I think it's pathetic that if you dig deeper, most of TRP criticisms about how unjust society is for men boil down to "I can't control my wife anymore"

howdoiw0rkthisthing · 2024-07-03T13:42:05+00:00

There was one user here a while ago who really REALLY cared about circumcision but I haven’t seen him lately.

bluestjuice · 2024-07-03T13:48:04+00:00

I think any overlap between TRP and men’s rights activism is incidental at best.

Gravel_Roads · 2024-07-03T10:51:17+00:00

That isn't actually a TRP criticism, in that those complaints aren't supported by actual TRP. Like, if you look at the sidebar or what the old guard of TRP dudes used to recommend, it's WRIT, TRP actually says "stop trying to control your woman and start controlling yourself". It says not to debate, not to demand submission, to "keep frame" and NGAF about minor details and, when faced with an environment that doesn't appreciate you, it recommends reminding yourself "I am the Prize" and NEXT that situation in search of greener pastures.

However... I do agree that we see a lot of dudes CALL themselves TRP, and make a lot of complaints about how much they wish they could control women. But that's just the weird thing BlackPillers are doing lately - calling themselves Red Pill, because it makes it easier for them to post on this sub (because incel content is banned.)

UpbeatInsurance5358 · 2024-07-03T11:07:09+00:00

There's lots of male centric issues. Most notably, the cultural acceptance of non medically necessary circumcision. The lack of acknowledgement of DV and sexual violence against men.

The complete and utter refusal of our society to teach boys to care for their own mental and emotional health. Aka "boys don't cry"

The refusal of society to acknowledge that intimacy is also a necessity, and that forging intimate relationships with friends can be as rewarding as romantic ones.

There's a host more but my brain won't allow me to work and think of more.

I have to edit and explain that I am not RP and I agree that I've only ever heard any of these things mentioned in retaliation to issues for women.

SaBahRub · 2024-07-03T14:29:30+00:00

That’s because real TRP

1) is a strictly individual, not political, philosophy — “I’m going to get mine; fuck you”

2) requires work and self blame

AlmostKindaGreat · 2024-07-03T17:41:05+00:00

In its ideal form, TRP is just a set of advice for how to make women attracted to a man. It doesn't concern itself with your political views or your stance on issues affecting men apart from relationships/sex. It's not trying to do anything other than increase romantic options. "women won't fck me" is the kind of thing that it is meant to address and not circumcision or the draft.

...but of course that's the ideal.

In reality it seems like a lot of RP guys are also involved with Men's Rights, anti-feminism, conservative politics, traditional lifestyle, and a whole lot of other supposedly pro-man stuff that has nothing to do with a sexual strategy.

K4matayon · 2024-07-03T13:47:17+00:00

How did you come to the conclusion that trp is about men’s rights? do you think trp is male feminism?

wtknight · 2024-07-03T12:16:35+00:00

TRP is more about how to have more sex in the face of women’s empowerment than it is complaining about not being able to control women, even though TRP does attract a lot of misogynists.

Qwertyy123098 · 2024-07-03T10:54:49+00:00

circumcision

Male genital mutilation.

Expensive-Tea455 · 2024-07-03T13:10:51+00:00

Yeah they’re really mad that women don’t have to walk around bare foot and pregnant anymore 🤣

Women having any sort of bodily autonomy upsets them because now we actually have the right to say no to them

meteorness123 · 2024-07-03T17:32:10+00:00

"Real issues like circumcision"

obviousredflag · 2024-07-03T18:36:47+00:00

I don't think TRP cares about real male issues like circumcision or the mandatory draft.

You don't seem to underestand what the goal of TRP is. It's not feminism for men.

Gold_Supermarket1956 · 2024-07-03T19:12:14+00:00

It's not about controlling your wife it's about wanting respect... respecting him and the relationship, going clubbing or drinking, and dressing like a hoe isn't respecting him or the relationship

nofaplove-it · 2024-07-04T01:52:38+00:00

Circumcision isn’t a real male issue, the only ones who care are extremely hyper-fixated on their dick not being the way they want, and it’s almost pathetic to a point.

It’s an irrelevant discussion and I laugh every time some guy brings it up.

