The Orgasm Gap

sleepy-kitten-zzz · 2021-05-10T00:42:32+00:00

[deleted]

Phoesilvle · 2021-05-10T10:50:47+00:00

Another reditor already quoted this paper, but the numbers supplied there clearly show it is not just biology:

Heterosexual men were most likely to say they usually-always orgasmed when sexually intimate (95%), followed by gay men (89%), bisexual men (88%), lesbian women (86%), bisexual women (66%), and heterosexual women (65%).

If the orgasm gap existed only due to biological reasons we would expect to see the same orgasm-frequency with lesbian women and heterosexual women.

In light of this I would see responsibilities with both men and women to see a rise in female orgasm-frequency. As it takes two to tango, I think both the affected women should strive for sexual encounters they feel secure and confortable in that they can allow themselves to enjoy an orgasm (not in this paper shown, but one-night-stands have on average absymally bad orgasm-rates for women) and men should take the time and dedication and skill to aid a womans orgasm

SmurfESmurferson · 2021-05-10T01:41:49+00:00

Sex can still be satisfying, but there’s nothing like an orgasm

I mean, doctors had to invent the vibrator in order to cure women of hysteria. This has been going on since forever - our plumbing is just so much more confusing

NinjaOfTheSouth · 2021-05-10T00:47:16+00:00

To put it simply, it’s more complex to make a women cum. There’s all the different spots and areas for them. Men can’t really do shit about it except try lmao. If a women doesn’t tell her fuckbuddy what makes her cum, that’s on her.

Laytheblameonluck · 2021-05-10T01:43:01+00:00

Originally, there was the "desire discrepancy" also called the "desire gap" - studies consistently show men desire sex more often than women, in aggregate.

The idea floating around is that this is because of the "orgasm gap".

However, female orgasms don't necessarily increase interest in sex, the only model and evidence that it does, is the Basson model of circular desire - however that specifically does not say orgasms are necessary, and it won't increase interest in sex to the level which men feel it.

If you read /r/deadbedrooms, you will read of plenty of discussion where the female has plenty of orgasms yet is still low libido.

One theory postulated is that some people are "sexual introverts" and find sex draining, and even find orgasms draining.

In any case, there is no evidence that closing the orgasm gap will cause equality of desire.

Sid_Insidious · 2021-05-10T00:47:13+00:00

Every time I hear someone coming up with a new "gap" that women have to endure, I get this sharp pain in my wallet.

Namah-Mayco · 2021-05-10T02:34:07+00:00

Is this the case for all sex or just casual sex?

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10508-017-0939-z

Compared to women who orgasmed less frequently, women who orgasmed more frequently were more likely to: receive more oral sex, have longer duration of last sex, be more satisfied with their relationship, ask for what they want in bed, praise their partner for something they did in bed, call/email to tease about doing something sexual, wear sexy lingerie, try new sexual positions, anal stimulation, act out fantasies, incorporate sexy talk, and express love during sex. Women were more likely to orgasm if their last sexual encounter included deep kissing, manual genital stimulation, and/or oral sex in addition to vaginal intercourse. We consider sociocultural and evolutionary explanations for these orgasm gaps. The results suggest a variety of behaviors couples can try to increase orgasm frequency.

Seems to be all sex, however, stuff you'd expect from a more intimate relationship seems to give a better chance of orgasming compared to casual sex.

Reading this whole article, two takeaways are that it's a combination of biology and lack of understanding of anatomy (for both men and women). Articles seem to imply that getting better at oral would be the simple solution, but for myself I focused on learning about the g-spot and a-spot.

xFallacyx69 · 2021-05-10T02:33:47+00:00

Yeah. It's a thing. But there's fault everywhere.

Anecdotally, from talking to my single women friends, it's because dudes neglect foreplay, don't take instruction, or get all butt-hurt when they're told their fool-proof technique for getting a lady off isn't working.

Anecdotally, from talking to my single male friends, it's because women are often clueless about how to get themselves off, clueless about how a dude would even go about getting them off, are terrible at giving instructions, or just expect a dude to turn up automatically knowing exactly what works.

