Not at all. My wife took our baby when she dyed her hair blue and fell in with a crowd of regs feminists that work with her at Starbucks. She moved back in with her mom, stopped working, and hit me up for child support. They set my CS at the highest earnings I've ever made in my life - a single month during my time owning a janitorial business - , pre tax, 40%. So, that one single month (I had got a contract to clean up a demolished building that paid $4000), I made $6000. Luckily, in Texas, there's a cap at a little over $1000 a month. Problem is, I make $600 every two weeks.
I didn't cheat. I didn't flake. I was supportive, loving, and if I might say so, a good husband. She cheated on me while pregnant with our child, took off while I was at work, no notice, and filed a restraining order which I later found out all lawyers MUST advise their clients of, because it means a MUCH higher rate of achieving custody. That shows up on my background check.
I'm genuinely going to kill myself soon, because I have about two months of savings left with which I can pay my CS, and after that, for each payment missed, it's a court date, with a 180 day jail sentence. Why did all of this happen? So she could find herself. Because she's a strong independent waman who don't need no man. <--- that sentence would have never, ever come out of me before she left.
That's not the half of it, either. I won't bore you with details, but just a few highlights are:
Legal Aid place said their free help for poor people was "more for women".
The state provides free attorneys for women but not men in custody and CS cases.
95% of all custody cases are awarded to women in my state.
This one's the worst of them all, to me: After all of this, I am, in most of society's eyes, a deadbeat dad.
No, this one's the worst: They arbitrated CS from out of state for my wife, so she didn't even have to show up to the court date, but they won't do that for custody. I still haven't even seen my daughter. I learned her name (went from a classic "Julia" to "Aaliahya"..) when the policewoman served me CS papers and treated me like I was trash.
My wife, unemployed, living with mom, gets nothing but help and positivity and support. I'm a monster.
So, that's the story of how I die, apparently.
EDIT: wwell fuck I'm sitting here crying for the first time in.. I don't know.. I can't begin to tell you guys all how much this means to me. I've been living with this huge knot in my chest for close to 2 years and haven't told a soul because I was sure they'd call me weak or not a man or whatever I thought. Just thank you. Thank you thank you thank you, all of you, so much. I promise this to each and every one of you guys: I will document this all. I will make a video detailing all of this, and I'll try to get in contact with some of the people which some of you guys have told me would be interested in the story. I'll plea my case in court before I commit to anything, and like one guy said, maybe jail isn't that bad.
That poor, poor man. This was a very expensive lesson he’ll learn from for the rest of his life. Marriage is a rigged game and the only winning move is to not participate.
If he does actually decide that it’s hopeless and commit suicide, he should self immolate on the courthouse steps like those Buddhist monks during the Vietnam war. And detail what led to his end in a letter to the local newspaper.
Self immolation is pretty fucking painful
Fun fact, a veteran did this outside the VA recently.
Did you hear about it?
I haven’t heard anything about this and I read the news constantly.
Kinda proves my point of how corporate media realizes that the entire world economy is based on the American economy and that the system is much more fragile than the public realizes. They’re terrified of these stories depicting symbolic acts by people with nothing left to lose.
A few years ago a man crashed an airplane into a regional IRS office in Texas. His suicide note made it clear that this was intentional. Coverage at the time was minimal and now most people are unaware that it ever happened.
EDIT: Makes you realize that extensive coverage of school shooters including delving into their backgrounds has a purpose. Law enforcement always says that the way to discourage them is to limit the posthumous publicity they receive but the media fixates on it because it moves us closer to eliminating gun rights.
Is it an attempt to reduce gun rights or to promote gun sales? I see both sides of the coin but I firmly believe if american has a nationally recognized religion then it is the religion of consumerism they'll tell us anything to make sure we keep spending .
Gun sales do go up in the wake of shootings, as you would expect. But the purpose of selective media coverage of tragedies is to steer the nation towards gun control.
Gun laws are usually enforced retroactively, so your newly-purchased AR-15 can be made illegal only months later. As long as the public can be brainwashed into accepting unconstitutional gun control laws, they will surrender their rights willingly, and that brainwashing is achieved piecemeal.
I started working in that office park shortly after that happened. What a weird thing.
If you really want to get your point across, self immolation seems like a pretty powerful way to do it.
People would think "Jesus, what is he protesting that he literally lit himself on fire?"
But he would't be able to answer.
Instead, I suggest taking a hammer to your own nut. Go in the middle of MSG or in this case the courthouse steps, pull out a nut, and pop it like a paintball. People will listen then.
His answer would be in the letter sent to the local press. A man lighting himself on fire is a powerful symbol of resistance to oppression. That’s what kickstarted the Arab Spring in Tunisia.
Every time an American does it the only coverage is a tiny blurb that never delves into the cause. The media conglomerates ensure minimal coverage because they’re terrified of the power of that symbolic act to inspire action in the masses.
Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. In the late 70s, early 80s, whenever tf, some dude lit himself over the Panama Canal Treaty, turning it back over to Panama. It was a one inch article. No pics.
I think that there was one in a Manosphere protest of treatment of men, where the immolatee said that there was a 'second set of books.'
NO public interest.
The Arab Spring thing was, IMHO, a Deep State action. So.......if I am right, don't go torching yourself unless John Brennan gives you the OK.
Why? so they could run this headline?
"Toxic Masculinity claims another male life as the patriarchy leaves another helpless Woman and Child alone without support because men are encouraged to repress their emotions"
Just for interest sake, but "immolation" doesn't imply setting oneself on fire. Immolation simply means ritual killing or sacrificing and it can be done by any means, not just burning. I am telling you this because I also always thought it meant being lit on fire and burning to death and only found it doesn't a short while ago.
Not saying he should do this but if he was gonna do it this would help the cause
Remember Thomas James Ball
His name was Tom Ball.
"He was angry at the state child protection bureaucracy and the courts after a ten-year battle over a child abuse charge that became, for him, a Kafkaesque struggle with cruel authority."
https://freekeene.com/2011/06/16/thomas-james-ball-self-immolated-in-protest-of-the-justice-system/
You can actually download his final statement from the website. As expected, it is clear, well written, and factual. Just a man pushed too far.
I would call it more a not-losing move.
Nobody wins in a society where matrimonial partnerships are impossible, and NO I do not mean the legal entity impersonating marriage as sponsored and promoted by the state.
We just need to legalise surrogacy.
Serious question, would he be able to leave the country and start over elsewhere? I truly hope he doesn't give up on himself because there can be a way for his life to turn around and I hope it does for him.
I mean.. he could just do the classic coke and hookers in Mexico and maybe he'll see life isn't that bad after all..
https://totalfratmove.com/guy-goes-to-mexico-to-kill-himself-spends-week-doing-coke-and-banging-hookers-decides-to-keep-living/
His only real choice. Leaving behind friends and family is a serious kick in the teeth, but it’s his only real option other than death.
I always tell seriously suicidal people to pick a small bag and leave it all behind, preferably to somewhere warm. Wherever you end up will feel like you died and were reborn.
Id rather put a bullet in my head than go to mexico to potentially have my head sawed off.
He don't spoil the fun gringo !
Child custody payments can go after unmarried guys as well.
You gotta stop feeling sorry for the chumps. They're normally the white knight clowns that will shoot you down before they get hit with something like this. And most will still remain that way till they get hit a few more times.
That's what I always believed as well... But idk, I'm 28 now and my thoughts are changing. Marriage has a sentimental value that can't be measured. My parents are happily married for 40 years now. I have friends that got married that I just don't see it any other way.
IMO those failed marriages happen because either they get married just to get married or they simply don't know how find a good partner.
I have been with my girl for 3 years. I wouldn't take 1 day back. She actually keeps asking me to get married to her but so far my answer has been no just because of my red pill beliefs. This might change because my perspective of the world is changing as well.
Your marriage ultimatum will hit you within 1 - 2 years time max.
Best to read OP's post over and over again until you inevitably realize what you will need to do.
That's fine. I'll reevaluate then. It's not the first girl to ask for marriage. Those girls are in my past now.
Your opinion is ill-informed, wrong, and stupid.
Please present to the community one meaningful, tangible benefit you get from marriage, apart from a meager tax break.
Why are you such a dick? I'm in agreement that marriage is useless. My belief is that if we love each other we would stay together regardless of a damn paper from the government. I was just saying that I might let that belief go because I don't see the harm in it from seeing people I personally know who are happy in their marriages. And I know those people on a very personal level that the wife and husband both share their troubles with me and in general they're quit happy. I don't care about the tax break. That doesn't save much anyway. Yeah I know bad shit happens to people because of marriage but it doesn't happen to everyone and if you love someone you should be making sacrifices and taking chances as much they are.
If you don't see the harm in it, then you're either illiterate, haven't been reading the sidebar, or you're an idiot. Regardless of which of those three it is, you have no business speaking on this issue. Your opinions and your feelings are stupid and wrong.
I'm a dick to protect newcomers from gullible idealists like you.
I've asked that the moderators ban you temporarily while you take some time to review the basic theory readings. Whether you see this as a favour or as an insult will say a lot about you and your readiness to be a part of this community.
I am a businessman, albeit with little experience. I have a proposition for you.
I think you and I should go into business together. This will offer us a few tax breaks, and also make our families happy as they will see us as "official" lifelong business partners. It will also make God happy. We can even post pictures on social media and announce our partnership to everyone we know, and gather great praise from others as a result.
Please be sure, however, to read the fine print!
The ironclad contract you will be signing states that, at any time, I maintain the right to terminate our partnership for any reason, without warning. If, during our years in business, I work very little and earn hardly anything, whereas you work tirelessly and accumulate very large amounts of wealth, you will guarantee me no less than 50% of all of your earnings, to be paid via lump sum.
On top of that, you will also agree to pay to me a monthly sum, the amount to be determined by a lawyer in court who will not have your best interests in mind.
Aforementioned monthly payment, by the way, will last for as long as I live.
Sound good? Fantastic! Dont worry - you and I will last for life. I can feel it. I just know.
We'll set the ceremony date for next year. Oh, and to become partners in the first place, we will need to spend at least $10,000 on the ceremony itself, and a few additional thousand for diamond and gold pins, to be worn on our clothing at all times for as long as we remain partners.
Sign the dotted line, please.
Damn, if someone had put it in those terms for me I never would have done it. Marriage ended in divorce in January and I'm fucked almost as bad as the OP.
If your life is ruined like this, can't you just flee from the US? It's not great but sure beats killing yourself.
If you want any hope of returning, taxes and child support are still due.
Unless you want to renounce citizenship completely, which I'm told is actually quite difficult.
Renouncing citizenship is easy. But it’s highly discouraged and risky because you could very well wind up stateless and with no legal protection. The hard part is becoming a citizen elsewhere.
Renounce citizenship, go to California, get child supported
probably cheaper to just be a permanent traveler
I'm thinking that in this situation there is no chance and hope to return ever again. Probably best to disappear of the earth completely and start a new life elsewhere. I'm sure it would be difficult but if you have no choice?
The thing about people who run from their problems, they tend to find the same problems wherever they run to.
I would probably try to get into a life of crime. You would already be a criminal in the eyes of society.
When you're barely above the poverty line, CS sucks, especially when the state wants 1/4 of what you make. Not sure about everyone else who has a middle class job, but when you're barely making it on $15 an hour, 25% of that is a lot
It's basically theft, taking 1/4th of barely anything. It's insane how these family courts can get away with it.
I don't know your situation and how willing you are but consider it. Flights aren't so expensive anymore these days and inside Europe there are a lot of opportunities to live on little money. Could always teach English somewhere or get lucky and use whatever it is you trained for. If you're desperate enough there are plenty of ways is all I'm saying.
Cash out and bail
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extradition_law_in_the_United_States#International_extradition
Just paddle board into the atlantic
The best thing I've seen for a divorce is making sure that your wife is chasing their "newfound love" and will happily take some money and run to get it over with ASAP.
Yes, dude was even paying for hotel rooms for them to fuck in.
I didn't get it at the time. I do now.