Lift_and_Lurk · 2024-07-03T13:14:39+00:00

If you read TRP or the sidebar almost all of them reference “the rational male” as a “cornerstone source”

So it’s not surprise that the book written by a truck driver who married a BPD woman would actually be about his own issues and LARPs

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blarginfajiblenochib · 2024-07-03T11:09:19+00:00

Not really - a lot of women tend to bring up rape/crime stats to derail topics about men’s issues, and most complaints I see are in regard to double standards - men are always somehow bad while women are always the moral underdogs who are endlessly victimized by the mean scary men.

volleyballbeach · 2024-07-03T12:20:45+00:00

Correct, TRP is culture and dating focused whereas MRA includes legal rights.

greekgawdz · 2024-07-03T16:27:31+00:00

OP believes that men wanting women to fuck them and men feeling entitled to respectful treatment from their lifelong partners are "pathetic."

OP lacks self-awareness lol

DarayRaven · 2024-07-03T11:08:19+00:00

Instead when you dig deeper about why they're frustrated at "gynocentric" society, their issues boil down to "women won't fck me" and "I can't control my wife anymore like I think I am entitled to". How pathetic is it that your problem is that you have no control of the opposite gender.

Nice strawman

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PMmeareasontolive · 2024-07-03T18:21:36+00:00

In olden times RP wasn't terribly concerned with marriage so I think you are conflating traditional-conservative relationship types with RP. So be it; RP, lacking any formal manifesto, has become pretty much whatever anyone says it is.

Due to that malleability though it can also be more than the interests of a few traditional-conservatives. It can be viewed equally as easily as a critique of marriage in general ("she's not yours, it's just your turn", "don't have one-itis", "women only love men for what they can do for them", etc). The whole AF/BB thing was not very encouraging in terms of marriage prospects.

Expanded to it's logical conclusion, RP can be viewed as a critique of gender roles for both men and women. Why? Because you've probably heard guys say that this is virtually the only sub where they can complain about their gender role experience w/o being banned (they will be ridiculed for non-conformance, but that's fine. Usually the BP circle jerking is within bounds).

Upset_Material_3372 · 2024-07-03T19:45:04+00:00

Im going to die alone without ever experiencing a romantic interaction “damn I wish I could control my wife.”

kvakerok_v2 · 2024-07-03T20:02:52+00:00

Whatever gave you the idea that TRP has anything to do with men's rights?

The only connection is a book & a documentary by Cassie Jaye named "The Red Pill", even though the whole work was about men's rights (or rather lack thereof). But there was absolutely nothing about TRP in it 🤷🏽‍♂️

boom-wham-slam · 2024-07-03T20:05:22+00:00

TRP does not care about anything. It's essentially a framework of fact focus. You're really talking about other movements.

jymssg · 2024-07-04T01:03:38+00:00

I'm in danger :)

GridReXX · 2024-07-04T02:42:28+00:00

[permanently deleted]

GridReXX · 2024-07-04T02:57:50+00:00

TRP doesn’t care about male issues. They care about getting what they want out of sexual and romantic relationships with women.

That said, you’re right that a lot of that does look like being mad women won’t fuck them or that women won’t submit to them.

ThanosSnapsSlimJims · 2024-07-04T15:12:07+00:00

The thread title shows that the op has no intention of being objective. Red pill is about being a better you and not being a doormat for others

I could make up the same thread title in reverse and say that women don’t like red pill because they don’t eant to give up control of their husbands. It’s all made up

Alternative_Poem445 · 2024-07-03T12:36:32+00:00

women are increasingly legally advantaged while claiming to be oppressed.

lgtv354 · 2024-07-03T12:34:50+00:00

females say "everyone should be drafted or nobody should be drafted" then proceeds to do nothing about said problem. okay man goes against the agenda that conscripts him. he is getting jailed, killed or both and all his efforts are in vain because government doesnt care about man. if females actually start rioting about shit then government will change the policy because they care about female opinion.

GridReXX · 2024-07-03T12:50:19+00:00

What do we do about a world where everyone wants to be the dom, and not the sub?

Unable_Evidence_4028 · 2024-07-03T12:25:38+00:00

More precisely? it is about how most guys see women have no control at all, external or internal.

