As a guy Imma be honest, I think more guys should really work on self-establishment and self-actualization before getting into any relationship, even if it isn't serious

Mrs_Drgree · 2022-06-04T11:05:58+00:00

This thread has been retagged as a CMV

Swordfromthecement · 2022-06-04T10:58:59+00:00

I think a lot of men on here suffer from low self-esteem which leads to the insane opinions I see. but I also think it’s a slippery slope to fall into what I call the constant self improvement trap. There’s billions of awful people in relationships, you shouldn’t have to go into a self discovery phase just to find a girlfriend or get laid. Especially when these things are somewhat important for our psyche.

BlKaiser · 2022-06-04T11:43:57+00:00

Wouldn't by that time be too late since they would be disqualify themselves because of inexperience? How many times you have hard women say "I don't wanna be his teacher" or something similar.

Anykindofland · 2022-06-04T11:45:32+00:00

I somewhat agree, I somewhat disagree.

I agree that you should feel ready to date someone. Relationships are hard work, there needs to be effort put into it and managing your daily life with someone by your side can be as rewarding as it can be challenging. So yeah, be ready to continue the work even if you are in a committed relationship.

I disagree that you need to know who you are if you want a relationship. Life is a stream of events, some pass you by, some hit you hard, some change you are are. The goal of a relationship should be changing and growing together. Who you are today can be radically different from who you are tomorrow. Be it from a sudden health issue, losing your job or something on a global scale (Just take whats happening in the Ukraine as an example or the last two years of Covid).

techr0nin · 2022-06-04T10:39:10+00:00

I think “know thyself” is one of the best general advice ever. But I also think that being in a relationship is one of the greatest shortcuts towards that goal. The union of the masculine and the feminine is an accelerant towards self-discovery and growth like no other and the natural way our psyches are built. Even in a failed relationship there can be alot to learn about yourself.

NockerJoe · 2022-06-04T10:00:20+00:00

The fact that you put a regular relationship on par with a ferrari is kinda the issue. The amount of work it apparently takes just to get someone to agree to a relationship where you probably put in most of the work anyway isn't really a great sell on it.

rick-dicking-morty · 2022-06-04T11:41:32+00:00

This self-improvementalism is just a fad. People have been in long lasting relationships without learning about their self-establishment and self-actualizationism. There is nothing wrong about being self aware and whatnot but people go through different stages in life. If you are 20 and you think you know yourself (it could be true or not) you are probably going to change by the time you reach 30. If you are too self aware but without any belief in anything then it's like two mirrors pointing at each other.

People learn as they go and age. You don't need to be a Buddha to enter a relationship with a consumerist society citizen

TendieDinner777 · 2022-06-04T09:48:29+00:00

You’re mischaracterizing the reasons why men want relationships.

It’s an innate human desire for the overwhelming majority of people, not some trendy car.

Selkie-Princess · 2022-06-04T11:54:40+00:00

Sometimes these posts I read on here truly make me wonder if I live in a different reality

TightGang · 2022-06-04T17:05:35+00:00

I disagree. The loneliness i feel makes me a lot less motivated to do anything. Work out, study, practice a hobby, the pain of being lonely kills my motivarion for any of that. If i had a partner, someone to share my life with, i would be more inclined to do stuff.

Cookiecuttermaxy · 2022-06-04T10:04:15+00:00

I think it’s something every person should do no matter the gender. I know too many women that jump from relationship to relationship since night school because they are afraid to be alone. Even if they hate their boyfriend they are not going to break up until someone else isn’t in the picture. They have no personality, no interests and don’t know what they want from life.