Sex is like driving. Everyone thinks they're better than average, and it's the other people that are the problem.

fakingandnotmakingit · 2021-05-10T01:46:47+00:00

Is this the case for all sex or just casual sex? For (unmarried) relationships I would think a lack of sexual satisfaction would be a deal breaker

All sex in general. Sexual satisfaction should be a deal breaker, but a lot of women have never had an orgasm or don't prioritise it. It's also why I think women have the tendency to have casual sex once or twice and then GENERALLY opt out. The exception is when they're having sex within a STR or a FWB because they can have a better experience.

Anecdotally (which isn't worth much tbh, but I can't find anything on it while I'm at work) women I know are demanding it more often. Which is to say, it will increasingly become a deal breaker for LTRs. I know it is for me.

The definition equates sexual satisfaction to achievement of orgasm, but is this necessarily the case? Do women enjoy sex even when they don't orgasm?

We can have fun without it, and I think in some ways our sexuality is slightly more complicated than just have sex - >orgasm. In saying that it is becoming more of a priority I think.

Why does this gap exist? Are men responsible for this gap or is it just biology?

Part of it is sexuality is complicated. But part of it is honestly the fact that people can't find/ don't care enough to find the bloody clit. Also I've heard weird shit where guys do things like slapping it or something. That... Doesn't do anything.

Should men be expected to put more effort into sex (compared to women) because of this gap?

Define effort I guess? I mean sex should be a mutual and reciprocal experience. Like if I give a bj, I expect some sort of reciprocation which we both find fun. In theory that means we should get each other off and enjoy doing so. Like foreplay should be fun for everyone.

I'm not sure about "should" put in more effort. I don't think there's a "should". Its more I guess, it's fine if you don't because no one should be forced to do sexual acts out of obligation.

but be prepared to be dumped after. Or as is common with people i know, for girls to tell other girls you're bad in bed. Or as is also Ive heard becoming more common, women who refuse to get into PiV sex without the guy getting them off first. Since they won't get much out of it otherwise.

2021-05-10T05:14:20+00:00

The gap is largest w male and female partners, it goes down when women sleep w women.

Creation_Soul · 2021-05-10T06:33:21+00:00

The thing about casual sex (or sex with any new partner for that matter) is that you don't know what the other one likes, so the sex can be somethat generic (you do what you think the other may like based on experience).

I have been with my wife for 10 years now (married for 3) and I know what she likes, but if I were again to be in the dating market I have no idea how my "sex skills" would translate to pleasing a random woman I just met.

No-Seaworthiness959 · 2021-05-10T10:46:54+00:00

What the women who argue about the orgasm gap do not understand is: Just because the man orgasms during sex does not mean the sex was good.

superlurkage · 2021-05-10T13:48:25+00:00

It exists. That’s one of the reasons we don’t want to fuck as much as men, obviously.

LeadInfusedRedPill · 2021-05-10T01:08:51+00:00

A lot of woman are horrible at figuring out what gets them off or refuse to communicate it.

decoy88 · 2021-05-10T02:05:10+00:00

The Orgasm Gap

The orgasm gap, or pleasure gap, is a social phenomenon referring to the general disparity between heterosexual men and women in terms of sexual satisfaction —more specifically, the unequal frequency in achievement of orgasm during sexual encounters.

Is this the case for all sex or just casual sex? For (unmarried) relationships I would think a lack of sexual satisfaction would be a deal breaker

It can be in relationship sex too. But is much more prevalent for casual encounters (especially ONS).

The definition equates sexual satisfaction to achievement of orgasm, but is this necessarily the case? Do women enjoy sex even when they don't orgasm?

Yep. Many women enjoy sex without an orgasm, but I think even those women would prefer it with an orgasm.

Why does this gap exist? Are men responsible for this gap or is it just biology?

yes and no and yes. It’s a combination of:

Women’s orgasm biologically more complicated than men’s to achieve.
Women (particularly young women), not knowing themselves sexually and/or not communicating to men what they like in sex.
Men being unwilling to perform the way women need for their orgasm, often prioritising their own pleasure with no regard for hers - way less likely in an LTR because men typically care about who they commit to.

