Conservative/red pill men complain about the degradation of society but partake in it themselves

The-Sound_of-Silence · 2025-04-18T03:18:17+00:00

If you want to get really nihilistic, men are successfully killing themselves in much higher numbers than women, so there's that as one potential answer

YetAnotherCommenter · 2025-04-18T11:27:59+00:00

You seem to be conflating two very different kinds of RPers here:

The RP Tradcons (the Jesus types who want to go back to the 1950s with white picket fences, nuclear families only with 2 to 4 kids each), and the RP Opportunists (those who are solely out there for their own dating/sexual interests).

These are not the same groups, and whilst the Tradcons are social conservatives, RP Opportunists often aren't. In addition, Tradcons are gynocentric at their core - they really do take women's interests, at least as they understand those interests, into sincere consideration. The RP Opportunists are pretty much indifferent to "women" or "men" as societal interest groups - they're just trying to get their own dicks wet.

I'm going to offer some tough love here: the first thing you need to do is to stop aggregating 'men'. "Men" are not a unified bunch, they do not perceive of themselves as a unified political class with common interests, and they lack an internal sense of solidarity because cultural factors have made them even more rivalrous with each other than they otherwise would be.

And "conservative" politics is NOT the unified voice of men/men's interests. By the same token, the establishment women's movement (which, in every country, is aligned against conservative politics) is not a representative of all female persons (despite their incessant posturing as such).

I know not all conservative men are like this, but I'm talking about the ones who are.

And I think very, very few men are actually like this. The vast majority of conservative tradcon men are, well, tradcons. They are willing to provide and protect and be faithful so long as their woman dedicates herself to the household with a comparable level of effort to what he brings to his career and also remains faithful.

I mean, I am no fan of tradconism, but (like too many critics of the manosphere) you seem incapable of seeing the vast gulf in moral values between men like JD Vance (a devout Catholic and, consequently, a man who believes men are also ethically obliged to remain chaste outside of marriage) and men like Andrew Tate (who clearly supports male promiscuity).

leosandlattes · 2025-04-18T02:09:50+00:00

“Fatherless behavior” is so funny when you think about it. The kid isn’t at fault that the dad left, so if anything it is a reflection on the deadbeat dad for being a shitty person.

Anyway, this type of conservative / red pill men see it as unchangeable therefore it is better to partake in the degeneracy rather than not have anything at all.

NiaNia-Data · 2025-04-18T17:49:08+00:00

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Dertross · 2025-04-18T18:51:00+00:00

"Conservative men compalain bout the decline of society, but pornography exists!"

I'm tired of this dumb argument. Porn is no big deal. Prostitution has always existed. What are the things that have not always existed, though?

ThrowRABigStoveTV · 2025-04-18T03:35:13+00:00

I mean… I hear you saying a lot of them are assholes, which is probably true, but I’m not sure I see the hypocrisy.

My sense is it’s more about viewing dynamics in a more transactional, utilitarian, almost real-politic way because they feel like that’s how the world works deep down, beyond motivations people claim to have. They see it as a marketplace.

Not agreeing with the mentality, but my understanding is they aren’t saying they’re morally superior as much as playing what they see as a fair game?

HTML_Novice · 2025-04-18T03:18:04+00:00

It’s called enjoy the decline

pinpointnade · 2025-04-18T02:09:11+00:00

I think you’re mistaking the red pill for the Andrew Tate cult. Two completely different ideologies.

mostly_justlurking · 2025-04-18T02:04:18+00:00

Not all but very close to all. Also, I consider most blue pill males to be hypocrites in the same way

abaxeron · 2025-04-18T02:46:02+00:00

Sometimes, when your team loses in a brawl, it's because your opponent brought guns. Not because you didn't train hard enough. Eaters and collectivoids cannot be outvoted in a fair election, and the vast majority of them don't care that things they vote for are unsustainable. The red pill is not unversal moral paradigm; it's adaptation and survival strategy. When women do the same thing (operate on non-universal morality) it's called "ethics of care" and considered a breakthrough discovery in philosophy. You may say, the red pill is "ethics of don't care".

