Befriending women will not make a difference

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Vlad_The_Great_2 · 2025-05-19T13:31:50+00:00

Me befriending women did nothing for my love life. If you’re attractive, your women friends will set you up with her other friends. If you’re not attractive enough, you’ll be treated as just another friend.

DelDivision · 2025-05-19T09:01:59+00:00

Yes and no, it depends on the friendship, if theyre comfortable around you then you might get a peek on how they really talk when theyre amongst themselves especially if they feel like youre not judgemental. Some of the most blackpilling moments of my life came from coworkers who liked me. Unfiltered girl talk can be brutal. Which is good to know if one is in the dark, outside of that unless you guys share an hobby or shes being a wingman, its no point.

SpicyTigerPrawn · 2025-05-19T15:32:56+00:00

Most of my negative views came from the things they said and did in my presence, not just to me personally, but to the best and brightest men in their lives. I have a lot of faults and frailties so if they only screwed with me it would be one thing, but I've seen them casually burn some of the finest and most honorable men I've ever met, as if they were worthless refuse to be tossed and forgotten. That was something that could not be explained away no matter how hard they tried to defend it and deflect from it. They think the 'sphere tricked and brainwashed me. No, it was their own scheming and screwing that did it and that's something they can never accept or admit.

Anon_cat86 · 2025-05-19T11:13:11+00:00

i think it more depends on the women. Because i have met women who pretty much only talk about that stuff, but i've also met women who acted borderline asexual even after knowing them for years, and most have just fallen in between those two extremes, like it'll come up pretty often but the majority of what she'll talk about is still other stuff. Could just be my subjective experience though maybe most women aren't like that.

rrp123 · 2025-05-19T10:07:45+00:00

I basically agree with this. As a 30 year old guy who is also living in Europe and has always been extremely social, most of my closest friends are women and I also have one sister that is only a few years younger than me.

I value them all deeply and my life has been enormously better for having them in it.

But you know what happens when you befriend women and get to know them as people?

You realise they can be just as shallow and mean-spirited as men. They are not always like that and can be wonderful, kind people, but we are all human at the end of the day.

Although we should always be careful when using our experiences to make far reaching generalisations about a group of people, I can only tell you what I have seen firsthand.

1) This idea that women are by and large opting out of relationships with men does not seem to be reflected in the slightest, at least in my age and friend group. Almost all of my female friends are constantly in relationships or hooking up with guys.

2) Age gap relationships seem extremely common where I am in Central Europe. Just off the top of my head, one of my closest female friends right now (she’s 27) is dating a 52 year old rich businessman, my other friend is 29 and I’m about to attend on her wedding in a few weeks to a guy who’s 41 (he’s lovely btw). Her younger sister that I’m also very close with is 25 and she’s dating a famous European artist who is 43. They met at an embassy event.

One of my closest female friends growing up is 28 and she’s married and has kids with a 43 year old partner at a law firm.

My sister herself dated a 27 year old when she was 19 and they had an 8 year relationship, they are still close friends to this day.

Now, these are certainly specific examples and not every female friend is dating someone that much older, but from what I have experienced, the women I know have zero issues dating someone significantly older as long as they are reasonably attractive, are wealthy and have some kind of status.

3) I talk openly and often to my female friends about guys they are dating and their experiences. They will absolutely go out with men they have no interest just because they want a fancy dinner and some attention. My best friend did this last year after breaking up with her long term boyfriend because he “wasn’t exciting enough”. There was a guy that had been asking her out for ages that she had no interest in, but she decided she wanted to feel good about herself and so she went out with him to a very fancy restaurant and bar, which he paid for of course. She ghosted him the very next day. To be fair, the guy was a bit desperate.

4) I have heard them discuss in great detail that men they slept with had tiny penises and didn’t know how to use them, that men are trash (but of course that I’m an exception), that they don’t want no broke ass, short man asking them out. That they deserve princess treatment and that men should pay for everything. Many of my female friends lament that they do miss the more traditional days in which they didn’t have to work and they could let the men handle all that making money stuff. I get calls at all hours of the night hearing them cry about how life is so hard and why can’t they just meet a rich guy that will take care of them.

