How could OLD be improved?

NockerJoe · 2022-05-10T17:27:53+00:00

The current ELO system used by basically all apps makes it a game of hot or not, where whoever can peacock the best gets the rewards since your place in the hierarchy is essentially decided 90% by half a dozen or less pictures, and most of the remainder a few sentences of text. This is then sorted by an AI who goes solely by the swipes, and therefore solely on first impressions before anyone interacts. This means that bots, catfishes, and bad faith actors can inevitably rise to the top since they don't need to be honest and their actual behavior isn't measured.

I would say one of the biggest issues for male users, from my perspective, isn't just that there's a lack of matches, but any time I try most of the mainstream apps my first slew of options to swipe on will usually be a mixture of social media thots, bots, women promoting sex work or social media, and the like. Actual average looking women with average looking lives of the sort you'd meet in real life are a thing I'd need to swipe for 50-100 profiles to even see consistently. If I ever run into anyone I know in real life it's usually like 150+ profiles down even if they're just regular women who aren't ugly and are in decent shape. They just aren't social media addicts with a million manicured selfies and all the linked profiles.

In my mind it would probably be better if actual interactions were measured in the score. Someone who has like 50 matches at a time but only averages like 3 replies to a match should not be that much higher than the women I know who aren't often getting the cream of the crop but are willing to engage honestly and actually have conversations. Likewise if you're constantly matching with a lot of people but will drop them within a couple of hours of a match regularly this probably isn't behavior that should be encouraged.

The more I spell this out, the more obvious it is that your average dating app algorithm is geared to a very specific sort of terminally online social media addict who wants easy social validation and bases their entire personality on a handful of apps, and pushing these people on the general public as a kind of ideal potential partner is probably a big part of the issue.

gofigure62 · 2022-05-10T18:05:00+00:00

Idk why people continously ignore that OLD is a buisness designed for profit. The behavior of the users are manipulated to keep them on the apps as long as possible.

It was never created as a means for anyone to be successful, it was created as a means to exploit vulnerable people seeking connections for money.

The desperate and delusional belief that OLD is actually intended to successfully connect people is bizzare.

OLD is a capitalist machine, it's not meant to get tou succuess, it's meant to dangle to possibility of companionship and sex into the faces of lonely men and women that are willing to pay to get it while simultaneously expending Zero IRL effort to get it.

There are tangible ways that online dating platforms could pair people off. Such as requirements of longer dating profiles beyond single sentence prompts, users have to spend a minimum of 5 minutes on each profile before having the ability to move on, only matchint users that have the same relationship goals (long term, short, casual, sex, marriage, etc), culling/permanent bans of low effort/low participant users, etc.

Old could be a VERY successful medium to make human connections, it's specifically designed not to be.

Quealpedoestoy · 2022-05-10T18:07:15+00:00

Remove the posibility of linking IG to your OLD profile and shadowbanning people who put their IG (or other kind of profiles) on their description. That would make OLD so much better.

Also, not showing the number of matches you have would be great too, or doing like Bumble does and deleting them after 24hs if there is no conversation.

This two things would get rid of A LOT people using OLD apps for ego boosting.

King_D0ng · 2022-05-10T17:44:31+00:00

OLD, needs to more closely mimic how one would find a partner irl. The current swiping system only encourages low effort and unrealistic standards. An example of an improved dating app would be men/women only given 10 profiles they view all at once everyday and they can only try to match with 3 of these profiles at maximum. This would encourage mento raise their standards and put more effort into every match and discourage unrealistic standards from women. I also think there should be able to "review" people you match with. If you get enough bad/good reviews it will show up on your profile for others to see.

athlete2biz · 2022-05-10T20:47:42+00:00

I feel like 90% of the so called "solutions" in this thread amount to "disincentivize attractive people from using OLD"

lol

Yummylicky23 · 2022-05-10T17:41:38+00:00

Wouldn’t you need to force women to use it first? It’s usually male heavy

Smitten_Squire · 2022-05-10T18:01:44+00:00

People wouldnt use weird forced apps that match you with ppl u cat see.