This is a fucking great post. I explain it to people using the analogy of friendship:
"So we've been mates for a few years now. I think it's time we signed this contract that says we pool all our assets and if we ever stop being mates we split everything 50/50. Also if one of us can't be bothered to work the other must support him for life. Now I know you are a hard worker, have a promising career and have saved a shit ton of money and I'm a useless layabout who couldn't be bothered to find a decent career and spends all his money on shit but we're friends right so that shouldn't matter. If you won't sign this contract I can't accept that you actually like me and I will go find another best friend."
Only a man with severe learning difficulties would agree to something like this. But swap "friends" for "lovers" and one man for a woman and all off a sudden 90% of men are chomping at the bit.
The stupidity of humanity knows no bounds.
Such is the power of the male sex drive.
That's why we teach men the tools they need to get laid on the regular, easily, and for free. So they can regain their mental faculties from time to time and live lives which are the product of rational calculation and not reactionary spasms in pursuit of sex.
now slap the word 'MARRIAGE' on top and millions of men sign up
Before I got married I knew this but for some reason I went along to get a long. Now I'm paying my fat ex wife $722 a month and all taxes due on that $722 which rounds out at $1000 a month. This is for a kid I barely see and have to fight to see. They tell me child support and custody are 2 separate issues when I complain. That's what the women who run domestic relations tell me. One time I over paid the bitch $3000 when I asked for credit I was litteraly laughed at. Hell of a deal there.
+1
Done
I read this in George Carlin's voice.
I had three opportunities to get married in my 20s. Three different LTRs putting the pressure on over the course of ten years.
I declined the opportunity each time which led to the end of the relationship each time.
Still the best three decisions I’ve ever made.
Don’t gamble your livelihood and potentially your actual life out of fear of being alone.
The alternative is worse.
Ever married male friend I have? “Miserable.” “Trapped. “ “Made a mistake.” “Staying for the kids.”
One life gentlemen. Don’t fucking waste it.
Marriage was a contract in past times. Now it's a fraudulent contract, with responsibilities and duties only on one of the 2 parties.
Only socio-cultural programming makes men still want/agree to take on it.
Socio-cultural programming is a sole reason for TRP's birth. Its good that more men are aware of the consequences of this blue-precept moms teach their boys.
I had a discussion with my mom and grandma about getting married. Told them to give me one good reason to do it, they said I would get a woman who would cook and clean for me. When I told them women aren't interested in doing those things anymore because they're all strong independent women now, they shut up real fast.
If she ain't like June Cleaver, Then you sure don't need her.
Most don't have enough options. The average guy is likely to feel a strong 'connection' with the first hoe that comes his way.
Yeah. Also, he isn't inclined to inform himself about such stuff before he's encountered serious problems and grief. Totally right — and I was the average guy too.
The entire marriage idea stems from a man's inability to realize the obvious. It is only his fear, nurtured by his woman to involve the state, which compels him to get married.
If he steps back, he'd see that the relationship was held up by absolutely nothing more than his performance in the smv arena. An arena which devalues the man who shackles himself like a fool to the whims of a woman.
Side story: I've been getting a high rate of flakes lately on tinder. Granted, these are smoke show 20 year olds. But, sitting back yesterday thinking about how a girl can go from spilling her guts, absolutely enthralled to meet and experience me, then two hours later, ghost before the meet up, shows how most women lack even the faintest scrap of integrity.
These are THE EXACT SAME WOMEN who will desperately try and lock you down with the marriage card, come 28 and the impending shadow of the wall. The thing is, nothing has changed, her integrity is still nil.
Integrity is a value which you either live by, or don't live by to whichever degree you choose, regardless of the situation or outcome. If she is a 9 at 20 years old or a 7 at 28 years old, although her value has fluctuated greatly, her integrity will remain unchanged. She will always be as unreliable as she was in her younger years.
Smv is the only thing that matters - marriage contracts are for fucking idiots who can't see past their own emotions.
I have a tag on blog, don't get married, filled with the horror stories and the abstract reasoning.
Readers ask, "Why are you repeating yourself so much? We get it."
I reply, "I will stop when guys stop agreeing to marry."
It's always funny to me (funny-sad, not funny-haha) when guys get overly upset or hung up on an LTR that doesn't work out. Like, when you're just dating, you're just hanging out, having fun, and hooking up. It should be easy, right? Like, you're just going out for drinks, maybe taking a vacation, having sex, and doing easy, fun shit.
But then it goes sideways. She starts acting bitchy. Or becomes distant and is losing interest. Whatever... And so the relationship ends.
But why do some dudes get so hung up on it? What's the alternative? You going to get married, buy a house, have kids, etc? That stuff is the hard stuff. Life isn't going to get better and more fun or easier when you do those things. And if it isn't good enough now, there's no way it's going to be better when you're doing all the hard stuff, and it's not just vacations and drinks and sex... It's crying children, mortgage payments, no vacations, and a dead bedroom... Then they leave and take half your stuff (or more), and find a new sucker to fuck them until they get bored, and they try to take half of their stuff... Rinse and repeat.
It's that old saying right :
Men marry hoping to salvage / perfectly preserve that early honeymoon phase and the woman his wife is at the beginning of the relationship .
They don't get that THAT period is the golden period , very very very few relationships get better from that point so when shit starts going south don't desperately grasp to keep it , allow yourself to go find someone new and create those feelings there.
And if your marriage is not going well... Just have another kid! /s
I have a female coworker that is in her mid-30s. She and her husband divorced a few years ago, but got back together. Then they had another kid about a year and a half ago (so now they have 4 children, one of them has autism).
And now? She wants to separate from him. They got together when they were in their early 20s... And even got back together. He doesn't want to lose her or the kids, and they even bought a house together. But... She needs to "find herself" and claims she "never has felt those feelings she wants to feel." The fucking hell? This woman is going to screw over her children's well-being just to chase some feelings?
I don't think she understands she's playing a sucker's game. No self-respecting man is going to want to date/marry an average looking woman in her mid 30s with 4 kids who left her husband to "find herself." The high-value male she is imagining in her head is too busy banging women 10-15 years younger than her with no baggage or children.
I promise all of them watch romantic movies, read romance novels , and listen to love songs, and think that the goal is to achieve something that the song perfectly describes 1000% of the time .
It's like teenage girl imaginations on overdrive no matter how old they get. She's going to divorce him , hop on Tinder for a while, If she's halfway attractive possibly meet a Chad who fucks her for a few months, and then when he dumps her she'll be right back on hubbys doorstep .
I can accept that women are shitty but these men who refuse to grab their balls and let these bitches die alone infuriate me . She's fucked you over and abandoned your relationship twice and yet these dudes just wait in the wings for the women to return .
It bothers the shit out of me.
Yep. I dated a single mother once and I'll never do it again. It never got to the point where she wanted me to meet the kid, but there were just so many red flags that it was a bad idea to get into a LTR with her.
Women show their bitchy attitude months into any relationship. Not sure how one could stay poker faced in 'fun gf mode' for months or years just to snag a husband. With my last gf, after the first fight, i was like FUCK THIS BEING PERMANENT and I strategized a way out from there.
I just think it's like withdrawal from stimulates. Sudden lack of dopamine and serotonin. I think that's a huge factor in why people get so hung up and upset when a LTR ends before the difficult stuff like buying a house or having children begins.
I was miserable, trapped, and staying with a mistake for the kids when I found TRP.
Im still married but things are very fucking different. I now choose to stay as I like living in my house and with my kids. but I dont need it and can burn it down and be just fine
That attitude has her clinging like a barnacle and things are fine.
I dont recommend marriage but its not inevitable that if you already sat in the game and drew these shitty cards that you will lose.
Completely agree. It's a long trip to get to that point. Took me 3 years to get there. Just my curiosity, how long for you?
Not married here, but interestingly, it also took me 3 years post-unplugging to finally get to the point where I felt like I don't need LTR/marriage at all. Wonder if that would be a typical time to remove a deeply-ingrained belief.
Seems that 3 years is common.
will concur, 3 years for that plug to be nowhere near the receptacle
From unplugging to true indifference about the same. 3 years or so. I remember calmly suggesting a separation and it wasn't during an argument nor waw I looking to gain an upperhanf with any ultimatums, I just wasnt pleased with the effort I saw in her looking to be an agreeable partner. She must have all along sensed I wasnt fully at peace with being away from kids and on own. It wasnt a dread of other women, it was a dread of being abandoned. Really primal fear I saw in her eyes and she became stepford wife
Similar here. In the course of a conversation, she said (and I think she meant to threaten) why don't we just divorce. I calmly and thoughtfully said, maybe you are right. The difference was I not only meant it, I was at peace with it. Over the next few days after that, there was a complete internal release, a strange joy, as I had let go of my attachment to the marriage. The anger and rage emotions that had been so much a part of my life, drifted away. Once I let go, she latched on. Like you said, it isn't dread, it's not wanting to be left behind. She now says things like, "whatever you want, I'm here to make you happy, etc..", and she means it.
Maybe dread got me there. But like you said, it was not dread.
If a girl doesn't stay with you because you wont marry her she didn't really like you IMHO.
This is a typical bluepill comment, ala "just be confident".
Let's try it redpill-style:
Girls have an innate anxiety about long-term providing given that their SMV is going down rapidly past their 20s. Even if they don't believe this because they bought into the "sexy-at-all-age" blue-pill lie, they still have this evolution-built little voice in the back of their mind that say, louder and louder with age, "Lock in the commitment of the highest SMV man you can, ASAP!". This is inherent to their sexual strategy. If you're in a relationship with her, this little nagging voice means that she will feel the need to ensure your long-term commitment, aka to get you to marry her.
Now we know that girls will categorize you either as an alpha lover or a beta provider. If you're a beta to her, your resources and attention are your entire value. If you make it clear you prefer to reserve the right to take those resources away from her (aka not marry), then she will swing branch as fast as possible to a more cooperative branch. If you're an alpha to her, she will insist even more to ensure your commitment. She will be extremely frustrated if you refuse to marry, but she will stay because you're the best she has... and keep hoping she can eventually convince you... until the day she hits the wall and she will leave you in hurry to marry a dependable beta provider (and still fuck you on the side).
In any case, it's not about whether she "likes" you or not, it's whether or not she wants to get married to secure a male's providing for after she's lost her SMV. Some don't want it or need it. But if this is what she wants, there's about nothing you can do to prevent her from leaving you eventually. Now if you want to stay with the same girl forever without marrying her, here's a trick: just find one that is already married to a beta shlub and be her affair partner, or official cuckolder.
This is all fine. Only these days there are no consequences for anything women do, so I think it's equal parts hypergamy and equal parts arrogance.
While the evolutionary biology holds good, there's the question of just how spoiled people can get as well.
Way to go and make things more complicated than they need to be. The point is that the woman doesn't like you -- ever! She likes the way you make her feel, and likes the things you can provide for her. So if she won't stay with you because you won't marry her, then she definitely doesn't really like you.
Dumbing down concepts to make them understandable by a wider public is automatically denaturing the concepts. Saying that the original concept is complicated doesn't mean it's unnecessarily complicated. It only means that you are incapable or unwilling to do the intellectual effort to understand something and thus demand something simpler, despite the risks of misconstruing the original concept.
Women's sexual strategy as defined in TRP as "hypergamy" and explained as the dual "Alpha fucks, Beta bucks" might sound too complicated for you but it is the best model out there to explain women's behavior. For any behavior by women in your life, your first line of understanding should be "does she see me as alpha or beta?". Or in other words "Is she sexually attracted to me, or am I just a tool to provide her with something?". If it's too complicated for you and you prefer to use the "she likes me / she doesn't like me" model, then by all means go for it. But don't be surprised when the day comes that she leaves you even though she "likes" you.
If you have an objection to my claim, then feel free to make one. The fact that you needlessly complicate the theories shows that you haven't understood it at a foundational level. Ever heard of the "if you can't explain it to a 5-year old, you don't understand it" concept?
I summarized your drivel by saying:
So considering that, SHE DOESN'T LIKE YOU. Want to try and turn that into a college thesis? Go ahead. All you're doing is circle-jerking by making readers think they're smart because they understand big words.
