Why does the red pill receive so much hate on PPD?

2021-04-07T00:07:35+00:00

I am a blackpiller and i don't have issues with the redpill. I find some things they say to be true while others things are based on delution. I do dislike how they treat their fellow incels and call out any other man who question it by saying "just so the work, bro" I also think many people have issues with it because it's gives men some power in the dating market. Same way a lot of women shame men for going to see prostitutes or dislike the fact that sex robots are becoming a thing.

icedhumblepie · 2021-04-07T04:37:35+00:00

I don't think TRP receives that much hate here. It's more that theories make for interesting discussion, for both those who are anti-TRP and those who are exploring it, but not fully red pilled.

That said, here are some reasons why it "receives hate":

Not actually investigating TRP for themselves/ignorance of the deeper content

Just like many people hate on FDS without ever reading the handbook properly and taking the time to see the systemics from an objective point of view, many people hate on TRP without ever digging deeper into their material either. They feel they know enough from what they've read about the place from others.

TRP also gets conceived as perhaps the worst of the manosphere.

Overt misogyny from members

This is particularly so for people still in the earlier phases. Some of it is venting, but some of it also crosses that threshold. This sort of angry hatred isn't actually part of the Red Pill philosophy itself though, and ultimately has no place for the properly Red Pilled.

That said, self-identifying RPers do have histories of behaving quite badly outside of their spaces as well.

Tolerance of this behaviour by more established RP members

Add to this the fact TRP is not a debate space, at least on reddit.

Innate misogyny within the theories about behaviour of women

This is a stronger criticism of TRP, as it promotes a highly reductionist, essentialist view of female behaviour. That said, once you get deeper into TRP, it is mentioned that there are exceptions where women can override their apparently biologically programmed behaviour.

Sources of disagreement about this would be

a) if the proposed behaviours have any foundation in reality

b) where they might arise from (culture vs "evo psych" vs systematic reflections of men's actions)

c) to what extent they affect women. Is AWALT (All Women Are Like This) true? Note again that most deeper Red Pillers will tell you that AWALT is actually just a generalisation, and meant to reflect tendencies, and commonalities

d) to what extent can women have agency over this?

Demeaning language used to refer to women and their behaviours

Hamstering, promiscuity references, etc.

Promotion of unethical behaviour

Machiavellian approaches to life, manipulative and abusive tactics such as negging and dread game.

Philosophical objections

TRP paints a potentially bleak world view, as others have pointed out. It certainly is a useful model for certain experiences of some men, and to that extent, it can be very uncomfortable / illuminating / liberating.

Complete departure from some people's experienced realities

Some people just don't have TRP type experiences in their personal histories, and have a different mental framework that adequately explains the world around them. When this is the case, TRP seems like a flaming toxic waste dump.

mxp68 · 2021-04-06T23:53:19+00:00

I don’t hate the players, I hate that the redpill even works. I know it works because I see it irl.

I have two friends with completely different experiences in dating,

Guy #1 is a good person, good job, not bad looking, family oriented and has been dateless for two years, wants to be married and can’t find dates. Basically he is too nice, and not aggressive.
Guy #2 uses rp tactics (without even knowing what redpill is) and he has more dating opportunities than he’ll ever have time for. He never wants to marry or have an LTR because he’s drowning in attention he knows he’d have to give up if he ever settled down.

Most women claim they want guy #1 but they don’t date him. Most women claim they hate guy #2 but they can’t get enough of him.

It‘s just very confusing to average men, so I see why RP is growing in popularity.

Spacechichen_1990 · 2021-04-07T09:12:13+00:00

Because rp advocates for manipulation and lying by omniscion. Two things seen as scum bag moves

Slipthe · 2021-04-06T23:28:38+00:00

I'm curious what you think the reason is for /r/PurplePillDebate to exist at all.

From what I understand, it's because /r/theredpill was not a place that was open to debate. If you had a contentious opinion, you were probably gonna get banned.

superlurkage · 2021-04-07T03:42:51+00:00

Um, have you even looked at flairs and counted them up? There’s definitely more red pill here, which makes sense because blue pill is really just “mainstream attitudes”

lulll · 2021-04-07T11:00:48+00:00

i hate it mostly because its outdated gen x shit and the blackpill is far more relevant in the world we live now. red pill doesnt go far enough and its too concerned with delusional power gymnastics. it also doesnt help that the entire red pill sphere has been overtaken by dweebs larping as alphas to get in on that sweet red pill grift bux. i think it has run its course, thats why blackpill is becoming wildly popular, its actual brutal reality, red pill still sugar coats

you have to look the part to act the part, thats what it has always been and always will be

Pilling_it · 2021-04-07T00:41:10+00:00

[deleted]

NinjaOfTheSouth · 2021-04-06T23:27:12+00:00

It’s brutal and honest . It’s why there’s hardly any blue pill here. Reality overcomes ideals. And you know, women don’t like getting exposed and shit.

