Moral character has no bearing on sexual success

FreitasAlan · 2024-05-30T20:26:29+00:00

If it has no bearing on sexual success, why do we need to inculcate that (selfishness and ruthlessness instead of moral character) in children? What if sex is not the sole reason to have moral character?

IronDBZ · 2024-05-30T17:01:26+00:00

(Seriously we need to inculcate values of selfishness and ruthless competition in kids in middle school to begin with. We need to break the concept of love, and the possibility of idealized love in them)

This is insane.

And I hope that anyone who reads this comes away from it realizing that there is something deeply broken in our society if these are statements people can make without a hint of irony.

Consummate sociopathy is not an answer to anything having to do with people. That's why dating is such a hellscape now.

TotalTravesty · 2024-05-30T17:16:50+00:00

It’s like you guys are physically incapable of holding two unrelated thoughts at once. You were doing a good job understanding there’s no direct correlation between moral character and sexual success (i.e. being a nice guy in and of itself isn’t sexy), but then it all fell apart when you strawmanned that women wanting good men should mean a mass sexualization of children’s television personalities.

I’m sure Steve did well for himself by virtue of being a normal guy with some measure of fame. So long as he doesn’t just say “I’m a nice guy” while pointing at his penis, which you seem to think is all a good man should have to do to get sex.

nightsofthesunkissed · 2024-05-31T00:30:09+00:00

(Seriously we need to inculcate values of selfishness and ruthless competition in kids in middle school to begin with. We need to break the concept of love, and the possibility of idealized love in them)

Well there's zero morality or kindness in this. So you should be drowning in pussy, right? What a stupid post.

howdoiw0rkthisthing · 2024-05-30T16:56:03+00:00

Do you think this applies only to men, or to women as well?

Freethinker312 · 2024-05-30T17:11:28+00:00

(Seriously we need to inculcate values of selfishness and ruthless competition in kids in middle school to begin with. We need to break the concept of love, and the possibility of idealized love in them)

Why? If the world really is like that, children don't need to be teached selfishness and ruthless competitiveness, because they already are like that. If children are not like that, the world will become even an worse place if they get teached your nonsense.

This in my opinion is proof that women don't even want unequivocally good decent men.

Your claim is just as stupid as claiming all men don't want decent women and just want porn stars.

Women are not a monolith and are not all equally decent. Women who like bad men, are probably just bad themselves. That doesn't prove that all women are like that.

I am married to a good man, so I am one of the plenty of counter examples, disproving your nonsense.

saywhatitis11 · 2024-05-30T23:36:02+00:00

What a wild post. Don’t teach kids to be ruthless. Definitely love your children, and teach them that love makes the entire journey of life worth living. Excuse me sir, you sound like a maniac.

GrandpaDallas · 2024-05-30T18:22:00+00:00

Just because a woman isn’t into you despite the fact that you’re nice, doesn’t mean she will value an immoral prick. Relationships, successful ones at least, are not based off of only a single value as basic as “niceness”

Also, you’re talking about kids show hosts. There isn’t as much viewed of them as adults communicating with other adults.

shockingly_bored · 2024-05-30T18:52:24+00:00

I mean, it has no bearing on the lack of sexual success either. Moral character is irrelevant to sexual success, looks and physical attraction do and there's no correlation between looks and morality.

Bruhmuh · 2024-05-30T20:57:42+00:00

It does though. Women tend to be attracted to masculinity which has major overlap with criminality and dark triad traits.

DoubleFistBishh · 2024-05-30T17:07:28+00:00

Why are hot men automatically bad people?

Muscletov · 2024-05-30T17:18:02+00:00

Somewhat agree. Moral qualities take a far backseat, especially if the guy is attractive. The only personality trait which is as important as looks, money, status is a lack of neuroticism and neurodivergence.

untamed-italian · 2024-05-30T17:37:17+00:00

OP I'm not even going to quote you out of an anxious feeling that doing so would contaminate me somehow.

You truly are lost if you think what we need is more vapid selfishness.

