Mainstream deeming men with limited earning prospects "ineligible for marriage" or "unmarriageable" demonstrates that women seek to cast aside their own traditional gender roles while continuing to impose them on men. "Unilateral imprisonment".

NeilYoungFanBoy · 2020-08-03T20:58:57+00:00

Women achieved emancipation from gender roles, largely, by changing their attitude to no longer need approval from men. Men should likewise not be so desperate for approval from women. Obviously you wont get to be who you want to be, and live how you want to live, if you’re living for what you think someone else wants.

You can be the careerist salaryman with a house and a wife and a family, or you can defect and live on your own terms. You have to be strong and independent if you choose the latter.

whichbladeN · 2020-08-03T19:56:14+00:00

Second of all, a man can choose to be involved in their kids life, invest resources, etc.,

I think it's still enough of a stigma that women do not choose to be single mothers or forever girlfriends.

So if men want a family they have to compromise with the mother of their children.

ModsRControlFreaks · 2020-08-04T00:29:38+00:00

Male/female relationships are designed to alleviate men of liberty and income while providing the allure of consistent sex (which won’t be delivered) and family (which can be revoked at any second).

Why any man signs up for such a patently unfair, unjust and exploitative system is beyond me too.

I’m yet to meet a male divorcee who received a fair settlement.

Men are treated like garbage in our society. The second you say “I do”, you literally hand your future to statistically the worst person to trust with it.

red-tea-rex · 2020-08-04T00:06:51+00:00

If you apply MGTOW logic to it, It's calling poor men unmarriageable to protect the higher earning women from paying alimony and child support. WGTOW in other words. If the underlying principle is do whatever's practical that benefits you, then it is not internally inconsistent. I see nothing wrong with the surface contradiction. It serves as a reminder to all people men and women, protect your interests.

woxmintari · 2020-08-03T22:33:00+00:00

Ignore them who cares if men are considered ineligible because they dont earn enough. Men should not be getting married anyways as all the benefits can be achieved during co habitation without the risks (most places are not common law marriage). Male gender roles have been fading away for a long time now. We at a point where women are shamed for not contributing 50/50 to the relationship financially. Men can get paternity leave etc etc.

It's impossible to free women of they gender roles and not free men at the same time and that's what we are seeing.

Sigma1979 · 2020-08-03T21:20:21+00:00

(1) I earn plenty so this is not a personal vendetta

It really should be though, you can't be sure if a woman is interested in you or your money. Very wealthy men are absolutely fucked and I would advise them to either marry another wealthy woman or pretend you're of limited means.

Suck-Less · 2020-08-03T20:43:07+00:00

I’m gonna agree and disagree. When I was dating in the cough 80s and 90s caugh even I knew a vast majority of women chased men with money and or men that treat women like crap. Seriously, how can any man with eyes not see this? So I agree that a vast majority of women look like prostitutes to men.

I’m also going to say that there are simple things you can do to avoid those women. And YES you should go out of your way to avoid them. If you just want to get laid, get s suit and a fake Rolex, then get a good car. But NEVER assume these prostitutes are anything but what they are.

If you want to find a partner and not a prostitute then do this: Dress casual not rich, do NOT get a good car, just a reliable one. Downplay what you do for a living, and never take dates to expensive restaurants. Oh, and expect to get a lot of rejection.

So yes you are right for a high percentage of women, however you are wrong about all women. I also know a number of broke young guys that have girlfriends that are actually damn good women, so it still is possible today.

akihonj · 2020-08-04T06:22:37+00:00

What are men waiting for you said yourself.en are still expected to meet traditional roles. While accepting the fact that women are educated to reject them, in many cases women are chastised by society for choosing them.

However men are educated that accepting them is just right and the entire point of their lives.

Studies have shown the following, when women earn more than a man, they consider him less than a man, certainly not equal in their mind, yet the hypocrisy is that they can chose to earn less and still be equal to a man, this is partly the societal imbalance that exists. When women accept traditional gender roles they expect men to also, again another hypocrisy displayed by women.

