Why aren't men hypergamous?

Purple_Cruncher_123 · 2023-06-03T06:13:54+00:00

If I had 100 mutually interested options to pursue, I would probably deploy some filters. If I only had like 5 mutually interested options to pursue, I would make the best of the options available, or forego and hope the options get more enticing. Most men are closer to the 5 than the 100, some even fewer so.

Hard to be hypergamous if the options aren't there.

WilliamWyattD · 2023-06-03T05:56:08+00:00

Women have a desire to look up to and admire their mate in a way that is not symmetrical with how men look at women. It has to do, in a subtle and hard to perfectly articulate way, with issues of dominance, leadership and submission. IMO it is related to female neuroticism, which is necessary for childraising. Women want to be able to NOT think about the world and trust their man to take care of the world for them while women focus on the baby. BUT this only works--a woman can only let go of her worries--if she trusts that he is doing as good a job without her control as he would with her input. That means he needs to be above her in some primal metrics of competence, dominance and ability. A woman cannot truly submit to being led by an inferior or even equal.

Beyond that core hypergamous urge, women are just sexually selective, like men are. Each is just optimizing mate choice by their criteria. Women are more sexually selective, but the basic dynamic is the same: get the best bargain you can.

However, men are not really concerned whether that mate is superior or inferior to them. Just the best they can get. In fact, as a reaction to hypergamy, men are somewhat hypogamous. They prefer to date down in these key qualities of competence, dominance, etc. But this is a secondary thing. A reaction to the primary driver of female hypergamy; a male instinct that if they cannot meet a woman's hypergamous needs, the relationship will suffer.

ivyleaguehoodrat · 2023-06-03T11:03:48+00:00

Men aren’t hypergamous because you’re defining characteristics they don’t want someone to be better in. Society has deemed these to be indicative of “higher social standing.”

And yet men want someone

More beautiful

More domestically gifted

More socially skilled

More flexible in personality

Etc

These traits are just not valued in the same way

kukkle1111 · 2023-06-03T05:56:16+00:00

Smarts and Education

Don’t give a shit.

Salary

Don’t give a shit.

Physically strength

Don’t give a shit.

Height

Don’t give a shit.

My only requirements are be vaguely attractive and don’t have AIDS.

Crafty_Letter_1719 · 2023-06-03T13:54:19+00:00

It’s true Men aren’t hypergamous in terms of the traits you have listed. It doesn’t mean however they aren’t hypergamous in general though. The more successful a man is the more likely he is going to “upgrade” his partner to a younger more physically attractive model once he has the opportunity. Men and Woman are just as “shallow” and “cynical” as each other. They are just “shallow” and “cynical” when it comes to different things.

AngeCruelle · 2023-06-03T10:03:40+00:00

Conventionally feminine traits are not valued to the same extent as masculine ones and therefore excelling at and surpassing your partner in them isn't seen as making you "better" than them.

My love definitely has me beat in terms of kindness, nurturing, patience, and compassion. I admire him deeply for it. None of that seems to come up in hypergamy discourse for whatever reason. The fact that I have the greater education and earning potential is supposed to make me "better" but I think that's bullshit. My value is of this world while his is beyond that.

SDinAsia · 2023-06-03T05:37:08+00:00

Simple answer is that from an evolutionary biological perspective, a man wins by impregnating as many women as possible to pass on his genes. Whereas, a woman requires the provision and protection of a man when she is vulnerable pregnant or with infants. Thus, it is natural that women do and should have higher standards for their partners than men.

Anxious_Adult123 · 2023-06-03T06:20:32+00:00

I think both male and female hypergamy exist and it is not as blown up as it's discussed! I have discussed this as a Comment to a different post!

I think hypergamy exist for both men and women in their own regard, but it's more extensively discussed with respect to women than men.

Men tend to marry younger and comparatively more good looking women.

Men prefer women with better personality than what they are!

