CMV: Males should continue to make the first move

wapbamboom-alakazam · 2024-10-04T13:53:52+00:00

All you have to do is not be creepy

A completely subjective criteria that changes constantly from person to person.

Also your reasoning is basically "It's hard and potentially hurtful to approach, so we should leave the burden to men." Which sounds extremely entitled.

abaxeron · 2024-10-04T14:39:34+00:00

Women

males

Not engaging.

odd_cloud · 2024-10-04T15:10:19+00:00

Okay. Women like a little proportion of men. Data on right swipes on old support this, and many women say they consider very few men attractive. Men are more open and consider a large proportion of women attractive (like 30-70%).

It makes sense for women to approach, because men would get less rejections and women would get less unwanted attention. Women want no unwanted attention and men to approach, which is contradictory.

Have a look at this analogy. Imagine that instead of you going to a supermarket and buying the juice you like, sellers of juice would knock at your door and market their juice to you. That would be a huge waste of effort, and you most likely wouldn’t like that the sellers are constantly knocking on your door. That’s why we invented supermarkets where people just grab stuff they like.

The system where men approach is similar to the world with annoying juice sellers going from door to door. On the dating market women choose so I don’t see why they wouldn’t just grab what they like.

justanother-eboy · 2024-10-04T14:44:12+00:00

But women are strong and independent?

emax4 · 2024-10-04T13:36:29+00:00

Women: "We want confident men."

Also women: "Please don't make us do the work and ~~possibly~~ have to deal with rejection."

MaulerX · 2024-10-04T13:34:47+00:00

77% of Women ages 18-30 want to be approached by males.

You forgot the secret thing the women in that study arent saying out loud. They only want to be approached by men who they find attractive. Any other man that approaches them is automatically creepy.

meisterkraus · 2024-10-04T13:37:10+00:00

Creepy is a nebulas term that has many factors beyond your control. I propose women need to call each other out for calling men creepy.

Combatenjoyer23 · 2024-10-04T14:31:09+00:00

And lemme guess. "Whoever approaches first should pay for the date teehee!". This is just a roundabout way to keep most of the responsibility of dating on the guy by implying that it benefits us smh.

ThanosSnapsSlimJims · 2024-10-04T16:21:39+00:00

After this

https://www.fox29.com/news/woman-charged-for-lying-about-attempted-rape-kidnapping-in-bucks-county

Fathers should be encouraging men to not make the first move and to have a legal plan ready just in case things go south for just existing.

WanabeInflatable · 2024-10-04T13:45:14+00:00

All you have to do is not be creepy

You can't. It is subjective and decided not by your objective looks and behavior, but by how you are perceived by others.

Of course you can influence the chance of being considered creepy, yet you can't eliminate it altogether.

77% of Women ages 18-30 want to be approached by males

By male whom they find attractive. If you are attractive it is likely you have no problem and not sitting on PPD. If you are not, your advances wouldn't be welcome by these 77%. Attractiveness is subjective, though and there is a chance that some women will find you attractive, while majority don't

And here waiting for the first move, at least hint, makes sense. You know that you are at least not repulsive to her, probably attractive. You are likely won't be seen as a creep and your advances will be not considered harassment.

According_Second4222 · 2024-10-04T17:53:13+00:00

By making the first move, you feed the woman's ego. Egos are fed enough at this point. The success rate for approaches is incredibly low for most guys. I'm sure women love destroying other people's self esteem to boost their own, so of course they like the approach.

Men should not continue to enable women and should stop approaching.

Eastoss · 2024-10-04T13:59:07+00:00

Blue pillers told men not to. Ask them. Women 18-30 might say that, women 40-55 told a different story to their kids.

63daddy · 2024-10-04T16:06:05+00:00

“All you have to do is not be creepy”

The problem is anything a woman doesn’t welcome can be perceived/labeled as creepy or harassing these days. (The EEOC even states present giving and standing close to someone as examples of harassment).