If a man decides he doesn't want to accept those traditions, he only has two choices, either walk away and reject relationships or be labelled a man child. Even if that man is better with the kids and the home he is still a man child, if the relationship breaks down, you will see a concerted effort to stick to traditional paths where the man loses out, in terms of a woman's resources, child support etc. For example let's take a look at the Adele divorce, her husband left his career to support hers, in the divorce she was ordered to pay him millions, we don't bat an eye when a man has to do that for his ex-wife and happily say she supported him but when it's the other way around we see many tweets arguing this isn't the equality women wanted.

You ask why then men still want to be married, that's another aspect of hypocritical education, most men grow up in single parent homes and we are nothing if not riddled with hypocrisy, so if we accept that women do the majority of child raising, then we have to accept that it's women teaching boys these things. You can't have it both ways I'm afraid, you can't say that women raise the children but men teach boys to want to be married.

Women teach their sons to want to be married, mothers will think nothing of telling their sons that a man will marry, a man will want to be married, I experienced it myself from my own mother and female members of my family, one is a lesbian who never married and after my divorce all of them asked if I'd ever do it again, my reply was no never, their response was that a man should want to be married. Oh the irony though.

Women then are the epitome of laws for thee but not for me.

This is why.

LittyKitsune · 2020-08-03T20:30:01+00:00

I disagree in the sense that men and women should be mutually considering each other's earning prospects, including what that will mean in terms of childrearing. That does not make either party a "walking wallet."

Isn't it mainly the men on this sub who argue that a woman without a career makes a better partner? If a man prefers a woman without career prospects he's going to have to provide for her and the kids. A woman who thinks mom should stay at home would need to find a man who is willing and able to provide.

Women can't even claim they're doing it for resources for the kids, because they're not even breeding at a replacement level anymore!

Smaller families can also contribute to this phenom iirc. If the same woman who would have had 9 kids running around in the past just has 1 or 2 and devotes resources that would have been spread 9 ways into fewer kids, the children get a better quality of life. Raising and educating children isn't getting any cheaper. My grandma was one of 14 kids and my mom was 1 of 3.

Meritamen9 · 2020-08-03T22:15:57+00:00

Women are able to cast aside their gender roles because all men care about it youth and beauty, if she has that, she's golden.

Zombombaby · 2020-08-03T22:35:30+00:00

Women used to not be able to leave toxic relationships/marriages thanks to social and financial inequality. My mom had to have a male sign her for her bank account when she first got one. And she's only 59.

Women want equality and they want a partner who is reliable and consistent. 50%of marriages that end in divorce tend to have money as the main factor. Financial maturity and education should be a mandatory attritubute to any relationship. Ultimately, what you're really complaining about is women no longer being forced to stay in financially abusive marriages or choose to be earners who expect their spouse to have the same financial goals as them.

And I know, 'what about the gold diggers'. But ultimately, both men and women can be gold diggers/financial leaches. It's not intrinsically one gender's issue.

grand_tiremaster · 2020-08-03T23:57:08+00:00

I'm into gender roles and all that jazz. My bf and I have a trad relationship and there is nothing to complain about. I know the FDS ladies give me shit for it-- but I actually LIKE doing things for my boyfriend, such as making him food or keeping his place tidy. One of my love languages is acts of service.. I'm that kind of lady. All I hear from my bf is that I'm the best thing that ever happened to him because he got screwed over by his exes in one way or another. And yes he earns a good amount of money for his age, which helps him reach his goals so that he can obtain the things he wants. He's always wanted a family and the white picket fence dream. He said in 1-2 years we can get married and start trying for a baby. Which is just awesome IMO.. all I've ever wanted is a husband and a family. Yes, it requires money, he earns 65k/yr now and he can save up on that, he can also get his bachelor's degree and get a job that racks him 120k/yr. Which is what he is thinking about doing, and I support whatever he wants to do. No, I'm not a gold digger, I don't spend or ask for stupid shit. I budget and I am pretty frugal, if I want something I save up for it. Same with him. I actually help him save a lot of money by cooking for him. In both our opinions we're a team and this is how a relationship should be.

I think it's unfair that some women want a breadwinner partner but they are unwilling to pitch in themselves with the household. It doesn't really make any sense to me. I'm pretty blessed with what I got with my man and I wouldn't have it any other way.

2020-08-04T01:36:09+00:00

Humans are hypocrites.

