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If you complain about “high n count slutty girls are no good for commitment”, it’s stupid to also complain about girls who dont fuck until the relationship is exclusive.

LillthOfBabylon

November 29, 2022

452 upvotes

/r/PurplePillDebate

I finally have proof that the same guy is claiming both.

“[Women] are more than welcome to have or not have as much sex as they want, and men are more than welcome not to commitment to promiscuous women.”

Which would be fair if it wasnt for this:

“I always laugh anytime I see a girl with a bio including something like "I don't have sex for 3 months" or "no sex until we're in an exclusive relationship", it screams I have baggage and am looking for a provider.”

https://www.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/z706ux/comment/iy86lsa/

I dont understand why men play this holier-than-thou virtue signalling BS when they clearly just want their dicks wet.

Clearly, if you just want a woman to fuck you within two minutes of knowing you, stop getting pissy that she’s fucked over a dozen guys. You’re not that special and what you want isnt that special either,

If you expect a woman to have a low n count after a certain age, it’s most likely because she’s picky about who she lets fuck her.

You cant have it both ways.

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Post Information

Title	If you complain about “high n count slutty girls are no good for commitment”, it’s stupid to also complain about girls who dont fuck until the relationship is exclusive.
Author	LillthOfBabylon
Upvotes	452
Comments	470
Date	November 29, 2022 2:58 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/z7wch6/if_you_complain_about_high_n_count_slutty_girls/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/if-you-complain-about-high-n-count-slutty-girls.1141388 https://theredarchive.com/post/1141388

Comments

[–]HazyMemory7They hated me because I spoke the truth[M] [score hidden] 3 years ago* stickied commentlocked comment (36 children) | Copy Link

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[–]lolthankstinderPurple Pill Adam 48 points49 points50 points 3 years ago (34 children) | Copy Link

If a high n-count guy complains about any women’s n-count, that’s just stupid and hypocritical. So, I think what you’re referring to here is mainly low n-count guys complaining about high n-count women.

It’s not her absolute n-count they care about, it’s her n-count relative to theirs. If a woman with a high n-count claims to be more conservative about sex, it’s probably because she was able to go through a developmental period of sexual promiscuity that eventually turned her off to casual sex. It’s not the n-count that upsets the guy, it’s jealousy, resentment, and perception of unfairness. What a guy like this is really saying is “I want a woman that doesn’t make me feel like she went around banging THGs while she was younger unsuccessfully locking them down and now finally decided to start having realistic physical standards but treats me differently”.

I was one of those “average guys” in college that saw the THG on my dorm floor have a different girl over every night. No matter how hard I try, I will ALWAYS have a haunting resentment that a woman I’m dating might’ve been one of those girls having fun with all the THGs while ignoring tf out of me until later in life. I hate that I feel that way, but I do. It’s just a side effect of growing up being sexually ignored and then suddenly getting more and more attention despite being the exact same damn person, just older and more established.

[–]FlyV89 26 points27 points28 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

This is exactly what one of my friends described to me.

It's intresting, but I think in the back of their minds, lots of "late bloomers" think like you. They can't stop living in the past, like they were stuck in that phase of their lives that they didn't get to live and they can past to the next one without having experienced it.

And you know what?

I think women in their 30's struggle a lot to find men to settle down with because lots of men in this age bracket have this same mindset.

It's kinda funny in a sense, because at some point in their lives women's rejection help to create the future men they are inevitably going to date in hopes to get married. Kinda like a self fulfilling prophecy or somethin.

And I kid you not...

I can absolutely 110% relate to you, thou in other forms.

I (33 years old) recently broke up with my ex-fiancee of 10 years to pursue the dreams I always wanted to follow when I was a young dude and was working 24/7 to help my younger brothers and my grandma to keep ahead.

I work since I was 14 (child work wasn't regulated by law two decades ago in Argentina, which mind you, was of great help to my situation) and I spent my youth working like a mule, buying food, clothes and paying rent because my brothers were too young to make a living for themselves. I became, in some bizarre way, a father of two when I was a teen and my pearents dumped us at our grandma's.

I had relationships here and there and sex wasn't really hard to get for me (luckily, my brothers and I hit the genetic jackpot or something like that, I think this is the only thing I can thank my pearents for haha) but other than that, I was broke, poor, misserable and ostracized by other teens, and I suffered great pain seing other kids living normal lives, studying, making friends, going out, practicing sports and having awesome hobbies, traveling around on vacations paid by their pearents, recieving gifts and presents for their birthday and Christmas, driving dad's car when they hit 18, having brand new clothes and dressing nice...

It's stupid, I know, but the lack of material stuff carved deep in me.

I couldn't understand why despite me sacrificing so much and being a good guy, I couldn't have the confourtable life other kids had.

And I grew up with a lot of resentment because of that. Not for the kids that had all the oportunities I didn't. I was happy that my friends were happy. I didn't resent my brothers for just being there, damn, I LOVE MY BOYS, dearly, and even when they are grown ass dudes now I would go far and beyond, all the way out again, just to be sure they are safe and happy.