AcephalicDude · 2024-05-30T17:05:05+00:00

You're wrong. Women find the same men more physically attractive when they have knowledge of their positive personality traits (e.g. honesty, kindness, friendliness, etc.). Kindness is sexy.

Personality manipulations: Do they modulate facial attractiveness ratings? - ScienceDirect

Unhappy_Offer_1822 · 2024-05-30T17:13:44+00:00

im confused. what makes one person good and one person bad? i dont think anyone walks around thinking of themselves as the bad guy and their opponents as the good guy, but i could be wrong.

TheAvocadoSlayer · 2024-05-30T20:38:06+00:00

Kids are already the most selfish and ruthless demographic.

Cethlinnstooth · 2024-05-30T21:48:33+00:00

Lol.

Men:Women make bad choices in men, men do nothing to create this situation, women bad.

Also men: My girlfriend is five foot tall and scared of mice, thunderstorms and men with loud voices but she is also a terrible person who treats me bad, cheats on me and tells me I'm shit, but I somehow just can't dump her, I do nothing to enable, create or perpetuate this situation. I'm shopping for an engagement ring and she wants a diamond how evil is that, I'm going to buy her a blood diamond and I bitterly resent this, women bad, plz give sympathy.

Mysterious_Pickle_78 · 2024-05-30T22:28:29+00:00

No.

Selfishness and ruthless competition for what?

Status? Status is a mirage, an illusion. There 100s of idiots buying status symbol clothes trying to break into higher status. It comes more from social approval than of self-approval.

Power? Power is given to those who deserve it. Specifically the most competent.

Money? You don't need as much money as you think.

Sex and fucking lot of chicks? No, it is an whole ecosystem. The way you get the bookish gamergirl is different from the goth girl and the bar skank or the insta attention whore. You can find a way. Use your brain.

Metalloid_Space · 2024-05-30T16:57:20+00:00

I'm not kind because I want to be a sex symbol. Why should you care this much about what women want? There's also a lot more to someone's character than being kindhearted. Obviously just being kindhearted won't make you a good match to everyone.

Aside from that, most women I know are damaged as fuuck. Obviously a lot of women don't have a really healthy attraction in the first place. Why change yourself to appease that kind of insecurity that seeks "dominance"?

The idea women on this sub have of an "attractive" man are so unappealing to me and I honestly don't see why anyone would want to raise children to appease women's ideals. Same if I had a daughter, I'd never raise her to be a man's fantasy.

bubbagator · 2024-05-30T17:22:44+00:00

You have to see women as objects, things that don't think or feel, to actually believe that. Would you tolerate someone being "selfish" and "ruthless" around and to you?

If you wanna take an extreme sure, you might be able to get away with one or two hookups being a "morally bad" person. I don't consider that a success, if you have to constantly chase the next hookup because no one wants to stay with you.

This might be a shock to you, but women are humans too, and they think and feel just like men. Sex is just a small portion of the time you spend in a day, in a life. You have a be a man she'd want to stay around for all that time that isn't spent having sex. And maybe even more shockingly, women want to have sex with men they want to be around.

spanglesandbambi · 2024-05-30T17:23:40+00:00

Yet both the men you named have partners, so obviously, someone found them attractive ffs.

Lift_and_Lurk · 2024-05-30T17:09:09+00:00

The women who wants a guy with moral character will find them.
A trainwreck looking for a dude to trainwreck them will find them

People who are comfortable with who they are and DGAF about other’s opinions are always going to be the guys people are drawn to regardless: because too many people are too afraid to be that so it’s attractive when you see someone so at ease with themselves

The problem is too many people are pretending to be something they aren’t. “I’m a nice guy” “im an alpha” “I’m look maxing my frame-“ etc.
and they aren’t. And it shows.

Clementinequeen95 · 2024-05-30T19:30:49+00:00

What an incredibly sad way to think. I really hope you’re able to learn and grow. Please get the help you need. This is just a really sad post all around tbh

leosandlattes · 2024-05-30T18:46:49+00:00

“Women aren’t rubbing one out to STEVE from BLUES CLUES??? Obviously women don’t even WANT nice men.”