It's politically incorrect when you point out this stuff so it'll be dismissed immediately.

shrug

Not like anything will be done about this anyways.

There's injustice and unfairness, lying, deceit, hypocrisy all over the world.

LotBuilder · 2020-08-04T06:04:38+00:00

The issue for men of the highest means is you end up with a women that does NOTHING beyond a few staged photo ops to look good on the gram. My kids had a nanny, au pair or preschool. We had laundry service and at the very least a weekly maid. We had take out or some sort of dinner in a box concoction like Blue Apron. The ex wife fiddled around on social media, bought junk on Amazon and planned vacations. I leased her a Volvo XC90 when they first came out and it had 8300 miles on it when I turned it in 3 years later. That is how little she did. There is nothing in marriage for a wealthy man unless you are trapped into what others think about you. I seriously would have had kids with one of my female friends and been good co parents.

sublimemongrel · 2020-08-03T20:44:08+00:00

I would not marry some deadbeat guy with no job, prospects or potential myself. That being said I work and my husband and I divide domestic duties. I think women these days more often want marriage to be a “team effort” in most respects not either party doing 100% of the money making or 100% of the domestic duties either.

If a man is “unmarriageable” it’s probably because his potential partners can’t even envision him sharing 50% of those roles. I don’t think wanting a man who is “economically stable” (whatever that means by some study you linked) is a bad thing, nor do I think it would be a bad thing for men to only want to marry women who are themselves “economically stable”.

Demiansky · 2020-08-03T23:59:35+00:00

I agree 100 percent with your title, sir, but most of the other stuff is too much of a dichotomy. So the stuff I agree with: women have been encouraged to branch off and be whoever and whatever they want to be. Great. Men, on the other hand, are still expected to be success objects, and most women still evaluate a potential mate on that criteria. Not great.

But the argument against marriage? Like, I'm guessing you are still young, because you are fixated a lot on sex, which is very normal. Sex is a good thing to have, but when most men get older they start caring less about chasing women and they start caring more about being able to relax in life and enjoy the simple things. It's also nice to enjoy those simple things with a wife whom you get along well with and with kids who liven things up.

I agree 100 percent that the mate market has been totally borked by unrealistically high expectations by women, and I agree that marriage isn't for everyone. But I can speak from my own experience that marriage has the potential to make life much better than it would be otherwise, depending on your qualities. For me? It's wonderful to go through life with someone ALWAYS in my corner, who understands my weird quirks, who--- when the world sucks and doesn't get me and makes me feel like completely alone--- makes me feel that someone understands me. And then you start a family and you see in your kids that same person that's got your back? It's a great feeling, like it's Christmas next to the fire every day. And if it's sex you are still fixated on, married sex with someone you trust and adore is in a completely different universe than horny-dog-humping-leg sex.

Believe it or not I consider myself mostly red pilled because I recognize that it's SO hard for most men to have what I have, and in many, many cases it's not their fault. It doesn't have to be that way, and I think a gender equality movement that ACTUALLY took men's issues seriously and which sought to change the perspectives of women--- not just men--- would go a long way in achieving that.

But of course no such movement exists. Instead it's feminists who hate men and men's rights activists who mostly want to go back to a time when men were forced to be men and women were forced to be women. No thanks.

reluctantly_red · 2020-08-04T01:24:38+00:00

If you don't earn enough, you're "unmarriageable" or "ineligible for marriage"

This now applies to both men and women. Welcome to a more equitable world ladies.

HighTesticles · 2020-08-04T03:51:53+00:00

I'll put this in my ever-growing collection of undeniably interesting cases against marriage box. I really wish the for marriage box had a stronger case, but posts like this are becoming easier and easier to make or relate to.

Nurizeko · 2020-08-04T10:33:52+00:00

I'm not sure how much of it is even conscious.

But the term you're wanting is 'hypergamy'. The phenomenon of women to GENERALLY seek higher status men than their own perceived level, that goes beyond mere aesthetic looks.

This just about worked in more conservative gender roles because despite everything else (not saying it wasn't problematic) of the way those systems largely operated and the lack of technology giving people the 'tyranny of choice' or enabling warped self-image, but it has always been an aspect of female mate choice.