Look despite all this, sometimes all of this is said when they are depressed or in a bad state of mind, and they are all genuinely great people. But just like male humans are not always perfect, neither are female humans :D

So just chill everyone, I absolutely hate this gender war nonsense.

OMWSpuds · 2025-05-19T17:50:14+00:00

Pragmatically speaking if your goal is to eventually meet women for something casual or more serious having a social circle with a lot of women greatly increases the probability of that happening. It's not just the women you are close to, but their friends, friends of their friends, associates, and so on. The potential of these associations/relationships represent the giant gap between the awkwardness or creep factor of pure cold approach and organic gradual romance occurring between close individuals

But I get it too, for a lot of neurotic people observing human behavior can definitely reinforce existing [negative] beliefs and cynicism.

washington_breadstix · 2025-05-19T09:20:28+00:00

The guys I've known in my life who were the most sexually successful, i.e. who never went without an abundance of single women around them, were pretty much always the "social butterfly" types and socialized with plenty of women they weren't hooking up with, in addition to the ones they were hooking up with.

So I think the advice "Befriend women" can be helpful if interpreted as "Learn to be comfortable around women in any given social situatuion, no matter what the hook-up prospects are". It seems to me that being friends with women can help a guy to knock women "off the pedestal" in his mind, so to speak, and just to be more chill around them in general, which will be a huge boon for that guy when he's trying to get laid.

Aromatic-Following98 · 2025-05-19T14:44:24+00:00

The one good thing about getting to know women is it reinforces non-relationship views of them. They can be competent and hard-working, though they're rarely the hardest working. They understand the assignment and complete the assignment and demonstrate foresight where needed.

They often take good care of their families

But nothing about women in practice is ever going to make you appreciate/understand/accept/transform views on how they act towards men romantically. And friend zoning is a part of that. All that being around women and seeing their real life behavior is going to do is reinforce red pill views, and the only way to avoid becoming mysogynistic is to embrace the system

BobtheArcher2018 · 2025-05-19T10:23:34+00:00

Women, particularly young women, treat male friends differently based on the man's mate value. Even if he is not her type, if a man is attractive enough to other women, he'll get a certain level of respect and treatment from female friends. He won't be treated as an asexual and he won't get the unvarnished version of girl locker room talk like the low mate value guy who becomes 'just one of the girls'. Never become just one of the girls.

There's really no shortcut to leveling up your masculinity and/or public persona and frame. Even if it is looks that keep your mate value down, if you level up the other aspects, women will still treat you right even if they won't date you. This general principle can apply to any woman, from your grandmother to the school nurse. If a man is put together as a man, whatever his looks, he gets treated like a man. If he doesn't act like one, he doesn't get treated as one.

Fieser_Factsack · 2025-05-20T00:08:58+00:00

it depends. Its smart to befriend women, but not all women. Befriend women that you would like if they had a dick and no boobs. Women are not a monolith. Some women are cool other suck ass and it depends on you what type of character a women needs to have for you 2 to have a good time, be it as friends, partners or whatever.

I figured out later in life that i needed a women to be opposite to me. Both as partners and friends.

NataliaCaptions · 2025-05-19T09:57:59+00:00

The surest way to become a misogynist is to interact with lots of women while the opposite is true. I have seen plenty of misandrists become sympathetic to men once they interacted with them. I have never seen the opposite.

One funny counterintuitive example is the Don Juan. He loves women and isnt annoyed with them because he considers them to be children and never take them seriously. He is still a misogynist by definition

Alwaysnthered · 2025-05-19T15:05:43+00:00

Im my experience, be-friending women (and TRUE friends, not just "hang out with a group once every month") - there ALWAYS is some sort of "layer" of behavior modification that happens between you two, due to expectations/male and female dynamic. So its hard to really get that true free flowing relaxed "in the present" connection you have with male friends.