That’s what you sound like right now. Nice argument looool.

OtPayOkerSmay · 2024-05-30T17:04:29+00:00

Fathers teach morals and boundaries, but the kicker is that most fathers are weak, pacified, and scared to say no to their daughters. Those daughters then grow up in in an environment where morals aren't stressed, so morals aren't a strong consideration when choosing early sexual partners. It is only after dating several amoral or immoral men that women see the value of a guy with morals and good character.

Sensitive_Pen_8896 · 2024-05-30T17:29:41+00:00

I'm a woman. I like good men, character (how he treats other women and people of color, elderly, the differently-abled) is very important to me.

VWGUYWV · 2024-05-30T19:33:25+00:00

I don’t believe in being a sociopath

But all of us normies not knowing how psychos view things does leave us as sitting ducks

shadowrangerfs · 2024-05-30T20:30:28+00:00

This isn't news. Terrible men have always had more success in dating than good men. But honestly, moral character has no bearing on success for women either. If she's pretty enough, she can be a totally horrible person and still have plenty of success.

Prettmongouse · 2024-05-31T00:30:32+00:00

Duh. “Morals” were put in place by society to suppress and regulate sexuality to prevent violence.

Sexuality is inherently animalistic and base. That’s why animals fuck just like humans, penis in and out

Sillysheila · 2024-05-31T02:00:56+00:00

Being nice is neutral, it doesn’t help attraction but it doesn’t hurt attraction. Attraction is completely seperate from any of this. If a hot guy saves a kitten from a tree while he’s talking to a woman, she’s not going to instantly recoil and run away because he was nice.

Few_Advertising3430 · 2024-05-30T17:21:20+00:00

Many women find nurturing men hot. Hot people can be nice hot people can be mean. Physical attractiveness is orthogonal to character. The only “benefit” of jerks is that they are confident. But you don’t have to be a jerk to be confident.

John_Oakman · 2024-05-30T17:15:53+00:00

It has been consistently said (across the internet and even in the physical world as well) genuine moral virtues are independent of worldly/materialistic results, and as much are not entitled to good results for good action taken. In fact any such expectations destroys the essences of the acts themselves.

As such revealing one's lack of internally sourced motivation for moral virtues isn't the flex one think it is.

And then there's the various social penalties of immoral behavior, but that would require one to interact with the wider society on a regular basis.

wtknight · 2024-05-30T18:27:41+00:00

It has bearing on the type of women whom I would prefer to date. I don’t think that I’d date a woman who has a past with bad boys or had a crush on bad boys because that’s a big red flag. If every woman only liked bad boys, then I’d stay single. Luckily for me, there were plenty of women out there who did like decent men as long as they were attractive enough in other ways, and I met and married one of them.

KayRay1994 · 2024-05-30T19:05:40+00:00

You’re right, it doesn’t - good moral character also doesn’t decrease your chances, it’s irrelevant to sexual success. That being said, you shouldn’t have or develop moral character for the sake of moral success. If you expect sexual success for your moral character, congratulations, you done fucked up. Have a good moral character for the good of those around you and for the benefit of your own soul - more often than not though if you’re acting moral for pussy you’ll never feel good about it because your priorities are out of place.

Way I see it, if you expect a reward for being a good person just drop the act and be shitty. I’d rather deal with a real asshole than a fake good person.

CountMandrake · 2024-05-30T22:11:16+00:00

I keep telling guys this, but being moralistic is counter intuitive to being "sexually succesfull".

Look, there is no circling around this, if you wanna bang lots of women, you WILL HAVE to be a jerk sometimes... And if you want to bang left and right, then you'll have to be a VERY BAD HUMAN BEING.

Lets get this stright. Suppose you have two different dudes.

