what exactly are the standards for an average man ?

NockerJoe · 2022-07-25T03:59:20+00:00

The bar to jump is low. Qualifying for the competition is another matter entirely. If a woman already likes you a lot she'll excuse a lot but getting a woman that actually likes you that much is where 90% of the effort goes.

EnteFetz · 2022-07-25T09:11:03+00:00

The reason why women say the bar is low is that if a man is good looking and confident, he can get away with absolutely everything. Women will excuse every behaviour because they are attracted to him and just say that all men behave as badly as him.

Or when they are with a not so attractive man, they will find an infinite number of complaints to justify why they are not attracted to him.

The concept that they are attracted to looks and confidence seems to twist their perception in a way that they backwards rationalise the terrible behaviour of good looking men by saying all men are like that and rationalise the fact that they are not attracted to average men by getting overly upset about every tiny mistake he does.

If you are not attractive she will judge you harshly for everything you do or say and for everything you don't do or say.

That is also how women get to the twisted conclusion that all ugly men are asshloes and terrible people. I've heard repeatedly that women say attractive men have treated them better than ugly men. The reason for that is simply that the attractive man basically cannot make any mistakes because she will rationalise being attracted to him through his actions, while anything the ugly man does is in her mind a justification why she is not attracted to him.

Laytheblameonluck · 2022-07-25T06:16:05+00:00

There are plenty of comments in almost all women centric subs here that say stuff like "the standards for a decent man is very low"

What they're actually saying is this:

"Ignoring all men I'm not attracted toward, the standards for a decent man is very low"

Steakman1 · 2022-07-25T02:29:55+00:00

The perceived standard of what is an average man or woman isn’t what it actually is. Wanting someone who isn’t overweight and near obese (at least in the US) automatically means you want someone above average physically.

SmarmyPapsmears · 2022-07-25T01:22:46+00:00

The standards for men will never be low because inherently women want men who are above average. If the bar moves, so do women's standards.

The only women complaining about the bar being in hell are delusional, as women have never had more advantages in history than they currently do.

DisplacedBitzer · 2022-07-25T04:17:33+00:00

Every chick I’ve met(anecdotal ik) has had high standards. And cool, more power to them, but as an average man(in my opinion) the bar has never been even close to low.

Consider average attractiveness. Typically, it’s on a bell curve, but most dudes are considered below average looks wise.(old study). Which is dumb, because that makes no sense when thinking about averages definition. So from the get go, most women already perceive the average as more attractive than 80% of men.

Now, sure, attractiveness is the foot in the door, but other stuff matters to be decent. Personally, I’ve always found the expectation of income has always been higher than average as well. Car crib job, right? And all typically better than the norm.

Then even personality wise, I think average is considered to be more confident, extroverted and stereotypical than exists.

If we look at the real average guy, we get a slightly overweight, not that great looking guy working an alright job that doesn’t make great money. Someone who has an alright personality, not a social butterfly by any means and a few friends maybe, plus some problems. Now, do you think that sort of guy is considered dateable by most women? Considered decent by most women? My anecdotal answer is no, because I know several dudes like that, and they all struggle.

GottaPSoBad · 2022-07-25T01:08:58+00:00

May I let you in on the dirty secret? (More open secret really.) Women's idea of "basic standards" and "average man" are way out of whack, at least when compared to the actual average that exists. Ask any woman to tell you what her basic expectations are and it'll be a damn laundry list. Ask a man, it's probably just a few things.

As I say that, let me try to nudge the pitchforks downward by acknowledging this: Women aren't inherently wrong for wanting what actually amounts to an above average male. But the key issues are being honest about it and doing the work to justify it. Wanting someone above average when you yourself are average or below is a very real hypocrisy that many people (including women) act out everyday.

As to my own definition of an average male? I think I outlined it in another thread, but basically...

Has a mediocre (at best) job, isn't in great shape, doesn't live alone (might live with family), average looks, average height, no real status, and basically has a ton of room for improvement. He's not necessarily a basement dwelling loser, but he's not what women think of when they say they want an "average guy."

Redditcritic6666 · 2022-07-25T06:47:51+00:00

The average millennial is still living with their parents but women expects men who's dating them should at lesst have their own place. Right or not that should tell you something about women's standards about men in this date and age.

vtribal · 2022-07-25T07:56:24+00:00

“Average” = just outside the top 20% of men

gladusgates · 2022-07-25T01:10:14+00:00

They definitely are not low. If you want to know what the standards are for an average man, pay attention to how women treat or speak about height, that should give you a decent idea of what they consider average to be. Same for money, and the same for looks. Here's a hint, what they want is typically not very average.

