When does dating market decline for men?

throwawaylessons103 · 2023-01-31T16:37:16+00:00

Something to keep in mind - People go to dating subreddits when they're having trouble dating, so unsuccessful people are going to be overrepresented there.

Statistically, it's harder for everyone on average dating as they get older. People have more potential baggage, trauma, children, mental health issues, etc. People often get more stuck in their ways, are less attractive, and there's less single people the older you get.

... But individual success can vary greatly. If you get/stay fit, get enough sleep, get into therapy (or some cheaper version of therapy), work on your appearence and style, work on your communication styles, work on making a stable income, build a social circle and find ways to meet new people often... then you can have success at any age.

Yeah, all things equal, if a younger person does all of the above, they'll have better success usually than someone older. But the equalizer here is most young people aren't doing most of the above (hell at any age most people aren't) so it never hurts to start wherever age you're at.

(I'm a woman and you said question for men but you can't ask your own gender only a question here, so I answered as a Q4A)

Slavicgoddess23 · 2023-01-31T19:03:24+00:00

by 35 or 40 most men completely go off the sites of 20 year olds. The very rare male fox will probably have good luck or sugar babies looking for guys with money. The good luck in the 30s is actually because a lot of women are ready to settle down and have kids just like a lot of men that’s why many men who had no luck in their 20s will say their 30s were a lot better.

People really need to put their selves out there in the 20s that’s the best time to meet. if you’re looking for a lifelong partner. Like 95% of couples are five years plus or minus within each other.

Lift_and_Lurk · 2023-01-31T16:53:47+00:00

Every age is gonna have struggles. Teens- no money, under parents rules and curfews. 20s- no money, where’s the time with work and learning how to adult, 30s- a lot of people have established marrages and careers are probably at the “upwards push” stage so little time and not many opportunities as before. Plus clubs and bars are starting to feel old.
40s- you are looking probably looking at those from divorces who have their own kids (and possibly yours) and the whole dynamics of families not just the two of you

It’s never going to be “easy”.

TermAggravating8043 · 2023-01-31T18:12:41+00:00

I don’t mean to sound rude but yeah, you’ve kinda left it too late,

“Quality” women who know they want the whole traditional family husband kids etc are doing this in their 20’s/early 30’s and they do it with guys who want the same thing at the same age.

Girls who don’t want the traditional family might still be available to you but not if you expect them to turn them into a domestic wife

Men need to stop this fantasy that they’ll be in their prime at 40 and girls in their 20’s will be throwing themselves at you. Girls in their 20’s who want a family do not want some old man with old balls and no energy to actually help with the family, they want a guy roughly their own age to grow with and go through the same phases of life together, they don’t care if you’ve got money, they want commitment and security, not some old man lording it over them with how much he makes

Best thing you can do now is wait another 5-10 years for the divorces to come through, but a word of caution, at least 50% will have kids, and all of them will have a lot less patience for putting up with shit

AreOut · 2023-01-31T17:57:14+00:00

if you are in your twenties you have to be top 20%, if you are in your thirties you have to be top 10%, if you are in your forties then shoot for top 1% or just give up

Johnny_Autism · 2023-01-31T16:42:21+00:00

I never uderstood this… ageism seems like entirely looks driven. So are balding 20 year olds “over the hill” by pdd logic?

Early-Christmas-4742 · 2023-01-31T16:30:06+00:00

Most men date their own age or 3/4 years younger, so by your late 20's/ early 30's you are going to have a lot of single mums being your options. If you're ok with that then your dating market will still be ok, although i woukd say a lot of the most desirable women will be married by then.

Basically starts to decline from mid 20's.

h1shman · 2023-01-31T21:20:02+00:00

There are haves and have nots in life, mostly pertaining to looks and health. Haves at any age can get whatever they want. Haves tend to decrease in both sexes as age increases.

In an age group of 40s you’re going to have a huge portion of have nots (overweight, bad aging, bald, kids) The pool of “dateable” people becomes smaller and smaller while the pool of haves gains more scarcity. I will say it’s easier to be a have in an older demographic as people let themselves go so your competition become less.