Understandable from an evolutionary stand-point, higher status males are going to more likely ensure healthier offspring reach maturity.

Now women have by and large equality in the West, in fact in the broad women are outperforming men in many areas of status-value. The problem is women are STILL hypergamous. The availability of men hasn't really changed, they are all out there, most are reasonably decent guys doing their thing. The issue is that the women now perceive them to be lower status than them, and even in cases of equal status many women would much prefer a higher status male.

If ya gurl is bringing in the bread, has a reasonably high-status job, etc, she's going to look at a guy bringing in about the same or even less income and not so glamorous a career and not going to be overly impressed. Made worse by modern technology such as Tinder and social media in general which encourages shallow narcissism and turns people into paper-thin surface level CVs to be read and discarded on a whim.

You'll note this in how many foreign men talk about their experiences of dating Western, especially American women I've noticed. "It feels like a job interview", "I felt like she was looking for a reason to end things", "She didn't really seem to want to give things a chance", "She made me feel like I had to do everything", etc.

You see it a lot in women's posts and stuff online, many often complain about dissatisfaction in their love lives, and in most cases you can always see that there's a heavy element of self-sabotage. Unreasonably high expectations, discarding guys that even by their own accounts sound like decent men who were dropped because they didn't pass a status-check.

In general neither gender needs the other quite like they used to, but isolation and loneliness is now an epidemic because social media is superficial, and modern life doesn't encourage as 'real' connections as people used to make, much MUCH less sense of community and belonging, and women's hypergamous standards have not adapted appropriately to the new world of female emancipation and many men obviously don't want to play a fools game where they have to do all the heavy lifting and meet unfair and unrealistic standards with little-to-no win condition.

tanyadav01 · 2020-08-03T23:16:28+00:00

We all still value a man who would be able to provide financially so we can stay home and take care of our children for at least the first few years. It's extremely hard for a woman to give up her child to strangers at a daycare 6 weeks after giving birth in order to go back to work.

flamingoinghome · 2020-08-03T19:58:54+00:00

Question: do you know a lot of guys who try, even a little, to pursue women of greater financial means than themselves?

I'm not asking if these guys succeed, I'm not asking how those relationships went, I'm not asking what their efforts look like, I'm asking if they tried.

Because there's still a societal expectation that men pursue, and frankly, I'm just not seeing all these men who are even willing to entertain the idea of being financially subordinate to their wives.

wtknight · 2020-08-03T20:03:12+00:00

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MikepGrey · 2020-08-03T23:56:52+00:00

1.) never marry if you have money (any of us who have cash can tell you this)

2.) have a few girls in your house who get along (this bypasses common law marriage bs so you don't have to rotate out a good girl for a possible crazy girl to keep her from using marriage rape)

3.) always get a prenup (agreement that no matter what the law says your affairs and such are separate and spells out how kids will be provided for)

4.) when women start spouting off at the mouth about their stupid shit... look at them like they have a dick growing out of their head and turn your back on them (almost always shuts them up) ignore them from that point on until they apologize.

5.) rock their world in bed... After the whole talk/dance/buy drink/lets go some place quiet =one thing leads to another. If you can get them off they will want to hang with you even if you got no money (this is called being a CHAD).

6.) if you got your sit together on top of that, see points 1-5)

If you could figure this out yourselves you wouldn't be single (I used to be like you lot but I learned and have had long term trios and pairs living with me )

POINT 7.) The girls must get along better with each other then with you, you are the hunter who bends them over, takes what you want from them but also supports and protect them - but if the girls grind you will lose them all.

Physiologist21 · 2020-08-04T19:06:49+00:00

Women have been liberated. So have men, but they're not availing of it--what are men waiting for?

I seriously don't know. There is absolutely no reason to get married, especially for men, and yet they keep doing it despite that it is not, AT ALL, in their best interest.

Men, stop the madness, stop getting married. It is the absolute worst decision a guy can make.

Mrs_Drgree · 2020-08-03T21:25:37+00:00

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bluehorserunning · 2020-08-03T23:47:31+00:00

"mainstream" != 'feminist women.'

sounds like women are just awful, and you should totally GYOW and never approach a woman again.