People act on incentive and men, young men especially are getting a strong incentive not to not make the first move. If we want men to approach women more, we need to address the reason they are more reluctant to do so.

Proudvow · 2024-10-04T22:46:21+00:00

And before you say "hurr women said not to approach" - 77% of Women ages 18-30 want to be approached by males.

Then they should shut up the feminists telling men not to approach. And avoid brutally rejecting men who try.

Friedrich_Friedson · 2024-10-04T13:39:17+00:00

By making the first move you are opening yourself up to rejection which takes courage and confidence. Two traits that are attractive. Women should not have to carry this burden.

What a load of fucking tradbrainrot nonsense

1) why should men be required to "open themselves to rejection" if they don't want to? Why shouldn't women do it? Lmao

2)If these are attractive traits, then women should approach First to rip the benefits of it. Lol.

Men shouldn't be required,pressured or expected to approach because you are a chicken that wants to rationalize that with "MUUHHH WOMEN SHOULDN'T APPROACH!!!"

IdiAminD · 2024-10-04T13:46:32+00:00

I appreciate your consistency in using males and women
Approaching should not be gendered, my personal and unscientific evidence shows that women who approach, clean up the market from best guys and sometimes even from acceptable guys. We are living in hard times for people who are passive.

enesutku12 · 2024-10-04T13:40:37+00:00

is this post serious? obviously everyone wants to be approached and no one likes being the person that has ti approach men has realized this and now women wants their privilige back.

Equal7Drive · 2024-10-04T17:18:13+00:00

"stop approaching us 😡"

"why aren't men approaching anymore 😢"

Women being women.

Siukslinis_acc · 2024-10-04T16:34:55+00:00

How about people make a first move when they want to have an interaction regardless of the gender/sex. I don't get when people who don't initiate complain that the other party is not initiating. If you are interested in them - initiate and don't hope that they wil initiate.

WingAffectionate1757 · 2024-10-04T16:57:26+00:00

What happened to being 50/50

Audi_fanboy · 2024-10-04T13:35:29+00:00

Why do you always use males and women, and not men and women? I get that hearing men and females are annoying (rightly so), but doint the same isn't gonna solve the issue.

Gwandaru · 2024-10-04T14:28:35+00:00

"Women should not have to carry this burden."

Cowards. Approach someone if you like someone.

balhaegu · 2024-10-05T05:23:22+00:00

Women dont like needy men. Hence making the first move automatically lowers his value in her eyes. Men like willing women. Women making the move increases her value in his eyes.

banthaaaa · 2024-10-04T14:55:20+00:00

Top tier troll post right down to using women and males

Artistic_Speech_1965 · 2024-10-04T14:04:23+00:00

Cold approach are one of the worst strategy that doesn't really benefit both men and women in the short and long term

Women risk being approched/annoyed/harassed by creepy guys and increase the chance to end in unfulfilling relationships

Men risk being called a creep publicly and will lose greatly confidence since the rejection rate will be high. One of the best way to mass produce black/red pillers from blue pillers

Warm approach is the healthiest way tbh

Cunnin_Linguists · 2024-10-04T14:48:43+00:00

I approach women on dating apps 😂

Aafan_Barbarro · 2024-10-04T15:15:13+00:00

Please don't post that "survey", author made it from responses of his twitter audience.

HopeMuch7178 · 2024-10-04T16:57:22+00:00

Women are extremely picky

Electric_Death_1349 · 2024-10-04T18:33:06+00:00

The crux of your argument seems to be that men should approach women because a) not doing so would mean women having to make the first move and they don’t want to, and b) women want the ego boost/validation that comes with being approached - there’s not much to debate here; where is the incentive for the men?

KentuckyCriedFlickin · 2024-10-05T02:05:44+00:00

Seeing that all of these women are complaining about creeps, weirdos, and uglies approaching them. I'll only do it if the woman is worth it, very attractive, and I feel like I have a bit of a chance (IOIs).