The decline depends on your own effort and genetics. For a man, being fit is 100% your control. Being somewhat wealthy also almost all in your control. Skincare and minor cosmetic maintenance (peels, microneedling, Botox) also very much in your control. Balding is a toss up but finasteride and hair transplants are very viable. Just being a fit guy in your late 30s with a decent career puts you in the very top percentage of men sans the very unlucky (who also had no success in their youth anyway)

xzpw · 2023-01-31T16:49:11+00:00

It declines quickly after women’s sexual market peak because men’s sexual market value is in relation to women’s. The amount of women who are single, childless, and put together after 25 falls off a cliff. This means that for men - they are all competing for a very small percentage of women. Therefore, your SMV tanks super hard due to sheer volume of men competing for one commodity.

If men were instead spread out over all available women - I think it wouldn’t be as bad but no one really wants to be the father of someone else’s kids. Women don’t want to be the mother of someone else’s kids either. (That ask is just not as common cause men having sole custody isn’t common - I suspect many men don’t advocate for having sole custody because this would be a death sentence for their dating life post divorce. For women, this is really bad but it’s not the end all. Lots of desperate men out there who can’t compete for the childless women)

MisogenesUSA · 2023-01-31T17:06:22+00:00

Men’s SMV goes up, but the pickings go down. That means he’s able to pull easier from bars and whotnot, but who wants a lounge lizard for a partner

modidlee · 2023-01-31T18:22:26+00:00

It depends on the guy tbh. Some are “late bloomers.” I’m in my 40s now and the women I get now I would struggle to get in my 20s. And it’s not necessarily that I look better, although I have focused more on being healthy the older I get. I think the biggest difference from me now vs me in my 20s is confidence. Not just being confident enough to approach women, but being confident in knowing that I’m actually good enough for the woman that’s in front of me. A lot of younger men struggle with thinking they’re not good enough for a woman even if she thinks he is.

Green-Quantity1032 · 2023-01-31T18:40:44+00:00

I think tinder is starting to die for most men @ 33y/o.

Really hot guys can still date hotties in their 40s.

So as in any age, it depends on how hot you are.

Ecstatic_Celery7194 · 2023-01-31T23:33:28+00:00

according to studies, men actually do better in dating as they age but in my anecdotal experience, based on my tinder experience, these studies are bullshit and men actually do worst in dating with every passing year. i did a study using 3 alt profiles of mine with the same pics and words but with only my age changed, geolocation in asia. here are my stats:

21 years old: 5% swipe back rate
25 years old: 2% swipe back rate
28 years old: 1% swipe vack rate

so as you can see, my swipe rate declines with age even without changing anything else. it seems women are just like men: they chase pretty young thangs.

NewWayNow · 2023-01-31T18:33:49+00:00

Depends on what you mean by market decline.

If you are a man who wants to date women around your own age bracket, or a few years younger, then the dating market continuously gets better as you age. Bear in mind that the women will have kids, exes, and other features that occur as people get older.

Guys who look decent and have their stuff together become increasingly rare, so it’s easier to stand out.

search4bigfoot45 · 2023-02-01T00:40:22+00:00

Men peak in sexual attractiveness in their early 20s.

The dating scene for men in their 30s and 40s sucks. It's a lot of single moms with a lot of baggage.

Lock something down in your 20s if you can.

KayRay1994 · 2023-01-31T16:24:14+00:00

i think men have the benefit of having a more flexible timeframe than women, assuming you take care of yourself and stay successful (whatever that may mean to you) you could probably do well into your 40s, but if not, you can easily peak in your 20s

DoinIt989 · 2023-01-31T16:25:30+00:00

Depends where you live and how well you take care of yourself. In a lot of places, the number of women over 30 (or even 25) who are "date able" is quite small. In other areas, this doesn't really happen until 35.

Typically 34-37 is when men are too old to date women younger than 25, above 40 for a man things start to get rough everywhere. Late 30s is definitely past your peak but not "the male Wall" yet.

Early-Christmas-4742 · 2023-01-31T17:07:36+00:00

[permanently deleted]

obviousredflag · 2023-01-31T17:08:02+00:00

If you never had problems finding girlfriends and sex in the past 20 years, you will be good for the next 20 years, too. If your struggeled up until now, maybe never had a long term relationship, it will only become harder, because the older you get , the more experience is expected from you. Nobody wants a relationship-newbie in their 40s. That is way too much learning to do to get to a point where one is at a pleasureable point.