The only thing that matter is poc, height, money, social status. If girls can't see those things on a dating app, they simply won't use it

Lift_and_Lurk · 2022-05-10T17:33:55+00:00

I don’t think people quite get this: The point of OLD is to make money and right now they are making a ton of it. So why would they change things? This is working out great did them! What, you thought they set them up out of the goodness of their hearts?!
If everyone matched: then everyone would stop using the apps and they’d stop making money since everyone would delete accounts when they got a GF/BF. It’s much, much better too keep people on the apps! They need as many women on as they can since that’s what men want. And they need men to be in Constantly because if it’s too easy to match, then they’d never spend any money. It’s way way better for OLD apps to keep people swiping, all the time, to keep the algorithm going, just like a casino keeping you playing till you give them all the money you are willing to spend. (They admit they use casino algorithms BTW).
So why should they give a shit if you are an unsuccessful dude using it?
Did you pay for Tinder gold? Well they already got your money- why would they care Did you refuse to buy any services? Well you aren’t making them any money so they give even less a shit about you.

Do some dudes do really well? Yeah: there are also professional poker players out there some people are naturals

Do some people get lucky? Absolutely! People also hit jackpots in casinos all the time! Luck is a thing!
And OLD, just like casinos make sure to promote when it happens excitedly saying- “if it could happen to him it could happen to you!”

The sooner dudes stop acting like OLD is a civil service and more like what it is the better. People don’t go to Vegas mad they didn’t win the jackpot: they know what it is. They talk about the good time they had.
If dudes started looking at the experience of OLD as the point and not “getting lots of women” then they might stop getting so mad when they don’t get lucky.

And maybe they might decide they don’t actually like it. And then they don’t have to participate.

And if enough dudes stop because they just don’t enjoy it then the Apps start losing customers

And if it’s starts meaning they aren’t making money: Then the Apps will start changing things because the only way things are going to change is if they can’t make money they way they are now. Cause it really is all about making money.

NOTSM · 2022-05-10T17:20:04+00:00

A hard limit on the number of right swipes a man gets per day and a limit of the number of active matches one can have.

This will force men to be more selective, men's lack of selectivity is a huge driver behind OLD being so lopsided

Financial_Leave4411 · 2022-05-10T17:58:29+00:00

I would like to not see someone I said no to again. It could be because I come from a small town that I get offered the same crappy matches I have already rejected over and over again. It’s one of the main reasons why I just quit looking on OLD. It would also be nice to not have a distance cap. Currently most apps don’t let you look further away than 500 miles and in hick towns you NEED to look further away. And ironically enough we need more filter questions and for the site to not show us anyone who doesn’t match all the filters. I would rather have no matches than waste time weeding through people that I’m not compatible with.

jah-roole · 2022-05-10T21:50:47+00:00

There isn’t much to be improved. You have an opportunity to put your best foot forward by putting in effort. 99% of men don’t put any effort and then whine that they don’t get matches. Shocker. The last time I used tinder, I paid for the subscription, tested my pictures before creating the profile, dressed properly, didn’t have cringy selfies in the mirror and had over 50 high quality, attractive matches. Picked 5 out of those after realizing no chemistry with the rest and I’ve been with the one out of those 5 for a while but could have been with anyone of them. I do not see a problem with how things currently are.

GlowingAsItDazzles · 2022-05-10T23:16:14+00:00

why would anyone bother with a dating app that didnt immediately have pictures? lol. like why would i ever just read profiles. the best thing for men would be videos. men have to be experienced in motion, women do not respond well to still pix like men do

ExtraGreenBox · 2022-05-11T05:34:23+00:00

An app you don't have to pay for, that doesn't treat women like prostitutes and act like a pimp extracting money from men, then hiding potential matches from them.

OKCupid once published a blog saying why you should never pay for an online dating service.

They took it down after match bought them. Match also owns tinder.

bison5595 · 2022-05-10T19:41:12+00:00

There’s nothing wrong with the dating apps. The only problem is that guys are not putting any effort with their appearance. We are not conditioned to care about our appearance to the level that women are. We also never take selfies either. If we want to do better online, we have to get in shape, dress better and take better quality photos. That will bring more women on to the apps. I believe only about 5-15 percent of guys have maxed out everything possible on dating apps. Most of us are just lazy.