And yes, women tent to prefer dudes that are taller than them. But in reality, a good proportion of women does care about height if the difference is extreme. Just as they are disgusted about dating a guy with is a foot smaller than them, most women, in my experience have reservations regarding dating/marrying someone with whom the height difference is stark.

And this so-called gap with respect to social status in female hypergamy is often blown out of proportion, citing less common examples of some rich athlete who married some broke saleswoman. Most of times, men marry down their socioeconomic strata but the gap is not that pronounced.

In my community (SE Asia) for eg: it is rare for a female doc to marry a male nurse. But it is equally rare for a male doc to marry a female nurse. Even when they marry in similar fashion, the female nurse is usually a govt. employee (meaning better pay and work life balance along with other perks). So in a way, the gap in not that pronounced. And the story is not different for other careers. Majority of middle class men don't prefer marrying someone broke bartender with tons of student loan debt.

Any yes, with this, I am not denying that extremely hypergamous women doesn't exist. There are broke average looking delusional women without any personality or intelligence running behind men with the so-called three 6s, but that's mainly a minority in the west and the affluent parts of the east. And the concept that guys would fuck any women is also true for casual flings and ONS. Men when it comes to marraige or serious LTRs are more or less hypergamous as women but it a different perspective.

RP tend to discuss female hypergamy more. And yes, male hypergamy is also not discussed often because in dating set up (as well as in a hedonic world ig) men have indeed lowered dating standards to get a chance with many women but often these are restricted to relationships started with a short term flings kinda motive!

CountC0ckula · 2023-06-03T05:32:19+00:00

Men can be hypergamous when it comes to physical attractiveness because they can make up for their lackthereof with money for instance, so a classical rich 5/10 dates a 9/10 supermodel. Everything else you listed men don't care much about, so it makes no sense for them to be hypergamous in those aspects as they'll be narrowing their dating pool without any benefits to compensate.

grendalor · 2023-06-03T14:31:03+00:00

Keep in mind that "hypergamy" does not mean "tendency to optimize".

Every human being tends to optimize (prefer best they can get). That is not what hypergamy means. Hypergamy means that the minimum acceptable is higher than one's own level or, at the very least in a pinch, equal to it.

Men are not actually hypergamous. They optimize, yes -- but everyone optimizes about everything, it is a human trait. Men will happily accept a woman who is "below" them in any number of areas, provided she is over a certain threshold (that is equal to "him - X", where "x" varies by the man, his preferences, and the characteristic in question and how important it is to him).

This is why, before class assortative mating became ironclad like it is now (see next paragraph below), lawyers would happily marry secretaries, doctors would marry nurses (etc), even though the women were lower in financial, social and educational status ... while women lawyers and doctors have never done that.

There is significant evidence that hypergamy is now largely mitigated when it comes to marriage (which was always the classic context in which the term was used in the sociological literature), because marriage nowadays largely takes place within class bands (education and social class mostly) which are generally fairly narrow the higher you go, and so the classic cross-class hypergamous marriages are becoming a thing of the past. Scott Alexander had a recent post about this at Astral Codex Ten.

The red pillers aren't actually talking about "hypergamy" when they use the term, because they generally aren't talking about women's tendency in the past to marry up in class and status terms. The red pill is talking about who women choose for casual sex, for the most part, because that is the core area that red pill developed around, and women's choices in casual sex, while they are most concentrated on the more attractive physical men, are not explained by hypergamy (the classic hypergamy vectors like income, class status and the like are mostly not salient for the choices here), but rather by supply and demand -- women being in very heavy demand for casual sex by men, meaning that they get their pick of the men making the demand, which means they pick the sexiest ones, given that women are only screening for sex in that specific context, and not for any other characteristics. The same kind of analysis may be made for "casual dating" (dating done just for fun, with men who are fun and not the kind of men you want to even think about marrying -- what a nightmare he'd make for a husband, lmao!! -- when women are younger) to some extent, but the impact isn't as strong. Neither is "hypergamous" in the proper meaning of the term, but the manosphere and red pill guys use the word to describe something that has to do with supply and demand.