I'm also basically talking about heterosexual friendships only.

the BEST way to approach it is stating that I'd like to be friends and keep hanging out - while at the same time be non-judgemental etc. this way you tend to get the most transparent authentic version of them.

when I failed to state this I always got weird behavior and statements (since I was never making a move on them) like:

"can I just staying something...like you are totally not my type at all.....like at alll...so yeah I just wanted to say that"

"I don't think I could EVER EVER date you, like ever

I dont get why women do this.

and im sitting there thinking "ok, I never really did either, but I didnt feel like I had to say that"

AdmirableSignal6225 · 2025-05-19T08:48:47+00:00

The answer is for men like this to seek out the company of men who are sexually successful. I’m not talking about fuckboys, just the nice, normal men who are also able to attract women. But, as with so much, this is a problem of an atomised society, lack of third spaces, lack of inter generational socialisation, particularly amongst men. But your premise is right, I think. Sometimes as the “cool boyfriend” hanging out with a group of female friends, I have occasionally found myself thinking damn, these women are deluded and horrible.

Edit: there is also the really difficult to process fact that men seeking out such advice are possibly never going to be successful with women.

Ok_Ask6327 · 2025-05-19T22:27:53+00:00

Why do you feel that you are entitled to be successful with women. Either you are or you are not... But why should someone think badly of women because they are not interested in sex with you or whoever else.

What is it you see in real life and being in close proximity to them makes them wrong for not wanting sex with you?

Women can choose to have sex with Chad, Brad, or no one at all. It is not your business and they don't own you anything.

Superannuated_punk · 2025-05-19T09:34:48+00:00

For real - having women friends was the best thing for my romantic life by a long shot, so YMMV.

SeemedGood · 2025-05-19T17:34:46+00:00

As you have stated RP philosophy is really just a collection of male observation of female behavior and choice-making. While the “movement” is new, the observations themselves are as old as the genus Homo.

My uncles (on my mother’s side) were all over 6’, muscular, masculine, and broadly considered handsome. They essentially communicated RP philosophy to me in the late 1970s and early 1980s just by recounting their own experiences interacting with women and trying to school their beloved nephew.

At the time, I was too brainwashed by leftist ideology to be able to listen and evaluate their advice objectively, but rather thought of them as “sexist” and anachronistic while entirely discounting what they had to say - a classic thought pattern symptom of those who have been indoctrinated by cultural Marxism.

In short, RP philosophy is really just the stuff older men used to tell younger men about women’s behaviors and choices in order to better prepare them to have better interactions with women. In its proper context, none of that would cause (or used to cause) young men to have negative feelings about women. Rather, you would have just learned that that’s how women behave and make their mate choice decisions and you would have adapted to it.

The negative feelings are a direct result of the sense of betrayal that results from having been lied to about the true nature, behaviors, and choice-making of women and then finding out later that what you were told (and then adapted yourself to) was only propaganda.

So, it’s not interacting with women that generates the negative associations, it’s the interaction with the lies about them which does so. If men reclaim the role of sharing the truth about how women behave and make their sexual choices from the beginning and give no oxygen to the lies and propaganda of cultural Marxism and feminism, the negative reaction that comes from having been lied to will disappear.

TermAggravating8043 · 2025-05-19T08:20:57+00:00

Op, why do you have female friends do if all it does is give you negative feelings towards women?

Cause somethings not adding up here

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lle-ell · 2025-05-19T12:42:02+00:00

I’m Swedish too, if it makes any difference. I would 100% say that being friends with men has made me more romantically successful (with men). For two reasons;

I get men, and

I’m used to and perfectly at ease talking to men. As a teen, I would clam up around hot guys. In my 20s, I learned to roll with the punches and actually flirt with people I would previously have been too shy to talk to.

Now, I’ve never really struggled to date or get into relationships, but holy hell it made a big difference to be able to talk to anyone. I’m so glad I didn’t meet my husband back when I was too shy to flirt with someone as hot as him!

