–]Gilmoregirlin 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Interesting I had not heard that before. Nonetheless it was lovely to see after all those years of trying.
[–]BKLD12 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
That’s likely why my sister and I (fraternal twins) exist. Mom had us in her late 30s. We’re not even the youngest.
[–]slashd 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
They failed for like 20 years??
[–]learn2earn89 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
She had a kid in her late twenties and kept trying to have one right after all the way into her late 30s. Out of nowhere she ended up pregnant at 45.
Anything can happen, that's why you are supposed to start rolling the dices early.
Starting late is not a working method, it's how you increase your chances to fail.
[–]Willow-girlReusable Hag 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Had she already completed menopause at 45? That would be a bit unusual, although not unheard-of.
I got my last IUD at age 46 ... I wasn't taking any chances!
My mom was 43 when she had my youngest sister. My parents are broke Catholics, so I’m certain no fertility treatments were involved. I’m not actually sure if she was even planned. Mom got a hysterectomy after.
It’s not as hard to get pregnant in one’s 40s as most people seem to think. Yes, it’s easier in your 20s and 30s, and I believe that you’re more prone to miscarriage at that point, but it’s not impossible.
[–]Flightlessbirbz 9 points10 points11 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
What’s the problem here? I’m sure she was told the odds of it working when she froze her eggs, and if not, that’s on whoever falsely advertised the procedure. It’s sad but a risk that these women chose to take. And ultimately better than having a kid you don’t really want yet or with Mr. Wrong just because you’re worried about not being able to later. You know how many parents regret having kids? A lot. They just don’t talk about it publicly because it sounds bad.
And most importantly, why would you care? I don’t believe you’re genuinely concerned about this woman’s happiness. Men who complain about this kind of stuff are just mad that not all women want to make their existence all about caring for a mediocre man and carrying on his genetics.
[–]TermAggravating8043 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (32 children) | Copy Link
What’s the problem here?
[–]gobble6gobble9 11 points12 points13 points 3 years ago (31 children) | Copy Link
She can’t have bio children.
[+]TermAggravating8043 -8 points-7 points-6 points 3 years ago (30 children) | Copy Link
Well she can? She unfroze her eggs and got a sperm donor so presumably she’s now expecting?
[–]northernlights190 21 points22 points23 points 3 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
She has at least one kid now, yeah. (This story is from 2018). The eggs she froze didn’t work out, because the clinics that freeze them often oversell the efficacy rates of freezing, but she went on to get pregnant with a donor egg + donor sperm and IVF.
https://nationalpost.com/news/world/i-was-sad-i-was-angry-i-was-ashamed-inside-the-struggle-to-conceive-with-frozen-eggs
[–]TermAggravating8043 11 points12 points13 points 3 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link
Ah that’s a shame but good for her not letting it stop her being a mother
[–]WestCombSplit 9 points10 points11 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
her being a surrogate mother
[–]TermAggravating8043 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
No she’s still the kids parent unless I missed something?
[–]WestCombSplit 9 points10 points11 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
It's not her eggs or her sperm. She's not a biological mother. She's still the parent, just not the kind of parent she wanted to be. She basically adopted the baby before it was conceived and chose to be the surrogate
[–]TermAggravating8043 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
It takes more than eggs to be a mother
[–]TheRedPillRipperAn open mind opens doors. 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
stop her being a mother
There’s no issue with how she becomes a mother. The question is whether she has the right supports for the child. e.g. two-parent household, a village etc.. Otherwise she’s made a very selfish choice.
[–]TermAggravating8043 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
If she can afford to freeze her eggs, and buy both sperm and egg she can probably afford everything a child needs to grow up
[–]TheRedPillRipperAn open mind opens doors. 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
everything a child needs
Is ideally a family. Totally agree financial factors are important, but you can’t put a price on filial support.
[–]TermAggravating8043 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Agreed but that doesn’t also just mean a father, there could be grandparents, aunties, uncles etc all there ready to help raise the children
[–]Connect-Industry-702 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
You do realize that plenty of people grow up without fathers despite being conceived the traditional way right??
Also, people get divorced and co parent children which isn’t ideal either.
Broken homes are not the ideal situation, however millions of people raise children that way. People have accidental babies they don’t want all the time.
Yet, you’re harping on the fact that this woman is single??? She planned her baby and has the finances to support it. She might even have familial support.
Make an argument that makes sense if you’re going to comment.