Interesting. When it came up, I told my ltr, I will never marry. She did not bail, yet. Also she isnt nagging me about it. Sooner or later I will see how it plays out.
How long have you been together? How old is she? How financially independent is she?
From my own experience (multiple LTRs that end when she wants marriage) this description makes perfect sense. Started to see a slight variation in this pattern develop with the later and most recent LTRs: Women wanting children even more than provisioning. They are willing to keep working or rely on their parents, which means the man they settle for can give them children without real financial or material support. These women still insist on marriage but that might only be a formality, a social requirement. They want to appear proper to friends and family. Divorce is no problem once the number of children they wanted are born and healthy.
I'm baffled that they're worried what people will think if they have children without a marriage license. Seems like society is okay with this now, but maybe it depends on specific families or social groups. They are not worried about what people will think when their (temporary) husband doesn't provide for them and their children. In this scenario the husband is basically a sperm donor. Once he has done that job he is disposable.
No. There’s an art to being concise, and writing a whole paragraph to exaggerate what is said by his one sentence is nonsense.
You didn't say anything different from what he said. If she doesn't stay with you...she didn't really like you. The only exception is what you said about leaving for a beta but still fucking you, but that's not really leaving is it.
I get where you're coming from but marriage (lifetime security and commitment) is their end game. They might like you but not as much as they like that and if they have to throw you under the bus to get it they will. Think of commitment for women as like sex to a man. Very important and biologically driven.
What is ironic when considering that 90% of divorces are asked by women... BTW, all girlfriends I had wanted to end the relationship. I was the one wanting “commitment for life”.
Yup same, or they would do shit like start fights with me for no reason or something which would force me to end the relationship so they would not look like the bad guy that ended the relationship.
I kinda agree with you.. if she leaves because you won’t marry, that’s a good sign of what her intentions for you actually were. We all know when a woman is really in love she will do almost anything including going along with a man not willing to commit to marriage. If she leaves you, she didn’t really love you that much.
Who said they left me? a man can leave a relationship too if he gets tired of listening to hints and pressure for rings and babies
Yep.
Once you get the ultimatum or the "I just feel like I'm wasting my time" or "where is this going?" speech, the relationship enters the life-support stage.
That's what fucks with me. I'm 33 and I sort of want to settle down, but I know it's smarter not to. I know that AWALT which isn't a bad thing, but means that given the moment, they could decide to walk away at any point. So I'm glad I haven't gotten married. I'm actually the only person at my job out of 12 people that isn't married or engaged, and everyone seems to be mostly jealous about the time. They always talk about how I can do anything I want with my time. A couple have mentioned that new pussy would be nice, but most of them are just like "Fuck, the fact that you can go do whatever you want, or nothing at all, on your own time, without having to be responsible for any kids or be intertwined with anyone sounds incredible!"
I have 2 cousins that got married in their 20's. Same age as me. One is divorced and one is separated.
You can get married by the church, just don’t go to the courthouse.
I couldn't agree more! Affirm yourself and inspire millions after your death. Women are weak creatures who only seek to tear men down.
This is one of the best comments on Reddit
Look I’m in my mid forties. Married the perfect woman. Luckiest guy I know. And I still wouldn’t ever get married again. There. From the guy who has a fantastic marriage. It’s just not necessary.
As someone who is very interested in the challenge of marriage and building a large family, I would love to hear more of your thoughts on this.
Think about whether you actually need to marry her. How does marriage improve your life?
If you definitely want to marry her although the system is heavily flawed against you, make a good prenup. Let her get a lawyer different from yours. Let a lawyer check and accept the prenup again ~2 years after marriage.
Apart from that, find yourself a great woman. If you see serious red flags, move away or at least don't commit any further. There are probably hordes of Eastern European and Asian women that would literally do everything for you in order to be able to raise a family while living a life 99% of their country could only dream of.
Prenups are no guarantee and are often tossed out in court. One thing that does work and will protect you and your assets is an irrevocable trust. Get one set up well beforehand, and put everything you want to keep in it.
Lol he just fucking said, don't do it.
If you're gonna shoot your own foot, post it on YouTube so we can laugh.
I'm the same as feros321. Happily married, life if actually pretty good. But fuck no if i'm ever going to get married, or even encourage my two sons to get married. Most likely there is zero reason for you to actually marry. I mean zero... want kids? Go adopt, go find a women who also wants kids and is willing to co parent, instead of marry and share living spaces. Otherwise i can't think of a single reason to have a women that close within your life. I bust my ass(so does my wife), and what do we really have to show for it.... no time for each other because we have two kids and no time together. Basically, we're co parenting and co habitating for the last 5 years since having children. This is all based on having children.... if you don't want to have children, WHY WOULD YOU GET MARRIED??? there is literally NO reason, i mean NO logic reason for you to wed. You gain NOTHING by marrying. Absolutely NOTHING! If you have any ideas that you have that you actually gain from marriage i would love to hear them.
My block of text is not cohesive at all.... i know this, and i don't care.
I have to disagree here. I'm not sure if it's cool to have my own kids grow up up with basically two sets of parents. The mom that is co parenting will have other guys in her house who is basically another dad.
The same can be said for you assuming you're going to be banging other women that's not your baby mother.
Here are mine: http://archive.is/yxzC1
Hey man I’d love to hear how you managed to snag somewhat of a unicorn.
Im in my 20s and for some reason my brain is hardwired to be a family man and have babyfever for a daughter.
Growing up Christian and growing up with stable parents that resolves their occasional quarrels like actual adults made me believe and strive for a similar marriage when I hit 30.
Im curious on how men like you and my father manage to snag loyal ones. Really am.
The times are wrong. You grew up in the wrong era. That's not your fault, but it's still your problem.
That's The Red Pill, right there.
You can't have a family and kids. Accept it and thrive, or delude yourself and suffer. Those are your options.
So true.
I'm a 26 year old, and I can see through bullshit faux confidence in my age mates and tell who is trending upward and trending downward. And I'm also at the age where people I grew up with are starting to get married.
Since I work with mainly men who are 15-20 years my senior on average (engineering), many are married with kids. Out of all of them, I think 2-3 are happily married. The others are pretty sloven alcoholics. ALL obese, or morbidly obese. They hate their job, their wives, and their lives in general. They look for any reprieve they can find from their daily lifecycle. They are truly beasts of burden. They look like hell.
The 26 year olds in marriages, from what I see, experience pretty rapid weight gain. Makes sense, no that they are settled and don't need to keep up appearances for their loved ones. They look, health wise, to be trending downward. I can see the formation of unhappy 40 year olds down the road.
Lol, I can see the posts on dead bedrooms already.
The single dudes in their late 30s have a few screws loose, but they are happy. They definitely see life as still a half full glass and enjoy traveling. Some are in shape, some aren't. Most are slaying. Most have savings. They mention they can be lonely at times. And that's understandable when all your friends or coworkers are busy maintaining those awful marriages their in (in general).
Life is suffering. But you can to decide the suffering.
It's no joke out here. And HSP himself said it best.
Beasts of Burdens- that's all men are to society. That is what the government wants and that is what a women will take- why not when men go out of their way to provide this service.
To the men out there, As Nancy Reagan said, Say No to Marriage!
If you're lifting solely for women you're doing it for the wrong reasons. I'm 26 and I see myself still lifting 50 years from now. Its typical that men get into some hobby in order to impress women and then find out the hobby itself is better and more meaningful than any woman. Strive for greatness, not an excuse to give up. Shameless plug for Jordan Peterson's new book, it changed my life.
This post is so relatable as a man who recently hit 30. I can see the signs from my peers who are getting married, gaining weight you can foresee the inevitable effects health-wise and happiness-wise on the decline. It almost feels like they have this need to keep up with the joneses which puts their own needs in the backseat.
Sad!
This is spot on. I've seen great physiques turn to schlub overnight at the hand of marriage.
Bummer you're shaming them. Seems to me they've got it figured out.
What does the community still not get about this? There is no family anymore. We were lied to. Wake up and realize that you don't get to have a family anymore. Go out into the world in live. Do not take all this information and ignore the obvious truth. I don't care if you find your unicorn. It still won't work. You can be the most alpha douchebag in town. Your unicorn will divorce you, and run your life into the ground. How many more field reports do people need to see before they realize there is no marriage and no family anymore. Time to wake up and deal with the cold reality.
Yes yes, wake up and allow foreigners to out-bread you while you sink into biological irrelevance because making families is so much harder now. Defeatist mentality, so attractive. White genocide? White suicide.
Shit dude, i also have these things moving around my head.
God (not allah buddah or krishna) but true followers of Jesus are allowed reconciliation and a power higher than themselves to be held accountable to. This mess wouldnt fly. This man wouldnt kill himself because God can clean up the biggest messes know to man spoken from a former selfish POS drug addicted family destroyer.. Think about it Who in the politcal scene are fighting for families, unborn babies, and FAIR taxation (if it can ever be fair) and are the only ones who would dare fight for people like this guy, actively fight against the liberal indoctrination in our colleges and schools men and women, are moving towards homeschooling and the right to do so, and is public enemy #1 by the rest of the world? Christians (real Christians with conviction and a relationship with Jesus) Not to say we dont tragicly fall short but things would be alot different if everyone did think they were God and women didnt try to find themselves in another womans vagina. (Dont know why thats their first move)
My almost 40 year old neighbor divorced her husband to pursue her lesbian lover.. she had children.
But we laugh at the people saying REPENT... its only downhill from here. Hes made Himself known through creation if we would just get out this rat race/pussy chasing/adult pacifying nonsense...
Knock, He will answer, Ask, He will answer. Hes waiting on you, and it all starts with Jesus
This answer has nothing to do with the psychology of attraction. Nothing. You are only Christian by virtue of time and location of your birth. 5 thousand years ago you would’ve been worshipping Zeus or some shit. Religions change. Laws of attraction do not.
Try explaining to the plugged in bp, that there is no upside to marriage. It is his idiotic fantasy you're threatening with your reason and he can't handle that. It's his life line.
Your comment resonates with me much more than anything else I have ever read here about marriage, probably because it’s so short and simple...
Get back to me in your 70s.
Im not saying I'd get married, but its a long game man.
Do you mind expanding on why you feel marriage is unnecessary?
Modern society in all its facets has ruined the possibility of having a healthy relationship.
Incoming Brave New World, I suppose.
If you read that book you need to read The Wanting Seed by Anthony Burgess.
The Forever War is also a good read for this genre
It's kind of a perverse mixture of BNW and 1984. from 1984 we get the surveillance thing, rewriting of history (to some extent) and the party (eg. feminism).
Wouldn't feminism be the equivalent to that girl group in 1984 as opposed to the Party? The Party in my opinion is political correctness.
Fair point. Mostly I meant if you go against the current dialog, you will most likely loose your job, friends and more. You can't really voice you real thoughts and opinions anymore. There is almost always that one white-knight around listening in.
The biggest reason women got married before was for security for herself and her children. Now, they can get the security without having to stick around with their beta husbands. Their lack of foresight coupled with the newfound feminine entitlement leads them to believe they can dick around and someone else is going to reward them with another marriage later on.
Well, I mean they probably CAN find another chump. At least for now. Men are slowly starting to wise up, but bluepill chumps are still the majority.
I think this is the rubicon, if something like this should wver happen to you:
This is when you tell CS, or the judge, "No. I refuse. I will not do that. I will never agree to that amount. Either set a reasonable amount now, or take me to jail."
Jail is not as bad as poverty in slavery.
Fuck that. Just leave the country. I mean this dude is contemplating suicide, just fucking peace out. Go to Canada, go to a Europe, go to some country where that shit don't fly.
Too late for him, unless he already has a passport. He can never get one now.
Pro Life Tip: Always hold a valid passport from age 18 onwards.
I hear the tunnels under US/Mexico border are cheaper on the way out.