And don't get me wrong, when I met my ex-fiancee, I didn't resent neither that she spent her best years traveling around the world, making friends and going to parties.

I was happy for her, and I could spent nights and nights hearing her talk about that time she was on Venice, or when she visited Disney for her 15th partner (I was never invited for a 15th party mind you) or the weekend she spent on cambodian beaches with her four best friends.

And when we got to our 30's and we got engaged, I was finally well stablished, I had the money, I had the bike I always wanted, I had the car I always dreamed of (a beautiful Chevrolet Nova 73' - Chevy here in Argentina - that my brothers and I restored almost from 0, we are damn proud of this car hahaha it was my grandpa's car actually) I was FINALLY there you know, and I thought we were going to travel the world together and she would teach me what's out there, she would show me the places she had been to, and we would enjoy together...

But... She didn't want to travel anymore. She was now ready to settle down, start a family, pay a mortage, start our own bussineses...

And all I could here was

"Ok you finished work like a mule? Great, now join me, I have work to do. More work."

Sadly, our relationship didn't resisted the differences between US.

It's simple. We were at DIFFERENT STAGES of life.

That's how I understood that.

We broke up and we parted ways amicably. Well she kinda hated me at the begining but I told her it was going to be all right, and I wasn't wrong.

She's an AMAZING woman, incredibly smart, drop dead gorgeous and on top of that she has a golden heart, so she didn't have any troubles finding another man.

She got married within two years and a half after we broke up, and I attended to her wedding even. She's not pregnant of 5 months, and she couldn't be happier, and so am I.

I'm now single, dating some young girls here and there, and I hit the road with my bike whenever I want. And I tell you dude, if I died tomorrow, I wouldn't regret ANYTHING of what I did in my life.

I'm the happiest man alive. And well, that's my story.

So yeah, I can relate to you, even if our lives are not exactly the same.

This FOMO thing, happens to a lot of men in lots of different ways, and I think this is because men have it harder while growing up in almost every aspect of life.

We start to enjoy life more around our 30's when we are stablished and acomplished.

Girls have guys buying them drinks and taking them out as soon as they hit puberty hahah it's more simple for them you know, but life is troubblesome for everyone at the end.

They have kinda a rouger patch when they start to feel like settling down and the only options they have around is men with lots of hang ups, "pending" things and dreams to chase.

[–]vorterNo Pill 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]FlyV89 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Makaveli676 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

If a high n-count guy complains about any women’s n-count, that’s just stupid and hypocritical

Hypocritical is commonly meaning: your actions not aligning with your words & claim of morality.

What do you mean by that? Are you just using that word to express disapproval of it? If so, why?

If you mean by “hypocritical” that it’s contradicting, how exactly? A pretty but broke woman complaining about her husband being broke too isn’t contradicting or hypocritical in my understanding. Men & women tend to have different sexual/dating preferences

What’s hypocritical about wanting something in someone (in this case, chastity) that you don’t have yourself?

Men & women’s sexual experience is held to two opposite standards in the dating market.

I hate that I feel that way, but I do

I think it’s reasonable to feel that way. Don’t feel guilty for thinking like that. I don’t see how it’s avoidable. A woman ignoring you (her future husband), carelessly reducing her sexual market value for the person she will get with when she’s ready to settle down (you), it’s inherently disrespectful towards her future husband and as the husband, it’s a degrading position to be in, it’s just a matter of if your recognize it or not. Your wife, the person who’s supposed to have the most love & respect for you, would be literally serving you the worst version of herself, that she lavished to other men who didn’t even commit to her.

A promiscuous woman has been considered “repellent” & condemned throughout human history, usually more brutally. Being with a woman of this nature should feel degrading.

[–]Leeola_Mcgillicuddy 25 points26 points27 points 3 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

[–]lolthankstinderPurple Pill Adam 15 points16 points17 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

I think what you're describing happens, which is why it's important to understand and appreciate everyone's perspective on things. But it's not just resentment, it's also:

jealousy, resentment, and perception of unfairness

Also I don't want to feel this way, I'm just honestly describing my genuine feelings (and probably how a lot of other guys feel as well):

I hate that I feel that way, but I do. It’s just a side effect of growing up being sexually ignored

I can relate to the feeling of being discarded because that was pretty much my college sexual experience. Except, rather than BE discarded, I just started off in the discard pile. I didn't even have a choice in the matter. So I empathize with the women cautiously joining me in the discard pile, but a little jealous they had to the opportunity to not start there to begin with.

[–]Due-Lie-8710 15 points16 points17 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]lolthankstinderPurple Pill Adam 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I know I feel that resentment and hate when people try to pathologize or invalidate it, but assuming I'm being the "safe" option for a girl makes a LOT of assumptions. For example, my girlfriend and I started off casual. At 27, it was the second time in my life I had EVER had consistent casual sex with someone! She had never been in an LTR while I had been in 2 (casual dating/sex was inaccessible for me). So of course I start assuming things... but a lot of it turned out to be false. After a month of sex, we got really drunk on a date and she said I was the hottest guy she'd ever slept with. I'd never heard that before in my life, EVER. The way she treated me made it seem true. It didn't seem like I was just a "safe" option to her. I assumed her n-count would be high... but overall it was lower than mine.