PreparationWorried33 · 2021-04-06T23:25:50+00:00

The same reason FDS gets hate. People don’t like openly seeing the opposite gender plotting to abuse them and the gaslighting about it just pours salt in the wound and drives the point home further.

PAThrowaway59 · 2021-04-07T11:42:26+00:00

Women don't like it because it's manipulative, guys don't like it because it doesn't work.

zeedoctorzee · 2021-04-06T23:51:30+00:00

[removed]

DaBlockObama · 2021-04-06T23:38:07+00:00

Trp is kind or triggering to some. Because it exposes some harsh realities. People usually get upset about it as a knee jerk reaction. But when they try to debate, they can’t prove any logical point using arguments. So they just show hatred, act bitter, smug, and sarcastic. It makes them feel as if they have made a point. Then the mods (who are blue pilled) say “hey it’s not a direct personal insult, so we’ll allow it”.

AffectionateCitrone3 · 2021-04-07T09:53:11+00:00

TRP exposes the harsh reality of the dating world and inter-gender relationships. As so why people don't like like it - 1. Women dont like it because to them it's like hacking their code. They wanna be able to choose the Alphas, and through Game and TRP that process is being challenged. Also some of them are brainwashed by feminism and anything that doesn't adhere to their feminist beliefs they hate. 2. Bluepilled men don't like TRP because it shatters their whole worldview. Everything they knew about women? A lie. They can't accept that and so they hate on TRP.

PlayfulLawyer · 2021-04-06T23:37:47+00:00

Well I've said before I'm fairly new to the pill thing and I have no interest in swallowing either pill whole, I just found it fascinating for whatever reason, a lot of so-called redpill stuff to me is just a rebranding of shit my father and other men have already taught me

But to answer your question I mean there are certain people within the red pill that could be considered misogynistic and just based on what I've seen from content creators the tone is very blunt and sometimes harsh which can be a lot for people, and not to mention some of the top guys in the red pill Community have been found cannot practice everything they preach there was a threat about it the other day, now as far as incels I consider that a whole other thing and I don't fuck with them lol, but overall I consider the manosphere a generally good thing for younger men navigating in today's world

Aw0lManner · 2021-04-07T01:21:37+00:00

Hoes mad. Simple answer

PoliticsIsBroken · 2021-04-07T00:19:46+00:00

Black/red pills expose some ugly truths about dating, and women. People don't take kindly to things that put them in a bad light or doesn't match up with their perception of the world.

TheJim66 · 2021-04-06T23:44:40+00:00

Because of the things it implies about female nature and sexuality. Concepts like hypergamy, how emotion rules the perception of female reality, brifaults law ,the not so morally good traits women find attractive in men etc. force both men and women to come face to face with the ugly side of female nature. This is something that is almost completely absent in modern society while we are fairly familiar with the ugly side of male nature.

BP men hate it because they don't want to let go of the idealized version they have of how women are like and the mistaken belief that women are basically better men.

Blackpillers hate it because it invalidates their defeatist worldview. It tells them that there is hope for them but they need to put in a lot of effort and put themselves in a lot of risk and the results might still not be what they want. Better to just pretend women are the same as men and all they care about is looks.

The women hate it because it paints them in a negative light and forces them to face a part of themselves they aren't ready to accept. The things RP theory implies about women don't exactly bode well for their love lives and they deal with unconscious drives they arent actually aware of. They don't know why they like that guy. It just happens. At this point I would say they don't like that RP is basically a cheat sheet for men to get women and bypass their hypergamy filters but I honestly doubt they are self aware enough for anything like that.

Also, on PPD specifically there are like 10 redpillers and I'm being generous. Most are either bloops or blackpillers.

John_Oakman · 2021-04-07T00:08:05+00:00

It's because it works and works very well (just read their field reports). It just happens to utilize methods/tactics that society considers to be underhanded. Also the trend of the manosphere hating on modern social norms is concerning for the continued health of said societies, especially their shaming of productivity and contributing to said societies...

BlackPorcelainDoll · 2021-04-07T02:05:30+00:00

I do not hate Red Pill, I just acknowledge it is a religion (in these parts), not a lifestyle. Should I say, "most aren't about that life.." This is just age-old hijacked gangsta talk/PIMP lingo.