Also, understanding men is definitely important to keeping a relationship going long term.

Goonerlouie · 2025-05-19T13:28:27+00:00

The friends to lovers route is harder because if someone is initially attracted to you they will want to impress you. Friendship comes after successfully impressing the other person. Friendship allows walls to drop and flaws to be exposed. No one wants their flaws out in the open when trying to impress someone.

That being said, people put friends in three categories:

No attraction, hell no to dating.
Neutral attraction, could be open to it but it doesn’t cross their mind during the friendship.
Attracted, being friendly as a way to worm themselves to a relationship.

This is not exclusively done by men btw, I’ve seen women do this plenty of times.

I’ve always thought you need some level of attraction to be friends with someone. Even with same sex friendships there is an underlying “attraction” to something the other person has or is into. So as a man being friends with women is a decent indicator that you have some base level of attractive qualities

musicissoulfood · 2025-05-20T03:42:35+00:00

It will make a difference to the women involved. They no longer are moving their own heavy furniture when they are relocating, because now you as their male friend can have the honor to do that for them.

And guys, don't expect the favor to be returned.

Realistic-Ad-1023 · 2025-05-20T23:45:39+00:00

… or maybe you just hate women?

If no matter what you do, no matter who you befriend if hang out with, your only option is to hate women because they don’t want to fuck you, maybe, just maybe, you just hate women.

EugeneCezanne · 2025-05-21T00:54:36+00:00

As someone with way more women friends than male friends I just have to laugh.

As someone with more female friends than male ones, I find the advice mostly true. The difference, the the source of the "mostly", comes down to which women you befriend.

pretty much 99% of what my friends talk about are related to relationships, sex, criteria for dating and what they have been up to, romantically

My female friends talk about art, politics, science, literature, music, sociology, stories that make them confront their vulnerabilities and, of course, dating.

But that isn't actually what I really like about them, though I do like it. It's not what they talk about, but how they talk about it: how they manage to be interesting and surprising and emotionally engaged without closing their minds off to reasonable, or at least entertaining, objections. It's that they manage to talk about anything without forgetting their charm.

I'd say the same about the men I'm friends with. But there have been far more women than men in my long social career that have met the high standard.

This is also not even the younger age group, but 25-35.

Yep, same.

It sounds you just don't like your friends that much. Regardless of their gender, if this is how you'd talk about them, you haven't understood the assignment.

wheatgrass_feetgrass · 2025-05-19T12:59:17+00:00

I thought the "befriend women" thing was just to demystify and depedestalize them. Guys who have never had a conversation with a woman can build it up so much in their heads. Having genuine friendships with women takes the untouchable shine off of them. My reading of your post is that it is actually very successful at doing that.

BluePillUprising · 2025-05-19T10:07:06+00:00

When I was single friendships with women often turned into withbeneditsships. Including what became a marriage.

I say you should make friends, OP.

Lightinthebottle7 · 2025-05-19T08:55:00+00:00

In your personal experience befriending women didn't help your chances?

We heard it all, pack it up lads and ladies, this is definitive proof that having cordial, casual, platonic relationship with women is completely useless when it comes to getting dates on the long run. Don't even bother talking to them.

(Yes, this is sarcasm)

wtknight · 2025-05-19T12:04:26+00:00

I think that understanding how women think and feel and how it different than men can help in knowing how to attract them, and one can learn this by befriending women. However, befriending a particular woman is usually not going to make that woman more like to be attracted to that guy.

Axis_Control · 2025-05-19T14:29:02+00:00

I think at this point you are subcounsciously looking for things to reinforce negative beliefs and ideas you may be forming about women, a confirmation bias if you will. So really that's not women or other men's fault.

You need professional help.