[–]TheRedPillRipperAn open mind opens doors. 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
broken homes are not the ideal situation
That’s all my argument was. Not blaming her. Not deriding her. Just said it’s a selfish decision, if she doesn’t have appropriate support in place.
Make an argument that makes sense
ALL children need both a mother, and father. Pretty sure we can agree on that. Anything less, is suboptimal.
[–]BiodegradableOffense 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Bitches literally cannot read an article with important parts highlighted
[–]TermAggravating8043 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Articles that only show you the important parts of you click on them, but I’ll admit I was lazy and still confused as to why this is an issue for women
[–]gobble6gobble9 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link
She got an egg donor. It’s a different process.
[–]TermAggravating8043 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link
Still don’t understand why this is a problem for women, she bought someone else’s egg and sperm and now has kids? What’s the problem here?
[–]gobble6gobble9 9 points10 points11 points 3 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link
Some people might want their own biological children. That appears to have been important to her because she spent $19,000 on freezing her eggs. You don’t have to understand for yourself, but can you understand some people have priorities that you do not share but are no less valid than your own? Not everyone has 10,000 dollars to throw like you do.
[–]TermAggravating8043 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
It was important to her to be pregnant and have children, not necessarily for them to be biologically hers. She worked within her means
[–]gobble6gobble9 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
Ok. I guess $19,000 is not a lot of money to you. It is to me.
[–]TermAggravating8043 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
It’s a lot of money for many people, but that’s not the issue here. She paid for it herself, it failed which is a horrible shame so she found another way to get what she wanted. Problem solved
[–]gobble6gobble9 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
She did not solve the problem of having her own biological children.
[–]THHBHStT -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
She very obviously wanted her own children but settled w raising someone else’s. I feel like you understand this but are being purposefully obtuse
She could’ve did the donar egg and donar sperm to begin with and not had frozen her eggs for an expensive amount of money and been depressed when it didn’t work out
[–]UpbeatInsurance5358 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
It isn't, it's just another "make sure your realise making babies is your main calling, ladies" pile of shit.
[–]ManzBearzPigzIzRealz 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Did you read the whole thing?
[–]Cult_of_ChadSex Master 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Her embryos failed.
[–]cast-away-ramadi06 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
It's the hubris for me. I feel bad that she wasn't smart enough to discern fact from fiction and I feel bad that she's in this predicament. But it really is a problem of her own creation. I do hope she's ok though.
[–]anonymous-platypus1 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Why is it hubris? I think it super responsible to put off having kids until you’re ready, that way you don’t resent them for drastically changing your life later on.
Women have a shitty lot with fertility.
Have kids young and not have money, resources or time to do anything else. Even if they are married, taking care of a person that’s solely dependent on you who can’t work at all, is hard and expensive.
Or have kids young and be pushed out of any careers or education because you can’t afford the huge expenses of child care.
Or try to have kids when you’re older and maybe be unable too.
Personally, I feel that people that truly want to be parents should adopt and not see it as a lesser option. Either you want to be parent, truly and selflessly, or you want a kid as a status symbol for your life.
[–]cast-away-ramadi06 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
My experience has been most of the women who have never been married by 30-35 have issues that they're too arrogant to identify, primarily that they handle conflict extremely poorly. I'm sure my male peers have similiar issues, probably most commonly that they don't want to settle down if they're sexually successful or they've given up if they're not sexually successful.
This has historically been the norm and it probably will be for couples who lack the skills to make enough to offset the cost of child care. It's entirely possible to make it work if folks watch their expenses and one of the spouses makes near average. I saw a lot of Sgts in the Marines who were able to make it work with a SAHS, provided they were very disciplined and very frugal.
I think the real issue is people not willing/able to make effective decisions and prioritization. Too often, my peers prioritized having fun in their 20s and by the time we reached our early 30s, they don't have much to show for it. That could be career and/or family.
[–]anonymous-platypus1 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
I think the military spouses are a different situation. They don’t have to pay for food if they live on base, at least for one person. They can get BHA pay, and other benefits that most people don’t have.
Like having a tax free way of buying things like gas and groceries is a huge way to save. Plus having access to cheaper childcare programs and get discounts.
For the non-military family it’s exponentially harder. For instance, the average US salary is 40K. I think on average it costs about 17k a year to raise a baby.
Add on the fact that there is also an adult dependent, who doesn’t work…yeah, most average people in the US cannot afford to support a family off of the average income.
And I think trying to perpetuate the fantasy ideal life is what’s driving up divorce rates. The breadwinner gets jaded and discouraged and angry because he is doing his role, working and providing and it’s not enough.