SaBahRub · 2020-08-03T21:04:42+00:00

Marriage is voluntary

Divorce is a thing

Single parenthood is a thing

Diverse households are legal

Childlessness is legal

Discrimination based on marital status or existence of genetic descendants is illegal

Ergo, no one is forced to do anything and there are plenty of options

Things are fine and not imprisonment. If people can’t handle freedom and decision making, that’s too bad and pathetic

CatchPhraze · 2020-08-03T20:25:22+00:00

Show me the line of men who want to date poor ugly women. Iike your options are bring value one or two ways. If you don't do any of that (and many men are far to lazy to groom themselves into attractive men ) then your not cut out. Applied to anyone of any gender.

wtknight · 2020-08-03T20:16:58+00:00

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DXBrigade · 2020-08-04T12:47:36+00:00

Avoiding broke men is common sense. If men were actually smart, they would also filter out broke women.

Personally, I Don't want a provider but a guy I can share expense with, broke men are just dead weight.

Kizka · 2020-08-04T18:20:03+00:00

Personally I never understood women who are going into relationships with nothing and don't even want to be financially independent. I mean do what you want, but I will still find it stupid. Everybody likes money but there's no better feeling than knowing that you can make it on your own if you have to. I think men and women should look out for a partner who isn't a lazy fuck and who could carry both financiallly for a little bit if something happened, but besides from that?

If something happened and my SO would be out of a job I can carry us both, if something happened to my job and I were looking for a new one, my SO could carry us both as well, not as comfortable as the other way around but it would be possible. More is not necessary.

We have separate finances, always had, always will have, even when we get married. Both of us have our own main account and a shared one for monthly expenses like rent and groceries. Bigger stuff like large vet bills or new things for the apartment are shared 50:50.

When we get in the mood to get married we will get a prenup. Personally I don't care for one as I don't want nor need anything financially from him, but he wants one and I don't care one way or the other. Who knows if we ever will get married, it's not a priority for both of us and as finances are separate anyways it wouldn't even be beneficial in that regard, so it would be purely for sentimental/romantic reasons.

Money and kids are the two big reasons for stress in a relationship and a lot of times the reasons for the failing of relationships and marriages. Not having kids and being financially independent from each other brings a lot of peace to us. We still know we can count on each other if shit hits the fan but it would be something completely different if there was financial dependency. I only need to head over to the brakingmom sub for all of the horror stories to know to never willingly put myself into such a situation.

I can only shake my head when I see that women and men (but especially women) willingly enter relationships where one of the two is completely dependent on the other, even more so without having anything to show for. No education, never worked, bringing one child after the other into this world, doing nothing than child bearing and caring for years and then if something happens (divorce, dearh, unemployment, disability) not being able to financially care for the children. I honestly will never understand this.

Peacheslikeyou · 2020-08-04T18:28:29+00:00

women seek to cast aside their own traditional gender roles while continuing to impose them on men.

> Women still do MOST of the housework and childcare even when they are the breadwinners

>Stay-at-home fathers do less childcare than working mothers

The sheer IRONY of you writing this my god, could you be any more delusional?

i_have_a_semicolon · 2020-08-03T21:51:12+00:00

The mainstream doesn't represent what all women want or think. This post rambled into "marriage is bad for men" content at the bottom so im not quite sure which of your views to change or what is changeable. But have you ever considered that some people are happy and dont give a fuck about problems other people who are not happy are facing? And when i think of a man who isnt marriage material, im not thinking of a man without money, im thinking of a deadbeat, loser, or asshole.

SslimReaperr · 2020-08-03T20:41:57+00:00

Men want women to go 50/50 on bills/expenses/etc but still want women to retain all traditional roles of being the primary homemaker (cooking, cleaning, household chores) and primary child caretaker

This isn’t a cmv but just an angry rant.

Barneysparky · 2020-08-03T20:36:50+00:00

If all you can bring to the table is "I'm a provider" expect every woman who can fend for herself to say "no thanks".

What else do you offer?

cunningcaring · 2020-08-03T22:36:27+00:00

I know three male teachers, all happily married; they don't earn much.

I know an Uber driver and a FedEx driver; not highly paid but both married happily.

My stepson's wife earns three times what he does, and happily married.