My girlfriend is over 3 years younger than me. I was a late bloomer growing up, constantly surrounded by women that had physically matured a little earlier (and liked guys that had also physically matured more). Women just naturally like guys that are physically/mentally mature so I feel like it's wrong to resent them for it. If anything you should resent the age stratification of our society and the all the cultural/legal factors surrounding the arbitrary number "18". It's like a big giant magic barrier that once you go off to college, hitting on any girl under 18 is weird or predatory... So I feel like I wasn't starved of sex because of women, I just had to wait to get older for it to be more "acceptable" to date the women that actually physically like me. And by that time, I was very behind. A lot of those women had already had a lot of experience so I was stuck playing catch up and thankfully didn't get caught in a rut of never being able to catch up.

[–]Due-Lie-8710 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

but thats the point right , her body count isnt high, majority of the poeple who usually have high body count usually get burned out because they usually go after meaningless sex until it becomes pointless or they get hurt by it and just want to settle down, its like you being used as a purpose to satisfy their emotional need rather than geniune love affection and desire of that particular person , and its also not a male only thing women have felt this too, like how some women choose not to date guys that ignored her when she wasnt beautiful and then changed thier mind when she did become beautiful , or a guy that screws up with a good woman and then comes back and gets screw and then feel he deserves a good woman again, its the same logic here, or the partner who opens up her marriage but then gets mad when it only works out well for her partner instead of her and then she chooses to close it off and the partner disagrees

[–]Leeola_Mcgillicuddy 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Leeola_Mcgillicuddy 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Due-Lie-8710 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

the answer is simple," i didnt ignore you , you ignored me, what she went through isnt my fault , if you are being sexually cautious from the start you wouldnt have that resentment, you having that resentment isnt my fault, now my resent is also not your fault but you dont get to use me as a fallback because you couldnt get what you want" , thats the mentality in question i am describing," its not that what you went through doesnt mean anything its that it could have been prevented and its not like you werent warn about that possibility you were and chose to go that route anyway and when it happened and you got hurt and now you want to use me as a way to heal yourself rather than because you actually care or love or desire me as a person, thats why it doesnt matter, i couldnt meet you , but you could meet me you just chose not to until you felt hurt and it was convenient for you to date the average guy when the guy you wanted didnt work out for you" this is how it feels when a woman with high body count go after a woman with low body usually , they tend to use the guy with low body count as a source of validation not because they care or loved the person but they have been hurt by the person they wanted initially

[–]8lankspace 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

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[–]insertcredit2Purple Pill Man - Married - INTP 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Men and women hold each other to different standards because men and women are different.

It's perfectly ok for a women who works a low paying job to want a guy with a high paying job despite the fact that she doesn't have a high paying job.

It's ok for a woman to expect her man to go downstairs when she hears a bump in the night when she wouldn't want to go down if he heard a bump.

It's ok for a short woman to want to date a guy over 6 foot despite her being 5'2.

most average women of dating age could fuck 10 guys this week with 0 effort and yet they don't. It's not weird to want one of the women who don't. Men simply don't have that option when they do (looking at you gay guys) then you see a lot more fucking as men are wired differently. It's okay to expect something from your partner that you don't do.

[–]jdsvmlghhjkhv 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]shonenhikada 13 points14 points15 points 3 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

[–]lolthankstinderPurple Pill Adam 20 points21 points22 points 3 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]shonenhikada 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Generalization are a good thing and not something we should turn away from. It helps us form a pattern in behavior and come to a conclusion from which we can use to keep ourselves informed.

The reality and general pattern for modern day women is to live their best years with one group of men (top 20%) then find a guy with the highest status/money that is willing to commit to her. Any guy who now notices a sudden increase in women's attention in their 30's should be cautious as the exceptions do not make the rule or end up like JDF here would ended up divorced and committing suicide.

Also this behavior is further corroborated when we look at marriage behaviour. On average statistical data shows first time marriages in US happens at 29-31 years of age. It coincides right around the time that women are freaking out about their age and getting old (age 30) and men mobilizing upwards in their career and most likely having save a sizeable fortune for themselves.

[–]lolthankstinderPurple Pill Adam 9 points10 points11 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

According to CDC data I’m in the top 28.3% of men for sex (18-45). You might assume I’m a total Chad, but if you saw me you’d be like “whoa this dude looks incredibly average”. About 1/3 of my sexual encounters were mainly just unenjoyable bouts of drunken desperation. And the rest mainly came from about 4 sexual encounters PER year on average from dating and several years of being single trying to find someone.

My gripe is not with women. My gripe is with the societal/cultural factors that shit on guys coming from both men and women. For example, I went to go get fitted for a suit a few weeks ago. They asked me if I knew my sizes and I guessed that my coat length would be regular because I’m quite literally right on the mean for height at 5’9”. Well, guess what? The “short” length fit me perfectly. Apparently “regular” men are only 5’10” to 6’2”… tons of men out there won’t even fit in a “short” and have to get it tailored. That’s the kind of shit that pisses me off.