DietTyrone · 2025-04-18T03:51:04+00:00

how women are all hoes nowadays, how family values are dead, fatherless behavior, women don't value men anymore, blah blah blah.

So it's Red Pilled men's job to police women's choices? How will that work exactly?

But how many of them watch porn?

Right, because if men stop watching porn the women selling their bodies for profit will instead get a job at Subway. Cause clearly they don't have that option right now.

How many of them would sleep with a random attractive woman if she asked (and would desire to be promiscuous/unfaithful)?

Right, because promiscuous women or unfaithful women are only that way because of Red Pilled men. Not like they would still sleep around or cheat will all the other men available to them.

How many of them are ACTUALLY good husbands and dads

Where in Red Pill does it encourage men to be bad husbands and fathers? Doesn't really have anything to do with being Red Pilled.

And they have no respect for women other than their female family members and maybe their wives

Respect is earned. They do not owe every random woman respect beyond the general kind.

They don't realize that how individuals act has an effect on the whole of society, even slightly.

Again, they're not responsible for how women act. Those women are responsible for their own life choices. It's not the responsibility of Red Pill men or any man besides their own fathers to police what they do.

Schleudergang1400 · 2025-04-18T18:18:24+00:00

I know not all conservative men are like this, but I'm talking about the ones who are.

You know nothing of the men who complain that family values are dead, etc.

How many of them are ACTUALLY good husbands and dads (more than just making money, but actually being emotionally present)?

We simply don't know. All you do is assume something based on things you want to be true.

Come back with actual data on those men.

RapaxIII · 2025-04-18T12:13:39+00:00

Letting an American woman speak on conservatism is like letting a fish talk about flying, what a ridiculous idea. Not only are conservative beliefs and the red pill separate and distinct, but people aren't intelligent enough to use two brain cells and realize this

Also, one of the questions liberals never ask is if the country is getting more gay/minority/immigrant/single mom friendly, what exactly is a conservative to do, it's not like they're going to help conserve that shit

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DzejSiDi · 2025-04-18T11:20:31+00:00

Redpilled != conservative.

You're writting about conservatives, or as you specified, pretty large subset of them. Redpill men should know that they can achieve jack shit excluding wasting time, energy and being villainized, so what's the point? Hence the "enjoy the decline" mantra.

DenverKim · 2025-04-18T02:50:21+00:00

The conservative/red pill men you are talking about actually don’t have respect for their female family members either. Definitely not their sisters, mothers and daughters. They might feel protective over them and feel the need to pay for their basic needs, but that’s because they view them as a form of property… Not because they respect them.

All you need to do is spend one Thanksgiving dinner with a traditional conservative family to see this very clearly. And I’ve spent several unfortunately. Never again.

No-Rough-7390 · 2025-04-18T14:45:30+00:00

It’s a flaw in the incentive structure. If playing by the rules results in 0 return, you’re not gonna do it.

Life-Income2986 · 2025-04-18T02:07:01+00:00

One of the most important things I've learned over the last decade is that pointing out hypocrisy in conservative people is a waste of fucking time. They know. They don't care.

I think it's most important to point out how normal and reasonable their positions are. Just as they keep spewing shit keep saying 'yeah man totally my mom was saying that insane shit the other week'. Way more effective then trying to get them to stand by their positions like an adult.

Everyone in a mental health hospital is more connected to reality than the average conservative. Truth has no meaning to these people other than what will make them not have to ever correct themselves. They are unhinged, and not sharing the same reality as you. Treat them as such.

caption291 · 2025-04-18T02:19:10+00:00

Conservative men are pulling things towards the direction they want which is perfectly reasonable and what you should do. Your expectation that conservative men should act like things already are the way that they want is poorly thought out.