Should men be expected to put more effort into sex (compared to women) because of this gap?

Depends on their goals. If he wants repeat customers, absolutely. If she just wants a another notch, I guess he has no incentive. Plus the more men who fail at this, the better other men who try actually look.

Rfupon · 2021-05-10T01:07:24+00:00

[deleted]

OldSimpsonsisbetter · 2021-05-10T03:15:19+00:00

Even if a man can make a woman cum every time she has sex, the woman will still not be satisfied. In this age of swipe culture, 3rd wave feminism and social media, women are never satisfied.

Algae_Natural · 2021-05-10T09:58:10+00:00

If you consider natural selection, it makes perfect sense for male orgasms to be easier an more common. Males who have problems achieving less frequent orgasms generated less offspring.

mindsanitizer · 2021-05-12T13:49:37+00:00

If women really cared about orgasms they would work out how to orgasm by themselves, communicate that to their partners, and filter for partners that were open to taking that feedback.

Pastelitomaracucho · 2021-05-10T04:05:28+00:00

Women: YoU ArE ReSpOnSiBlE FoR YoUr OwN OrGASMS.

Also women: omg the orgasm gap

thetruthishere_ · 2021-05-10T01:46:51+00:00

Yes, sex can be enjoyable without an orgasam.

That said, as a women I know how to get off with a man. I know myself.

I think many women out there dont know their body enough to know how to get off is part of this gap. Or tell a man what works for her. Its not just its 'causal' and men dont do enough.

If I were to do casual... if he wont let me ride his D till I get off or give me oral till I get off I'll never see him again.

reluctantly_red · 2021-05-10T06:36:24+00:00

the unequal frequency in achievement of orgasm during sexual encounters.

Women may not always climax but when they do it's more intense and they can orgasm multiple times. If there's an orgasm gap it's in women's favor.

BioStu · 2021-05-10T12:05:15+00:00

The orgasm gap is caused by female ED

Female Sexual Dysfunction

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/female-sexual-dysfunction/symptoms-causes/syc-20372549

Dec 17, 2020 — This most common of female sexual dysfunctions involves a lack of sexual interest and willingness to be sexual. Sexual arousal disorder. Your desire for sex might be intact, but you have difficulty with arousal or are unable to become aroused or maintain arousal during sexual activity.

Also Frigidity

What causes frigidity in a woman?

This disorder can stem from psychological or emotional problems such as stress, anxiety, depression, fatigue, worry, guilt, fear of painful intercourse and fear of pregnancy. It can also develop from the undesirability of a partner, the undesirability of the setting, and the use of alcohol or drugs.

SaBahRub · 2021-05-10T00:38:19+00:00

The orgasm gap just is. Women have orgasms because men have nipples; it’s biological superfluousness

It’s not men’s fault, but it’s also why we’re never going to be as thirsty as them

Orange_Paisley · 2021-05-10T01:42:36+00:00

[deleted]

SylvestorTalone · 2021-05-10T04:18:23+00:00

Has anyone researched into whether this is actually separate from how women are always less satisfied with everything?

lestratege · 2021-05-10T11:48:13+00:00

The gap exists because the orgasm of males is necessary for reproduction but not that of females. As simple as that.

hesipullupjimbo445 · 2021-05-10T15:17:44+00:00

Women hold sex over most men’s heads constantly while simultaneously being bad or average at it then get shocked when men are selfish in bed. On the flip side, guys that do have sex on a regular basis have no reason to care about getting a women off if he can just fuck someone else next time he’s horny. The only time he needs to get her off is if he wants to get with her again and most women aren’t worth a second go.

I do think there’s a solution for women though: practicing sex. I know it sounds silly but if women practiced sex I think the satisfaction rate would increase. When I mean practice I don’t mean just grab a vibrator and lay there, I mean actually practicing different positions with an average sized dildo.