Fair-Bus-4017 · 2024-10-04T14:05:47+00:00

Everyone should approach eachother. There. Solved it. We live in 2024 not 1879. Grow up people.

kaffeetasse22 · 2024-10-04T19:47:01+00:00

By making the first move you are opening yourself up to rejection which takes courage and confidence. […] Women should not have to carry this burden.

Courage (risk taking) and confidence are soft skills that are beneficial to anyone regardless of gender not only when it comes to dating but also in your career.

Maybe if women had more courage and confidence they’d also earn as much as men?

MC-Purp · 2024-10-04T14:58:30+00:00

I agree with your point. But I’m curious as to why you don’t think women shouldn’t have to carry the burden?

Opie67 · 2024-10-04T15:41:11+00:00

I agree but women gotta stop saying being approached is creepy and unwanted

Possible-Memory-1147 · 2024-10-04T20:48:27+00:00

Most women saying they wanna be approached means nothing in this discussion imo. Everyday men aren't gonna know what women are part of that 77%. "Back in the day" women would drop a handkerchief to get a man's attention. Maybe do something similar if you want approaches from men? A sign you're actually open to such attention? We don't really live in a world where it's normal to just start flirting with ladies in the supermarket, even if you are both shopping in the gluten free section. Such things don't make for a strong long term commitment... 😞

Termodynamicslad · 2024-10-04T22:44:03+00:00

Tell that to all the PUAs that were approaching women and got kicked for harassment.

https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/video/1.2459780

By making the first move you are opening yourself up to rejection which takes courage and confidence.Two traits that are attractive. Women should not have to carry this burden.

Baseless statement. Perception of confidence is skewed by physical attractiveness. More attractive people are seen as more confident.

Reasonable-Cookie783 · 2024-10-05T01:16:28+00:00

But there is still no reason for women not to make the first move. Men should do it and women should do it. 23% of wo men not wanting to be approached is actually quite a large number thats almost 1 in 4. It's kind of nuts that its not like 90% plus of women that want to be approached.

SufficientAdvantage8 · 2024-10-05T09:19:08+00:00

Breeders should not have to carry this burden.

Then how could she carry a baby? If this was a problem for her, she would most likely be a bad mother. So a man dodget a bullet by avoiding her.

Hosj_Karp · 2024-10-07T06:51:29+00:00

I actually had way more fun (not to mention success) with dating when I fully embraced the masculine "leading" role.

You mean I get to pick the activities I enjoy and the schedule most convenient for me and lead the interaction where I want it to go? Splendid.

Good_Result2787 · 2024-10-04T14:17:49+00:00

If confidence and courage are attractive, why should a man not look for that in a woman? Do women find having their own confidence and courage burdensome in some way?

Prestigious_Pipe_522 · 2024-10-04T14:53:31+00:00

Oh my god if you’re interested in somebody in a social setting just go flirt with them if they aren’t taken wtf is all this “burden” shit grow up

Fichek · 2024-10-04T14:29:16+00:00

And you should continue making posts like this one, I can never get enough of them.

marchingrunjump · 2024-10-04T16:48:38+00:00

Over the last half century, there has been a push for empowering women.

But with great power comes great responsibility. Or, at least, that’s what Yoda claims.

Perhaps power dynamics are in play as well?

So how does this work: 1. Do the powerful typically approach the less powerful? 2. Do the less powerful typically approach the powerfull? 3. Do people of equal power approach each other?

I would probably say that the one being approached has the upper hand.

This is also law #8 in Robert Greenes book 48 laws of power: “Law 8: Make Other People Come to You”

But if the power differential becomes too large, men counter with law #36: “Disdain Things You Cannot Have: Ignoring Them Is the Best Revenge”.

What else is there to do?