96tillinfinity_ · 2023-01-31T17:43:47+00:00

With men its kind of complex, or atleast i think so. Men do not have a biological clock for kids like women do so a man’s prime is dependent mostly on himself and genetics but its also very flexible. IMO

For example, take a 6 foot 28 year old, balding guy. Lets say he was a Chad or fuck it lets say he was close to being a Chad in high school/college. Played sports, was in shape, handsome but not jaw dropper, was in college to be a doctor. Now lets say some personal stuff went on in his life and that never panned out. Dropped out. Fast forward to some years post grad hes 28, balding, a little heavier, making average to slightly above average (lets say 50k to be make it simple)

You can tecnically say hes past his peak SMV but now lets say he gets back in shape, switches careers and now making better money (lets say 75k) shaves his head so hes bald but hes somewhat close to that high school/college athlete physique he once had and now hes 30

You can say hes back to peak SMV, or that this current form of him is his peak SMV, no?

Which is why id say a man’s peak SMV is more flexible than a woman’s. Men are not up against the same clock women (who want to get married/have kids) are

purplish_possum · 2023-02-01T00:45:41+00:00

Absolute looks don't really matter. It's your rank within your cohort that matters.

At 58 I'm certainly not as attractive as I was when I was 18. However, I'm more attractive than at least 95% of my late middle age peers. When I was 18 I was 75th percentile at most. Within my cohort I've moved up the rankings. Therefore, finding a similar age woman to date today is easier.

VasiliyZaitzev · 2023-01-31T20:10:36+00:00

I'm in my late thirties.

First, stay (or get) fit.

Second, learn Game. get your money straight.

Third, get your money straight, particularly if you want to marry/have kids.

If you want to age gap date it is possible - the gals who show up and need to "shame" men who "think they will suddenly be getting all these 18-22 year olds" are just whistling past the graveyard, it's just a straw man argument; nobody thinks that - but there will be a much smaller pool of girls who will be into you, but those girls in it will be super into you.

At any rate, if you fix the three things I mention you will be able to maximize your chances with your available dating pool at any age.

Mindless-Fun-6852 · 2023-01-31T20:42:58+00:00

To be honest, the guys who makes 1 million a year, and are 35- 40 are attractive to women. They are not people barely getting by, or making 6 figures at that age. The way the red people paint the picture, is at that age they are finally part of the 1%.

The Dark truth is if your not part of the 1%, then your options dwindle. I have a cousin who is 38 and is getting married to a women thats 36. Hes in IT with a Phd degree and makes 120k a year. She makes 6 figures and is educated as well. He tried to marry and date, others but he couldn't and people dont talk about this. I think most people are not going to make 250k at any age. The sad truth is the red Pillers, all think there the exception to the rule and they will all be in the 1% at some point. When they will never.

tritter211 · 2023-01-31T16:38:18+00:00

Men peak in their mid 40's. And then it slowly lowers from there.

Of course, its hard if you try to date women in their 20's, but dating 30's and 40's women are far more easier for men in this age group. Its also the age where men hit their career best income and are at their peak wealth accumulation stage.

Its the age where men come close to having female dating privilege (But still not equal). Its where men have the opportunity to genuinely choose between multiple options instead of being forced to make a subpar choice or stay single forever like 20's men.

Coolio_Street_Racer · 2023-01-31T17:40:29+00:00

It really depends on other factors such as wealth, status, and looks. Men are not handicapped by their age like women are soley based on the fact that men date younger and women date older.

You may think a 40 year old would have a hard time attracting a 25 year old. Throw in he is a millionaire and in great shape. Well now it dosen't seem so unreasonable.

Scarce12 · 2023-01-31T17:35:13+00:00

Which is terrifying for me because I feel I have only a few years left in me to find a girl for that stereotypical romantic relationship.

Women in your age and 5 years younger, wanting children, are even more terrified.

Consider that.

PuertoRock007 · 2023-01-31T17:04:47+00:00

I would say late 20 to find a serious relationship. That's when all the girls that are any good start disappearing.