Think_Brilliant3517 · 2021-10-27T17:09:04+00:00

I think this is not specifically for sex but about the fact that women experience only nearly half as many orgasms than men.

spletharg2 · 2021-05-10T11:33:34+00:00

Oral sex can pass on papilloma virus which can lead to throat cancer.

Bandit174 · 2021-05-10T01:52:08+00:00

Is this the case for all sex or just casual sex?

All sex but for different reasons.

With casual sex the guys are often hotter and more endowed but supposedly more selfish in bed. Better looks and bigger dicks increase chances of orgasm but a guy being selfish and not putting any effort into forplay can negate that.

With relationship sex the guys are less likely to be selfish but are often not as hot or endowed as her previous fuckbuddies. Some women are lucky and end up in relationships with guys who are hot and well endowed but since hot well endowed guys are less common than average guys most women will end up in a relationship with guys who are less hot and less endowed than their previous fuckbuddies.

Should men be expected to put more effort into sex (compared to women) because of this gap?

Kinda seems like guys already are. Whether they live up to those expectations is a different story, but it definitely seems like there is more pressure on the guy to perform and if the sex sucks the default assumption is that it was his fault (bad technique, didn't last long enough, not big enough, not hot enough ect)

ChibsFilipTelfordd · 2021-05-10T02:12:38+00:00

Yeah, when it doesn't feel good and I know I'm not going to cum, I have to psyche myself up for it and learn to love it anyway for sure. If it's the best I'll get, better to focus on the positive. That goes for any aspect of sex like blowjobs or anal, when it's not really good, it's painful, the joy I get is from my partner's pleasure and his consideration (making sure I'm okay). I wind up satisfied because at the end of the day I'm with a partner that loves me and does put effort into making me feel good.

I have to be in certain positions, using certain motions for it to work, so sometimes it doesn't happen, and that's okay.

CandleLess · 2021-05-10T04:15:55+00:00

Is this the case for all sex or just casual sex? For (unmarried) relationships I would think a lack of sexual satisfaction would be a deal breaker

I'd agree. Not sure why women would be in a FWB or otherwise casual relationship without orgasms

The definition equates sexual satisfaction to achievement of orgasm, but is this necessarily the case? Do women enjoy sex even when they don't orgasm?

Not a woman, but I believe they do, just not as much

Why does this gap exist? Are men responsible for this gap or is it just biology?

It's part biology, part men not knowing what to do, part women for not communicating or knowing what to tell men to do to make it happen

Should men be expected to put more effort into sex (compared to women) because of this gap?

Yes. IMO as a man, you're gonna have to put in more effort to satisfy a woman than vice versa seeing as dudes can nut in a minute while watching the news. So if you want repeat customers, you need to put more effort in. As far as ONS, I guess it's not necessary but it's just good manners

geyejoe7 · 2021-05-10T05:45:36+00:00

I feel like most women that just have casual sex are a lot more likely to encounter the orgasm gap. Because the guys fucking them are mainly interested in their own pleasure. Unless they're planning to keep it FWB.

But it's true that commited partners are a lot more likely to put in actual effort.

Ppdebateismental · 2021-05-10T06:51:56+00:00

The definition equates sexual satisfaction to achievement of orgasm, but is this necessarily the case?

I think that’s highly dependent on the woman, but most women certainly want orgasms with their partner

Do women enjoy sex even when they don't orgasm?

Absolutely. Sometimes it just isn’t happening. Is being jackhammered for an hour enjoyable when it’s just not happening? NO. But for the most part, it’s still very pleasurable.

Why does this gap exist?

All the reasons men might have including mental, emotional and hormonal problems, PLUS, add some basic biological differences

Are men responsible for this gap or is it just biology?

Well that depends. If a woman can only experience orgasm with a partner during very specific acts or positions, or only after prolonged foreplay, and her partner doesn’t provide enough foreplay or direct stimulation, then yes, he’s responsible for creating the gap. If he is perfectly willing but the woman really can’t or won’t articulate what she needs then that’s on her.