I think women are always going to care about mens’ mental/physical maturity, status, and stuff, just like men are always going to care about womens’ weight. The key to fixing the god awful male/female desirability and sex gap is NOT hating women, it’s hating whoever the hell decided “regular” men are 5’10” - 6’2” (and that was probably a dude that decided that). It’s breaking the expectation that men have to approach women, causing women to get absolutely inundated in attention and astronomically jack up their physical standards (for those juicy tall guys deemed high status by society). It’s realizing the effects of age stratification of our education systems on men that physically mature slower, causing them to sexually mature while surrounded in women that sexually matured a little earlier and are naturally attracted to more physically mature (probably older) guys.

If you help create a world where height means nothing more than having freckles (something you’re just born with), where men and women feel free to approach whomever, that’s aware of age stratification and doesn’t pathologize or criminalize YOUNG guys 18-20 going for girls a just a little bit younger, I bet most of this dating asymmetry crap would disappear.

[–]Suriels_cat 9 points10 points11 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

I don't get why men are resentful of this. In the past they were not part of that top 20% of attractive men, and also had nothing else to offer as they were teens/in college. As they aged they still do not have the beauty of those top men, but they have things to offer now, like financial stability, personality traits that come with maturity and wisdom, etc. It makes sense that now women would be interested in those men rather than their past versions that were a worse version of the top men.

Men do a similar thing...they go after women primarily for beauty, and if a woman becomes more conventionally attractive, such as through weight loss, she gets flooded with male attention that wasn't there before despite being the same person. Also rich women get much more male attention than poor women. While "gold digger" men aren't as common, they're still plenty of them.

I think we're all aware from a young age physical appearance is the number one most important thing when it comes to attractiveness for....anyone, so I don't get the resentment of this biological fact. We aren't all good looking, and those of us that aren't have to be desirable in other ways/offer something else besides looks. If one doesn't have looks, then what do they have to attract a partner? If their personality is also average, and they aren't financially stable...what is it? There has to be something.

[–]Due-Lie-8710 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]shonenhikada 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Due-Lie-8710 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Suriels_cat 6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

I understand that part of it for sure, I just don't get why resentment is the emotion for either gender. I can get being sad or feeling like you're missing out on what beautiful people get to do, but resentment doesn't really make sense when you think about it.

Of course who wouldn't want to be a brilliant and charming 10/10 supermodel, right? But for those of us that aren't at the top, why resent other people for wanting to be with attractive people? Is it because, growing up, some people were raised with the unrealistic expectation that one day they would be lusted after? Realistically speaking most of us aren't going to be anyone's top choice because we're all wired to wanna reproduce with the best. But being less than someone's fantasy ideal doesn't mean your partner won't love you of that you can't have a fulfilling, normal relationship.

Maybe it's just entitlement for these types of people—wanting to be perceived as special and desirable when one isn't. It's like being a bad employee at a job and being resentful that you didn't get a promotion.

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Isn't it like the "nice guy" logic? Like expecting something from someone because X reason?

I’m not sure what you mean. The logic is that a woman who is dating a guy should be as sexually attracted to him as the guy who she had casual sex or first date sex with in the past. If she’s not having sex as soon, then the manosphere takes that as evidence that she’s not as sexually attracted to that guy and, hence, he is a beta.

This is so strange. The RPWomen sub is filled with advice not to sleep with the guy right away, to maka them wait until things get serious. I thought RP men dated RP women but idk now.

FDS is a big proponent of making men wait, and the Red Pill take on them is that these women were mostly “alpha widows” who were previously pumped and dumped and thus they were now so bitter that they make the men they date wait a long time for sex. Women who have always made men wait for sex are considered “unicorns”.

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I don't see how this is nice guy logic it's having mental point of origin and self respect saying I'm not going to work harder and get less from a woman than somebody else because that is indicative of less than 100% genuine desire. Sure she could have genuinely changed ( but is that change truly through every aspect of her being or is it only the ego and not the id). If she didn't change at every level both conscious and subconscious dating her could easily result in a less than satisfactory sex life and a i love you but im not in love with you situation. Why risk it when the point is to be high value enough to have options so you don't have to risk that.

Vast majority of the women that red pilllers date are not red pill women looks affluence and game attract 99.9% of women so why limit yourself. Also (pw is just women accepting the redpill and trying to think of ways to attract high value men in that paradigm whether they be blue or red pilled alphas.

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Two things.

1) That’s only from your perspective - there is a population of those women you don’t care about who cared about YOU, which is it’s own whole dynamic. Irl, there’s probably an equal cost burden between the genders here.

2) Given the virtue signaling, you should only respect that woman for waiting. The fact that your mind jumps to deceit and lack of sex when you hear this instead of believing her, tells us the priority is not actually on the moral or logistical good of her celibacy. Yall are just really annoyed you can’t get sex now, and you rile yourself up by creating this idea that she’s a liar or has a character flaw.

We are suspicious of the immediate presumption of guilt. It’s so ok to just want sex, but men make it alot harder on themselves when they vilify people for giving them what they’re asking for.