It actually gets better to get though after 30 because so many females are desperate and all the other good men have disappeared too. That's if you're OK with smashing single moms and other leftover women. You might also have to lie and let them think you're open to a relationship.

KirthWGersen · 2023-01-31T18:06:19+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Aubrey_D_Graham · 2023-01-31T19:19:02+00:00

Have you ever considered dating 5, 10, 15 years younger? Any 30-40's man having trouble with dating is because they restrict themselves to their age-cohorts who are divorced or had kids.

West-Ad-9697 · 2023-01-31T20:19:07+00:00

Those are blue pillers that still seek a mommy.

If you want something that doesn't exist - you will have a bad time.

If you take women at what they have to offer - it's nice. What you get with age is a inherent masculine look. Before let's say - 28 - unless you have some nice facial features or good beard - you need to act a bit more agressive to have the girl fall into her feminine and swoon.

After let's say 30 - or even beyond. Just seeing you - makes women think - oh, wait, this is a man. You need to talk and suplicate or be corny to change her mind and fuck over your chances.

Annual-Umpire8567 · 2023-01-31T21:17:35+00:00

If you are willing to look overseas or at different cultures within your own country, your SMV doesn't need to decline as quickly and you will have better options than many younger men.

Square-Pie9671 · 2023-02-01T00:32:44+00:00

never, because a womans value drops faster, so despite getting less and less desirable, demand and supply work more and more in a mans favor as he ages, his pool of women increases as he ages, while the womans pool decreases. quality gets lost at some point, maybe approaching 40. but options increase indefinitely because a 60 year old can date 65-40, but a 60 year old woman can only date 60 and up. a 40 year old dude could date 25-45, but a 40 year old woman could only date 40 and up, so women will be forced to take a bigger and bigger age gap and less and less desirable men for their age.

Professional-You1235 · 2023-01-31T17:21:57+00:00

If you wanna date women your own age, then your choices just keep going up and up as you age. If you want young hot girls then they keep going down and down!😄

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festethefoole1 · 2023-01-31T17:01:31+00:00

It is very difficult to put an absolute number on this because age is inseparable from earnings, status and all those other factors which are crucial in terms of success for men.

I lived at home with parents working in a callcentre when I was 26, and owned a half-million pound flat at 30. Now at 32 I earn £82,400 plus bonus.

Also I’m living in London so even on the apps with women over 30, only about 1/100 women is a single mum.

RegTextoffender · 2023-01-31T17:03:15+00:00

When their penis stops working. From what I gather the guys who make it into old age have a field day in retirement homes.

slazengerx · 2023-01-31T18:38:52+00:00

I'm 55. Mine probably peaked at around 45 and just leveled off. If actual results are the indicator - which I assume they should be - then I'm still within a reasonable range of whatever that peak was. But I don't think I could say that if I lived in the US. That's a very different dating world. But I'm on the (steady, slow) decline now. That's life.

Diligent_Divide_4978 · 2023-01-31T19:05:29+00:00

After you leave high school. The market immediately becomes much more competitive and looks-based.

As a 5’7 autistic Asian guy, it likely never began for me, so I’ve spent a lot of time watching my acquaintances date. It got really hard for them comparatively after high school.

Davegvg · 2023-01-31T20:21:57+00:00

If you have money - never.

Ohyarlysmiles · 2023-01-31T20:56:40+00:00

My dating life got better once I hit my 30's.

It's true though that if you're on dating apps, it just keeps getting tougher year after year.

Useful-Indication225 · 2023-01-31T21:18:52+00:00

Lol I’m 32m and you’re putting a rocket up my ass rn

Stunning-Spirit5275 · 2023-01-31T22:10:27+00:00

Usually as soon as their economic value declines

Antisocialite99 · 2023-01-31T22:17:45+00:00

The ideal is falling in love in high school or college and getting married for rhe rest of your life with someone near your own age.

Any time after that it gets weirder and weirder.

purplish_possum · 2023-01-31T23:00:05+00:00

The dating market never declines for healthy active attractive guys. It's just as men age fewer and fewer of them are in that category.