Panda-997 · 2022-07-25T00:57:37+00:00

[permanently deleted]

MicrospathodonChrys · 2022-07-25T02:13:06+00:00

I could be way off base, but usually when i see the phrase “the bar is in hell,” it tends to be referencing how men treat women rather than specific qualities men may or may not have. And i think what women want in terms of how we are treated —“the bar” so to speak— would be things like:

-respect our goals/careers/interests/opinions

-be reliable (call when you say you will, etc)

-don’t cheat

-be friendly to our friends and family

Etc

-25T · 2022-07-25T01:38:39+00:00

the standards for a decent man is very low

This is because women tend to lower the bar to keep the man they already like over the bar. Some men will manage to go even lower. If the woman puts the bar on the floor then he breaks out a shovel.

What exactly are the standards that they speak of?

Depends on the woman, but the widely accepted minimums are:

wears clothes that are not stained up or very old
is not a misogynist or obvious abuser
makes some kind of effort to not look slovenly (combed hair, groomed beard, showers)
Is financially stable / not a mooch or couchsurfer
has stable shelter that has furniture
edit to add: shelter is not slovenly

Commonly accepted additions that are probably about 50% of American women's minimums:

shelter is not his parent's house
has transportation
has a job
"smart" (compatible IQ)
"emotionally stable" (compatible EQ)
"we have a spark" (highly compatible EQ, or EQ + physical attraction)

How do women in those subs perceive an average man to be like?

It depends on the sub. Men on average use % (10% are 1/10, 10% are 2/10, etc.) and women usually use bell curve (most are 5/10 with few 1/10 or 10/10). So most men are failing in some way to meet a minimum, or are failing to meet the extras above minimum. However, women will lower the bar for a man they like (we have a spark)

And would they even be with an average man?

Women treat a man like a 5/10 until he shows his personality or if he doesn't keep up with his appearance. In general, because women are referring to personality and maintenance of appearance (the whole package is in the rating and men have to prove their personality to get above or below that 5), they won't rate someone they want to be with as average.

Men rate based on physical first and adjust the rating later if she's awful. They assume the women that is attractive has the personality they want to be with. You rate first then vet later. Women vet first then rate later. So some things she wants might go out the window if he checks other boxes.

If not then why bother about those standards?

They won't rate someone they want to be with as average. And men don't want women they're only attracted to in a mediocre way either.

AelfredRex · 2022-07-25T12:06:53+00:00

He has to be someone she likes. And since that is a subjective variable, it's completely down to the individual in question.

hdksndiisn · 2022-07-25T20:11:42+00:00

If a woman likes you there really is no bar. I’ve been a homeless drunk and had women fall in love with me (that weren’t homeless drunks) and I’ve been a sober CEO and had women reject me.

The other strange thing is there is a difference between immediate attraction and interest vs long term attraction accumulated over time like via work or school.

The environment plays a sometimes paradoxical role in attraction, in that someone who would reject you at the bar or a party may develop feelings for you at work, or the opposite - you are attractive initially but over time that fades so you basically have a window of opportunity. Either way, a woman is gonna like who she likes.

Dating, on the other hand, is unnatural, as you’re trying to force familiarity attraction over time via multiple dates or take advantage of the initial attraction acquired from that right swipe or drunken hook up.

This is why it’s almost always easier and better to meet people via a social environment where acquaintances are shared or work or school and you can both take advantage of initial attraction by blocking any friend-zoning & take time in accruing attraction or displaying value through multiple natural interactions.

This is why I think the bar is “so low” - you simply need to stand out amongst the heap of “average” guys, like she stands out amongst the heaps of fat women…

heartheartdoki96 · 2022-07-25T01:26:37+00:00

Has a job, hopefully has his own place or a place with a roommate, but many will avbept a partner living st home if you explain it right, like if the parents are older

Mostly clean, bur even then like most people don't expect a magazine home. Just not filthy. But even then, some people fuck nasty people

Nice. Just nice, compliments you sometimes and buys you a candy are when he gets gas

Looks wise, really there's a pot for every lid, like I've seen big fat dudes and rail thin skinny dudes with big tit gfs who had jobs and were nice, sp if they can you can. I've met plenty of short dudes who slay poon. Honestly, women love short dudes. I've met a lot of women who fetishize little people, just saying.

Hoopy223 · 2022-07-25T00:59:29+00:00

The people who say that stuff are just trying to puff themselves up. I’m so great men don’t deserve me! Etc.

ta06012022 · 2022-07-25T04:58:00+00:00

It seems like standards for an average man are about... average. In the US, 69% of adult men and 69% of adult women are in committed romantic relationships. That means the average man or woman in the 50th percentile has settled down with someone.