Malgurath · 2022-06-04T13:06:15+00:00

I disagree, there are a lot of lessons to be learned about relationships that can only be learnt once you've been in them, and most of the time its lessons about yourself and how you manage in a relationship. When I was younger I thought that only men enjoyed sex and that women just put up with it, until I got into a relationship and found out that my gf wanted sex just as much if not more than I did. I thought that love was enough to make a relationship work, then I realized that you need similar goals and life plan to have a future together. I didn't realize that I didn't know how to properly communicate, or to handle someone elses emotions. When I was single for a long time I got used to just being by myself, but when I got into a relationship it became almost claustrophobic having a partner and having to plan things with/around them. And let's not talk about how to manage break ups. All of these lessons I learnt in different relationships, and I would hate to meet the perfect partner and have to go through all of that with them for the first time.

asshole67throw · 2022-06-04T14:02:57+00:00

I think as a man if you don’t have your shit together and you have a girlfriend - there’s a good chances you’re settling. She might be also. You start to resent each other over time. She’s also a distraction to you. You want to work on yourself and lean out, she wants to drink alcohol and go for meals out. You want to work and do overtime or projects, she wants your time attention and money. Time that you probably would be better off spending on things you need to do to get your shit together.

MarBitt · 2022-06-04T10:20:20+00:00

It's true that through the dumbest and most difficult part of my life, I got single. I'm glad for that, because any woman in a relationship with me would suffer at that time.

I think that before a first serious relationship, a man should get to the stage where he knows his life priorities and has found the principles he wants to follow in life. So then there is no danger that he will become dependent on the relationship and that he will get lost in the relationship.

But it still can't be compared to how much I've learned and developed in a long-term relationship and marriage. Love for a good woman and then for children can really teach and move a man a lot.

343_peaches_and_tea · 2022-06-04T12:37:06+00:00

When you're in a stable long term relationship then you can make more space for independence within the relationship.

You can still find things out about yourself because you learn to not let the relationship consume your entire life.

The first two years of a relationship are very different to years 5,6,7. You can do plenty of self-actualization in those years.

But hey. Maybe I'm missing something. I've barely been single since I was 15.

ionlydatechads · 2022-06-04T13:32:55+00:00

I agree. I think men should find happiness through their hobbies, friends and their career. There is a dependence on finding a woman to make them happy. Women are like this too but I see it more often in men. There are so many wounded men who think finding a beautiful and submissive woman will cure everything and they get angry and resentful when they don’t find it. If relationships are making men so unhappy and bitter, I would rather they work on themselves and forego dating. I know everyone wants intimacy but I don’t think the trade off is worth it for men. I think they would be happier being around other men until they find themselves.

gettin_paid_to_poop · 2022-06-04T09:57:12+00:00

I agree that working on establishing one's self is beneficial, and even essential to being a fully competent adult, but I disagree that a celibate person will be able to learn what they need to about relationships within being in one.

I think you learn more about yourself from trying & failing at relationships, then having a period of being single to reflect & work ok yourself. You (can/should) learn what you are doing wrong, compare what you are looking for vs what you should value for a long term relationship. What your boundaries are and how to enforce them in a mature way.

Also do you believe your post only applies to men & not women?

PMmeareasontolive · 2022-06-04T12:19:26+00:00

If there were some reliable way to do what you are asking I'd say "sure". But there isn't. There's too much conflicting information about men, women, relationships, out there. Yes, you could 'work on yourself', but it would be lucky to find the right approach, the right therapeutic model, for you. And without that it's like reading a book to try and learn how to ride a bike. And here's something else that happens: no matter how much you prepare for a situation, life will throw you a curveball that you didn't prepare for. Some things are just learned by experience.

Instead you should stop viewing your early learning experiences as failures.

trail22 · 2022-06-04T14:20:03+00:00

You gotta live life and have relationships with people to grow as a person. If you down all your time at self improvement until you feel like you are ready, that’s just a defense mechanism to avoid taking a risk because you feel like you aren’t ready. Better to have bad relationships and realize your flaws then to sit alone and try to figure yourself out.

It’s okay to make mistakes. That’s how most people learn and grow. Hell people even look vack fondly on their mistakes.