Should men be expected to put more effort into sex (compared to women) because of this gap? I terms of time and effort put in, yes. Most women simply require more time and more effort.

Pilling_it · 2021-05-10T07:47:24+00:00

Ime, casual and not casual, many women don't know how to get themselves off. Then there is those who get themselves off just fine, but never managed to do it with someone else (often being self conscious of this or that, as well as porn addicts). Then there is those who refuse to communicate (those who rub it to things they're too ashamed to admit and fear being judged or something along those lines). Then there is those who can't relax because of fear of performance.

That's in this clusterfuck that at some point I just told a fwb to shut up and let me experiment. And basically learned all I know through practice.

So yeah. In comparison a guy can get himself off by fucking. She can even get him off with a handjob (doesn't mean it'll be good though), and I'm not even getting into how more complex it is for a guy. There are sure a lot of selfish guys around, no issue there. But if someone tell me about an orgasm gap, my answer? Duh.

I vet for desire for a reason.

MasterTeacher123 · 2021-05-10T11:31:48+00:00

They are people who have argued that women would have WAY more casual sex if they came almost every time like guys do.

SonicBackScratcher · 2021-05-10T14:00:32+00:00

There is an equivalent for guys but its rarely talked about compared to women complaining like this is some equal thing.

As a guy I can easily get off just rubbing on my bed if I really wanted to. Nature of the penis. Thats not exactly good or satisfying though.

Most women, and this includes women who are swingers, as in they LIKE casual sex with multiple partners, they can't claim any sort of ignorance they've been there, are not very good at sex. They might not all starfish but most are content for the guy to do most of the work. Most do give oral, but thats the limit to their "giving".

Just getting a guy off isn't an accomplishment.

analt223 · 2021-05-10T14:38:40+00:00

The gap exists because the thing women pleasure on men is right in front of your face, the thing men pleasure on women is a bit more tucked away.

Us dudes need to probably ask and feel around to make sure we are even stimulating the right place, but that kills the mood in most people's eyes so it creates a gap.

mydikishomofobik · 2021-05-10T15:13:32+00:00

It's much easier for men to have orgasms. This isn't rocket science.

Murphysmongoose · 2021-05-10T15:52:01+00:00

Yes, another dude to admit and agree men should, on average, put more into making sure she's getting off. How this is even debatable I can only attribute to pure selfish intentions kind of mentality.

Just recently got a new partner, and big shocker (not so shocker) I was the first person to really go down on her, to, "do it like that." Big shocker, she's on her third day in a row of being eager to come back. Literally had like, a two hour window yesterday she could work me in, and still came to take advantage of it.

Timmy721123 · 2021-05-10T17:27:19+00:00

I cant imagine why. Getting to good sex takes a few months.

Do women really believe that a random guy in a one night stand is going to care if she gets hers or not?

SnooCats37 · 2021-05-10T18:35:05+00:00

Most women don't achieve orgasm through penetrative sex. It happens more through clitoral stimulation. Men can be a little rough with their hands or unsure of what to do with their tongues. Sometimes the lack of orgasm is down to not enough communication between the couple. Sometimes it's down to whether the man is listening and being receptive to what the woman wants during sex

alberto-hoff · 2021-05-10T19:19:56+00:00

When I was having my sexual awakening at high school, there was absolutely no talk about the clitoris and as far as we knew - female orgasms just happened from PIV sex. I thought that when women made noise during sex, it was an orgasm. This was the consensus amongst my peers, circa early 00s with very minimal porn exposure for teenage boys.

I was sexually active for three years before I had an orgasm, and that was with a vibrator.

It turns out I just needed clitoral stimulation with mouth or hands. Now, the thought of having sex without an orgasm is unfathomable - the idea sounds so frustrating.

I've not had trouble having an orgasm from casual sex because I think I'm very sexually liberated, I don't have sex when I'm nervous and I'm comfortable in my own body. Even with a ONS - I tell guys what gets me to orgasm and they do that.

silkPJson · 2021-05-10T19:36:33+00:00

Lots of men are simply lazy in bed and a lot of you do girls are socialised to think sex is over when he cums it’s sad really

Nuke_Me_Senpai · 2021-05-10T19:56:22+00:00

Good communication and a little research can help bridge the gap for most all cases that there isn’t some medical condition involved.