While the woman is usually working hard trying to make what they have work, and is frustrated because she isn’t in a position to fix it, and her spouse probably shows his frustration at their situation.
[–]cast-away-ramadi06 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
And I think trying to perpetuate the fantasy ideal life is what’s driving up divorce rates
Absolutely!
I think the military spouses are a different situation.
You either don't get BAH for on-base housing or, if it's contract housing, BAH pays for housing. You also don't get free food if you're married - that's what the commissary is for. As an E5, you're pulling down between 36-42k. Not having to pay for housing and medical are the biggest impact. It's entirely possible to support a SAHS with 2 kids on that salary in Jacksonville provided you make good financial decisions like not wasting money on expensive clothes & electronics.The biggest problem I saw was when people had to have an expensive cell and tv, designer clothes, the infamous Dodge Charger at 24% APY, etc. It's when people piss their money away chasing after those things, going into debt pissing the money away, or wanting to piss it away but one spouse stops it ... those are the situations I saw where the fantasy life you mentioned earlier causes problems.
You know someone just graduated tech school when they pull up in a charger or a mustang. It’s like a rite of passage
[–]justforlulz12345Jester Pill 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Oh no, her eggs failed. How will she make omelette now. No more protein for her.
[–]1Here4BachFriendly Misandrist 13 points14 points15 points 3 years ago (23 children) | Copy Link
Even if every woman got married at 20, you still wouldn’t be able to get one.
[–]noonereadsthisstuff 13 points14 points15 points 3 years ago (15 children) | Copy Link
I think its more that freezing embryos is not as reliable as people think. Its very hit & miss.
[–]1Here4BachFriendly Misandrist 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
She probably knew that when she froze them.
[–]THHBHStT 18 points19 points20 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Many women have no idea how their fertility works or are just willfully ignorant
Many understand it gets harder but many don’t understand how exponentially difficult it gets
[–]JosieSandiePurple Pill Woman 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
If you think that’s bad you should see what men believe about fertility.
[–]THHBHStT -2 points-1 points0 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yeah I don’t really expect men to know a lot about womens anatomy.
[–]Gilmoregirlin 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Of course she did and she made that choice and took that risk. But its still better than getting pregnant by some man she did not want to be with or who would have made a horrible Father and I bet if she had the choice to make again she would do the same thing.
[–]noonereadsthisstuff 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
She might have done but I don't think its common knowledge.
[–]RIPGeorgeHarrison 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
And that’s why she reacted calmly and certainly didn’t lose her shit when it didn’t work out?
[–]JosieSandiePurple Pill Woman 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
Is there an epidemic of normal women doing this while single?
[–]noonereadsthisstuff 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
I think its becoming more common.
[–]JosieSandiePurple Pill Woman 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
It’s not enough to write home about
[–]noonereadsthisstuff 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
https://www.bbc.com/worklife/article/20220816-the-sharp-rise-in-egg-freezing
Its becoming more popular and I've heard it before that its not as reliable as people think.
[–]JosieSandiePurple Pill Woman 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Ppl need to realize an increase from a little is still a little
[–]noonereadsthisstuff 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Some data suggests that in the US, egg freezing retrievals increased by 39% from pre-pandemic levels, and in the UK, enquiries rose by as much as 50% in the summer of 2020, compared to the prior year.
A rise is a rise. And that's a huge rise.
But I'm just saying that people need to realise that its not as reliable as people think. Its not the golden miracle for career women that its made out to be.
The procedure of egg-freezing is an increasingly popular, but expensive, option for women who want to delay childbirth. But new research documents some caveats: how old a woman is when she freezes her eggs and how many eggs she freezes make a significant difference in whether she will have a baby. Most women who tried to become pregnant, the study found, did not succeed, often because they had waited until they were too old to freeze eggs and had not frozen enough of them.
I don’t think anyone doing it thinks it’s a golden miracle.
[–]noonereadsthisstuff 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Isn't that what the woman in the story was saying? "Freeze your eggs and free your career"
[–]lulll 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
will you marry me
[–]jmoincali1 points 3 years ago [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link
Cus it shows the entitlement of these women where they think they can just 'find a man' to marry and have kids when they feel like it. They got humbled because they didn't realize they only got that attention cus they were young and pretty
[–]northernlights190 16 points17 points18 points 3 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link
Of the four women interviewed in the story, two of them did find a man to marry and have kids when they felt like it. And all four did go on to get pregnant and have kids. Not getting everything you want in life isn’t the worst thing that can happen; overall sounds like things turned out pretty good for all of them.