**ANOTHER PRO LIFE TIP: CHILD SUPPORT WILL TAKE YOUR PASSPORT IF YOU DONT PAY, SKIP THE COUNTRY BEFORE THEY DO
Wouldn’t the real tip be: pay the child support while you slowly move all your assets to foreign countries then secretly apply for residency/citizenship, and when approved, dip out forever?
That seems like the best option. Pay the CS while you make sure the govt cant get another penny from your assets when you leave.
I've had one since I was in my young 20's! I'm in my 40's now.. still valid.. blank as fuck, but valid.
Lol i got one recently at age 25 for "just in case" and hopefully it will be blank in my forties too.
Although as an eastern european the emergency i had in mind had much more to do with russia repeating their soviet era than my personal problems.
So basically, if you already have your passport, and if they wouldn't issue you a new one because of something in court, you can still leave... because they don't put you on a "no fly" list?
Wat? He is paying his CS regularly. Why wouldn't he get a passport? Horseshit.
unfortunately this will not really work foolproof as the U.S. has considerable influence. though it may not be likely, I believe it is within the realm of legal possibility to have you seized in another country even China, Russia, Viet Nam, etc, depeending on the severity of what is going on with you in the U.S.
Only for criminal stuff. CS is a grey area.
Canada and Western Europe will extradite you back to the US. Go to Eastern Europe like Ukraine or Russia (easier to blend in). Or go to Thailand.
All of those countries would also probably extradite a foreign fugitive of no political importance.
I wonder if they would put in that much effort for some child support.
If it got into the media, then yes, because otherwise the "long arm of the law" looks a lot shorter. Otherwise, yeah, they might not bother.
At this time, Russia wouldn't extradite out of spite to the US/UK...they expelled most of the Russian diplomats and Russia is pissed so even a minor issue willl be made big by the Russians.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extradition_law_in_the_United_States#International_extradition
So i wasnt mistaken about Russia Good to know.
It’s worse there... did you see the post about Sweden’s sex laws the other day?
Thankfully Sweden is not representative for all of Europe
Yeah I was just using it as an example because I saw it in a post the other day.
Did you see the one where convicted murderers in Norway serve their sentence on a vacation style ranches and live out nicer lifestyles with more amenities than earned by most Americans?
American's really do go overboard with the self-praise and American-exceptionalism of capitalism. You work yourself to death and get pennies thrown at you while men walk among you with trillions of dollars. And when asked of the reason for the gradient all you can do is shout its praises. Europe just has a more socialistic view where just a couple of the trillions of dollars from the rich get re-invested back into you dirt-poor people living on pennies per day.
How would you like to be immediately upgraded financially to have enough money to buy 15 houses with a governmental stroke of the pen? This is possible! Poor people defending capitalism is almost embarrassing, it's like a starving person in a banquet of food who loudly defends the gluttons who gorge around them.
In Europe you don't pay for healthcare, you don't pay for college, you get out of college and you start earning money. It's like Americans think America is the only place in the world where these things happen. It's why they say you should travel the world sometimes. Europe, Japan, Russia, China. You'll be surprised to come home and feel bad that you have to live in squalor while the people you visited enjoy a much wealthier lifestyle while doing much less work.
It's stockholm syndrome. You've come to love your owner so much, you'll bite the hand of people trying to expose you to life outside your cage. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2013/feb/25/norwegian-prison-inmates-treated-like-people NO! I refuse to acknowledge that I live like a small caged animal in the wealthiest nation in the world! I like it here! I deserve this!
As a europian, this is just plain bullshit. No healthcare? We do, just less. Same for college. And getting money with the stroke of a pen? Yea we do, but only enough to barely pay the bills.
To pay for this shit, our tez rate starts at 32% and ends it 51%. More then half your fucking paycheck, but that's not enough. We have to pay money for having shit. Got 20k or more? Pay for it. Bought your own house? Pay for it.
Our socialistic ways never give room for 15 house. It's created to keep us peasants poor. Just rich enough to own a tv and computer to keep us content, but not much more.
Socialism doesn't ever work. The bills keep getting higher, while paychecks are left in the dust. Not working grants you a 1000 euro income and working most jobs gives you 200-300 euro more for 160 hours a week. It punishes you for working, and thus unemployment raises.
Europe will fall through it's socialistic ways.
Know a pathetic 8 story complex in Berlin, where virtually all of the people living there dont work, dont pay taxes, get money from the government, run buisness with out paying tax, drugs, many there illegal. Its not a slum, its just pathetic and people get taking advantage in every way every day. Not knocking Berlin, Germany or Europe. Amazing Places and People, the ones that dont take advantage
Certainly not in my country. Not working barely grants you any money here. You are european and you probably know how vastly different the countries are here, yet you talk about europe like it is one single entity.
No, you pay for someone else's healthcare and college. The welfare state has created a permanent underclass who live free of charge largely courtesy of a certain demographic, which the media simultaneously portrays as the worst ever to exist.
Have fun paying more taxes and having the government give you everything.
To supplement /u/0newinged:
In Germany a deadend job will pay 1800€ before taxes. You pay roughly 200€ in actual tax, which admittedly is not much, but you'll pay around 400€ in social security contributions.
That will leave you with 1200€.
Rent, Electricity, Internet, Insurance, Phone? Left with 600€.
Food? Chicken is 6€/kg. 400€ Left.
Save some money incase your washer dies? 200€ left.
Have fun going to bars where a longdrink costs 8-10€.
Let's do this again.
1800€ is an hourly of 10€. That is really fucking low. Even waiting tables will bring you more than than. But OK.
If you are Steuerklasse I, you'll be left with ~520€ of tax, social security & health care. So that is 1280,-€
I live in the city centre of Cologne, one of the most expensive places to live here in Germany and I still managed to find an - admittedly very small - appartment for 325,-€ altogether. For the sake of the argument lets assume you pay 400,-€. That's 880,-€ then
I pay ~40€. That's 840€.
25mbit at NetCologne cost 29,90€. That's 810€
What insurance? Haftpflichtversicherung? I don't bet against me & I also never needed one on my 41 years of living. What for even? If you absolutely have to get one, it's about 40€ per year. I think we can leave that out, no?
I only use pre-paid. Everything else is essentially a credit you are taking from the phone company. I pay 14,99€ per month for Internet Flat and maybe phone for another 5,-€, probably less. That's 770,-€ then.
No. Chicken is more like 4€. 200,-€ ist pretty realistic though, if you don#t plan on feeding of thrash. So 570,-€
Nah. Fuck the washer. You won't have place for that in your small appartment anyways. Go to a laundromat. We'll deduct 30,-€/month for that. That is 540,-€ then.
For ~45€/month you can register at a university here in Cologne, which will give you the Semesterticket. This means free use of public transit in all of Northrhine-Westfalia which is pretty well developed over here. I'll deduct this as well. That is 395,-€ then.
Gym is about 20€. That's 375,-€ then.
So you are left with 375,-€ for your amusement or for saving or whatever. That's not too bad in my opinion.
As a sidenote, going out is retarded on its own, but going out and paying 10€ for somebody to pour together some hipster gin and tonic, is missing chromosome level retarded.
Agree. America is pretty unique in their thinking and implementation of capitalism. The job market and jobs mostly are brutal, few holidays, many hours barley raises. Well raises here are also an issue but at least you get do slack-off, work your 40 hrs/week and not a minute more and as soon as I leave my office, good look reaching me and trying to bother me. And the 5+ weeks of holidays which you actually must take and not get fired for taking them.
When you're at the point where a woman has just taken your entire life from you, I wouldn't be surprised if many men resort to paying their ex a visit before knocking themselves off.
Go to one of these countries:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extradition_law_in_the_United_States#International_extradition
You don't think Europe or Canada does the same thing?
This would take the kind of guts few men could muster but as a negotiating strategy it has its upsides.
The court's primary focus is to get the case off its docket under the best terms it can. Voluntary jail short circuits this goal.
The wife's attorney (and the wife) will be horrified at the prospect of not getting any CS and will quickly agree to getting something over nothing.
The downside is that Family Court Judges can be capricious and unpredictable. There are no doubt some that would say, "Fine. Have fun in jail".
It's hard to negotiate with a man with nothing to lose. And a man whose income will be almost entirely taken away will have nothing to lose
Agreed. There are at least three options I would consider before suicide in this scenario. This is one of them.
In my experience, the judge does not really give you the opportunity to speak. I was allowed to speak one sentence of 8 words before the verdict was rendered and the gavel dropped. For those going into family court, you might only get one chance to speak. Make it count.
When you really look at it, the modern marriage contract is an agreement to accept small morsels of freedom in exchange for performance. This contract extends into divorce.
You can legally dodge child support but it takes balls. The key to it is your never actually locked up for failure to pay because that would be debtors prison. Your locked up for contempt of court however you have to actually go in front of a court. Never get served papers and never go in front of a judge then all they can do is garnishment of your check. Get a 1099 sub contractor job or own your own business and now your set.
And before any girl who hears this brings up upper class women, and give a sophisticated "don't be poor" argument...
Exactly what annual income makes a woman act right? Wait for the answer.
Brad Pitt made plenty of money and he got the you are an abuser routine because he dared to raise his voice with the kids.
Celebs are professional sociopaths, they never count
lol
these-days, even the princes of Dubai couldn't keep a chick in check
SIX of my friends are married and still married. Actually there have been no divorces after 10 to 15 years...I actually don't know anyone from my group of friends that got married within 3 years out of college that got a divorce. For all intents, they were equal to higher value than the girl... maybe that explains it.
When she makes more than you and isn't willing to give up her career?
Because then she is paying child support?
Depends who has custody, if she has custody she's likely still going to get child support regardless.
Honestly he should just jump the border and get the fuck out
What border? We've been super busy getting rid of those things. Good luck escaping governments that want to keep their milk cows paying. It's going to get to the point that you'll have to go to some of the most lawless corners of the planet to avoid crushing court orders.
and people are surprised why i voted for Trump; lol.
which candidate was shilling for the "no borders" again?
Useful link as the majority of TRP readers are from USA.
However, Russia is not listed so feel free to rawdogg some sluts in your vacation in Florida.
Some cuck will pay for a single mum for sure.
Wow thats crazy but good to know i can still escape to Asia like i planned hahaha
If you want to run to another country from child support payments, run to a country the US does not have a good relationship with as they will not have an extradition treaty. This includes countries in the Middle East and Russia. Frankly, Russia is very similar to America and you can have a nice life in Moscow as it is essentially a standard metropolitan megapolis similar to LA or NY.
Even after watching my situation unfold (which is very tame compared to that guy, but still) my three closest friends proceeded to get engaged and marry over the course of the past couple of years. It couldn't have happened at a better time for them to see what can (and will likely) happen but they went ahead with it anyway.
Unfortunately it's like touching a hot stove burner. You have to do it once to know what it's like, but this pain lasts a lifetime. Those guys that get married three or four times, though, I really can't explain that one.
Everyone who spectates a horror show of a divorce from someone they know and still gets married likely says "oh we're different...she's not like that...we're gonna do it right".
I did. Married and divorced within two years. Guys don't understand how quickly women change their mind; the ring is meaningless.
It actually has a ton of meaning in that you are a beta pushover. No man really thinks it's a good idea to waste thousands of $ on a ring.
Meaningless to a woman's sense of commitment.
Live under a rock lately?
Does it bother you that your friends found people that they trust enough to marry? I am really sorry that you went through a divorce, I am sure that was extremely difficult for you. However, just because you had a lackluster marriage does not automatically apply to all others.
Did I say it bothered me? My point was that reading a statistic like, "70% of women initiate divorce" along with the fallout being burdened by the male doesn't feel as real as watching my experience first hand. I thought they may reconsider or at least seek my advice. They didn't, and that's fine.
Told my brother some facts about marriage, you know, the usual numbers. % of divorces. % of divorces initiated by women.
Then told he would lose half his shit, wouldn't be able to see his children anymore and would give half his salary to his ex wife until the children are of legal age.
His answer :
I kid you not.
That's when I stopped trying to help BP guys.
Same story. I realised literally today that he is a white knight type, despite having had all the bullshit happen to him.