IveGotIssues9918 · 2022-06-04T20:51:11+00:00

I think this is true for a lot of PEOPLE in general. I see women who, like me, have minimal romantic experience and are struggling mentally who seem to think that getting a boyfriend would instantly solve all their problems. The trauma subreddits I'm subscribed to have TONS of people who entered into codependent/toxic relationships expecting their partners to validate or fix them and are now having problems because it wasn't an immediate cure like they thought.

I know that any boyfriend I could get in my current state (well, I'm doing slightly better recently, but still) would either be a desperate codependent or a manipulative narcissist. Neither is worth going through just so I can say "my boyfriend" and cosplay being normal.

Perseus_the_Bold · 2022-06-05T01:07:27+00:00

If more men had non-gynocentric goals in life, and focused on self-actualization, less men would be hung up on women's opinions about them. Men want to be in relationships because they are convinced that this will fill the void in their life combined with the mistaken belief that this will satiate biological urges.

Men's error here is in precipitating a solution before they understand the problem.

The problem is that they haven't yet figured out how to exist as free agents because the power that this conveys feels oppressive to them; this is because power comes with accountability. And in order to get themselves except from accountability they are willing to give up both freedom and power. Being free is painful, it's the root of existential angst. Freedom is also something that everyone believes they want until they actually get it and discover that freedom requires owning up to all your choices including those you failed to make. They mistakenly believe freedom includes freedom from consequences and accountability.

Freedom thus turns into an unbearable Democlean Sword to some men, and they wish to placate the anxiety by running to the nearest thing that gives them a child-like - it's not your fault it's someone else's fault - purpose for their lives. Something for them to live for.

2022-06-04T11:38:59+00:00

Did you read the thread where all the guys were saying how insecure about their bodies they are? That was an eye opener.

Wtf is everyone doing? The bar to be top 20% is so fucking low lmao.

Lysa_Bell · 2022-06-04T09:58:15+00:00

I don't think that's gender specific. All genders should try to improve themselves, love themselves, build a solid relationship with themselves. So many people that don't even know themselves try to close a void with a partner. But the little partner bandaid won't work forever and then you are coming to the realisation that you are still not happy. And then you start to project your own happiness on your partner and find things to hate about them just so you don't have to see your own issues.

It's easier to externalise than internalise. Humans like to go the path of low resistance.

wtknight · 2022-06-04T13:17:43+00:00

Some guy who is a virgin should probably do whatever it takes to find a way to legally have sex whether it’s through a girlfriend, a hook-up, or a prostitute. The self-esteem toll of being a virgin is just too large.

Other than that, I agree with you.

Cookiecuttermaxy · 2022-06-04T10:07:49+00:00

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2022-06-04T11:29:24+00:00

I disagree. Relationships of any kind are basically just an outgrowth of having an active social life. Anyone who wants to get into a romantic or sexual relationship should absolutely cultivate an active social life if they don't already have one. If they do already have one, they should be honest about their desires for a relationship and try to meet people who might be interested in them. Life's too short to not go for the things you want. You can work on yourself and date at the same time.

pop442 · 2022-06-04T16:17:57+00:00

The key which the original Red Pill before it got hijacked focused on was having a clear cut purpose and goal for your own life before factoring women and relationships into it.

And that's how it should be. Before you even chase women, you should have a goal that you're working towards and seeing how you can fit women into the plan.

Too many dudes are just living complacent and meaningless lives and expecting female approval and sex alone to add meaning and purpose to it. That's why incels are a thing. These dudes literally live for nothing but female validation and sex and feel worthless and spiteful because of the lack of it.

Don't get me wrong. Getting dates is great. Sex is even better. And a relationship can be heaven or hell depending on who you ask. But a man should be in a position where, if a woman says no, it shouldn't break him because he has other shit going on that's fulfilling.

Some dudes have absolutely nothing fulfilling going on in their lives and they see men around them getting dates and LTR's and feeling like life is passing them by.

Also, I want to leave this video here for some of the younger dudes that post or lurk on here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpvUVG43IdU

shonenhikada · 2022-06-04T18:48:44+00:00

Yes self actualize and self establish yourself then give it to a girl who will come in to reap all your benefits while not being there to support you at all while you achieve your goal. Perfect strategy to get a goal digger spouse.