PapaPinyun · 2023-01-31T23:00:17+00:00

I killed it on the scene in my late 30's man that's like, nearing the peak. You have like 6 or 7 crowning years yet where you have enough youth that, if you were serious about your manhood through your life, you can still compete in leagues against young men. And you have much accumulated wisdom and reach, connections, logistics, perspective. Orders of magnitude more interesting and fun than 10 years ago.

If youve been taking being a man seriously anyway.

deznue · 2023-01-31T23:15:47+00:00

When they broke 😆

ArmDiscombobulated29 · 2023-02-01T03:31:47+00:00

When you are or become poor

Gilmoregirlin · 2023-02-01T03:33:36+00:00

45 year old woman here and I got my comments deleted too many times in of that forum for offending the moderators. ! There are some decent people in there but the mods will delete anything they don’t agree with, and so the forum is skewed a lot. I left earlier this year.

That being said if you are a 45 year old man looking to date women in your age range, are average looking, have a job are mentally stable, honest, and kind generally there are a lot of women out there looking to date you. The problem is that most men in my age range want to date women 15 years younger, those women have no interest unless they are billionaires or Brad Pitt so they become angry and bitter and ignore the women in their age range that want to date them. I have been on both ends of this. In my early 30s I used to get hit on by all these (to me then) old dudes when my age range on dating sites was very specific and did not include theirs I also got a lot of men that lowered their age and lied to try to date me and they were infuriated that I was not interested.

But overall the stats are good for men as they age because men die young so the male population is low. My Mom works in the nursing home industry and she always jokes there are male hoes in there, one man to 20 ladies. I digress I know you did not mean that old.

People over 40 tend to be a lot less willing to put up with other peoples crap because by this age we are confident and used to be alone. I would not put up with in my 20s now not eve maybe. Plus you get better at spotting red flags and this is men and women Most women over 40 that see a man not willing to date in his own age range at all, as a no go.

lolthankstinder · 2023-02-01T05:18:37+00:00

One of the mathy cofounders of OKCupid, Christian Rudder, played around with anonymized data from millions of people and found that women desired men around their age or a little older until around 40 when the trend inverts and women start preferring younger men closer to 40 than older. However, I don't think that's exactly when men's SMV "starts to decline".

I think the desperation of wanting kids causes a lot of women to finally start having realistic standards of men. The modern misandrist narrative tends to bash men for needing therapy, lacking basic life skills, not knowing how to manage a house, etc. but then conveniently leaves out the prevalence of things like height preference. So are all men bad, or is it just the tall, unrealistically attractive leftover garbage you choose to dig through?

Well age 35 tends to be the cutoff age for pregnancy out of risk of chromosomal conditions and women don't want to raise a baby with some stranger, so they generally want to find someone by around age 33. While marrying someone up to age 40 isn't unheard of, per Rudder's findings women most prefer a guy only a little bit older. So, I think that puts the peak of men's SMV at around 36. Once you're past that point, women can just go back to having unrealistic standards and finding creative ways to blame men.

Over_North8884 · 2023-02-01T06:03:05+00:00

Guys over 50 dating women in their age, looks, and social bracket will rarely have trouble. It only gets better since women live longer. I could have older fat women queued up outside my door but my hand provides better company.

The problem comes when men seek significantly younger women with upper tier beauty. I moved to Southeast Asia to get what I wanted.

tropicalazul · 2023-02-01T06:06:48+00:00

If you haven't aged super well (which, most of you don't, that's just the truth) to the point where you look 5+ years younger, and if you aren't earning 6 figures, and if you aren't really fun to be around and in great shape, I think it tapers off after 30. Even more so by 35.

For guys who are tall, attractive, in-shape, well-earning, well-educated, they have more time. For them I think it's about 35ish then it starts to taper off a bit.

The reality is, you likely won't be settling down with someone WAY younger than you, despite how much men here desire that. Most of us women want a man around our own age. Very few 25 year olds are OK being with 35 year olds... only the really insecure ones are OK with that (or the ones who want your money). 99% of my female friends want a guy around their age, and the better looking they are (and not gold digging), the more likely this is to be true.