You don't have to be rich to get married. Women look at other things than money.

You post is just more rubbish polluting this subreddit.

poppy_blu · 2020-08-03T23:56:44+00:00

I’ll CMV. If you argue that women are still hardwired to want a man with resources to take care of their offspring, you have to argue that men are still hardwired to want to provide. Meaning, many men still feel uncomfortable if not emasculated by a woman who make significantly more than him. I’ve personally experienced this, and frankly it’s just not worth the hassle of dealing with the day to day drama of a man who feels insecure with you. I eventually stopped being as open to dating men who make a lot less than me for that reason.

So I’d say if men want us to be OK with us being the breadwinners, then they have to be OK with it too.

I mean, men do the proposing. Do you think lower earning men are proposing left and right and women are just turning them down? Or are they just postponing marriage they’re better off financially - because they want to.

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2020-08-04T04:30:25+00:00

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siempreloco31 · 2020-08-04T05:29:22+00:00

because they're not even breeding at a replacement level anymore! (Well, poor women still are lmao, see the irony?)

Not true, women holding degrees are more likely to marry, and married couples are more likely to have children.

ontherailstoday · 2020-08-04T05:49:30+00:00

Demonstrated capacity to earn a living reasonably consistent with the class level at which one was raised is one of the basic markers of adulthood for non-disabled people in our economy.

Now I can maybe cut people some slack on that due to the current state of the economy, due to the shitty hand that Gen X onward has been increasingly dealt, due to sometimes people choosing a vocation over a career... and obviously if a couple elect to have one of them stay home to raise kids that's a thing too and doesn't negate the fact that prior to that decision they both demonstrated an ability to earn and support themselves... but I really can't blame any adult for refusing to date another adult who has never properly worked for a living. Who possibly could blame someone for wanting to date another adult?

Adult human females just want to date adult human males is that really too much to ask? Yes I know a lot of men in the past and even currently have elected not to make this a requirement of a woman for dating. They don't care if they date a girl not a woman. And? That's not something that woman who want to date men not boys are responsible for equalizing. That ones partner be a functional grownup is the fair and reasonable non-creepy non-exploitative expectation. It is dating people who are not functionally grownups that is the problematic thing to do.

coochiepls · 2020-08-04T09:51:25+00:00

I mean, women marry guys with normal 45k jobs all the time.

40% of births are to single mothers, and over half of millennial births are to single mothers)

This is bad

dumbfucks are giving up the game

It's people that love each other making a lifelong commitment. It's a tradition and sign of devotion.

Sounding like a pretty hardcore mra type rn. Yes, marriage is a risk. Be careful. I understand you can't see the future. Get prenup. Plenty of good women aren't going to be interested in a guy that rants and raves about marriage being terrible.

rubbooyuri · 2020-08-04T16:13:33+00:00

I don’t think you understand the meaning of “imprisonment”

Willow-girl · 2020-08-05T04:28:33+00:00

What are neurotic box checking wagie Karens offering in return for demanding traditional norms from men

I dunno; ask the men who marry them?

diacylglycerol82 · 2020-08-09T09:02:28+00:00

Mainstream is composed of trad cons/men who are fully aware that they only value they have to provide is their money.

NIGHT-RIDER-EVAKI · 2020-08-26T10:40:19+00:00

Firstly, mainstream media says a lot of things that doesn't relate to normal people.....in this case, there are plenty of happy families where the man earns less than the women..... (example: sara Blakeley jess itzler) so, it's about finding the the person whose mindset is compatible to you..... Don't pay heed to such things, a real woman/person would care more about the type of person you are over how much money you make....

Secondly, gender roles might not exist for women where you live.....but it is still very much alive....I have seen women who worked thier ass off to get to a certain position, only to get disrespectful comments (insinuating sexual harassment) from subordinates and juniors.... getting shamed for not being able to give a son..... telling the younger sister to clean up after the brother because it's a woman's job....etc.....so not all women are free of gender roles..... btw, I don't really care about modern day feminists of the west who care more about manspread than actual atrocities commited against women for being women.....

lastly, everything boils down to compatibility and equal contribution (not just financial) in a relationship...

Stokelly100 · 2020-08-03T22:05:26+00:00

Why are women hearthless creatures?