OscarSmiled · 2022-05-10T17:21:05+00:00

Old can “improve” for women where it auto unmatched anyone based on an age filter, height filter, wealth filter, etc. and since anyone can lie, it probably won’t work.

Nothing will improve for men. It’s working as designed. Men swipe on lots of women, and women are hyper filtering losers and sub-8 men from their queue of suitors.

There’s nothing to change. It’s working as everyone wants it to. You cannot make women have interest in you. Women don’t care about casual sex with randos. It’s 6’4” millionaire Chad meme or GTFO.

If you aren’t that, date via some other method.

wtknight · 2022-05-10T17:18:10+00:00

Online faceless chatrooms were the best way to do things. Eventually, people would send photos, of course, but often not before a rapport with chat was established. Also, one is limited to how many people one can chat with at the same time. This made finding one’s attractiveness match more likely, as the “swipe system” in OLD promotes inequality in matching.

Supposedly there are Discord chatrooms that offer the same kind of experience even now, but I don’t think that chatrooms are nearly as popular as they used to be.

Lysa_Bell · 2022-05-10T17:15:14+00:00

Make it some kind of a VR bar so that interactions are more similar to how dating works in real life. Maybe Mark Zuckerberg & Elon Musk could figure something out?

odd_cloud · 2022-05-10T17:16:33+00:00

I have quite a radical idea. Let’s make it that only women are able to swipe. Average match rate for men is so low, a lot of men swipe on every woman. Why do men need to swipe at all?

baresquad · 2022-05-10T17:32:33+00:00

It can’t because using it to search for long term companionship is the source of the problem. No matter what app, what methodology, questionnaires etc. the actual goal of whatever virtual matchmaker you can come up with, will always be profit. Profit through ad sales and premium features

I turned 18 way back in 2013. I saw Tinder from the start. It’s been insane to see how 2013 OLD has snowballed into duping so many people that they can find long term serious relationships on dating apps. Of course exceptions happen, my 2nd girlfriend was a tinder match. But somehow the misconception got misconstrued that finding love was as easy as signing for a dating app and swiping

That’s a marketing ploy, they’re selling you the app, and so many people are genuinely buying the message. Hinge isn’t the app designed to be deleted, it’s designed to drive Match profit

Maybe up until 2012 when Tinder began to take off online dating was genuine back with E Harmony and shit, but the dating app boom was initially driven by hookup culture. Now a bunch of others are too dependent on finding love where it was never meant to be in the first place

I guess you had to have really had been there from the start to truly appreciate and see dating apps for what they are but nowadays it’s kinda sad to see the toll it takes on people

festethefoole1 · 2022-05-10T17:36:07+00:00

It can’t be improved. No-one post-Tinder has managed to invent an app which doesn’t rely on a yes/no swipe/button based dichotomy.

“Thursday” has done very well in making women engage with the conversation much more actively given that everything expires at midnight, but ultimately you’re never going to level up the playing field given the ridiculous leverage women have in the sexual marketplace.

EviessVeralan · 2022-05-10T18:07:40+00:00

Nothing will improve for men on dating apps unless more women use them. Right now men make up 70% of app users.

Pastelitomaracucho · 2022-05-10T18:40:22+00:00

Men need to quit.

humdf · 2022-05-10T18:43:11+00:00

it is a oxymoron, the same you've seen in "war games" when joshua took the pill by playing tic tac toe.

"A strange game. The only winning move is not to play."

SmarmyPapsmears · 2022-05-10T18:53:12+00:00

The only way OLD will improve is if the male:female imbalance were fixed, and there's way too many desperate males with lower value women taking advantage of it currently

mydikishomofobik · 2022-05-10T19:52:27+00:00

If something doesn't work for me I stop doing it and do something else instead.

SwinginPastMyKnees_ · 2022-05-10T22:37:00+00:00

Currently, people are swiping on random people with whom they want to sleep and then hoping a relationship will form from that. If it didn't work with Hot person #1, then go back and try with Hot person #2. Lather, rinse, repeat. That essentially encourages hookup culture.

Sex is important in relationships, but you have to form deeper connections for LTRs. And for that to be successful you have to remove the shallowness of swiping on only their pics and a short bio. I was a fan of the old OKCupid structure where you answered questions about yourself and that affected your match percentage with other people on the app. You could better gauge whether the two of you would mesh well in a relationship based on how they answered their questions. That's pretty crucial IMO.