Start looking now. Why are you waiting?

anonymousUser1SHIFT · 2023-02-01T06:25:52+00:00

It's doesn't really ever start.

herinquisition · 2023-02-01T06:33:12+00:00

I kind of feel like dating in your 30s is better than your 20s, but that's from a woman's perspective in city contexts in the USA and thinking with a more quality vs quantity mindset.

I don't know that there is one specific time overall. I'm sure such a generality could be found with credible data, but usually people are just giving their opinions here. I think one of the biggest factors for men in their 30s and 40s will be time. If they have young kids from separated or divorced relationships and have more than minimal interaction with their kids, if they work long hours and are tired after balancing that with social time, time on their hobbies and interests, etc. I suppose dating actually does get more limited if they're dating people their own age, but that depends on where they live. Men often date women their age in major cities where women have put off kids while focusing on careers and education as well. Maybe in other contexts, more women tteir age are married now and off the market. And then they often date younger, which can have its own challenges. Some men in their 30s and 40s with kids prefer single moms actually from what I've heard. Depends.

I don't really put much stock in the idea of SMV, but if I had to say when things shift for everyone - probably 40s.

Substantial_Video560 · 2023-02-01T10:54:22+00:00

It's been declining for men for some time now.

BruddaMSK · 2023-02-01T11:40:01+00:00

For men the hardest time is before 30.

feanoric · 2023-02-01T13:09:55+00:00

I think it is the opposite.

Those men over 40 are desperate because they see other men married or re-married. They are fewer so the feel behind.

JewliusCaeser · 2023-02-01T14:16:03+00:00

After early 20s

Nihi1986 · 2023-02-01T14:56:39+00:00

In my late 30's too and can confirm every good partner is already taken, but I guess that makes me a not so good partner.

Anyway, don't lose hope.

Sabrepill · 2023-02-01T17:07:03+00:00

Don’t listen to what women on Reddit say. Watch what attractive women in real life actually do.

What you see is that the most highly attractive women tend to go for the men with the highest status. Status is rare in men under 25 barring a few exceptions like pro athletes and YouTube stars.

The men that have the most status in society are usually between 30 and 55 years old. It’s not their age per say that makes these men so attractive, it’s the status they have attained.

Therefore, the most attractive men are typically 30-55 because they have the highest status and you see this reflected in attractive womens choices.

Once again, pay attention to who fitness models, ig models, or attractive women in general are dating. They aren’t going for average men. If you’re an average man when you’re older than you’re even more irrelevant.

But since status often takes time to achieve, the most attractive men who get the most attractive women are high status men often ages 30-55

Sabrepill · 2023-02-01T17:14:47+00:00

As a man if you are

Good looking
Tall
Charismatic
High status

Then you do well with women regardless of age. High status men often peak between 30-55 because it often takes time to achieve status: wealth, muscles, game, etc.

Coincidentally leading males in most Hollywood movies are between these ages as well. Remember don’t listen to what women say on Reddit. Observe actual reality and what attractive women actually do. They go for high status men

The average age gap of very wealthy men is over twenty years. That’s not an outlier, that’s average for very wealthy men

Ok_Bus1797 · 2023-02-02T15:02:39+00:00

Since you want a traditional relationship, I presume you want someone around your age (within 6-8years). Men peaks at late 20s-late 30s.

If you want a trophy wife, then it’s like what some others said. Peaks at 35-early 50s. Can get girls from mid-20s and upwards, even at 40-50yo.

SoldierExcelsior · 2023-02-03T22:57:05+00:00

I think traditional dating is dead modern western women are toxic and they aren't wife material really aren't worth dating unless your just hooking up and guaranteed to fck.

There's hot wonen that only deal with the top men...there's average women that only deal with top men and below average women that deal with simps and betas.. The only exception is women will deal with a pookie Jason or Tyrone that has felony convictions they love the bad boy juice.

So older men 30+ shouldn't even bother you can go to the Philippines Vietnam Thailand Brazil to find a wife...

If you just want sex that easy enough to find anywhere

Title	When does dating market decline for men?
Author	kookoobear
Upvotes	33
Comments	267
Date	January 31, 2023 4:19 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/10q3661/when_does_dating_market_decline_for_men/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/when-does-dating-market-decline-for-men.1150562 https://theredarchive.com/post/1150562

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