Calm-Lab-8592 · 2025-05-20T18:35:42+00:00

The true issue is that men cannot accept that women are can be flawed individual’s and also simultaneously cannot accept that women acknowledge shitty men and stay weary of them. When you see a woman complaining about a man he’s an abuser, he’s a misogynist, he takes his anger out on others.. when you see a man complaining about a woman it’s because she gossiped or badmouthed somebody or has unrealistic standards. These things are comparable by no means and yet seem to be enough for men to generalize women but women can’t do the same in return to men? Every guy claims to be so innocent and nice but how can that really be true considering the statistics on male violence and rape that exist. Somebody is lying about their character and surely a lot of you men aren’t as nice as you THINK you are. If befriending more women reinforces your beliefs it’s because you don’t see women as individuals.

Siukslinis_acc · 2025-05-19T09:03:43+00:00

I think when people say stuff, they imply that it is of quality. Like, shitty friends is worse than no friends, but no firends is worse than quality friends.

I think people need to have quality male and female people in their lives.

Schleudergang1400 · 2025-05-19T09:35:34+00:00

You need to befried people who have a positive outlook on love, sex and relationships. Not the same negative views as you have.

Epthewoodlandcritter · 2025-05-19T14:31:22+00:00

These guys need to fix themselves. Women can't fix them and it's not their job.

Worth_Plastic5684 · 2025-05-19T08:35:41+00:00

"Don't bother experiencing real life to contrast with the angry gospel; trust me that it will only reinforce your belief in the angry gospel"

Ok? Sounds like a good wager. If the angry gospel was right all along you get to tell yourself, I didn't trust it blindly, I went and interacted with reality and verified it for myself. If the angry gospel was wrong you get to tell yourself, wow, I almost let the angry gospel tell me not to bother to double check it because there is no use, how stupid would I have been to fall for that.

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CarHungry · 2025-05-19T16:21:48+00:00

I think it could go eitherway really. If all your experiences with women are via internet porn you'll probably view them as sex goddesses, while interacting irl would just make them seem more like normal people, and normal people will generally treat you badly if you are low status, both male and female.

Also I think platonic friendship is probably a bad idea if you're very lonely for alot of reasons that would be too long to type, but you probably WOULD want female friends if you weren't, as that boosts your status and gives you more options in the long run. If you're lonely though you just open yourself up to disappointment and at worst, exploitation.

2025-05-19T20:49:51+00:00

Well don’t befriend them for sex, that could be the reason

People know and feel when ur not being genuine and nobody likes that, not a male female OR fish

bery big pish

rejected-again · 2025-05-19T22:00:20+00:00

I think there's a difference between being friendly with a woman and being her "bestie". I think you fall into the latter category with your female friends where they treat you like one of the girls.

Mountain-Most8186 · 2025-05-19T22:22:39+00:00

Either you befriend women and it will most likely increase your negative thoughts about them because it will reinforce what you have hear online, or you hang out with men who are equally unsuccessful which can lead to an echo chamber that also helps reinforce and validate your negative feelings.

With all due respect, I think this is a wild take. Befriending women for the genuine sake of building friendships and experiencing life and people will likely, imho, lead to a newfound realization that women DONT think the way Red Pill tells you they think. It will shake you out of this Internet echo chamber you’ve found yourself in.

BigMadLad · 2025-05-19T23:30:56+00:00

I think it can in two scenarios:

You are truly so out of touch or poorly connected that you have almost no reference to what women your age in real life do. If you’re in a situation where you have five friends and all of them are guys, having a baseline knowledge of women’s energy, how they speak, And even just being comfortable around them is a very important first step. If it’s that level, I think you should get some exposure versus not.
You are a very particular sell or type and so need a warm introduction from somebody to grease the wheels. A lot of guys are not going to be immediately attractive or do well on dating apps, and so their personality is what would get the dates. Because that involves social Interaction, is easy to present yourself in the wrong crowd or not get the spotlight, and so having female friends who may not be attracted to you, but feel you would be good for one of their friends could be a lifesaver.

SlayerHdeade · 2025-05-19T23:35:56+00:00

I think they say it because women usually have female friends they invite to social events but just being around women and seeing what behaviours they respond to helped me a lot.