They are happy being fucked over.
Take my father. He is abused by my feminist mother constantly.
Whenever I would step up to defend him he would end up attacking me.
Whenever I would side with my mother and injustly attack him, criticize him...he would be happy and tell me I'm right and he would appreciate me more.
I mean I'm all for treating you right but if you punish me for treating you right and reward me for treating you like a piece of shit....
Those people live in a different world than us and none of us can't understand them anymore and vice versa.
I can understand it to a degree; from my viewpoint it's a case of low self esteem and lack of understanding of gender dynamics. It can easily be cured (in the case of my brother) but they are weak, lazy and afraid to take a risk and 'lose'. Especially if time is not on their side any more.
What's the alternative? You don't get married, spend the rest of your life fucking random women and die without a family and kids, or you date a woman who doesn't want children? Marriage is the biggest life risk for men but it's the only way they'll have a strong family foundation.
Paternal love is real. Men aren't drone bees. They love children, they have a drive to pass on their genes and the lessons they learned to another generation. Children love and need parents and a strong family foundation. Trust and the needs of many is what built all aspects of civilization. But it's not possible the way people and the government are today. Men must take back their power to commit, but there'll be plenty of fools willing to get fucked over who won't get it until it hits.
If that's the only way how men need to awaken to the truth, so be it. If you still want to take the risk, go ahead, but be prepared. It's only a matter of when, and how ugly.
There's nothing wrong with going into a relationship or marriage with knowing that statistically it won't work out - that's the mindset from the reality of the world we live in - however likewise all the doubt and caution you have with commitment links back to the fear and insecurities of your post and can be self-jeapordising to your family, legacy and relationship.
At the end of the day, all men can do is make their best judgement and choose a woman and hope she has similar basic moral values to not deprive her children of a father figure. Women simply cannot raise a child to a satisfactory standard on her own. Children are not stupid and over time, especially after development through their teens will see both parents for who they are, despite the warped view one parent tries to spin.
It's not a question of right or wrong. Thing is, your life will have to go on after the breakup. The question is - do you know what that involves? The consequences of a marriage and family breakup are on a whole other level to breaking up with your first crush.
For all the talk, no one really knows what it's like to get hit by a train till they do. Yeah, people do get up from that and move on and even thrive again - but you've got to be in a position to do that if and when such a time comes. There was one guy here who wrote about how he had to go homeless on the streets for a while. And then there's the emotional impact to deal with. Practically everyone here woke up only after being hit by that bolt of lightning.
And it will wreck your kids up. They better be ready for it too. If you're that bulletproof and abundant, only then it makes sense.
Wrong..........
You can still have a family and not get married.
isn't the alternative to get a solid prenup?
i realize with a prenup she can still fuck you over with custody but you minimize the risk of her leaving when she realizes she won't get anything aside from child support.
Women who don't want children are usually broken in some way. Or they change their mind suddenly at 40. The "biological clock" is no joke. Beware.
Send him this story and maybe his response will change...
I don't bother anymore.
I mean if I sent him this story he would call me a misogynist and attack me.
Try to help and you get attacked. So why try to help anymore?
My LTR of 4 years is starting to nag about marriage and complaining that I don’t want to get married. I’m not going to cave. I know too much now to even consider marriage
I caved. But reacted and got out shortly after and without any financial damage.
My advice: walk.
Next time she brings it up, you should ask her why exactly she wants to get married. Unless you already have?
I'm in the same boat man .. I've been with my girl a little over 2 years and she definitely keeps mentioning marriage, hinting at engagement, moving in, kids, etc.
Frankly, it's a shit situation because she really is a sincere, decent person. I just feel like I know too much now. The Easter bunny isn't real, so to speak...
I’d feel an immense restriction if I got married. Like I see guys who are married, following around their wives like little puppies pretending to be happy with their circumstances. We all know that they aren’t happy, they literally have no mobility or freedom. Women love control. And they way they do it is with marriage and children. And if they can’t get a man to commit they literally begin to lose their shit.
lead her on. Tell her you need X amount saves up first. That should take a year and a half. Then propose, plan the marriage, and then dump her. You get good engagement sex.
You should probably sack up and break up with her at this point. Sounds like a big disagreement.
Yea that’s the most probable outcome
You can't just always break-up instantly. First tell her clearly that you will never marry. Then if she keeps to nag and does not enter your frame, then dump her.
Not sure what these other fools are talking about "have you asked her..." or "have you talked about why...".
Fucking hard next, immediately. When the marriage talks begin, it's time to end. Once they got marriage on the brain, all they see is signs of marriage and commitment. She'll zero in on all social media about friends getting married, then bitch. Or she'll talk to a friend who's brother's cousin's sister is getting married, then bitch. It's just death by a thousand nags.
Been there, fuck that.
Thanks for the advice! I’m working on getting out ASAP . Now she’s talking about buying property together. Apparently she has decided where as well lol. I can’t wait to be a free man.
I curious, did you explain to her that you don't need to sign a paper to show that you love her? Just wondering how she would reply
Yes I’ve explained that I don’t need to sign a legal document to prove my commitment or love but she just brings up all this bullshit like ‘it’s the ultimate gesture of commitment carried out in front of friends and family’ . IMO she is anxious that she can’t get me to commit to marriage. I think it is a control thing for her that she needs to know I’m her bitch by agreeing to marriage. She says without me agreeing to marry her in the future she doesn’t know where we stand in this relationship. It’s all a load of BS lol. We’ve had big arguments about this, almost to the point of breaking up. Plus it doesn’t help when her friends are getting engaged and she’s like ‘why don’t you love me that much’. ‘Am I not good enough for you’.
We all know feminism is rampant and women think they are entitled to anything they want... she literally said to me ‘are you telling me I can’t have something that I want’.. I was like ‘with me, yes’.
I’m kinda expecting her to break up with me. I’m not going to be naive
Ahhhh ok, I figured as much. Just was curious how she would frame it if you didn't want to commit with marriage.
My brother gave in. He didn't want to marry, but his wife pressured him to death. His wife's sister got married and her friends got married so the pressure increased tend fold.
He's not the happiest but he understands that it's his fault. The Good news is I can't see her killing him in the divorce procedure because she makes Good money herself.
Point is, hang in there.
How do you handle it? I usually give them the “it wouldn’t change the dynamic of our relationship, so what’s the point?”
And you are right... it would change everything. I’m not going to roll the dice on that shit.
I’ve just told her I’m not interested in marriage and I don’t see the point in it. Like why do I need to sign a legal document to show my love? She wants me to list reasons to her. Then I give her some stats or something about shitty marriage and divorce rape and she says can you give anecdotal examples of this.
Why are you staying in the LTR? Don't you get tired of hitting that same pussy? Break up. Walk. Go out. Get new chicks.
I’m going to.. just sorting out living arrangement etc.
Paternal love is real. Men aren't drone bees. They love children, they have a drive to pass on their genes and the lessons they learned to another generation. Children love and need parents and a strong family foundation. Trust and the needs of many is what built all aspects of civilization. But it's not possible the way people and the government are today. Men must take back their power to commit, but there'll be plenty of fools willing to get fucked over who won't get it until it hits.
If that's the only how men need to awaken to the truth, so be it. If you still want to take the risk, go ahead, but be prepared. It's only a matter of when, and how ugly.
I'm sorry, but a good chunk of this is complete bullshit.
Texas does not base CS on one month of pay, but on the last year's earnings prior to divorce.
Restraining orders do not mean a higher rate of achieving custody.
There is free legal help for both men and women in Texas.
95% of all custody cases do not go to women. More and more men are challenging custody, and men who do challenge for custody get custody the vast majority of the time.
How do I know this? Because I got a fucking divorce in Texas and won. I beat everything this man said he faced because I faced it, too. Control your emotions, document your shit, and do what is best for your kids. If she truly is a fuck up, you will win. In short, be a goddamn man and stop whining by blaming the woman.
Another user in he original thread went through dudes comment history and yes, this is a troll post it seems.
What really sucks is that it’s completely plausible barring those details.
It's plausible, but only if you literally do nothing. My frustration is that this sub is supposed to be for men to better themselves, but all too often it turns into a woman bashing echo chamber.
That's not really valid since the entire "family court" (puke) system is rigged against men in favor of women... so even if you do have a "good case", they can still easily win. Sounds like you got lucky.
Yes, it is valid. The op was making excuses that were totally within his realm of control. You can either be pissed and bitch, or do something about it. I didn't get lucky. Stats are showing more men are fighting stereotypical expectations in family court, and they are winning more often than not when they do. And isn't that what this sub is supposed to be about---improving ourselves as men? Or, are we supposed to whine and bitch when the odds are supposedly against us even though we can do something about it?
i agree much of this HAS to be bullshit as i know a good handful of super damaged women who only get to see their kids like 1 or 2 days a month and under strict supervision. And i'm in one of the worst states for divorce for men.
Buddy I went through a very similar situation in the past year and a half. My high school sweetheart was pregnant with my son. I was supportive to the nth degree. She dumped my ass on valentine's day and ignored me the entire pregnancy. Right after the baby was born she starts going out with her ex who had been in jail. They broke up after about a month. We got back together. I knew it wouldn't last but wanted to see my son for the first time and spend as much time as possible. 5 days before Christmas she texts me at work saying it was a big mistake for getting back with me and that she was going to go back with her ex who was in jail. Can't imagine the pain. But it's slowly getting bether. Trust me, the pain numbs. I haven't seen my son in almost 2 months and it's he'll. I made one last Stand with her on the phone and told her she will call me to come to and understanding or I will not call or text. I did that because she was trying to pull a power play on me, demanding I pay her monew, pay for a bunch of shot even though she gets a LOT of money for the baby from the government, and her insistence that her ex is going to have a talk with me. I recognized the cuck frame she was trying to put me in and walked away. Still haven't heard from her. Ran into her parents a couple weeks ago and they were sympathetic. The sad and painfull part is I have to walk away in ghost.mode in the hopes she pulls back into my frame and from there I won't give and inch. Ice been reading TRP for the past year but it's really this situation with her and that I have been able to recognize paralells and RP lessons. I know what NOT to do. Anyways, our story isn't uncommon so don't beat yourself up. Just realize AWALT. And talk to the courts because the will adjust your payment to fit your income.
I don't want to hit you when you're down, but have you gotten a DNA test? If not, that should be your one number priority right now.
wish you the best. using the kid as a pawn. girls are ruthless which is why i feel nothing when applying trp
It’s hard to feel empathy for women when you hear stories like this. I agree. Unfortunately this scenario is not at all uncommon, and there are decent numbers of women who would provide emotional support to a friend engaging in this sort of behavior as well. Young men really need to get their wits about them early. This is a war, but it’s largely being fought on psychological grounds, and in the courts, academia, and media.
Talk to a lawyer to see what your options may be, if the other guy was in prison for violent things it may sway a judge.
So have you initiated any motions to get 50% custody? I understand how you feel, but you cannot afford to react, instead plan, and act.
Understand the feelings you have right now are essentially ego. Just give distance and with time a relationship will likely naturally grow, but enforce your boundaries.
But again, understand your desire right now that is overwhelming you likely doesn't accurately reflect how you'd feel if you had time to meet your child and let them into your heart.
Having kids is straight work, and the nurturing is a female duty. You're operating on male duty and honor right now.
I hope in the future I have a way of helping guys like you but I don't think this is any easier than convincing guys about the way it is in the first place. Having kids is its own "unplugging."
play stupid games, win stupid prizes
This always gets to me. I don't know how you can walk into the most shadiest casino and not see the red flags. I can actually see a couple and in 15mins of meeting them I already know it will fuck up. People ignore the signs and signals and when shit goes wrong. They forget about that time where she cheated and they forgave her, or the other time where she went to an ex's house, going out late to parties and coming back pissed drunk, drinks, have no hobbies, social media is her only life, daddy's little princess, narcissistic, rude to people lower than her. Like they just block out everything and when all the cards are down and they failed to call her bluff, "But I thought you were different", Nahh son, you wanted her to be different. If someone isn't a good sport. I don't play.