Obviously women would still want men to give them the upper hand and do the work of approaching. Then they can enjoy the sweet validation by lots of interest as well as the power they have gained from the push from what goes under the label of “gender equality”.

The proof is in the pudding.

Teflon08191 · 2024-10-04T17:02:16+00:00

How about this:

Men will acknowledge that it's their duty to approach if women can agree on one single duty that they as women must have towards men.

Deal?

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rustlerhuskyjeans · 2024-10-04T17:07:49+00:00

Women make insanely obvious choosing signals that can make an approach very easy. Once you start talking they can make things even more obvious to ask them out or kiss them.

If you’re never getting these looks, stare lookaways, gestures, arm touches etc. then you have to cold approach to find someone. The only other alternative is work, social circles, or dating apps. Cold approach is hard though, you’re going to waste a lot of time, and the rejection is real and brutal.

y2kjanelle · 2024-10-04T22:04:13+00:00

I don’t mind approaching but it doesn’t work in my favor. Rejection doesn’t scare me as much as many people but men always take it a step further in either treating me poorly by oversexualizing me or rejecting me harshly BECAUSE I’m a woman and I must be some easy slut and desperate since I’m approaching because “men aren’t approaching me”.

So I’ll do it just not very often. When men value and appreciate it, I’ll definitely reconsider how often.

ArtifactFan65 · 2024-10-05T05:11:54+00:00

I don't think men being expected to approach is really a problem for men. Attractive and socially competent men will have no problem approaching women, and men who don't fit those criteria wouldn't be approached very often anyway if the roles were reversed.

I just don't believe waiting around is a winning strategy for women. By waiting for men to approach them instead of going directly for high value attractive men and seducing them women are lowering the quality of their dating pool to whoever decides to approach them.

They may end up dating a man who they never would have approached themselves just because he initiated.

H8beingmale · 2024-10-08T04:43:21+00:00

doesn't matter, men will always be stuck with this whether they like it or not, hence why there will always be more male wizards than female wizards

Key-Garage-9574 · 2024-10-28T02:05:25+00:00

If we approach first, you should be in the kitchen right?
I GUESS gender stereotypes only work if it's in the complete benefit of the women right?

REALLY sounds like were equals don't it?

Unable_Evidence_4028 · 2024-10-04T13:39:58+00:00

You speak as if men had a choice. We need sex, so of course we will be active in our pursuit.

Let the passive guys be passive, they at least not bothering anyone and it leave more pussy for us who know the real value of a woman. Win-win.

SaBahRub · 2024-10-04T14:08:40+00:00

It’s not “should”

It’s “have to”

As long as “men will fuck anything”

kingofgama · 2024-10-04T15:32:15+00:00

Can't say I disagree.

People will waffle about whether this is fair or what not, but that doesn't matter really. Although look, I totally agree it's rejection sucks and it is pretty one side. But It's pretty much expected for men to make the first move, so if you want to be romantically successful as a man you should bite that bullet.

But try and learn the difference between harassment and approaching someone, you don't need to go all in and it's fine to test the waters. Also be realistic, if you are creepy or butt-ugly learn to accept that your most likely fucked, and all you can do is either find a way to change or accept your situation.

Impossible_Cup7586 · 2024-10-04T13:42:47+00:00

Men: Endlessly complain about how uncomfortable it is to approach people, how nervous it makes them and how the fear of rejection consumes them.

Also men: Why don't women start approaching men?!???

Not necessarily selling the idea or making it appealing are you? Lol. If you don't want to do it, why should we? It's like complaining about your job all the time but then asking someone to replace you over the summer.

Title	CMV: Males should continue to make the first move
Author	Windmill_flowers
Upvotes	0
Comments	416
Date	October 4, 2024 1:27 PM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1fvz4qd/cmv_males_should_continue_to_make_the_first_move/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/cmv-males-should-continue-to-make-the-first-move.1532040 https://theredarchive.com/post/1532040

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