[–]BridgeBurner22 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

[–]LadyofTheGreyPathAngel Mind On Demon Time 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Men don't care about a woman being a slut.

Disproved in 3..2..1..

What men do care about is a slut, who pretends to be a prude, to manipulate a man into giving her more commitment than he would be giving her otherwise.

So, the issue is that she's a slut but in also that she lied about it, but the primary reason is that she's a slut.

You all have no problem with building a relationship on false pretenses.

?

It's really sad you can expect more honesty from a woman when she sees you as a human dildo, than you can expect from a woman who wants to date you seriously.

Since you called yourself a Red Pill man, is this not what you wanted? To be seen as a human dildo and not to be dated seriously? And why would a woman lying to you bother you so much? TRP doesn't teach men how to get relationships it teaches them how to get sex, as such you weren't going to be dating that woman anyway.

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Of course a man has a right to be angry at however his relationship is going? What you CANNOT accept and it shows very much by how pedantic your argument is, is losing control and power. You want women to be able to whatever the fuck they want and not have any consequences.

Saying a man doesn't have to put up with a former whore withholding sex isn't the same as saying her pussy belongs to him. Only a deluded, jaded women would draw that conclusion from that.

This has absolutely fuck-all to do with bodily autonomy. It has to do with men not wanting to pursue a relationship with a former ho if she is treating him as lesser than men who fucked her and dumped her.

Maybe an analogy you can understand. Everyone has freedom of speech. They have bodily autonomy over their mouth and brain. But if they say hate-speech, they can and should absolutely be punished for it.

Likewise, a ho can ho around. But if she then chooses to act like she doesn't let men easily pump and dump her to a guy that she wants a relationship with by withholding sex, that man can do whatever the fuck he wants by most commonly deciding she is not worth it.

[–]AcanthocephalaNew947Willing to tell you its your face not your personality. 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

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This is exactly what they’re saying and they’re not even good about hiding it LMAO. It’s as if they think a woman who waits to have sex 1 month, that’s her permanently set time with every man ever. A woman who has had a ONS is now only allowed to make ANY man wait a couple hours. It’s ridiculous. As if each dyad isn’t a new situation, as if chemistry doesn’t vary, circumstances don’t change (maybe she didn’t shave, maybe she’s on her period, maybe she’s ovulating and doesn’t want to risk it, maybe she wants to establish you’re not trying to pump & dump, maybe she wants to actually get to know you for more than a couple hours, maybe she isn’t horny that night, maybe she gasp! didn’t go out to seek sex that night, etc)… nope, none of that matters, because she’s had a ONS before. It’s very much “You’re a slut so know your place.”

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

You are talking about the difference between a man just wanting sex and a man who is looking for a wife. Women can have it both ways if they want by having such amazing personalities, domestic skills, and looks, that the men the sleep with wants to marry them. By the 10th man, I would hope you at least have some direction in mind. Say you try out 5 more relationships before you’ve had the time to become the best version of yourself, and know what type of man you would like. There are lots of men who will sleep with you still even with a high count. The ones who don’t want to sleep with you over your count shouldn’t bother you in the same way that a man who only dates tall girls shouldn’t bother you if you are short. The guys that complain about the relationship rule before sex are unlikely to be good husbands anyway. I think you are conflating the two types of men on the dating market, but it’s certainly possible that there’s a guy out there who has complained about both on the same day. It could easily be the same guy like 5 years apart though. If that’s the reality of all men, then as a heterosexual woman who wants a husband someday, it would be wise to observe this fact about men, and recognize that men value the quality of your past relationships, not quantity. You can learn a lot about a men in a long relationship with one, but if you are young and your body count is greater than your age, it is mathematically impossible for you to have spent the necessary time learning to cohabitate with a man for me to offer you my hand in marriage. If we were both young, we could grow and learn together, but if we are both 30+, I have younger options who have less past lovers for me to compete with. Again, it shouldn’t bother you if anything I said doesn’t vibe with you, as we just aren’t meant to be together. However if I tell you that a majority of men think like this, and that upsets you, I would advise that you not take the advice of single women on how to get a man.

[–]themoderationPeople Over Pill 19 points20 points21 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Spare me the melodrama. You aren’t being sold into slavery, you are not meeting one man’s standards for the most single most important woman in his life. And, yes from the age that you realize that your next relationship should be for marriage, I would hope that 2 years is a reasonable milestone to demonstrate you are capable of long term relationships. Unless your standards are so low that all the men you sleep with don’t make it more than a few months, or so high that you deem no one worthy to last more than that. Your reaction shows that you consider men’s red flags unreasonable, yet I’m sure you have your own. If you are a heterosexual woman who wants a husband, AND you went through your twenties not looking for one, AND slept with 10+ men, AND you can’t start being more selective with relationships, AND you are upset that most men will see not see a strong likelihood that they will be the person you will be loyal to for the rest of your lives…. That’s coming from a place of entitlement in my opinion. It’s like you want to treat your sexuality as something “off limits” for judgement from a person willing to dedicate the rest of their life to you. I would hope it would make a difference to you if you had to pick between two guys and one of them had kids with two different women, or regularly went to the strip club, or was at the club every night rubbing up on strangers looking for a one night stand. Men are not that picky compared to women, women are just less adjusted to being rejected. We don’t need you to be a virgin. We don’t need your body count to be less than 10. We don’t care if you actually aren’t as pretty as your pictures online. You can be emotionally needy, low income, have less domestic skills than your mother or grandmother, and we will still marry you. Then if men say one thing that might be a red flag for the most important choice of our lives, and that’s too much.