If standards among either gender were grossly out of line with reality, then the majority of adults would be single.

https://www.pewresearch.org/social-trends/2020/08/20/a-profile-of-single-americans/

f_ckupsomecommas · 2022-07-25T04:00:10+00:00

That’s a difficult question to answer, but I suppose it could be broken down into categories.

Appearance:

To be average, you’d have to be around 5’8-5’10 in height, depending on your build probably between 150 to 180 lbs, maybe a little higher or lower. You’d ideally have most if not all of your hair, facial hair trimmed neatly or shaved, and a plain looking face. You build isn’t skinny, but isn’t fat either, but also not particularly muscled.

Personality: You’re not awkward, but not charming. You can be funny at times, but other times more guarded. You’re usually decent at building a rapport with others, but occasionally run into minor conflicts. Most people don’t mind you, and usually neither dislike nor like you. You probably have enough friends to feel content.

Miscallenous: You probably drink on occasion with your mates, but you’re not a drug user aside from a couple hits of weed off a spliff at a party. You have at least a high school level education, possibly some post-secondary. You’re consistently employed, but not in the best job. You’re not in trouble with the law or a convict, nor do you have any drug problems or severe mental illness like bipolar or schizophrenia. You might be depressed, but not to a degree that’s significant.

Generally you err somewhere in the middle, not deviating to any extremes like a neckbeard or a Chad. Some people find you attractive, some don’t, it’s really random most of the time.

anon018274031 · 2022-07-25T08:12:34+00:00

The bar is in hell usually applies to the standards women allowed DURING a relationship. A stupid amount of women end up becoming their boyfriends mother, they allow cheating, they just let their partner do absolutely nothing and stay with them. I know far to many women supporting unemployed wasters.

januaryphilosopher · 2022-07-25T07:08:31+00:00

The standards that they're talking about are to do with being a halfway decent person and having something approximating an equal relationship. These aren't easy to meet.

jonascf · 2022-07-25T07:22:25+00:00

In my experience this is what makes a man good enough to get into a relationship and also have some casaul sex;

Be able to support yourself. I got a lot more women and attention after getting off welfare.
Be able to actually listen to and communicate with your partner, to take what they say to hearth and act on it.

M_LaSalle · 2022-07-25T08:47:22+00:00

How do women in those subs perceive an average man to be like ?

Beneath their consideration and unworthy of them

And would they even be with an average man ?

If nothing better were available and only until better comes along

If not then why bother about those standards ?

So they can know when to dump the man they currently have and trade up.

_Oh_Be_Nice_ · 2022-07-25T09:51:27+00:00

What exactly are the standards that they speak of ?

Guess I'll have to repeat this until the heat death of the universe:

Relatively easy-going
Reasonable life-goals
A sense of humor
Doesn't treat people expendably
Fiscally literate
Responsible with money
Athletic
Hygienic
Self-aware
Possesses a curious mind
An actual attraction to me
Exhibits all or most of these attributes consistently throughout her life

aspiring-schizoid · 2022-07-25T12:05:44+00:00

I don’t think they’re talking about attractiveness when they say that. It usually comes as the response to stories about women being taken for granted in a relationship, like when the man expects her to clean up after him despite her also having a full time job, or immature communication skills, possessiveness and policing, etc. the standard for attractiveness is high but I think the mean the standard for decency in a relationship is low

nostalgicboomer · 2022-07-25T12:07:09+00:00

The bar for behaviour, morality, economic success etc is low.

The bar for looks is high.

Women are responsible for both of these paradigms.

Flightlessbirbz · 2022-07-25T13:09:58+00:00

When I say “the bar is on the ground/underground/in hell, etc.” I’m generally referring to when men are praised for things like taking care of their own kids, not being abusive, not raping someone when they had the chance, buying their own mom a present... the most basic human decency that’s taken for granted in women, but treated as special in men.

And the fact that men are saying things like “the bar is only low for men she likes/is attracted to” ...why is this a surprise? Do you even have a bar for women you don’t like and aren’t attracted to? Why does it need to be stated that women generally want to like their partners?

lalelu2727 · 2022-07-25T07:19:43+00:00

My standard would be that you actually see me as an individual human being with individual personality and not just a representative of the female gender that is somehow entirely different than men.

SnooCats37 · 2022-07-25T12:34:56+00:00

What’s meant by that is society’s standards for men. If a man cleans around the house it’s: oh isn’t he amazing, he’s so helpful. If a woman does the same thing, it’s: yep. If a man doesn’t clean: oh you can’t expect him to, he’s so tired, he could be a lot worse. If a woman doesn’t clean, she’s lazy.