A man shows his loyalty by having tons of options and yet still choosing to stay with his wife who is now declining in SMV. E.g. See Pierce Brosnan who can easily get a more attractive and younger wife when he was at height of his James Bond career but chooses to stay with her.

A woman shows loyalty to her husband/bf by sticking, supporting and being with him while he is building up to his goal even though she has plenty of options to fuck/get in relationship with other men.

This advice is terrible and will only get you beta provider/divorce rape in the future where half your assets you work so hard for goes to some girl who probably does not like u all that much as a person.

HazyMemory7 · 2022-06-04T19:48:59+00:00

Counter argument: dating gives you learning experiences and aids in self actualization. You learn more about yourself, make mistakes, and learn from them. I'd say dating has honestly helped my pursuit for self-actualization. I'm more self-assured, confident, have improved my social skills and am generally a more well rounded person.

2022-06-04T20:00:01+00:00

I’m a female and I think the issue is too many men put their mothers on a pedestal without realizing they do it. What’s that Tupac song lyric “ain’t no woman in the world that can take my mothers place” so many men think this way .

Men get their emotional needs met from their mother so they’re emotionally unavailable to the women in their lives. On the other hand, so many women are desperate for an emotional connection because a lot of women for one, don’t even have their father present in their lives - and a large portion of women who do have their fathers in their lives - are still dealing with emotionally unavailable fathers - as in they’re there; but not actually present. I’ve gone to friends houses as a kid where the fathers role is simply to watch TV drink scotch and bark orders. That’s not being emotionally available.

whitepumas · 2022-06-05T01:45:51+00:00

Agree. Women do this more than men tend to, and it’s not uncommon for a woman to know and stand firm on what she wants both for herself and from a relationship.

vertr · 2022-06-05T03:34:03+00:00

If I've learned anything from this thread it's that RPers have extremely poor reading comprehension and somehow think OP is saying wanting a relationship is like a desiring a Ferrari.

confusedthrowaway144 · 2022-06-05T04:25:59+00:00

As a woman, CMV: relationships (and trying to get them) distract you from pursuing goals that are actually important. This is true of both men and women. Plus, if you have things going on in your life aside from thirsting for a gf/bf/hookup, you'll automatically become a more desirable partner.

Stunning-Potato-1984 · 2022-06-06T15:31:46+00:00

I think it's more this belief that once they get the Ferrari everything in life will be better. But if the Ferrari leaves them everything falls apart for them so they never improved, their Ferrari propped them up. So heck yes on the establishment and self-actualization.

jax006 · 2022-06-04T12:48:07+00:00

Quite the opposite, IME celibate/perpetually single men have much more stunted (and sometimes fucked up) perspectives on life and the world.

Idk what single/celibate guys you're hanging with who are so "enlightened" by their lack of sexual success ?

Slight_Fig5187 · 2022-06-04T15:24:40+00:00

I totally agree... I'm a woman, have had a few important long term relationships, and what led to put an end to them was nothing of the kind of things often discussed here (money, looks, height, etc) but lack of interpersonal skills, empathy, communication, etc. As it has happened to all of the women I know who've ended relationships. I've never heard a woman say "I dumped him because he was ugly/short/not successful", but very often "because he was hateful to me, didn't speak to me, wanted to impose his ideas or plans on me, was cheating, didn't do his share of house chores, was always on his phone, didn't pay any attention to my emotional or sexual needs, etc".

Cookiecuttermaxy · 2022-06-04T18:07:08+00:00

Disagree.

As people stay single, they become more anti-social, less tolerant of compromises and generally worse partners to be with.

Being in a LTR is a skill set that you can not develop by being single. It is pure socialization. Men who stay single a long time are typically terrible partners.

Hoopy223 · 2022-06-04T14:14:34+00:00

Here’s the thing:

You can do all of that and be the “perfect package” according to whatever advice you are being given...and still be single. Or you spend a bunch of time on introspection and become self-centered and unable to connect.