It's always funny to me how not respecting women is by default a bad thing for a man, but I pretty much never hear women say that not respecting men is a bad thing for a woman.

Until shit like that changes, I think you're wasting your time whining about men.

man-frustrated · 2025-04-18T02:14:59+00:00

Most of these perceived group hypocrisies are just different members of a group acting differently, not actually individuals being hypocritical.

mrcs84usn · 2025-04-18T03:35:41+00:00

Porn? Pretty much every conservative/RP talking head tells you that you need to stop watching porn.

Sleep with random attractive woman? We don’t know, and neither do you, so let’s not pretend like that’s a talking point. This also goes for your “actually good husbands” as well.

I’m not going to continue addressing the rest of your Gish Gallop, but I will say this. Trying to use conservative and RP interchangeably doesn’t really work. Someone like Ben Shapiro is not synonymous with someone like Andrew Tate.

Even within RP spaces you have the 3 primary pillars when looking at how they interact with the current social climate. PUAs try to work within it. MRAs are trying to change things. MGTOW just avoid it altogether.

ThePrinceJays · 2025-04-18T05:39:15+00:00

> Conservative/red pill men are always complaining about how women are all hoes nowadays, how family values are dead, fatherless behavior, women don't value men anymore, blah blah blah.

Red pill men yeah, conservative, depends on your definition. If you're talking about men who proudly call themselves conservative, yes.

Yeah hypocrisy is a huge issue with red pill/manosphere in general. They talk big game about conservative values yet they want to indulge in liberal culture (like promiscuity) when it benefits them. Yet they'll also turn around and shame women for being promiscuous.

They talk about how important family stability is but will proudly say cheating is okay only if a man does it, not realizing cheating statistically (something they love to bring up, statistics) almost always introduces marriage & family instability. They talk about how self control is one of the most important things for a man yet they can't control their sexual urges during marriage for the good of the marriage and the family.

They talk about body count and how higher body counts make less happy and stable marriages, they often leave out the fact that the same rule applies to men, albeit to a lesser degree than women, it still applies. So a high body count for a man most times will still be just as detrimental as a high body count for a woman.

They have a lot of good points they just take way too far, much like any modern radical group.

egalitariandystopia · 2025-04-18T06:47:09+00:00

I am myself a hypocrite in this, as I did engage in hook-up culture. Not proud of it. I feel like I gave up casual sex, mainly because of STD risks, being grossed out and trying not being a hypocrite.

Without being aware I split women based on Madonna/ whore complex. As in, in considered there is a pool of women who engage in casual sex (whores) and those who don't (Madonna). I still think this is mostly true, but they do get mixed.

I went without sex for 7 years, so that "Women have sex with who they want, and men with who they are allowed" is pretty valid. Women control sex, this is clear.

ThePrinceJays · 2025-04-18T13:46:59+00:00

Well OP’s examples were pretty weird and kinda bad I’ll admit that.

But if red pillers say family is important then partake in practices that are statistically known to destroy families, like cheating, they’d be hypocrites. Something a lot of them do.

Of course there are some red pillers like StephisCold that do not have views on family being important, and even tell men not to marry at all.

So a lot of red pillers don’t follow OP’s line of logic but a lot of others kinda do.

Puzzleheaded_ghost · 2025-04-18T17:47:29+00:00

Thank you for admitting that not all men. Are shit. Much appreciated

Ok_Wishbone3535 · 2025-04-18T22:08:39+00:00

Cognitive dissonance is not uncommon in "The Red Pill".

petellapain · 2025-04-18T23:04:38+00:00

Site even one single example instead of combining redpill and conservative into the same hypothetical person even though the 2 groups clearly have opposing views and then calling the non existent combination a hypocrite

CarHungry · 2025-04-19T09:28:29+00:00

Firstly, I love hoes. Second I think you are refering to incels, incels aren't redpilled they are mostly just mentally ill and sort of delusional. Thinking they can turn back the clock instead of adapting (via rp) is why they can't get laid.