If a man picks up pizza for his kids, again it’s wow what an amazing dad. If a woman picked up pizza for the kids, you’re so lazy why didn’t you cook them a proper meal.

If a man cheats, men and women will turn to the woman he cheated on and say what weren’t you doing, you mustn’t have been giving him what he wants. If a woman cheats, she’s a bitch.

If a woman works full time, she’s still expected to take majority responsibility of the household and kids. If men work full time, the same isn’t expected back in society.

There’s this double standard where the bar for men is low. Society wants men to be looked after like another child whilst telling women to not question a man’s contribution to the household, relationship or kids

KFC_Fleshlight · 2022-07-25T14:04:26+00:00

kind, funny, empathetic, wants to spend time with their partner outside of sex, is interested in their partners pleasure during sex is above the bar but should really be what the bar is.

EugeneCezanne · 2022-07-25T14:54:11+00:00

The bar is low. Take care of yourself, be fun to be around and don't be cringe. It's astonishing how many men fail and resent that bar.

WaffleBurner96 · 2022-07-26T20:17:41+00:00

The average man is neither fat nor bony. He showers regularly. He has neatly kept hair, but it’s not cut in a particularly stylish or flattering way. He keeps his modest house or affordable apartment relatively clean, but might do something like leave a dish in the sink or miss the dirty hamper occasionally. He like sports, cars, comic books, some other generic male hobby, and isn’t an alcoholic but enjoys beer on the weekends. He makes eh, 60k or so a year working a 9-5 with limited upwards mobility. He has some but relatively little savings. He can cook food that is edible but not delicious, maybe five or six good meals. He has a cat, probably. He’s close with his mum, but feels like he doesn’t live up to his dad’s standards, and would never admit it. He has a close circle of mostly equally average friends. They get together and complain about their girlfriends until they find one they really love, and then they are teased by the group. He can get average women to date and sleep with him, and has an n count of 4. He’ll meet his wife at a wedding or work party. He’ll probably get divorced after about 15 years of marriage and two kids.

catniagara · 2022-07-25T15:53:04+00:00

Here are the “super high standards” just about zero men I’ve ever met are capable of meeting. Coincidentally, most women complain of the same issues.

*know how to cook for yourself.

*know how to clean up after yourself.

*be kind to people because you are kind, not because of what they look like.

*talk to people (especially women and girls) for a reason other than wanting to have sex with them.

*don’t make fun of me or complain about what you wish I did differently.

*don’t comment on my looks and how someone else is better.

*don’t compare me to others/talk about how they’re better than me or I’m better than them. Existing is not a competition between women.

*don’t be a raging pedophile. (eg. Don’t comment on how “hot” you think children are)

*shower. Daily. Possibly twice daily. Don’t smell like a walking butt.

*wash your face and clean under your nails.

*be polite. Don’t lift your leg and fart in public thinking it’s funny. I assure you it’s not.

*don’t hit people.

*don’t scream at me.

*don’t blame me for your problems.

*don’t pressure me into things I don’t want to do.

*literally shut the fuck up about your ex.

*literally shut the fuck up about your mom and how her cooking is better, when you spent at least 15 of the 20+ years you lived with her bitching that HER cooking wasn’t good enough.

*don’t assume I’m “jealous” if you want me to be jealous of some other girl so bad, leave me for her. So I can replace you. Next.

*don’t expect me to do everything.

*don’t have a hidden addiction.

*don’t use me for money while constantly loaning expensive shit to your friends.

*don’t develop some pompous self obsession, decide you’re better than me and can treat me like crap.

….etc. ad nauseum, but here are some specific situations we really shouldn’t have had to tell idiots were wrong.

-My friends husband said I had “great tits”, tried to grab them and couldn’t see what the issue was

-My ex kept “running into old friends” but couldn’t invite any of them over, and would tell them it was because he had a mean jealous gf bla bla bla. So I invited one of them over, told her exactly the game he had been playing, said she could have him, and tossed him out. To this day he still lies about me throwing him out because I was “jealous”

-My other ex didn’t understand why inviting 20+ of his closest friends from their oppressive religion over, and then asking me to act like Suzy housewife and SERVE their food and drinks was a problem.

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IllMathemagician · 2022-07-25T11:54:44+00:00

I mean by definition average would be such that about 50% is higher and the same lower

Title	what exactly are the standards for an average man ?
Author	Panda-997
Upvotes	33
Comments	267
Date	July 25, 2022 12:52 AM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/w7axjf/what_exactly_are_the_standards_for_an_average_man/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/what-exactly-are-the-standards-for-an-average-man.1124949 https://theredarchive.com/post/1124949

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