The truth is have to learn by doing it over and over. If you have a bad relationship you take a little while and then go out and meet people all over again.

2022-06-04T15:21:41+00:00

This mfer spititn

Helpmefindu · 2022-06-04T10:00:54+00:00

The more men discover themselves and their potential the more disappointing weak willed herd mind women will be. A lot of men simply don't want to lose that luster of women in their mind's eye

tuesdaysatmorts · 2022-06-04T14:03:22+00:00

Wanting intimacy, a natural human NEED, is equivalent to owning a Ferrari? No. It would be like having to walk hours to get to work everyday and wanting at minimum a bicycle. Yes guys need to work on themselves. But treating intimacy as a luxury only few deserve is incorrect. We all need intimacy. And going your whole life without it fucks you up.

BeautifulTomatillo · 2022-06-04T09:50:05+00:00

[permanently deleted]

neolib-cowboy · 2022-06-04T16:30:21+00:00

this is still the equivalent of wanting to buy a ferrari because everyone else is rocking one

So women are ferrari's now?

Sure-Vermicelli4369 · 2022-06-04T17:42:11+00:00

Bad advice. If men figure themselves out they'll figure out they no longer need women.

sheaintdidnuffin · 2022-06-04T19:15:15+00:00

"Just learn platitudes and be a worker drone, bro."

Isn't solid advice, especially for dudes who was/knows bros who were getting laid before they were even self aware.

TBH

2022-06-04T19:16:06+00:00

I strongly disagree.

The only way to get better with women is more practice (with women).

This is like saying doing a lot of pushups will improve your career as a salesperson.

I cant see too much carryover there. To really get better at something you must practice that "something".

Self improvement is mostly for you, and if you increase your wealth or status you might get "better" women. But getting women is an art by itself, which needs practice.

BitShif128 · 2022-06-04T22:39:09+00:00

I can't believe you're comparing something as fundamental as a relationship with a woman To a fucking luxury sports car. Holy fucking shit this boggles my mind.

Also why the fuck do men have to go on a spriitual journey to unlock our third fucking eye just for a relationship and family ?

Get tf outta here with that bs.

barbodelli · 2022-06-04T15:05:17+00:00

One mistake a lot of socialist type make. And im not accusing you of being a socialist. Just sharing an observation. They complete missunderstand incentives. Humans are very incentive driven.

On one hand humans can achieve great feats. On the other hand humans are very often lazy as fuck.

A lot of men derive incentive from their sex drive. As in if they are not working towards something that helps them find a mate. They aint working at all. They have no motivation.

So in essence what youre saying is people should stop using the best possible source of incentive (for some) simply because you disagree with it.

You want men to focus on self actualization before having a relationship. But until they are in a relationship they could give a fuck about self actualization. Its like telling a person to learn how to be on time before gettinga job. Having a job is the best method in the world at teaching you how to be on time.

gate18 · 2022-06-04T14:34:35+00:00

This isn't a thread to advocate being single, this is more so a thread to advocate finding your inner wisdom, and getting to know yourself.

Whilst I agree with the point. The truth is getting into a relationship doesn't get in the way of finding your inner wisdom.

You'd argue, by getting into a relationship and experiencing what it is would help people to remove it from the front of their minds.

I don't think you need to be "the best version of yourself to get a partner", rubbish.

But I do think you need to be happy (overall) and ha have something going so that if you don't get a partner is not a big deal.

It's like with anything. If you go for a job interview and don't get it, "shrug", you have these other things. But if when you don't get it you start with "unqualified are getting special treatment, they hate mind kind" - you get into a dark spiral that not only is not based on reality, but you are hurting yourself.

The idea that you need to be established and actualized is rubbish. Plenty that aren't are in relationships. In fact, you are throwing these people their rubbish arguments back at them, that "women don't look at you if you aren't established" - yet it isn't true.