[–]Poisongirl5No Pill 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Noooo! We’re here to rejoice and revel in specific women’s pain!
[–]Leethefairy 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I think she also wanted to have an exciting fulfilling career and that's very hard to do while being pregnant and raising children. I think it's quite difficult for many women to make these choices about what their priorities are.
[–]1Here4BachFriendly Misandrist 13 points14 points15 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
How is this entitlement? Point to the entitlement. It sounds like she worked for everything she has and she’s not demanding that a man must inseminate her eggs. You all just hate that women dare choose more than one path in life.
[–]justforlulz12345Jester Pill 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Why are you so obsessed?
They got the consequences of their actions, good for them. Worry about your own problems first. Your perfect waifu isn't going to emerge in your basement.
[–]Connect-Industry-702 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
A lot of employers actually cover the cost of freezing your eggs.
So how is this post a bad thing? Sounds like she had the children she wanted in the long run.
[–]Purple-Following-422 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Who said it's a bad thing? It's quite hilarious actually.
[–]wutaab 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
how long can you freeze some food untill it goes bad regardless. I would not want make a human person like that. Waht a stupid idea.
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You know its been heavily scrutinised so it's safe, right?
[–]BKLD12 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Last October, the birth of twins from 27 year old frozen embryos was announced in the news. I’m not sure how long an egg, sperm, or embryo can stay frozen and still be viable, but apparently at least that long.
[–]virgilhall 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Do not let the cryonics industry hear that
[–]JosieSandiePurple Pill Woman 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
This is such a typical female human 🙄
Not.
[–]Ok-Throat-80451 points 3 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link
This truly is just an incel sub, huh
[–]lawn-mumps 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Each day we stray further from God’s light. /s
Seriously though I joined this sun for new perspectives and each new one is “women bad”, “men are being manipulated/led on”, etc. I’m starting to think it’s not worth it, especially the misogynist memes. (Yes, awaiting downvotes, captain)
[–]DeepfakeGretaThnberg 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
she remembers screaming like a wild animal, throwing books, papers, her laptop -- and collapsing to the ground
point and laugh at the genetic dead end
[–]anonymous-platypus1 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
So we can make fun of virgins now or we can’t?
[–]iwasneverherehaha 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You cant halt biology, 45 is to old.
[–]ashleyrose56Pink Pill Woman 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link
Women are pushing maternity way too far out of our biology for the sake of keeping a career. Ideal ages imo are 26-32.
[–]CaptainObvious4000 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
Being a corporate slave is far more important than raising a family, clearly.
[–]ashleyrose56Pink Pill Woman 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
And then they spend the money they sacrificed their youth to make in various rounds of failed fertility treatments 🤡
[–]DisastrouslyMessy -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
Or being financially stable on your own so that you can feed your child is clearly more important. This board has made the point over and over again that women shouldn't rely solely on men to provide for their children or themselves. Statistics also point to this - the poorest demographic in the U.S. are single mothers. Don't get mad that women actually listen to this and decide to ensure their own financial security for themselves and any children they may have.
[–]CaptainObvious4000 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
You can get a job and earn some coin before your eggs dry out.
[–]DisastrouslyMessy -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Peak earnings for women are at around age 39. In order to get there, you have to work and can't time off for having a baby. So, what are women supposed to do? Have a kid and the two of them live in poverty?
[–]CaptainObvious4000 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Oh BS. All the senior women at my job have kids. Just more excuses.
[–]DisastrouslyMessy 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Do they have husbands? Do the fathers financially contribute? The statistics (backed by men on this board) clearly show that single women live in poverty and should not rely on men to financially contribute to their child's well-being.
Making sure one is financially stable is not an "excuse." I'm explaining to you why some women choose to wait. Believe it or not, no woman needs to justify themselves to you. Their choices are valid. We can not rely on men, so we do it ourselves. Why are you angry about that?
[–]CaptainObvious4000 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
They have husbands. They chose well.
[–]DisastrouslyMessy 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Uh-huh.
[–]ashleyrose56Pink Pill Woman 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You can be financially stable way before 35. If you have to wait so long, there's some other issues going on. And young single mothers who are not widowed... most of them made bad choices by letting a waste of space impregnate them. If you wait too long, all your "financial stability" is going to be destroyed by fertility treatments (which most of them fail).