Usually it’s a lack of experience and exposure that leads to a basic understanding of “P goes in V” rather than understanding erogenous zones and nuance. It’s on both partners to understand sexual competences of one another and work towards a healthy, fulfilling medium.

Once you obtain that balance and understanding, you’ll find your partner is more willing to go the extra mile for you. It’s not uncommon for her to have multiple in one session, and with practice it’ll be easier and easier.

With casual sex, it’s a lot of touch and go and feeling out goods and bads in the moment. You have to be more aware of your partner.

Overall, the gap likely exists because “P in V” is the barebones exposure people get outside of porn, which is rarely sensual or educational. For men, your entire tool is pretty exposed and involved so there isn’t much work needed. Just stick it in and it’ll feel good 90+% of the time. Not always the case with women, but once you find the right methods it’ll be as easy as clockwork.

boy_named_su · 2021-05-10T20:27:10+00:00

Men's masculinity and attractiveness predict their female partners' reported orgasm frequency and timing

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1090513811000250

PreparationWorried33 · 2021-05-11T22:42:12+00:00

It exists in all sexual relationships but it’s smaller for relationship sex. The gap is mostly an issue when it comes to casual sex.

JohnnyNuemonic · 2021-05-12T07:11:52+00:00

The orgasm gap would legitimately be non existent if dudes realizes 2 things. 1. Getting a woman's brain off (getting her head space right) is 1/2 the job and 2. Foreplay is not fuck starting her cooter with your fingers. Sorry to be crass but it is what it is.

BIGJOLLYJOHN · 2021-05-10T01:23:51+00:00

Wait, you think women have fewer orgasms?!

TheBookOfSeil · 2021-05-10T00:57:24+00:00

Is this the case for all sex or just casual sex? For (unmarried) relationships I would think a lack of sexual satisfaction would be a deal breaker

For all sex. Casual sex is slightly higher since women tend to pick men who they find more attractive (and more well-endowed) and are therefore more likely to get off as a result.

The definition equates sexual satisfaction to achievement of orgasm, but is this necessarily the case? Do women enjoy sex even when they don't orgasm?

Yes, and yes. Most women do not achieve orgasm/are not sexually satisfied in that regard, but they still enjoy sex with partners even if they don't orgasm.

Why does this gap exist? Are men responsible for this gap or is it just biology?

Mostly biology but I think that sexual selection throughout human history has played a role in it as well. The gap exists mostly because the female orgasm is not necessary for reproduction at all.

Should men be expected to put more effort into sex (compared to women) because of this gap?

That is the sentiment held by women, but I think everyone is responsible for their own orgasms. If you're not putting in effort to get stimulated enough to climax, then you can't complain if/when it doesn't happen.

xXx_FireHydrants_xXx · 2021-05-10T03:42:00+00:00

Imagine how much worse society gets if all women found casual sex to be enjoyable

cast-away-ramadi06 · 2021-05-10T04:59:07+00:00

Does this same orgasm gap exist between gay tops & bottoms?

Turns out probably not. I suspect the issue is more about straight women being too passive in the bedroom. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/orgasm-gap-sex-study-straight-women-have-fewer-orgasms-than-men/

Liberal_On_Guns · 2021-05-10T06:35:29+00:00

There is a large gap in orgasm quality. Women have higher quality orgasms than men. Perhaps women need to step up their game and give men orgasms of equal quality.

Goodthingstartssmall · 2021-05-10T12:24:14+00:00

Yes this gap annoys me. I really want to know how it feels to have multiple mind blowing orgasms making the body shaking. Damn i'm so jealous :)

Title	The Orgasm Gap
Author	AverageDick3nergy
Upvotes	17
Comments	332
Date	May 9, 2021 10:38 PM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/n8ph7c/the_orgasm_gap/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/the-orgasm-gap.758025 https://theredarchive.com/post/758025

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