Meanwhile, this is like saying I hate my entire culture. My family has plenty of pump/dump plate-spinning "alpha males" that'll never marry.

One I put $50 in his prison commissary a month.

nemporisso · 2021-04-06T23:31:33+00:00

It encourages bad faith engagement with the opposite sex

Superfluous_Toast · 2021-04-07T23:10:48+00:00

I have zero respect for an ideology created out of a man's idea of what's going on in a woman's head. Everything the redpill preaches about how women work is just dripping with male motivation and values, it's all just what a man would want in a woman's position. Not to mention how often those who subscribe to the redpill tell any woman who says otherwise to "stop lying" everytime she expresses a preference the redpill says she can't have...

pandora7780 · 2021-04-08T11:58:18+00:00

TRP is a smoke screen. On the surface, like MGTOW, it is about men improving themselves. Blow the smoke away and its really about putting women down and men up. The hypocrisy within it is astounding (It is unforgivable for a woman to use a man but the men who use women are congratulated). It says all men are superior and all women should be owned, dominated and basically have zero rights.

It's obviously great for men with certain beliefs to congregate and be applauded for treating women badly. It's a warped view of reality they can share and make ridiculous theories on what women are like. In reality their claims and information is false and inaccurate. Its ultimately a hate group.

SaBahRub · 2021-04-07T00:14:47+00:00

What are you talking about? Red pill is the majority on ppd

LittyKitsune · 2021-04-07T02:29:56+00:00

Because a dude used the kinds of tactics promoted by RP to get me to fuck him when I repeatedly said I wasn't ready for that and essentially destroyed our relationship. 🤷🏾‍♀️

ThunderbearIM · 2021-04-06T23:32:03+00:00

If TRP was about ethical dating strategy this would be fine.

Problem with TRP is that they argue that dating is amoral, that lying is fine if you're willing with taking the risks of "spinning plates".

They also base themselves on the whole extremely weak concept of "Alpha/Beta" males. It has no merit in reality. Many women don't prefer "Dominant" men (And the agressive traits that come with them), many men change completley how dominant they are in a situation, and human individual tastes are much more varied than what we see with wild animals that have alpha males. In fact we're more like (Serial)monogamous animals, which completely changes the "A/B" mechanic all over again. It's just off as a descriptor.

Even thou many people on PPD acknowledge the fact that the 80/20 rule does apply a majority of the time when it comes to sex and relationships. (Maybe not those exact number but in theory most acknowledge it to be true)

Do they? o.o I've seen it argued a lot here, mostly because it kinda goes against itself in the original paper. Women keep messaging back men that are "below" their standards in attractiveness.

What they do have right is that dating is skewed though, women don't really make the first move, and that should be fixed. More women to make

flapperfemmefatale · 2021-04-07T00:38:26+00:00

Because it's based on the premise that women's attraction has somehow changed. What RP men (and the whole manosphere, really) miss is that the same dudes bitching about not getting any nowadays would have only gotten some 50-70 years ago (their "good ol' days") because marriage was much more of a sociocultural requirement for women. Now that women can earn their own money and manage their own lives, they are free to hold out for men they actually WANT (rather than who they'd settle for). The complaining men perceive it as being unfair, which is idiotic.

ManTheFudgeUp4 · 2021-04-07T03:18:40+00:00

It's not the theory, the community is toxic. Not all of them, but many.

IcarusKiki · 2021-04-07T01:08:58+00:00

Incels arent redpill theyre black pill. The only thing I hate about red pillers is that they think they know how women think just because their methods work and extrapolate from there. They know the what without knowing the “why” yet pretend they do. I do not care that they sleep with plates or that their methods work, in fact I’m happy for them.

pongaminbloom · 2021-04-07T01:35:39+00:00

Because it negatively stereotypes half the population, among other reasons.

IOportA · 2021-04-07T04:05:14+00:00

Because the red pill is like taking a woman's picture when she's not wearing make up.

_-CHUBUT-_ · 2021-04-07T00:32:58+00:00

They hate TRP because they know it's true. That simple.

AttackOnTightPanties · 2021-04-07T04:47:53+00:00

I hate it because it gives a bunch of angry guys a reason to shit on “modern women” and to long for the older days where we married the first guy we fucked and were SAHMs. I honestly don’t even care that much about the gaslighting or psychological abuse tactics used by men subscribing to this movement to get laid because people who are abusive in nature will figure out how to do it right eventually, regardless of TRP or not. The reason I come on here to argue about TRP is because it almost always carries a misogynistic undertone and gives men a modern reason to hate/ be suspicious of women now that witchcraft is no longer a valid reason. I get pissed off at this very general caricature that is drawn of women that condenses phenomenon I see in certain groups of women but not all. I also think TRP does not accurately portray the entire dynamic between the sexes and that the 80/20 is a cop out that does not even begin to explain the moderate number of average to meh looking men who manage to get laid/ in relationships.