Plazmatron44 · 2023-06-03T15:01:28+00:00

Men aren't hypergamous because they don't have to spend 9 months growing a child inside them and them spending the next 16 years raising that child. Women have to be choosy about who they mate with because the better the genes and the environment to raise a child in the more likely the child is to survive, this pretty common throughout the animal kingdom.

Most of the struggles we see today in terms of the dating scene being a shit show is due to our animal instincts conflicting with what society sees as the best way to raise a family.

Da_Famous_Anus · 2023-06-03T05:43:22+00:00

Men already have to be better than women in all of these areas in order to qualify for dating them in the first place.

badgersonice · 2023-06-03T06:15:47+00:00

Physical strength

Because there are almost zero women who will be stronger than the overwhelming majority of men. And it’s not close— in one study of grip strength, 90% of females produced less grip strength than 95% of males.

For almost all men, limiting their sexual interest only to women stronger than them would result in never finding a partner. Testosterone is a powerful steroid.

Height

Similarly here: the majority of men are taller than the overwhelming majority of women. For example, an average height woman is around 5’4” in the US (roughly 50th percentile); only around 4% of men are that height or shorter. Or looking at the approx. average male height, 5’9” (roughly 50th percentile again), only about 3-4% of women are that height or taller.

It’s, again, really really restrictive for a man to try to date someone shorter.

And this is also why red pill’s obsession with whining about female hypergamy, at least when they include height and strength, is just stupid. The male being bigger and stronger than the female is just basic biological sexual dimorphism in the human species— the male is larger than the female in almost all mammal species (hyenas are maybe the only exception I’m aware of), and certainly in all the great ape species.

So the red pill bilbber blabber about hypergamy is often more about ego validation for men— it’s a way of telling men that, whenever they get laid, it’s because a woman thought he was “better” than her or “above” her… even if they have to include basic biological dimorphism and declare that being male is “better” than being female.

The fact that they insist that a woman having sex with almost any biological male is “dating up” is also confirmation that they view masculinity and maleness as superior to femininity and femaleness.

So men are hypergamous if we include physical features the way red pill does and simply define some physical features as superior to others. Men seek women who have bigger tits and a larger hip to waist ratio than themselves… that would be hypergamy in men by red pills methodology if the red pill considered femininity to be a positive thing, rather than shameful and inferior.

Edit: I doubt I’d personally be considered fully blue pill since I do agree with red pill on a few things, but this answer is blue pill enough, so not posted under automod.

ethanbangs · 2023-06-03T09:39:51+00:00

I care about all of those except physical strength (mental) and so does any self respecting guy that has high standards.

There's a ton of women that are attractive and have their shit together. The supply is high. So that's not enough to impress me or even waste my time on a date with. I do not give a shit to waste 5 to 10 hours dating a girl for vanilla sex with an 8-10.

I only date up if they got more than me in at least most of those categories. So I'm a guy that's hypergamous.

My advice to guys here is be more judgemental. You owe that shit to yourself and the women that you want to date that want to date you. While you're wasting your time dating and banging broads you don't even like, you could be working on yourself and only dating high quality women.

Women can detect some unbelievable shit. And I get a feeling when u date and bang low quality broads, it changes you and they pick up on it.

Mr_Chad_Thunderpenis · 2023-06-03T06:15:23+00:00

Hypergamy in the traditional definition is the tendency to date across and up in socioeconomic status. By that definition, men are not hypergamous, since they date across and down. However, when a woman is hypergamous and dates significantly up in socioeconomic status, the man usually dates up in looks. So in essence, yes men are "hypergamous" in a way as well. It's pretty evident if you go outside. Most couples are of similar physical attractiveness or the woman is more attractive. You'll very rarely see a couple where the man is the more attractive one.