Not sure how that could be replicated with the swiping apps. Maybe instead of swiping on pictures, you swipe on listed attributes of the person, such as books they've recently read, activities they've done, and hobbies they partake in? You won't get to see any of their pictures until shortly before the first date. I think this would encourage many to give a relationship a fair chance instead of just dismissing this person because they are a little pudgy or because they have an oddly shaped nose or something.

I was also a fan of the Hinge/Coffee Meets Bagel method where they would only send you a handful of matches a day. I think taking away the illusion of infinite options helps people make reasonable choices in the dating realm.

tossa445 · 2022-05-11T00:00:26+00:00

I get matches here and there, even text conversations, but very rarely do actual dates happen. People want to chat but as soon as meeting up or even a video call comes up it's ghost-town.

The text conversations I've had went from me being interested and trying to be interesting, sometimes being ignored and sometimes benig reciprocated at first, to me pushing to meet as fast as possible because of how much time I've wasted with these text conversations already only for a meeting not to happen.

The very rare times I've been able to meet up with someone face to face, they looked totally different from pictures and it was still a waste of time.

I don't know how those problems get fixed

back_in_blyat · 2022-05-11T01:52:47+00:00

There is no way to fix it because no app is profitable without a critical mass of female users, and the whole point is just to throw chads at them to keep them on and involved. It really is a zero sum game because any way that fixes apps to make them more appealing or useful to the average man does damper the experience for the average woman - which causes more men to join and more women to leave and then it's dead.

Preme2 · 2022-05-10T17:14:26+00:00

Flawed question. OLD is fine for relationship-seekers on sites meant for serious relationships. The clusterfuck is just for hookup apps: Tinder, Bumble, Hinge.

athlete2biz · 2022-05-10T17:17:04+00:00

I dont think you can.

you'd have to convince woman to actually use OLD, alot of them dont, or if they have it they rarely check it, because they have so many options in real life.

you'd also have to convince woman to stop using instagram and sites like seeking arrangements, alot of girls are using these apps instead of your classic apps like tinder, bumble, hinge etc.

Im not saying any of the above should happen. I personally do pretty well on OLD, but im not dependent on it at all, I use it as a supplement for my dating life, and when im feeling lazy.

The best would just be for men to improve their IRL dating prospects and habits

ruboyuri · 2022-05-10T18:56:34+00:00

It’s going to be hard to do much, because

1) it’s working well enough

2) money is paramount, not making people happy

sarkington · 2022-05-10T19:09:44+00:00

OLD is terrible for men because of male thirst, as it is for every venue

I don’t see a way around that

I mean, you could make a not for profit app, but I’m going to assume it’s going to be terrible

analt223 · 2022-05-10T19:57:31+00:00

No pictures. Also any promotion of your Instagram or only fans causes you to get banned

John_Oakman · 2022-05-10T19:54:33+00:00

Allow women to ban any male that they find problematic in any way, shape or form. This dash the hopes of the LVMs early and so prevent dragging out delusions while giving women the delusion of a safer online atmosphere.

LowCreddit · 2022-05-10T21:35:29+00:00

The only way to improve OLD is to improve the general dating market. The only way to improve the dating market is to make marriage attractive to men.

jamesbwbevis · 2022-05-11T01:22:29+00:00

It can't be improved because the problem is female nature. They all want the same guys

backcourtjester · 2022-05-10T17:44:54+00:00

Get rid of the Instagram-y aspects of it and make it less of an ego boost. Four pics; one full body nude straight at the camera front and back, one headshot no makeup, no hats, no sunglasses, no beards. One regular photo to show personality. All photos must be <6 months old

No more using make-up, angles, poses, clothing etc to lie about your appearance. No more swiping on a fantasy. No more character limits to describe your passions, desires, hopes and dreams

Edit: to add flat lighting

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NigroqueSimillima · 2022-05-10T17:33:55+00:00

Actually limit the amount of likes guy can give out, they won't do that because they like the pay for version.

Substantial_Video560 · 2022-05-10T17:49:04+00:00

By shutting these apps/sites down! Not going to happen though as businesses make too much money from it. I strongly believe it's damaging to mental health and wellbeing.