You sound like my old Drill Sergeant
He sounds like everyone on the internet
JUST DON'T DO IT... EVER!
I live in Poland - ultraconservative, catholic country and guess what? Married/engaged girls are the first ones to hit on me. The more they know me, the more they want me. Unexperienced, young girls get shy, but married ones get all touchy, while their beta sits at home or "goes with the guys".
You want to "Let her boyfriend/husband worry" than be the idiot who worries why she is coming home so late.
u/Whisper, if it was not for you, I would not see that shit with my own eyes. I adopted the mentality you suggested, that her social deal is not my responsibilty, so I escalated things and my eyes got opened.
Shit was all his fault too. Had a fucking terrible attorney and I have a feeling he felt bad about something and just agreed to whatever that bitch was asking for. There are no statutes that would take his one month of highest ever earning to calculate his CS off of, that is bullshit. He also said it was determined in arbitration, which means he AGREED TO IT! idiot!.
I am answering, and pissed at this DF because I am divorced to a land whale, pay $3,200/mo for another 10.5 years! Bitch wanted $7k/mo!!! Best bet for this guy or any guy is to go out an improve yourself from the divorce date status (just don't let her know). My income has doubled and I live like a pauper in front of her. Let that cunt believe she is killing me. Will say divorcing her fat ass was the best thing ever in my life. She gained 100 pounds after 2 kids, then wanted to quit her 100k/yr job that allowed her to work from home, and wanted me to give her fat ass more kids! Said Fuck no, she moved out, then when I didn't chase her, tried to beg her way back,,, no fucking way. Now at 47, divorced 6 years, I have enjoyed 20-40 year old women and had 5 girls going at once, and they all knew about each other! Fucking crazy how this RP works, compared to what you are taught growing up.
Also, Having a C-suite job, high 6 figure income, work out with the same strength as when I was in my 20's, TRT, hair replacement. Men remain desirable if they make an effort.
Thanks for the opportunity to vent, rant...
People in this sub are so bad about conflating "relationship" with "marriage". You can have a solid relationship without marrying anyone. You can even have children and not marry. The marriage part is you making a foolish bet just to flaunt how awesome you think your relationship is at the moment. Stay humble and just don't marry. You maintain the power of leaving that way. That's your only weapon in a gynocentric society.
If you have children, you can still end up paying CS whether you're married or not.
You don’t loose half of everything though.
Well, I would not be so sure. Depends upon what assets were collected during the relationship.
Assets belong to their in individual owners.
Doesn't mean you have to make it worse by risking alimony and all your assets. Child support is understandable in principle. If you make a kid you SHOULD be held financially responsible for it. How much the payments are could use some adjustment though.
If you are going to have kids, you should get married. When you break up, you will still be paying child support, but will have more parental rights if you are married and getting divorced.
Women are cruel and enjoy making men hurt emotionally and financially. It is a sick form of “grrrl power” to them. Something like this happened to me but without the kid. She dyed her hair red and started cheating on me when we were supposed to be getting married. Yes I am happy we never married but shocked at how malicious women can be.
It's because we are physically able to overpower them, whereas they need to resort to psychological means to exert force. Not condoning it just a biological observation
and i bet it happened almost overnight. they can do a complete 180 on you and act as if you were never there to begin with
It's called lightswitch effect. Not only they forget you, they forget that they ever loved you to begin with. That's why they say "I never really loved you anyway" they really forget it. It's some kind of evolutionary shit they have programmed in their heads.
IIIRC the leading theory (at least in our sub) is that it’s an evolutional adaptation for when a new group comes into the tribe and slaughters everyone, killing offspring and taking wives. It’s interesting as hell, in addition to being very tough to accept.
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<Hopefully helpful rant>
Edit: I misread, thought troubled guy made original post.
Dealing with tragedy is yet one more RP skill. Whether you have a flu so bad you want to die, suicide seems like a rational choice, you lost your job and have no means to pay rent and / or you got divorced it you will be in a state you believe is how it's always been and will always be. It's not. Use your mind. The amount of time you spend that 'that mental' that you want to die is a tiny sliver of the time you have lived. Understand that. The most fucked situation will pass with no effort and some patience. That's rule #1. It gets better than that because if you can just keep yourself distracted, say watching a movie, then movie hopping to kill 4 hours of this sliver you are ahead. That's rule #2.. you can wait it out in a waiting room fretting over it the whole time and it will pass so distracting yourself for hours is even better. It's much better to go in to self regulation mode, and distract yourself for hours too. That is, make sure you have eaten a few times every day, don't spend time thinking about the problems in a way that drives you crazy. Choose one of your problems and solve it in chunks, then use any downtime to distract yourself with a movie or a podcast. That's rule #3 Merely distracting yourself will get you out of 'wanting death' mode, but if you can put in some work jobs as a form distraction, and solving some of the problems as a form of distraction, you will not only come out of it soon enough, you will be happy you did and ready to move on.
It doesn't matter if you when to a street corner and hung around like a bum for a week. It will pass.
After. you know it will pass. no matter what's a matter of channeling yourself to pass the time.
....
Also. All the 'deadbeat dad' and other shit are just shit women criminally use to distract blame from themselves. You need strategies to deal with that shit as well. It's about learning not to lower your head when one of these verbal abuse lines is bolting towards you. It's about seeing them for what they are AWHILE you are being shanked with this abuse. You should see these actions as petting, malicious and childlike. As a strategy do not every visualize yourself as a deadbeat dad or ever engage in explaining to them why you are not a deadbeat dad. That's just shit stupid stuff men do. If a woman is blatantly using a lie to get somewhere, she will never say 'oh your right' after you explain it to her. Don't allow yourself to be around those 'backing her up' Avoid the ones you must see sometimes, never see yourself as what they are calling you, and never engage or explain. If you have to retreat, retreat to your real friends and / or here.
Eliminate as much (that is all) of the drama and brain damage as possible by keeping busy or distracted (a healthy combo of both is the ticket). Put logistical strategies to deal with this shit in place. Who knows maybe you'll have a flu from hell next year, you can use the same strategies again.
Maybe watch stoism videos on youtube. It's timely information that will put you in the right frame of mind. That is don't shit time trying to control what you can't control, and go full force on what you can control (you can always complete them and feel rewarded), especially times like this. Another one. Remember that all of your problems are stupid trivial in the big scheme of things. If you are acting out drama you chose to. No different then when you see someone else act like a clown when they are getting arrested or after a divorce. What do you think of them? you are thinking them acting out is just retarded. Accept that if you are acting out as a drama clown you it's useless and you are doing it by choice, not because it's a 'normal response'. That's another stoic thing, but I didn't explain that one that well.
Here's a link to youtube videos on stoism. Clicking on any one of them will probably get your head screwed on straight again.
Also read 'Light Switch Effect' in the sidebar.
I knew you were a stoic before you said anything about stoicism.
Fellas, this is the right state of mind. No matter how bad things get, nothing can harm the soul but the soul itself.
Do not be fooled by externals. Guard your heart and soul above all.
Great contribution, I think this could even be a whole post on dealing with tragedy. Have you thought about expanding it?
Well, I guess this is part of the mechanics of how the alphas at the apex of society get their never-ending supply of slave-betas, gammas, and omegas to fit into their pyramid-schemes.
Also, OP is a textbook example of how not to react. He is just taking it. They set his child support on a one-off event and he doesn't appeal that? If Texas really is that unjust, he should fucking flee the state, disappear, and start a new life, not fork over his dwindling savings to that vampire.
what are the gammas and omegas for?
Slave-labor, cannon-fodder, fuel, prey, etc.
When you get over how badly women behave in marriage, you will see how badly men act too -- but not with infidelity, insensitivity, or apathy as this culture will lead you to believe, but how spineless, self-brainwashed and weak husbands and fathers have become.
Was married once. Got out of that relationship as fast as I could once the baby talks started to mix with the proposals to "open the relationship". That shit was ticking bomb. I'm never doing it again.
I have gotten to know about my ex since then: she's still having a hard-working, career-driven life as an independent woman. Good for her, but a massive lesson for me and all of us: once they are bored with life, they just want to attempt to spice things up at OUR expense.
In other news, all my married friends are unhappy, 50% of my close female friends are cheating on their husbands or boyfriends while trying to "reinvent themselves", "find who they really are", "exploring polyamory" (without telling their men) and so on.
I get them, both boys and girls. Married life is boring. Routine is boring. But we men are generally on the pink end of the cock if we enter into a marriage contract and things go south.
Two things need to go out the door from American and European countries
1) No fault divorce 2) Contraception
Life will be a bit more boring, but hey, much less abuse of man!
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I wouldn't be about to kill MYSELF....
I think the real takeaway here is don't have a kid.
Lots of men want to father a son, though.
And lots of men have happy marriages without kids.
you misspelled "relationships"
Well I’m married with no kids
Am I the only one that would fake their death and start over if this was them?
The thing is that American Laws are somewhat super strict on divorce ... almost oppressive to the husband ... in other countries where the laws are more relaxed, you don't get into the quoted situations
But to answer the question, don't get married unless you and your spouse are religious people. Marriage is based off religion, so makes no sense why you'd want to if you aren't?
Actually, in this scenario, I bet it makes very little difference if he's married or not. Bring your own condoms guys.
Can't a prenup prevent this sort of thing? I would only marry a woman if she was so wrapped around my finger she'd sign a prenup, otherwise, no deal.
Yes and no. There has been cases where prenups were thrown out.
Also good luck finding any woman that would agree to one. Asking for a prenup is basically telling your wife that you dont trust her and those vows you guys promised dont mean shit.
I think pre nups work better for more wealthy individuals or people that marry just for status (IE politicians, celebs, ect...).
Could anybody link the original?
Lol if i were this guy i would just go live in the mountains for a while... no social media or anything for a year.. just relax.. lmfao.. police have better things to do than chase some dude who isn't paying child support. And its pretty easy to duck the cops. Just say you lost your mind and you don't remember the last year! LOL! all you know is you just woke up on the other side of the country, or in another country, and you don't remember how you got there! Appear as dumb as possible so they dont suspect youre up to anything. Get a lawyer to find some obscure mental illness that has been observed in people with your genotype and that this illness makes people forget large parts of their lives. Haha. Better to lie than slave away for a bitch.
Its not that hard to live a good life. Just self educate yourself with some self help books and live as a free man. I recommend How to Win Friends and Influence People, the 48 laws of power, and the art of war. and i would never ever ever EVER give a SINGLE penny for child support. NOT. A. PENNY. motherfucker. No bitch is ruining my life. No bitch.
If younger married, marry a girl with similar assets and a high paying job. That's what my dad did and when they got divorced both of them were well off financially.
Damn that title made me swallow. Old guy here, married twice and all I can say is DO NOT FUCKING GET MARRIED!
I just dont understand men who marry poor uneducated women. I will get married to my LTR but not until she gets her PHD. She will make more money then I do and then if shit foes sideways she will be the bread winner in court. Might get myself some CS if it really gets twisted.
You’re delusional. How many PHDs make money? How much loans do they have? How much respect is they have for their man who has less of an education then they do?
Have fun with that. Tip me in 5 years when you’re divorced raped.
My coworker PhDs make 300-500k per year.
Every medical doctor I know makes money and lots of it. School loans come with the education and she already pays her own first school loan that got her a BA.
She treats me like a king now and she has a Bachelors in Bio Engineering and I Don’t even have a degree. Our money is separate, she pays for most stuff but we don’t combine our income.
Though I am about to go into a Nursing program and I may do a PA degree afterward.
We already been together 6 years and living together 5.
She isnt like other woman but she still is one. So I treat her as such. But anyway in California, the person who makes the most money get divorce raped, not just men. Its just rare that women are the bread winners.
Im full Red Pilled and apply its theories but still, why do men marry poor uneducated women. If a poor girl asked me, when I was gonna propose, I would ask when you getting a degree? I don’t marry whores, I marry a woman who was brought up to take of herself, educated, and driven. Thats the only type of women I would ever consider to take as a wife. Hence why I am still not married, but I could be close... 8 years to go. Ill be 40 by then and she will be 37.