Why don’t you tell me what a man should look for in a marriage? Should a man have any red flags at all? If so, what would be something that a woman could do that could disqualify her from marriage in a man’s eye, without the man being considered too judgmental? You sarcastically replied “deemed too used up to live up to these men’s standards”. Surely, you don’t exclusively date men with no standards at all? They have to have some standards, so which standards are appropriate in your mind, and what specifically about a high body count makes it too sacred to judge compared to, say not making enough money for example?

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As for this specific example, a woman using a dating app is going to perceived as someone who has a past in 99% of situations...that's why her claiming to "hold out for sex" is humorous for a man (because she likely hasn't in the past).

All you have to do is realize that there are levels to a man's psyche:

Level 1: We are sexually attracted to most women, and will likely have sex with someone if she's willing, available, and even moderately attractive. But this means nothing about commitment, and we'll probably regret it the next morning if we know she's been around.

Level 2: We can be exclusive to a woman who has a past, but treats us at least as we perceive on par with other men in her past. EG she has sex with us immediately, and is not making ridiculous demands or standards that she likely didn't put on other men. The problem with her is that we feel like we are constantly competing for this woman (even though her past is the past, and she promises exclusivity)

So again, we can be exclusive to this woman sexually. But if we meet another woman who we can emotionally connect with her more, our instinct would be to leave the Level 2 woman for her as quickly as possible, because we will never be free from the constraint of judgement/competition.

Level 3: Although we can be exclusive with a woman and only have sex with her, I don't see that as true "commitment". There is another level - a "Madonna", who we would lay down our future and life for if necessary. This woman doesn't necessarily have to be a virgin, but the man has to believe this woman was put on Earth for us and only us. Unfortunately, men who treat women like this get labeled as simps and often get taken advantage of.

So interestingly enough, treating a woman like this will only work if she's inexperienced and hasn't trusted men in the past because she has fewer experiences to compare us to. A man can thus be allowed to express himself freely, without feeling like he's being judged by her, and the relationship can grow as naturally as possible (obviously it's not as simple as that, but that's how we will view her...through a lens of innocence and always giving her the benefit of the doubt).

That's really all there is to it. Men aren't that complicated.

[–]LillthOfBabylon[S] 12 points13 points14 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

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[–]ConsciousGuidance5 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Why are men so afraid of being judged by women? And why do you presume lack of judgement only comes from inexperience?

Men want to be judged on what they can control - especially what they can offer a particular woman that no one else can (IE Proving his motivation to provide, listen to, and work with her as being stronger than anyone else in the world).

But we don't want to be judged on traits that are only markers for competition with other men (What's he look like? How competitive and confident does he appear on the outside? Does he have a lot of influence on other men?). It's impossible to be best in all of those categories, so it's futile. And even then, those traits have nothing to do with how much you care about a woman....they are all male-focused. Sure, it feels great if a woman acknowledges you for these traits like height, but if it's not something we can actively work on and improve on (like being dedicated to woodworking), then it will just be a hollow compliment and we will have no real affinity for the woman herself.

So again, it's not about a woman having standards...it's about her standard being sexual attraction, which just happens to coincide with immutable, competitive male traits and not how much a man cares about a particular woman.

It's important to note that this doesn't mean we fear other men, as any man would fight if something he loved was threatened. But having to constantly fight/compete (even if only psychologically) is exhausting and a huge barrier to being able to trust a woman.

[–]Leeola_Mcgillicuddy 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

So it is okay to judge a woman's worth concerning commitment on being moderately attractive enough to bang but not hot enough to commit to? Then simultaneously believe and be very angry behind women who want to give their vagina to a man at her own judgements. So like if she gives it to Chad "easier" because she judges him as more valuable to sleep with faster than you or she is more easily aroused by him than you than she is a "slut" who isn't worth your time or effort? She is less valuable in your eyes. But women cannot take a collective view of you being less valuable in her eyes as far as sleeping with her and discarding her because you were not hot enough to do so and she may feel like it wouldn't be worth it to let an average not hot male have access to her so easily.

So ultimately I hope most of you can admit as males with this view and with this thinking and holding yourselves up and trying to position yourselves as the ones that should have all the control and options , the ones that get to decide worthiness or unworthiness according to your male perspective, that you are the exact reason women have to fight for their human rights. I see a lot of whining and crying about feminism ruining everything. But it is amazing how you can make excuses for your way of thinking and blame women for not wanting to "play fair" or outright refusing more and more to deal with males with this thinking and indoctrination at all. If you can have this mindset about relationships and sex most people can only guess at what your minds and ideologies began to develop for women and girls as a whole and in other aspects of life. Which is how oppression for women and girls is born and has been sustained for a very long time .