LilRedMoon__ · 2023-06-03T12:40:03+00:00

little to no standards.

KayRay1994 · 2023-06-03T12:41:51+00:00

in the past, women needed men for survival, especially when you consider on average women are smaller and physically weaker, then you need to factor in the fact that for quite some time a woman wasn’t really allowed to do much of anything without the support of a man - so naturally, women kinda needed to be hypergamous in the past for the sake of basic survival - men didn’t need to do that to survive. Now given, these behaviors have become so culturally engrained that they’ve more or less become the norm, but also as women have been getting more rights and the ability to be more independent, the concept of hypergamy is becoming less and less relevant. I do think the concept will become more or less extinct within the next 50-80 years barring some world-shattering event that would then require survivors to revert to needing strength and power first and foremost to survive

Soloandthewookiee · 2023-06-03T07:06:30+00:00

If so, why are men not hypergamous?

Because the red pill definition is intentionally distorted such that virtually all women will be classified as hypergamous. The red pill use of the word is meaningless, it's just used to prop up red pill ideology. A woman could be better in 9 out 10 arbitrary categories but they will still call her hypergamous because the man is better in the 10th category, whatever it might be.

FakeNewsFredo · 2023-06-03T05:32:57+00:00

I think that it's because men have to proposition women, and men have a strong(er) sex drive.

Men have to proposition women, and women normally make the decision as to whether she finds the guy acceptable.

Women are less likely to settle, but men will settle more often because they wish to satisfy their sex drive.

Men usually abdicate control of the process to the fairer sex.

Ohyarlysmiles · 2023-06-03T10:38:57+00:00

If the argument is that women are hypergamous in all domains, and in the instance of casual sex, at leaset hypergamous in physical attractiveness, the reason men aren't hypergamous is...

....men are hypergamous but are unable to enact their hypergamy.

Women can.

Windmill_flowers · 2023-06-03T09:53:32+00:00

Men don't have the option

wtknight · 2023-06-03T13:30:32+00:00

Evolutionarily, men want a measure of control in order to prevent paternity fraud, so it doesn't make sense for them to want to find better women who might cheat on them with better men. Ideally, they'd like to date and marry across rather than up or down, although even "across" is risky to certain men, which is why they might purposely try to date down.

Of course, men will have sex with women who are better than them. Unlike women, they'll have sex with any woman who doesn't repulse them. But your question is about dating rather than sex.

Spyro7x3 · 2023-06-03T07:38:18+00:00

Because we're polygamous. My brain and heart wants a simple life with a cartoonishly loyal partner but my body wants multi mammas. And y'all just about forced me into that direction too because they b running away.

2023-06-09T00:57:18+00:00

Most men are not hypergamous in any way.

And even those who are, are to a limited degree compared to women or the definition of the word.

Men are polygynous. Our basic instinct is to find a new woman all the time (not necessarily a better one, thus why so many men cheat with objectively ugly women).

The difference is. Most serious monogmaic men control their nature if we find it worthwhile. They will stay with a given woman and not pursue a new one if they find their woman worthwhile. Women do not.

WilliamWyattD · 2023-06-03T06:10:32+00:00

Men don't want who are better than them apart from looks maybe

MarBitt · 2023-06-03T06:20:25+00:00

Smarts and Education / Care and nurturing. Different type of education and prerequisites.Even the first schools for women were about how to be a good mother and housewife.
Salary / Work at home. Cooking, cleaning and generally being able to make a house a home. Different priorities in the division of duties.
Status / Purity combined with youth. This is also a form of social status. Man can be just as proud of a young woman of good reputation as a woman is of a successful man.
Physically strength / Physical appearance, beauty. Men are valued more for strength, women for beauty.
Height / Figure shape. Ratios of breast, hip and butt sizes.

just_a_place · 2023-06-03T07:39:13+00:00

Because hypergamy in men is a form of emasculation.