[–]lawn-mumps 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
imo
A doctor in this sub? That’s awesome! Tell us more about your experiences?!
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Ideal age is 20 year old.
30 year old is too late for many women. It's okay if you are lucky, it's not if you are unlucky.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_and_female_fertility
https://www.babycenter.com.au/a6155/your-age-and-fertility
Fertility starts to decline after 27. The ideal age is younger than what I stated, hence why the in my opinion. Within the range 26-32, you should have graduated from college and graduate school with some years of work experience under your belt.
Unless you plan on getting into a career that requires more years than average, you should be financially stable way before 35. In that scenario, women should choose a reliable and financially stable partner to have kids with while still young.
[–]houstongradengineer -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
She knew she had a chance at failure. I'm sure this s sad.
Not as sad as marrying some POS man child or giving up on her career, and she knows this, so that's a win.
Cocky? Jeez, what an odd thing to say. Like she can't use science to try something? And like you think you know better than her that she should have taken a different sort of risk with her life? Bruh, there are literally women who are born sterile and those women can adopt if they are so lucky. There's more to life than DNA for some people. If you are ever a parent in any kind of way, I hope you can grow to realize that.
[–]nothatyoucare 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
oh look who's back.
[–]Saelaird 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Oh, the hubris.
[–]warramite 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
I mean.. if you want kids having em in your early 20s is the ideal.. this is simply the price of being independent
[–]JosieSandie1 points 3 years ago [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link
My ideal age is 36 bc that’s how I got the best baby
[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Nice, according to the losers on this sub your situation is impossible.
[–]warramite 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Its about numbers my friend, older women more likely to give birth to a child with defects. Its basic biology
Same for older men, but nobody shits on men for having kids later in life.
It's also the case with old fathers but for some reason men here forget about this part.
[–]localmicrodosechamp -3 points-2 points-1 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
men are fucking sick in the head
[–]Bubbly_Taro 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Why?
[–]localmicrodosechamp -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
this post
[–]MOProG2 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
This is all a result of late capitalism. When becoming a cog in the capitalist machine is more important than family building.
We are heading to a post human future
[–]glitch83 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Sooo extinction?
[–]MOProG2 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Voluntary depopulation at the very least via reduced birth rates. Wholesale replacement in 500 years (or evolution with machines). When the machines can do everything and AI accumulates resources at the top of society, we'll see less people on earth overall.
Just a hypothesis thinking about the current trajectory of income inequality.
[–]gobble6gobble9 -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
That is depressing. I wonder if she can sue. Anecdotally, I have heard of other women having issues with freezing their eggs.
[–]Fearless_Method_1682LVM solidarity squad 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
I've heard that it's a borderline scam.
[–]cast-away-ramadi06 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
This is my understanding as well. It works for a suprising small percent of the time (as in nowhere near 80).
[–]Fearless_Method_1682LVM solidarity squad 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
It's very expensive too. It's a fucked up trick to pull on someone.
[–]cast-away-ramadi06 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Caveat emptor, time waits for no one, etc
I feel like these younger GenX and millennial women are starting to find out they've been lied to. I hope things turn out better for GenZ.
That’s what I heard, too. I wonder how honest the company actually was with her.
[–]Monkebizniss -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
If your response to a woman failing to have kids is “Yeah, take that, feminist bitch!” then you seriously need to go outside and touch grass.
[–]RandomAttackHelpMe -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
To paraphrase Jackie Treehorn,”Interactive high tech reproduction dude,wave of the future!”
[–]lady_ven0m -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
The average woman isn’t trying to put off having their first kid until 45, so this isn’t even relevant. This is just a rare and tragic case.
Also, there are plenty of really young women having kids, but doing it out of wedlock or ending up single, and you all hate on them too.
[–]MeasurementOk790 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I think the average woman is waiting for her 30’s when her reproductive “quality” (for a lack of a better term) starts declining. But you’re dammed if you do and dammed if you don’t. Women can’t win 😅
[–]lady_ven0m 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I think most women do wait to be more financially stable, and that generally does happen during late 20’s and early to mid 30’s. I personally didn’t wait for those reasons, but my ex-husband did want to wait so I respected that.
[–]MattPayneWrestler -2 points-1 points0 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Oof!
[–]Final_Philosopher663 -2 points-1 points0 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
It is really sad to see such situations, that's why when I talk with friends I try to make the point that freezing the eggs is the "last resort" and not a plan.
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[–]_here_ok 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link
In all honesty for me personally, if a person doesn't want or wants something don't go through irreversible means. It's gonna really bite if you change your mind.