Finally, I hate it because evolutionary psychology is a pseudoscience at best that constantly gets treated like a real science on this subreddit when it doesn’t even begin to chip away at the fact that the rules of the animal kingdom are only somewhat applicable to us because we are an anomaly and that the mere fact we have culture is what is the biggest shaping force in human behavior.

relish5k · 2021-04-07T00:03:37+00:00

Because lying and manipulating to get things from people eez not nice. Even if it's sex, from women.

YungBoi12 · 2021-04-07T00:25:16+00:00

I don’t know what the difference is between red pill, blue pill, incel, pua, mgtow, etc. I thought we were mostly here to debate gender roles and dating. Trp go after women they aren’t attracted to w the intention to mistreat them tho, so that’s pretty bad.

Ok_Razzmatazz_1751 · 2021-04-07T05:39:05+00:00

I'll say this I've actually looked at the Red pill Reddit and YouTube content, They at their core hate that women have rights especially to vote , compare women to children , yet think childern should have children because supposedly that's all women should really be doing on this Earth is settling down young and breeding , haven't quite figured that issue out right there.lol .mind boggling. They hate that women have personal choice can go to college .They hate that women work , but then complain if a woman can't afford things because she doesn't work , degrades women that have children out of wedlock , want to see women shamed for having children , Yet hate abortion. Total oxymoron . Red pill dislikes that the government has come in and will supplement a women's or individual's lifestyle if they fall under the poverty level. Like SNAP ,Wic ,and/ or section 8 housing state insurance , Tax Credits etc Guess Red pill thinks children should starve and be without medical care so the mother suffers and will stay with her husband. You know that whole financial Independence thing they hate that. Red pill in a way likes that women are dependent upon men or where at one time , hence the the reason why they hate women having the right to vote because it eventually led to Independence throughout time. Pretty much red pill doesn't like that the government has stepped in because it gives women the opportunity to get away from shitty men, Now men are being held accountable for their shitty behavior. Red pill hates that women can fall out of love, move on, that women have personal opinions and thoughts beyond pleasing a man. Red pill is complicated . It's so much more than just spinning plates.

nemma88 · 2021-04-06T23:43:03+00:00

Because its a debate sub, it doesn't function without both sides.

The more contriversial parts of Red Pill and I'll be honest I havnt been over in a few years but things like LMR & dread are steeped in manipulation and the air on TRP is conditioning to see women as the enemy so as not to feel bad for said manipulation.

On PPD it used to be the case a lot of the demonisation was handwaved as men still swallowing the pill in the anger phase (because once swallowed they understand and do not hate a woman for her nature in the same way he did not hate himself for his nature) but I think that kind of died since it seems most never leave the anger phase.

Same reason Red Pill Women dropped Men are Dogs article from the sidebar, men took it over and got all offended.

AutoModerator · 2021-04-06T22:19:01+00:00

Attention!

You can post off topic/jokes/puns as a comment to this Automoderator message.
For "CMV" and "Question for X" Threads: Parent comments that aren't from the target group will be removed, along with their child replies.
If you want to agree with OP instead of challenging their view or if the question is not targeted at you, post it as an answer to this comment.
OP you can choose your own flair according to these guidelines., just press Flair under your post!

Thanks for your cooperation and enjoy the discussion!

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

miskioo · 2021-04-07T02:28:48+00:00

Socially adept and well adjusted men aren’t the ones googling “dating advice for men” and therefore aren’t the ones coming across red pill rhetoric. Majority of redpill men find themselves there because they need to read advice about women and dating unlike successful men.

Appropriate-Ad2175 · 2021-04-07T08:23:43+00:00

Even thou many people on PPD acknowledge the fact that the 80/20 rule does apply a majority of the time when it comes to sex and relationships.

I disagree. The 80/20 rule comes largely from a misunderstanding from a Tinder study, but it does not mean 20% of men are having sex with 80% of men, it just means that in Tinder 20% of the men are receiving likes from 80% of the women on the platform, not that they are actually having sex with them (most Tinder likes don't lead to sex).

Promiscuity is not shamed upon in the west and on this subreddit so why is men learning to figure out ways of getting more sex from women a bad thing?