*when I say you, I am meaning "males with this view"....it is not a personal attack. I am speaking of all the males with this mentality and the view..

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no one is saying this, again you see this as punishment , you arent being punished because you arent supposed to be given anything from the start on the basis of you just wanting it , and men do say it with their chest the problem, women cant handle it, they usually end up being upset about the fact that a man even cares about this, you are literally proof of this , again no one is controlling women autonomy you just cant handle the fact that a man can reject women for this reason because you somehow believe that their preference has be fair to you , it doesnt ,

i think you are under the misconception that you get to dictate how men set their terms for a relationship with the woman they want , again you dont, just because a lot of men want women with low body count doesnt mean you have to listen to them go date someone that likes you, good for you , he see you as worthy if others dont so what, have your autonomy and these men can go find a woman who actually meets their standards as in not you and it shouldnt matter and if it does then it because you hate the fact that some men want someone that isnt you

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Usually combination of picking up on body language, snooping through her social media (if not private), being non-judgement and getting her drunk to talk about herself. Bonus points if you are around similar social circles and are acquaintance with some of the people she regularly get down with.

Women like to talk about themselves, eventually they let their past slip out or say something that doesn't align with how they present to the person that let's a man know that is all fake.

There are also risk factors that you can find on websites that talks about certain traits that men should look out for with regards to promiscuous women. Some of these include: 1. poor relationship with daddy 2. social media addict 3. unnatural hair colour 4. Unusually piercing like bull rings 5. Very big tattoos 6. mental illness 7. still friends with her ex or has tons of male friends8. Her friends are known sluts etc.

[–]No_Reflection_798Optimistic against all reasons not to be. 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

I dont understand why men play this holier-than-thou virtue signalling BS when they clearly just want their dicks wet.

You're still missing the point. What the guy is saying is that he is looking for a healthy relationship. I see those types of bios myself, and, yes, those are red flags that a guy has to come to terms with, one way or the other. He may choose to give it a go. Or, he may realize that it's either not what he's looking for, or that it's trouble, or that she is not the type of girl for him.

The fact that some stranger is already putting some arbitrary transactional standards on the relationship before you even meet is a harbinger of what is to come. It's not the words, it's the meaning behind them. Think of the type of person, and the situation that they are in, where those phrases seem reasonable.

Guys don't just want their dicks wet. At least, quality guys don't. Stop chasing those types of guys, and stop harboring this thought. It's not healthy, and overall not true with a majority of men.

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[–]Dstar5388881 points 3 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

Exactly, some of these men want a girl to sleep with them after 2 seconds of talking, but then get very butthurt when they find out she's sleeping with other guys...like dude what do you expect?? if she sleeps with you that quickly and you guys haven't agreed to be exclusive, then chances are she's doing that with other guys too....what is making some of you men on here think that you are so special that she's only supposed to sleep with you when you don't even want to commit to her anyways?? I would genuinely like to know because it's the delusion for me....and for the ones claiming they want a "good girl" with a low body count...news flash: a woman like that is not gonna fuck you right away...she's more than likely very selective about who she sleeps with and will probably require an emotional connection and exclusivity from you first... which will take time ( probably couple months at the minimum)....you guys can't have your cake and eat it too.... if any of what I just said bothers you, either use your right hand, go buy a blow up doll, go pay an escort, or just fuck each other since y'all need it that bad lol...

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Not what I'm saying at all.

One of the few woman I considered having a relationship with had a high n count we got along really well.

She made me wait and the insult of it, and the fact it meant she didn't want to fuck me made me both not like her or trust her, I'm not gonna trust a woman with a high libido or n count to A not cheat or B not just give me obligatory reward/intimacy sex if she doesn't want me enough physically that she thinks I want to make him wait. I left.

The withholding sex also turns away guys who may have wanted a relationship with you. You don't want to fuck someone and fucking is part of even a relationship, a big part, someone who really doesn't want to fuck you.

I don't want to be with a woman who withholds sex, I don't care about past n count and a guy who doesn't care, is also a guy who likes a very sexual woman and isn't going to feel affection for you if he has to wait. He will if he is not desperate just decide a relationship is not worth it and get laid with someone else.

[–]LadyofTheGreyPathAngel Mind On Demon Time 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

She made me wait and the insult of it, and the fact it meant she didn't want to fuck me made me both not like her or trust her, I'm not gonna trust a woman with a high libido or n count to A not cheat or B not just give me obligatory reward/intimacy sex if she doesn't want me enough physically that she thinks I want to make him wait. I left.

This is the second time I've heard a man in this community complain about a woman with a high libido, and the second time I've heard someone say a woman with a high libido cannot be trusted. I'm going to assume this is a broad generalization and not just women with high libidos who don't have casual sex because you made no mention of it.

The withholding sex also turns away guys who may have wanted a relationship with you. You don't want to fuck someone and fucking is part of even a relationship, a big part, someone who really doesn't want to fuck you.

Does this apply to the high n woman you were going on about or women in general? Not really following what you're saying here.