Also get as much education as possible when it comes to these things, some forms of contraception are generally less known then others and that can lead to poor decision making.
[–]gate18No Pill 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Haha! Why are you talking about all "sisters"? The article talks about one, Brigitte Adams.
[–]lvlupkitten✨ecstasy pill✨ 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Thank god I'm never having kids lmfao
[–]vollyvenus 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
this is so sad. infertility can happen to anyone and is always a tough blow
[–]Purple-Following-422 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Not really she isn't entitled to having biological children.
[–]vollyvenus 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
same with everyone
[–]SteakhouseBlues 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
That five head…
[–]Moon-on-my-mind 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I'm recently thinking of donating all eggs if possible..i don't need them,. I'm child free by choice. Once those little bastard are out maybe I'd get less anxious about accidentally getting pregnant. Should start looking around for clinics that accept 34 yo eggs. Good family health history, nice pretty genes, done well in academics, quite the talented artists in my immediate family...why the hell not, if it helps anyone out there, good by me.
Also, people really need to stop being afraid of adoption. Those lil kids have tons of love to give. It's also an incredibly beautiful gesture to adopt. You give an innocent lost soul the opportunity to have a loving family and a good life.
Genes and blood do not make you family. Women that panic like this need to realize it. Love and bonding comes even without those two ingredients.
[–]Lexaprofessional1998Blue Pill Woman 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
The science will get better, that sucks for her though
[–]Decent-Zombie-5513 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Is her mediocre career going to offset the loss in productivity of the 3 people she should have made 15 years earlier? Very unlikely.
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[–]Anti_ThingChristpilled 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
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[–]funnystorPills are for addicts 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]cara-melada -2 points-1 points0 points (8 children) | Copy Link
[–]KikiYuyuPurple Pill Woman 12 points13 points14 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]armpitpics 8 points9 points10 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]MiniMouse8 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]KikiYuyuPurple Pill Woman 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 14 points15 points16 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]pearllovespink 6 points7 points8 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]MiniMouse8 -1 points0 points1 point (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]pearllovespink 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]_here_ok 0 points1 point2 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 1 point2 points3 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]funnystorPills are for addicts 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]_here_ok 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 0 points1 point2 points (8 children) | Copy Link
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 0 points1 point2 points (7 children) | Copy Link
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 0 points1 point2 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 0 points1 point2 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 0 points1 point2 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 0 points1 point2 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]howdoiw0rkthisthingsugar-pilled 19 points20 points21 points (27 children) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 4 points5 points6 points (16 children) | Copy Link
[–]howdoiw0rkthisthingsugar-pilled 9 points10 points11 points (15 children) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 8 points9 points10 points (14 children) | Copy Link
[–]howdoiw0rkthisthingsugar-pilled 1 point2 points3 points (13 children) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 3 points4 points5 points (12 children) | Copy Link
[–]howdoiw0rkthisthingsugar-pilled -1 points0 points1 point (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 2 points3 points4 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]howdoiw0rkthisthingsugar-pilled 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]phuck_polyeV 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 -1 points0 points1 point (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]decoy88Men and Women are similar 0 points1 point2 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 1 point2 points3 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]decoy88Men and Women are similar 1 point2 points3 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin 0 points1 point2 points (9 children) | Copy Link
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points (8 children) | Copy Link
[–]cshal420 1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin 0 points1 point2 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin 0 points1 point2 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]cshal420 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Stunning-Potato-1984No Pill 31 points32 points33 points (22 children) | Copy Link
[–]WYenginerdWYpro-woman pill. enjoys shitting on anti-feminists 17 points18 points19 points (9 children) | Copy Link
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 5 points6 points7 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]WYenginerdWYpro-woman pill. enjoys shitting on anti-feminists 5 points6 points7 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Street_Fuel_7751 2 points3 points4 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–]Stunning-Potato-1984No Pill 11 points12 points13 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]WYenginerdWYpro-woman pill. enjoys shitting on anti-feminists 3 points4 points5 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]Street_Fuel_7751 -1 points0 points1 point (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]CLyD3_H3ffalump 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]Street_Fuel_7751 -1 points0 points1 point (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]CLyD3_H3ffalump -1 points0 points1 point (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points (11 children) | Copy Link
[–]Stunning-Potato-1984No Pill 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]cshal420 0 points1 point2 points (9 children) | Copy Link
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points (8 children) | Copy Link
[–]cshal420 0 points1 point2 points (7 children) | Copy Link