Then again, you don't know these people that are getting rejected, so all you can do is throw a bullshit blanket statement - they have so many "gurus" doing that already, all be it in different tone

PostNutCharity1 · 2022-06-04T12:23:11+00:00

All men should be working on is emotional manipulation and lying. Those are the only real “skills” you need to succeed with women.

-Ivar-TheBoneless · 2022-06-04T13:59:49+00:00

I couldn't disagree more. Where I'm from if you have some money, a nice car, and nice (expensive) clothes, you will get girls. But I need to make sure that I'm not just a beta buxs, and one way to know you're not a beta bux is she was with you when you didn't have any money. Being a beta bux is nothing to be proud of. It's basically a sugar relationship where she's only with you because she's getting compensated financially. Where she doesn't actually respect you, doesn't actually care about you, and doesn't actually want to have sex with you.

I always tell guys to keep in mind that if you needed money for her to be attracted to you, that there were other men that didn't need to have any money to get with her. And those are the guys she's really attracted to.

sarkington · 2022-06-04T14:02:42+00:00

It’s too easy blame your desires, sorry

Which is something both genders are guilty of, just for different things

meshsesh · 2022-06-05T01:28:21+00:00

equivalent of wanting to buy a ferrari

Having a girlfriend for healthy sexual needs & intimacy satisfaction in your 20s is just basic normal thing in life.... kindda like eating a balanced healthy diet.

You obviously have some Psychological issues if you equate having a girlfriend to a Ferrari, which is a luxury item which most will never be able to afford.

purplish_possum · 2022-06-04T14:18:36+00:00

Hell no! Guys work on themselves by actually doing shit. Not just talking and navel-gazing. Guys get better at relationships by having relationships.

Time_Animaal · 2022-06-04T16:43:57+00:00

The amount of people with no skills or accomplishments that turn to spirituality and self-actualization. Tsk, tsk, you have to desperately grasp for something in the Ocean when your drowning.

If you can't measure it, it's not meaningful.

Typically when lower value men want a relationship it's not because other people around them are in relationships, it's because they're craving stability in their sexless, loveless lives.

Ask your average guy what did he even learned about himself during any recent relationship, I dare you to

This cuts against your own point of view so hard it's amazing to me you even tried to make it. People in relationships learn how to relate to each other, they can learn their weaknesses, their triggers, they learn about the opposite sex. They reflect after it and maybe move a couple of inches in the right direction.

Men that don't get into relationships are infants that know nothing other than ideals, or if they're paying attention to certain online communities, bitterness.

Not engaging in relationships is net emotionally/maturation stunting. Your talk of self-actualization nonsense speaks to the value you place on an internal life that doesn't exist, that millions of people latch onto in a desperate attempt to pretend their bodies and even minds aren't just decaying for the last 5 decades of their lives.

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szclimber · 2022-06-04T14:34:26+00:00

No. They can do both. Also, your reasons don't make sense to me

m7thena · 2022-06-04T15:03:34+00:00

I agree with this

Think_gawd · 2022-06-04T15:47:23+00:00

Your corporate overlords will thank you for this.

Valuable-Marzipan761 · 2022-06-04T17:17:02+00:00

I agree that the focus should be more on self actualisation than on getting into a relationship but I don't necessarily think one has to be done before the other. 'be been in a relationship since the age of 21 and wouldn't say it's hindered my self establishment at all.

FrostieTheSnowman · 2022-06-04T17:59:34+00:00

While I don't COMPLETELY disagree, I think the problem is a bit different for most people, especially on this sub. Let's be real, most of us are nerds, and we probably don't get out much. As such, we get lonely, breed shitty attitudes, let it fester, develop more serious personality issues, and many of us, at least on the men's side of things, become so thirsty it's hard to even make friends with pretty girls because we're so hopped up on testosterone and desperation.

So while I agree that self-improvement is important, I think for a lot of people that improvement needs to turn inward. Don't get me wrong, losing some fat won't hurt your chances, but ultimately the attitude needs to be in the right place, and you need to actually step into the real world and interact with people.