Hopeful-Card305 · 2025-05-23T07:24:11+00:00

Purposely putting yourself into the friendzone?

I miss the age when that damn show hadn't existed to create this phenomenon.

Kliere · 2025-05-20T05:06:21+00:00

Negative thoughts and feelings towards women.

Wonders why women don't set him up with their friends.

Suspicious_Glove7365 · 2025-05-19T12:52:44+00:00

You must be in an extra special friend group. None of my friend, male or female, spend much time at all talking about sex and relationships.

Outside_Memory5703 · 2025-05-19T14:44:07+00:00

Of course it will. I don’t date dudes who don’t like women

tritonezub · 2025-05-19T19:49:59+00:00

Man stfu and go to a fucking club and pull like a normal person

Delicious_Algae_8283 · 2025-05-21T00:45:49+00:00

This is something I wish people outside this space would realize. People aren't getting redpilled by some pipeline, they're getting redpilled by having these experiences, and then the only people who will listen to them and explain to them are people in some niche community. It should be parents and such that are telling kids about how to navigate the dating world as they come of age. After all, the parents figured it out, so they must know something about how dating works. But the blue pill perspective of "well, I guess it just worked out eventually. I don't really know how or why" is so common that it's unlikely a kid will learn this from them apparently.

The_Sex_Economist · 2025-05-21T03:52:16+00:00

Women make horrible friends for men.

Always remember: Men are friends with women they are attracted to, and women are friends with men they are unattracted to.

Hot-Impact-5860 · 2025-05-19T08:36:39+00:00

The only way how to get a really good view is to casually meet them, get rewarded with casual sex, maybe talk some rubbish about life and move on. Friendships without sex worsen the view. Relationships, well, ups and downs there.

The_Forgotten001 · 2025-05-19T11:21:13+00:00

Befriend a stud, change your perspective.

Unhappy_Meaning607 · 2025-05-19T20:16:33+00:00

Red pill men are in need of therapy due to a myriad of reasons and yes I agree that just befriending women will not change much.

Their whole concept of a woman is warped in a lot of ways that it would take a deep dive into the root of their issues. I mean... are they actually a good person in their core? are they mentally ill to the point of psychopathy or have some other mental disorder?

It would seem like they could just flip a switch and be a decent human being that can get laid but I think its much deeper than that and I wish they would realize they need help from someone who doesn't want to grift off of them.

WarmClassroom4997 · 2025-05-20T05:58:34+00:00

That’s a really interesting perspective, and I appreciate the honesty. It’s true that just befriending women isn’t some magic fix if the underlying mindset or experiences are negative. I wonder though, do you think it’s more about who you befriend and the quality of those friendships rather than just the quantity? Like, maybe the right connections can challenge those negative thoughts, but if the circle itself is full of similar frustrations, it’s easy to get stuck in that cycle.

Flightlessbirbz · 2025-05-21T11:04:20+00:00

pretty much 99% of what my friends talk about are related to relationships, sex, criteria for dating.

Well I guess it really is different in Sweden than America, or at least your friend group than my friend group. Because I’m a married woman but some of my friends are single, and they don’t talk about men or dating very much. They mostly like to talk about their families, pets, art/hobbies, work, current events, spirituality and philosophy.

Now I will say if you are going through negative thoughts and feelings about women, hanging around women probably won’t help. Because women are not angels, and confirmation bias will highlight the negative if that’s what you’re looking for. It also heavily depends on which women. And it’s the same for men tbh, I’ve met some who made me consider going full lesbian or becoming a nun, but the men in my life currently are good people I like and respect.

WhatTheyWanttoHear · 2025-05-19T21:00:46+00:00

Every girl who I got close to eventually wanted sex from me but I'm attractive, so.

Title	Befriending women will not make a difference
Author	OndeVerge
Upvotes	191
Comments	215
Date	May 19, 2025 8:12 AM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1kq6d4j/befriending_women_will_not_make_a_difference/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/befriending-women-will-not-make-a-difference.1552571 https://theredarchive.com/post/1552571

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