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–]cshal420 0 points1 point2 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]cshal420 0 points1 point2 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]Whisperinthelair 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]nothatyoucare 25 points26 points27 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]oneblackcoffeeplease 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 23 points24 points25 points (24 children) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 14 points15 points16 points (20 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gakeon 10 points11 points12 points (11 children) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 5 points6 points7 points (10 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gakeon 4 points5 points6 points (9 children) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 4 points5 points6 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gakeon 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 2 points3 points4 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Gakeon 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Important-Stomach474 0 points1 point2 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gakeon 0 points1 point2 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]Important-Stomach474 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gakeon 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Important-Stomach474 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points (7 children) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 4 points5 points6 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 8 points9 points10 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 0 points1 point2 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 7 points8 points9 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]phuck_polyeV 1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]OpeningInner483 -1 points0 points1 point (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]phuck_polyeV 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Submersiv 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]hear4comments 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]34lockdown 27 points28 points29 points (95 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 17 points18 points19 points (94 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin 6 points7 points8 points (21 children) | Copy Link
[–]variedpageants 11 points12 points13 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin 6 points7 points8 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]variedpageants 4 points5 points6 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin -1 points0 points1 point (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]variedpageants 2 points3 points4 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points (14 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 7 points8 points9 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 9 points10 points11 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]PizzashillsmomSelf Made Pill 4 points5 points6 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]litanyagainsttears1 points [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]PizzashillsmomSelf Made Pill 3 points4 points5 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin 4 points5 points6 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin 2 points3 points4 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin -1 points0 points1 point (1 child) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]BusinessGarage2606 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]pearllovespink 2 points3 points4 points (70 children) | Copy Link
[–]variedpageants 10 points11 points12 points (51 children) | Copy Link
[–]THHBHStT 4 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]pearllovespink 0 points1 point2 points (49 children) | Copy Link
[–]variedpageants 2 points3 points4 points (48 children) | Copy Link
[–]pearllovespink -1 points0 points1 point (47 children) | Copy Link
[–]variedpageants 4 points5 points6 points (46 children) | Copy Link
[–]pearllovespink 0 points1 point2 points (45 children) | Copy Link
[–]variedpageants 1 point2 points3 points (44 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 7 points8 points9 points (17 children) | Copy Link
[–]pearllovespink -1 points0 points1 point (16 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points (15 children) | Copy Link
[–]pearllovespink -1 points0 points1 point (14 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points (13 children) | Copy Link
[–]pearllovespink 0 points1 point2 points (12 children) | Copy Link
[–]throwaway1937411 points [recovered] (11 children) | Copy Link
[–]OrdinaryFarmerBurgundy Pill Man 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]LupeDyCazari 12 points13 points14 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]learn2earn89 10 points11 points12 points (7 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin 3 points4 points5 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]learn2earn89 5 points6 points7 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]BKLD12 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]slashd 1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]learn2earn89 4 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Willow-girlReusable Hag 3 points4 points5 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]BKLD12 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Flightlessbirbz 9 points10 points11 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]TermAggravating8043 8 points9 points10 points (32 children) | Copy Link
[–]gobble6gobble9 11 points12 points13 points (31 children) | Copy Link
[+]TermAggravating8043 -8 points-7 points-6 points (30 children) | Copy Link
[–]northernlights190 21 points22 points23 points (11 children) | Copy Link
[–]TermAggravating8043 11 points12 points13 points (10 children) | Copy Link
[–]WestCombSplit 9 points10 points11 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]TermAggravating8043 3 points4 points5 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]WestCombSplit 9 points10 points11 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]TermAggravating8043 6 points7 points8 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]TheRedPillRipperAn open mind opens doors. 0 points1 point2 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]TermAggravating8043 7 points8 points9 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]TheRedPillRipperAn open mind opens doors. 3 points4 points5 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]TermAggravating8043 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Connect-Industry-702 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]TheRedPillRipperAn open mind opens doors. 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]BiodegradableOffense 8 points9 points10 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]TermAggravating8043 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]gobble6gobble9 6 points7 points8 points (13 children) | Copy Link
[–]TermAggravating8043 5 points6 points7 points (12 children) | Copy Link
[–]gobble6gobble9 9 points10 points11 points (10 children) | Copy Link
[–]TermAggravating8043 0 points1 point2 points (9 children) | Copy Link
[–]gobble6gobble9 6 points7 points8 points (8 children) | Copy Link
[–]TermAggravating8043 4 points5 points6 points (7 children) | Copy Link