Dramatic_Survey_5743 · 2025-04-20T10:40:32+00:00

I read redpill stuff for about a decade, I started when it was in its infancy and it's more about self improvement ans understanding nuances with female behaviour. Not it's just bashing and that's not my thing. Most people who are un unfavourable positions in life will distort reality to fit a narrative that favours them. Men and women do this. If these men were getting laid, they wouldn't be running around calling women who are promiscuous whores...

GofukYourselves · 2025-04-22T02:36:40+00:00

This is such a piss ass take. Real conservatives don't do shit like this.

Odd_Book_9024 · 2025-04-18T11:10:24+00:00

Yes

Enjoy the decline is a key Red Pill phrase

SherbertDense1415 · 2025-04-18T02:29:07+00:00

Porn? Porn is one of the biggest reasons men do not respect women.

Its women that don't realize that how individuals act effects the whole of society. See the many many women on reddit and other social media that defend female porn girls, and sex workers, and act like its a legitimate way of life. They see no connection between encouraging this bad behavior, and its proliferation.

Why you assume leftist men aren't cheating, psychopathic scoundrels just as often, makes me wonder.

Hell many racial groups of men are not even "political" at all in America. Maybe you are only talking about white men?

michaelangelo_12 · 2025-04-18T02:05:30+00:00

Very correct observation. It's one of the holes in red pill ideology.

berichorbeburied · 2025-04-18T02:12:02+00:00

1st there’s nothing wrong with watching porn because if we break it down. The act of lusting for women is porn. Finding a woman sexually attractive is porn. Wanting to see a woman in a bikini is porn. In this way you are just literally attacking male sex drive and reframing it as being about a single instance of porn. Where if we peel back the layers it would encompass more than two people fucking on camera.

2nd plays into the first. Telling men not to have sex with willing consensual attractive women is once again just attacking male sex drive. Because if this is consensual. Then it takes a woman for that action to occur. Yet you are not blaming or advocating against women no where in your post. So that point should also not be taken seriously

Women can do whatever they want and are not held to codes of honor or integrity or morals or etc

So the best thing to do is let them do whatever they want and adapt and survive and thrive in that environment

And when you do that you let women fend for themselves and you worry about your own interests because you understand a woman will not worry about yours

And the key is not hating women or being mad or sad about it. The key is not caring. That is the key. Just enjoy the benefits and positives and don’t care.

Since women want to do whatever they want. Women are not men’s responsibility. Therefore if women are all hoes it’s fine. If women lie it’s fine. If women are emotional it’s fine. It’s all fine.

That’s why I personally don’t understand why men complain about the current climate. It’s not our responsibility anymore. And this is the one time in history we are free to do whatever we want. And we aren’t tied down by responsibility or tradition or purpose.

It’s just a sink or swim environment. Women are doing whatever they want to do. Regardless of it works or not. And it is on you as a man to adapt

So in summary. Men are letting women “run wild”. So it’s not there responsibility to correct or change their intended course. It’s to worry about their self interests and enjoy life. And let whatever happens to women or society or etc be upon their heads. It’s literally not a man’s responsibility anymore. Women gotta figure it out for themselves. If they want to be whores let them be whores. If they don’t then they don’t. The most important thing as a man rn. Is to get what you want out of life. And not to be trapped or tied down to how it used to be. It’s no longer your responsibility as a man

reallinustorvalds · 2025-04-18T08:52:11+00:00

That isn't hypocritical, genius.

Title	Conservative/red pill men complain about the degradation of society but partake in it themselves
Author	Blonde_Icon
Upvotes	99
Comments	232
Date	April 18, 2025 2:00 AM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1k1tsb1/conservativered_pill_men_complain_about_the/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/conservativered-pill-men-complain-about-the.1549922 https://theredarchive.com/post/1549922

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