“She isn’t like other women”....oh boy here we go again! I’ll wait eagerly for your post in a few months on how things fell to shit, how we were right all along and how you now believe in the old adage which we’ll say together in harmonious unison ...All Women Are Like That”
Lol medical doctors are even worse, they are all fucking each other all the time. Have fun getting cucked
Hey guys I mean let's be fair to the man. We don't know what he looks like or what the girl looks like. I've seen plenty of nerdy AF women who aren't really about to cheat on their boyfriends or divorce them, but they are often pretty darn sexually repressed and frankly not anything I'd want to sleep with. I respect them in professional settings, but their SMV is frankly too low for them to be a problem for you anyway. That being said, this relationship situation sounds a bit dicey TBH. If she's better than you professionally, which let's be honest she sounds like it, you'll never really be the man in that relationship.
Low SMV, nerdy girls fuck too. Just because you don't touch them doesn't mean they won't have legions of thirsty, equally nerdy guys orbiting.
I like smart women too, they're better at lying and keep the illusion alive longer. The more they make me feel like I'm worth something, the more suspicious I get... Or at least, nowadays I do, those were some hard lessons, good luck with that. Or maybe you're one really is diffirent, I hope so for your sake.
We can make bets on how long it will take this broad's friends to start the "Oh you can do soooo much better than him...", assuming it hasn't already. We can follow that with how quickly she starts to believe it.
Maybe, but in that case the 'friends' are just jealous, he could just fuck her friends and be done with it. Let's just hope his GF hasn't found out that having a BF makes her attractive to guys looking to boast their ego's. She might just be stringing him along so that it's more exciting to duck other guys. However, I genuinely hope he has found something special, even though I doubt it.
I've never met a PhD with a stable mind. Don't do it.
Have PhD. LTR also has a PhD. Can confirm.
Would like to know more about this.
What's there to explain? Grad students are batshit.
Grad school is like Seal Team school for the mind. It breaks you mind and will to make it stronger. Sometimes it just breaks.
PhD = Permanent Head Damage.
Coming from a former grad student
Have you ever been to conferences PhDs and PhD candidates in conferences? everyone fucks everything that moves like you have no idea. Half of them with boyfriends or husbands.
Just a quick heads up.
I have almost 20 years of experience going to conferences full of PhD and grad students. I think I'm going to the wrong conferences because if there is sex, nobody knows.
Poor man. No man deserves that... I don’t care if he was the most beta guy ever.
I’m never getting married.
heres a simple fucking solution, marry someone that isnt a fucking deadbeat wife, more women go to college and more women study pharmacy/nursing etc
This is a problem most guys have. They go for really low level women. Don’t marry the woman that is working at a low level service industry job that is likely over 25. They’re always going to want easy money and a sense of empowerment. I bet this women was already working at Starbucks and living with her parents when he met her. He didn’t marry a woman he married the equivalent of teenager at an adult age and her “rebellious” attitude is showing by dying her hair and going feminist.
Yes I don't think all men are going to give up on marriage because there is just too much cultural history and tradition behind it, and because many men do in fact want to settle down. I do think that the greatest irony of all is going to happen though - going forward, it is going to become women who have to be big earners in order to get commitment.
I wanna get married because I don’t just want to be banging random chicks for the rest of my life ya know. At some point I want security and sameness but these marriage horror stories and seeing stuff like this happen firsthand with my parents scares me.
Yeah that's called an LTR. No contracts or ceremony needed. As if marriage guarantrees security and stability lol that's what everyone here is trying to point out.
Sameness and boredom will eventually kick in. If you or your partner are still attractive and get yourselves into situations where infidelity can happen, it will happen. Might be you, might be her.
You don't need to bang random chicks for life. You can simply jump from relationship to relationship as soon as they start losing the kick. Once we are old, tired and ugly enough to stop that, then maybe we can start thinking about setting down.
I can bet everything this dude ignored red flags, probably was a doormat of a sort, became complacent, went into the relationship on her terms
While possible, I doubt a traditional woman or a woman with no red flags would dye her hair fucking blue, cheat while pregnant, run off with feminists, etc.
Now she’s definitely at fault but don’t ignore the fact that the guy might’ve made some retarded but common mistakes.
Let's play: Who Wants to be a married fool?
Fiancé tried to poison me, can you guess why?:
A) She loved me but wasn't in love anymore
B) She was secretly in love with someone else
C)She was afraid of what I might do when I found out about her lover
D)I was forcing/guilt tripping her into a relationship with me.
Anyone?
Made me tear up. Yet the media will never fucking cover this as it does not serve the feminine imperative. Seriously.... shit like this makes my blood boil and very angry. The times... they be changin’
Its sad but at least his pain will end soon. I dont think he has the money to flee to another country even, which usually requires at least 10k.
I’m curious to all my brothers out there from culturally Asian backgrounds, where the talk of marriage creeps up on you and takes over the dinner table conversation the moment you turn of age, how do you deal with the talk that you’ll have to have years to come on the inevitability of no marriage to your conservative, sheltered, delusional parents?
I never say anything I'm currently 22 so the pressure isn't on yet but provided I marry within the same ethnicity then they don't seem too fussed. In reality, they don't realise I don't give 2 fucks what they think and will do what I want.
If you were financially independent you wouldn't be asking these kind of questions.
Pretty sure this is how murder made me famous, got its start. I cant tell if the sub as a whole is cynical or there are really a crap ton of shitty females out there. Ive been doing my homework & the game seems rigged, very rarely if ever in the mans favor. Keep your head up op...btw js moving out of the country an option? Like an automatic do-over?
Jesus, I'm going through a divorce now. It's really not a big deal because we don't have kids, but I can feel his pain. I have to try my best to keep my ex-wife calm and amicable because at any moment she could flip and try to go after a lot of my money and income. It's a fucked up situation. My lawyer told me she can also require me to pay HER lawyer fees. What the fuck?
Another strategy is to only get into LTRs with women who are financially successful but submissive and check all the other red pill boxes for a good mate.
I’m divorced and with shared custody my ex actually pays ME child support because according to my tax return I make less than she does. Learn how to hide your money properly.
My current main plate makes six figures and has massive savings but knows her place and I have excellent control over the relationship. It’s an ideal scenario if things go long term.
Just a PSA that child custody payments can affect unmarried guys.
Condoms... hell, vasectomies.
I would rather flee the country then pay child support for a cheating wife
I was already set financially. She would have a hard time challenging the prenup, considering she essentially wrote most of it.
I have given her my name, so she is under constant scrutiny. Everything she says and does, her looks and style, her feminine graces, now all of it is a reflection of me. And not just me, but of my family and my business.
Over time, being unavoidably indispensable for some aspects of my business, she will experience all manner of shit. Seduction attempts by capable men, blackmail, threats, emotional pressure, and other charming behavior.
She is responsible for raising our children. When they are old enough to begin understanding who I am and what I do, I’ll take a more active role. But I’ll never be too familiar. I’ll provide a role model, she’s responsible for everything else.
Those are some of the demands of the role she has undertaken.
Me? I basically keep doing what I was doing pre-marriage.
I like being married. Maybe I won’t forever, but right now it’s amazing.
No reason why any man should get married now. Life is too short to play russian roulette with marriage.
Oh my God, thanks because I'm divorced but with no kids. Marriage no more!
Real life is more chilling than any horror movie. I cant imagine what he has been through. Hopefully he has now seen there are still people out there support him. We need to help eachother out in the society we live in.
Holy shit man this is degrading. I hope that guy turns out alright at the end
Why didn't he take the bitch with him, if he is going to commit suicide?
Marriage is a legal way to steal from each other. Feel your pain. My state is exactly the same and did the exact same to me. Finally after three years though with "No" job theu were forced to drop it to the minimum and report to them when I come up with a job. Only thing I can say is hang in there and it will get better
To really understand what true abundance feels like, one needs to think about how you're gonna dealing with old age, disease, loss of work, money, your home, degeneration, dependence, isolation and death. And let me get the bad news out of the way first -- these things are the curse of the earth and they WILL come to you, sooner or later, if you're not ready.
What I see is that when a lot of men cross 50-60 and their testosterone declines, they start getting these fears. Most younger people marry and start families from this needy point of origin -- only to see that their fears attracted the very thing they fear. As men, we need to figure out how we're going to face these, it's not if, but when.
These fears when not addressed, keeps a man trapped and bound, hurts his confidence and abundance mentality, and it'll force you to build your life around a needy paradigm. The thought at the very bottom of your mind, is the one that'll come true.
Now how's that relevant to TRP? This. You cannot fully discover the things that make you a high value attractive man -- fearlessness, power, confidence and abundance without a healthy frame and a way of living that addresses these.
PS : And the first step one can do is -- yes, LIFT!
But then, what is your advice for dealing with old age, disease, loss of work, money, your home, degeneration, dependence, isolation and death? How can a man prepare for these eventualities?
Honest question, if marriage is completely out of the question what's the solution to procreating? I seems to me that having multiple children out-of-wedlock would be way more expensive?
There really is no solution. So this is people will continue to marry, even guys that frequent this sub. It's a risk worth taking I guess
I am of the belief that modern feminism/liberalism is the way it is for the specific purpose of destroying the possibility of healthy long term relationships between men and women which would produce fully capable and capacitated adults.
I'm noticing the TRP doesn't answer this issue, in fact it seems to exploit the situation, making it worse.
If sex is all this sub wants, cool, but if everyone is doubling down hard 24/7 the only outcome is hell.
Men, true men, should want more than just sex, they should want to be able to cultivate a good number of zero or low n-count women from whom to choose for a future life, not just high n-count harems for sex until their dicks fall off.
So if TRP is only offering a sex strategy, long term effects might be worse for all.
All good points and yes I agree with you.
I believe most men here and in general would be cool with just a monogamous relationship.
The problem is that attempting to go that route would mean the guys will end up getting post wall women to marry them.
The red pill is teaching guys they have two choices. Either marry a chick who had far more sex partners thenyourself while she settles for you and you give her your reslurces. Or have sex with many women as you want and not give them any resources and commitment.
Doing the latter is not helping, but the former is making things much worse. If guys just end up being perm bachelors then maybe women will wise up (they wont) and start being traditional again.
This sub refuses to acknowledge the true redpill, which is WHY society is the way it is, and that advocation of "plate spinning" and avoiding marriage and MGTOW etc is quite literally accelerating the intended degradation of human civilisation and is falling straight into the playbook of those who are orchestrating all of this. Be as "redpill" as you want about women but without the understanding of WHY things are the way they are you are still blue beyond comprehension and you are lost
Okay Yes, I can agree to that POV. A part of me almost wants to say it is a conspiracy, a necessary conspiracy for many, but one none the less. And like Neo and Morpheus walking past the lady in Red(Pill), even hinting at it is targeted with Billy-Beta-Baby-Fever over here here.
Out of curiosity, when you say ...
you mean ... ?
(PM if you feel it will cause backlash)
I wondered this similarly, Prenups pehaps? its a good bet but also not fool proof.
Just it seems that without legal provisioning, the natural trust that once exited in a more natural way.
Sorry but I don't see this having anything to do with marriage. It can happen to you if you knock out any bitch, marriage or not.
All men that marry in todays age are submisisve cucks who miss the authoritative reign of their single mothers and want a woman-boss clown thingy. If you get married you are gay because you are going to get fucked in the asshole that will soon become very salty and you will be forced to try the lower sodium version of the State's Sausage, and even that will come with a price tag attached.
lol well there you have it fellas
That's right! Don't marry and raise children. Stay a bachelor till the day you die and leave nothing behind after you because you read some bad divorce stories on the internet. That's the real redpill.
Swallowed the red pill after similar situation good thing I didn't knock her up though.
I don't get it. If that child support bullshit happened to me like that i would just take my savings and peace out to a different country. What makes guys stay in a fucked up scenario like that...
But...I found a unicorn.
You should see what kind of books SJWs and feminists read these days...