MelodiousTones · 2022-05-10T17:59:28+00:00

I don’t understand why you wouldn’t just put together a profile that communicates who you are and what you’re looking for.

iamprosciutto · 2022-05-10T18:10:51+00:00

I think having a description of the person with body types, height, etc in place of pictures might be interesting. Maybe pictures only reveal after like 20 responses in DM's. The idea would be that personality and charm would play more of a role rather than initial physical attraction. I think a video chat feature would be really helpful to avoid catfishing on this type of site though. Maybe that becomes an option rather than puctures. I'm just tossing out ideas here

No-Priority7869 · 2022-05-10T19:10:58+00:00

It can’t be changed or saved. everything that goes mainstream eventually becomes as shallow as it needs to be to attract the lowest common denominators of the population. I don’t think it can get more shallow than Tinder

briiiana1122 · 2022-05-10T19:16:35+00:00

A guy friend (definitely not a guy ppd would assume would do well with women) met his wife on a paid for online dating / matchmaking service. They are very much equals and well suited to one and other likely because they didn’t just pick each other out of a catalog but matched on other criteria. I’m not sure how common these kinds of services are everywhere but for someone looking for a relationship it seems sound to me.

Ziogatto · 2022-05-10T19:20:24+00:00

Format their servers and use them for mining crypto.

wtbrift · 2022-05-10T20:20:59+00:00

OLD isn't the problem. It's the attitude of people using the apps. A new app won't change that.

Karmanger · 2022-05-10T20:45:19+00:00

I think Hinge has tackled that problem fairly well since it matches people based on AI.

Admirable_Bee_8714 · 2022-05-10T22:28:34+00:00

Can of gasoline, flame thrower and a cigar. Burn the fucking thing to the ground, light the cigar and enjoy the show.

Short-Fingers · 2022-05-10T23:45:42+00:00

Hinge before I got banned had the best idea. You only get like 10 swipes a day and then that’s it.

Maybe they should make it 20-30 swipes a week and thats it. It encourages women to actually talk to who they swipe on and actually have conversation. Maybe just 10 a week would be better honestly. This would force guys and girls to actually have meaningful and descriptive bios because they only get a small chance to make an impression.

stingfucksuplol · 2022-05-11T06:59:36+00:00

Make it so you can only get a limited number of matched partners each week (Let's say 3) after that you can't swipe anymore that week.

This will increase the chances for both men and women to find a date.

HazyMemory7 · 2022-05-11T08:30:24+00:00

Get more aggressive with banning bots and scammers, require verification to sign up, and remove "elo" entirely.

Also I think it's funny as hell how many people are suggesting that pictures should be hidden until you chat with someone for a bit. Screw off with that bs, I'm not wasting any time chatting with a girl on a dating app if I don't think she's attractive.

RottingVillain666 · 2022-05-11T15:16:38+00:00

You can always limit the numbe of straight men joining

Ladywhofishes · 2022-05-11T19:34:18+00:00

One way to improve the ratio would be to kick off the scary-looking slobs who can't be bothered to even smile for their profile photo. When women see enough of that on a site they leave for good.

dottywine · 2022-05-11T22:11:36+00:00

I think I am missing something here. Do you mean OLD as in people above a certain age?

veloron2008 · 2022-05-12T20:25:23+00:00

OLD seems to be largely about f-boys and the girls that chase them, which sadly appears to be most women. That entire game revolves around extreme superficiality and toxic masculinity, which women claim to abhor but at the same time are attracted to. It's a hot mess, and I believe the declining marriage and LTR statistics reflect this.

Best bet for normal guys who are "invisible" is to not get involved in it. Dating can be a huge drain on time and resources anyway, especially in this time of high inflation and teetering economy. With patience and self improvement these normal guys will become the selectors, and can ghost the messed up women who exhibited such poor self control in their 20s. Choices have consequences.

Another option is to find a moral and loyal woman from overseas. They tend to be higher quality on average than what can be found in the west.

Title	How could OLD be improved?
Author	Lysa_Bell
Upvotes	10
Comments	201
Date	May 10, 2022 5:09 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/umnkvp/how_could_old_be_improved/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/how-could-old-be-improved.1114742 https://theredarchive.com/post/1114742

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