I don't care about past n count and a guy who doesn't care,

Uhhhh actually you said you did here

She made me wait and the insult of it, and the fact it meant she didn't want to fuck me made me both not like her or trust her, I'm not gonna trust a woman with a high libido or n count to A not cheat or B not just give me obligatory reward/intimacy sex if she doesn't want me enough physically that she thinks I want to make him wait. I left.

The withholding sex also turns away guys who may have wanted a relationship with you

That's not what the sounds like, if they didn't get sex immediately and are THIS pissed about it, well it sounds more like they're mad they didn't get a chance to add another notch to their belt. Same if a girl says she'll split the bill but then gets very angry when it comes time to split the bill, sounds more like she wanted a freebie.

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Don't women on ppd always say, why is someone else's dating preferences any of your business?

There is a middle ground between two minutes (which is a strawman by the way), and waiting for some girl with an arbitrary several months rule or waiting until you are an exclusive relationship with a girl, which can also take several months.

Women pushed for the sexual revolution. Why in the world should a man with options initiate/ask a woman out, plan a date, pay for dates for months on end commit to women before they even know if they are sexually compatible? Expecting commitment without sex isn't feasible unless you're staying celibate until marriage or something. The sort of man most women want to date will simply move on.

Don't get me wrong, some women genuinely have very conservative values on intimacy, but women if you aren't getting intimate to some degree within the first 3-5 dates, which is what normal people do by the way, then odds are a) the girl is not attracted to you and b) she is not having sex to try and create a power dynamic, not because she doesn't feel comfortable.

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Have you even dated before lmao? People talk about past relationships very early on. On first dates where you talk for at least an hour, we'll talk about family (potential daddy issues), past relationships and what they've been up to romantically recently.

I have no clue what you're getting at in the second part. It's not being "autistic-ly weird" to look deeper, that's the whole point of this sub. If they're actively dating but she's withholding sex then the guy is thinking she's not AS attracted to him as other dudes which she let smash on the first night. And no guy wants to be the guy she settled (or in most cases, she thinks she settled*) for.

*By this, it's because women get an overinflated sense of their value in the SMV because they get pumped and dumped by more attractive dudes who won't take her seriously.

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[–]lovestocommentRed Pill Man 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Promiscuous women being no good for relationships was never a complaint. It was more so an observation and pointing out the phenomena men experience.

The complaint is " if she gives it up easily and quickly to other guys, why should I wait and invest more when they haven't for something used?" That's why men use the "used car" analogy. I have yet to see a sensible response to that question or complaint from blue pills.

Also, I don't see men complaining about low or no body count women making them wait for sex. And most sensible men wait because they understand the benefits of waiting. Those being; sex will bond that woman to him, increases chances of paternity, lease likely to cheat and its the ultimate show if affection for women.

I think this post was made out of frustration of not understanding men and what they value and why they do. The logic of the complaints are not going to make sense, if do know have context.

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Well that’s an entirely separate topic, my point was that the comment you’re referring to seemingly doesn’t align with your title.

It seems as if you feel more against the idea of men complaining about how promiscuous women tend to be while simultaneously being upset that women don’t put out immediately for them. While I agree doing/thinking both is counterproductive and borderline hypocritical, I don’t think I could label that as “stupid”, as there is a strong factor of “every man for himself” that can’t be ignored. That idea is similar to how “insecurity” can be a positive force in certain circumstances.

All that being said, to address your response. There’s nothing wrong with saying that, and I even think that’s extremely respectable. It’s the fact that you’re brandishing it up front and feel as if you can’t wait to say it.

By brandishing it that way, you’re eluding to the idea that it has happened to you so many times that you are fed up with it to the point where it needs to take up space within seconds of your first impression.

Hence the “baggage” part included in the comment you’re referring to. It points towards a woman having baggage because something drove her to that point to brandish it that way. Reason being that a woman who believed that from the start would have no reason to place that statement right there as a first impression.

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[–]edgyny𝒥𝑒𝓇𝓀-𝑜𝒻𝒻 𝑜𝒻 𝓂𝒶𝓃𝓎 𝓉𝓇𝒶𝒹𝑒𝓈 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon[S] 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]edgyny𝒥𝑒𝓇𝓀-𝑜𝒻𝒻 𝑜𝒻 𝓂𝒶𝓃𝓎 𝓉𝓇𝒶𝒹𝑒𝓈 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon[S] 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]edgyny𝒥𝑒𝓇𝓀-𝑜𝒻𝒻 𝑜𝒻 𝓂𝒶𝓃𝓎 𝓉𝓇𝒶𝒹𝑒𝓈 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Due-Lie-8710 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Dstar5388881 points 3 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]jellybeanzandtingsModerator[M] 0 points1 point2 points 3 years agolocked comment (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Square-Pie9671 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]DoinIt989 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Ducks_Are_WatchingNo Pill, I'm on rehab 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon[S] 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Ducks_Are_WatchingNo Pill, I'm on rehab 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Dizzy_Nerve3091 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]WouldUbuy 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Saitama1993 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]RGL137 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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