[–]gobble6gobble9 2 points3 points4 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]THHBHStT -1 points0 points1 point (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]UpbeatInsurance5358 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]ManzBearzPigzIzRealz 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Cult_of_ChadSex Master 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]cast-away-ramadi06 3 points4 points5 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]anonymous-platypus1 2 points3 points4 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]cast-away-ramadi06 0 points1 point2 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]anonymous-platypus1 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]cast-away-ramadi06 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]anonymous-platypus1 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]justforlulz12345Jester Pill 6 points7 points8 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]1Here4BachFriendly Misandrist 13 points14 points15 points (23 children) | Copy Link
[–]noonereadsthisstuff 13 points14 points15 points (15 children) | Copy Link
[–]1Here4BachFriendly Misandrist 4 points5 points6 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–]THHBHStT 18 points19 points20 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]JosieSandiePurple Pill Woman 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]THHBHStT -2 points-1 points0 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Gilmoregirlin 6 points7 points8 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]noonereadsthisstuff 7 points8 points9 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]RIPGeorgeHarrison 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]JosieSandiePurple Pill Woman 0 points1 point2 points (7 children) | Copy Link
[–]noonereadsthisstuff 0 points1 point2 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–]JosieSandiePurple Pill Woman 1 point2 points3 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]noonereadsthisstuff 0 points1 point2 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]JosieSandiePurple Pill Woman 0 points1 point2 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]noonereadsthisstuff 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]JosieSandiePurple Pill Woman 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]noonereadsthisstuff 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]lulll 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]jmoincali1 points [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]northernlights190 16 points17 points18 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Poisongirl5No Pill 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Leethefairy 6 points7 points8 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]1Here4BachFriendly Misandrist 13 points14 points15 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]justforlulz12345Jester Pill 7 points8 points9 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Connect-Industry-702 1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Purple-Following-422 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]wutaab 3 points4 points5 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken 5 points6 points7 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]BKLD12 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]virgilhall 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]JosieSandiePurple Pill Woman 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Ok-Throat-80451 points [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]lawn-mumps 5 points6 points7 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]DeepfakeGretaThnberg 1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]anonymous-platypus1 5 points6 points7 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]iwasneverherehaha 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]ashleyrose56Pink Pill Woman 1 point2 points3 points (13 children) | Copy Link
[–]CaptainObvious4000 7 points8 points9 points (9 children) | Copy Link
[–]ashleyrose56Pink Pill Woman 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]DisastrouslyMessy -1 points0 points1 point (7 children) | Copy Link
[–]CaptainObvious4000 0 points1 point2 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]DisastrouslyMessy -1 points0 points1 point (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]CaptainObvious4000 1 point2 points3 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]DisastrouslyMessy 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]CaptainObvious4000 1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]DisastrouslyMessy 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]ashleyrose56Pink Pill Woman 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]lawn-mumps 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]DrBobyRed Pill dad 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]ashleyrose56Pink Pill Woman 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]houstongradengineer -1 points0 points1 point (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]nothatyoucare 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Saelaird 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]warramite 1 point2 points3 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–]JosieSandie1 points [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]warramite 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]BKLD12 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]BusinessGarage2606 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]localmicrodosechamp -3 points-2 points-1 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]Bubbly_Taro 3 points4 points5 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]localmicrodosechamp -1 points0 points1 point (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]MOProG2 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]glitch83 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]MOProG2 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]gobble6gobble9 -1 points0 points1 point (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]Fearless_Method_1682LVM solidarity squad 6 points7 points8 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]cast-away-ramadi06 2 points3 points4 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]Fearless_Method_1682LVM solidarity squad 2 points3 points4 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]cast-away-ramadi06 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]BKLD12 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Monkebizniss -1 points0 points1 point (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]RandomAttackHelpMe -1 points0 points1 point (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]lady_ven0m -1 points0 points1 point (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]MeasurementOk790 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]lady_ven0m 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]MattPayneWrestler -2 points-1 points0 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Final_Philosopher663 -2 points-1 points0 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]AutoModerator[M] 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]_here_ok 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]gate18No Pill 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]lvlupkitten✨ecstasy pill✨ 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]vollyvenus 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]Purple-Following-422 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]vollyvenus 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]SteakhouseBlues 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Moon-on-my-mind 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Lexaprofessional1998Blue Pill Woman 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Decent-Zombie-5513 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link