It is true that before men were tasked with controling emotional, impulsive, oblivious, obnouxious, and mentally ill women,

But this time has passed, now women must control themselves or be criticized for what they are, and it is clear they are not doing that, thus being criticized.

Realistic-Ad-1023 · 2024-07-03T12:52:09+00:00

Why do I always get the feeling that what people like OP are really saying is

How pathetic is it that ... you have no control of the opposite gender.

shadowrangerfs · 2024-07-03T14:49:13+00:00

TRP isn't a men's advocacy movement. It's just about dating strategies. Why should they be talking about those issues? They only reason they should mention those things is when feminist bring them up. It's the feminist bringing them up.

Issues like the draft or circumcision is more of an MRA topic.

Idol_Four · 2024-07-03T15:07:49+00:00

Basically, what you're saying is that you experience a complete lack of understanding of trp.

abaxeron · 2024-07-03T16:32:22+00:00

I don't think TRP cares about real male issues like circumcision or the mandatory draft.

Not only the red pill was never intended as continuation, faction, wing, or umbrella above the men's rights movement; a lot of redpillers see MRAs as cucks.

Instead when you dig deeper about why they're frustrated at "gynocentric" society, their issues boil down to "women won't fck me" and "I can't control my wife anymore like I think I am entitled to". How pathetic is it that your problem is that you have no control of the opposite gender.

GENEROUSLY assuming this is true AND exhaustive... what's wrong here, except that you subjectively find it "pathetic"? How does "can't control my wife" expand onto "have no control of the opposite gender"? You do understand that all women everywhere are not married to every single man everywhere?

Finally, how deep do you need to dig to stumble upon "RED PILL IS IN FAVOR OF MARRIAGE"?!

What planet are you on?

DissociativeRuin · 2024-07-03T17:53:35+00:00

I think it's about equal labor and long term prospects.

Men don't want to invest the time, resources and energy in to women.

Women don't have to invest anything to get a man's attention except her boobs in the right shirt.

It's just that simple.

Able_Donut2654 · 2024-07-03T11:16:50+00:00

This is just a bucket of unfalsifiable rhetorical slime directed at some kind of blackpill/tradcon straw man. Not the red pill.

There is no actual content to debate here, just invective.

Proper_Frosting_6693 · 2024-07-03T12:22:26+00:00

No! TRP is just about awareness of how women operate: AF/BB etc and how to properly vet them.

I’m sure that there are plenty disgruntled people complaining about other issues but it’s not the core of what TRP is. Just like the core of feminism isn’t misandry but many women identifying as feminists are just misandrists

Tywinlol2 · 2024-07-03T12:47:02+00:00

This is nothing more then a bunch of semantics with the aim of demonizing men. Exactly same behavior can be classified as controlling and healthy boundary setting depending on the intent of the author. And examples of double standards have been shown here many times where the same behavior from men is demonized and celebrated when done by women. So when you say "control wife" what you really mean is that men are refusing to mindless slaves of their wives, that supposed to accept abuse with the smile and mindlessly agree with everything she says. Shove your double standards where sun doesn't shine.

OmoshiroiKudamono · 2024-07-03T13:16:30+00:00

"I can't control my wife" is just a guilt tactic for when men put REASONABLE boundaries up.

Examples include no "girls trip" to Miami, no clubbing with the single "friends," no sleepovers with the ex boyfriend, etc.

The man should acknowledge her for her and act accordingly. Even if it means walking away.

Other red pillers say "She is NOT yours. It's just your turn."

What men do with their red pill knowledge is up to them alone. There are no RP secret meetings in which "doctrines" are written.

Evening_Invite_922 · 2024-07-03T12:07:56+00:00

why is desiring sex bad

neverendingplush · 2024-07-03T11:34:47+00:00

I'm convinced no one has actually taken the time to read red pill doctrine. So these arguments are already in bad faith

Evening_Invite_922 · 2024-07-03T12:07:35+00:00

circumcision is a non issue

Crimson-Pilled · 2024-07-03T12:18:42+00:00

Control is a good thing. Women don't behave unless positively or negatively reinforced. Male authority is fair when women refuse to take responsibility.