If you're awkward, roll with it. You will not get over your awkwardness by staying at home every day. Go to clubs. Drink responsibly. Dance. Make an effort to hang with your buds more often. Deconstruct those shitty pre-conceived notions of how people are supposed to act, and how dating is supposed to go, and focus on getting out there, meeting new people, and having fun.

I know this is probably falling on a lot of deaf ears and I'm going to get lessons on "plates" and shit in the comments, but this really is the most important stuff you can affect, outside of personal hygiene.

jobbo321 · 2022-06-04T18:02:30+00:00

No, going into some self improvement phase for entering a relationship is stupid. You self improve because you want to do it for yourself, not to get mature for a relationship.

hdksndiisn · 2022-06-04T18:06:14+00:00

Realistically & ideally it should look like this: - seek self-actualization - meet partner - grow interrelationship skills - develop spiritually with partner - separate for reasons - internalize new necessary growth - continue to self-actualize with new knowledge of self/other via prior relationship experience - meet new partner - repeat until ideal partner is met where both parties are their best selves pushing each other to be better

In other words you can do both. It’s important to learn to be alone and to seek spiritual fulfillment without needing external validation. It’s also important to learn the Other by being with the Other - a partner, equal, match, counterpart, soulmate. You grow as much as you can with someone then are single again growing alone then meet someone & repeat the process, always striving for more/better realization/acceptance eventually being individuated and able to harmoniously have a partnership where both parties are full alone and overflowing together.

Cookiecuttermaxy · 2022-06-04T19:07:31+00:00

I agree to a certain extent. The “know yourself” advice is thrown around too vaguely now. I feel like you should take the time to figure out what you want from a partner, what you’ll do to keep said partner, and boundaries that said partner cant get away with crossing. Outside of that getting better comes from just trying and failing, relationships are a skill like anything else no amount of self discovery will make up for inexperience.

2022-06-04T19:38:24+00:00

Agreed.

DeliciousPussyNectar · 2022-06-04T21:32:42+00:00

They need to focus on learning how to navigate social environments, you’ll never learn a thing in life if you’re in solitude, single or not.

SavageAnalFissure · 2022-06-05T18:40:23+00:00

Oh for Christ sake, so many guru like checklists and milestones are vomited out on the internet as if you must be a perfected specimen in all facets of life before even daring to have even your first relationship with your desired sex… lol…so fucking unrealistic. Maybe the the person is just fucking ugly/unattractive… so many over complicated answers instead of the obvious ones right in peoples faces.

cryptothrow2 · 2022-06-06T07:47:35+00:00

I don't agree. You can do it during. When you're younger, the standards are lower. Even basement dwellers will get laid. No issue. You also need to develop social skills. Your babes friends will help with that.

Women just expect you to know. But when you're younger, they'll be more willing to teach. 18 year old virgin - great. 28 year old virgin - gross

Cerrax3 · 2022-06-06T11:13:22+00:00

this is still the equivalent of wanting to buy a ferrari because everyone else is rocking one

No, because very few people can afford a Ferrari. Being in a relationship is like owning any car, they all do the same thing, but the quality of the ride is going depend massively on what you started with, and how much you're willing to put into it.

There are '91 Toyota Camrys that drive like the day they rolled off the assembly line, and there are 2012 Lamborghinis that are sitting in a junkyard somewhere.

Cookiecuttermaxy · 2022-06-06T21:11:11+00:00

My good friends mother told me. NBA players have lots of woman as they don't have one.

Title	As a guy Imma be honest, I think more guys should really work on self-establishment and self-actualization before getting into any relationship, even if it isn't serious
Author	Cookiecuttermaxy
Upvotes	206
Comments	238
Date	June 4, 2022 9:45 AM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/v4ljhd/as_a_guy_imma_be_honest_i_think_more_guys_should/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/as-a-guy-imma-be-honest-i-think-more-guys-should.1117299 https://theredarchive.com/post/1117299

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