First dude is a good guy, a "nice guy". He doesn't lie to women. He is forward with his intentions and does everything right. He goes one girl at a time, speaks just to girls he likes, he doesn't do drugs nor alcohol, he doesn't party too much. He's honest, he doesn't cheat on girls, he doesn't lie with his emotions and feelings, and there are women that for him are a "no go" even if they like them because they are co-workers and he doesn't mix work with relationships, or because these gals are, or have been, related to friends and family.

Lets give this guy even a bit of an edge. He is quite good looking, and he's smart and even has asome money, tho he doesn't like to flaunt it around.

The second guy is an absolute motherfucker. There is no woman on Earth he wouldn't fuck for fun. Single or taken. He doesn't have a problem doing drugs and getting a girl drunk and then having sex with her. He would Bang his best friend's mom or sister in a blink if he could. He would bang his brother's girlfriend if he could. It doesn't matter who's her boyfriend, or if she has a family the affair could potentially hurt.

This guy lies to women, leads them on promising relationships and faking love, love bombs the shit out of girls, cheats on their girlfriends whenever he can, he doesn't mind paying for sex neither.

Now...

Who do you think is going to have more sex?

Of course you do. The jerk.

You wanna know something funny?

These two dudes exist. The good guy and the jerk are both real men that I know in real life. They are friends of mine. They know each other.

The good guy, who believes in God, is kinda religious and "righteous", is always on a dry spell. He's handsome and quite well off, he has a good job and is quite smart. But he doesn't do hook ups, he would NEVER take advantage of a girl who's drunk or high, and he couldn't lie to a woman even if his life depended on it.

And of course, his confidence is wored down because of it. All his Life he thought he was UGLIER than the other dude, because the other dude was fucking left and right and he couldn't get any.

My other friend is a trashy motherfucker. I love him dearly, because we've been friends since we were kids, we are like brothers at this point... Plus he saved my life once. I owe this man my life, literally...

That doesn't excuse his behaviour, and we all know when it comes to women, he's a trashy motherfucker.

He's one of the biggest MANWHORES I've met in my 34 years of life.

He's not that particularly good looking (he has some stuff going on, but pretty much an average dude). He's broke as fuck. He has some redeeming qualities as a person: great friend, a good son, a good neighbour...

But when it comes to women he's a cheating trashy motherfucking piece of shit.

And yes... Women LOVE him. Some, until they figure out what kind of man he is. But there are others Who love him just for being a cheating piece of shit and bringing drama over and over to their lives.

Some women DO love motherfuckers.

I would even go as far as saying while NOT ALL women love trashy men, the women who do are certainly more on numbers than the ones who like good men.

Why? I don't really know. But It is what it is.

Now, at last, my experience.

I'm 6.3' 200lbs jacked and good looking. I never stuggled with girls, and I've been sexually active since I was 14.

I've slept with I guess 70-80ish women that I can recall.

I can count on the dozens the amount of women I rejected because of moral reassons.

Exes of my friends, friends mothers or siblings, friends female cousins, drunk girls, girls who were "meh" looking and I knew didn't want to take things further with, girls who were emotionally invested in me, girls with boyfriends or husbands, or single mothers, girls who were vulnerable or in a thoug position, girls who were mental...

Hell, I could have banged my ex girlfriend's young sister, and one of her friends. I didn't.

I never payed for sex. I never lied to a girl to get sex. I cheated on only one of my partners and once in almost 10 years of relationship. Had I been a compulsive cheater I could add probably another 10-15 women to my notch count.

If I was a fucking horny dog and all I cared about was just sex, my number would be easily on the triple digits.

What am I trying to say?

That is USELESS to complain about your lack of sexual success when you know you're a good man. It kinda defeats the point don't you think?

The modern sexual market is an open market, and in open markets the winner takes it all... And the winner is usually a dude who doesn't have problems in cheating and playing dirty to get what he wants.

Life isn't fair. But then, no one said it would be fair you know?