I am so sorry women in our culture are so immoral its digusting im 20 i don't bother with women at the moment because of this
The punishment for founding a family is 18 years for a misdemeanor and life for an intentional felony. Don't be so stupid.
Not that the sentiment isn't correct, but the OP in the quoted post was outed as a huge troll; a racist and jew-hating shitposter. His account is most likely fake.
Crazy. But really crazy. Could Trump do something about it?
Curious what state this is in cause that's not at all how child support works (at least in mine). If unpaid for 90 days they take your license. They'll garnish wages but no jail time. Also you can pretty much file your own custody paperwork and they use a fancy support calculator to figure it out, any morons dog could see this is an absurd amount and have it redone.
What about signing a pre-nup?
What's the deal with just getting a prenup? Still legally in for an ass pounding later enless highly specific or? Also got married young and daughter is about to turn 1. Trying to convert to redpill more but slow gains. Our wedding was small thankfully but if a divorce is eminent I'd still get fucked over.
"Not at all. my wife took our baby when she dyed her hair blue..." fucking died, Im not even past the first sentence and im dead
jiminy fuckballs though, this guy should actually flee the country. like, at some point you have to accept that you've only been given one life. alot of us were lucky enough to have some kind of shephard to guide us through the retard younger years and prevent us from committing some irreversible fuckup. Then you reach this point where you're making decisions for yourself. you start off with all this potential, you're like 18-20 ish and gradually the decisions you make start to limit and take away that potential.
you choose a career path and doors close, you buy land somewhere and tie yourself up, you get married and you close off a fuckload off doors. I look at marriage as a fucking disability. I have a brain injury thats going to follow me for the rest of my life. Im a potential liability to any employer should they put me in a position where my cognitive impairments could make me a danger for others or the company. Thats closed some doors off for me. thank fuck I didnt get fucked up more in the accident. Would you rather lose your legs or have to pay a bitch 1000 dollars a month? at least with the 1000 a month you can fuck off to some country. that might as well be a death warrant in the country it was issued in. There's nothing there for you anymore. You had one life and guess what, you went and got married, divorced, and lost your america privileges (or wherever)
this guy wont abdicate. he'll eat a bullet, or find a way to keep paying. it's shit honestly. I feel for him because, like me, he probably didnt have anybody there to say "listen women are fucked and you should make it your priority not to make any decisions that are going to seriously effect the rest of your life before you've really figured out what you want that life to be" and a little bit of "there are some things in life that are permanent. among them are death, disability, herpes and child support"
180 day prison sentence for missed child support payment. Ahaha afraid I'd have to call societies bluff on that one.
They send him away, he becomes an expense to the state, along with the his wife and child. He stops working and contributes zero in income tax etc.
This system is laughable and I'd just as quick laugh in the judges face and tell him to do his worst. You may fuck me up, but you won't take my dignity or self respect.
I can't belive this, I really want to insult her, but I know we're better than this. We need to reform the law. Stop with this feminism. Let's search for real equality. No more men down. We must unite brothers
If you are rich, get an agreement that makes sure you pay the lawyers more than her. If you are poor, stay poor and you can't be gauged later (actually incorrect, usless men married to useless women have been hit with huge alimony even if they made it big once freed from their shackles.)
I absolutely want kids.... is there any way to make this work
The OP is full of shit. He is trolling and a bunch if idiots fell for it. Yes there is a way to make it work. Best thing to do is marry someone who earn about or more than what you make and fight for 50/50 custody. Don't be tricked into 51/49. Kids are like stocks. Whoever controls 51% controls 100% of the money.
50/50 and if you both make similar amounts of money, you will both be contributing equal.
If that shit happens I’m moving to Thailand or Ecuador lol.
Marriage itself isn't a bad idea. Its the culture nowadays that puts people of it. Far too much financial restrictions on the man by people of law.
The main reason I won't get married is that restraining orders can be filed whenever and divorce can be filed whenever. Marriage has been weaponized.
If you're not a wife beating pussy then there should be no reason to have a restraining order. Also, don't date, fuck, or marry raging cunts you reprobates
Marriage is for Government Support!! Fuck the stupid court system. 3rd world countries aren't like this!!!
This kind of ruined my day. It's unconscionable how unfair the system is. I feel awful for this guy.
The OP is full of shit. It is a troll post. Fight for your rights and you will be fine.
Or, just use common sense. Remember, there are two sides to a story and you already arrived to a conclusion by just listening to one side.
I don't cause I am more than one dimensional
Yet you suggest someone is one dimensional for having a feeling of empathy toward someone else in a specific situation.
That's like ... the ultimate example of one dimensional thinking.
Actually, I use the term one dimensional because I question the veracity of his post. I cannot reach a conclusion without details, and the largest detail left out was the other person's side of the story. I don't believe anything unless I'm certain of it. Let's be model Americans and strive to hear both sides of an issue and question everything.
You can still not be married and pay child support
Last time I heard the name Tito was in Belize. He was gay and he ended up dead. My country don't tolerate batty man!!!! Pussy Hole!!!!!
I used to wonder why people didn’t want women to have rights.
It’s because they knew women would abuse them.
I’m 21. I don’t ever plan to get married and don’t see any benefits of it. I’ve just put that out there so they can take it in for themselves and allow for me to take in their reactions, they brush it off with a sarcastic laugh but little do they know I’m just feeling the same thing as you. Thanks brother.
My story is not much different than OP's. This is a devastating thing to read and it drags up a lot of harsh memories for me. While I would like to think that my demeanor out in the world is still reasonable and decent, when I get online I am an asshole. I have developed a deep seated hatred for foolishness and ignorance. Any slight thing can piss me off. I used to be a lot more tolerant.
Even people here on TRP anger me at times. It seems that when you get treated this way by systems and people you deeply trusted, your view of everything changes permanently. That is why I keep coming here - to remind me of those moments and keep me frosty.
On another note - I nearly quit my dream profession to work off the books so that they could not get my pay. There are ways to do this and you can look it up. It would be dramatic and a lifelong decision, but at least you would be able to live and maybe even thrive despite this mess. But keep in mind, the people who made this happen are also taking away gun rights and freedom of speech. So they are not messing around.
I wish you well /u/Whisper.
This reminds me of this story from Terrence Popp.
I plan on happily marrying my SO, we both have a bright future ahead of us, and I really look forward to having someone to spend the rest of my life with. Nothing brings me more joy than thinking of spending my life with my SO. I hope one day you guys find someone who will make you see that. We're not at war, lads.
lol wtf I wouldn't have paid a single CS payment. By the time they get me, me and all my assets have already boarded the SS galactic transnational legal and financial master race.
LOL LOL LOL at your western society. I will get married, I will make children with my wife. She is gonna raise them. Cook and clean our home. If she's gonna misbehave, I can simply send her back to her home where her parents will teach her how to behave. If she will cheat, then she better make sure it that she won't get caught because she will be getting a divorce and no one marries a cheating woman here. Even the widow or respectfully divorced woman don't get to have a high status man.
This is the normal state of affairs. A man is simply a dominant force. A woman is submissive. Is it such a taboo thing for your society to accept. I think you guys deserve it, you bring it upon yourself.
Women are fine as fuck, they are as moral as a man. They cheat like men cheat. They want to survive like a man wants to. There is no problem with them. You guys just happen to reward women for cheating. So its fucking very much obvious and natural for an organism to do things that reward them. I can't just stop laughing at you guys.
Man up and stand for yourself and change the system. Or get the fuck out of your country. A western man can easily have a luxurious life in most of the sane countries. Or the least you can do is stop fucking supporting the system.
My men can't even imagine a woman disrespecting or cheating. Rewarding a woman for cheating, and punishing a man for being a loyal man is like imagining some harry potter level fantasy shit, they both can't be possibly real.
If the author reads this, please write to the Iconoclast, good outlet of good people: https://www.iconoclast-media.com/magazine/
Yes, married men statistically make more money, have more sex and live longer.
https://stream.org/married-men-are-happier/
Just don’t marry a psycho girl and you’ll be fine
I know this is hard. But can't you just start over in another country?! Clearly the US system fucks all divorced fathers and clearly with that kind of ex wife you will not be a father to your kid. So, I would think it's better to start all over again in another country than living in that kind of misery.
So where's the other person's side of the story? Let's ask her if she disagrees with his version of what happened.
The future of marriage is bleak at best even outside the anglosaxon sphere.
What about marriage from traditional countries, with high income levels? Perhaps one can escape this man fate there?
When you are a man of high value and in tune with your masculinity your woman will not be dying her hair blue and be a feminist. I am still getting married. Still will have children.
Irrelevant. Women aren’t trying to get financial security from low value men. A man of high value doesn’t instill discipline into a woman, he is simply a target for women.
You can be into your masculinity all you want, not that the government cares how big you think your balls are, but life is yours to live so good for you.
Lol dude. I respect your alpha-mindset, but I know turbo chads who would make you look like peter pan, and they were cucked despite holding their frame. All it means that you will be a Chad paying CS.
You’re right especially about the CS. I still believe having children is important. That matters more to me than a wife anywAy.
Then why get one? Just have kids with someone who is really into you and isn't a complete fuck up. If they demand marriage, next em.
I hope your masculinity stays strong and robust for the road you face ahead. High value or not, if she gets tingles from a low value male she gonna swallow his semen faster than you can say "high value male".
Sure, your mileage may vary, but the odds are you will be divorced. It’s pretty simple.
Correction: Still wanna get married in the West without propper RP-vetting and a prenup?
They're not worth the pair they're written on. A judge can throw it out for any or no reason after the fact.
Correction: Don't get married whatsoever.
Marriage is unnecessary. You're literally signing/agreeing to a contract with witnesses to whatever happens, happens.
If a person has to get married then make sure to sign a prenuptial.
marriage always needs prenup, and for the love of god vet the shit out of whoever you think you want to marry. Seriously. Double check, triple check them. I have the belief you should only get married once so don't fuck it up when you pull the trigger. Make sure that person can not only satisfy you but keep you entertained socially
This chick ran off with the kid and dyed their hair blue? I'm pretty sure you can tell someone is fucking weird long before this happens. Trust you gut.
Not getting married just means you have no kids and the lefties out reproduce us, and having kids unmarried means your kids are likely to resent you and become lefties.
Not saying marriage is the whole solution, but of course if you marry a feminist you are screwed. Dating a feminist was the mistake long before he married. You should not have any sex and definitely not any kids with lefty feminists definitely. Lefty feminists should be ignored and they have to go off and they'll have to accept their limited dating options, be single, or change and not be a feminist anymore.
That's the Left's goal. Screw the institution of marriage, break up marriage, and get the parents to hate each other so the schools can be the primary influence on kids to brainwash them into lefties. And also to import lefties from the third world.
If they are able to gather enough brainwashed voters to win most every national election then marriage will be the least of your concerns. Giving your dick away to some lefty skank who has no standards or values because you're horny is not helping the problem.
Find a good woman and marry her instead. There are lots of women out there who have values, standards, and who support responsibility in marriage. Don't date lefties and actually be a man who women want to be with, then divorce won't be a problem.
Marriage has nothing to do with the mechanics of conception. When your screed begins with a false premise, you got nothing.
Conception? No. Reproduction? Yes. K reproduction has always been the foundation of civilized society. People groups who use R strategy reproduction never have the discipline or intelligence to advance technologically. Are you claiming otherwise?
This is tragic. I cannot understand the cowardice of politicians in evading this a d allowing it to continue.
What if you marry a rich woman?
Most successful women are covert narcissists. Enjoy the discard phase.
that doesn't really happen
Yeah women always look for someone making more than them
ok i knew this one girl that was married to this guy and the girl was very well off through her family, but the the dude was poor. however, the girl was on the uggo side and fat and the guy could have done better for sure.
I think all men should boycott marriage in protest of this shit system if women want their big fancy wedding and their day of being the center of everyone’s attention they have to earn it they have to prove they can act like a fucking adult no one should have to go through what the op has experienced
Was married. Never again. Marriage rape is a very real thing.
How would not being married have saved this guy? You can still be forced to pay child support.