FirmQuarter6623 · 2024-07-03T11:39:03+00:00

I don't think TRP cares about real male issues like circumcision or the mandatory draft.

TRP is about personal development and sexual strategy. It's not "we should change the world for the better". TRP is not a movement.

You probably talking about Men's rights or something.

Yeah, they are frustrated that they're treated like shit by society. Average Joe's wife can fuck a neighbor in front of him then take at least half of his shit, pension and make him pay child support and maybe alimony. CS money she spends like she wants, she may spend it on her new bf or nails, or whatever the f. At the same time she will teach kids to call her BF a ''dad", and shit talk a real dad. Let's not forget that kids can be from neirbor, paternity fraud isn't considered a crime. If she goes full war and claim rape/dv/child abuse, then her husband is fucked, he needs spent a fortune on lawyers in order to see his kids again.

TRP says that a man can control only himself and advise men not to marry.

OtPayOkerSmay · 2024-07-03T14:53:27+00:00

This post is just like the news media reporting on male loneliness and singledom. You've made some big sweeping claim yet made zero attempt to explain why you think that way, which makes it seem like you don't want to understand or critically analyze the situation - you even make reference to "digging deeper," but it's clear you didn't if you're going to put such little effort into a post lol

You've basically just said "red pill men are stupid and pathetic" and left it at that.

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OkProfessional9405 · 2024-07-03T14:56:59+00:00

I've never seen RedPill say anything like that. RedPill is all about understanding reality, accepting it, and learning how to best navigate that reality.

A blue pill approach would be to always try to make your wife happy as an ill fated attempt at having a happy content wife. It turns out this fails miserably. RedPill tells you to to do things (like work on yourself) that actually make your wife excited to be with you.

2024-07-03T18:36:33+00:00

Exactly! This is why I hate those RP podcasts, like Fresh n Fit, and Whatever podcast. I've been trying to get on them to give them a piece of my mind but I was denied because I dont fit the type of woman they hand pick to be on those shows.

They mostly want the promiscuous, and OF girls types because those pretty girls are the types they wish they could fuck but were never picked, so they invite them strictly to shame them n tell them why no man is ever going to want them.

These TRP communities are not actually about helping men, or having them understand the reality that: - women are human beings too - women can like who they like, even if it doesn't include you - Men need to be shown how to embrace their masculinity holistically, which includes respecting women

All these podcasts, and RP communities do is reaffirm men's disgust n hatred toward ladies

2024-07-03T13:05:30+00:00

"if you dig deeper, most of TRP criticisms about how unjust society is for men boil down to "I can't control my wife anymore"

Ok great, sounds like you've "dug deeper," so show us your work. You are making a statistical fact claim here. That being: MOST of "TRP CRITICISMS" boil down to I can't control my wife anymore.

So where's the data substantiating this? Who's cataloging every red pill "criticism" (whatever the fuck a red pill criticism is)? Who's charting that data and reaching the conclusion that you postulate?

Jesus fuck, this is the most moronic statement I've read in a while.

WolfInTheMiddle · 2024-07-03T15:59:40+00:00

I don’t think it’s about control, it’s about respect, if I’m paying the bills and being loyal to you the least you can do is appreciate me and not step over my boundaries. If that’s too much for you then you’re not the person for me.

tendrils87 · 2024-07-03T14:30:18+00:00

Preferences are entirely biologically driven through evolution, so it’s not fair to blame anything on either sex. Try as you may to be a non-conformist to your gender role and you are setting yourself up for failure.

Cunning_Linguists_ · 2024-07-03T13:05:20+00:00

None of these are criticisms of TRP, just blackpill/incels

Title	I think it's pathetic that if you dig deeper, most of TRP criticisms about how unjust society is for men boil down to "I can't control my wife anymore"
Author	Novel-Tip-7570
Upvotes	21
Comments	405
Date	July 3, 2024 10:37 AM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1dub6v7/i_think_its_pathetic_that_if_you_dig_deeper_most/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/i-think-its-pathetic-that-if-you-dig-deeper-most.1523116 https://theredarchive.com/post/1523116

Comments

"if you dig deeper, most of TRP criticisms about how unjust society is for men boil down to "I can't control my wife anymore"