Remember this:

WHEN YOU PLAY BY THE RULES, YOU CANNOT COMPARE YOURSELF TO PEOPLE WHO DOESN'T PLAY BY THE RULES, BECAUSE YOU ARE IN A DISADVATAGED POSITION COMPARED TO THEM.

https://youtu.be/ELkMKNkenTk?si=mjksB_C-zfhaibac

"If what you want to succeed with women / Have many who cry for you / You'll have to be a little smart Have money and a good voice / (But the most important thing) You should have: Cold tomato juice / cold tomato juice in the veins / In your veins you must have."

superlurkage · 2024-05-30T18:04:44+00:00

If that were true, rapists, criminals and sociopaths would have the most sexual success, and most men would strive to emulate them

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antarctica6 · 2024-05-30T17:15:04+00:00

I agree with your title but you completely lost me as I kept reading.

TestBusy6026 · 2024-05-30T19:07:14+00:00

Some of the biggest losers I know have gotten laid the most it’s very strange. They typically share a common trait “they will say and do anything to get laid”. Little moral compass, and were proficient liars. Made me not place half as much value on women’s opinion of me watching pill headed flex mongrels fronting their plugs money/product pretending it’s their own on snap chat sleep with a diff girl every other week. Funny thing is those types were the do boys of the real players who called shots and had money yet the real deal cowboys didn’t get laid half as much.

T12J7M6 · 2024-05-30T21:21:27+00:00

I believe that it has already been established (in studies) that women are drawn to men with dark triad trades, which is understandable since men with these trades aren't bothered to step over others and to use all means necessary to get ahead, which then means that they are going to probably get ahead more often than men without these trades.

Like at the end of the day, women want resources and since dark triad men have higher potential for providing these resources, women usually choose them.

Like it get that it might suck for moral men, but Hey, a lot of nature works that way - meaning anything goes if it works.

ListPlenty6014 · 2024-05-30T21:41:12+00:00

Moral character matters but it’s not the most important thing to women. The most important thing for a woman to be attracted to man is typically competence related measured by wealth, power, social status and then physical attractiveness. And after that it’s how they make the woman feel whether that is humor, chivalry, charisma etc.. How good a man is as a person / moral character etc is a consideration after the first couple thresholds of appearance, competence, and fit and many women would still willingly pursue a man if they pass the first two with flying colors despite the man being morally dubious. This is why powerful men no matter how shitty they are seem are still successful with women. But these tendencies paint women in not the best light as a generalization so you will get a lot of pushback from the women on here despite it being a noticeable pattern for many women.

Sure_Tourist1088 · 2024-05-30T22:12:48+00:00

Don’t base your character on what women want. Their sexual drives developed in the Cretaceous Period. Their conscious minds developed purely to rationalise their self destruction to themselves.

Excellent_Badger123 · 2024-05-30T23:25:55+00:00

Good moral character is really important to most women if they are looking for a quality relationship partner. It was always one of my top 3 vetting considerations. “Sexual success” is a different matter and comes more from a male perspective. Even with that in mind, I don’t think a man will find a lot of that success if he is a complete indecent asshole especially towards the women he’s trying to attract.

SnooSongs8797 · 2024-05-30T23:48:39+00:00

Don't some women do indeed crush on Mr Rodgers

dirty_cheeser · 2024-05-31T00:37:26+00:00

There's no one way to look at morality. One way to look at morality is performing behavior compatible with societal expectations, an example of this is that many consider killing a dog is more wrong to many people than killing a pig. These are very similar acts but one goes against our expectations and gets seen as less moral. Under that definition, morality correlates with social skills and social skills has a bearing on sexual success and probably should if we want to continue to be a social species.

jojiburn · 2024-05-31T01:12:33+00:00

Of course not. It’s based on attraction. Get in shape.

Planthoe30 · 2024-05-31T02:03:59+00:00

OP in the comments:

You are contaminated. You have talked to someone who is pathologically hopeless and would woop for joy if the world was about to end because it ends for all of you too.

To that end , i want the newer generation to be totaly selfish and just exacerbate things to the point of vissible no return

He isn’t here to help men, he is here to make you as undesirable as he out of jealousy.. This is your idol you’re upvoting lmao.