Promiscuity should definitely be shamed to some degree, both for men and women. Plenty of research shows it is correlated with harmful outcomes to the individual (do people really forgot the panic of the AIDS epidemic? To this day there's no 100% effective way to combat STIs), and one could argue it is one of the causes of the decline of fertility in the west: people no longer feel the need to emotionally bond to have sex, which translates in lower marriage rates.

I also don’t understand how people can compare it to FDS because it actually tells men to become better version of themselves by working out, earning money and learning good hygiene whereas FDS has almost nothing about self improvement.

Both subreddits promote unhealthy, distrustful and resentful attitudes toward the opposite gender and human relationships. That's the last thing we need in a society where people are more lonely and afraid of intimacy than ever.

Aldabruzzo · 2021-04-07T13:24:12+00:00

because it's the truth

because it speaks truth about women

because it speaks unsavory unflattering truths about women that women don't want men to know.

Anthony-waltzs · 2021-04-07T14:19:42+00:00

Because it works.

/thread.

renfsu · 2021-04-07T15:09:54+00:00

Because someone who "gets it" is more attractive than someone that has to look in a manual

Because of negative terms like "awalt" so it's seen as all bad. Just like fds, you ignore the good ideas and only focus on the bad, then blanket the entire community as bad. Though neither of those communities are great when most of their members are just shitting on the other gender. Hard to take you seriously when you're bitter.

ISimpForKweens · 2021-04-07T15:27:45+00:00

TRP= “I want to improve myself”

FDS= “YOU should improve for me! I’m a kween!”

I don’t understand how FDS and TRP are comparable either. Sure both of them shit on the opposite gender but they are otherwise completely different.

The reason TRP receives so much hate is because the ideology contains misogynistic ideas (like AWALT).

801735 · 2021-04-07T17:13:46+00:00

Why does the red pill receive so much hate on PPD?

Because the weak ones prefer to point their finger anywhere else but towards the source of their problems?

Have you considered how difficult it is, to bend the hand 2 times compared to just stretching it out, finger pointing?

The dual mating strategy is failing massive numbers of players. Must be the game is shitty, otherwise it could be the players themselves, and some cannot and will not hear any of that. Causes deep insurmountable bitterness of defeat.

thedeadpill · 2021-04-07T17:28:48+00:00

Caveat: Red pill gets treated well on PPD, when you compare with literally every other place.

I think there's a few possibilities:

Red pill gets hate (from everyone) because they prescribe treating women badly as a self-defense mechanism.
Red pill gets hate because it ruins the female agenda and it's no different than inquisitors locking up Kepler or any other establishment criminalizing dissent from the status quo (this is red pill's stance as far as I can tell)
Red pill is just violently wrong about everything and is harmful to everyone.

I personally think it's 1, but there's a huge gulf between 'treat women badly' and 'just don't be a simp, make them pay for their own drinks'.

Physiologist21 · 2021-04-07T18:40:10+00:00

Have you seen the shit people post on this forum? The average IQ must be about 50.

Not to mention the actual cross over is like 70% FDS and other subs populated by zero value women.

People hate things that put them at a disadvantage and men learning how women actually work, speak etc. is at the disadvantage of women.

ceo_of_cope · 2021-04-07T19:54:26+00:00

I mean because it’s mostly true and sometimes the truth is hard to accept.

Simple-Craft-9577 · 2021-04-08T03:01:59+00:00

Is promiscuity not shamed in the west ? I moved to the west from another more conservative country and expected that things in the US would be more open and liberal. But then everyone on Reddit seems to be shaming promiscuity. Or is Reddit an inaccurate reference ?

throwingwearethrowin · 2021-04-08T14:13:07+00:00

FDS is a dating strategy. It’s not a lifestyle/emotional trip thing like TRP.

upalse · 2021-04-08T17:18:57+00:00

Red Pill/Back Pill is akin to tankies in socialism. They're not necessarily wrong, just obnoxiously militant.

alberto-hoff · 2021-04-11T21:10:42+00:00

Because this is literally a place to critique the red pill.

Automatic-Speech-203 · 2021-05-07T05:04:28+00:00

Because all they do is hate on women.

partsunknown99 · 2021-04-07T06:27:33+00:00

Anyone can link me a blackpill sub here?

Title	Why does the red pill receive so much hate on PPD?
Author	Raymondsuper
Upvotes	32
Comments	493
Date	April 6, 2021 10:19 PM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/mlngcu/why_does_the_red_pill_receive_so_much_hate_on_ppd/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/why-does-the-red-pill-receive-so-much-hate-on-ppd.764545 https://theredarchive.com/post/764545

Comments