Hypergamy is the innate desire and instinct to marry up. NOT across or down, but UP. It means seeking to date or marry someone of higher status than one's own.

Men have an innate drive to achieve status in order to attract a mate, hypergamy goes against that instinct because dating up places men at a disadvantage and makes his own status tenuous at best; he would have no real power nor status. Hence, the emasculation part.

So, no. Men are not hypergamous. We are ambitious and driven to gain status and prestige. Neither of these are possible if men were hypergamous and it also has much to do with women's own instincts. Women are not attracted to sneaky, weaselish men who slip into their status through hypergamy. NOBODY respects men who marry into power, they are considered a universal joke of a man, emasculated, subdued, and socially neutered.

I figured all of this out when I used to date women of much higher status.

CptKillsteal · 2023-06-03T08:27:46+00:00

Because I am going for those things and I need a women who is:

Fertile
Motherly
Provide a higher standard of cleaning and cooking

To compliment me. I don't need more of what I have.

DeepHouseDJ007 · 2023-06-03T16:23:11+00:00

I’m a dude and I’m definitely hypergamous. I usually date women who smart, cultured, well traveled, speak multiple languages, and who are college educated. I don’t really care if they don’t have a lot of money, but those type of women do tend to come from wealthy backgrounds.

James_Cruse · 2023-06-03T10:58:14+00:00

This is genuinely such a difficult concept for women to understand:

Men (us) want a very small range of qualities in a woman - but those qualities we do want are VERY important to us: Beauty, youth, feminine, pleasant and co-operative.

Women want a broad amount of qualities in a man that are not only difficult to achieve/ become/aquire (for a man) but take alot of time. Luckily women only need a smaller amount of each of the vast list of qualities than men need of theirs for women.

What men want from women is mostly passive on women’s part - what women want from men is mostly active - which means far more difficulty in acheiving.

What men don’t care about in women:

Your job/career, your money/wealth, your social status, your degrees or education, your “life experience”, how many places or where you’ve travelled to and we certainly don’t care if you wear designer clothes. Most of that is at best neutral for a woman, at worst, it’s a serious negative.

I think it’s very difficult to accept for women that there isn’t much a woman can actively do to improve her value to men outside of improving her looks and being more pleasant - and there’s a finite limit on improvements to those aspects of yourself.

Whereas men have so many opportunities to improve themselves to improve their dating/mating life in so many measurable ways.

2023-06-03T08:11:32+00:00

Because sperm is cheap and pregnancy risk doesn't exist.

purplish_possum · 2023-06-03T08:43:44+00:00

We don't use the word the way anthropologists and sociologists use the word. We're not talking about social class. We're talking about always being open to an upgrade. -- even after vows.

As every marketer knows women are more easily enticed by even the possibility of an upgrade.

Ill-Menu5401 · 2023-06-03T09:11:21+00:00

That's just biology. Men are polygamous. Dunno what else to say

Chemical_Major_1403 · 2023-06-03T09:43:42+00:00

Because people give men in general the exact (with no fraction of addition ) rating in a point system , no exaggeration, no uplifting, no flattering, people frame men way earlier probably after kindergarten when teachers and fathers become harsher towards men's failures, you can't be hypergamous with people when you are punished for every bad trait you have while not being praised for the good one , being stupid deduct your point, while being romantic is the bare minimum, guess what it's even considered a female trait, people stopped the criticisms of women since average women are mostly in the presence of HVM men in the media like movies ,theatre .... we even have a troupe called the average girl who is chosen by every men while we encouraged the criticisms of men to get a final product that looks like a girl like Bella should be a match made in heaven for Edward without doing anything for him ( twilight), average men are paying for how much romantically they believed women and " crucified" men who harmed those women while just watched women treating men badly in general while some men are ever justifying it . You can't be hypergamous with women (with women is the key words) it's a woman thing, you would be crucified for being hypergamous with women from being called shallows, to he sees women as object( which I had enough from the trap, men aren't sexually attracted to objects) to misogynistic...