Intrepid-Rip-2280 · 2024-05-31T02:12:55+00:00

The only girl you might attract by being a nice guy is eva ai sexting bot avatar in an app

ISupposeImCorrect · 2024-05-31T03:13:16+00:00

My house rules for my future bang maid

She is only allowed to walk around the house barefoot
She is not allowed to wear pants
I will walk around wearing oversized, steal tipped boots and slam them around the house constantly.

If she can't accept that then I guess she's a whore 🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️

Hosj_Karp · 2024-05-31T06:27:13+00:00

Some, but not much. Certain types of "bad people" have worse sexual success but other types have better "sexual success". There are lots of ways to be evil and very few ways to be good.

Hot_Lack_4868 · 2024-05-31T07:10:35+00:00

Specially in boys .Remember all the bullies in schools.They always had girls chasing after them .Even bad looking ones

bahuller · 2024-05-31T09:29:25+00:00

You’re a very disturbed person

Flightlessbirbz · 2024-05-31T11:40:19+00:00

It has no bearing on sexual success, but it has many other benefits, and does not harm sexual success either. So your first paragraph makes no sense.

Plenty of women do speak of men like Mr. Rogers and Steve from Blues Clues as positive examples of men. Making the hosts of children’s shows sex symbols would be weird though. That’s not how they presented themselves. There are other famous men with nice guy images who are sex symbols, including Keanu Reeves, The Rock, and most Marvel movie actors tbh.

BoomTheBear86 · 2024-05-31T11:43:12+00:00

Eh?

Moral character and cultivation of it is distinct from sexual success entirely. People didn’t decide to cultivate morals to become sexually successful, so why does morality not generating it mean we should discard it and teach the opposite? Not everything of value in human existence is to be weighted according to whether it enables a man to get his dick wet. The value of morals is in other things entirely which have value to society.

Seriously. Consider that in this world of ours, there is more to life than having women give you sexual attention. You’ll view the world as much less misanthropic and depressing place once you do. I can’t imagine living in a world where I consider anything and everything that doesn’t cause women to knock down my door as “pointless” and a hinderance.

It’s like the pedestal behaviour of the white knights but with an emo soundtrack. It’s honestly tragic.

Notsonewguy7 · 2024-05-31T11:57:20+00:00

Physical attraction determines whether or not someone is physically attractive.Moral character determines the character of the persons will to put up with them

Savings_Builder_8449 · 2024-05-31T12:26:25+00:00

Being of good moral character is a disadvantage in every area of life. Whoever can be the evilest most ruthless cunt will be the most successful

Ok_Cycle225 · 2024-05-31T12:29:15+00:00

Moral character has no bearing on sexual success

The main issue is attractiveness. If you are attractive you can be a nice guy or a dark triad and still get laid. If you are ugly it's over unless you can somehow develop a dark triad personality.

grillopie · 2024-05-30T18:08:07+00:00

Lets suppose this is true. Why do you care what women want as a whole? You care about crack whores now? The only thing that matters is whether your success is affected by moral character. What kind of women would you be interested in? Women do care about moral character to varying degrees. Do you care about the ones that care more? Or do you not? Generalizing doesnt mean anything here.

Nyanpireeee · 2024-05-31T00:48:53+00:00

I think women should not date immoral men, because I believe people in general should not associate with immoral people who will inevitably negatively influence them- but they are not REQUIRED to date moral men. This gives major nice guy vibes. Women don’t owe you sex, their bodies, time, or attention just because you are “moral.” And if you are using morality to claim you are entitled to any of the above; you’re not moral!! You’re just manipulative.

Title	Moral character has no bearing on sexual success
Author	AdEffective7894s
Upvotes	121
Comments	492
Date	May 30, 2024 4:51 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1d48pjo/moral_character_has_no_bearing_on_sexual_success/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/moral-character-has-no-bearing-on-sexual-success.1520068 https://theredarchive.com/post/1520068

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