2020-08-03T23:26:21+00:00

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DaphneDK42 · 2020-08-04T01:19:53+00:00

Women can't even claim they're doing it for resources for the kids, because they're not even breeding at a replacement level anymore! (Well, poor women still are lmao, see the irony?)

Why are you even contemplating a relationship with a woman if you aren't planning on having a bunch of kids? Having children is what marriage - and long term relationships - are for.

If you are planning on having a bunch of kids, money does matter. If you're not planning on a brood, then why would you care what woman want, you shouldn't marry anyway.

alices-whiiterabbit · 2020-08-04T00:00:28+00:00

This thread seems a little out of touch to be honest. There will always be exceptions to any rule... but feminism in 5th wave, & as a broader concept is one that pertains to equality. Feminism is just as much for men as it is for women. The idea that women want higher pays but want men to earn more is quite preposterous, it’s same pay for equal work load, it’s acknowledgement for work at home and a shared home/house workload. Look at Jacinda Arden, her partner is beloved and is there as a stay at home- if she was expecting some chad with a fat wallet, that wouldn’t be the case. Further to this, I know many women intimately and from open online discussions who couldn’t care less about their partners income. Of course there are attributes like drive, productivity ect that some women are attracted to which can equal money but that is not necessarily the focus or comes along with someone who shares those ambitions, ie: a woman who works hard, likes expensive items ect will want someone who thinks and acts the same way. Again, ofcourse there are women who are turned on by the idea of money and expensive gifts but there are men who feel the same way AND there are men who receive sexual gratification from giving their money away/spending it on a partner- eg: financial dom/sub relationships, sugar babies/sugar daddies/sugar mummies... these things exist for a reason and go both ways. If it isn’t your vibe, don’t go for that type of person... but OP refers to this phenomenon as though it’s the norm... speaking in absolutes about gender stereotypes doesn’t really work.

Mimoxs · 2020-08-03T20:26:20+00:00

Ok so wahmen bad rant #1028271 of the day has been posted, but what's the substance. What are you even trying to instigate debate on. You say you don't want convincing marriage is good or whatever so why did you even post this.

Sex no longer requires marriage, monogamous commitment, or even giving a first name!

It never did. The worst take from men here is this fantasy that ~50 years ago all women were virgins till marriage and no one ever had wild sex with strangers

What's the point?

Hoodratshit1212 · 2020-08-04T03:26:57+00:00

I’m pretty sure any woman you ask just wants a man to be on her level, to earn as much as her and be as educated or successful or ambitious as she is. The vast majority of women just want a man that brings in what she does.

artrandenthi1 · 2020-08-04T01:26:23+00:00

Here’s my take on this. Just like how we acknowledge white privilege, men have default privileges that women don’t have. So while we are making progress in society towards being more equal, we are nowhere close.

Women have to pay for birth control, tampons, bras, skin-care, beauty products, yearly exams, loss of pay and career options due to pregnancy, loss of career options to focus on kids etc etc. Not all apply to every woman but we get the idea.

So while society is trying and arguing very hard to be equal, we are not focusing on the right things.

Maybe if all the above are correctly implemented, which means we agree that it’s unfair for women to have to pay for all these, but not men then it will be a level playing field.

Then women won’t focus on a male’s earning potential. And divorce and child support laws can be made more equal and we all will be happier.

So if society makes women really equal and they don’t have to worry about finances, their focus will shifts towards not wanting a guy who makes money.

artrandenthi1 · 2020-08-04T04:31:00+00:00

“What about tampons” Tampons are more expensive than TP

“What about suits that guys have to sweat through”

We don’t need suits. If women shouldn’t dress up, why so we need suits?

“No one forces you to have a kid. If it's not worth it, don't have one🤷‍♂️”

No one is forcing a guy with no job to be with a girl either. What’s the argument? If a girl doesn’t want to be with you because you can’t make a living, then why are you asking her to be with someone with no job or money?🤷🏽

Mainstream deeming men with limited earning prospects "ineligible for marriage" or "unmarriageable" demonstrates that women seek to cast aside their own traditional gender roles while continuing to impose them on men. "Unilateral imprisonment".

Comments

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