Duxshan · 2023-06-03T20:08:48+00:00

We are, men constantly leave older wives for younger women.

roger61962 · 2023-06-03T09:21:30+00:00

I am. My GF is 35y younger.

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medlabunicorn · 2023-06-03T07:30:30+00:00

They are. The categories for women are just different than the categories for men. We all try to get the ‘best’ partner we can.

Koipisces · 2023-06-03T08:53:19+00:00

I think that part of it also has to do with being realistic and believing to be unable to be hypergamous. If you think you do not stand a chance, you probably won’t try to go for someone “higher” than you. I think people usually go for what they think they can get, on the very subconscious level. I also think that is with women btw, the women that think they can date up, do. However women who think they can’t get a man as successful as themselves, are more open to date “down”. And then there is the factor that people just value different things over other things.

2023-06-03T10:05:54+00:00

I'm hypergamous in the sense that I like it when they're hotter than me and got a much better ass. Also smarter or higher income is fine too, don't care.

It would be near impossible to find a woman who is taller and stronger than me.

screechingfeminazi · 2023-06-03T11:58:28+00:00

Hypergamy originated as a social science term to talk about cultures with widespread marriage across socioeconomic barriers, virtually always well off men getting with much poorer women. In redpill circles it's become a kind of shorthand for two things:

a) anything women tend to care about more than men when selecting a partner, and

b) the idea that we will drop our current partners like a rotting fish the second a better deal comes along

It's a bit of a bait and switch, using a useful term that describes a real phenomenon to make awful assumptions about women sound more science-y.

Shitty disloyal people exist, and will always be willing to trade up along the dimensions they care about if the benefits outweigh the costs.

A woman who picked her partner entirely on wealth, and does not have any sense of love or loyalty, will ditch him for a wealthier guy if she can. We already have a term for that, she's a gold-digger.

A man who got with the hottest teenager he could land, and does not have any sense of love or loyalty, is going to trade her in for a younger and/or hotter model if he gets the chance. We don't call that hypergamy, but it's the same basic phenomenon.

Both cases are shitty extremes rather than representative samples of their sex.

Notsonewguy7 · 2023-06-03T12:20:12+00:00

Heterosexual men don't generally have the ability to be as selective.

I on the other hand as a bisexual am selective on women and because that's the case I find the majority of women unattractive in the same way that the majority of women find the majority of men unattractive.

All the things you've listed I care about I don't want to date a woman under a certain height I don't want to date a woman that doesn't belong to the same class that I grew up in I don't want to date a woman that doesn't have at least the same degree of Education that I have which means you finished college. I just have other things that you haven't listed here as well like level of interest in history and politics as well as religion.

I don't want to date anyone that I have to constantly inform about the law that just passed or talk to about the nature of politics like I would have to talk to a 16 year old or a 12 year old. I also don't want to date anyone that's super religious because I don't believe that religion has any real moral or social value for me or for the human race as a whole.

pagan6990 · 2023-06-03T12:50:28+00:00

Because men want good looks, nice personality, and good in bed. All the others aren’t as important. Though most men have a bottom line on smarts though.

My wife has an associates degree and I have a masters. But she’s got great tits. (LOL)

HydrazineHawk · 2023-06-03T12:53:43+00:00

It’s evolutionarily disadvantageous for men to be overly picky when it comes to women.

10,000 years ago 1 man reproduced for every 17 women that did. A man who spent his time too focused on anything that wasn’t an acceptable level of youth and fertility was a man who was an evolutionary dead end

Women meanwhile will almost always have some male interest so it’s in their interest to be hypergamous

Windmill_flowers · 2023-06-03T13:09:15+00:00

It's annoying and there are better and more interesting things to do in life.

Swordfromthecement · 2023-06-03T13:17:59+00:00

I think men display more hypergamous traits when they’re a cut above the rest of the population, even if it isn’t framed in that manner.

But I think most men are so fucking average that’s why you don’t see it as much. They’re taking whatever they can get.

Lift_and_Lurk · 2023-06-03T13:24:28+00:00

I mean: as a MC dude that married into a UMC family I think I could technically count as “hypergamous?”

2023-06-03T13:56:25+00:00

men by the majority won’t have a problem w dating a girl who he perceives to be less in stature to him financial standings he has no problems w dating a girl who he sees as beautiful but she still lives at home w her mom. But for us we don’t want tht type of guy we value a guy having his own things a car a home a basic provider ig so we want the best that we can get in the dating world

nemma88 · 2023-06-03T15:04:48+00:00

Because they're measurements of value added by men historically or traditionally. If you instead measure on value added by women then men are hypergamous.

Traditional roles were as because of environmental factors which in turn fuel physiological selection and evolution. Gendered roles were beneficial.

Men do however care far more about those things than they used to, as women care more about age and looks etc - as all hypergamy is declining as environmental constraints disappear. Less need for two strict roles and therefore no evolutionary advantage, selection shifts etc.

kkkan2020 · 2023-06-03T15:19:58+00:00

1.) smarts and education - just because you go to college doesn't mean you're smart. i think we've seen through that veil now. but from what i gather men don't mind gap in intelligence.

2.) salary - again if we believe the narrative that men make more money... why would they go after someone that makes more money than them. i guess it never came up in their minds.

3.) status - again from what we are told men are the ones with more status. who are they going to go after with more status than them?

4.) they already got more strength again who will they go after with more strength than them.

5.) they're already taller. who are they going to go after with more height.

so i guess if you're the apex predator... you're at the top of the food chain there's no one to monkey branch to. but im speaking of the group as a whole and not the individal.

HazyMemory7 · 2023-06-03T15:48:30+00:00

Because men don't carry a child for 9 months and then deliver it/go through labor. It's evolutionary. If you disagree with this, you are thinking about hypergamy with far too narrow a lens. Humans are not the only species that exhibit hypergamy.

DoinIt989 · 2023-06-03T16:08:17+00:00

We are, or at least I am, but I think of hypergamy more in terms of "family background" and "looks". I don't really care about a woman's salary or education necessarily, but rather what her family's like, if she's smart, and obviously is she's hot. I do also happen to like taller women, and I've dated a couple women in bands and I found that to be a turn-on as well.

_here_ok · 2023-06-03T16:45:46+00:00

Hypergamy is just following what society values. What ever makes a high value man or woman is completely dependent on what society wants.

If society deems women with bushy beards as valuable then a good amount of men are gonna go for them even if objectively those traits aren't beneficial in the grand scheme of things.

MelodicCrow2264 · 2023-06-03T20:48:36+00:00

Most men can’t get away with being hypergamous. To be quite frank the vast majority of men take what they can get, because if they pass on a woman there’s always some guy ready to simp for her. It’s why most men cling to the first woman that acknowledges their existence.

karmakiller3001 · 2023-06-03T21:12:09+00:00

This experiment has been done ad nauseum.

Line up women based on their "accomplishments" and let men choose partners based on their own preferences.

9 out of 10 men will choose the young, kind, sweet and beautiful poor girl as long as they are capable themselves. The 1 % of men who choose to "upgrade" are the lazy ones looking for an easy life, knowing full well they will cheat on her with the young, kind, sweet and beautiful poor girl eventually.

This speaks to the bottom 80. The top 20 do whatever they want based on their own interests. If it's a consolidation of power they want, they'll marry an equal. The rest just want the beautiful young cutie over there.

How people STILL talk about this as a question is beyond me.

Men just don't value the same things women value in men. Period.

Striped_Parsnip · 2023-06-03T21:22:21+00:00

'attractive' and 'kind' aren't on that list, which for me are a hundred times more important.

I mean, 'height', really? Do some men actually care about a woman's height? I've never met a man who who does

Summeronmymountain · 2023-06-03T21:50:24+00:00

All men try to get the most beautiful, young, fertile women possible. So yes, they are hypergamous.

HinduProphet · 2023-06-03T22:11:32+00:00

Men who have generational wealth are very hypergamous.

Men were hypergamous back in the Feudal Times.

When the most rewarding reproductive strategy is to have as many kids as possible then men lose their hypergamy.

Vronicasawyerredsded · 2023-06-03T23:12:40+00:00

Because women are responsible for discerning and furthering the species so they don’t want a scrub to procreate with who can’t enhance the nurturing of her offspring.

Some women are better and discerning than others…

Reptheft · 2023-06-03T23:29:17+00:00

If so, why are men not hypergamous?

Because women rarely ever matched or surpassed men in those fields, so it wouldn't make sense for men to prioritize them. Wealth, strength, and height are not associated with femininity, men instead value beauty, slimness, and curves.

daddysgotanew · 2023-06-04T02:50:34+00:00

Men and women both primarily care about looks. Women are the selectors, and most men do not get chosen. Not as a primary option anyway.

But as a man, I can do everything I need in life pretty much by myself. Why? Because I have to. When you don’t have a vagina, no one is coming to save you. Now let me go down your list.

I have pursued and continue to pursue my own education. Why? Because as a white straight male, I have to in order to advance in corporate America. I will have an MBA next year. In turn, I don’t care about a woman’s level of education. I don’t need it for anything.
My salary as of right now is 80K. I will get to six figures in the next couple of years. My money is my money, I don’t need anyone else’s and I’m not looking for handouts.
Status? Who gives a shit. I certainly don’t care about it. I’d prefer a woman with less status because it probably means she’s less promiscuous.
Physical strength. I’m already 200 pounds, and can bench press 230. There’s like 10 women on earth that are stronger than me. I also carry a gun most of the time. The thought of relying on a 120 pound, tik tok scrolling, situationally unaware woman to physically protect me is laughable.
Height. I’m 6’1”, 6’2” in boots. I can’t remember the last time I saw a woman as tall or taller than me. It’s certainly not a marker of attractiveness to me or most other men anyway.

Warm_Gur8832 · 2023-06-04T08:00:35+00:00

I actually think this is changing but very slowly because things that are as long term as opposite sex relationships take generations to really see any changes play out.

I additionally think that the notion of hypergamy in women is proving less and less true as women run laps around men in things like college degree attainment

People too often think that any adaptations in terms of gender and family will necessarily just happen.

In reality, it takes a long time for anything like that to actually change.

There are still women alive today that weren't taught to read, couldn't own property or have money of their own, etc.

The average lifespan is somewhere around 80 years.

Think of what life was like in 1943 compared with today.

JelloMany9374 · 2023-06-04T21:05:39+00:00

I don't get why you'd put height on that list. Being taller doesn't make a person better objectively. Being more fit, or more smart, or more wealthy, or more attractive, or more charismatic, are gender neutral goals.

Men often want to date women who are more physically atteactive than them. They like women who work hard, have interesting skills and hobbies, and are more fun and social than them. Men date up in many different ways all the time. How often do you hear the story about men who can barely take care of themselves without a woman? That is 100% an example of men being hypergamous.

purin233 · 2023-06-05T08:20:10+00:00

men are hypergamous, they prefer women with high class markers(femininty requires a comfortable life)

Scandi_Navy · 2023-06-07T14:57:55+00:00

It's because of the paternity problem. See women are guaranteed to be the biological parent, men are not. How do they try to get that guarantee? By making sure she likes him more, by being her best option.

Title	Why aren't men hypergamous?
Author	Windmill_flowers
Upvotes	39
Comments	316
Date	June 3, 2023 5:30 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/13z23fj/why_arent_men_hypergamous/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/why-arent-men-hypergamous.1221138 https://theredarchive.com/post/1221138

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